| --- Log opened Tue Aug 12 00:00:32 2014 | ||
| kyknos_ | paperbot: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v499/n7456/full/nature12323.html | 00:06 |
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| paperbot | http://libgen.org/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1038%2Fnature12323 | 00:07 |
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| kanzure | uhhh "Increased luminosity per week comes from protein engineering the pathways in bacteria. We then test those improvements in plant leaves, which takes about four weeks, before inserting the full DNA in a plant which is the slow part which takes 6 months." | 06:08 |
| archels | hm, point of reference. 370 integrate-and-fire neurons with 11002 conductance-based synapses and short-term plasticity. achieved better than real-time performance on an NVidia GTX 280 | 06:14 |
| archels | about a factor 10 faster than a non-optimised parallel CPU implementation | 06:15 |
| archels | Igarashi et al. Neural Networks 24 (2011) | 06:15 |
| archels | kanzure: is the GFP expression heritable in those plants, anyway? | 06:17 |
| kanzure | not gfp i thought | 06:19 |
| chris_99 | it's the luciferase or whatnot thing | 06:21 |
| archels | er. apparently I'm not fully awake | 06:23 |
| archels | but is it heritable? | 06:23 |
| chris_99 | as in do the offspring plants inherit the glowingness? | 06:24 |
| archels | yes | 06:25 |
| chris_99 | yes they do | 06:25 |
| chris_99 | i emailed them about that | 06:25 |
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| archels | that is cool. then they should just start a breeding programme | 06:28 |
| archels | "Arabidopsis can complete its entire lifecycle in six weeks." | 06:28 |
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| chris_99 | they mention somewhere that after a number of generations it loses the ability to glow somewhere | 06:33 |
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| archels | onoes :( | 06:36 |
| archels | what is the explanation for that? | 06:40 |
| chris_99 | yeah on HN the founder says ' Thank you! The seeds are fertile and will retain the glow for a few generations at least (eventually evolution will turn it off due to the metabolic cost on the plant).' | 06:40 |
| archels | does that argument still hold when we demi-god scientists start breeding them for light output? | 06:41 |
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| chris_99 | no idea heh | 06:42 |
| kanzure | what do you mean no idea | 06:44 |
| kanzure | he just said it in the quote | 06:44 |
| kanzure | unless his "evolution" explanation is a fucking lie | 06:44 |
| kanzure | like all his other lies | 06:44 |
| chris_99 | i mean i don't know how you'd breed them for light output | 06:45 |
| kanzure | measurement | 06:46 |
| kanzure | "Before creating a legal framework for the Bio-Commons, the social relations and assumptions underlying an idea of the Bio-Commons need to be addressed. Opening up the Bio-Commons discussion and introducing democratic decision making will make everybody a stakeholder. To successfully initiate a broader discussion about the underlying principles for the Bio-Commons, a mutually understandable bio-language is needed that adequately describes the ... | 07:24 |
| kanzure | ... biological reality in digital form." | 07:24 |
| kanzure | i hate these people why do they even bother | 07:24 |
| kanzure | if their goal is to make antibiotics they should stick to that, rather than waxing poetic about stakeholder staketheory | 07:25 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/Bio-Commons/Bio-Commons | 07:25 |
| kanzure | they are also pretty dumb for this line: "Citizens proposed a ‘Bio-Commons’ license model to put biological innovation into service to society and at the same time limit the potential misuse of knowledge and material" | 07:25 |
| kanzure | no amount of licensing is going to prevent bad actors from doing bad things, that's a really dumb reason to do licensing | 07:26 |
| kanzure | there are much more legitimate and valid reasons to think about licensing issues | 07:26 |
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| ParahSailin | lol | 07:34 |
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| kanzure | couldn't help myself.. i replied: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/diybio/uq6iEcE-88U | 07:57 |
| kanzure | oh brother... http://dna-bits.com "utilizes the Bitcoin platform to solve problems related to Big Data, HIPAA" | 07:59 |
| eudoxia | DeepLearningCoin when | 08:00 |
| kanzure | justanotheruser: am i going to have to suffer with a lifetime of people misusing blockchain ideas | 08:00 |
| kanzure | "A spinoff of the recent OCNS workshop on the modelling of glia-neuron interactions, we have started a new mailing list. It is intended to share items of interest (new results, papers, events, trainings, jobs...) to the computational glioscience community, i.e. researchers implicated in the modelling and simulation of glial cells at large (astrocytes, microglia, oligodendrocytes, Schwann cells...) and their interactions with neurons. To ... | 08:05 |
| kanzure | ... subscribe, send an email to : sympa@inria.fr with the following Subject: subscribe comput-gliosci your_name" | 08:05 |
| kanzure | cc archels | 08:05 |
| kanzure | rudiger replied: "dear Bryan, thanks for commenting, but it would be nice if you read the paper first before you bring up such arguments." | 08:07 |
| kanzure | yeah because i just spontaneously predicted that his whitepaper would mention maidsafe, and "bryan has read the paper" is a completely unreasonable alternative explanation | 08:07 |
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| kanzure | andytoshi: here is an amusing biologist misappropriating blockchain things https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/diybio/uq6iEcE-88U | 08:08 |
| andytoshi | ooh, i haven't seen a biologiest beforle | 08:08 |
| andytoshi | o.O lol | 08:10 |
| andytoshi | "It was thought that the blockchain technology could in future comprise the technical infrastructure for the Bio-Commons" by whom?? | 08:10 |
| kanzure | by the author | 08:10 |
| kanzure | there is an attached pdf | 08:10 |
| kanzure | and he talks about maidsafe and other bullshit :( | 08:10 |
| andytoshi | i'm following to the github.. is that it? | 08:10 |
| kanzure | attached on the email | 08:10 |
| kanzure | also, what's the name of the fallacy or attack about "creating so much misinformation that your opponent can't reply fast enough"? | 08:11 |
| andytoshi | can't remember.. | 08:12 |
| eudoxia | it's kind of like moving the goalpost | 08:13 |
| kanzure | then it needs a better name | 08:13 |
| kanzure | like "babble attack" | 08:13 |
| andytoshi | my tor node has connected me to google groups in german .. i can read the email but can't figure out how to get to the original msg or the attachment | 08:14 |
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| andytoshi | or how to get to english, for that matter :) | 08:14 |
| kanzure | oh, it looks like he's on moderation for the diybio mailing list, so someone has to approve his original email first | 08:14 |
| kanzure | one sec | 08:15 |
| kanzure | argh biotinkering-berlin@googlegroups.com is members only? fuck them | 08:15 |
| kanzure | arghh this is also 403ing http://diybio.eu/mailman/listinfo/diybio-eu | 08:16 |
