2013-05-25.log

--- Log opened Sat May 25 00:00:36 2013
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nmz787paperbot: http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v6/n3/abs/nphys1513.html05:06
paperbotHTTP 401 unauthorized http://www.nature.com/nphys/journal/v6/n3/pdf/nphys1513.pdf05:06
nmz787paperbot: http://iopscience.iop.org/0960-1317/22/8/085008/article05:09
paperbothttp://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Fabrication%20of%20micro%20pneumatic%20valves%20with%20double-layer%20elastic%20poly%28dimethylsiloxane%29%20membranes%20in%20rigid%20poly%28methyl%20methacrylate%29%20microfluidic%20chips.pdf05:09
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JayDuggerGood morning, paperbot.05:47
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SphericalMousenmz78707:42
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heathmorning JayDugger09:42
Urchin[emacs]nanoengineer is hosted on sourceforge, right?09:47
Urchin[emacs]wait09:49
Urchin[emacs]found it09:49
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kanzureUrchin[emacs]: https://github.com/kanzure/nanoengineer12:36
kanzurenot sourceforge12:37
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Urchin[emacs]I figgured it out a while ago12:42
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kanzuremailman archive viewer https://github.com/hyperkitty/hyperkitty13:26
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kanzureinteresting use of phantomjs to show which css rules are applying where http://css.benjaminbenben.com/v1?url=http%3A%2F%2Fgoogle.com13:55
kanzurehttp://benjaminbenben.com/2013/05/09/wtcss/13:57
kanzurehttps://gist.github.com/benfoxall/5647039 "// Client script to find all the styles of a page and compute the position of the matching elements"13:59
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Adifexhm. could help debugging sites for IE, curse microsoft14:04
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SphericalMousetoot toot14:16
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nmz787:(14:27
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SPhericalMouseyes?14:29
nmz787hey14:35
nmz787"Do you mean what the pressure would be directly under the valve in the fluid channels?"14:35
nmz787yes14:36
nmz787you said 15-25 PSID, so I imagine that measurement is taken at some pressure gauge at the end of a pneumatic control line14:36
SPhericalMouseso you're basically asking how hard somthing laying in the channel would be pressed on by the valve membrane?14:36
nmz787yeah14:37
SPhericalMouseyes, 15-25 is what the regulator is set to, but because the valve system is dead ended, the whole thing reaches that pressure14:37
nmz787but I guess it might be 15-25 as well14:37
SPhericalMousethe valve will provide some back force. if you slowly turn up the pressure from zero, you won't see valve operation till some point14:38
nmz787have you seen or think it would work to just push a 0.5 t 1 mm rod on the channel?14:38
nmz7870.5 to 1mm14:38
SPhericalMousealso, the fluid lines may be driven at 1-10 PSI, so you sometimes have to increase the valve pressure to compensate14:38
nmz787otherwise i was thinking connecting a small piston to a small solenoid, and have one of them per valve14:39
SPhericalMouseit depends, that has been suggested a fair numer of times, but it depends what you are trying to do14:39
nmz787the piston acting to compress the air in the pneumatic line14:39
SPhericalMouseso, the pneumatic line actually has water in it14:39
fennalso known as a hydraulic line!14:40
nmz787ahh14:40
SPhericalMouseair will basically leak through the pdms and inject bubbles into the flow lines14:40
nmz787hmm14:40
SPhericalMousereally annoying14:40
SPhericalMousethe flipside is that it makes filling the control lines with water fairly simple14:40
nmz787i assume you can use any fluidi that won't swell the PDMS14:40
SPhericalMouseprobably. water works fine14:41
nmz787like DNA synthesis doesn't like water14:41
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nmz787and since water will permeate through PDMS14:41
nmz787...14:41
SPhericalMousemaybe., not sure the flow rate though14:42
nmz787kanzure: where can I go to chat about JTAG intefaces and poking at unknown devices through JTAG?14:42
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SPhericalMousei'm pretty sure dna synthesis in pdms has been done, so look up what they did14:42
nmz787yeah14:42
nmz787i've got a few papers with their recipes14:43
SPhericalMousei would avoid the direct piston valve if possible14:43
nmz787why>14:43
nmz787seems like it could be the cheapest route per valve14:43
SPhericalMousealignment and visibility and size14:43
SPhericalMousemaybe, but it isn't scalable to a large number of valves14:43
nmz787oh, I thought you meant hydraulic piston14:43
SPhericalMousei'm talking about any off chip system that pokes down and closes a channel14:44
nmz787basically I figure I only need high/low settings, so the exact pressure hydraulic piston to hydraulic piston wouldn't matter, my thinking is that the different solenoids wouldn't be calibrated relative to one another14:44
nmz787though calibrating them might not be so hard14:45
nmz787i imagine it would produce current vs pressure14:45
nmz787hmm, but then the length of the control line would be variable14:46
nmz787so different amounts of current would be required for the same pressure14:46
nmz787have you ever seen people calibrate things with droplet makers?14:46
