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| kanzure | seanph: fix your connection? | 05:05 |
|---|---|---|
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| kanzure | "Skip-thought vectors" http://arxiv.org/abs/1506.06726 | 06:31 |
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| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone. | 06:41 |
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| poppingtonic | hello | 06:45 |
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| seanph | hello | 06:50 |
| kanzure | what's up? | 06:51 |
| JayDugger | My wife's interest in Bitcoin, although that will probably pass today. | 06:52 |
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| JayDugger | I am very impressed by the recent discussion about xenotransplantation and kosher. | 06:52 |
| JayDugger | Has anyone considered whether bio-compatible pigs will taste more like people? | 06:53 |
| kanzure | yeah i dunno if anyone breeds their livestock for meat tastefulness | 06:54 |
| kuudes | I have understood that people would taste more like pigs than cattle, but have not tested that... | 06:55 |
| JayDugger | Uhh...most beef ranchers at a guess, though I doubt they do anything like biopsies followed by cooking. | 06:55 |
| kanzure | well to breed for taste you have to keep samples for future insemination before butchering | 06:56 |
| kanzure | and i'm not sure if anyone does that | 06:56 |
| JayDugger | I don't know either, though I'd be really surprised if that didn't happen. | 07:00 |
| JayDugger | .wik https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meat#Human_intervention | 07:01 |
| yoleaux | "Meat is animal flesh that is eaten as food.:1 Humans are omnivorous, and have hunted and killed animals for meat since prehistoric times. The advent of civilization allowed the domestication of animals such as chickens, sheep, pigs and cattle, and eventually their use in meat production on an industrial scale." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meat | 07:01 |
| JayDugger | Not the quote I expected. | 07:01 |
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| JayDugger | "Artificial insemination is now routinely used to produce animals of the best possible genetic quality, and the efficiency of this method is improved through the administration of hormones that synchronize the ovulation cycles within groups of females.[3]:33" | 07:01 |
| kanzure | yeah but that's usually for meat production growth rate reasons, or stock germline trading between ranchers | 07:03 |
| JayDugger | I find it hard to imagine that pigs (PERVs?) would ever get slaughtered and butchered. | 07:03 |
| JayDugger | I expect you're right. I don't know whether taste is directly used as a criterion, or whether body fat % or another biomarker serves as a proxy for flavorfulness. | 07:04 |
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| kanzure | "american chemical society partners with figshare" ok i guess. | 07:45 |
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| kanzure | "I am patient zero for exogenous GDF11 supplementation. Note that I am a software developer, not a molecular biologist nor an MD. Needless to say, I have always been a believer in the programmatic theory of aging. Attached is my GDF11 study as well as some backup data. I look forward to your thoughts and feedback." - Steve Perry <steveperry@nyc.rr.com> | 09:36 |
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| kanzure | "Q Fever Outbreak Among Travelers to Germany Who Received Live Cell Therapy" http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6438a3.htm?s_cid=mm6438a3_w | 09:38 |
| kanzure | "Live cell therapy is the practice of injecting processed cells from organs or fetuses of nonhuman animals (e.g., sheep) into human recipients (1). It is advertised to treat a variety of health conditions. This practice is unavailable in the United States; however, persons can travel to foreign locations to receive injections." | 09:38 |
| kanzure | "The five New York patients had traveled in a group of 10–15 persons to the state of Rhineland-Palatinate in Germany to receive intramuscular injections of fetal sheep cells from a German physician on May 30, 2014." | 09:39 |
| kanzure | "Second WHO Global Consultation on Regulatory Requirements for Xenotransplantation Clinical Trials" http://www.who.int/transplantation/xeno/report2nd_global_consultation_xtx.pdf?ua=1 | 09:40 |
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| maaku | kanzure: you don't have to do artificial insemination to breed for taste | 09:56 |
| maaku | just favor descendents of the tastiest cow | 09:56 |
| kanzure | well, presumably you don't want to breed things that are going to taste poorly | 09:56 |
| kanzure | your favoring method would work but would have more untastey results, i think. | 09:57 |
| kanzure | or er, would have more untastey intermediates | 09:57 |
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| kanzure | pg startup essays but in a book instead http://playbook.samaltman.com/ | 10:06 |