| andytoshi | lol, no worries, the "blockchain technology" comment gave me a good idea of what to expect :} | 08:16 |
| kanzure | andytoshi: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/diybio/Bio-Commons%20Whitepaper%20-%20%20R%c3%bcdiger%20Trojok%20-%20august%202014.pdf | 08:17 |
| andytoshi | fwiw i think `blockchain` only appears once.. | 08:24 |
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| andytoshi | i don't have time today to read the whole thing, sorry | 08:25 |
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| kanzure | shrug, just some entertainment | 08:26 |
| andytoshi | i've got it open, i'll read it when i need a break :) | 08:29 |
| kanzure | aha... gish gallop. | 08:31 |
| kanzure | http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop | 08:31 |
| andytoshi | ah, excellent, might wanna post that on bitcoin-wizards :P | 08:32 |
| kanzure | done | 08:34 |
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| JayDugger | Good morning. | 08:49 |
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| JayDugger | And yes, you will "have to suffer with a lifetime of people misusing blockchain ideas." | 08:50 |
| JayDugger | Hope your sins were worth it. | 08:51 |
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| kyknos | paperbot, http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1095-8312.2008.00967.x/ | 09:34 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/e0a817078c5c3c4c088b7732192a5c8a.txt | 09:34 |
| kanzure | .wik cladistics | 09:35 |
| yoleaux | "Cladistics (from Greek κλάδος, klados, i.e. "branch") is an approach to biological classification in which organisms are grouped together based on whether or not they have one or more shared unique characteristics that come from the group's last common ancestor and are not present in more distant ancestors." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cladistics | 09:35 |
| kyknos | paperbot, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14641478 | 09:36 |
| kyknos | cladistics is evil :D | 09:36 |
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| kyknos | paperbot, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14641478 | 09:38 |
| kyknos | paperbot, http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1034/j.1601-5223.2003.01503.x/abstract | 09:39 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/96c418617d1807a0bfde4a953beab2fa.txt | 09:39 |
| kanzure | what brand of evil? | 09:45 |
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| justanotheruser | kanzure: blockchains are useful for that because it can be used as a buzzword and attract new users | 09:48 |
| justanotheruser | other than that it's pretty pointless | 09:49 |
| justanotheruser | they should also set up two servers and call them the cloud and utilize that too | 09:49 |
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| justanotheruser | guys I just invented blockchain-cloud based DNA 3d printing | 09:57 |
| bbrittain | holy shit. I'm 95% sure I just walked by Aubrey De Grey on the way to work. | 10:05 |
| bbrittain | the other 5% is a homeless person | 10:05 |
| justanotheruser | bbrittain: are you sure it wasn't just a... | 10:05 |
| bbrittain | but apparently SENS has a foundation out here in MV, so not unlikely. | 10:05 |
| justanotheruser | yeah, beat me to homeless person | 10:05 |
| bbrittain | yea, but I walk by them every day and never have looked at them and gone "that man wants to make me immortal" before | 10:06 |
| bbrittain | turns out SENS is a 5 min walk from my office. I'm gonna say it was him. | 10:11 |
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| catern | if you meet De Grey on the road, kill him | 10:14 |
| bbrittain | what. why. | 10:14 |
| catern | um | 10:15 |
| catern | no reason | 10:15 |
| eudoxia | create sympathy for transhumanists obviously | 10:15 |
| eudoxia | by making it seem like we're an oppressed group that's under attack | 10:15 |
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| catern | the snowclone doesn't make much sense | 10:15 |
| catern | i don't know why it popped into my head | 10:15 |
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| eudoxia | like in Zendegi where SIAI/MIRI/whatever got bombed | 10:15 |
| bbrittain | we are under attack, lack of funding. I think De Grey is our greatest fighter for SENS. :P | 10:16 |
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| nmz787_i | there is probably some reinforcement that needs to be done to make the glowing-ness stable, like some feedback where the nucleus isn't illuminated the cells die (or fail to grow/mature). | 10:28 |
| nmz787_i | maybe using some rhodopsin or phototropism related | 10:30 |
| nmz787_i | not sure if I already posted this here or not: http://www.rsc.org/chemistryworld/2013/05/microfluidic-paper-sugar-solutions-delay-fluid | 10:31 |
| nmz787_i | paperbot: http://pubs.rsc.org/en/Content/ArticleLanding/2013/LC/c3lc50178g#!divAbstract | 10:32 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Dissolvable%20fluidic%20time%20delays%20for%20programming%20multi-step%20assays%20in%20instrument-free%20paper%20diagnostics.pdf | 10:32 |
| nmz787_i | also this http://depts.washington.edu/bioe/academic-programs/bioengineering-summer-camp/ | 10:33 |
| nmz787_i | 'Tuition is $475, in addition to a mandatory $25 registration fee' | 10:33 |
| nmz787_i | 'What will we do?: | 10:33 |
| nmz787_i | Participate in fun hands-on laboratory activities Take a field trip to the Gates Foundation Visit UW Bioengineering laboratories Interact with UW Bioengineering students and faculty | 10:33 |
| nmz787_i | ' | 10:33 |
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| nmz787_i | paperbot: http://dx.doi.org/10.1007/978-3-642-68393-0_20 | 10:42 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/c7e7781dd5e468317ca298424b23e881.txt | 10:42 |
| nmz787_i | heh, Nature Methods wants to keep sending me free dead-tree-format journals | 10:54 |
| chris_99 | heh | 10:59 |
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| nmz787_i | They've been sending me 3 (!) copies per month and I haven't actually been reading any of the articles | 11:04 |
| chris_99 | save the trees maaaan | 11:05 |
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| kanzure | 05:52 < brlcad> first page of all 2014 siggraph technical papers: | 11:07 |
| kanzure | 05:52 < brlcad> http://s2014.siggraph.org/sites/default/files/firstpages.default.pdf | 11:07 |
| kanzure | "Computational Design of Linkage-Based Characters" might be fun | 11:09 |
| ParahSailin | have i ever mentioned how shitty lua is | 11:11 |
| kanzure | "First-person Hyper-lapse videos" is cool | 11:11 |
| chris_99 | damn you ParahSailin | 11:11 |
| chris_99 | it's great :P | 11:11 |
| chris_99 | i really like it | 11:11 |
| ParahSailin | where is string:split | 11:11 |
| kanzure | the only thing going for it is that people know how to bind lua into their projects | 11:11 |
| ParahSailin | fuck you im not going to do string:find and string:sub | 11:11 |
| chris_99 | heh | 11:12 |
| kanzure | the lua standard library is not great | 11:12 |
| ParahSailin | only using it because nginx | 11:12 |
| chris_99 | i'm building a MapReduce thingyjig in it | 11:12 |
| kanzure | that context is already clear because you said openresty | 11:12 |
