--- Log opened Wed Mar 30 00:00:14 2016
00:13 -!- merlincorey [merlin@sm.ok.es.nu.gs] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:13 -!- merlincorey [merlin@sm.ok.es.nu.gs] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
00:17 -!- jtimon [~quassel@227.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
00:22 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:22 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
00:23 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
00:23 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
00:24 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
00:26 -!- Guest20938 is now known as starsoccer
00:33 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
00:34 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
00:39 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
00:40 -!- jarret [~jarret@162.216.46.119] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
00:49 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
00:50 < MRL-Relay> {-othe} theres some unfinished yet to be further done somewhere in summer or soon(tm) research on that difficulty topic by us https://github.com/monero-project/research-lab/tree/master/publications/MRL-0006%20-%20Difficulty%20Adjustment%20Algorithms%20in%20Cryptocurrency%20Protocols zooko
01:00 -!- AaronvanW [~ewout@202pc230.sshunet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:00 -!- AaronvanW [~ewout@202pc230.sshunet.nl] has quit [Changing host]
01:00 -!- AaronvanW [~ewout@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:03 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-229-199-227.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
01:04 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-229-199-227.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:04 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kofsoblsqwiqihcv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:09 -!- AusteritySucks [~Austerity@unaffiliated/austeritysucks] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
01:09 < fluffypony> O.o
01:10 < fluffypony> zooko: I think that blog post should endeavour to provide better attribution for ZKCP
01:10 < fluffypony> https://en.bitcoin.it/w/index.php?title=Zero_Knowledge_Contingent_Payment&oldid=20089 <- November, 2011
01:10 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xzglapqewofsuffu] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
01:11 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
01:13 -!- _rht [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nwccwwtikmndwefp] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
01:13 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:21 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
01:29 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
01:35 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:36 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:40 -!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
01:49 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
01:51 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:01 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:04 -!- roconnor [~roconnor@host-45-58-255-235.dyn.295.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
02:24 -!- proslogion [~proslogio@2.222.73.74] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:28 -!- jarret [~jarret@162.216.46.119] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:30 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:33 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:37 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:38 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
02:40 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
02:40 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
02:44 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
02:45 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
03:02 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
03:04 -!- supasonic [~supasonic@172-11-188-117.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
03:06 -!- chris2000 [~chris2000@customer-static-225-38.wobline-ip.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
03:12 -!- chris2000 [~chris2000@customer-static-225-38.wobline-ip.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:13 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: :)]
03:14 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
03:15 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
03:16 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
03:24 -!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
03:30 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
03:57 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:00 -!- phiche1 [~Adium@185.97.214.101] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:01 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
04:07 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
04:10 -!- andytoshi [~andytoshi@wpsoftware.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
04:14 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.148.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
04:19 -!- SireWolf [~TimothyJo@194.140.198.146.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
04:23 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
04:33 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
04:36 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:37 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:41 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
04:41 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:42 -!- chris2000 [~chris2000@customer-static-225-38.wobline-ip.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:43 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Client Quit]
04:44 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:53 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.148.103] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
04:58 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
05:01 -!- str4d_ [~str4d@27.110.123.92] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
05:02 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:04 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:06 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:08 -!- phiche1 [~Adium@185.97.214.101] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
05:23 -!- belcher [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:36 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-122-14-46-190.cm.vtr.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:36 -!- _rht [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dqrrnmpcqexolirx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:37 -!- jannes [~jannes@178.132.211.90] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:39 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: :)]