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| justanotheruser | and not by pg? | 10:36 |
| kanzure | sam and pg ideas are probably indistinguishable at this point | 10:36 |
| justanotheruser | Good read so far | 10:37 |
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| kanzure | wikipedia should have a deletionpedia purgatory where all deletes are forwarded. all reversions too. merge conflicts can be kept side-by-side and show tree history stuff awaiting human intervention for re-merging. | 11:49 |
| kanzure | this is similar to current bitcoin-dev moderation policy where moderated messages are autoforwarded to rusty russell's bitcoin-dev-moderated mailing list for public display | 11:50 |
| fenn | link to steve perry gdf11 paper? | 11:54 |
| kanzure | was stupid email attachment | 11:55 |
| kanzure | state level of priority of request | 11:55 |
| fenn | also "patient zero" is a weird thing to say | 11:55 |
| kanzure | glory seeking, probably | 11:56 |
| fenn | please redistribute on diyhpl.us at your convenience | 11:56 |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/longevity/gdf11-steve-perry/ | 11:59 |
| fenn | wow it's been 1.5 years since the young blood thing? | 12:00 |
| fenn | 403 | 12:01 |
| kanzure | try now | 12:02 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/wikimedia/mediawiki/blob/master/includes/WebStart.php | 12:02 |
| kanzure | mediawiki source code quality may be reason for lack of alternative wikipedia experiments, but source code doesn't look as bad as i recall | 12:02 |
| fenn | pretty sure there are a zillion "alternative wikipedia" projects | 12:03 |
| kanzure | but none with interesting variations on the "rules" or whatever | 12:03 |
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| fenn | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deletionpedia | 12:04 |
| kanzure | fuck | 12:04 |
| kanzure | well they get points for naming it correctly so that others can come up with the same name without actually looking | 12:04 |
| fenn | related projects: Pluspedia.org, a German project to create a wiki without relevance criteria | 12:05 |
| kanzure | wikipedia itself should experiment with probabilistic delete button | 12:05 |
| kanzure | i want a scholarpedia (yes i know scholarpedia exists, sigh) that has laser focus on thorough popplerian content like making null hypotheses that don't completely suck and putting them everywhere | 12:07 |
| kanzure | but this is unrelated to my "where are the mediawiki experiments" question | 12:07 |
| kanzure | (different content is the primary variation that most wikis have) | 12:08 |
| fenn | http://fennetic.net/irc/Results%20of%20my%201.5%20years%20of%20injecting%20exogenous%20GDF11.txt less annoying format | 12:09 |
| fenn | "I believe I am the first human to inject GDF11. It was definitely a risky proposition, but so is letting aging take its course." | 12:20 |
| fenn | i wonder if this would pass "ethical review" | 12:21 |
| kanzure | you should judge only against your own ethics- if there were forms of warranted caution that he skipped out on, then did he properly disclose these and provide at least some reason why? etc. | 12:22 |
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| fenn | it's more that i was whining about the fact that this is being done by some guy in his basement rather than being pursued with gusto by a large research organization | 12:28 |
| kanzure | strategy is not something that most research organizations focus on | 12:29 |
| kanzure | convincing people to drop their pet projects for another project is also pretty hard | 12:29 |
| fenn | obviously aging is fatal but for some reason this is ignored when considering the risks of medical treatments | 12:29 |
| kanzure | especially when they have fought for bloody grant money their whole life just to finally get a chance at their own pet project | 12:30 |
| kanzure | blood stained with the tears of all the grad student dreams that you.. hm... well, i'm sure someone will flesh this out for me. | 12:31 |
| fenn | well whatever, it's N=1 and no control group and no double-blind etc etc and these things would be done better as a matter of course if the medical establishment didn't have its head up its ass | 12:31 |
| fenn | i sort of wish he included before/after photos while we're being unscientific | 12:33 |
| kanzure | disappointed with lack of speculation and theorizing in science in general. amount of speculation in hplusroadmap is way higher than average speculative density of most research papers, which is very strange to me. you have to iterate through a whole bunch of models to find stuff that doesn't fit the data, and which things might. and i don't see this happening often in papers. | 12:33 |
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| fenn | the good news is that the effects of GDF11 appear quickly so we don't have to wait around for people to get older and die | 12:38 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | fenn : have human trials done shit? | 12:40 |
