| --- Log opened Mon Jan 24 00:00:10 2011 | ||
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| Utopiah | recordings from the french transhumanist association (no subtitles) http://vimeo.com/channels/164832 1st conf | 01:11 |
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| antonio_ | !list | 01:17 |
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| jrayhawk | You can install xserver-xorg-video-dummy if nothing else. | 02:24 |
| jrayhawk | Assuming it actually needs an xserver to render stuff; if you're just concerned about installing libraries I don't really see a reason to care in the first place. | 02:25 |
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| kanzure | unfortunately a few of them really do need a screen to render on (wtf) | 03:42 |
| joshcryer | ??? | 03:44 |
| joshcryer | Hardware acceleration or something? | 03:44 |
| kanzure | no | 03:46 |
| kanzure | opencascade's "save to png" is actually just a "open a window and take a screenshot of the desktop" function | 03:47 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: what's up with the ping timeout? | 03:47 |
| jrayhawk | I guess one of the backup scripts is a little too aggressive about eating up bandwidth :( | 03:49 |
| joshcryer | kanzure, ahh | 03:50 |
| jrayhawk | perhaps it'd be better to export these sorts of files in formats that support headless rendering? | 03:55 |
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| Lukas___ | Good morning | 04:15 |
| archels | lo | 04:21 |
| Lukas___ | Kanzure, you around? | 04:39 |
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| kanzure | jrayhawk: what format would that be? | 07:17 |
| kanzure | all of the export methods require xorg | 07:17 |
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| kanzure | hi Director_X | 07:59 |
| Director_X | hi. | 08:00 |
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| Director_X | Hey Kanzure, any recomendations on a 3d printer? | 08:02 |
| Director_X | for metal? | 08:02 |
| kanzure | ? http://reprap.org/wiki/SpoolHead | 08:02 |
| Director_X | thank you much | 08:04 |
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| Lukas___ | http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/ben/emiddt/2006/00000006/00000003/art00001?token=005c1a9e34e4846dc96720297d7634707b494a457a6c7b4257476d3f6a4b4b6e6e42576b642738641555d4ab9c6b | 08:42 |
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| Lukas___ | http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16003759 | 08:56 |
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| kanzure | is this how people spend their time? http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/irc/ForesightStudies.doc.html | 09:09 |
| kanzure | hrmm | 09:09 |
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| kanzure | jmil: do you have estimates on timelines for when you'll release your tissue printing hardware? | 09:47 |
| jmil | hardware already exists. it depends on peer review. could take 6 months unfortunately | 09:48 |
| kanzure | is it the hardware under peer review or a paper/publication? | 09:48 |
| jmil | paper/publication | 09:48 |
| jmil | about to be submitted | 09:48 |
| kanzure | random other question.. how is chen lab authoring it? | 09:49 |
| kanzure | some labs i know just use word .doc files | 09:49 |
| jmil | lol | 09:49 |
| kanzure | :/ | 09:49 |
| jmil | i'm using latex | 09:49 |
| kanzure | under git? how do you share that | 09:49 |
| jmil | but peeps don't like it | 09:49 |
| jmil | ya, 'course with git :D | 09:49 |
| jmil | share that? | 09:49 |
| kanzure | and your coauthors use git too? | 09:49 |
| kanzure | in one botched paper i was coauthoring people just sent .doc files around in email attachments :( | 09:49 |
| jmil | ya .doc is usual fare | 09:50 |
| jmil | no no one uses git or latex. just me | 09:50 |
| kanzure | so if it's in git does that mean your coauthors are pulling/pushing? | 09:50 |
| kanzure | oh i see. | 09:50 |
| jmil | i don't like to throw written text away or delete it. i'd much rather comment it out and/or store it in the git repo. i'm a pack rat | 09:50 |
| jmil | that's why i love latex | 09:51 |
| jmil | unfortunately each paragraph in latex is a single line in git | 09:51 |
| jmil | so git merges are actually not so good for latex co-authoring | 09:51 |
