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| kanzure | https://github.com/wltrimbl/thumbnailpolish "scripts to visualize the thumbnail images from illumina sequencing machines" | 07:10 |
|---|---|---|
| kanzure | recursive docker-within-docker https://github.com/dgageot/fiboid | 07:10 |
| kanzure | "NPAPI plugin for Chrome and Firefox that exposes fun VR devices" https://github.com/benvanik/vr.js | 07:12 |
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| justanotheruser | Would SKDB automatically buy your product from online stores? | 08:22 |
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| gnusha | https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=73d94953 DavidCary: Other discussions of various CAD packages >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/cadfaq/ | 09:59 |
| kanzure | justanotheruser: would be nice | 10:15 |
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| kanzure | his contact for someone selling him the tubing is azco biotech... | 10:24 |
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| kanzure | 100 pack of 1000 angstrom CPG columns for $350 http://azcobiotech.com/reagents/CPGCol.php | 10:32 |
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| chris_99 | don't spose anyone knows whether anyone can buy medical grade oxygen in the UK per chance | 10:44 |
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| seba- | chris_99 why do you need it | 10:56 |
| chris_99 | oxygenation during fermentation, apparently you could get away with industrial, possibly | 10:57 |
| seba- | chris_99, you can make it via electrolysis? | 10:58 |
| seba- | also industrial would work ok imo | 10:59 |
| chris_99 | yeah it probably work actually | 10:59 |
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| kanzure | haha brlcad has no way to render an image in their library | 11:24 |
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| ParahSailin | typical air contains about 200 mbar partial pressure of oxygen | 11:32 |
| seba- | ParahSailin not where i am! | 11:34 |
| ParahSailin | nepal? | 11:34 |
| seba- | ParahSailin, no, here it's ~198 mbar on average, it's because of the altitude! | 11:36 |
| seba- | :p | 11:36 |
| seba- | oh well it's not such a difference :-( | 11:37 |
| seba- | i thought it's more | 11:37 |
| seba- | i can thou measure the difference | 11:37 |
| seba- | in boiling of water | 11:37 |
| seba- | it doesn't boil at 100 C | 11:37 |
| kanzure | where did all this come from https://github.com/raj12lnm/python-brlcad/commits/master | 11:38 |
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| gradstudentbot | My experiment was working a second ago, but now it doesn't even work. | 11:39 |
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| nmz787_i | hmm, I really want one of these http://pro.sony.com/bbsc/ssr/product-DPTS1/?PID=I:digitalpaper:digitalpaperproductpage | 11:49 |
| nmz787_i | wish their price was 1/2 or 1/4 | 11:49 |
| nmz787_i | I have the opportunity to get one or two though | 11:49 |
| nmz787_i | so I wonder if they fail to become a mass-available product, if I don't get one now, I may never | 11:50 |
| chris_99 | is it colour | 11:50 |
| chris_99 | oh apparently not | 11:51 |
| ParahSailin | im sure if you wait, youll get something even better | 11:52 |
| chris_99 | mm fancy colour electrowetting displays should come out soooon | 11:53 |
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| nmz787_i | i care only about the size, and the ability to zoom PDFs in a smooth manner | 11:58 |
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| kanzure | synthesizer is shipped | 12:26 |
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| nmz787_i | schweet | 12:36 |
| kanzure | i think we can buy all the chemicals from azco biotech | 12:37 |
| kanzure | but the 6 weeks lifetime seems really really annoying | 12:37 |
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| gradstudentbot | Yeah, there's a clear trend. | 12:39 |
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| ParahSailin | phosphoramidite has that bad of shelf life? | 12:42 |
| kanzure | nope, the phosphoramidite is distributed as a powder | 12:45 |
| kanzure | and has longer shelf life | 12:45 |
| kanzure | ammonium hydroxide has the "don't use after 2 weeks after opening" warning | 12:46 |
| kanzure | in the manual | 12:46 |
| kanzure | "Phosphoramidites are stable in powder form for one year and should be stored at room temperature in a desiccator. Once they are dissolved, they should be used within approximately two weeks. After this time, coupling efficiencies may decrease. If they cannot be used within this time, you can freeze, store, thaw and then reuse the phosphoramidites. However, they may show a loss of activity." | 12:47 |
| ParahSailin | weird, ammonia must spontaneously turn into hydrazine or something, i better flush all my cleaning products down the toilet before they explode | 12:47 |
| kanzure | ammonium hydroxide must also be stored at 4 celsius | 12:48 |
| kanzure | "Since all phosphoramidite reservoirs are pressurized simultaneously with a single valve, all five bottles must be attached to the instrument, even if some are empty, to perform a synthesis. Phosphoramidites are extremely sensitive to acid, oxygen and water. Once they are in solution and the protective cap is removed, quickly put them on the instrument to prevent contamination." | 12:49 |
| kanzure | acid, oxygen and water, might as well be sensitive to being looked at funny | 12:50 |
| kanzure | "quickly put them on the instrument" lolz | 12:50 |
| ParahSailin | sounds like an iron foundry | 12:50 |
| ParahSailin | if you arent utilizing it at full capacity, best not to run it at all | 12:51 |
| kanzure | that does not sound like a good way to prevent contamination | 12:51 |
| ParahSailin | idt is the iron foundry | 12:51 |
| kanzure | just think, this was all a nobel prize | 12:52 |
| kanzure | for the 2 liters of "hazardous organic liquid waste" every 4 hours | 12:53 |
| kanzure | i wonder if there was a nobel prize for the oil refinery | 12:53 |
| kanzure | i demand it | 12:53 |
| ParahSailin | oh, now i understand why inosine costs so much at idt | 12:55 |
| kanzure | ""Upon opening the bottle, quickly place it on the instrument. Use in a well ventilated area and avoid inhalation. Store at room temperature."" | 12:55 |
| kanzure | "Acetic anhydride-lutidine-tetrahydrofuran (THF), (1:1:8) is one half of the capping reagent. Atmospheric water will reduce its efficiency." | 12:56 |
| kanzure | bad news... i'm pretty sure atmospheric water is impossible to completely get rid of. | 12:57 |
| ParahSailin | do they tell you to store it with molecule sieves? | 12:57 |
| kanzure | "This device is best operated in the vacuum of space." | 12:57 |
| kanzure | better get some meth gas masks to operate this thing | 12:58 |
| ParahSailin | lutidine smells like death | 12:59 |
| kanzure | docs http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/DNA/abi391/ | 12:59 |
| ParahSailin | better that you sent this death machine to nmz787_i | 13:00 |
| ParahSailin | i do not have the necessary supply of forsaken children to use as the power source | 13:01 |
| kanzure | that's okay, he'll get a cool biography titled "phosphoramidites i have known and loved" | 13:01 |
| kanzure | (aren't i clever?) | 13:02 |
| ParahSailin | too soon | 13:03 |
| jrayhawk_ | haha | 13:03 |
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| kanzure | what's the difference between ctypes.c_voidp and ctypes.c_void_p? | 13:20 |
| kanzure | nevermind, neither work for my situation | 13:23 |
| ParahSailin | c_voidp = c_void_p # backwards compatibility (to a bug) | 13:26 |
