| --- Log opened Mon Aug 13 00:00:40 2012 | ||
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| strangewarp | Nietzsche said: "The typewriter ball is like me: Made of iron, but easily twisted on journeys." | 06:46 |
|---|---|---|
| strangewarp | I say: "The computer keyboard is like me: Made of plastic and easily depressed." | 06:47 |
| * strangewarp works on things | 06:47 | |
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| nsh | http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/08/08/Curiosity-interview-with-Malin-Space-Science-Systems-Mike-Ravine | 07:03 |
| nsh | (re: camera resolution on MSL) | 07:04 |
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| Technicus | Hello . . . | 11:05 |
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| @kanzure | why is everyone being so boring? | 11:25 |
| Sanky_ | how to not be boring? | 11:27 |
| archels | because we're making science | 11:30 |
| @kanzure | oh fbi <3 "Dear Bryan, Nathan and I are hoping you might be able to help us. We have been unable to figure out a practical way to send out the presentations from the FBI-DIYbio workshop (some of the files are huge), and are wondering if you can help us with setting up some sort of drop-box system or alternative suggestion." | 11:32 |
| @kanzure | i wonder why they picked me to send that to.. i can definitely help them but why didn't they pick, say, all the screwy people presenting web apps and things? | 11:36 |
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| strangewarp | kanzure: They're treating you like a leader figure. That bodes ill. :P | 12:04 |
| TheEmpath | hello large community! | 12:04 |
| strangewarp | hi | 12:04 |
| TheEmpath | who is George Church? | 12:05 |
| strangewarp | stick around for a while and one of the many people who reads the logs will give you an answer, probably | 12:05 |
| TheEmpath | oh.. derp http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Church | 12:07 |
| TheEmpath | i'd like to get started with the concept of synthetic life. i have a comp sci background | 12:10 |
| TheEmpath | pretty run of the mill, im sure | 12:10 |
| TheEmpath | anywho, i'd like ot figure out how to understand http://partsregistry.org/Main_Page so i can start contributing to it | 12:11 |
| TheEmpath | and i dunno where to start :X | 12:11 |
| TheEmpath | is there an actual road map? | 12:13 |
| chris_99 | don't suppose anyone knows of a cheap ir spectrophotometer | 12:14 |
| @kanzure | https://panopticlick.eff.org/index.php?action=log&js=yes | 12:14 |
| @kanzure | "Your browser fingerprint appears to be unique among the 2,346,061 tested so far. Currently, we estimate that your browser has a fingerprint that conveys at least 21.16 bits of identifying information." | 12:14 |
| @kanzure | neat. | 12:14 |
| @kanzure | obviously the current thing to do is to browse as "wget" | 12:14 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: partsregistry.org is not open to non-academic contributions | 12:15 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: there /was/ a roadmap but it sucks, so until i rewrite it, the answer is no | 12:15 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: http://diyhpl.us/wiki/diybio/faq and since you have a CS background you might appreciate the git clone instructions near the end | 12:15 |
| TheEmpath | excellent. thank you much | 12:16 |
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| @kanzure | TheEmpath: finding things ok? | 12:52 |
| TheEmpath | i am! | 12:52 |
| TheEmpath | you seem helpful, i'll try and keep my questions to you in a yes/no fashion :D | 12:53 |
| @kanzure | why would you do that? | 12:54 |
| @kanzure | what? | 12:54 |
| TheEmpath | make it easy for you :D | 12:54 |
| ParahSailin_ | roadmap for what exactly | 13:07 |
| Mokbortolan_ | ParahSailin_: hplus | 13:07 |
| ParahSailin_ | i got that, thanks | 13:07 |
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| delinquentme | anyone in here ever stream their coding? | 13:32 |
| TheEmpath | i do not | 13:48 |
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| TheEmpath | whose the linus torvald of biohacking? | 15:29 |
