| --- Log opened Sat Jun 16 00:00:41 2012 | ||
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| brownies | kanzure: wasn't it today? | 02:24 |
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| fenn | long awaited services upgrade and database prune, oh boy | 05:26 |
| * fenn battens down the hatches | 05:26 | |
| JayDugger | Good luck. | 05:33 |
| JayDugger | Good luck to fenn and to Steel2. | 06:00 |
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| archels | kanzure: thanks, checking out http://anselmlevskaya.com/ | 07:30 |
| archels | seems like I guy I would get along with; does he ever come on here to chat? | 07:32 |
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| archels | Hacking Biology is like trying to root an alien server over a milli-baud TTY connection with no error correction and no echo. #diybio | 07:35 |
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| chido | klafka2: we do exist, we just are kind of quiet about it | 08:08 |
| chido | Steel2: ^ I guess that was meant for you... I'm still sleepy | 08:12 |
| bkero | Whatever, I'll do it over my gameboy. | 08:13 |
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| Steel2 | hey chido, I know, it's just amusing | 08:32 |
| chido | I've never met anyone into it up until now, girl or boy | 08:38 |
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| bkero | There is definitely a community. | 08:40 |
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| chido | probably not where I come from though | 08:58 |
| bkero | Good news: There was an invention called the internet, and on that invention people communicated regardless of physical location. | 09:04 |
| bkero | At this very moment I'm in the remote city of Iqaluit, Nunavut, Canada communicating through a satellite uplink. | 09:05 |
| chido | you can't go out for a beer using the internet though | 09:16 |
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| @kanzure | booop | 09:42 |
| @kanzure | brownies: it's both days | 09:42 |
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| @kanzure | archels: he hasn't entered this irc channel but he does monitor the diybio list, and lives with fenn or something | 09:42 |
| @kanzure | so, the major problem with conferences (besides people never paying attention) is that any time an actually relevant-to-my-interest talk shows up, the speaker never goes into sufficient technical detail | 09:45 |
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| brownies | kanzure: i see. how was it yesterday? | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | and meanwhile everyone is in total spending $100k to get there | 09:45 |
| brownies | and how was your conference? | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | so why not just pay for those "speakers" to get together and e.g. pay them to talk about those actual technical details | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | brownies: to be honest, 'startup science' was an okay group of people, but the product pitches were definitely shrug-worthy | 09:46 |
| @kanzure | brownies: http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/startup-science-2012/ | 09:46 |
| brownies | no chronological numbering =( | 09:46 |
| brownies | kanzure: and how was the other one, where you spoke at and whatnot | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | one moment | 09:47 |
| brownies | k | 09:47 |
| ParahSailin | almost like talks are useless for information transmission! http://www.paulgraham.com/speak.html | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | adler, peerj, academia.edu, ah fuck it | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | brownies: also, the science exchange chick (elizabeth) was talking about "startup tips" | 09:47 |
| brownies | kanzure: heh that's the one i opened first | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | but none of her tips were all that valid.. like, she got into ycombinator and that changes a lot of things | 09:48 |
| brownies | hahah | 09:48 |
| brownies | "my advice is to get into YC." | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | "step 1: get into ycombinator" | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | yeah no kidding | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | brownies: so, if everyone pays $1k in travel fees to get out to a conference, and then sits around on their laptops, i don't really understand | 09:50 |
| @kanzure | i'm on my laptop because i'm transcribing, what are their excuses? | 09:50 |
| brownies | they're here for the networking! | 09:50 |
| @kanzure | i mean, 100 people paying $1k each is actually a big hunk of cash that can go towards 'crazy diy startup sciencey projects' | 09:51 |