| kanzure | Segmentation fault, yo | 13:26 |
| ParahSailin | http://svn.python.org/projects/external/ctypes/ctypes/__init__.py | 13:27 |
| ParahSailin | paperbot: http://jls.sagepub.com/content/early/2014/04/03/0261927X14528804 | 13:34 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/A%20Few%20Prolific%20Liars%20Variation%20in%20the%20Prevalence%20of%20Lying.pdf | 13:34 |
| kanzure | what is the criteria of prolific lying? | 13:35 |
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| kanzure | huh, 10 lies/day puts you in top 1% of liars | 13:41 |
| kanzure | i wonder if you can count the same lie twice | 13:42 |
| ParahSailin | no, thats double jeopardy | 13:44 |
| nmz787_i | yeah I'm pretty sure we can't afford to actually run that 391 as-is | 13:44 |
| kanzure | do the math before concluding that | 13:45 |
| nmz787_i | subprocess is crashing my program, even though I have it in a try except | 13:45 |
| nmz787_i | :/ | 13:45 |
| kanzure | use sh | 13:45 |
| kanzure | terrible name, but ok library | 13:46 |
| kanzure | https://pypi.python.org/pypi/sh | 13:46 |
| ParahSailin | subprocess isnt crashing it; you are | 13:46 |
| kanzure | hrm he hasn't done much since merging in my stuff https://github.com/amoffat/sh/commits/master | 13:48 |
| kanzure | argh this guy needs to split up his pull requests :( https://github.com/kanzure/pokecrystal/pull/256/files | 13:50 |
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| catern | http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0167577X13006538 | 14:02 |
| catern | paperbot: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0167577X13006538 | 14:03 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/56253bfde47aa367ca29b872bc50577b.txt | 14:03 |
| ParahSailin | oh sweet i have lots of goat hair | 14:05 |
| kanzure | yeah there was another weird paper the other day about using yarn for microfluidics | 14:05 |
| catern | so does paperbot's scrapers all live on university networks where they can scrape papers? | 14:06 |
| kanzure | but i'm not sure how you're supposed to weave that tiny | 14:06 |
| kanzure | paperbot travels through a transdimensional portal to a universe where papers are easily accessed | 14:06 |
| catern | ah that is much simpler | 14:06 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/kanzure/paperbot | 14:06 |
| catern | clever to do that | 14:06 |
| ParahSailin | catern is actually willing to provide a vm behind a paywall for us | 14:07 |
| catern | I saw, but I still don't get it | 14:07 |
| catern | oh, yeah, I am | 14:07 |
| kanzure | hm, at the moment paperbot does not have the ability to abuse that arrangement | 14:07 |
| kanzure | but it is worth adding | 14:07 |
| catern | well if it develops that capability, this is a standing offer | 14:11 |
| ParahSailin | i would do a kickstarter to make paperbot work | 14:12 |
| ParahSailin | money is probably the only thing that would make me care enough to finish the job | 14:12 |
| catern | it would be nice to have an automated process to scrape things direct to libgen or wherever | 14:12 |
| ParahSailin | thats what was intended | 14:13 |
| catern | ah | 14:13 |
| kanzure | kickstarter is a bad idea | 14:13 |
| kanzure | you don't want that much attention | 14:13 |
| kanzure | if you need money just fucking ask argh | 14:13 |
| kanzure | but also, i'm paying dpk to do paperbot things | 14:14 |
| kanzure | and joepie91__ | 14:14 |
| kanzure | i forgot about those two for a moment | 14:14 |
| ParahSailin | oh | 14:14 |
| ParahSailin | still id rather have money from suckers instead | 14:14 |
| ParahSailin | because i wouldnt feel so bad that it could have been used better | 14:15 |
| catern | attention is useful, though, so you can "crowdsource" the scraping and make it go faster/safer | 14:15 |
| catern | you want some attention at some point | 14:15 |
| catern | (Maybe?????) | 14:15 |
| kanzure | if you get attention then the universities cut you off | 14:16 |
| kanzure | i had a small android proxy app at some point, but you still have to do centralized communication with some server (possibly over tor) | 14:16 |
| catern | ah... that is a lot easier way to block it, hm | 14:16 |
| kanzure | if you say you're downloading from university of utah, they will just block you | 14:17 |
| kanzure | and putting it on kickstarter is a good way to get noticed | 14:17 |
| catern | that sure would be dystopian, though. universities blocking access to a website with papers | 14:17 |
| kanzure | the android proxy idea was so that students could arbitrarily run the app themselves | 14:17 |
| kanzure | and then get paid in bitcoin from an anonymous service | 14:17 |
| catern | people will do it voluntarily | 14:17 |
| kanzure | universities constantly block people downloading papers | 14:17 |
| gradstudentbot | I really like him, but some of his work is really problematic. | 14:18 |
| catern | yeah, but you're suggesting they might block access to the server they're uploading to. | 14:18 |
| catern | scary to think of my uni blocking libgen | 14:18 |
| kanzure | libgen will get blocked above the university level | 14:18 |
| kanzure | dns level etc | 14:18 |
| catern | well, anyway, there's an easy middle ground. i'm sure many people would be willing to run a drop-in VM image on a university network | 14:19 |
| kanzure | if you are going to disturb the hornet nest, you should have a better plan than (1) publicly stating your name, (2) publicly stating who you're going to attack, and (3) putting it in front of 100's of thousands of people who will turn around and inform the publishers ("because it's stealing") | 14:20 |
| catern | and that way you can avoid downloading at such a high rate to be suspicious | 14:20 |
| catern | or just an application | 14:20 |
| catern | so don't publicly state your name or who you'll attack | 14:21 |
| kanzure | iirc there has never been an anonymous kickstarter campaign | 14:21 |
| pasky | i could host something too i guess | 14:21 |
| catern | oh, i wasn't thinking you'd actually use kickstarter | 14:21 |
| kanzure | you fucking said kickstarter :( | 14:21 |
| catern | there are plenty of self-hostable clones | 14:21 |
| catern | ParahSailin said kickstarter! | 14:21 |
| kanzure | oh, well fuck him too then | 14:22 |
| ParahSailin | i recuse myself | 14:22 |
| catern | i don't know why technical projects use kickstarter | 14:22 |
| kanzure | because it's an advertising channel | 14:22 |
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| nmz787_i | kanzure: shame on you for recommending things I can't use "if "windows" in platform.system().lower(): | 14:22 |
| nmz787_i | raise ImportError("sh %s is currently only supported on linux and osx. \ | 14:22 |
| nmz787_i | please install pbs 0.110 (http://pypi.python.org/pypi/pbs) for windows \ | 14:22 |
| nmz787_i | support." % __version__) | 14:22 |
| nmz787_i | " | 14:22 |
| catern | does it really have network effects? but there are so many clones | 14:22 |
| kanzure | nmz787_i: shame on you for using windows, that's your own fault | 14:22 |
| kanzure | catern: kickstarter.com definitely has huge network effects | 14:23 |
| ParahSailin | nmz787_i: whats wrong with subprocess | 14:23 |
| kanzure | catern: indiegogo is pathetic in comparison | 14:23 |
| catern | jesus kickstarter is 5%? i thought it was like 1% | 14:23 |
| catern | kanzure: i guess i just can't visualize the kind of person who regularly browses kickstarter | 14:23 |
| kanzure | redditor | 14:23 |
| kanzure | easily distracted by helvetica | 14:24 |
| kanzure | and youtube videos | 14:24 |
| catern | but they actually go to kickstarter, the site itself? not just individual projects? | 14:24 |
| catern | anyway | 14:24 |
| kanzure | there's been studies on that | 14:24 |