| TheEmpath | who's* | 15:29 |
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| exiff | TheEmpath: Ben Goertzel? | 15:34 |
| @kanzure | exiff: ben goertzel doesn't do any biology work | 15:34 |
| exiff | He is a transhumanist though. | 15:35 |
| TheEmpath | oh my god | 15:35 |
| TheEmpath | he does exist | 15:35 |
| @kanzure | exiff: what does that have to do with anything? | 15:35 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: nobody has yet claimed that title | 15:35 |
| TheEmpath | i see | 15:35 |
| jrayhawk | linus torvalds is a confusing analogue for much of anything these days | 15:36 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: and frankly, expecting computer stuff to map directly to biology stuff, is wrong | 15:36 |
| exiff | biohacking, nootropicsm, transhumanism... | 15:36 |
| @kanzure | exiff: are you just saying things? | 15:36 |
| exiff | no, im reading the topic | 15:36 |
| TheEmpath | i was thinking more along the lines of business models.. if ventner is the gates, then _____ is torvalds | 15:36 |
| @kanzure | i don't recommend thinking like that | 15:37 |
| TheEmpath | diy is a competitor to anyone trying to build a subscription model | 15:38 |
| TheEmpath | as edison crushed tesla... | 15:38 |
| @kanzure | not really. even with people who do things on their own, there are others who will pay for things. | 15:38 |
| TheEmpath | and those who pay for things provide money to a person who wants to render competition a sin | 15:38 |
| Steel2 | that sounds like fanatic ideology to me | 15:39 |
| TheEmpath | efficient business practice is fanatical? | 15:39 |
| @kanzure | what? | 15:40 |
| Steel2 | the competition is a sin part | 15:40 |
| Steel2 | what do you mean by it | 15:40 |
| TheEmpath | anyone who sinks in millions into a genomic venture will want to recoup | 15:40 |
| TheEmpath | the last thing you want is some punk kid brewing something in his backyard that does better and doesn't have teh price tag | 15:40 |
| TheEmpath | therefore, outlaw competition | 15:40 |
| @kanzure | so your plan is to outlaw competition? | 15:41 |
| TheEmpath | my plan? | 15:41 |
| TheEmpath | its the natural plan of anyone who has big money behind them in the bioengineering genre | 15:41 |
| TheEmpath | monsanto, ventner, even wake forest | 15:41 |
| @kanzure | are you saying you have big money? | 15:41 |
| TheEmpath | what? | 15:42 |
| TheEmpath | At what point in this conversation did I claim ownership of this concept? | 15:42 |
| @kanzure | it sounds like your ideas are already formed, and anything we say wont contribute much to you | 15:42 |
| TheEmpath | I'm asking for an appropriate force capable of distributing the intentions of DIY without being destroyed by obvious compeition | 15:42 |
| Steel2 | @kanzure: He's saying that the large businesses will try to outlaw competition | 15:43 |
| Steel2 | not that he will | 15:43 |
| TheEmpath | what the hell? are you reading the same chat? | 15:43 |
| @kanzure | Steel2: "outlaw competition"? so patents? | 15:43 |
| TheEmpath | that | 15:43 |
| TheEmpath | s one way. | 15:43 |
| TheEmpath | there are many others | 15:43 |
| @kanzure | ok. so what do you want to say about patents? | 15:43 |
| TheEmpath | ever wonder who is funding anti-GMO sentiment? | 15:43 |
| @kanzure | no. | 15:44 |
| TheEmpath | you'd be wise to | 15:44 |
| @kanzure | i don't think that matters | 15:44 |
| TheEmpath | heh | 15:44 |
| exiff | just look at the issues already surrounding patenting of genetic sequences. | 15:44 |
| @kanzure | exiff: that's not exactly a novel observation | 15:44 |
| exiff | i didnt claim it was | 15:44 |
| @kanzure | ok. still trying to understand what he's trying to claim. that DIY is impossible? | 15:44 |
| TheEmpath | o___O | 15:45 |
| TheEmpath | buick | 15:45 |
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| Steel2 | no, all he's saying is that it seems likely that sufficiently large companies may try to outlaw diybio | 15:45 |
| Steel2 | or put roadblocks in the path | 15:45 |