| kanzure | "Automatic editing of footage from multiple social cameras" | 11:13 |
| ParahSailin | ok, the standard lib stuff doesnt really bother me so much as the completely worthless repl | 11:13 |
| kanzure | "Interactive manipulation of large-scale crowd animation" | 11:13 |
| kanzure | "Tangible and modular device for character articulation" | 11:13 |
| chris_99 | is there a "Stereotype people based on their facial features" the NSA would love that | 11:14 |
| ParahSailin | > 1 == 1 "stdin:1: unexpected symbol near '1'" | 11:14 |
| ParahSailin | diaf | 11:14 |
| kanzure | not sure how the magic in "Robust and Accurate Skeletal Rigging from Mesh Sequences" works | 11:14 |
| ParahSailin | wtf worthless repl | 11:14 |
| ParahSailin | is that even advertised as a repl? | 11:14 |
| kanzure | "Pixie Dust: Graphics Generated by Levitated and Animated Objects in | 11:14 |
| kanzure | Computational Acoustic-Potential Field" | 11:14 |
| kanzure | this one seems to claim they can do acoustic manipulation of colored particles to make a visual display? | 11:15 |
| kanzure | how do they select the colors | 11:15 |
| ParahSailin | only way to test my shit is doing everything online and using ngx.log shit and hoping the types work out | 11:15 |
| chris_99 | have you seen the 3D ultrasound floaty object thingy kanzure | 11:15 |
| kanzure | i have seen many | 11:16 |
| kanzure | "Spin-It: Optimizing Moment of Inertia for Spinnable Objects" why is this siggraph? | 11:16 |
| chris_99 | aha | 11:16 |
| kanzure | " Specifically, given an input 3D shape, the | 11:18 |
| kanzure | goal of our analysis is to predict a corresponding human pose" | 11:18 |
| kanzure | from "Shape2Pose: Human-Centric Shape Analysis" | 11:18 |
| kanzure | "Darkroom: Compiling High-Level Image Processing Code into Hardware Pipelines" | 11:21 |
| kanzure | this one is a little strange, "Active Volumetric Musculoskeletal Systems" i guess they are taking MRI images and making muscle mesh models and then simulate flexing because ?? | 11:22 |
| kanzure | welp that's all | 11:23 |
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| ParahSailin | cfo: "i found some books in the conference room, something to do with server" parah: "books?" cfo: "says western digital enterprise storage" parah: "hard drives?" cfo: "yeah" | 11:31 |
| pasky_ | http://www.oneweirdkerneltrick.com/catbasis.pdf | 11:32 |
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| kanzure | i admire the brevity of section 1 | 11:34 |
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| heath | kanzure: IM please | 12:03 |
| drazak | kanzure: still into nootropics? | 12:05 |
| kanzure | heath: alright | 12:08 |
| kanzure | drazak: what about it | 12:08 |
| drazak | I'm still a pussy but l-theanine is pretty good so far | 12:08 |
| drazak | I should say L-theanine but w/e | 12:08 |
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| kanzure | a survey of remote automotive attack surfaces http://illmatics.com/remote%20attack%20surfaces.pdf | 13:11 |
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| nmz787_i | chris_99: at the conference I heard someone mention gate profiling (how someone's walking style looks) | 13:29 |
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| nmz787_i | apparently it is a pretty good metric | 13:29 |
| chris_99 | i think that's actually gait iirc | 13:29 |
| chris_99 | yeah i've heard of that before it sounds interesting | 13:29 |
| kanzure | jokes on them, i have a third leg | 13:30 |
| chris_99 | lol | 13:30 |
| nmz787_i | ah, yeah prob | 13:30 |
| nmz787_i | kanzure: that would certainly be unique! | 13:30 |
| chris_99 | do the defcon talks get put up quickly? | 13:31 |
| nmz787_i | i've got no idea | 13:34 |
| nmz787_i | they gave us 3 week old slides on CD-ROM | 13:34 |
| nmz787_i | I presume the slides will also be up somewhere later | 13:34 |
| chris_99 | aha cool | 13:36 |
| nmz787_i | there was a talk on weaponizing your pet | 13:39 |
| nmz787_i | aka cat with a wifi sniffer collar | 13:39 |
| chris_99 | heh i heard of that one on the news | 13:40 |
| ParahSailin | chris_99: you are lua fanboi, give me function that does equivalent md5 crypt hash to php | 13:42 |
| ParahSailin | i know i know, but its called interop :\ | 13:43 |
| chris_99 | i don't think i've used md5 sorry in lua, looks like theres a number of libs though | 13:44 |
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| heath | neat: https://github.com/nviennot/tmate | 13:47 |
| heath | terminal sharing | 13:47 |
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| ParahSailin | huh thats cool | 13:48 |
| kanzure | i know that guy | 13:49 |
| kanzure | from back when i was regularly scraping google play and the ios store | 13:50 |
| kanzure | i think he made this giant physical vapor deposition chamber thing | 13:51 |
| kanzure | can't remember why | 13:51 |
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| ParahSailin | i guess ill just have to port this shit http://www.sabren.net/code/python/crypt/md5crypt.py | 13:56 |
| superkuh | Huh. I would've through that low field magnetic brain stimulation would have less beefy electronics. It turns out LFMS still uses >3 kA current. And not just pulsed but continuous and modulated. No way to implement that cheaply. | 13:57 |
| superkuh | s/through/thought/ | 13:58 |
| kanzure | what sort of cost range is it | 13:58 |
| superkuh | I'd estimate >$10k at least. | 13:58 |
| superkuh | It's basically just half an MRI machine. | 13:59 |
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| kanzure | slashdot misunderstanding stenography http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/14/08/12/1812250/type-225-words-per-minute-with-a-stenographic-keyboard-video | 14:47 |
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| chris_99 | nmz787_i, would you possibly be able to give me a copy of that PCI-E USB thingy | 15:21 |
| chris_99 | the slides i mean | 15:22 |
| chris_99 | ohhh it seems it's thunderbolt | 15:27 |
| * chris_99 :( | 15:30 | |
| nmz787_i | chris_99: yep thunderbolt is pci-e | 15:37 |
| nmz787_i | pcmcia is too | 15:37 |
| nmz787_i | I have to go home to do that though | 15:38 |
| chris_99 | which isn't usb tho | 15:38 |
| nmz787_i | ? | 15:38 |
| nmz787_i | I keep saying the crux was a USB to PCIE bridge IC | 15:38 |
| chris_99 | yesterday you said it was a usb dma attack i thought | 15:38 |
| nmz787_i | yes a pci-e attack orchestrated via USB | 15:38 |
| chris_99 | via thunderbolt | 15:38 |
| nmz787_i | using PyUSB or something | 15:38 |
| chris_99 | which isn't usb | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | that was what they used for a demo | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | no, the whole point is pci-e packets crafted via USB | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | thunderbolt was simply the connector they chose | 15:39 |
| chris_99 | i just watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvnvOXXAxaI and they make it sound like it's thunderbolt | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | since all sorts of people have that | 15:39 |
| chris_99 | i'm 99% sure it wouldn't work on usb | 15:39 |
| chris_99 | now | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | ? | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | it is pci-e | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | . | 15:39 |