| catern | ah? | 14:24 |
| kanzure | people go back to check on the previous projects they funded, it shows other projects to them based on their interests | 14:25 |
| catern | ahhhh | 14:25 |
| kanzure | if you're trending then you show up on their category views | 14:25 |
| catern | i've never funded anything so I wouldn't know | 14:25 |
| kanzure | i think at least 20% is from previous users | 14:25 |
| kanzure | still need to have a campaign to get users and traffic flowing to your page though | 14:25 |
| kanzure | (this usually means terrible press releases and paying off journalists) | 14:26 |
| catern | anyway I can totally see even a self-hosted kickstarter-style campaign getting massive traction, lots of people want to get access to papers | 14:26 |
| kanzure | you also have to make sure you fund 10% of it on your own within the first 5-30 minutes | 14:26 |
| kanzure | i don't remember any self-hosted crowdfunding campaign that raised any significant amount of money, ever | 14:26 |
| kanzure | (crowdfunding blows man) | 14:26 |
| catern | there's been some games | 14:26 |
| catern | mediagoblin recently | 14:27 |
| kanzure | were those pre-orders | 14:27 |
| catern | not very significant | 14:27 |
| catern | well, yeah | 14:27 |
| kanzure | :smug: | 14:27 |
| catern | i think i will start a startup | 14:27 |
| catern | and apply to YC | 14:27 |
| kanzure | anyway, i'll try not to discourage you too much from putting together your own campaign | 14:27 |
| kanzure | for stealing papers from universities? | 14:27 |
| catern | and our product will be a | 14:27 |
| catern | paper-stealer | 14:27 |
| catern | yes | 14:27 |
| catern | i wonder if you could legitimize it somehow | 14:28 |
| ParahSailin | mega's plausible deniability strategy seems like it might stand up in some courts | 14:28 |
| catern | because there's a huge demand | 14:28 |
| kanzure | findrs fees | 14:28 |
| kanzure | *finders fees | 14:28 |
| kanzure | mendeley legitimized it | 14:28 |
| kanzure | and somehow researchgate is doing the same thing | 14:29 |
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| gradstudentbot | I am kind of curious what he has a Ph.D. in, I can't really find this anywhere, it could be underwater basket weaving for all I know. | 14:29 |
| kanzure | they are probably doing the "author of the paper shares it" strategy | 14:29 |
| catern | you can get random papers off mendeley? | 14:29 |
| kanzure | not anymore haha | 14:30 |
| kanzure | used to | 14:30 |
| kanzure | mendeley was uploading all your papers to their servers | 14:30 |
| kanzure | "for ocr metadata reasons" | 14:30 |
| catern | someone needs to re-legitimize it then | 14:30 |
| catern | get a few mil in VC funding | 14:30 |
| catern | run for a few years | 14:30 |
| catern | then go out in a blaze of lawsuits | 14:30 |
| kanzure | and why would they give you money | 14:31 |
| ParahSailin | serial bankruptcy is how lots of people get money | 14:31 |
| joepie91__ | because intellectual synergy cloud reprioritization strategy acquisition | 14:31 |
| joepie91__ | pls2gief money | 14:31 |
| joepie91__ | (that seems to work for most VC-funded stuff) | 14:32 |
| kanzure | there is often strategy that they don't reveal to the public | 14:32 |
| joepie91__ | kanzure: you mean like HSBC funding drug cartels? :P | 14:32 |
| kanzure | hsbc drug cartels wasn't venture capital fundraising | 14:33 |
| kanzure | argh wtf | 14:33 |
| kanzure | another plausible answer to "why would they give you money" is "because we'll make them a crapload of money by doing x" | 14:34 |
| catern | maybe just persuade one of the PDF upload sites to have proper indexing and paper-finding whatever stuff | 14:34 |
| catern | advertisements on papers | 14:35 |
| catern | advertisements inserted between every 5 pages of the PDFs | 14:35 |
| kanzure | some of the publishers are doing advertisements on papers | 14:35 |
| kanzure | pdfparanoia strips them out :) (at least one publisher's ads, at least) | 14:35 |
| gradstudentbot | These findings indicate that extensive genetic engineering of human hematopoiesis can be achieved with lentiviral vectors. | 14:36 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/kanzure/pdfparanoia | 14:36 |
| nmz787_i | ParahSailin: using pythonw to open a .py file which calls subprocess.Popen with PIPEs, this process then calls subprocess.Popen | 14:36 |
| nmz787_i | ParahSailin: the first time the first subprocess child calls subprocess.Popen ti works, the second time it crashes | 14:37 |
| ParahSailin | crashes how | 14:37 |
| nmz787_i | ParahSailin: http://pastebin.com/kzBzHttP | 14:37 |
| nmz787_i | ParahSailin: crashes and doesn't hit the except, seemingly | 14:37 |
| nmz787_i | as I over-rode sys.stderr and sys.stdout to also print to to a file | 14:38 |
| joepie91__ | kanzure: I was joking :) | 14:38 |
| nmz787_i | so even though the GUI crashes... I thought I'd still retain the errors | 14:38 |
| joepie91__ | catern: PDF upload site operator here, what do you need | 14:38 |
| kanzure | joepie91__: lots of people honestly hold that opinion | 14:38 |
| nmz787_i | but they aren't making it to the file | 14:38 |
| joepie91__ | kanzure: Poe's law | 14:38 |
| joepie91__ | :P | 14:38 |
| nmz787_i | and strangely the pythonw.exe lingers | 14:38 |
| gradstudentbot | I need to send that abstract. | 14:39 |
| ParahSailin | use the strace | 14:39 |
| catern | joepie91__: some way to make sure the ripped PDFs on your site don't go away when you do | 14:41 |
| gradstudentbot | Can I get some more media? | 14:41 |
| catern | joepie91__: also a generic interface would be nice too | 14:41 |
| joepie91__ | catern: my site auto-mirrors all public docs to IA on an hourly cronjob | 14:41 |
| joepie91__ | http://pdf.yt/ | 14:41 |
| ParahSailin | (do all serious windows work on cygwin) | 14:42 |
| joepie91__ | as for generic interface, what do you mean? | 14:42 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: yeah, at this point windows is too annoying for me without cygwin | 14:42 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: even if i end up calling windows binaries, still.. | 14:42 |
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| catern | joepie91__: like the libgens, they're all identical and interchangeable so when one goes down no-one cares. hmm, does libgen have an API? | 14:42 |
| ParahSailin | libgen is russian php | 14:43 |
| joepie91__ | I think they offer dumps | 14:43 |
| joepie91__ | or did so in the past, anyway | 14:43 |
| ParahSailin | does the kalashnikov have an api? | 14:43 |
| catern | i have wanted to upload things to libgen | 14:43 |
| catern | but could not find out how | 14:43 |
| joepie91__ | but yeah, libgen is more of a paper/book hosting service, PDFy is more of a generic PDF hostt | 14:43 |
| joepie91__ | host * | 14:44 |
| joepie91__ | though I'm looking into ODT/EPUB support in the long term | 14:44 |
| kanzure | not dumps, torrents | 14:44 |
| kanzure | which nobody seeds | 14:44 |
| ParahSailin | catern: see paperbot in github for how to upload | 14:44 |
| kanzure | because who has time to seed 12 TB of torrents | 14:44 |
| * bkero raises hand | 14:44 | |
| kanzure | well go do it | 14:44 |
| bkero | Assuming good saturation I can do it in a little bit over a day. | 14:45 |
| catern | ParahSailin: well I think I did find out but my PDF was too big for their public api or something | 14:45 |
| joepie91__ | bkero: I think the saturation was a problem | 14:45 |
| joepie91__ | :p | 14:45 |
| kanzure | there's only one seeder | 14:45 |
| kanzure | has been for years | 14:45 |
| bkero | oh, huh | 14:45 |
| kanzure | everyone else has been too lazy | 14:45 |
| bkero | Wait, 12TB torrent. What is it? | 14:45 |