| fenn | i haven't seen any human trials yet (except this one) | 12:40 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | fenn : stanford is running an alzheimers one | 12:41 |
| fenn | "patients with Alzheimer's disease will be given blood from younger people" not the same | 12:41 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | could have sworn it was gdf11 specific | 12:42 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | my b | 12:42 |
| fenn | "In October of 2014, the research team will conduct 30 blood plasma transfusions to older adults who have mild to moderate Alzheimer’s disease." | 12:42 |
| fenn | they're both good studies to do; there were something like a dozen different blood proteins that could contribute to the anti-aging effect, but we also don't know much about the effect of whole-blood transfusion on aging | 12:43 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | Reading this I'm curious at what age it's worth dosing gdf11 | 12:44 |
| fenn | i'd like to test it on young people too | 12:45 |
| fenn | it's not the "reverse aging protein" it does something physical | 12:45 |
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| kanzure | jrayhawk: git-bigstore yes/no? | 12:49 |
| kanzure | oh seems to just be s3 backend. so probably no. | 12:50 |
| kanzure | "When I was in Ukraine, I saw numerous heterochronic parabiosis experiments (some of them are published in Rejuvenation research journal where Aubreys is editor) and non of them had any longterm rejuvenation effects, although in some cases there were some shorterm effects" | 13:07 |
| drethelin | hey guys guess what you can now go to www.fugenehd.com | 13:08 |
| drethelin | and read all about how cool it is | 13:09 |
| drethelin | and look at lots of pictures | 13:09 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | oh god you have two logos | 13:13 |
| Aurelius_Work2 | drethelin : did you do the css? | 13:13 |
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| drethelin | aurelius: the logos thing is my dad's fault | 13:41 |
| drethelin | and not I | 13:41 |
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| kanzure | "Yeah I just pulled up the microbial nootropics log before I called you... My kind of thing" | 14:03 |
| kanzure | finally my spammy ways of leaving my phone number all around the web have paid off | 14:03 |
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| kanzure | i thought source code wasn't public for this extension? https://github.com/piroor/treestyletab | 15:27 |
| kanzure | and some strange fork of the same https://github.com/windsurfer/treestyletab | 15:30 |
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| CCortex | Hi everybody | 19:48 |
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| kanzure | CCortex_: hi | 20:28 |
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| CCortex_ | still here kanzure ? | 21:11 |
| CCortex_ | or anybody else ? | 21:13 |
| CCortex_ | I guess it's not the right time.. | 21:13 |
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| CCortex_ | Hi nmz787 and abram | 21:17 |
| abram | hi CCortex_ | 21:17 |
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| CCortex_ | I just found this irc channel while digging on nootropics | 21:19 |
| CCortex_ | but I don't see a lot of activity | 21:19 |
| CCortex_ | where are you based guys ? | 21:20 |
| nmz787_i | internet | 21:21 |
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| nmz787_i | some ppl are upstream, some are downstream... but we're all from the ether | 21:21 |
| nmz787_i | there's more activity here than IRL for me, usually, or at least comparable | 21:22 |
| CCortex_ | hmm ok | 21:22 |
| CCortex_ | I'll just wait | 21:23 |
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| nmz787_i | you can read the logs | 21:29 |
| nmz787_i | there are years of them | 21:29 |
| nmz787_i | and the wiki | 21:29 |
| CCortex_ | I saw them | 21:30 |
| CCortex_ | I'm here because I want to make a team | 21:30 |
| CCortex_ | I'm looking at places where I can find people interested in nootropics | 21:31 |
| nmz787_i | about? | 21:31 |
| nmz787_i | team about? | 21:31 |
| CCortex_ | some projects I have about these substances | 21:31 |
| nmz787_i | it would be easier for us to tell you where you are, so others nearby can speak up | 21:31 |
| nmz787_i | if you want IRL meeting | 21:31 |
| nmz787_i | otherwise this is the right place to discuss that stuff | 21:32 |
| CCortex_ | what is this ? IRL | 21:32 |
| nmz787_i | in real life | 21:32 |
| CCortex_ | haha sorry... | 21:32 |
| CCortex_ | no need for irl | 21:32 |
| CCortex_ | through internet is fine | 21:32 |
| CCortex_ | as long as people are motivated | 21:32 |
| nmz787_i | then fire away | 21:33 |
| CCortex_ | there is plenty of good ways for working like this | 21:33 |
| nmz787_i | people idle will speak up, or reply when they awake from sleeping | 21:33 |
| nmz787_i | (we haven't figured out getting rid of sleep yet) | 21:34 |