| @kanzure | Steel2: that's a nonsense observation though | 15:45 |
| Steel2 | so as to maintain profits | 15:45 |
| @kanzure | oh you are going to stop people-who-don't-care-about-being-outlaws by calling them outlaws? who cares | 15:46 |
| TheEmpath | how many business models would you like me to cite indicating the usage of that technique? | 15:46 |
| TheEmpath | pick a number | 15:46 |
| @kanzure | um? who cares if it is used or not? | 15:46 |
| @kanzure | my point is that whether or not it is used does not materially affect whether or not outlaw biology exists | 15:46 |
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| @kanzure | so it's sort of pointless. | 15:47 |
| * Mokbortolan_ toys with e-textiles. | 15:47 | |
| TheEmpath | So, in your world, how many DIYers are doing jail time? | 15:47 |
| TheEmpath | 80% of them? | 15:47 |
| TheEmpath | 90%? | 15:47 |
| @kanzure | what? | 15:47 |
| @kanzure | right now i know nobody in prison or jail for doing biology projects | 15:48 |
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| TheEmpath | That means you have a time advantage to make sure it stays that way | 15:48 |
| TheEmpath | which is why im trying to find the Linus Torvald of this craft | 15:48 |
| @kanzure | i don't think linus torvalds is going to personally prevent you from being sent to prison, TheEmpath | 15:48 |
| exiff | monsanto might, they have been looking at animal biotech lately. | 15:49 |
| TheEmpath | You do know that Microsoft was recently tried to eliminate the ability to install Linux over any machine that has had Windows on it? | 15:49 |
| @kanzure | exiff: monsanto is also not going to prevent you from going to prison. they aren't a legal firm. | 15:50 |
| @kanzure | i mean, they aren't going to represent you, unless you worked for them /maybe/ | 15:50 |
| TheEmpath | Do you know there are these things called "lobbyists" | 15:50 |
| TheEmpath | ? | 15:50 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: are you trying to fearmonger? | 15:50 |
| exiff | i think i was confused by you 2's conversation. | 15:50 |
| exiff | monsanto will be the one to prosecute you. | 15:50 |
| TheEmpath | kanzure: Are you trying to ignore obvious outcomes and not prepare for them? | 15:51 |
| @kanzure | exiff: yes, anyone can prosecute you for anything, that's why the trials exist | 15:51 |
| TheEmpath | oh look, Microsoft moving to destroy the DIY OS crowd: http://techrights.org/2012/07/17/rms-on-uefi/ | 15:51 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: i don't think me spending time in prison is an "obvious outcome" | 15:51 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: uefi does not actually prevent other operating systems and hardware from existing | 15:51 |
| TheEmpath | Then I really suggest learning how highly competitive business mind operate | 15:52 |
| TheEmpath | minds* | 15:52 |
| @kanzure | you don't sound competitive, you sound afraid | 15:52 |
| TheEmpath | I am asking for the Linus Torvald of the community | 15:52 |
| TheEmpath | how much more competitive woudl you like me to be? | 15:52 |
| @kanzure | are you a kernel contributor? | 15:53 |
| @kanzure | i'm trying to assess how well you know linus | 15:53 |
| TheEmpath | am I the only one sensing intentional density? | 15:53 |
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| exiff | TheEmpath: no. | 15:54 |
| @kanzure | TheEmpath: anyway, there are people who might claim to be linus torvalds, but i assure you there isn't one yet in the biohacking scene | 15:54 |
| Steel2 | TheEmpath: you should look up a guy named Bryan Bishop | 15:54 |
| * Steel2 dodges. | 15:54 | |
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| TheEmpath | Names are good. I shall review these names. Thank you much. | 15:55 |
| Steel2 | I'm a horrible person. | 15:55 |
| TheEmpath | Making biohacking as simple as programming a script is really an ideal outcome | 15:55 |
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| @kanzure | TheEmpath: there are some huxsters who claim they can do that, but nobody has achieved that | 15:55 |