| brownies | i don't know; generally the major value-add of a conference *for me* is to immediately barge into conversation with the speakers i want to meet | 09:51 |
| @kanzure | yes theoretically, except we were all kicked out of the venue at 5pm sharp | 09:51 |
| brownies | and/or i just speak at the damn thing, thereby achieving the same goal | 09:51 |
| brownies | kanzure: oh, well, that's hilariously dumb. | 09:51 |
| @kanzure | conferences line up speakers, but the speakers agree to speak because it's sorta ego-inflating or something | 09:52 |
| @kanzure | i think i might prefer the expert-led workshop model | 09:52 |
| @kanzure | instead of traveling around the world and all of us spending a total $100k, why don't we spend that $100k on something like, $5k in buying everyone microphones and webcams, and then $95k on a crazy project, and then network over the interwebz | 09:53 |
| @kanzure | in most cases i find that >60% of the conference attendees already know each other | 09:53 |
| brownies | well, that's because in your case it's the same 12 people talking about the same projects | 09:54 |
| @kanzure | i was also thinking of just paying some 'advanced optics' guy to hang out in this irc channel for $50/hour for 8 hours sometime, and just do tutoring and shit | 09:55 |
| @kanzure | or s/advanced optics/insert some other thing that you would usually have to go to a conference or school to get people to talk about/ | 09:55 |
| brownies | kanzure: as i understand it, scientists are lonely and want to talk about their work, and you'd probably just have to give him coffee or something | 10:01 |
| brownies | kanzure: besides, stop inflating grad student wages, asshole | 10:01 |
| @kanzure | yeah, i realize that $50 is really super high | 10:04 |
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| @kanzure | brownies: besides the usual reasons (incompetence; awful implementations) why did 'web conferencing' never take off for these events? | 10:05 |
| @kanzure | humanity+ tried to force me to use secondlife/telexlr8or but i hated those things- why not just fucking irc channels? | 10:05 |
| brownies | secondlife? | 10:05 |
| brownies | what the hell? | 10:05 |
| brownies | kanzure: it's bumbling around (it = webconferencing) -- i'd like to think it's on the uptick, as people slowly figure out that java applets may not be the future | 10:06 |
| brownies | i'm still not aware of in-browser HTML5-only idiot-proof webconferencing though. | 10:06 |
| @kanzure | well, i don't really mean webex or any of that shit either | 10:07 |
| @kanzure | java applet stigma definitely caused a slowdown on its adoption tho | 10:08 |
| @kanzure | oh also, before i forget.. | 10:08 |
| @kanzure | someone should use phantomjs + d3.js to do scientific-visualization-rendering-as-a-service | 10:09 |
| @kanzure | e.g. for configuring beautiful-but-cheap figures to paste into your latex-written papers | 10:09 |
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| @kanzure | yash-phone: yo | 10:11 |
| yash-phone | hey | 10:11 |
| yash-phone | getting brunch | 10:11 |
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| yash-phone | you guys at the conf? | 10:12 |
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| brownies | kanzure: naw fuck that ... static unchanging PDFs are important. | 10:29 |
| brownies | kanzure: are you going to the conference today? ...are you already there? | 10:29 |
| yash-phone | can't all you channel people just meet up at langton or something? i don't wanna commute for 3 hours | 10:30 |
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| @kanzure | yash-phone: i'm at langton | 10:46 |
| @kanzure | and nathan is still here | 10:46 |
| @kanzure | brownies: didn't you say you wanted to meet langton labs at some point anyway? | 10:46 |
| @kanzure | brownies: btw i meant that phantomjs would be used to render the image, which would then be static (i hate html widgets for graphs when they would normally be static images; interactive things aren't drop-in replacements ever) | 10:47 |
| brownies | but then why not just render a nice LaTeX graph? | 10:48 |
| brownies | kanzure: i do want to meet them, but ... grumble grumble... i'm tired of driving in to the city | 10:48 |
| @kanzure | i'm not aware of how nice you can get things with latex graphing/visualization tools | 10:48 |
| @kanzure | from what i've seen, d3/three.js/raphaeljs produce some pretty bitching shit | 10:49 |
| @kanzure | and i can't imagine that scientific illustration shops are doing anythig more complicated than "hire artist; have artist draw things until it looks professional"... | 10:49 |
| @kanzure | *anything | 10:49 |
| @kanzure | oh that's right.. elsevier has some website where they "connect" you to scientific illustrators; not sure how legit that was | 10:50 |