05:43 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
05:45 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
05:59 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:06 -!- andytoshi [~andytoshi@wpsoftware.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:12 -!- jtimon [~quassel@227.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:20 -!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Excess Flood]
06:20 -!- zmanian__ [sid113594@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vjccyxmljydosypa] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
06:21 -!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:22 -!- phiche1 [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:24 -!- zmanian__ [sid113594@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ewsxkjvafvmqgppd] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:26 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
06:30 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
06:41 -!- xeon-enouf [~xeon-enou@unaffiliated/xeon-enouf] has quit [Quit: leaving]
06:44 -!- xeon-enouf [~xeon-enou@unaffiliated/xeon-enouf] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
06:53 -!- atgreen [~green@38.104.156.251] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
07:02 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2605:e000:1525:802f:fdfc:5f36:c775:b936] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
07:09 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
07:15 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-229-199-227.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
07:23 -!- markus-k [~markus-k@designnet.work.de] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
07:26 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
07:28 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: laurentmt]
07:31 -!- atgreen_ [~green@38.104.156.251] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
07:44 -!- se3000 [~textual@38.125.163.25] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
07:46 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
07:47 -!- stonecoldpat [~a9380004@janus-nat-128-240-225-56.ncl.ac.uk] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:04 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:05 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:05 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:12 -!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:12 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:21 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:22 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:24 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:27 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
08:29 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:6c9f:7bdc:98af:d8f1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:34 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:38 -!- molz [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:39 -!- bliljerk_ [~bliljerk1@c-71-60-0-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:39 -!- molz [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:39 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:39 -!- nugit [~nugz@50.248.81.65] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:39 -!- bliljerk101 [~bliljerk1@c-71-60-0-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:40 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:40 -!- nugit [~xix0r@50.248.81.65] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:42 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
08:43 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:47 -!- chris2000 [~chris2000@customer-static-225-38.wobline-ip.de] has quit []
08:47 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
08:49 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
08:50 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:53 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:53 -!- SireWolf [~TimothyJo@194.140.198.146.dyn.plus.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
08:56 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
09:05 < r0ach> Is there any consensus in this channel of cryptocurrency being required to adhere to a certain monetary school, or can you just make up any random thing as long as it "appears to probabilistically be secure"
09:05 < r0ach> as in, it's a currency, so mostly an engineering task by default, not a religion
09:07 < r0ach> this post is my example for how I seem to be stuck on one monetary school with no way of altering it:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1414866.msg14365315#msg14365315
09:10 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
09:11 < SireWolf> bitcoin is some sort of class of commodity but I dont think its a currency
09:12 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.223] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:13 < belcher> r0ach some schools of economic thought would require centralization to implement e.g. a central bank to interpret all economic data and change the money supply to keep prices stable
09:13 < SireWolf> you would need an authority to provide pricing wouldnt you?
09:13 < belcher> iv mostly seen the fixed money supply as the only decentralized way of doing it, it getting libertarians interested is a side effect
09:14 < r0ach> my implied statement is that it's an entirely an engineering task to create a price peg, if you remove accessibility, you cripple the engineering task
09:14 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
09:15 < r0ach> and then you can never say 1 chicken = 1/10th a hat because it will always just be an extortion scheme
09:15 < SireWolf> could we do some sort of decentralized authority, maybe handling shares and voting on the blockchain?
09:16 < belcher> yes, to learn price information you need to query the real economy
09:16 < belcher> even central banks dont always get it right, and they are centralized institutions with a large amount of resources at their disposal and the backing of their states
09:17 < belcher> doing the same thing in a decentralized ungamable way seems impossible (but im happy to be proven wrong)
09:18 < belcher> however you could make a centralized cryptocurrency that went with the keynesian or monetarist school, easily
09:18 < SireWolf> well couldnt you poll shareholders for the price?
09:18 < belcher> shareholders = currency holders ?
09:18 < SireWolf> I dunno
09:19 < belcher> "oh yes, prices are really high, please engage in monetary tightening that will make the currency more valuable"
09:19 < SireWolf> but couldnt you poll people on the network and have it ask what the price is and the mean average of the poll is seen as the price?
09:22 < belcher> point is they'll lie because they want their investment to get more valuable
09:22 < SireWolf> so we need a decentralized marketplace that can be used to gauge the price?