| @kanzure | and realistically, it might not be possible | 15:56 |
| TheEmpath | From what I understand, its a really challenging problem | 15:56 |
| @kanzure | biology is a huge beast and it might not conform to your pre-existing notions of programming | 15:56 |
| TheEmpath | yeah | 15:56 |
| @kanzure | to be honest, this is a popular claim that programmers bring to the table | 15:56 |
| TheEmpath | life likes its exceptions | 15:56 |
| @kanzure | instead of taking inspiration from programming maybe you should take inspiration from biology, and then use bioinformatics to help you. | 15:57 |
| TheEmpath | but then again.. language itself is pretty complex too | 15:57 |
| TheEmpath | has a loose semblance of structure | 15:57 |
| TheEmpath | but lots of exceptions | 15:57 |
| TheEmpath | HRMM i ponder | 15:57 |
| TheEmpath | maybe i should be asking for the Noam Chomsky of biohacking? | 15:58 |
| TheEmpath | o___O | 15:58 |
| @kanzure | why are you looking for a "x of biohacking" person? | 15:58 |
| TheEmpath | analogs help | 15:58 |
| TheEmpath | especially when learning something new | 15:59 |
| @kanzure | if you're just looking for things to learn, start with http://diyhpl.us/wiki/diybio/faq | 15:59 |
| TheEmpath | ya, im reading that | 15:59 |
| TheEmpath | in addition to lots of other stuff | 15:59 |
| TheEmpath | I BREATHE INFO | 15:59 |
| yorick | https://shirt.woot.com/offers/deallocated <-- NO, YOU CAN'T BE SOLD OUT | 15:59 |
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| ParahSailin__ | i am the bryan bishop of biohacking | 16:43 |
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| @kanzure | this is a pretty fun android reverse engineering presentation: | 17:13 |
| @kanzure | http://www.floyd.ch/download/Android_0sec.pdf | 17:13 |
| @kanzure | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_OU2YCIXgU (500 MB) | 17:14 |
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| tashoutang | morning | 17:42 |
| strangewarp | i am the ayn rand of communism | 17:45 |
| strangewarp | 0_O | 17:45 |
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| tashoutang | what? communism? | 18:10 |
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| AdrianG | kanzure: galaxy note 2 will have a flexible scren | 18:15 |
| AdrianG | did u know dat | 18:15 |
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| exiff | i am the exiff of irc. | 18:24 |
| AdrianG | you disgust me. go on. | 18:26 |
| exiff | i chuckled a little. | 18:30 |
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| @kanzure | man it's almost a party in here. | 20:11 |
| yashgaroth | woo | 20:13 |
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| delinquentme | jmil, do you find yourself changing the frequency on the shaker often? | 20:23 |
| jmil | delinquentme: naw we gotta have repeat controls so we usually shake at 2 hz | 20:24 |
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| delinquentme | and I was looking at your code jmil and you're ramping up to fullspeed on a single rotation? hows that working out? | 20:27 |
| jmil | its good. it doesnt spill that way. acceleration is important | 20:27 |
| delinquentme | i like the math in the code hahaha | 20:29 |
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| strangewarp | oh hell | 20:39 |
| strangewarp | Wrong identity; whoops | 20:39 |
| delinquentme | lolol | 20:40 |
| strangewarp | Was on someone else's username there.. how embarrassing | 20:40 |
| delinquentme | strangewarp, are you trying to troll in here?? | 20:40 |
| * delinquentme puts away his altar boy outfit | 20:40 | |
| delinquentme | false alarm | 20:40 |
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| @kanzure | Query : SELECT password FROM v_members where true and email = '' ; -- | 21:20 |
| @kanzure | i'm pretty sure ;-- is correct? | 21:20 |
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| @kanzure | nmz787: hi. | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | yo | 21:25 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: what's good? | 21:25 |