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| @kanzure | jrayhawk: i would like to get the NRA's support on diybio for using gene guns (shotguns, basically) | 11:18 |
| @kanzure | jrayhawk: any suggestions for that? i was thinking i might write them a letter, but they might interpret that as a comedy piece | 11:18 |
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| chris_99 | don't you use airguns for gene guns | 11:33 |
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| @kanzure | guidelines: http://www.nrafoundation.org/grants/graphics/ggg.pdf | 11:44 |
| @kanzure | what is the relationship between the NRA and FBI? | 11:50 |
| @kanzure | the NRA says they support law enforcement groups so maybe i can have the FBI co-write this grant application | 11:50 |
| @kanzure | http://connection.ebscohost.com/c/articles/1400369/nra-suing-fbi-over-gun-owner-list | 11:56 |
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| @kanzure | huh they also give grants for robots and biohazard suits | 12:42 |
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| brownies | kanzure: you've transcribed some fascinating stories | 13:02 |
| brownies | kanzure: " This is Hairy Creamer, he was a business magnet in the 60s who was fascinated about human powered flight." | 13:02 |
| brownies | poor guy must have had a hell of a time in elementary school. | 13:03 |
| @kanzure | i am terrible at writing down names so sometimes i just make things up | 13:03 |
| brownies | haha | 13:04 |
| @kanzure | "Ever since he was a young girl, Hairy Creamer wanted to fly in the sky." | 13:04 |
| @kanzure | btw feel free to fix typos | 13:05 |
| @kanzure | git clone git://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki.git | 13:05 |
| chris_99 | have you considered using mturk for transcription? | 13:09 |
| @kanzure | i haven't found any service that is faster than me for real-time transcripts | 13:10 |
| @kanzure | wait, hm that sounds pretty weird | 13:10 |
| brownies | usually you have to pay top-dollar for good real-time transcripts | 13:12 |
| brownies | $1-2 per minute, something like that. | 13:12 |
| @kanzure | that's not bad | 13:12 |
| brownies | no one tell kanzure, so we can keep enjoying the free fruits of his slave labor. | 13:12 |
| chris_99 | hehe | 13:12 |
| @kanzure | does $1/min include a stenographer showing up? | 13:12 |
| brownies | no, it's virtual | 13:12 |
| brownies | i guess you'd have to stream it to them. i don't know why i said real-time. | 13:13 |
| @kanzure | ok who does virtual-but-real-time transcripting? | 13:13 |
| @kanzure | yeah, ok. | 13:13 |
| brownies | what i meant was ... s/real-time// | 13:13 |
| @kanzure | i wonder if real-time transcription is a thing that customers want | 13:13 |
| @kanzure | like people seem to really enjoy me doing these transcripts and a conference organizer would probably pay a few bucks for it | 13:13 |
| @kanzure | most conferences have all these videos that end up on youtube | 13:16 |
| @kanzure | and all the shit listed on http://diyhpl.us:9001/ | 13:16 |
| @kanzure | transcripts would be more useful to me than lots of video that i have to re-watch | 13:16 |
| @kanzure | but the real-time aspect may or may not provide additional advantage | 13:16 |
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| @kanzure | if anything, it's a loss because i sometimes hear "is not" as an "is" | 13:17 |
| @kanzure | and other things (like names) get muddled and typoed | 13:17 |
| brownies | i *hate* watching videos | 13:20 |
| brownies | i would pay for it -- in the sense that i'd pay $10 extra for a conf ticket to get it | 13:20 |
| @kanzure | you pay for conference tickets? o_o | 13:20 |
| brownies | make it a mandatory fee for 100 - 1000 attendees, and that's not bad. | 13:20 |
| brownies | kanzure: sometimes. | 13:20 |
| @kanzure | so, scientific conferences have this shit down (more or less) | 13:20 |
| brownies | kanzure: the price of a conference ticket is a nice filter to make sure people show up and pay attention and make it worthwhile. | 13:21 |
| @kanzure | before you arrive, you get a list of fucking abstracts | 13:21 |
| @kanzure | and possibly papers | 13:21 |
| brownies | kanzure: hm, never been, i think. go on. | 13:21 |
| @kanzure | and then when you show up, you know who to talk with and what to ask | 13:21 |
| brownies | hmm | 13:21 |
| @kanzure | and then everything gets published as something like "Proceedings of the 58th Molecular Biology Bullshitters Gentleman's Club" | 13:21 |
| brownies | that does sound nice | 13:21 |
| brownies | here's the difference, though: | 13:21 |
| brownies | at non-scientific conferences, you're more likely to get people who are good speakers. so you *want* to hear them talk if you're there in person. | 13:22 |
| brownies | s/the difference/a difference/ | 13:22 |