| nmz787_i | you interface with pci-e using USB | 15:40 |
| chris_99 | it's thunderbolt ---> pci-e | 15:40 |
| nmz787_i | ? | 15:40 |
| nmz787_i | thunderbolt simply has pci-e pins | 15:40 |
| nmz787_i | it is a connector | 15:40 |
| nmz787_i | like I said, you could swap the connector to pcmcia | 15:40 |
| chris_99 | and pci-e gives you DMA access, via thunderbolt as thunderbolt is more or less a PCI-E type protocol apparently | 15:40 |
| chris_99 | that allows DMA | 15:40 |
| nmz787_i | http://pinoutsguide.com/SerialPorts/apple_thunderbolt_pinout.shtml | 15:41 |
| nmz787_i | "Thunderbolt controllers multiplex one or more individual data lanes from connected PCIe and DisplayPort devices for transmission via one duplex Thunderbolt lane, then de-multiplex them for consumption by PCIe and DisplayPort devices on the other end." | 15:41 |
| chris_99 | this guy gave the same kind of talk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FoVmBOdbhg | 15:41 |
| chris_99 | earlier this year | 15:41 |
| nmz787_i | .title | 15:41 |
| yoleaux | SyScan'14 Singapore: Thunderbolts And Lightning Very Very Frightening By Snare And Rzn | 15:41 |
| nmz787_i | well as I keep saying the point was that it was crafted via USB | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | he said it's exactly the same thing | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | the USB is a misnomer | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | here | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | not really | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | that's not what permits the attack | 15:42 |
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| chris_99 | you can't do it via straight USB | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | pci-e permits the attack | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | only thunderbolt | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | no | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | no | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | that is wroing | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | no it's not | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | thunderbolt is what permits the attack | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | you could also use the pci-e to USB card | 15:42 |
| chris_99 | nope | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | i know the dude | 15:42 |
| nmz787_i | :/ | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | he lives 15 mins away | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | I see him every so often, he told me about this months ago | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | he was selling pci-e to USB cards | 15:43 |
| chris_99 | you can't do USB ------------> grab memory from USB | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | I sent the link to the plx website yesterday | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | no | 15:43 |
| chris_99 | you can do DMA attacks with PCI-E | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | it is a pci-e attack | 15:43 |
| nmz787_i | orchestrated via USB | 15:43 |
| chris_99 | sorry maybe you don't get what i mean, i mean it's impossible to do DMA attacks via USB | 15:44 |
| chris_99 | you can do DMA attacks via thunderbolt, PCI-E | 15:44 |
| nmz787_i | you connect a USB cable to your laptop, craft a pci-e packet, send it via USB to the bridge IC, which converts the signals to pci-e protocol and levels | 15:44 |
| nmz787_i | if you want something more prevalent, check out the i2c pins on all video connectors, basically | 15:45 |
| nmz787_i | VGA even has them | 15:45 |
| chris_99 | ok so imagine a laptop that doesn't have thunderbolt whatsoever, you're saying you can do DMA via USB | 15:45 |
| nmz787_i | there was a demo on UEFI bios malware from a non-admin windows 8 machine, which then allows you to listen on i2c video pins for signals | 15:46 |
| nmz787_i | the guy had a GSM to i2c dongle then | 15:46 |
| nmz787_i | no | 15:46 |
| nmz787_i | in that case you would need pcmcia | 15:46 |
| chris_99 | heh | 15:46 |
| chris_99 | so it's not a USB attack | 15:46 |
| nmz787_i | if you didn't have that, then firewire | 15:46 |
| nmz787_i | it not that, then idk | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | no | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | it is VIA USB | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | USB to PCIE | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | that is all | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | you then need PCIE exposed | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | you can trick people who have thunderbolt (lots of people) | 15:47 |
| chris_99 | i thought yesterday you meant you could attack a std. laptop, without thunderbolt or anything else exposed | 15:47 |
| chris_99 | via USB | 15:47 |
| nmz787_i | or if you have other physical acces install a card in the mobo | 15:48 |
| nmz787_i | oh, no, that's why I kept saying PCIE | 15:48 |
| nmz787_i | and mentioned the USB to PCIE bridge | 15:48 |
| chris_99 | yeah i thought the bridge was something you attached via USB | 15:48 |
| chris_99 | external | 15:48 |
| chris_99 | to the machine | 15:48 |
| nmz787_i | they were basically replicating the NSA stuff that was leaked | 15:48 |
| chris_99 | i bought an FPGA PCI-E card to essentially play with that kind of attack | 15:50 |
| nmz787_i | cool | 15:54 |
| nmz787_i | the whole point was that the attack was orchestrated through python | 15:55 |
| nmz787_i | using pyusblib or pylibusb | 15:55 |
| nmz787_i | something like that | 15:55 |
| nmz787_i | rather than needing to learn an FPGA | 15:55 |
| chris_99 | oh cool | 15:55 |
| chris_99 | not heard of that | 15:55 |
| nmz787_i | also laptops commonly have mini-pcie slots under a panel | 15:56 |
| chris_99 | yeah i need to see if mine does | 15:56 |
| nmz787_i | likely | 15:56 |
| chris_99 | http://int3.cc/products/facedancer21 looks quite fun | 15:57 |
| nmz787_i | yeah talked to those guys | 15:59 |
| nmz787_i | guess they've come here to work to talk about it too | 15:59 |
| nmz787_i | there's also the daisho in development | 16:00 |
| chris_99 | what's that | 16:00 |
| nmz787_i | usb3 thingy | 16:00 |
| nmz787_i | usb3 with FPGA | 16:00 |
| nmz787_i | https://github.com/mossmann/daisho | 16:00 |
| nmz787_i | http://ossmann.blogspot.com/2013/05/introducing-daisho.html | 16:01 |
| chris_99 | ah interesting | 16:01 |
| chris_99 | i guess that uses the cypress fx3 or something? | 16:01 |
| nmz787_i | sergey the one facedancer guy was talking about crashing skype when they presented as a microphone | 16:01 |
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| nmz787_i | the daisho is all FPGA code | 16:02 |
| nmz787_i | I think | 16:02 |
| nmz787_i | pretty sure | 16:02 |
| chris_99 | just trying to find a schematic | 16:02 |
| nmz787_i | I remember reading verilog of the USB implementation | 16:02 |
| chris_99 | ah hmm | 16:03 |
| nmz787_i | 'We're especially excited to be producing the world's first open source USB 3.0 device core for implementation of SuperSpeed USB with a transceiver IC and FPGA. (The USB 2.0 functions are already working!)' | 16:03 |
| chris_99 | it could be something called SERDES that converts the USB stuff to a parallel bitstream for the FPGA | 16:04 |
