| --- Log opened Mon Mar 19 00:00:58 2012 | ||
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| strangewarp | Hmmm | 01:20 |
|---|---|---|
| strangewarp | Does anyone actually have a positive opinion of Alex Knapp? | 01:21 |
| strangewarp | He seems dedicated to worshipping ancient Roman wisdom, and posting about how any interesting tech developments are centuries away, even though he is supposedly Discover magazine's transhumanist correspondent. | 01:21 |
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| Steel2 | strangewarp: He actually works for forbes | 01:32 |
| lichen | they only have one? | 01:33 |
| Steel2 | he's just a staff writer for forbes | 01:34 |
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| strangewarp | oh, hmmm | 01:57 |
| katsmeow-afk | http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-17183890 : Woman considers hand removal for bionic replacement | 01:58 |
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| Coornail | well I guess I would want to do the same | 02:39 |
| Coornail | and that robotic arm on the bottom just looks absolutely awesome | 02:40 |
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| JayDugger1 | ls | 06:02 |
| JayDugger1 | Shit. | 06:02 |
| JayDugger1 | Wrong window. | 06:02 |
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| JayDugger1 | Good morning, everyone. | 06:20 |
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| kanzure | damn you all hop online at roughly the same time | 07:25 |
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| kanzure | hi mindbound | 07:46 |
| mindbound | Hi! | 07:46 |
| Mariu | hey kanzure, mindbound | 07:46 |
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| kanzure | aw | 07:47 |
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| kanzure | mindbound: what's up? | 07:48 |
| mindbound | Nothing much, accidentally stumbled upon this chan. What's up here? | 07:51 |
| Mariu | brb | 07:51 |
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| kanzure | mindbound: global world domination | 07:51 |
| mindbound | I, for one, welcome our new robot overlords. | 07:51 |
| kanzure | starting with cybernetic flying beetles | 07:51 |
| kanzure | then we'll move up to cybernetic flying starfishes | 07:51 |
| mindbound | And from there, it's just a step to cybernetic flying octopi. | 07:52 |
| kanzure | correct | 07:52 |
| strangewarp | better have a trapdoor to disgorge some darn sashimi | 07:54 |
| strangewarp | I covet this | 07:54 |
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| kanzure | "The evolving threat of antimicrobial resistance" http://whqlibdoc.who.int/publications/2012/9789241503181_eng.pdf | 08:00 |
| kanzure | "Canadian Integrated Programme for Antimicrobial Resistance Surveillance" | 08:01 |
| kanzure | these names are still awesome | 08:01 |
| kanzure | "antibiotic resistance surveillance" | 08:01 |
| Mariu | :p | 08:02 |
| kanzure | so according to page 82 the only recent techniques are cyclic lipopetides and oxazolidinones | 08:03 |
| kanzure | "The Roll Back Malaria initiative estimates the R&D costs at approximately US $800 million per new malaria vaccine" man we suck | 08:05 |
| archels | fuck vaccines, we need that laser system to shoot mosquitos out of the air. | 08:10 |
| ThomasEgi | someone called for an engineer? | 08:10 |
| * ThomasEgi gets his welding goggles | 08:10 | |
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| kanzure | hi zacharycohn | 08:13 |
| zacharycohn | hi kanzure | 08:14 |
| * mindbound AFK. | 08:15 | |
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| delinquentme | kanzure, is there a data aggregator for companies who are cool w giving out public data and want data hackers to make novel correlations on that data? | 10:06 |
| kanzure | infochimps | 10:06 |
| kanzure | datamarket | 10:06 |
| kanzure | aaron swartz used to run theinfo.org... dunno what happened to that | 10:06 |
| jrayhawk | netflix had that recommendation contest | 10:13 |
| kanzure | which they promptly shat on | 10:24 |
| kanzure | wikileaks has some nice data | 10:25 |
| delinquentme | WHY ARE SO MANY STARTUPS PISS POOR BORING | 10:39 |
| delinquentme | UGH. | 10:39 |
| strangewarp | Because that is what the environment believes will be profitable | 10:41 |
| strangewarp | Nice, realistic, sadness-inducing boredom | 10:41 |
| strangewarp | very savvy | 10:41 |
| delinquentme | fml | 10:48 |
| delinquentme | i dont say that lightly | 10:48 |
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| kanzure | i don't even understand how these people can justify or legitimize their existence | 11:03 |
| kanzure | https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/viewform?formkey=dERxQ1F5b1RKX3hDTC0xVnRRaWk3Q2c6MA | 11:03 |