| @kanzure | to crush your enemies and to see them driven before you | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | hmm | 21:27 |
| nmz787 | driven to the incinerator | 21:27 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: been watching this on youtube "http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-Dv6dDtdcs&feature=player_embedded" | 21:47 |
| nmz787 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-Dv6dDtdcs&feature=player_embedded | 21:47 |
| nmz787 | Lepht Anonym - Cybernetics for the Masses (1 of 3) | 21:47 |
| @kanzure | ugh | 21:48 |
| @kanzure | please don't | 21:48 |
| delinquentme | dont eat crappy food! | 21:48 |
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| nmz787 | heh | 21:49 |
| nmz787 | well its a research survey | 21:49 |
| nmz787 | :P | 21:50 |
| nmz787 | she's kinda cute | 21:50 |
| nmz787 | (though i think she's gender neutral, so I shouldn't be saying she) | 21:50 |
| @kanzure | a research survey? | 21:50 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: i should point out that she's batshit, so don't let any cuteness deceive you | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | yeah like i'm not sucking it up like gospel | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | i kinda like batshit | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | lol | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | its better than plain boring/normal | 21:51 |
| nmz787 | but the cuteness is probably more mental than physical | 21:52 |
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| delinquentme | hahah | 21:53 |
| delinquentme | id err on the side of she | 21:53 |
| nmz787 | the accent is kinda too anti-national for me | 21:53 |
| nmz787 | being a proud 'merican and all | 21:53 |
| @kanzure | "i have been known to slice my arms open for shits'n'giggles, sure, and do a fair amount of damage in the process (none of this emo cat-scratch bullshit, i've split my arm to the tendons like the little psychopath i sort of am), but this is not something i do when properly medicated. i need a better way of communicating that." | 21:54 |
| nmz787 | implant a raspberryPi | 21:56 |
| nmz787 | lol | 21:56 |
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| nmz787 | wow | 21:57 |
| nmz787 | i've just split a mouse or 10 | 21:57 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: http://gnusha.org/logs/lepht_crap.txt | 21:57 |
| nmz787 | actually felt a human spinal chord in an anatomy lab once | 21:57 |
| @kanzure | neat. | 21:58 |
| nmz787 | lepht - "bodily health takes a second seat to curiosity" | 21:59 |
| nmz787 | well just finished that | 21:59 |
| nmz787 | started it a few days ago | 22:00 |
| nmz787 | was interesting, but also kinda boring | 22:00 |
| nmz787 | i knew about sterilization before I ever operated on myself (which I never really have I guess) | 22:00 |
| nmz787 | but I knew about it when i was like 15 | 22:00 |
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| nmz787 | and I'm pretty sure I could easily find dosing for lidocaine... and find out what biocompatible shit was out there | 22:01 |
| nmz787 | so, the approach seems kinda unintelligent | 22:01 |
| yashgaroth | what approach, masochism? | 22:02 |
| @kanzure | also there was this: https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/diybio/ia7GkiR3FjE%5B1-25%5D | 22:03 |
| nmz787 | yashgaroth: hmm? | 22:03 |
| @kanzure | haha where did i come up with "neodymium and pain" | 22:03 |
| nmz787 | yashgaroth: no just unplanned/unthoughout | 22:03 |
| @kanzure | would have been better if that rhymed | 22:04 |
| yashgaroth | ah right | 22:04 |
| @kanzure | no pain no gain.. so if i inflict infinite pain, i will gain infinitely, right? | 22:04 |
| @kanzure | Steel2: you're probably a pain/gain expert, right? | 22:04 |
| @kanzure | would you be open to some pain experimentation? free of charge, of course | 22:05 |
| Steel2 | I try to minimize the pain parts :P not a masochist | 22:05 |
| yashgaroth | what doesn't kill you only makes you stronger, unless it cripples you for life | 22:05 |
| delinquentme | hahah | 22:05 |
