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05:44 < pinheadmz> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/19953 merged! WE DID IT REVIEW CLUB
05:44 < emzy> \o/     
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06:00 < michaelfolkson> Everything I looked at over a long period of time was an ACK. But there could still easily be something I missed or didn't understand. I guess that is where we are leaning on the long term reviewers
06:01 < michaelfolkson> It would never get merged if waited until all of us were 100 percent sure
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06:04 < michaelfolkson> If you had to put percent on it based on your personal review (not all the long term reviewers ACKs) that there were no problems with it what percent would you give?
06:04 < emzy> Using tabroot is optional, so it will anyway take time until widely used. So still time to fix stuff on the way. Sure best to don't have to.
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06:06 < michaelfolkson> It is optional until activation. But I guess this feeds into the activation discussion. How sure do we personally want to be before it is activated?
06:07 < michaelfolkson> It is probably ok if someone like me is 80 percent sure and long term reviewers are 95-99 percent sure
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06:21 < emzy> I think there is no absulut 100% anyway.
06:21 < michaelfolkson> Of course not. That's why I said 95-99 percent even for long term reviewers
06:23 < emzy> right
06:23 < jonatack> zero bugs? close to zero chance :D
06:24 < jonatack> but the next 6 weeks are a good time to find and fix them
06:25 < michaelfolkson> Right. Even though merged needs attention as much as ever
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06:41 < jonatack> once merged, it's much easier to continue testing it every day and some issues become more clear/more quickly
06:43 < jonatack> (a nice upside as long as the issues aren't critical)
06:45 < emzy> Is it activated on testnet or signet?
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06:54 < jonatack> emzy: i was offline and missed some of the discussion, but with "once merged..." i meant in general
06:59 < michaelfolkson> emzy: Testnet no. I'm not sure on latest status of Taproot on Signet
06:59 < kallewoof> emzy: if it was activated on signet, and we realized it was broken, we would brush the activation under the carpet and re-activate a fixed version. that's the power of a centralized test net.
07:00 < jonatack> kallewoof: starting the 11413 follow-ups tomorrow. will ping
07:01 < emzy> Right, so kallewoof just activate it :)
07:01 < pinheadmz> emzy well i think part of the test is testing the activation
07:02 < pinheadmz> so i think we need to wait until activation logic is decided, maybe even merged (?) but with earlier activation params for test/signet
07:02 < kallewoof> yeah, i was initially thinking of activating it in a couple of days, but maybe we do want to test the activation part as well
07:02 < emzy> pinheadmz: But maybe more fitting for that is the testnet.
07:02 < pinheadmz> kallewoof youd have to activate it on a fork?
07:02 < emzy> just do both :)
07:02 < pinheadmz> bypass the inevitable bikeshedding over bip8 params
07:03 < pinheadmz> (fork, code fork not blockchain fork)
07:03 < kallewoof> anyone can take bitcoin master, modify like 3 lines of code, and start up a taproot enabled signet today.
07:03 < pinheadmz> add a deployment
07:03 < michaelfolkson> How much of a pain is it to reset Signet? You mean start from genesis again by reset kallewoof?
07:03 < kallewoof> and what's interesting is that, with the current code base, everyone would happily relay taproot transactions
07:04 < pinheadmz> yeah bc we dont discourage witness versions any more
07:04 < pinheadmz> i sent btc to a v1 address a few months ago
07:04 < pinheadmz> michaelfolkson the cool thing is you can have as many signets as you want!
07:04 < pinheadmz> dont even have to reset "the" signet
07:04 < kallewoof> michaelfolkson: depends. if we end up changing taproot in a non-compatible way, we can pretend signet activated later than it did and avoid the pesky non-compatible spends of the past.
07:05 < michaelfolkson> pinheadmz: Right. But we want a "default" one too :) Any of my questions are related to default Signet
07:05 < kallewoof> so we activate taproot on block #10000. we then find horrible soul eating bugs. we then "adjust" the activation to start at block #20000, and tada, all those pesky little weirdos are just OP_TRUEs.
07:05 < kallewoof> i think it's OP_SUCCESS nowadays, actually
07:08 < michaelfolkson> This confused me for ages. On mainnet this happens https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/99429/what-is-stopping-a-taproot-spend-following-old-taproot-rules-initially-treated
07:09 < michaelfolkson> On default Signet we have this option: https://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/98642/can-we-experiment-on-signet-with-multiple-proposed-soft-forks-whilst-maintaining
07:11 < michaelfolkson> But presumably this OP_SUCCESS option is to have multiple activation dates so Taproot spends with soul eating bugs can be treated as OP_TRUE if they were between Activation date 1 and Activation date 2
07:12 < michaelfolkson> Confused me for aaaages haha
07:16 < michaelfolkson> And at this early stage in default Signet history we could just throw it all away and start from genesis again if things got really messy
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07:31 < kallewoof> yeah, i've done that too many times already tho, so i'm hopeful we can avoid that :P
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12:04 < robot-dreams> Following up on the tapscript / sighash discussion from yesterday, I'm trying to understand the sighash performance improvements from both segwit and tapscript. Is this an accurate summary?
12:05 < robot-dreams> legacy: for each txin, we need to hash (a modified version of) the entire transaction
12:05 < robot-dreams> segwit V0: for each txin, we don't need to hash the entire transaction, but we do need to hash the entire scriptCode (i.e. witness script)
12:05 < robot-dreams> tapscript: for each txin, we don't need to hash the entire scriptCode because we use a tapleaf hash instead; now there's just a constant amount of hashing
12:05 < sipa> seems right
12:07 < robot-dreams> Woo, thanks! And congrats on the merge :)
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