| kanzure | "Please check off from these options how you would prefer to be ass-raped. Thanks." | 11:03 |
| kanzure | this is woodrow wilson center's latest "synthetic biology project" (a ... survey) | 11:03 |
| kanzure | "Ensure that the negative consequences of synthetic biology applications with long-term effects, such as changing the human microbiome or the production of synbio-based fuel, are benign (or limited)" | 11:05 |
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| kanzure | ALSE. you can't regulate whether or not I consider it a negative consequence. | 11:05 |
| kanzure | *FALSE | 11:05 |
| kanzure | "Determine whether future oversight in the United States should be based on synthetic biology products, or on the processes used to create them" | 11:06 |
| kanzure | FALSE: future oversight is not something i've agreed to yet | 11:06 |
| kanzure | "Ensure that ethical, legal, and social concerns are addressed in a legitimate manner, and identify and include groups that should be represented in this broader discussion" | 11:06 |
| kanzure | FALSE: i don't care what you think | 11:06 |
| kanzure | "Decide which social, ethical and religious issues will be incorporated into the governance and regulatory structures, who will make these decisions, and how the issues will be incorporated" | 11:06 |
| kanzure | FALSE: i don't care about your regulatory structures, and will ignore you if you impede me anyway | 11:06 |
| kanzure | "Ban certain applications that pose a significant threat (deadly viruses, re-engineered human stem cells)" | 11:07 |
| kanzure | FALSE: i will do it anyway, screw your bans | 11:07 |
| kanzure | "Regulate the Do-It-Yourself biology community" | 11:07 |
| kanzure | hahaha | 11:07 |
| kanzure | "Identify intellectual property-related (IP) issues specific to synthetic biology and consider changes to the current patent and copyright systems" | 11:07 |
| kanzure | FALSE: IP is bullshit | 11:07 |
| kanzure | "Explore which IP regimes have worked “best” historically" | 11:08 |
| kanzure | FALSE: screw that | 11:08 |
| kanzure | "Make sure the concept of risk (in addition to benefits) is properly communicated by scientists and policymakers to the public, particularly members of the public with low scientific literacy" | 11:08 |
| kanzure | FALSE: your theory of risk sucks | 11:08 |
| kanzure | "Educate journalists to promote clear and unexaggerated reporting on achievements in synthetic biology" | 11:08 |
| kanzure | ^good luck with that one.. gah | 11:08 |
| kanzure | in conclusion, i think their survey is wrong and completely biased towards pro-regulatory pro-risk-thinking individuals | 11:09 |
| kanzure | (i mean "pro-[risk-is-a-good-way-to-think-about-things] indviduals") | 11:09 |
| lichen | nobody's going to say they think high risk behaviors should go unreported | 11:10 |
| kanzure | "high risk behaviors"... like breeding children THAT MIGHT TAKE OVER THE WORLD? | 11:10 |
| kanzure | Therefore, we should ban sex immediately | 11:11 |
| kanzure | your logic sucks | 11:11 |
| lichen | ...? | 11:12 |
| lichen | dude i was agreeing with you | 11:12 |
| kanzure | you said "nobody's going to say x" suggesting that you support "nobody saying x" where x is somewhat related to what i'm arguing | 11:13 |
| lichen | youre skewing what i said | 11:13 |
| kanzure | ok please state exactly what you mean | 11:13 |
| lichen | what i meant was the way the question is framed doesnt accurately respresent the argument in question | 11:13 |
| lichen | its framed in such a way that its very unlikely anyone would disagree with it | 11:13 |
| kanzure | yep.. "Would you like it up the ass or down the throat first?" | 11:14 |
| lichen | like this -> "Ensure that the negative consequences of synthetic biology applications with long-term effects, such as changing the human microbiome or the production of synbio-based fuel, are benign (or limited)" | 11:14 |
| lichen | nobody would disagree that you want to think about the effects of what youre doing | 11:15 |
| lichen | well maybe some would, but i digress | 11:15 |
| lichen | its not as important a focus as what the issues might actually be | 11:15 |
| kanzure | nobody would disagree with that quote, but you absolutely know that they are going to use responses to limit the development of those technologies | 11:16 |
| lichen | regulatory committees have a tendency to go heavy | 11:16 |
| lichen | no unnecessary risk and all that stuff | 11:16 |
| kanzure | have you ever looked up "theory of risk"? it turns out it's based on the old "gods of fortune" thing | 11:17 |
| kanzure | i.e. prayer | 11:17 |
| lichen | i havent, though id imagine it has much more to do with statistical analysis | 11:17 |
| kanzure | the concept of "risk" existed long before stats | 11:17 |