09:22 -!- supasonic [~supasonic@172-11-188-117.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:22 < SireWolf> seems easy enough if you peg two cryptocurrencies against each other
09:22 < belcher> that can be gamed by sybiling, the same entity being the buyer and seller and trading at whatever price they want
09:22 < SireWolf> but thats useless
09:22 < SireWolf> fees could mitigate against that
09:23 < SireWolf> price fixing by trading with yourself wouldnt be free
09:23 < belcher> so that is like churning, a method of market manipulation
09:23 < belcher> if the manipulator owns enough currency units, their profit can be higher than the fee required
09:23 -!- MoALTz [~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
09:24 -!- bhez [~bhez@unaffiliated/drivelights] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
09:24 -!- bhez [~bhez@vps.boxxy.info] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:24 -!- bhez [~bhez@vps.boxxy.info] has quit [Changing host]
09:24 -!- bhez [~bhez@unaffiliated/drivelights] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:24 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:25 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:25 < SireWolf> an advanced AI able to gauge the price organcially thats consensus driven and distributed?
09:26 < SireWolf> a trustless AI that can figure out the price without an authority the way you can?
09:26 < belcher> as you're finding out, it rapidly becomes very complex
09:26 < SireWolf> granted I dont think any of us can develop that or providedit the processing power tody..
09:26 < SireWolf> but would it work?
09:27 < SireWolf> in any case yeah
09:27 < SireWolf> that's not a simple engineering challenge
09:27 < SireWolf> I like it when the implemention is the relatively easy part
09:27 < SireWolf> lol
09:27 < belcher> if you're going to do it for free to release an open source currency, you might as well work for central banks doing the same thing and get paid well
09:27 < belcher> its essentially making an automated central bank oracle
09:28 < SireWolf> well the obvious answer
09:28 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.223] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
09:28 < SireWolf> is to integrate the market into the currency
09:29 < SireWolf> but how do you send gold to a blockchain?
09:29 < SireWolf> or anything else thats stable
09:29 < SireWolf> seems like you'd need to bootstrap it with a centralized currency to peg it against
09:29 < belcher> you cant even premine the currency to fund development because the point is that price levels stay stable
09:30 -!- markus-k [~markus-k@p5B29AE8A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:30 -!- TheIdea [~TheIdea@5.2.64.122] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:31 < SireWolf> oh the price needs to fluctuate and its probably a good idea to have it go up in value, seeing as the whole crypto scene is speculative investment driven
09:31 < SireWolf> financially atleast
09:31 < SireWolf> but it needs to be slow and predictable
09:31 < SireWolf> ya know?
09:31 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
09:31 < SireWolf> which... heh
09:32 < SireWolf> building a coin that can manipulate its own price isnt going to be easy is it?
09:32 -!- kmels [~kmels@93.166.151.186.static.intelnet.net.gt] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:32 < SireWolf> could you bootstrap stablecoin with a centralized ecurrency?
09:33 < belcher> of course, you maintain a peg
09:33 < SireWolf> I mean if you had a non profit that issued digital silver citificates
09:33 < belcher> it may be expensive, and you'll need to follow the law regarding AML/KYC
09:33 < belcher> the swiss central bank spent billions defending its eur/chf peg, before giving up
09:33 < r0ach> there actually already is a "stablecoin" fyi, which did not prove to be very stable (lol)
09:34 < SireWolf> lol
09:38 < SireWolf> a disaster I bet?
09:39 -!- zwick [~zwick@fsf/member/zwick] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:43 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.223] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
09:56 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: laurentmt]
09:59 -!- Tiraspol [~Tiraspol3@unaffiliated/tiraspol] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
10:00 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:03 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:04 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
10:04 -!- gielbier [~giel____@a149043.upc-a.chello.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:05 -!- gielbier [~giel____@a149043.upc-a.chello.nl] has quit [Changing host]
10:05 -!- gielbier [~giel____@unaffiliated/gielbier] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:09 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit []
10:11 -!- molly [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:14 -!- molz [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
10:16 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:20 < zooko> fluffypony: thanks for the bug report. I patched it like so: https://z.cash/blog/science-roundup.html
10:20 < fluffypony> tks
10:21 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:23 -!- kmels [~kmels@93.166.151.186.static.intelnet.net.gt] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
10:35 -!- phiche1 [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
10:36 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:40 -!- MoALTz [~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:45 -!- jcluck is now known as cluckj
10:45 -!- nuke1989 [~nuke@46-88-98.adsl.cyta.gr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:48 -!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:50 -!- neha [~narula@mint-square.mit.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:52 -!- belcher [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
10:53 -!- moli [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:54 -!- belcher [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
10:55 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:55 -!- molly [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
10:56 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.223] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
11:01 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:13 -!- moli [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
11:13 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
11:15 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:17 -!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:19 -!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
11:23 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:24 -!- sausage_factory [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:25 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
11:26 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:26 -!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
11:39 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
11:40 < zooko> Dear wizards: please review! https://github.com/zcash/zips/blob/master/protocol/protocol.pdf
11:40 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:44 < MRL-Relay> {-othe} hows multisig going with zcash zooko?