| jmil | you'd need git to split your text word by word | 09:51 |
| kanzure | you could set linewidth to 80 in the files and update line by line | 09:51 |
| kanzure | you could do that with a git hook actually (a pre-commit hook even) | 09:52 |
| kanzure | but i don't know how you'd detect whether or not the line is plain text vs. latex commands (which shouldn't be split up on multiple lines because that could break 'em) | 09:52 |
| jmil | ya i was gonna do a python script to pre and post-process one of these days... "but who has the time" | 09:52 |
| jmil | you just do " " -> "\n" and then reverse it back again | 09:53 |
| kanzure | so when you release the paper you'll release .scad files, or what? | 09:53 |
| jmil | probably will just throw on thingiverse | 09:53 |
| jmil | once it's published | 09:53 |
| jmil | it's probably not what you are thinking though... we are not printing cells directly. that's why it works so freaking well for large scale tissue culture | 09:53 |
| kanzure | i figured you might be printing growth media or scaffolds | 09:54 |
| jmil | ya that's the one | 09:54 |
| jmil | it's highly highly highly scaleable | 09:55 |
| jmil | and inexpensive | 09:55 |
| jmil | and easy | 09:55 |
| jmil | and simple | 09:55 |
| jmil | so we can do dozens of tissue mimics per day, ~1 mL in volume right now but it's trivial to go higher volume too | 09:55 |
| kanzure | 1 mL of diluted cell culture? | 09:56 |
| jmil | super concentrated cells | 09:56 |
| jmil | because we have the plumbing too | 09:56 |
| Lukas___ | I may actually have a useful idea, it's still not fully formed, but I thought I'd share the idea anyway | 09:59 |
| Lukas___ | Cancer cells, as well as some viruses, have genes that down regulate MHC class 1 molecules (perhaps using TGF-beta?). I think that if these genes included in a piece of DNA you want to incorporate into an organism, carried by an AAV vector, you could temporarily bypass the immune system until the new cells acquires immunity | 10:00 |
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| kanzure | can you give me a reference/citation to a paper that shows the immunity issues you're concerned about? | 10:21 |
| Lukas___ | no problem | 10:24 |
| Lukas___ | http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ijc.21312/full | 10:27 |
| Lukas___ | grr, the other article requires money | 10:28 |
| Lukas___ | -___- | 10:28 |
| Lukas___ | http://adisonline.com/biodrugs/pages/articleviewer.aspx?year=2005&issue=19060&article=00002&type=abstract | 10:28 |
| Lukas___ | abstract | 10:28 |
| Lukas___ | http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/ben/emiddt/2006/00000006/00000003/art00001?token=0058182c633af51f437a63736a6f5747464c23666c5f532e796f644a467c79675d7c4e724770f2784469d2b7 | 10:29 |
| Lukas___ | another abstract | 10:29 |
| Utopiah | http://www.quora.com/Aubrey-de-Grey (didn't know he was on Quora) | 10:31 |
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| kanzure | Utopiah: yeah, he signed up within the last month | 10:32 |
| kanzure | Lukas___: that's cancer immunotherapy.. | 10:33 |
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| Lukas___ | I know, I was focusing on cancer's ability to avoid immune detection. Most of the papers focus on stopping that. | 10:34 |
| Lukas___ | I will post more resources when I come across it | 10:35 |
| kanzure | i don't know why you are specifically worrying about immune detection | 10:36 |
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| Lukas___ | There are definitely other things to worry about, such as regulation of the protein, assuring the molecule produced doesn't do something harmful, but first you've got to make sure the body doesn't destroy whatever you' | 10:40 |
| Lukas___ | re | 10:40 |
| Lukas___ | trying to make | 10:40 |
| ThomasEgi | jmil, please excuse my no-knowledge since i'm new. but are there any restrictions on what kind of cells you can print? | 10:45 |
| jmil | see above... we are not printing cells... | 10:45 |
| jmil | what kind of cells do you work with? | 10:45 |
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| ThomasEgi | none yet. but i'd be interested in knowing if there's a way to create a mini-muscle thing | 10:46 |
| jmil | could probably work. would be a 5-year project most likely. | 10:55 |