| * joepie91__ doesn't have 12TB space | 14:45 | |
| kanzure | no, about 1000 torrents, a total of 12 TB | 14:45 |
| bkero | oh | 14:46 |
| catern | clerical data | 14:46 |
| kanzure | each one is about 10,000 pdfs | 14:46 |
| catern | bittorrent is a nice protocol for distributed shared immutable files | 14:47 |
| catern | i.e. exactly this | 14:47 |
| catern | er | 14:47 |
| catern | distributed shared is repeating myself repetitively | 14:47 |
| kanzure | i would say it's only good if people actually seed it | 14:47 |
| kanzure | so, go seed it yourself | 14:47 |
| catern | bittorrent just needs better tooling so people can seed the PDFs they download without having to keep them in the same place or with the same name | 14:49 |
| kanzure | huh? | 14:49 |
| kanzure | so you mean "people should invent symlinks" ? | 14:50 |
| catern | yes | 14:50 |
| bkero | or hardlinks | 14:50 |
| catern | hm, does inotify tell you when a file is moved, and where it moves? | 14:51 |
| catern | or | 14:51 |
| catern | yeah | 14:51 |
| bkero | If you just keep the torrent daemon running, you can move the file and it will still seed | 14:51 |
| kanzure | moving files around sounds like an extremely unrelated issue | 14:51 |
| catern | or just hardlinks | 14:51 |
| bkero | since it keeps the fd open | 14:51 |
| catern | so, then. someone needs to write a tiny bit of glue code that hardlinks your libgen pdfs together, grouped by torrent | 14:52 |
| catern | in directories, i mean | 14:52 |
| gradstudentbot | Who got mustard on my cell culture? | 14:53 |
| catern | bkero: but what happens when you restart | 14:53 |
| catern | kanzure: i'm just saying why i personally don't send all the libgen pdfs i have on my system | 14:53 |
| kanzure | you think that the lack of the glue code is the reason why nobody is seeding? | 14:53 |
| catern | seed* | 14:53 |
| joepie91__ | I should probably mention here that popcorn time does a similar thing for streaming video, and it got the MPAA pretty scared | 14:53 |
| catern | it's why i'm not seeding | 14:53 |
| kanzure | *that's* the reason why you're not seeding?? | 14:53 |
| catern | yes, it's too much effort | 14:53 |
| joepie91__ | catern: FWIW, some clients like Tixati let you move the file from the client interface itself | 14:53 |
| catern | i'd have to figure out which PDF is from which torrent | 14:53 |
| joepie91__ | and it'll happily continue seeding from the new location | 14:54 |
| kanzure | that's the silliest reason i have heard :) | 14:54 |
| joepie91__ | (or even change the location after the fact, and it'll pick up on the original file that's already there) | 14:54 |
| catern | which would be a pain | 14:54 |
| bkero | catern: why would you restart? | 14:54 |
| catern | bkero: because Big Publishing found a linux 0day and they're coming after your box | 14:55 |
| bkero | catern: Okay. I'll take those chances. | 14:56 |
| joepie91__ | if you're bored, write a graphical frontend that lets you search libgen for documents, and then automatically seeds them as you download them | 14:56 |
| joepie91__ | problem solved | 14:56 |
| kanzure | .title http://torrent.rus.ec/viewforum.php?f=186 | 14:56 |
| yoleaux | Библиотека 'Либрусек' (Официальные релизы) :: torrent.rus.ec | 14:56 |
| joepie91__ | (partially seeded torrents are a thing) | 14:56 |
| catern | that's what I'm suggesting, except without the graphical frontend | 14:56 |
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| bkero | joepie91__: didn't someone get prosecuted and hounded until he committed suicide for similar behavior? | 14:56 |
| catern | since you can just hash your downloaded pdfs to find out which pdf they correspond to in the torrent | 14:57 |
| joepie91__ | bkero: can't recall that | 14:57 |
| catern | it doesn't sound too hard, actually | 14:57 |
| kanzure | bkero: no, aaronsw didn't reach the stage of prosecution iirc | 14:57 |
| catern | i wish libgen wasn't so russian | 14:57 |
| kanzure | what's wrong with russian | 14:57 |
| bkero | kanzure: the hounding stage? | 14:57 |
| catern | i would like to read their forums and stuff | 14:57 |
| kanzure | learn some fucking russian, don't be a baby | 14:58 |
| * joepie91__ doesn't see what aaron has to do with above proposal? | 14:58 | |
| kanzure | joepie91__: bkero mentioned him | 14:58 |
| ParahSailin | the letters are just greek with some hairy bits | 14:58 |
| catern | english-language chauvinism has served me well so far | 14:58 |
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| joepie91__ | yes, I'm refering to [23:57] <bkero> joepie91__: didn't someone get prosecuted and hounded until he committed suicide for similar behavior? | 14:58 |
| joepie91__ | there's a pretty big difference between writing a graphical frontend, and mass-downloading documents | 14:58 |
| kanzure | русский язык, как сладкий запах навоза | 14:58 |
| joepie91__ | even if both are morally absolutely okay, they're not the same kind of thing | 14:59 |
| kanzure | agreed | 14:59 |
| joepie91__ | and likely won't trigger the same kind of response | 14:59 |
| kanzure | "with some hairy bits" haha | 14:59 |
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| catern | is there a place that has all the torrent files rather than magnet links for libgen? | 15:03 |
| kanzure | it's on one of the servers by ftp | 15:03 |
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| kanzure | if you find it, drop the link | 15:20 |
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| joepie91__ | http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/28h3z6/us_government_accidentally_reveals_private/ | 15:32 |
| joepie91__ | "oops" | 15:32 |
| kanzure | .tell nmz787 alltronics stuff has shipped | 15:32 |
| yoleaux | kanzure: I'll pass your message to nmz787. | 15:32 |
| kanzure | joepie91__: neat trick, although i htink it's a public list (e.g., not the people that have paid $200k? not sure) | 15:33 |
| kanzure | it may be the "sign up for announcements" list | 15:33 |
| joepie91__ | I think that's exactly what it was. | 15:33 |
| joepie91__ | lol | 15:33 |
| kanzure | .tell nmz787 alltronics shipping charges cost more than the synthesizer shipping charges | 15:44 |
| yoleaux | kanzure: I'll pass your message to nmz787. | 15:44 |
| nmz787_i | huh | 15:46 |
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| kanzure | hm there's a python-librtlsdr and pyrtlsdr http://sdr.osmocom.org/trac/wiki/rtl-sdr | 16:01 |
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| kanzure | someone is claiming lildlper is doing 37 micron layers | 16:15 |
| kanzure | https://www.dropbox.com/s/wkvjlql3vhhavse/trexScaleB.tif | 16:15 |
| kanzure | with this 1080p projector http://www.amazon.com/Acer-H6510BD-Theater-Projector-White/dp/B00B97ZKIA | 16:15 |
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| kanzure | larger prints: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ktwaaavu5pv5ans/2014-06-13%2017.32.02.jpg | 16:16 |
| kanzure | rabbit next to penny https://www.dropbox.com/s/crfls4d3gba64j5/2014-06-12%2018.29.32.jpg | 16:17 |
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| kanzure | why didn't any of those "3d printer plastic" bacterial culture companies ever do anything | 16:48 |
| kanzure | did it turn out to be more expensive than making normal plastic spools? | 16:49 |
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| ParahSailin | i had one of those strains | 17:47 |
| ParahSailin | guess who didnt want it | 17:47 |
| kanzure | was it me? fuck me | 17:50 |
| * kanzure looks at http://cs.umd.edu/~amiller/nonoutsourceable_full.pdf | 17:53 | |
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| nmz787_i | http://www.unece.org/trans/danger/publi/ghs/ghs_welcome_e.html | 17:54 |