11:47 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
11:53 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:56 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:56 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
11:56 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
11:57 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:00 < SireWolf> -othe whats zcash?
12:00 < MRL-Relay> {-othe} check their website
12:02 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
12:04 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:05 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:05 -!- frankenm_ [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:06 -!- frankenm_ [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:06 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:09 -!- r0ach [~r0ach@107-217-214-192.lightspeed.jcvlfl.sbcglobal.net] has quit []
12:14 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:17 -!- want_2o_know [4fb4a096@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.180.160.150] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:19 < want_2o_know> Hi.I'm new to IRC so please forgive in I'm doing some newbies staff. I'm trying to learn the depth of the bitcoin system can anyone answer some question I have?
12:19 < belcher> #bitcoin is a better channel for that
12:20 < want_2o_know> thanks
12:23 -!- markus-k [~markus-k@p5B29AE8A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
12:27 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:30 < zooko> -othe: it has multisig, but not private multisig. https://github.com/zcash/zcash/wiki/FAQ#q-does-zcash-have-multi-signature-transactions
12:30 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:32 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:36 < MRL-Relay> {-othe} yeah i´ve read that,we also did some multisig research
12:38 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:6c9f:7bdc:98af:d8f1] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
12:39 < instagibbs> zooko, could you at least to n-of-n schnorr?
12:40 < zooko> instagibbs: I haven't thought much about it. I don't understand much about schnorr sigs!
12:40 < zooko> instagibbs: maybe you could open a ticket on https://github.com/zcash/zcash and point the reader to the introductory explanation?
12:40 < instagibbs> mostly it's just a signature that looks like 1 of 1 lemme dig up libsecp doc
12:44 -!- Jeremy_Rand_2 [~user@ip68-97-35-223.ok.ok.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
12:44 < instagibbs> can't find it :/ but here's harding talking about it in general terms http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/34288/what-are-the-implications-of-schnorr-signatures
12:49 < waxwing> instagibbs: were you looking for this? https://github.com/sipa/secp256k1/blob/schnorrstages2/src/modules/schnorr/schnorr.md
12:49 < waxwing> i found it a good summary
12:49 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: laurentmt]
12:49 < instagibbs> yeah there we go!
12:49 < waxwing> although there is an erratum at the end of https://github.com/sipa/secp256k1/blob/schnorrstages2/src/modules/schnorr/schnorr.md#multisigning-combine-stage-2-signatures-into-a-full-signature
12:50 < waxwing> should read (R_all.x, s_all)
12:51 < instagibbs> also
12:51 < instagibbs> Multiply each of the Q(j) values by their hash SHA256(Q(j)).
12:51 < instagibbs> Compute the sum Q_all of all Q(j) values.