| ThomasEgi | uh.. guess nature is faster then. | 10:55 |
| jmil | oh i mean 5-year project to figure out all the details. | 10:56 |
| jmil | the basics of getting cells and the blood vessel network there should be pretty straightforward though. | 10:57 |
| ThomasEgi | i guess it owuld be easier to take the material from a already existing muscles in my case. would only need a small strand, like a few cm long and thin | 10:58 |
| jmil | what do you want to do with it? | 10:58 |
| ThomasEgi | building a sort of mini-generator. | 10:59 |
| ThomasEgi | father of a friend of mine is going to lose his arm in 5 to 10 years | 10:59 |
| archels | To what? | 11:00 |
| ThomasEgi | to build a mechanical replacement | 11:00 |
| archels | I mean to what illness? | 11:00 |
| ThomasEgi | including controll from the old nerves. | 11:00 |
| ThomasEgi | i totaly dont know the english term. some kind of slime-bags or so | 11:00 |
| ThomasEgi | we thought about wiring up the old nerves during the amputation and build a wireless interface between nerves and the mechanics. | 11:02 |
| ThomasEgi | so right now we'r evaluating all possibilities to avoid power cords. and a biological-generator was one of the many ideas | 11:03 |
| archels | And you're a family of neurosurgeons? | 11:06 |
| ThomasEgi | no. electronics, mechanics ,and mechatronics students | 11:06 |
| ThomasEgi | so we sorta have a lack of biologists | 11:06 |
| archels | You can buy robotic replacement limbs, you know. | 11:07 |
| jmil | oh... but a biological-generator probably won't make enough force to power anything | 11:07 |
| jmil | meaningful | 11:07 |
| ThomasEgi | the generator only would have to power the circuitry which does the input/output of the nerve signals | 11:08 |
| ThomasEgi | those range in the milli-watt range | 11:08 |
| ThomasEgi | single-digit miliwatt | 11:08 |
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| ThomasEgi | well. the generator idea is propably not feasible. but evaluating it was nececssary. | 11:17 |
| archels | Maybe you should re-evaluate the feasibility of the entire project. | 11:27 |
| ThomasEgi | that will be the outcome of evaluating all sub-parts | 11:31 |
| archels | top tip: start with the difficult ones. | 11:31 |
| ThomasEgi | that'd be reading input from nerves. | 11:31 |
| ThomasEgi | followed by output, which is alot easier already. | 11:31 |
| ThomasEgi | hardest part is to get hands on good electrodes. | 11:32 |
| ThomasEgi | and of course getting them in place. | 11:33 |
| ThomasEgi | most of the project is regular engineering work. there's nothing we need that wouldnt exist already. | 11:34 |
| archels | So if the difficult things magically resolve themselves, only easy things remain? Really? | 11:53 |
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| kanzure | archels: what? | 11:56 |
| archels | kanzure: just trolling ThomasEgi | 11:56 |
| kanzure | yeah, stop | 11:57 |
| kanzure | or at least do it better.. | 11:57 |
| kanzure | ThomasEgi: what do you think about openprosthetics.org? | 11:57 |
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| ThomasEgi | last time i checked it was a nice collection of lego models | 12:03 |
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| jmil | kanzure: http://biomaterials.org/ | 13:15 |
| jmil | just found out, will be presenting here: http://2011.biomaterials.org/ | 13:15 |
| jmil | 15 min talk | 13:15 |
| jmil | i will definitely be able to disclose some stuff then | 13:16 |
| kanzure | neat :) | 13:17 |
| kanzure | will it be recorded? | 13:17 |
| jmil | likely not | 13:19 |
| jmil | actually, surely not | 13:19 |
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| Lukas___ | http://abc.com.au/news/stories/2008/01/24/2146032.htm | 13:28 |
| Lukas___ | wtf? | 13:28 |
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| kanzure | i just got an email from Jeff Moe <moe@alephobjects.com> | 13:39 |
| kanzure | jebba: someone is using your domain name | 13:39 |
| jebba | huh? | 13:40 |
| kanzure | someone named jeff | 13:40 |
| kanzure | i guess. | 13:40 |
| jebba | maybe redmine sent something automatically to you? I dont think I "manually" wrote one. I am Jeff ;) | 13:40 |
| kanzure | it was sent to reprap-dev | 13:41 |