| nmz787_i | board files are here https://github.com/mossmann/daisho/tree/master/hw/main_board | 16:04 |
| chris_99 | although actually i don't think that term applies to USB so i'm probably wrong | 16:04 |
| nmz787_i | nah I think they're just using a PHY chip to convert to ULPI or something | 16:05 |
| nmz787_i | I only want to know about USB though, I don't know too much | 16:05 |
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| chris_99 | you might want one of theses : | 16:06 |
| chris_99 | sorry 1 tick | 16:06 |
| chris_99 | http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181156425615?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT | 16:08 |
| chris_99 | apparently you can shovel data through it at close to usb2 speeds | 16:08 |
| chris_99 | i need to grab one | 16:08 |
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| nmz787_i | http://haxpo.nl/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/D1T1-The-NSA-Playset.pdf | 16:10 |
| nmz787_i | by mossman | 16:11 |
| nmz787_i | ah | 16:11 |
| nmz787_i | yea | 16:11 |
| nmz787_i | i have one of those fx2lps | 16:11 |
| chris_99 | cool | 16:11 |
| nmz787_i | they are cheap Saleae logic clones | 16:11 |
| nmz787_i | or they are sold that way | 16:11 |
| chris_99 | mmm i bought 2x of these http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pcs-lot-Free-shipping-New-Arrival-Saleae-Logic16-saleae16-USB-Logic-Analyzer-100M-16CH-best-quality/667671473.html but that has a xilinx fpga in too | 16:12 |
| chris_99 | just got it working today | 16:12 |
| chris_99 | with Sigrok | 16:12 |
| nmz787_i | ya i've used that with the fx2lp | 16:12 |
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| chris_99 | cool | 16:13 |
| nmz787_i | and this https://github.com/securelyfitz/FitzSPA | 16:13 |
| chris_99 | ooooooh | 16:13 |
| nmz787_i | (he is the guy who did the usb to pcie thing) | 16:13 |
| chris_99 | mm i noticed his nick securelyfitz | 16:13 |
| chris_99 | i want to get into playing with glitching etc | 16:13 |
| nmz787_i | yeah he was saying that the xbox glitchers could be a cheap source of tools | 16:15 |
| nmz787_i | i guess they're basically small FPGAs/CPLDs that do a timing glitch attack | 16:15 |
| nmz787_i | idk too much | 16:15 |
| chris_99 | yeah it'd make sense | 16:15 |
| chris_99 | i loved the demo on the chipsniffer page where he glitches or whatnots an RPi | 16:16 |
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| kanzure | .title http://andybrown.me.uk/wk/2014/06/01/ase/ | 17:33 |
| yoleaux | An FPGA sprite graphics accelerator with a 180MHz STM32F429 controller and 640 x 360 LCD | 17:33 |
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| ParahSailin | ok i just had a good experience with lua | 17:36 |
| kanzure | someone call the feds | 17:38 |
| ParahSailin | i just ended up doing that with ffi using the crypt function from unistd.h and -lcrypt | 17:38 |
| ParahSailin | didnt have to do any derping myself | 17:38 |
| kanzure | libffi + lua does not count as derping? | 17:38 |
| ParahSailin | im not sure libffi is involved | 17:39 |
| kanzure | er then which fi | 17:39 |
| kanzure | ffi | 17:39 |
| ParahSailin | i suppose whatever c binding shit the luajit people crapped out? | 17:40 |
| kanzure | okie dokie | 17:40 |
| ParahSailin | um between this and that unafold crap | 17:40 |
| ParahSailin | im feeling empty inside | 17:41 |
| kanzure | wanna go kill some people? | 17:41 |
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| bbrittain | bahaha: https://twitter.com/kaskoen/status/499184263292792832 | 19:27 |
| bbrittain | sorry. I'm gonna get a reputation for being that bitter person | 19:27 |
| kanzure | that's the stupidest tweet ever | 19:27 |
| bbrittain | someone took time out of their day to make that graph | 19:28 |
| kanzure | hahaha | 19:28 |
| kanzure | did i mention i'm submitting to ycombinator with my cofounder max? https://www.neatoshop.com/images/product/36/1736/Dapper-Dog-Dog-Tie_6796-l.jpg?v=6796 | 19:29 |
| bbrittain | you gonna disrupt shit? | 19:29 |
| bbrittain | WAIT. disrupt the disrupters | 19:30 |
| kanzure | right in the pants | 19:30 |
| kanzure | bbrittain: if you really want to groan, watch everything from andrew hessel on youtube back to back | 19:34 |
| kanzure | also, how goes reading the mailing list archives? | 19:34 |
| bbrittain | I just got back from work. I'm reading a molecular biology textbook instead. :P | 19:35 |
| kanzure | which book | 19:35 |
| bbrittain | Albers | 19:35 |
| bbrittain | Alberts* | 19:35 |
| kanzure | you should consider reading a protocols book next | 19:36 |
| bbrittain | such as? | 19:36 |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bio/books/Molecular%20Cloning%20-%20A%20Laboratory%20Manual%20-%20Sambrook%20-%203rd%20edition.djvu | 19:37 |
| bbrittain | gimme a couple of weeks to get through alberts though :P | 19:38 |
| bbrittain | It's a hefty book | 19:38 |
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| nmz787 | bbrittain: I recommend Molecular Biology of the Gene by Watson (it was an RIT book but I think it is appropriate cause, uh, Watson of Watson and Crick) | 19:49 |
| nmz787 | there's also: lehninger principles of biochemistry | 19:50 |
| bbrittain | alrighty. will read. | 19:51 |
| nmz787 | and biochemistry by voet and voet | 19:51 |
| bbrittain | I have two weeks to myself starting friday. | 19:51 |
| kanzure | also this thing (it's prett bad, but you will be able to speak buzzwords to your jerk colleagues) http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bio/books/Primer%20for%20Synthetic%20Biology.pdf | 19:51 |
| nmz787 | that pretty much covers reference material for basic molbio | 19:51 |
| nmz787 | molbio/biochem | 19:51 |
| bbrittain | damn. what have I gotten myself into | 19:52 |
| kanzure | decades of misery and broken assas | 19:52 |
| kanzure | assays | 19:52 |
| bbrittain | can I go back to codec engineering now? | 19:52 |
| bbrittain | jk | 19:52 |
| nmz787 | hah | 19:52 |
| bbrittain | meh. this can't be much harder than tracing through a FFx stack trace, right?! right?! | 19:53 |
| * bbrittain is delusional | 19:53 | |
| kanzure | nope, ever since x264 we haven't needed anything else | 19:53 |
| bbrittain | 0_o | 19:54 |
| bbrittain | gtfo | 19:54 |
| kanzure | just put it in a 3gp container | 19:54 |
| nmz787 | I actually don't have the Alberts book... The only Albert's I know is Fat Albert (though I know a few Watsons) | 19:55 |
| kanzure | nmz787: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bio/books/ | 19:56 |
| bbrittain | damn. apparently at some point I downloaded Watson's book | 19:57 |
| nmz787 | molbio of the gene isn't there | 19:57 |
| nmz787 | though I think I have it | 19:57 |
| bbrittain | mb-of-the-gene-broken.dat | 19:57 |
| bbrittain | I assume that is it nmz787 | 19:58 |
| nmz787 | u want in your home? | 19:58 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: | 19:58 |
| kanzure | in my home? | 19:58 |
| nmz787 | yes | 19:59 |
| kanzure | no, i am not interested in dead trees | 19:59 |
| nmz787 | ew | 19:59 |
| nmz787 | ok | 20:00 |
| kanzure | bbrittain: also read all of this http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bio/ http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/longevity/ http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/diybio/ | 20:04 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: you can move it from my home now then | 20:05 |