| brownies | but if everyone shared abstracts of wtf they were going to say first, i'd still like that. | 13:22 |
| @kanzure | most conferences provide a two or three sentence abstract, especially if the attendees have to decide between multiple simultaneous talks | 13:22 |
| brownies | yup. this is true. and a schedule. and bios of speakers. | 13:23 |
| brownies | so... there's no difference, except charging for tickets? -_- | 13:23 |
| @kanzure | i get so bored at conferences, even the somewhat technical ones, because i'm just staring at the presenter talking about something and wishing he would get an order of magnitude more technical | 13:24 |
| @kanzure | i think it would be moer useful to have audience bios or a pre-survey like, | 13:24 |
| @kanzure | "how many would like to learn about how to model fluid flow in microfluidics" | 13:24 |
| @kanzure | or "how many would like to know about picking a good co-founder" | 13:24 |
| brownies | i often include a pretend poll at the start of my talk, that makes people feel like they had a say in the content | 13:25 |
| brownies | it doesn't actually change the content of the talk, though, except at most by 10% | 13:25 |
| @kanzure | it should be not just "% of attendees interested in this elaborated talk" but also "what percentage of time do you feel shoudl be devoted to it" | 13:25 |
| brownies | well, presumably you want to hear this person because they're competent enough to make such decisions on their own | 13:25 |
| @kanzure | so if 30% of the crowd feels something should be 90% of the time, and the other 70% of the crowd is indifferent, then go for that 30%'s preference... | 13:25 |
| @kanzure | yeah i mean, the speaker ultimately gets to decide of course | 13:25 |
| @kanzure | but like, say you have 100 attendees | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | 10 are actually programmers | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | 90 are science geeks who might be interested in programming | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | if you are giving a talk about github, *nobody* cares about github's ui | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | you should talk about the internals to the git state representation or some shit | 13:26 |
| brownies | also: debatably the attendees are there because they don't know the topic, so their input on granular pieces of the topic will be of limited value | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | if you aregoing to be talking to that 10%, you might as well up your game and make it useful for those 10 people, damn | 13:26 |
| brownies | ehhh. false dichotomy. | 13:26 |
| @kanzure | oh? | 13:27 |
| brownies | the amount of value i get from a talk is not 0 or 1 | 13:27 |
| brownies | it's some float in [0, 1] ... depending on a variety of things | 13:27 |
| brownies | so shouldn't the speaker maximize the sum of the audience utility? | 13:27 |
| @kanzure | haha | 13:28 |
| @kanzure | well. i don't know. depends on the goal of the conference and talk. | 13:28 |
| @kanzure | in 'advanced physics 501' you don't teach to the lowest common denominator.... | 13:29 |
| brownies | well, yes, but advanced physics 501 is something you pay $40,000 a year for the privilege of attending | 13:29 |
| brownies | (presumably) | 13:33 |
| @kanzure | i am surprised that lanyrd isn't more focused on 'conference disruption' | 13:41 |
| brownies | what're they doing? | 13:41 |
| @kanzure | there was that twitter backroom thing that was trying to do 'conference attendee real-time communications' stuff in 2007-2008 but everyone hated it | 13:41 |
| brownies | i'd like them to focus on a name with more vowels | 13:41 |
| @kanzure | lanyrd is just doing conference schedule aggregation | 13:41 |
| brownies | kanzure: well, no one needs conference real time bullshit | 13:41 |
| @kanzure | and eventbrite is just doing attendee registration | 13:41 |
| brownies | going to a conference IS real-time | 13:41 |
| @kanzure | brownies: exactly | 13:41 |
| @kanzure | brownies: are you coming by langton today? yashgaroth and chido are here | 13:46 |
| @kanzure | and fenn is here somewhere | 13:46 |
| @kanzure | nmz787 will be back later with his girl after they are done with simon field's farm.. thing | 13:46 |
| brownies | kanzure: bleh. unlikely. | 13:46 |
| brownies | how much longer are you in town again? | 13:46 |
| @kanzure | i don't really know how there is a farm in the middle of san francisco but i didn't ask either | 13:46 |
| @kanzure | i am leaving on sunday | 13:46 |
| brownies | that's tomorrow? | 13:47 |
| @kanzure | yes | 13:47 |
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| @kanzure | pasky: ping? | 17:17 |
| @kanzure | chido wants you to know that she's alive | 17:17 |
| pasky | good, thanks! tell her to stay that way ;-) | 17:30 |