| delinquentme | yeahh IDK about the stabby things into body | 22:05 |
| Steel2 | yashgaroth, get my pm on the forum? | 22:05 |
| yashgaroth | not that I know of, I'll check | 22:05 |
| @kanzure | i think implants could work, but i'm not convinced magnets are it | 22:05 |
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| @kanzure | i haven't seen many suggestions for better implant ideas though | 22:06 |
| Steel2 | something that'd be fantastic to get my genes changed for :P | 22:06 |
| @kanzure | rfid implants are sorta meh too, unless you're a dog | 22:06 |
| nmz787 | the compass idea lepth mentioned was OK | 22:06 |
| nmz787 | but still not really worth much | 22:06 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: northpaw? southpaw? | 22:06 |
| nmz787 | I can just look at the sun | 22:06 |
| yashgaroth | nope not seeing it steel2 | 22:06 |
| Steel2 | kanzure, got modded on /r/futurology. now to slowly and insidiously try to bring them over away from the woo side of things :P | 22:06 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: yeah some -paw | 22:06 |
| @kanzure | Steel2: that wont work | 22:06 |
| @kanzure | Steel2: first, it's reddit | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | second, it's futorology.. two terribel things | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | *terrible | 22:07 |
| Steel2 | *shrug* it's larger than /r/transhuman now :( | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | why would reddit.com/r/transhumanism matter | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | or transhuman | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | it's probably just filled with lesswrong people anyway | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | (lesswrong.com is an obvious reddit clone) | 22:08 |
| yashgaroth | also why are there two h+ subreddits | 22:08 |
| @kanzure | s/clone/instance | 22:08 |
| brownies | is it obvious? afaict they customized the shit out of it | 22:09 |
| Steel2 | there's a ton of h+ subreddits haha | 22:09 |
| Steel2 | futurology is the largest | 22:09 |
| @kanzure | brownies: stylesheets? :P | 22:09 |
| @kanzure | actually, i didn't know reddit was running on pylons | 22:10 |
| brownies | kanzure: naw, from what i heard they were mucking about with backend code too | 22:10 |
| Steel2 | yashgaroth: something about sleep...hd something | 22:10 |
| brownies | kanzure: besides, it takes all kinds of miracles to even get the lumbering reddit source code up and running | 22:10 |
| brownies | so they must have done all kinds of shit to get it stable and working well and etc. | 22:10 |
| @kanzure | brownies i thought ;-- was the right way to do a comment in sql syntax | 22:10 |
| yashgaroth | man I like sleep...had this awesome dream last night, can't remember it but it was great | 22:10 |
| @kanzure | am i doing something wrong? | 22:10 |
| brownies | kanzure: no semicolon | 22:11 |
| brownies | although it's hilarious that you thought the semicolon was part of it | 22:11 |
| @kanzure | hrm. | 22:11 |
| nmz787 | yashgaroth: i like dreaming more than being awake most times | 22:11 |
| nmz787 | its cheap | 22:11 |
| yashgaroth | gets me closer to the future quickly and lazily, too | 22:11 |
| Steel2 | can't find the gene name :( | 22:12 |
| @kanzure | http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/4.1/en/comments.html seems to indicate ;-- is valid | 22:12 |
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| yashgaroth | also that sort of gene sounds like it'd be brain-specific, which gets tricky to modify | 22:13 |
| yashgaroth | hdec2 btw | 22:13 |
| nmz787 | Steel2: yashgaroth I wonder if there's a SNP for that | 22:14 |
| nmz787 | "there's an app for that" | 22:14 |
| nmz787 | there's a SNP for that | 22:14 |
| yashgaroth | hahaha | 22:14 |
| Steel2 | oh, yash, marissa might be becoming a model lol | 22:15 |
| yashgaroth | saw something about a point mutation before the paywall, so it could be a snp | 22:15 |
| yashgaroth | aww yee | 22:15 |
| @kanzure | .fetch http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0020737392900908 | 22:16 |