| bbrittain | seriously. all of them? | 20:05 |
| nmz787 | this alberts pdf has pretty nice photos | 20:05 |
| bbrittain | well, some of these seem a bit unecessary. what if, for now, I'm only interested in the cellular level? limited interest in plants and animals. what can I ignore? | 20:06 |
| bbrittain | more important than what to learn right now, I think is what I can ignore... at least temporarily. | 20:07 |
| nmz787 | if you get bored with non-project-based homework then I'd say going by keyword is OK | 20:07 |
| ParahSailin | oh yeah i have lehninger book on my bookshelf | 20:08 |
| nmz787 | you'll inevitably run into concepts in papers on glowing cats that you won't recognize, and have to spider out if you want to continue learning about that | 20:08 |
| nmz787 | yeah | 20:08 |
| ParahSailin | i knew that not selling my college books was a good idea | 20:08 |
| ParahSailin | now i have decoration | 20:08 |
| nmz787 | yup | 20:08 |
| nmz787 | they don't crash either | 20:09 |
| nmz787 | unless you have fire | 20:09 |
| nmz787 | or ink | 20:09 |
| ParahSailin | or earthquake zone | 20:09 |
| nmz787 | welll | 20:09 |
| bbrittain | then they crash | 20:09 |
| nmz787 | I guess it depends what floor of the house they're on in that case | 20:09 |
| nmz787 | really though organic chem is what ties things together | 20:11 |
| nmz787 | err | 20:11 |
| nmz787 | is a big part of the puzzle | 20:11 |
| nmz787 | or is fundamental or something | 20:11 |
| nmz787 | or what sort of solidifies the concepts | 20:12 |
| nmz787 | it's basically 'how chemical reactions happen for one atom and like 1% other atoms' | 20:12 |
| nmz787 | then you know how far you have to go to cover the periodic table | 20:13 |
| bbrittain | I guess I'm gonna have a fun year? | 20:14 |
| bbrittain | wooo | 20:14 |
| bbrittain | my goals for the year include learning this stuff and copious amounts of drinking currently | 20:15 |
| bbrittain | think I'm doing it right | 20:15 |
| kanzure | how about some better goals, like "hijack all the equipment at ginkgo" | 20:15 |
| nmz787 | you could be /our/ mole | 20:15 |
| bbrittain | uhhh | 20:15 |
| bbrittain | they have some nice equipment | 20:16 |
| bbrittain | wait. will you guys pay me more than they will? | 20:16 |
| * bbrittain is considering being your mole | 20:16 | |
| kanzure | only if you accept payment in dogecoin | 20:17 |
| bbrittain | uhhh. no thank you | 20:17 |
| kanzure | not a geneshibe? | 20:18 |
| nmz787 | is that supposed to be something about canines? | 20:18 |
| nmz787 | money for canines? | 20:18 |
| bbrittain | I would prefer for my salary to be from untraceable-to-a-real-person bitcoin wallets please. #agorism | 20:18 |
| bbrittain | and not to be on a payroll | 20:18 |
| kanzure | that can be arranged | 20:19 |
| bbrittain | seriously. someday I'll find a job that lets me do that. It'll be awesome | 20:19 |
| bbrittain | thats right up there in my mind with someday I'll have an excuse to hop a train | 20:20 |
| kanzure | what? | 20:22 |
| bbrittain | someday I'll have a job which won't force me to pay taxes | 20:22 |
| bbrittain | which is nearly as awesome as untraceable semi-illegal transportation | 20:23 |
| bbrittain | now you guys are realizing I'm crazy. finally. I'll be a great culture fit in bio. /s | 20:23 |
| bbrittain | but actually. I interviewed in a t-shirt. almost everyone else was wearing a button down | 20:24 |
| kanzure | that's lame, they have a dress code haha | 20:25 |
| bbrittain | nah, some guy was wearing a jurrasic park tshirt. | 20:25 |
| bbrittain | it's just how they dress | 20:25 |
| bbrittain | different culture | 20:25 |
| yashgaroth | wtf kind of biotech startup wears button downs | 20:26 |
| nmz787 | i like wearing button shirts to work | 20:27 |
| nmz787 | sometimes a sportcoat | 20:27 |
| bbrittain | yashgaroth: one full of academics? | 20:27 |
| kanzure | nope, just jerks | 20:27 |
| yashgaroth | that's even less likely to have button downs tbh | 20:27 |
| nmz787 | i would wear a sportcoat to teach class when I did | 20:27 |
| kanzure | and nmz787 that's only because you work with a bunch of suits dude | 20:27 |
| kanzure | suits wearing suits, doing suitstuff | 20:28 |
| nmz787 | meh | 20:28 |
| bbrittain | whatev. They'll never get me out of a tshirt | 20:28 |
| yashgaroth | I've heard of academics actually not hiring people because they wore a suit to an interview | 20:28 |
| nmz787 | it fits cuz they're tailored | 20:28 |
| nmz787 | why not look good? | 20:29 |
| bbrittain | tailored suits are awesome | 20:29 |
| bbrittain | protip: if you are ever in asia, buy as much tailored stuff as possible | 20:29 |
| bbrittain | it's dirt cheap | 20:29 |
| nmz787 | it offset my huge beard and long hair :P (though I buzzed my beard a few weeks ago) | 20:29 |
| nmz787 | I've got some from bangkok and kolatta | 20:30 |
| nmz787 | kolkata* | 20:30 |
| nmz787 | they actually are probably my best fitting clothes | 20:31 |
| nmz787 | i got a bunch of shirts too | 20:31 |
| nmz787 | I look like a bum when I'm home | 20:31 |
| nmz787 | which is more often than when I go to work | 20:31 |
| nmz787 | 'discovering Streptomycin, is honestly hero material. He's a straight G' | 20:33 |
| kanzure | when he says G he means home doge | 20:33 |
| nmz787 | what it is with the canine-ness | 20:33 |
| nmz787 | is it all based on making fun of gangsta lingo? | 20:33 |
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| kanzure | .wik dogecoin | 20:34 |
| yoleaux | "Dogecoin (/ˈdoʊʒkɔɪn/ DOHZH-koyn, code: DOGE, symbol: Ð and D) is a cryptocurrency featuring a Shiba Inu from the "Doge" Internet meme on its logo. It was introduced on December 8, 2013." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogecoin | 20:34 |
| bbrittain | did you all do biotech degrees? (even if you didn't finish... kanzure) | 20:39 |
| bbrittain | anyone started from kinda scratch? | 20:39 |
| kanzure | mechanical engineering, but it would have been more sane for me to do computational butt science | 20:39 |
| nmz787 | I learned sterile technique in my kitchen at 15 | 20:40 |
| nmz787 | did CS in high school and some college at night then | 20:40 |
| nmz787 | then some internships, then RIT, more internships, etc | 20:41 |
| bbrittain | are there more active people than just the people I've seen talking on here? How many of the people on the DIYbio mailing list actually do something? | 20:44 |
| nmz787 | mega is an active person | 20:45 |
| bbrittain | actually, how many people would you estimate are active in DIYbio... like in any real way. | 20:45 |
| nmz787 | cathal was, not sure if he's got stuff in the works or on backburner | 20:45 |
| nmz787 | with hackerspaces and such around the world | 20:45 |
| nmz787 | well | 20:46 |
| nmz787 | i'm an academic/professional and I 'diybio' | 20:46 |
| bbrittain | well yea, but how many of them actually have active members? there was talk a few days ago about how biocurious only has a paying members | 20:46 |
| bbrittain | also, is there a better name than diybio? it makes me think of kits and classrooms. *shudder* | 20:47 |
| nmz787 | it just is a concatenation of two ideas | 20:47 |
| nmz787 | diy and bio | 20:47 |
| nmz787 | first-generation farming is diybio to me | 20:47 |
| kanzure | farms are businesses | 20:48 |