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| @kanzure | pasky: thanks for running git.or.cz | 17:44 |
| @kanzure | are you the one who did the new git-scm.com site too? | 17:44 |
| pasky | you're welcome :) no, i think it's scott chacon who is maintaining that | 18:02 |
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| @kanzure | Makris N et al. (2005). "Segmentation of subcomponents within the superior longitudinal fascicle in humans: a quantitative, in vivo, DT-MRI study". Cereb. Cortex 15 (6): 854–69. DOI:10.1093/cercor/bhh186. PMID 15590909. | 18:29 |
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| @kanzure | http://braininfo.rprc.washington.edu/TemplateNeuroMaps.aspx | 19:16 |
| @kanzure | diffusion imaging in python http://nipy.sourceforge.net/dipy/ | 19:18 |
| @kanzure | "Dipy is an international, free and open soure software project for diffusion magnetic resonance imaging analysis" | 19:18 |
| @kanzure | well alright then | 19:18 |
| @kanzure | "Ultra fast tractography clustering" | 19:19 |
| @kanzure | video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNB0sM7JJqg | 19:19 |
| @kanzure | http://pymvpa.org/ | 19:23 |
| @kanzure | "dipy.reconst is for the reconstruction algorithms which we use to create directionality models for a voxel from the raw data." | 19:24 |
| @kanzure | nibabel looks useful too.. neuroimaging file conversion stuff http://nipy.sourceforge.net/nibabel/ | 19:26 |
| @kanzure | http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/nipy-devel | 19:26 |
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| @kanzure | "In dipy we usually represent tractography as a list of tracks. Every track is a numpy array of shape (N,3) where N is the number of points in the track." | 19:55 |
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| @kanzure | hrm? /home/user/Data/PBC/pbc2009icdm/brain1/brain1_scan1_fiber_track_mni.trk | 20:11 |
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| @kanzure | http://www.bama.ua.edu/~wguo2/Publication/ISBI06_Using%20multiple%20tensor%20deflection%20to%20reconstruct%20white%20matter%20fiber%20traces.pdf | 20:48 |
| @kanzure | 'Mapping Anatomical Connectivity Patterns of Human Cerebral Cortex Using In Vivo Diffusion Tensor Imaging Tractography' | 20:49 |
| @kanzure | http://www.lrdc.pitt.edu/schneider/bcm/readings/Lecture%205/Bammer%202003.PDF | 20:49 |
| @kanzure | somewhat longer piece: | 20:49 |
| @kanzure | http://vis.cs.brown.edu/docs/pdf/Demiralp-2012-EBC.pdf | 20:49 |
| @kanzure | laser dopler imaging for neurosurgery http://miplab.epfl.ch/pub/raabe0901.pdf | 20:49 |
| @kanzure | Strategies for brain shift evaluation http://www.ann.jussieu.fr/~frey/papers/biomedical/brain_shift/Hastreiter%20P.,%20Strategies%20for%20brain%20shift%20evaluation.pdf | 20:50 |
| @kanzure | http://trackvis.org/ "TrackVis is a software tool that can visualize and analyze fiber track data from diffusion MR imaging (DTI/DSI/HARDI/Q-Ball) tractography." | 20:51 |
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| @kanzure | Jora: check ze logs? | 21:32 |
| * kanzure sleeps | 21:32 | |
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| @kanzure | langton labs should publish academic articles | 21:35 |
| @kanzure | 'proceedings of langton labs, volume 1 issue 1' | 21:35 |
| jrayhawk | i can't think of a way to get the NRA interested in gene guns | 21:44 |
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| nmz787_ | Yo | 22:16 |
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| Juul | nmz787_, hi | 22:21 |
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| Juul | hey kanzure | 22:48 |
| nmz787 | hes sleeping | 22:49 |
| nmz787 | what you up to ? | 22:49 |
| Juul | i'm in San Diego picking up some things | 22:50 |
| Juul | did you go to the startup science thing? | 22:50 |
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| nmz787 | not today | 23:14 |
| nmz787 | was in and out yesterday | 23:14 |
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| Juul | ok | 23:27 |
| Mokbortolan_ | does pulsing tDCS change the effect? | 23:29 |
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| Mokbortolan_ | maybe at the khz range it wouldn't make any difference | 23:33 |
| Mokbortolan_ | I was thinking time-domain mutiplexing multiple current paths | 23:34 |
| Mokbortolan_ | so you could affect multiple sections differently | 23:34 |
| Mokbortolan_ | I wonder if you could work EEG readings into the domain as well | 23:36 |
| Mokbortolan_ | or if there is some remnant of energy that might interfere with them until some amount of time has passed | 23:37 |
| chido | nmz787: too bad we didn't get to say goodbye | 23:40 |
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| --- Log closed Sun Jun 17 00:00:42 2012 | ||
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