| jebba | Jeff Moe, to be exact ;) | 13:41 |
| kanzure | oh. hi jeff | 13:41 |
| jebba | heh | 13:41 |
| kanzure | that makes sense then | 13:41 |
| kanzure | problem solved.. | 13:41 |
| jebba | ah ya, to reprap-dev i just sent some noise. | 13:41 |
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| kanzure | "Hi there! I am a Brazilian cyborg anthropologist and and I am in London for a couple of days. I would love to visit London Hacker Space. Is it possible? My friend Alexandre Abdo visited LHS two months ago. Does anybody there remember of him?" | 16:58 |
| kanzure | hmm brazilian cyborgs | 16:58 |
| kanzure | i imagine there might be more brazilian cyborg anthropologists than brazilian cyborgs | 16:58 |
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| uniqanomaly | kanzure: good point | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | ;D | 16:59 |
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| kanzure | does this load for anyone? | 18:05 |
| kanzure | http://70.32.108.164/~hplus/2010/12/21/lifebox-immortality/ | 18:05 |
| superkuh | kanzure: No. It loads the top head/nav but stops at " <!-- article " every time. | 18:11 |
| ThomasEgi | "Notice: Theme without comments.php is deprecated since version 3.0 with no alternative available" | 18:12 |
| kanzure | superkuh: that's fixed now, thx | 18:18 |
| kanzure | ThomasEgi: yeah, i'm slowly working my way through the errors | 18:18 |
| ThomasEgi | article loads now for me | 18:19 |
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| kanzure | hi timschmidt | 19:12 |
| timschmidt | hola | 19:12 |
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| JayDugger | kanzure..."Lifebox Immortality" loads, but it shows the author as "broken" and has the comments error ThomasEgi mentioned. | 19:52 |
| jmil | immortality is a 404. there's a lesson in there somewhere. | 19:58 |
| * AlonzoTG just spent 2 hours rambling about 2-stage vacuum tube amplifiers on a mailing list. =P | 20:00 | |
| uniqanomaly | http://www.trepan.com/HumPhys3_08MoskalenkoLO1.pdf | 20:00 |
| uniqanomaly | The Effect of Craniotomy on the Intracranial Hemodynamics | 20:00 |
| uniqanomaly | and Cerebrospinal Fluid Dynamics in Humans | 20:00 |
| uniqanomaly | if anyone is interested | 20:00 |
| AlonzoTG | mildly. | 20:02 |
| AlonzoTG | I used to read lots of neural science stuff, | 20:02 |
| AlonzoTG | then I got sick of it because I thought it was time to get to work. | 20:02 |
| AlonzoTG | So now I'm trying to build a robotics lab to test my ideas. | 20:02 |
| AlonzoTG | but it's taking so long that my neural science knowledge is getting rusty. =( | 20:03 |
| AlonzoTG | So I'm having to go back to reading just to stay on my game. | 20:03 |
| uniqanomaly | "according to our study, the cerebral blood flow may increase after craniotomy by approximately 8–10%," | 20:03 |
| AlonzoTG | Tell it to ##neuroscience. | 20:04 |
| uniqanomaly | I consider 8-10% blood flow increase an 'upgrade', so I guess it belongs here | 20:05 |
| uniqanomaly | ;) | 20:05 |
| AlonzoTG | I don't know. | 20:06 |
| AlonzoTG | (crap, timer on my oven didn't start...) | 20:06 |
| AlonzoTG | So, can anyone show me this H+ roadmap? | 20:07 |
| AlonzoTG | The more I study the human body, the more amazing it is. | 20:07 |
| AlonzoTG | While I fully, and enthuseastically, support upgrades, it's difficult to think of ones that don't have disadvantages somewhere else. | 20:08 |
| kanzure | h+ roadmap, the document, is stale, old, and not worth your time | 20:11 |
| AlonzoTG | OK... | 20:12 |
| AlonzoTG | Good; now I guess I can get about the task of drafting a new one. ;) | 20:12 |
| kanzure | maybe you should use my 2011-01-03 draft instead? | 20:12 |
| AlonzoTG | show! | 20:13 |
| kanzure | not yet | 20:13 |
| kanzure | but you sound like you're more interested in agi; how about ben's agi roadmap? | 20:13 |
| AlonzoTG | Lemme google that in a second, after I've tamed my inbox. | 20:14 |
| jmil | kanzure: tissue eng. is a big part of that, instead of mechanotronics upgrades, ya? | 20:15 |
| * AlonzoTG 's most desperate need is intelligence; hence that's my focus. =P | 20:15 | |
| kanzure | both.. but yes tissue engineering is important to me | 20:15 |
| kanzure | AlonzoTG: intelligence is a scam and you've been had. | 20:15 |