| paperbot | trying to fetch the paper... | 22:16 |
| @kanzure | blaah | 22:16 |
| yashgaroth | hDEC2-P385R is possibly a point mutation, depending on what the standard proline codon is in that position | 22:17 |
| Steel2 | that's what it was | 22:18 |
| yashgaroth | also http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2884988/ | 22:19 |
| yashgaroth | there still might be some weird side effects; two supposedly normal human mutants, who haven't been convicted as serial killers...yet | 22:21 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: where should i put that paper | 22:22 |
| nmz787 | unless fetch got it | 22:22 |
| @kanzure | fetch did not get it :( | 22:24 |
| @kanzure | put it up on diyhpl.us i guess | 22:24 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/1-s2.0-0020737392900908-main.pdf | 22:25 |
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| brownies | kanzure: hubot? | 22:42 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: does the android anti-ad software work 100%? | 22:45 |
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| nmz787 | jrayhawk: so re: this: http://hunter-gatherer.com/ "But Durant says it's a meat-based diet that was fundamental to early human development. My colleague Chris Joyce has reported on how a meat-based diet helped make us smarter." | 23:33 |
| nmz787 | jrayhawk: if we evolved, shouldn't we be able to figure out why meat made us smarter (if that's true), and engineer that into phototrophs? | 23:34 |
| jrayhawk | It's referred to as the "expensive tissue hypothesis" if you want to get more detail. | 23:41 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: it seems to work pretty well | 23:43 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: usually it uses the host file to block stuff, which is pretty safe | 23:44 |
| @kanzure | *hosts | 23:44 |
| @kanzure | brownies: phenny? | 23:44 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: also it includes a great deal more ad networks than i've come across yet | 23:44 |
| @kanzure | so i think it's pretty thorough | 23:44 |
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| jrayhawk | Carnivore digestive systems are shorter and require less energy to operate than herbivorous digestive systems (humans ferment little polysaccharide, humans manufacture few micronutrients, humans detox relatively little) | 23:46 |
| jrayhawk | Unfortunately human dietary needs are not well understood; there's a lot of genetic variation, a lot of state variation, a lot of problems systematically testing for optimality in a thousand dimensions, and problems knowing what pathologies to associate with what nutrients. | 23:49 |
| foucist | jrayhawk: how short are ours compared to carnivores? | 23:50 |
| jrayhawk | Like K2 and EPA/DHA weren't really on the radar until the late nineties, and we're still discovering pathologies they're good at battling. | 23:51 |
| foucist | probably considerably longer since we're herbivores too and crap | 23:51 |
| jrayhawk | No, according to the paleontological record we're obligate carnivores. | 23:52 |
| jrayhawk | or, at least, the chemical evidence in our fossils. | 23:53 |
| nmz787 | so why not fix/augment the auxotropies/pathways | 23:54 |
| nmz787 | what would the result be if I fixed my childs vitamin C production gene for example | 23:54 |
| nmz787 | or the pathway (maybe its not the gene, maybe some regulation crap) | 23:54 |
| jrayhawk | Presumably higher energy intake. | 23:55 |
| jrayhawk | You'd have to have some feedback mechanism to turn it off, of course, since humans are very good at recycling vitamin C as needed to maintain homeostasis and letting it degrade results in a toxic product | 23:57 |
| jrayhawk | (this is why you should not vitamin c megadose, by the way) | 23:58 |
| jrayhawk | And its manufacture may or may not throw off byproducts that need to be dealt with; I'm not familiar with the biochemical machinery there. | 23:59 |
| --- Log closed Tue Aug 14 00:00:43 2012 | ||
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