SPhericalMouseno14:46
nmz787and checking the size or distance between droplets?14:46
fennyou will get the same pressure regardless of line length, since the area of the piston remains constant14:47
fennline length mainly manifests itself as flow resistance14:47
nmz787fenn: but won't the distance the solenoid pushes need to be longer?14:47
nmz787hmm14:47
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fennalso line elasticity14:48
SPhericalMousei think it depends on the size of your channels, and how close you want your valves to be14:49
SPhericalMouseand how many valves you want14:49
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nmz787you mean running multiple valves off of one control line?14:50
SPhericalMousethats part of it14:50
nmz787theres a company that is trying to sell this bubble forming technology to cell phone screen suppliers14:52
SPhericalMouseoften valve placement is critical. for example if you have a t junctions, you may want a valve on each line, often with the valve right up against the intersection to limit dead/slow volumes14:52
fennin the case of multiple valves, your actuator piston will have a larger area and thus the pressure needs to be higher to achieve the same force per valve14:52
nmz787basically there's some pneumatic logic that they can pump air into an addressable location14:52
fennerm. i said that wrong. the flow needs to be higher14:53
fennis it addressable? i thought they just made bumps so you could feel where the buttons are14:54
fennnot a true tactile interface, just a button-raiser14:54
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nmz787yeah, bu tthey could raise them seelctably14:55
nmz787they didn't sense a button press if that's what you mean14:55
fenni mean they either raise all the buttons or none of the buttons14:55
nmz787that was still the capacitive layer did14:55
nmz787that's not what the product note seemed to make me think14:56
fennwell anyway, demuxing is entirely possible in microfluidics14:56
nmz787i thought latching has a bleed down time15:00
nmz787or rather, i thought that would be a limitation15:00
nmz787http://www.tactustechnology.com/technology.html15:01
nmz787so if their tech is 'custom' and not addressable, I wonder how they're pumping the air anyway15:01
nmz787"Minimal power consumption"15:01
fenn"Flickr are now offering 1 terabyte of free storage to all users... and it gave me pause for thought that it is only 9 years since GMail was launched (actually only 6 since the general public could sign up) and one of its big main selling points, which I remember being very impressed by at the time, was 1 gigabyte of free online space. Easy to be blasé about stuff like that, but for me it's15:28
fennanother singularity indicator (TM)"15:28
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fennam i the only one who thinks "driverless car" sounds like "horseless carriage"?16:49
nmz787paperbot: http://pubs.rsc.org/en/content/articlelanding/2013/lc/c3lc40991k16:53
paperbotno translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Label-free%20biodetection%20using%20a%20smartphone.pdf16:53
nmz787fenn: but the horse didn't drive the carriage, there was still the driver16:53
nmz787or coachmen or whatever16:53
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kanzurenmz787: ##electronics has JTAG-knowing people, i guess17:18
fennI checked my University quota. It's 20 gigabytes. According to amazon, a 3 TB hard drive costs 194 USD. That means the school is providing me with about 1.30 USD in storage.17:19
kanzureyes, online storage is extremely behind17:20
kanzuresupposedly this is because providers (like dropbox, amazon aws s3, etc.) are making sure they have redundancy, backups and mirrors of your data17:21
fenni think it's more about the cost of the bandwidth17:21
kanzureif that was true, they would let you just ship hard drives in for free, and they don't17:21
fennor bandwidth*time, however you say that17:21
fennhow much does amazon charge per TB?17:22
kanzurehttp://calculator.s3.amazonaws.com/calc5.html17:23
kanzurechoose "S3" on the left17:23
kanzure$94.53/TB-month17:23
kanzureerm, i was using 1000 GB. for 1024 GB it's $96.81/TB-month.17:23
fennhm that's like buying a new hard drive every month17:24
kanzureyes17:24
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nmz787i just saw a 1 TB for $60 or $6517:41
nmz787drive17:41
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heathpaperbot: http://pubs.rsc.org/en/content/articlelanding/2003/LC/b301410j18:45
paperbotno translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/A%20plug%20and%20play%20microfluidic%20device.pdf18:45
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kanzure"After the first push, it can take up to ten minutes before the content is available." damn it, github..19:03
juri_you know, its less than a minute on gitorious. ;)19:23
kanzurethe project doesn't use gitorious for their domain name19:24
kanzurei don't see how that's helpful19:24
juri_using github to manage domain names?19:25
kanzurethat's what ariya is doing19:26
juri_ok, thats strange. hadn't heard of that.19:35
kanzuregh-pages.19:42
kanzurehttp://pages.github.com/19:42
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kanzurehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degree_of_anonymity23:41
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--- Log closed Sun May 26 00:00:37 2013

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