| nmz787 | magnets in the fingers are to a bunch of ppl, but they tend to call themselves by others names | 20:48 |
| kanzure | bbrittain: there's about 5000 people you can reach through the mailing list (only 3500 subscribers) | 20:48 |
| yashgaroth | "biohacking" was a good term but it's been corrupted by people who do quantified self bullshit | 20:48 |
| kanzure | bbrittain: i would say <30 are doing anything worth talking about | 20:48 |
| nmz787 | so you're saying all the years of reading my farmer did before he bought animals was still a biz? | 20:48 |
| kanzure | reading is diybio? | 20:48 |
| nmz787 | i was thinking 10-100 | 20:49 |
| * bbrittain would like to think so. if so, he is a diybio person | 20:49 | |
| nmz787 | but if there are ppl not talking it could be upwards of maybe 500 | 20:49 |
| nmz787 | imo | 20:49 |
| bbrittain | damn. 5000 is nothing | 20:49 |
| bbrittain | nmz787: "my farmer"? | 20:50 |
| kanzure | his ohmedoge | 20:50 |
| kanzure | *homedoge | 20:50 |
| nmz787 | .wik doge meme | 20:51 |
| yoleaux | "Doge (often pronounced /ˈdoʊdʒ/ DOHJ or /ˈdoʊɡ/ DOHG) is an Internet meme that became popular in 2013. The meme typically consists of a picture of a Shiba Inu dog accompanied by sarcastic multicolored text in Comic Sans MS font in the foreground." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doge_meme | 20:51 |
| nmz787 | :( | 20:51 |
| bbrittain | nmz787: elaborate on your "homedoge" | 20:52 |
| nmz787 | i found a farmer on the internet and befriended him | 20:52 |
| nmz787 | he uses old-school biotech to produce food | 20:53 |
| kanzure | he means he stalked him | 20:53 |
| nmz787 | like some throwback shit | 20:53 |
| bbrittain | interesting | 20:53 |
| bbrittain | more info anywhere? | 20:53 |
| nmz787 | hah, there is a doge meme with snoop dogg's face morphed in | 20:54 |
| nmz787 | http://www.realmilk.com/real-milk-finder/ | 20:54 |
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| nmz787 | http://www.eatwild.com/ | 20:54 |
| bbrittain | I like raw milk | 20:54 |
| nmz787 | specifically i have been eating mostly grass-fed beef/milk for the past few years | 20:55 |
| nmz787 | the current cows have forest access though too | 20:55 |
| bbrittain | paleo? | 20:55 |
| nmz787 | not really | 20:55 |
| nmz787 | i notice bread and grains once I abstained for a few months pretty consistently | 20:56 |
| nmz787 | (more than before that I abstained once) | 20:56 |
| nmz787 | ugh | 20:56 |
| nmz787 | i hope you understand that | 20:56 |
| nmz787 | but yeah makes sense to have forest access and variety of plants | 20:57 |
| nmz787 | esp with the worm data on smell neurons and expression shifts | 20:57 |
| nmz787 | immediately threw me back to when I got sick as a kid and all the heinz ketchup would smell like underarms | 20:57 |
| nmz787 | (i pretty much only eat heinz ketchup, that is secret #2) | 20:58 |
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| nmz787 | kanzure: what is this Las Vegas entry? http://diyhpl.us/wiki/diybio/groups/#index51h2 | 21:00 |
| nmz787 | I talked to a guy from a hackerspace in LV and he said he didn't know of anyone really doing much sciency stuff | 21:00 |
| nmz787 | and that the hackerspace mostly was where people came to use tools then take their stuff home | 21:01 |
| nmz787 | not as much community | 21:01 |
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| bbrittain | hmm. sometimes I think farming would be interesting. than I actually think about it | 21:03 |
| nmz787 | differnt strokes for diffrent folks | 21:04 |
| bbrittain | like... it takes a lot of physical effort | 21:05 |
| nmz787 | it's funny and cool that my farmer buddy used to program on a commodore 64 when he was a kid | 21:05 |
| nmz787 | he's keepin it real | 21:05 |
| bbrittain | can I have a farm with a fleet of drones? | 21:05 |
| bbrittain | and GMO plants... but tasty. | 21:05 |
| nmz787 | i just went to a talk on that last week | 21:05 |
| nmz787 | ag is the biggest projected utilizer of drones | 21:06 |
| bbrittain | and like a co-op house with a bio lab? this isn't sounding so bad | 21:06 |
| bbrittain | too bad there is no money in it | 21:06 |
| bbrittain | most farmers operate in the red | 21:06 |
| nmz787 | he'd probably build a room for a microscope | 21:06 |
| bbrittain | with the exception of government grants | 21:07 |
| bbrittain | which bothers me | 21:07 |
| nmz787 | that's for corn and feedlot ranchers mostly I think | 21:07 |
| nmz787 | corn and soy maybe | 21:07 |
| bbrittain | nah, a lot of local farmers too. | 21:07 |
| bbrittain | http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/10/opinion/sunday/dont-let-your-children-grow-up-to-be-farmers.html?_r=0 | 21:07 |
| bbrittain | too many workers imho. - replace them with robots | 21:08 |
| bbrittain | that sounds like an excellent idea | 21:08 |
| bbrittain | :P | 21:08 |
| nmz787 | idk this is one dude | 21:15 |
| nmz787 | with like occasional help from his wife and friends | 21:16 |
| nmz787 | fuck going to the gym when I can just go unload a trailer of hay and stack it in a barn | 21:16 |
| dingo | i once had a guy come to repair my heater, and he saw my C64 and bugged out, he was a C64 coder as a teen | 21:16 |
| dingo | now he does plumbing and heating, hehe | 21:17 |
| nmz787 | oh well he doesn't do vegetables | 21:19 |
| nmz787 | not now at least | 21:19 |
| nmz787 | mainly just animals | 21:19 |
| bbrittain | I think ranching has different profit margins | 21:20 |
| bbrittain | which is good for him | 21:20 |
| nmz787 | the cow is sort of in the middle ground between bio and robots | 21:20 |
| bbrittain | I think farming would be a farm better place if there were no subsidies on it actually | 21:20 |
| catern | bbrittain: man, that article is such bullshit | 21:20 |
| catern | "price stabilization" | 21:21 |
| catern | fuck you farmers | 21:21 |
| bbrittain | catern: yes, it is full of it | 21:21 |
| nmz787 | and he's got landrace varieties feeding that | 21:21 |
| bbrittain | but it had a couple of interesting tidbits in it | 21:21 |
| catern | >"Others of us rely almost entirely on Department of Agriculture or foundation grants, not retail sales, to generate farm income." | 21:21 |
| nmz787 | in that he hasn't actively seeded grass | 21:21 |
| catern | thanks for being so forthright about the fact that your job shouldn't exist anymore | 21:21 |
| bbrittain | ahh well I think that is unfair. the ony reason big ag destroys little companies so readily is because of their heavy subsidies as well | 21:22 |
| bbrittain | it's a subsidy battle | 21:22 |
| * bbrittain thinks there should be none | 21:22 | |
| dingo | food is mainly about shelf-life now and price efficiency of shipping -- high in sugars and wheat is mostly what a grocery store carries now, they have optimum shelf-life | 21:22 |
| bbrittain | yea... I'll take my meat & veggies please. | 21:23 |
| nmz787 | that isn't necessarily the best for health though | 21:23 |
| nmz787 | re dingo | 21:23 |
| dingo | of course not, but its best for profits for the sellers | 21:23 |
| dingo | what do they care about your health | 21:24 |
| bbrittain | not if people stop eating it though | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | sure | 21:24 |
| bbrittain | well, people just need to be smarter? | 21:24 |