| AlonzoTG | Fascinating!!!! | 20:15 |
| AlonzoTG | A transhumanist who talks about tissue engineering! How remarkable!! =))))) | 20:15 |
| jmil | i'll drink to that. then we'll replace you liver. | 20:16 |
| kanzure | wait, which one are we going to sell on the black market? | 20:16 |
| jmil | oh don't worry. the first profits go to white vans. | 20:16 |
| jmil | it is interesting though. in the tissue eng. market the most profits are at the top of the market where the wealthy have amazing health care. selling one out of a white van minority report style will not make you rich in this case. | 20:17 |
| AlonzoTG | Ben Goertzel is a truly bizarre genius-crackpot hybrid... | 20:19 |
| QuantumG | can you identify any genius? ;) | 20:21 |
| kanzure | he's presently paying me for the hplusmagazine.com drupal2wordpress conversion | 20:22 |
| AlonzoTG | Can someone see if my server is up? It should be on 66.92.168.49:8000 | 20:23 |
| AlonzoTG | I have a roadmap-ish document somewhere on that wiki, I think. | 20:23 |
| kanzure | part 4: promotion | 20:24 |
| kanzure | yawn | 20:24 |
| AlonzoTG | Ok... | 20:24 |
| AlonzoTG | fine, | 20:24 |
| AlonzoTG | edit the page then... | 20:24 |
| AlonzoTG | =P | 20:24 |
| kanzure | i prefer my wikis in git :P | 20:25 |
| kanzure | but even if it was i don't think i'd edit it | 20:25 |
| AlonzoTG | I also have the yahoogroup: http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/thresearch/ | 20:28 |
| AlonzoTG | What's up with the extropians anyway? They only seem interested in intermittent liars these days. =P | 20:33 |
| jmil | kanzure: do you use NIH RePORTER? | 20:41 |
| jmil | e.g. this grant is a ffreaking lot of fun: http://projectreporter.nih.gov/project_info_description.cfm?aid=7871327&icde=6800019 | 20:41 |
| kanzure | no, what is it? | 20:41 |
| kanzure | hm that's your guy | 20:42 |
| kanzure | "the investigators will focus as a case study on the development of a vascularized engineered liver." | 20:42 |
| kanzure | "In addition to novel approaches to generate patterned multi-cell type constructs, the investigators will also develop nanoparticles for non-invasive monitoring of tissue vascularization." | 20:43 |
| jmil | ya that's what we are doing | 20:43 |
| jmil | all of it at once | 20:43 |
| jmil | it's a 5-year grant, pending renewal every year tho | 20:44 |
| kanzure | mri signalling? or radio signalling? or uh.. | 20:44 |
| jmil | so many ways to do it. really there are tons. | 20:44 |
| kanzure | oh are you not there yet :P | 20:44 |
| jmil | we are... our collaborator has the particles | 20:57 |
| jmil | lots of different kinds | 20:57 |
| jmil | a couple of us are working on making the liver mimics | 20:58 |
| jmil | it's a big team, but it could definitely be bigger | 21:01 |
| jmil | but NIH doesn't have enough money for that, so research is slooooooow | 21:01 |
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| jmil | we are all at minimum wage anyway | 21:04 |
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| kanzure | jrabbit: why isn't povray in debian.cs.pdx.edu squeeze? | 21:28 |
| kanzure | er | 21:28 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: | 21:28 |
| kanzure | jrabbit: of course, you might know the answer too | 21:28 |
| kanzure | oh it's in non-free. | 21:31 |
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| jrayhawk | Yeah, it has a non-commercial license. | 21:42 |
| jrayhawk | This is why blender exists. | 21:42 |
| kanzure | blender is an awful raycaster | 21:43 |
| kanzure | it doesn't even do raycasting! | 21:43 |
| kanzure | heh | 21:43 |
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| Nomadicus | Oops, I think I am going to be cross posting, I have a message I ment to post here but posted it on #reprap instead. Please forgive me if you are bothered by cross posting. | 23:33 |
| Nomadicus | Hello, is there anyone here able to assist me with reverse engineer a scanner driver? | 23:33 |
| Nomadicus | I did also post this at #sane but that channel does not have much life. | 23:34 |
| Nomadicus | This is realitevly critical to me as my work directly relates to this device. | 23:35 |
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| --- Log closed Tue Jan 25 00:00:10 2011 | ||
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