| lichen | well clearly | 11:17 |
| kanzure | `When the terminology of risk took ground, it replaced the older notion that thought "in terms of good and bad fortune."` | 11:18 |
| kanzure | `Niklas Luhmann (1996) seeks to explain this transition: "Perhaps, this was simply a loss of plausibility of the old rhetorics of Fortuna as an allegorical figure of religious content and of prudentia as a (noble) virtue in the emerging commercial society."` | 11:18 |
| kanzure | the question shouldn't be "Do we want bad things to happen?" but "Knowing that bad things can and will happen, and always assuming that they will happen, how can we solve these problems in advance?" | 11:21 |
| kanzure | if something is truly going to kill us all, then you should work on making us invulnerable, not weaker.. | 11:22 |
| lichen | yeah | 11:22 |
| kanzure | the whole idea of proposing to regulate DIYbio in the face of biohackers is really strange | 11:25 |
| kanzure | that guy should be booed out of his chair | 11:25 |
| strangewarp | Regulation feels like the right thing, to the untrained mind | 11:30 |
| kanzure | arguments for regulation are very easy to comprehend | 11:30 |
| kanzure | (.. if you already believe in it) | 11:31 |
| kanzure | for me, it is very difficult to understand.. they are essentially lying to politicians, telling them that biology can be controlled like a state secret | 11:31 |
| kanzure | with a state secret, you can shoot everyone who knows it | 11:31 |
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| kanzure | huh.. amazon finally bought kiva | 14:31 |
| kanzure | hi thesnark | 14:33 |
| kanzure | thesnark: http://python-requests.org is way better than python-mechanize | 14:34 |
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| kanzure | thesnark: wb | 14:37 |
| thesnark | hey kanzure | 14:55 |
| kanzure | how goes the coding? | 15:02 |
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| thesnark | kanzure ugh...doing a school project right now =[ | 15:06 |
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| thesnark | I imagine development will continue sometime after tomorrow | 15:07 |
| thesnark | tomorrow night at the earliest | 15:07 |
| kanzure | pesky school getting in the way of things again | 15:10 |
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| thesnark | kanzure 6 more weeks and Im done | 15:11 |
| thesnark | with school, that is | 15:11 |
| kanzure | "with life" | 15:12 |
| thesnark | or life | 15:14 |
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| Juul | Does anyone know where I can actually read the report mentioned in this article? http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2012/03/111-organizations-call-for-synth.html | 15:23 |
| Juul | ah found it http://www.foe.org/news/blog/2012-03-global-coalition-calls-oversight-synthetic-biology | 15:26 |
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| kanzure | Juul: let me know if there's anything interesting in there | 15:30 |
| Juul | kanzure, ok | 15:30 |
| kanzure | "No Patents On Life! (Germany)" sounds like a possibly useful NPO | 15:38 |
| Replop1 | What is Death , guys ? | 15:57 |
| Replop1 | it seems the question is far more open than I thought : http://www.salon.com/2012/03/18/the_evolution_of_death/?1 | 15:58 |
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| kanzure | Replop: do you mean information theoretic death? | 15:59 |
| Replop | I mean the raw definition of biological death. "brain death" isn't the same now as it was 70 years ago, for instance | 16:00 |
| Replop | some irreversible transformations of the time aren't irreversible anymore , with adequate drugs | 16:00 |
| kanzure | a chart would be nice | 16:01 |
| Replop | researchs seems to be on progress. | 16:01 |
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| uniqanomaly | 'emerging technology that is developing rapidly yet remains largely unregulated' funny how regulating anything slows progress, maybe thats the point? | 16:51 |
| A-Lusion | flying cars :I | 16:51 |
| kanzure | i don't think slowing is a good idea | 16:51 |
| kanzure | i'm a little disappointed that you support that | 16:52 |
| uniqanomaly | kanzure: so many assumptions, where you got that :D | 16:52 |
| kanzure | "funny how regulating anything slows progress, maybe that's the point" | 16:52 |
| uniqanomaly | I'm hard core libertarian | 16:52 |
| kanzure | many libertarian orgs are listed on that pdf juul linked to | 16:53 |
| uniqanomaly | yeah perhaps my wording is to blame partially | 16:53 |
| kanzure | it is very easy to misconstrue these things | 16:53 |
| uniqanomaly | I meant maybe that's their point | 16:53 |
| kanzure | it is their point.. their point is broken, because i can just ignore them | 16:53 |