| nmz787_i | 'Globally Harmonized System of Classification and Labelling of Chemicals (GHS)' | 17:54 |
| kanzure | wasn't there an IUPAC classification thing | 17:55 |
| nmz787_i | http://www.unece.org/trans/danger/publi/ghs/pictograms.html | 17:55 |
| nmz787_i | umm, IUPAC is naming/acronym rules I guess | 17:56 |
| kanzure | which symbol should i use for "curses your gametes with black magic"? | 17:56 |
| kanzure | ah, perfect http://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/trans/danger/publi/ghs/TDGpictograms/5-2red_noir.gif | 17:57 |
| nmz787_i | heheh | 17:57 |
| nmz787_i | radiation? | 17:57 |
| kanzure | oh is black magic supposed to be radiation? | 17:57 |
| kanzure | that would explain a lot | 17:57 |
| nmz787_i | http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/cen-v036n027.p044 | 17:58 |
| paperbot | http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1021%2Fcen-v036n027.p044 | 17:58 |
| nmz787_i | 'now with more cyanide!; | 17:58 |
| nmz787_i | huh, 1958 date on that article/advert | 17:59 |
| kanzure | how does azco biotech store its chemicals if these can only be stored for 6 weeks at a time | 17:59 |
| nmz787_i | damn pay-walled advertisments | 17:59 |
| nmz787_i | kanzure: the ammonia thing is probably just cause its a dissolved gas | 17:59 |
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| nmz787_i | "Your current credentials do not allow retrieval of the full text." | 18:00 |
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| nmz787_i | "You haven't paid us to see this paid-advertisement." | 18:00 |
| kanzure | so ammonium hydroxide is the only problematic one? | 18:01 |
| nmz787_i | idk | 18:01 |
| nmz787_i | haven't read the docs yet | 18:01 |
| nmz787_i | but liters of waster per 100 bases will not be cheap to dispose of | 18:01 |
| kanzure | docs claim it can be dissolved safely in "earth" | 18:02 |
| nmz787_i | not to mention buying all those reagents that are just getting flushed through | 18:02 |
| nmz787_i | heh | 18:02 |
| nmz787_i | I wonder if they're pre-EPA | 18:02 |
| nmz787_i | this library has a james-bond like girl for their logo http://wyld.sdp.sirsi.net/client/en_US/wmc/search/detailnonmodal;jsessionid=E3330DFA99DA5295B912EFBCC166880C.enterprise-35500?qu=Sampling.&d=ent%3A%2F%2FSD_ILS%2F833%2FSD_ILS%3A833057~ILS~0~16879&ic=true&ps=300 | 18:02 |
| kanzure | "Discard the waste. Place the liquid in a sealed container labeled “FLAMMABLE,” “POISON B N.O.S.” or absorb in vermiculite, dry sand or earth. Dispose of the waste following applicable government regulations. When handling the waste for disposal, wear gloves and eye protection, and avoid inhalation and skin contact." | 18:03 |
| nmz787_i | http://will.state.wy.us/wyld/ent/wmc_ent_logo.bmp | 18:04 |
| nmz787_i | kanzure: pretty sure waste companies would charge more if it was absorbed into some solid | 18:05 |
| nmz787_i | more weight to haul in their trucks, more processing to do I'd assume | 18:05 |
| nmz787_i | unless they just load the soil into their oven thing | 18:05 |
| nmz787_i | incinerator | 18:05 |
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| nmz787_i | kanzure: apparently this is used for "reproductive Toxins' http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/GHS-pictogram-silhouete.svg | 18:11 |
| ParahSailin | put it down drain to sewer | 18:15 |
| ParahSailin | wastewater treatment plants are very effective bioreactors for neutralizing chemicals | 18:16 |
| yashgaroth | pretty much, yeah | 18:18 |
| nmz787_i | I don't think that's a good idea | 18:18 |
| yashgaroth | it's fiiiiiine | 18:18 |
| ParahSailin | oh, are you telling me you know more about activated sludge reactors? | 18:20 |
| yashgaroth | if you're that worried, just run the tap while you're dumping it | 18:20 |
| nmz787_i | no, but I won't do something like that until I read through things on my own | 18:21 |
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| nmz787_i | I should probably do something about the unpolymerized acrylamide that I've been keeping in the back of my fridge for the last year | 18:35 |
| ebowden | Isn't that stuff extremely toxic? | 18:37 |
| yashgaroth | only if you have neurons | 18:37 |
| nmz787_i | it's capped and in a cold fridge, and I think in a sealed bag maybe | 18:38 |
| nmz787_i | I keep it next to my grass-fed raw milk | 18:38 |
| nmz787_i | not really, it's just in the back corner of the fridge | 18:39 |
| nmz787_i | supposedly the first thing to happen toxin-wise is your finger tips start to tingle | 18:39 |
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| kanzure | ParahSailin: why is antibiotic resistance used for selection rather than toxin/toxin resistance? | 18:56 |
| ParahSailin | isnt that basically the same thing to a bug? | 18:57 |
| kanzure | i mean lab reasons | 18:57 |
| kanzure | plate, antibiotic resistance screen, look for gfp, etc | 18:58 |
| ParahSailin | what do you mean by toxin as opposed to antibiotic | 18:58 |
| kanzure | sorry, i'm mixing up my signals | 19:01 |
| kanzure | iirc, most people use penicillin for their lab work | 19:02 |
| kanzure | which seems like a bad idea, since we use penicillin for medical reasons | 19:03 |
| kanzure | so ideally you would use different options for random lab work so you don't accidentally confer penicillin resistance to everything under the sun | 19:03 |
| yashgaroth | nobody uses it for bacterial selection, pen/strep is used to keep stuff from growing in other cell cultures | 19:03 |
| kanzure | i wish i could remember what the hell i've used | 19:04 |
| yashgaroth | ampicillin, tetracycline, kanamycin, chloramphenicol are the big ones | 19:04 |
| yashgaroth | also we use antibiotics since we know what the resistance genes are, finding a suitable 'toxin' and then trying to find a resistance gene for it sounds like a huge hassle and biologists are lazy | 19:06 |
| nmz787 | chloramphenicol isn't allowed for human use in this country | 19:12 |
| yoleaux | 18 Jun 2014 22:33Z <kanzure> nmz787: alltronics stuff has shipped | 19:12 |
| yoleaux | 18 Jun 2014 22:44Z <kanzure> nmz787: alltronics shipping charges cost more than the synthesizer shipping charges | 19:12 |
| nmz787 | other countries are less strict | 19:12 |
| nmz787 | so I'm thinking the synthesizer might be retrofittable | 19:12 |
| pasky | to expand on that a bit, i'd expect that as bacterias typically easily gain resistance to antibiotics naturally over time, which means it is easy to compare the bacteria strain "before" and "after"... I'd imagine gaining resistance to some random toxin can be quite more challenging for the bacteria? | 19:13 |
| nmz787 | probably swap a microfluidic in for the column | 19:13 |
| nmz787 | pasky: why would it be easier/harder to evolve one thing or another? | 19:13 |
| nmz787 | the main difference would be if a detox solution would need multiple enzymes, lots of aminos to hold the enzyme together or if the reaction sequence it needed was all over the target molecule | 19:14 |
| nmz787 | needing to interact all over the target molecule i mean | 19:14 |
| nmz787 | or if multiple enzymes were needed | 19:14 |
| nmz787 | and how much of that would be mutated from old stuff | 19:15 |
| nmz787 | or be de novo generated | 19:15 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: it might be easier to ask about certain toxins you'd think might be useful | 19:15 |
| kanzure | no, i was probably spacing on penicillin vs ampicillin | 19:16 |
| yashgaroth | re: chloramphenicol, apparently "Gray baby syndrome" is a thing heh | 19:16 |
| kanzure | .wik gray baby syndrome | 19:18 |