| CCortex_ | haha | 21:34 |
| CCortex_ | it's part of the nature | 21:34 |
| CCortex_ | anyway | 21:34 |
| CCortex_ | I'm using plants for cures since I can remember | 21:35 |
| CCortex_ | but my favorite topic is nootropic | 21:35 |
| nmz787_i | plants are pretty good | 21:36 |
| CCortex_ | some years ago it was kind of unknown and now people are becoming crazy about it | 21:36 |
| CCortex_ | so I'm working on some way to deliver the knowledge | 21:36 |
| nmz787_i | people were reading and discussing this earlier http://fennetic.net/irc/Results%20of%20my%201.5%20years%20of%20injecting%20exogenous%20GDF11.txt | 21:36 |
| nmz787_i | GDF11 is more of a 'biologic' than a 'nootropic'... but that's just semantics really | 21:37 |
| CCortex_ | and the products | 21:37 |
| CCortex_ | I went throught every retailler I could find but I'm not very happy about it | 21:38 |
| CCortex_ | I tested sooo many things | 21:38 |
| CCortex_ | my body and my spirit are part of my lab | 21:38 |
| CCortex_ | and what I see is that this new wave is kind of following the pharma mindset | 21:39 |
| CCortex_ | What I found is that the ancient type of taking things is much more efficient and pleasant | 21:39 |
| CCortex_ | but it's more time consuming | 21:40 |
| CCortex_ | so for the people sharing the same philosophy as me | 21:40 |
| CCortex_ | or wants to participate here is the thing | 21:40 |
| CCortex_ | an appli listing all of these plants | 21:41 |
| nmz787_i | well you need both, they're sort of a test.... somethings don't function when they are pure, they need paired with some buddy molecules | 21:41 |
| nmz787_i | etc | 21:41 |
| nmz787_i | (i.e. why complex extracts may be more effective) | 21:41 |
| CCortex_ | by appli I mean : website and app for phones | 21:41 |
| CCortex_ | exactly | 21:41 |
| nmz787_i | isn't that what herbalpedia is? | 21:41 |
| CCortex_ | let me check it | 21:42 |
| nmz787_i | you may be interested in this also: http://diyhpl.us/wiki/genetic-modifications/ | 21:42 |
| nmz787_i | basically if you know what's going on, you can just work on hard-coding it into the genome | 21:42 |
| nmz787_i | /me give a man a nootropic, and he'll buzz for a day -- teach his old genome new tricks, and he'll buzz on for his whole life | 21:43 |
| nmz787_i | (or hers, or theirs) | 21:43 |
| CCortex_ | so why not simply play on the epigenetic side for the change of the genome ? | 21:44 |
| nmz787_i | can't do everything that way | 21:44 |
| CCortex_ | not everything but a LOT | 21:45 |
| CCortex_ | I checked herbalpedia | 21:45 |
| CCortex_ | but that's not how I see it | 21:45 |
| nmz787_i | can't epigenetics yourself out of cystic fibrosis | 21:45 |
| CCortex_ | it can ! but it requires a lot... | 21:47 |
| CCortex_ | I know I might sound a little crazy | 21:47 |
| CCortex_ | but I just love to dig into topics I really love | 21:47 |
| CCortex_ | there is a lot | 21:48 |
| nmz787_i | yep, if you love learning, your life plan is pretty much set in today's world | 21:48 |
| CCortex_ | then I can begin to comprehend many things beyond what I could except | 21:48 |
| CCortex_ | so to get back to what I was talking | 21:49 |
| CCortex_ | the philosophy about nootropic | 21:49 |
| CCortex_ | being a better version of ourself | 21:49 |
| CCortex_ | is a multi disciplinar thing | 21:50 |
| nmz787_i | yup | 21:50 |
| nmz787_i | the challenge is organizing and managing experts, because none of them know how to talk to anyone else | 21:51 |
| CCortex_ | the idea is to compile all of this knowledge efficiently | 21:51 |
| CCortex_ | that's what I want to do | 21:51 |
| CCortex_ | and taking care of the IT side of the project | 21:51 |
| CCortex_ | but it requires a lot of fields I'm not into | 21:52 |
| CCortex_ | so it's always better if we are a group | 21:52 |
| CCortex_ | Am I at the right place for this ? | 21:54 |
| nmz787_i | well there are certainly a lot of IT and software and scientists and engineers here | 21:55 |
| CCortex_ | the only important thing for me is to find people passionate about this | 21:57 |
| CCortex_ | the rest is only bonus | 21:57 |
| nmz787_i | I work on finding ways to make micro and nanofluidics with the goal of build a next-gen DNA synthesizer | 21:57 |
| nmz787_i | I also study analog electronics, and write software | 21:57 |
| nmz787_i | my background is in biotechnology and programming | 21:58 |
| CCortex_ | cool | 21:58 |
| CCortex_ | where do you live ? | 21:58 |
| nmz787_i | oregon | 21:59 |
| CCortex_ | france for me | 21:59 |
| nmz787_i | ah | 21:59 |
| nmz787_i | have you been to the biohackerspace there? | 21:59 |
| nmz787_i | la pallaise? (spelling?) | 21:59 |
| CCortex_ | hahaha you know it ! | 21:59 |
| nmz787_i | http://lapaillasse.org/ | 21:59 |
| CCortex_ | almost yeah | 21:59 |
| nmz787_i | yes, we have it noted here, amongst other places: http://diyhpl.us/wiki/diybio/groups/#index27h2 | 22:00 |
| CCortex_ | I've heard of them | 22:01 |
| CCortex_ | but didn't go to them yet | 22:01 |
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