| uniqanomaly | oh yeah we regulate it and then terrorists will be like "oh my god its illegal I can't do that" | 16:55 |
| uniqanomaly | haha | 16:55 |
| A-Lusion | emerging technology allows us in due to be more humble and constructive towards one another and engaged in it's implications and liabilities as well as prospects and possibilities without having giving it up to the regulators to make it worse and add training wheels to it while they can exploit it for control / poower | 16:55 |
| uniqanomaly | >>>oh yeah we regulate it and then terrorists will be like "oh my god its illegal I can't do that"<<< their POV | 16:55 |
| kanzure | A-Lusion: no they basically want to stop it | 16:56 |
| uniqanomaly | idiotic justifications of everything to cover hidden agenda | 16:56 |
| fenn | disruptive technology is terrorism towards established corporations | 16:56 |
| A-Lusion | unless they can make a profit off of it. | 16:56 |
| kanzure | hi fenn! | 16:56 |
| fenn | good day | 16:56 |
| kanzure | su was a little upset that i wasn't pitching full genome synthesis | 16:57 |
| fenn | are you in the bay area? | 16:58 |
| kanzure | nope | 16:58 |
| fenn | hm ok | 16:58 |
| fenn | well, you have to consider the bullshit coefficient | 16:58 |
| fenn | it's like an impedance mismatch | 16:58 |
| kanzure | also they assigned me a way too high "DIYbio" weight | 16:58 |
| fenn | if you push at 1:1 bullshit to realistic projection ratio, people get confused | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | "Comprehensive public and worker participation | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | should be provided throughout the decision-making | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | processes involving synthetic biology. | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | " | 16:59 |
| uniqanomaly | rotfl | 16:59 |
| kanzure | "oh since bryan associates with diybio, clearly he is only going to sell to the diybio list" | 16:59 |
| fenn | did you explain that nobody actually wants full genome synthesis? | 16:59 |
| kanzure | are you sure? | 17:00 |
| kanzure | i think plasmid editing is dumb: just print what you're actually interested in (with the plasmid) | 17:00 |
| kanzure | gene pcring is also dumb | 17:00 |
| fenn | a plasmid isn't a genome | 17:00 |
| kanzure | true | 17:00 |
| fenn | whole plasmid synthesis is realistic and useful | 17:00 |
| kanzure | Juul: what were you cliaming about endy's kids? | 17:01 |
| kanzure | that they don't do any restriction enzyme steps? | 17:01 |
| kanzure | fenn: ligating things together to make >100 kb is generaly useful | 17:02 |
| kanzure | *generally | 17:02 |
| kanzure | 100 kb isn't a genome but you can stick enough of them together | 17:02 |
| kanzure | fenn: what have you been up to? | 17:04 |
| fenn | drinking lots of tea | 17:04 |
| fenn | faffing about ineffectively | 17:04 |
| fenn | fuck | 17:04 |
| fenn | it seems like there are 2 usable hours in every day | 17:05 |
| Juul | kanzure, yes I believe that is the case. If I remember correctly they order the completed plasmids. | 17:05 |
| Juul | I don't actually think this moratorium has anything to do with terrorism | 17:06 |
| Juul | just throwing that out there | 17:07 |
| Juul | I do think they have some good points, not that I haven't heard them before, but I think it's very foolish of them to target this at Synthetic Biology as a whole | 17:08 |
| Juul | They could just as well have targeted it at Genetic Engineering | 17:08 |
| Juul | "VII. Protect economic and environmental justice." | 17:09 |
| Juul | that has everything to do with bio-fuels and almost nothing to do with the rest of synthetic biology | 17:10 |
| kanzure | did you see that survey that todd posted to diybio? | 17:10 |
| Juul | no? | 17:10 |
| kanzure | http://groups.google.com/group/diybio/browse_thread/thread/55ac8e2d03216e48 | 17:12 |
| Juul | thanks | 17:31 |
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| Juul | they got a comment-field full of complaints | 17:40 |
| kanzure | paste! paste | 17:40 |
| Juul | though i forgot to complain about the fact that they're using a google service for something and calling it anonymous | 17:40 |
| kanzure | if you don't paste, only 1 person will read it | 17:40 |
| kanzure | and that 1 person will ignore you as a loony | 17:40 |
| Juul | http://pastebin.com/VeB7a0C8 | 17:42 |
| Juul | :P | 17:42 |
| JayDugger1 | Fenn: 2 usable hours per day? Wait until you marry. You'll fondly recall such halcyon times. | 17:42 |
| JayDugger1 | Good evening, everyone. | 17:42 |
| Juul | evenin' | 17:44 |
| kanzure | "If there are no videos available, why are these proceedings opaque? Why should the general public trust those who govern if they are not willing to open up their discussions to the public?" | 17:44 |