| dingo | hehe | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | pretty much | 21:24 |
| bbrittain | thats pretty much what all of my solutions come down to... aka not a solution | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | makes sense that it will take a while | 21:24 |
| nmz787 | everyone doesn't come in here to hear this | 21:25 |
| nmz787 | :P | 21:25 |
| bbrittain | are you advocating preaching? :D | 21:25 |
| nmz787 | time is evolution's solution... | 21:25 |
| nmz787 | idk why that wouldn't still apply | 21:25 |
| dingo | soylent green is people!! | 21:25 |
| dingo | time is the great decider | 21:25 |
| kanzure | it's *other* people | 21:25 |
| nmz787 | pressure and selection of the bulk | 21:26 |
| bbrittain | well in this case it is. I don't eat corn, soy, or wheat. | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | if it's bad for health well, either smart prevails or we end up with the movie idiocracy | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | nuff said | 21:26 |
| dingo | i like the evolutionary theory that mankind will split into two geneticly distinct forms -- a tall, attractive, intelligence class, and a gnome-like ugly lower-class | 21:26 |
| nmz787 | you're a speciesist? | 21:27 |
| dingo | it supports the theory that i'll breed with a tall attractive woman :) | 21:27 |
| kanzure | no he's just a nethack player | 21:27 |
| kanzure | it warps your brain | 21:27 |
| nmz787 | dingo: lol | 21:27 |
| nmz787 | i meant bbrittain you're a speciesist? | 21:27 |
| bbrittain | nmz787: wait. why? | 21:28 |
| dingo | nethack is a lot like life -- its really hard and then you die | 21:28 |
| bbrittain | nmz787: what did I say? | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | < bbrittain> well in this case it is. I don't eat corn, soy, or wheat. | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | or do you actively get sick? | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | affected | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | / affected | 21:29 |
| dingo | i developed an allergy to wheat and soy (gluten). sometimes i wonder if my body has a higher IQ than my mind | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | yes | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | not the corn | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | thats just me being crazy | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | and not supporting big ag | 21:29 |
| nmz787 | do you like lawns more than corn? | 21:29 |
| dingo | my own theory is the introduction of dwarf wheat, which has ~3x more chromosomes was introduced, and being a typical american boy, i was over-exposed and developed an allergy | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | I like pavement | 21:29 |
| nmz787 | corn is just the muscle car of lawns. | 21:29 |
| bbrittain | hahaha | 21:30 |
| bbrittain | but nmz787, I am still confused about the speciesist comment. | 21:32 |
| bbrittain | .dict speciesist | 21:32 |
| dingo | irc specialist | 21:32 |
| bbrittain | oh. | 21:32 |
| dingo | i wrote my own irc client | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | it's like racism except across species | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | but if you are allergic then it doesn't apply I guess | 21:32 |
| nmz787 | it was a joke | 21:33 |
| nmz787 | or sarcasm | 21:33 |
| bbrittain | oh. my bad. I've been trying to figure out why that was bad :P | 21:33 |
| nmz787 | I mainly just tend not to eat things | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | it makes sense that we're still young re: industrialization as a speices | 21:35 |
| nmz787 | species | 21:35 |
| bbrittain | so... who hear is making it so I can photosynthesize instead? | 21:36 |
| bbrittain | :P | 21:36 |
| nmz787 | idk i still don't know how the pyramids were built... so i'm convinced knowing how to survive an apocalypse is prudent | 21:36 |
| nmz787 | so thus farming and diy (which really just means being interested and active in learning) | 21:37 |
| bbrittain | nmz787: lemme help you with that: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/03/080328104302.htm | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | (and practicing those knowledge in some way) | 21:37 |
| nmz787 | bbrittain: but there are tons of theories | 21:38 |
| bbrittain | riiighhtt | 21:38 |
| nmz787 | ctrl-f ing for 'proof' doesn't match | 21:38 |
| bbrittain | "Scholars have found evidence that copper chisels were using for quarrying sandstone and limestone" | 21:39 |
| dingo | so the aliense used chisels! | 21:39 |
| nmz787 | the last thing i watched said it could have been an geomagnetic laser-type-thing | 21:40 |
| nmz787 | re the purpose | 21:40 |
| nmz787 | of the pyramids | 21:40 |
| nmz787 | :P | 21:40 |
| bbrittain | dammit. I'm gonna build something _REALLY_ weird for future generations just to fuck with them. like an evil version of long now. | 21:41 |
| bbrittain | best part? hopefully I'll be around to see them being confused about it. | 21:41 |
| nmz787 | bbrittain: the oiling of the road sounds cool | 21:41 |
| nmz787 | "I usually show the skeptic a picture of 20 of my workers at an archaeological dig site pulling up a two-and-a-half ton granite block." He added, "I know it's possible because I was on the ropes too." | 21:43 |
| nmz787 | but googling largest pyramid block weight gives: | 21:43 |
| nmz787 | The Tura limestone used for the casing was quarried across the river. The largest granite stones in the pyramid, found in the "King's" chamber, weigh 25 to 80 tonnes and were transported from Aswan, more than 800 km (500 mi) away. | 21:43 |
| bbrittain | pharoah to his people: "We need moar slaves" | 21:43 |
| kanzure | evil long now would just be the anti internet archive, deleting everything | 21:46 |
| kanzure | or a dischordia religion branch about misdating all of your content | 21:46 |
| kanzure | https://encyclopediadramatica.es/Discordianism | 21:47 |
| kanzure | "II - All Discordians have to use the Discordian numbering system. Note that there is absolutely no explanation or tutorial given as to what this numbering system is, thereby making it impossible to obey this commandment." | 21:48 |
| nmz787 | idk about impossible | 21:49 |
| kanzure | "Robert Anton Wilson, also known as 'People who actually think this might be true, but don't shout about it'. This makes them the most dangerous breed of all. RAW is regarded to be the king of the discordians, despite having a head size approximating Jupiter. RAW is what all true Discordians aspire to one day reincarnate their sorry asses backward through time into. The last sentence, most likely written by a discordian, is all the evidence ... | 21:49 |
| nmz787 | hackers be hackin | 21:50 |
| kanzure | ... you need of the utter gob-smacking fucktardedness of this particular group. " | 21:50 |
| kanzure | i like how robert anton wilson redirects to https://encyclopediadramatica.es/Shit_Nobody_Cares_About | 21:50 |
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| delinquentme | has animez. watching for inspiration | 22:54 |
| delinquentme | http://www.dubzonline.co/from-the-new-world-episode-1-english-dub/ | 22:54 |
| delinquentme | FOLLOH ALONG | 22:54 |
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| --- Log closed Wed Aug 13 00:00:33 2014 | ||
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