| yoleaux | "Gray baby syndrome (also termed Gray or Grey syndrome) is a rare but serious side effect that occurs in newborn infants (especially premature babies) following the intravenous administration of the antimicrobial chloramphenicol." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_baby_syndrome | 19:18 |
| nmz787 | ~~~~ | 19:18 |
| yashgaroth | "why is my baby gray?" "I'm afraid he has gray baby syndrome" "fuck you're a useless doctor" | 19:19 |
| kanzure | "thanks to smelly squid biotech, your baby can come out glowing with the best of them" | 19:20 |
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| kanzure | *** Error in `/home/kanzure/.virtualenvs/brlcad/bin/python': invalid fastbin entry (free): 0x0000000003b46b90 *** | 19:35 |
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| pasky | heh, nobody wrote a tool for on-gpu tile-wise seamless affine transform of huge image surfaces yet? | 20:02 |
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| kanzure | nmz787: i'm still not convinced that disposal service is necessary ("dry sand") | 20:23 |
| nmz787 | i believe so | 20:23 |
| nmz787 | what is the link | 20:23 |
| kanzure | in manual, http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/DNA/abi391/ | 20:23 |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/DNA/abi391/ABI%20391-manual.pdf | 20:23 |
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| justanotheruser | Please reccomend me an economical CNC mill | 20:30 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: it's out of context to not provide the next line in that quote "Dispose of the waste following applicable government regulations." | 20:30 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: I got the number for the waste water treatment folks re lab use | 20:30 |
| kanzure | justanotheruser: cncified bridgeport is as cheap as you're going to get for anything uesful | 20:33 |
| kanzure | *useful | 20:33 |
| kanzure | *cnc-converted | 20:33 |
| kanzure | what are the waste people doing that we can't | 20:33 |
| kanzure | buying bags of sand? | 20:33 |
| nmz787 | .wik Cordycepin | 20:34 |
| yoleaux | "Cordycepin, or 3'-deoxyadenosine, is a derivative of the nucleoside adenosine, differing from the latter by the absence of oxygen in the 3' position of its ribose part. It was initially extracted from fungi of genus Cordyceps, but is now produced synthetically." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cordycepin | 20:34 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: it isn't a CNC mill out of the box? | 20:35 |
| kanzure | manual :) | 20:35 |
| kanzure | you could probably find someone selling a converted bridgeport though | 20:36 |
| justanotheruser | Oh, do I need to hack it to get it to take coordinates? | 20:36 |
| kanzure | so, most of the cheap cnc machines you find on kickstarter are not going to cut aluminum | 20:36 |
| kanzure | it's too bad that they are all called "cnc" because it's hard to figure out which ones wont blow up the moment you try to cut metals | 20:37 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: is that an exaggeration? | 20:37 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: usually they use an incinerator with scubbers or additional burning I think... unless you're some company in the middle of nowhere with a lot of desert to dump in. I think they take watershed stuff around here pretty seriously. | 20:37 |
| kanzure | justanotheruser: i don't think so, although i haven't looked at /all/ of them. there have been lots. | 20:37 |
| nmz787 | justanotheruser: i heard similar recently | 20:38 |
| justanotheruser | nmz787: from kanzure? | 20:38 |
| kanzure | haha | 20:38 |
| nmz787 | "You can see all of the larger pieces of equipment in my shop here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5i9f9GJS9M I'd say that a CNC mill is probably the single most versatile piece of mechanical manufacturing equipment that you can buy. If you can afford and have space for a full-size mill, you will be in really good shape in terms of being able to make almost any reasonable part. Some of the smaller tabletop CNCs are not able to cut metal (even ... | 20:38 |
| nmz787 | ... aluminum) very much at all, so they are much more limited. You can certainly cur threads on the CNC, but just having a tap set is often more than sufficient for most projects." | 20:38 |
| nmz787 | "-Ben [Krasnow]" | 20:38 |
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| justanotheruser | nmz787: sorry to change the subject, but how do you get an ellipse at the end of your line carrying onto a new one in irssi? | 20:39 |
| nmz787 | uhh | 20:40 |
| catern | nmz787: splitlong.pl | 20:40 |
| nmz787 | there were some ellipses in the stuff i pasted | 20:40 |
| justanotheruser | lol :/ | 20:40 |
| catern | er | 20:40 |
| catern | justanotheruser: splitlong.pl | 20:40 |
| justanotheruser | catern: thanks | 20:40 |
| nmz787 | catern: I am paid to not use .pl | 20:40 |
| justanotheruser | nmz787: oh? | 20:40 |
| catern | justanotheruser: drop it in .irssi/scripts/autorun | 20:41 |
| justanotheruser | So you manually count the characters and ... at the end? | 20:41 |
| kanzure | the world health organization barred nmz787 from writing perl in 1997 | 20:41 |
| nmz787 | I have no idea honestly, i think it's just the default debian repo install | 20:41 |
| catern | they're very progressive so they pay him a stipend | 20:41 |
| kanzure | similar arrangements for jrayhawk have been met with little to no success | 20:41 |
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| kanzure | justanotheruser: fenn has spent a lot of time thinking about cheap cnc machines that do more than wood cutting | 20:42 |
| nmz787 | generally the way I sanitize IRC pastes is by first pasting it into my Chrome URL bar, then re-copying it | 20:42 |
| kanzure | justanotheruser: most people think that you need lots of mass to cut metal, but that's mostly because they don't understand how to do engineering | 20:42 |
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| justanotheruser | catern: umm, what if I don't have a scripts folder in my .irssi/? | 20:43 |
| kanzure | for example, it has been demonstrated that you can use lasers or water to cut metal without 10000 kg of metal | 20:43 |
| justanotheruser | just put it in .irssi/? | 20:43 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: has he built any prototypes? | 20:43 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: lasers seem more energy effecient | 20:44 |
| kanzure | well, there's hextatic, but that's not a water cutter or laser cutter | 20:44 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: would the lasers needed to cut that be cheap at all? | 20:44 |
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| kanzure | off the shelf, no, most good cnc equipment costs at least $50k, and then the fancypants stuff costs 10x or so | 20:45 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NsM0-9_n3Q | 20:45 |
| yoleaux | 5 Axis Laser Cutting | 20:45 |
| kanzure | .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7NofmHWWPQ | 20:46 |
| yoleaux | Mitsubishi VZ20 Series 3D Laser Cutting Systems | 20:46 |
| justanotheruser | kanzure: do wany | 20:46 |
| justanotheruser | *want | 20:46 |
| nmz787 | justanotheruser: http://eugene.craigslist.org/tls/4439725753.html | 20:46 |
| nmz787 | 3 axis | 20:47 |
| nmz787 | $10k | 20:47 |
| kanzure | i haven't priced a water cutter before but i'm sure it's >$5k for anything good | 20:48 |
| kanzure | i think you can usually pick up a good manual bridgeport for <$1k | 20:49 |
| kanzure | if a cnc conversion can be sold for $10k that sounds like good business to me... | 20:49 |
| kanzure | *used manual bridgeport | 20:49 |
| kanzure | gene_hacker: why hasn't everyone switched over to laser cutter cnc | 20:51 |