| kanzure | pcsbi had videos :| | 17:45 |
| Steel3 | what is this in response to? | 17:45 |
| Juul | pcsbi? | 17:45 |
| Juul | if there are videos, why are they not linked? | 17:45 |
| kanzure | president's commission for smoething about something about bioethics | 17:45 |
| Juul | ah yes | 17:45 |
| Juul | yes it did | 17:45 |
| Juul | it seems that this only has a report | 17:46 |
| Juul | I've been sitting here for hours with my headphones on and no music | 17:48 |
| Juul | -_- | 17:48 |
| katsmeow-afk | WHAT? | 17:49 |
| katsmeow-afk | i got a headphone-mic combo, and the mic looks silly when listening to radio, and the headphones are silly when talking to the puter | 17:50 |
| kanzure | Juul: no but really, maybe you should post that paste on the diybio list in the thread | 17:52 |
| kanzure | at least as an anonymous user | 17:52 |
| kanzure | "We are pleased to report our recent paper in which we surveyed | 17:52 |
| kanzure | Lab on a Chip platforms based on microfluidics, microstructures, | 17:52 |
| kanzure | microelectronics and microelectrode arrays which can be useful | 17:52 |
| kanzure | for Neuroscience researchers as new tools: | 17:52 |
| kanzure | Soe, A.K., S. Nahavandi, and K. Khoshmanesh, | 17:52 |
| kanzure | Neuroscience goes on a chip. | 17:52 |
| kanzure | Biosensors and Bioelectronics, available online 14 Feb 2012, in press. | 17:52 |
| kanzure | http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.bios.2012.02.012 | 17:52 |
| kanzure | For whom do not have access to Biosensors and Bioelectronics, | 17:52 |
| kanzure | please see the author copy (which is the uncorrected version) at: | 17:52 |
| kanzure | http://www.deakin.edu.au/itri/cisr/recent-pub.php " | 17:52 |
| kanzure | http://www.deakin.edu.au/itri/cisr/docs/09565663.pdf | 17:53 |
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| kanzure | Juul: hey, | 18:05 |
| kanzure | quick reality check | 18:05 |
| kanzure | i think i crashed protocol-online.org | 18:05 |
| kanzure | is it ok to post this to diybio asking if anyone knows him? | 18:05 |
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| ybit | 15:10 < kanzure> pesky school getting in the way of things again | 18:31 |
| * ybit is through with school for a very long time | 18:31 | |
| kanzure | ybit: since when | 18:32 |
| ybit | "I've never let my school interfere with my education." ~2 weeks ago | 18:32 |
| kanzure | so, it has come to this | 18:32 |
| ybit | i'm going to work full-time saving up for a move to buenos aires | 18:33 |
| ybit | i'm finishing school, just not going back for awhile | 18:34 |
| * ybit isn't going on his school rant | 18:34 | |
| * ybit walks away from the keyboard | 18:34 | |
| kanzure | ybit: you could come live with me and hack the pokemans | 18:36 |
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| ybit | hah! that sounds like a lot of fun, but i can save faster here | 18:54 |
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| Juul | kanzure, haha | 19:41 |
| Juul | kanzure, I wouldn't do it. I would take the same approach used by many when finding exploits: Stay anonymous at all costs. | 19:41 |
| Juul | He might be a decent guy, but worst case scenario is that he drags you to court. | 19:42 |
| kanzure | i am not looking for exploits | 19:42 |
| kanzure | :x | 19:42 |
| kanzure | i was using the site | 19:42 |
| Juul | yes, well | 19:42 |
| Juul | you found one | 19:42 |
| kanzure | haha | 19:42 |
| kanzure | haaa | 19:42 |
| kanzure | common use? | 19:42 |
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| Juul | did you just use it or were you scraping? | 19:42 |
| kanzure | i was using it at a reasonable rate | 19:43 |
| Juul | :) | 19:43 |
| Juul | hehe, well why not just fire him a friendly anonymous email then? | 19:43 |
| kanzure | who? | 19:43 |
| kanzure | :| | 19:43 |
| Juul | this guy? http://www.thomas-schenk.de/ | 19:45 |
| Juul | he owns the domain at any rate | 19:45 |
| kanzure | lovely php error in the background | 19:45 |
| kanzure | fsockopen - the best kind of error! | 19:46 |
| Juul | might be related to the other crash :) | 19:47 |
| kanzure | same ip? | 19:47 |
| ybit | yeah | 19:47 |
| ybit | oh, diff. conversation you two are having, nevermind | 19:47 |
| kanzure | http://alberteinstein.info/ albert einstein document collection | 19:47 |
| Juul | kanzure, not the same IP, but same hosting provider. Yeah probably not related unless he's doing | 19:55 |
| Juul | very cool | 19:55 |
| kanzure | very cool? | 19:57 |
| kanzure | oh, the link | 19:57 |
| Juul | yah | 19:57 |
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| kanzure | hi klafka | 20:11 |
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| klafka | sup kanzure | 20:54 |
| kanzure | not much | 20:59 |
| kanzure | how goes it? | 20:59 |
| klafka | bleh i am doing some drone work atm | 21:03 |
| Juul | stallman was at noisebridge last night | 21:08 |
| Juul | it was good to get an update on his views | 21:08 |
| Steel2 | he came to my school a few years ago | 21:09 |
| klafka | ah damn | 21:09 |
| klafka | i woulda gone to noisebridge for that | 21:09 |
| Juul | ah, well i was there and didn't get to ask my questions anyway | 21:09 |
| Steel2 | y'all san fran located? | 21:09 |
| joshcryer | His views have updated? | 21:10 |
| joshcryer | Not being snarky, just curious. | 21:10 |
| Juul | yes, some of that may be myself not remembering his views correctly, but at the very least his talk now deals with sass and smartphones | 21:11 |
| Juul | he also commented more directly on piracy | 21:12 |
| Juul | though he dislikes that term | 21:12 |
| kanzure | do you mean saas | 21:12 |
| kanzure | sass is the css thing | 21:12 |
| Juul | hehe yeah | 21:12 |
| Juul | i have a sass document open in another window :P | 21:12 |
| kanzure | brogrammers unite! | 21:13 |
| Juul | haha | 21:13 |
| Juul | i'm not actually writing sass, but the designer sent me some sass | 21:13 |
| kanzure | your designer knows sass? | 21:13 |
| kanzure | shit | 21:13 |
| kanzure | WHO IS YOUR DESIGNER | 21:13 |
| joshcryer | What did he say about piracy, Juul? | 21:14 |
| joshcryer | Time to embrace it I hope. | 21:14 |
| joshcryer | FOSS avoids talking about it. | 21:14 |
| Juul | hah, a german guy who is eager to learn. When we started working together two months ago he was using Windows and plain html+css. Now he runs ubuntu and uses middleman, haml and sass. | 21:14 |
| Mariu | see you you guys | 21:15 |
| kanzure | Juul: does he do the photoshopping? | 21:15 |
| kanzure | or just html/css? | 21:15 |
| Juul | kanzure, He does it all. He is very new though, but learning at a fast pace. | 21:15 |
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| Juul | hm, i guess his new portfolio site isn't up yet. probably will be up next week then. This is him: http://lookgoodonthe.net/portfolio/ | 21:16 |
| Juul | He did Eddan Katz's website. | 21:17 |
| Juul | I guess that's his most famous client so far. | 21:17 |
| Juul | oh here is the new portfolio: http://jehantremback.com/ | 21:18 |
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| kanzure | Juul: ok yeah i want him | 21:20 |
| Juul | :) | 21:21 |
| joshcryer | Juul, is this the talk? http://socialcam.com/v/F2TjXpuf | 21:21 |
| kanzure | Juul: so apparently gen9bio | 21:21 |
| kanzure | is just the same thing as codon devices | 21:21 |
| kanzure | http://www.synthesis.cc/2009/04/on-the-demise-of-condon-devices.html | 21:22 |
| kanzure | "Codon, as described to me by various people directly involved, was imagined as a full-service engineering firm -- synthetic genes and genomes, design services, the elusive "bio-fab" that would enable one-stop conversion of design information into functional molecules and living systems" | 21:22 |
| kanzure | eww in-house gene design | 21:22 |
| kanzure | or i mean, out-sourced genome design | 21:22 |
| Juul | oh. interesting | 21:22 |
| kanzure | "Codon was founded with of order $50 million, with no actual products ready to go." | 21:22 |
| Juul | joshcryer, sorry, didn't mean to not answer, give me a sec to type | 21:22 |
| kanzure | hahah | 21:22 |
| joshcryer | Juul, no worries man, I just went off and tried to find it. :) | 21:23 |
| kanzure | "Given that the maximum possible profit margin on synthetic genes is falling exponentially, it would seem that finding value in those particular atoms is going to get harder and harder." | 21:23 |
| kanzure | "DNA is cheap, and getting cheaper; the design of genetic circuits (resulting in bits) definitely costs more (in labor, etc.) than obtaining the physical sequence by FedEx." | 21:23 |
| kanzure | eh the design will be by software anyway | 21:24 |
| kanzure | i don't think that matters | 21:24 |
| kanzure | so in other words: gen9bio looks exactly the same as codon devices | 21:25 |
| Juul | joshcryer, so on unauthorized copies of proprietary software: Stallman's view, as interpreted by me though I try to represent it as correctly as possible based on my memories: Stallman sees it as the lesser of two evils. If your friend asks you for a copy of a proprietary piece of software, then you have to choose between not giving it to him and giving him an illegal unauthorized copy. Both are evil, but sharing is the lesser of the two evils. In o | 21:26 |
| Juul | rder for you not to fall into such moral dilemmas you should not use nor write proprietary software. It is Stallman's view that proprietary software is inherently evil/bad. That writing no program is always better than writing a proprietary program. | 21:26 |