| kanzure | i guess threading | 20:52 |
| nmz787 | "chickens could not compete with hazardous waste as a cash crop, since farmers typically were paid anywhere from $20 to $50 per drum of waste dumped on their land." | 20:54 |
| nmz787 | http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-04/how-toxic-dumping-led-tragedy-small-seaside-town | 20:54 |
| justanotheruser | >popsci | 20:54 |
| kanzure | "Waste organic solvents are separated into chlorinated and non-chlorinated solvent waste. Chlorinated solvent waste is usually incinerated at high temperature to minimize the formation of dioxins.[2][3] Non-chlorinated solvent waste can be burned for energy recovery. Innocuous aqueous waste (such as solutions of sodium chloride) may be poured down the sink; aqueous waste containing toxic compounds are collected separately." | 20:56 |
| nmz787 | "As easy as it was to dump legally in the hinterlands of central Jersey, many haulers wanted even sweeter deals. They preferred to do their dumping for free, deep in the pinelands, without anyone's permission or knowledge. No one stood in their way. In those days, the closest thing New Jersey had to an anti-dumping law was a misdemeanor public nuisance statute; it was invoked very rarely and only in the most blatant cases" | 20:58 |
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| kanzure | as far as i can tell, most universities just hire some outside service and then stop thinking about it | 20:59 |
| kanzure | but there's many forms of waste that you can react chemically with other stuff to make it drain safe | 20:59 |
| nmz787 | .wik tom's river | 20:59 |
| yoleaux | "The Toms River, formerly Tom's River, is a 41.7-mile-long (67.1 km) freshwater river and estuary in Ocean County, New Jersey in the United States." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom%27s_River | 20:59 |
| nmz787 | .wik tom's river pollution | 20:59 |
| yoleaux | "The Toms River, formerly Tom's River, is a 41.7-mile-long (67.1 km) freshwater river and estuary in Ocean County, New Jersey in the United States." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toms_River | 20:59 |
| kanzure | i'm not convinced that "liquid organic waste" is as dangerous as radioactive barrels you have to hide forever | 20:59 |
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| nmz787 | .wik Ciba Geigy | 21:00 |
| yoleaux | "Novartis International AG is a Swiss multinational pharmaceutical company based in Basel, Switzerland, ranking number one in sales (57.9 billion US$) among the world-wide industry in 2013." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciba_Geigy | 21:00 |
| nmz787 | that popsci article was excerpting a book, I guess the polluter was discharging dye into the river | 21:01 |
| kanzure | disposal is just "now it's someone else's problem", they might be dumping it down the drain for all you know | 21:10 |
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| nmz787 | that popsci article was excerpting a book, I guess the polluter was discharging dye into the river | 21:29 |
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| nmz787 | that popsci article was excerpting a book, I guess the polluter was discharging dye into the river | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | hi, sorry for the last two errant messages | 21:32 |
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| nmz787 | so the TCA is/forms 'halogenated waste' http://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/summary/summary.cgi?sid=24851461#x50 | 22:36 |
| nmz787 | "Disposal Methods SRP: At the time of review, criteria for land treatment or burial (sanitary landfill) disposal practices are subject to significant revision. Prior to implementing land disposal of waste residue (including waste sludge), consult with environmental regulatory agencies for guidance on acceptable disposal practices." | 22:36 |
| nmz787 | pure TCA is used as weed killer though | 22:37 |
| nmz787 | or maybe they used to | 22:38 |
| kanzure | "Because halogenated organic solvents are often environmental and health hazards and even human carcinogens, the use in open applications has been banned worldwide." | 22:42 |
| nmz787 | .wik Psoralen | 22:45 |
| yoleaux | "Psoralen (also called psoralene) is the parent compound in a family of natural products known as furocoumarins." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psoralen | 22:45 |
| kanzure | all those assholes that care about "green waste" should make me a database or website of obvious methods of remediation of basic organic compounds | 22:47 |
| kanzure | so far i don't see one. what a bunch of wankers. | 22:47 |
| kanzure | people are terrible and evil. after all of these years of me enduring 5 seconds a week listening to their crap, none of them have done even that much?? | 22:48 |
| nmz787 | maybe we can ask a safety expert on diybio.org | 22:52 |
| nmz787 | paste the whole list of reagents | 22:52 |
| kanzure | haha yes | 22:52 |
| kanzure | i think the trigger word is "remediation", not "disposal" ("make someone else take it away") | 22:53 |
| nmz787 | "Sodium monochloroacetate is currently used widely throughout the UK cane fruit industry and most particularly for both summer and autumn fruiting raspberries, to remove unwanted primocanes in both alleys and within the crop rows." | 22:55 |
| nmz787 | http://www.pesticides.gov.uk/Resources/CRD/Migrated-Resources/Documents/E/Essential_Uses_Report_for_SMA.pdf | 22:55 |
| nmz787 | "Without a suitable alternative to sodium monochloroacetate as an early season defoliant, the hop industry will find it very difficult to compete against imports of hops." | 22:56 |
| kanzure | the reason why it's harmful is because it's reactive, so you should be able to just react it into something more inert or less interesting | 22:56 |
| nmz787 | which burning does | 22:56 |
| kanzure | obv. the device needs a combustion chamber | 22:58 |
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| nmz787 | this tells us nothing http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1-Methylimidazole | 23:00 |
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| nmz787 | http://www.glenresearch.com/MSDS/reagents/mMethylimidazole.pdf | 23:02 |
| nmz787 | "Waste Disposal: This combustible material may be burned in a chemical incinerator equipped with an afterburner and scrubber. Observe all federal, state and local laws for disposal." | 23:02 |
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| nmz787 | http://www.deq.state.or.us/lq/pubs/factsheets/hw/HowToDetermineHW.pdf | 23:04 |
| nmz787 | http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/40/part-261/subpart-D | 23:05 |
| nmz787 | .title | 23:05 |
| yoleaux | 40 CFR Part 261, Subpart D | 23:06 |
| nmz787 | http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/pdf/MSDS_Sodium_trichloroacetate.pdf | 23:17 |
| nmz787 | http://orf.od.nih.gov/EnvironmentalProtection/Documents/Waste20Calendar2004270920508.pdf | 23:19 |
| nmz787 | "Multihazardous Waste" | 23:20 |
| gradstudentbot | Yeah, but that was only a sample size of one. | 23:20 |
| nmz787 | it has a flow chart | 23:20 |
| nmz787 | "Call 301-496-4451 for waste pick-up" | 23:20 |
| gradstudentbot | Cancer: still not cured. | 23:21 |
| nmz787 | "Available from Chemical Waste Disposal Service (301) 496-4710" "Liquid waste container 3/5 gallon Collect chemical waste" | 23:23 |
| nmz787 | "Hazardous waste should always be disposed of through a designated hazardous waste management or recycling facility. Hazardous waste should not be disposed with ordinary garbage, poured into the sewer system, down storm drains, or onto the ground. Oregon law prohibits these acts." | 23:30 |