| Juul | joshcryer, yes that is the video | 21:26 |
| Juul | kanzure, it's trying to do the same or it's the same company? | 21:27 |
| kanzure | same founders | 21:27 |
| kanzure | trying to do the same thing | 21:27 |
| kanzure | different company | 21:27 |
| katsmeow-afk | what about payment to a programmer for writing the first issue of the program, but the buyer is then free to give it away? | 21:27 |
| Juul | ok | 21:28 |
| Steel2 | kanzure: did codon achieve anything? | 21:28 |
| kanzure | they tanked | 21:29 |
| Steel2 | guessing they're getting given money again cuz people in charge have phds and investors throw good money after bad at biotech these days? | 21:29 |
| kanzure | because it's george fucking church | 21:30 |
| Steel2 | meh, a good academic a good businessman does not make | 21:31 |
| kanzure | do you know about george? | 21:31 |
| yashgaroth | it does in church's case | 21:31 |
| Steel2 | I just looked him up | 21:31 |
| Steel2 | I'm apparently in the wrong here, so shutting up. | 21:31 |
| kanzure | george is a monster | 21:32 |
| kanzure | he might not be particularly effective at business | 21:32 |
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| kanzure | but he knows how to sell himself | 21:32 |
| Juul | i heard someone in the know say that he has founded 40 companies of which 4 have been successful | 21:33 |
| kanzure | "co-founding (with Joseph Jacobson, Jay Keasling, and Drew Endy) Codon Devices, a biotech startup dedicated to synthetic biology, which produces DNA sequences to orde" | 21:34 |
| kanzure | hah | 21:34 |
| kanzure | those are the same names on http://gen9bio.com/team/ | 21:34 |
| kanzure | 1:10 is not bad | 21:34 |
| yashgaroth | it's about average really | 21:34 |
| kanzure | oh *founded*.. | 21:34 |
| kanzure | he sits on at least 40 boards | 21:35 |
| Juul | huh, i didn't know the MIT Media lab had a molecular machines division. Is that related to Knight lab? | 21:35 |
| kanzure | jacobson's group does some pretty neat shit | 21:36 |
| Juul | i'll have to read up | 21:37 |
| kanzure | Steel2: another guy who has founded a bunch of companies is whitesides | 21:39 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_M._Whitesides | 21:39 |
| kanzure | "the other george" | 21:39 |
| kanzure | "Whitesides is the author of more than 950 scientific articles and is listed as an inventor on more than 50 patents. He ranked 5th on Thomson ISI's list of the 1000 most cited chemists from 1981-1997." | 21:39 |
| kanzure | "Whitesides has co-founded over 12 companies with a combined market capitalization of over $20 billion. These companies include Genzyme, GelTex, Theravance, Surface Logix, Nano-Terra, and WMR Biomedical." | 21:40 |
| Steel2 | I think one of the good ways to make money is to start a company that does commercializations for universities | 21:41 |
| Steel2 | could be wrong though | 21:42 |
| Juul | haha, firefox restore session results in auto-start of youtube videos --> Carl Sagan and Richard Stallman talking on top of a some up-beat chip-tunes music. | 21:43 |
| kanzure | Tron Legacy and The Digital Frontier: Billions and Billions remix | 21:44 |
| kanzure | sounds legit to met | 21:44 |
| kanzure | *me | 21:44 |
| Juul | :) | 21:44 |
| Juul | kanzure, are the gnusha logs indexed by search robots on purpose? | 21:48 |
| Juul | it could be awkward if we're in here "shooting the shit" about someone, they google themselves and the logs show up | 21:49 |
| Juul | though i guess we can just keep that in mind | 21:49 |
| Juul | Search bots. | 21:50 |
| Juul | not actual robots | 21:51 |
| Juul | rummaging through your printed logs | 21:51 |
| Juul | that i'm assuming are streaming out of your dot-matrix printer at all times | 21:51 |
| Juul | I'm switching to work-mode. | 21:51 |
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| joshcryer | Juul, sorry I afk'd to make tea, so thanks for that answer. That's perfectly reasonable from a "let's create our own stuff" standpoint, that is, pushing that narrative. | 21:55 |
| joshcryer | (comment for log) | 21:55 |
| katsmeow-afk | the first for-profit interpreter Bill Gates was part of selling was for the Altair 8800 , and MITS sold the interpreter for $500 a pop, giving Gates (and Paul Allen) $30 for the 4K version, $35 for the 8K version and $60 for the expanded version | 22:00 |
| katsmeow-afk | had i known that then, i'd have gotten a much earlier start on disliking them | 22:01 |
| kanzure | i started disliking them before they were born! | 22:18 |
| kanzure | retrohipsterism | 22:18 |
| kanzure | holy hell pidgin crashed | 22:25 |
| kanzure | foucist: where are you :( | 22:27 |
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| kanzure | hi skorket | 22:41 |
| skorket | hey kanzure | 22:41 |
| skorket | So I've been reading "The singularity is near" by Kurzweil, I'm sure you're all familiar with it. | 22:46 |
| skorket | His 'sixth epoch' is when the 'universe wakes up' | 22:47 |
| kanzure | meh | 22:48 |
| lichen | ive been trying to read through that | 22:48 |
| lichen | its a bit repetitive | 22:48 |
| kanzure | yes | 22:48 |
| skorket | yeah, he's trying to market... | 22:48 |
| skorket | but you guys don't fundamentally disagree with anything he says. | 22:49 |
| skorket | Maybe you disagree on the timeline or some of the specifics, but overall, we're all on the same page, right? | 22:50 |
| skorket | Anyway, assuming that the sixth epoch is really going to happen and we create machines that try to use the energy as efficiently as possible for computation | 22:51 |
| skorket | the next step, for our solar system at least, is to make sure the sun isn't wasting all that energy, dumping it into places where we have no use for it | 22:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | dyson sphere | 22:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | or at least , a ring | 22:52 |
| skorket | or dyson sphere like | 22:52 |
| skorket | but at this point, that means the sun would essentially go dark... | 22:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | why? | 22:53 |
| sylph_mako | What I gathered from Kurzweil is not much "some serious shit's gonna go down maaaan." Because I don't trust his judgement deeply. He's right about the serious shit though. | 22:54 |
| sylph_mako | Hehehe | 22:54 |
| skorket | because any energy escaping is waste | 22:54 |
| katsmeow-afk | make the ring so far in that the sun dwarfs it, or build it outside the earth's orbit | 22:54 |
| katsmeow-afk | there's some physics problems with making a sphere, even a few rings around one star in different orbit planes would be easier | 22:55 |
| skorket | Also, since intelligence and life is the norm rather than the exception, if other civilizations have reached this point, this means they've done the same thing to their suns | 22:56 |
| skorket | which means the universe is in the process of waking up, just constrained by the speed of light | 22:56 |
| kanzure | some serious shit might go down, but ray's not gonna cause it | 22:56 |
| skorket | kanzure, I don't think Kurzweil is claiming he will and I don't think anyone is arguing that he will either | 22:57 |
| skorket | To me Kurzweil is just expanding on some obvious points and taking them to their logical conclusion | 22:57 |
| skorket | He's wrong some of the time but otherwise it seems pretty reasonable | 22:57 |
| skorket | I think he's just noticing patterns rather than claiming any ownership | 22:58 |
| skorket | Anyway, that was my big revelation. I might have some flaws in my reasoning so I wanted to talk about it a bit... | 22:58 |
| katsmeow-afk | do you have an url for specifically his latest stuff you're talking about? | 22:58 |
| skorket | katsmeow-afk, I've just been reading his book...The dark sun stuff is just what I've been thinking about | 22:59 |
| kanzure | aww yeah. got a nice thunderstorm going on over here. | 23:00 |
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| katsmeow-afk | wow, that storm is still sitting in Indiana, Ok, and Tx | 23:07 |
| katsmeow-afk | a lil moer into Mo and Arkansa now | 23:08 |
| * katsmeow-afk munches dinner | 23:08 | |
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| katsmeow-afk | in china today: After the increase on Tuesday, benchmark diesel will be about $1.22 (76p) per litre and 90-octane petrol about $1.17, although prices vary by region. | 23:15 |
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| Utopiah_ | http://fffff.at/free-universal-construction-kit/ | 23:39 |
| kanzure | too much artsy flare: i am probably being marketed something | 23:40 |
| nathaniel | the open-ended construction toy cartel is at it again. | 23:45 |
| -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 23:46 | |
| nathaniel | 1. get all the kids hooked on different toys | 23:47 |
| nathaniel | 2. promote inter-toy jealousy | 23:47 |
| nathaniel | 3. release interoperability connectors for "free" | 23:47 |
| kanzure | 4. hire the rayhawks to do your art | 23:48 |
| joshcryer | where's the free reprap | 23:51 |
| fenn | tanstaafr | 23:53 |
| fenn | don't you know that if you repeat something enough times it becomes true?* | 23:53 |
| -!- marainein [~marainein@114-198-78-177.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 23:54 | |
| --- Log closed Tue Mar 20 00:00:55 2012 | ||
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