| kanzure | that's bullshit, because you can't go to a hazardous waste facility and tell them "hey guys, stop whatever you're doing, you should really be transferring that waste to a hazardous waste facility" | 23:31 |
| kanzure | it's too recursive, their regulations are crap | 23:31 |
| nmz787 | no, that just means they probably have different rules | 23:32 |
| kanzure | :( | 23:32 |
| nmz787 | http://www.epa.gov/epawaste/hazard/tsd/index.htm | 23:35 |
| nmz787 | .title | 23:35 |
| yoleaux | Hazardous Waste Treatment, Storage & Disposal | 23:35 |
| gene_hacker | lasercutter cnc? | 23:35 |
| kanzure | only reason i can think of is threading | 23:36 |
| nmz787 | we still don't know if it requires burning or can be sprayed onto some landfill | 23:36 |
| kanzure | otherwise i think everyone should be using it for most cnc things | 23:36 |
| gene_hacker | lasercutter over CNC? | 23:37 |
| gene_hacker | oh I see | 23:37 |
| kanzure | like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7NofmHWWPQ | 23:37 |
| gene_hacker | you need to read this: http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/gcnc/ | 23:37 |
| kanzure | laser cutter cnc should cost much less in parts and maintenance than conventional bulky cnc stuff | 23:37 |
| gene_hacker | milling is a great process BTW | 23:38 |
| kanzure | yep i've read that at least once | 23:38 |
| kanzure | although not part 4 | 23:38 |
| gene_hacker | oh that sort of laser cutter | 23:38 |
| gene_hacker | problem is lasers suck | 23:38 |
| kanzure | well, water then.. | 23:39 |
| gene_hacker | lasers are really inefficient | 23:39 |
| gene_hacker | water jet cutters require lots of power | 23:39 |
| kanzure | damn. | 23:39 |
| gene_hacker | and they need jewels for the water jet that wear out | 23:40 |
| gene_hacker | I don't know which uses less power though | 23:40 |
| -!- Adifex is now known as night | 23:40 | |
| gene_hacker | but if you're using it to make a limited production run of parts, I'm sure it would make sense to use them | 23:41 |
| gene_hacker | techshop has a waterjet cutter don't they? | 23:41 |
| nmz787 | http://www.epa.gov/epawaste/hazard/tsd/ldr/resource.htm | 23:41 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: there's a bunch of stuff there | 23:41 |
| gene_hacker | incinerate the waste | 23:41 |
| gene_hacker | use a really big mirror and get it really hot, pass through a scrubber | 23:42 |
| gene_hacker | also what are the plans for the synthesizer? | 23:43 |
| nmz787 | careful teardown | 23:43 |
| kanzure | thorough teardown with pics, dumping software from the chips | 23:43 |
| nmz787 | firmware even | 23:44 |
| gene_hacker | why? | 23:44 |
| gene_hacker | just to reverse engineer it? | 23:44 |
| kanzure | curiosity | 23:44 |
| gene_hacker | sounds good | 23:44 |
| kanzure | their manual has a fluidic schematic of the device | 23:44 |
| kanzure | would be nice to run it for a while | 23:44 |
| nmz787 | might be able to see if there's a way to cannibalize it | 23:44 |
| nmz787 | retrofit it | 23:44 |
| kanzure | if we do choose to run it, | 23:45 |
| kanzure | there's a limited time during which the reagents are good | 23:45 |
| kanzure | so there should be a list of stuff to synthesize ahead of time | 23:45 |
| kanzure | so that it doesn't sit idle | 23:45 |
| gene_hacker | isn't it all just a bunch of precision stuff that will lose it it's precision magic if taken apart? | 23:45 |
| nmz787 | the complete chemical set (which I have no idea how much powder to solvent it uses yet) was like $1200 | 23:45 |
| gene_hacker | no surprise there | 23:46 |
| kanzure | i don't think it's $1200 recurring, though | 23:46 |
| kanzure | maybe $1200 one time, probably $300/mo recurring? | 23:46 |
| nmz787 | so if the powder is for like 10kb (which I doubt)... then we need about 100X more solvent than I pencilled for | 23:46 |
| nmz787 | http://www.epa.gov/opptintr/chemfact/f_acenit.txt | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | " Acetonitrile by itself is not likely to cause environmental harm | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | at levels normally found in the environment. Acetonitrile can | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | contribute to the formation of photochemical smog when it reacts with | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | other volatile organic carbon substances in air." | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | hmm, let it evap | 23:47 |
| nmz787 | 'i came back and it was gone' | 23:47 |
| kanzure | "gnomes stole it" | 23:48 |
| kanzure | gene_hacker: start thinking up a list of primers of interesting things you'd like :P (max is 175 bp, but my guess is that we'll get 20-40 bp) | 23:49 |
| gene_hacker | DNA nanotechnology | 23:49 |
| gene_hacker | do you have a hood for the darn thing? | 23:49 |
| kanzure | well the manual says "just use a 25 foot tube", so i imagine it could go outside for all we care | 23:50 |
| kanzure | it mentions that the waste bottle should probably be under a fume hood | 23:50 |
| gene_hacker | please don't set this thing up like the one in district 9! | 23:51 |
| nmz787 | oh ya, that's a good source of inspiration | 23:52 |
| kanzure | taq primers for sure | 23:53 |
| kanzure | various fluorescent proteins | 23:53 |
| kanzure | *protein primers | 23:53 |
| gene_hacker | aren't those >150 bp? | 23:53 |
| nmz787 | it would be easier to start with primers for whatever is specified by the kit | 23:53 |
| kanzure | nah the primers can be 20 bp | 23:53 |
| kanzure | for the genes themselves yes >150 | 23:54 |
| nmz787 | for a PCR mastermix | 23:54 |
| nmz787 | they ususally come with some plasmid and primers for a control | 23:54 |
| kanzure | ah good | 23:54 |
| -!- sapiosexual [~sapiosexu@d50-92-49-11.bchsia.telus.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:55 | |
| gene_hacker | actually the reverse engineering might be very educational | 23:56 |
| nmz787 | their valve design is pretty cool, seems pretty similar to a lot of the microfluidic stuff | 23:56 |
| gene_hacker | pictures? | 23:56 |
| kanzure | near end of the manual | 23:57 |
| gene_hacker | perhaps it might be simpler to make a smaller synthesizer based around syringe pumps | 23:57 |
| ParahSailin | acetonitrile biodegrades | 23:57 |
| ParahSailin | so ok to flush down toilet | 23:57 |
| nmz787 | "The normal flow into the column is from the bottom. By sending the liquid stream upward, the CPG particles are lifted and maintained in a fluidized state. The flow rates of the solvents and reagents have been set to achieve proper mixing of the particles." | 23:57 |
| nmz787 | ParahSailin: the problem is that it'll be mixed with a bunch of other stuff too | 23:58 |
| kanzure | page 118, 120, 219, 220 (last one is more interesting) | 23:58 |
| nmz787 | which I haven't google for yet | 23:58 |
| kanzure | of http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/DNA/abi391/ABI%20391-manual.pdf | 23:58 |
| ParahSailin | the other stuff will be handled too | 23:58 |
| nmz787 | ". The software is contained within a removable memory cartridge which plugs into the rear of the instrument. Updated software supplied by Applied Biosystems can be easily installed by removing the old cartridge and replacing it with the new one." | 23:59 |
| kanzure | gene_hacker: it probably would be cheaper overall, sure | 23:59 |
| kanzure | gene_hacker: there's about 10-15 chemical inputs here | 23:59 |
| nmz787 | 7 | 23:59 |
| nmz787 | 7 types | 23:59 |
| * kanzure looks again | 23:59 | |
| nmz787 | 5 of the inputs are phosphoramidites | 23:59 |
| --- Log closed Thu Jun 19 00:00:03 2014 | ||
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