12:51 < instagibbs> sum of those let's call Q'(j) values
12:52 < waxwing> yeah i guess. that's a kind of programmer's error x *= 2 :)
12:53 < instagibbs> I mean, neither error makes sense :P
12:54 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
12:56 -!- jannes [~jannes@178.132.211.90] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
12:58 -!- gg [4fb4a096@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.180.160.150] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
12:58 -!- gg [4fb4a096@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.180.160.150] has quit [Client Quit]
13:01 -!- forrestv [forrestv@unaffiliated/forrestv] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
13:04 -!- zwick [~zwick@fsf/member/zwick] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1]
13:04 -!- Newyorkadam [~Newyorkad@wikipedia/Newyorkadam] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:04 -!- ryan-c [~ryan@srv1.turboslow.net] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net]
13:05 -!- hazirafel [~hazirafel@bzq-79-178-224-167.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:05 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-217-16-2.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
13:09 -!- forrestv [forrestv@unaffiliated/forrestv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:09 -!- ryan-c [~ryan@srv1.turboslow.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:10 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:14 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-229-199-227.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:18 -!- forrestv [forrestv@unaffiliated/forrestv] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
13:20 -!- forrestv [forrestv@unaffiliated/forrestv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:24 -!- Jeremy_Rand_2 [~user@172.58.105.234] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:28 -!- Don_John [~Don@250-223-114-134.nat.resnet.nau.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:29 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
13:32 -!- want_2o_know [4fb4a096@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.180.160.150] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
13:37 -!- Tiraspol [~Tiraspol3@unaffiliated/tiraspol] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:38 -!- MoALTz [~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
13:41 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:42 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
13:43 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:45 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
13:54 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.148.103] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
13:55 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
13:55 -!- Newyorkadam [~Newyorkad@wikipedia/Newyorkadam] has quit [Quit: Newyorkadam]
13:56 -!- zooko [~user@c-73-229-199-227.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
13:58 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:05 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
14:06 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:08 -!- hashtag_ [~hashtagg_@cpe-174-97-254-80.ma.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:11 -!- hashtag [~hashtagg_@cpe-174-97-254-80.ma.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
14:12 -!- arubi [~ese168@unaffiliated/arubi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
14:16 -!- arubi [~ese168@unaffiliated/arubi] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:18 -!- TheIdea [~TheIdea@5.2.64.122] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
14:22 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:22 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:23 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:26 -!- atgreen_ [~green@38.104.156.251] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
14:26 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:26 -!- atgreen [~green@38.104.156.251] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
14:28 -!- DougieBot5000_ [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:28 -!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has quit [Killed (kornbluth.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))]
14:28 -!- DougieBot5000_ is now known as DougieBot5000
14:30 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:33 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
14:33 -!- Guest38019 [~Sleepnbum@f050135253.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
14:34 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
14:43 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
14:46 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.144] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:48 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:50 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
14:53 -!- SireWolf [~TimothyJo@194.140.198.146.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
14:58 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:00 -!- SireWolf [~TimothyJo@194.140.198.146.dyn.plus.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:02 -!- PaulCape_ [~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:05 -!- PaulCapestany [~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
15:05 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
15:06 -!- zooko [~user@50.141.118.144] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
15:10 -!- tromp [~tromp@216.223.243.225] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
15:13 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
15:14 -!- Jeremy_Rand_2 [~user@172.58.105.234] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
15:17 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hwfsrszzyidlutgp] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:21 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
15:21 -!- c0rw1n_ [~c0rw1n@24.187-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:27 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:27 -!- gielbier [~giel____@unaffiliated/gielbier] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
15:33 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:37 -!- AaronvanW [~ewout@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:38 -!- arubi [~ese168@unaffiliated/arubi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
15:41 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
15:41 -!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
15:43 -!- arubi [~ese168@unaffiliated/arubi] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
15:55 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
15:57 -!- p15 [~p15@45.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
16:01 -!- ghtdak [~ghtdak@unaffiliated/ghtdak] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.4-dev]
16:08 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:09 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
16:12 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: :)]
16:13 -!- _rht [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dqrrnmpcqexolirx] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
16:23 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:25 -!- zooko [~user@2601:281:8001:26aa:759f:a191:9026:e4fa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:28 -!- proslogion [~proslogio@2.222.73.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
16:34 -!- belcher [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:36 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:41 -!- proslogion [~proslogio@unit060.acavpn.strath.ac.uk] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:45 -!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
16:45 -!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:46 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:49 -!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:49 -!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:49 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@remote.digitalmoneycorp.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
16:55 -!- zooko [~user@2601:281:8001:26aa:759f:a191:9026:e4fa] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
16:57 -!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
16:57 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:58 -!- sausage_factory [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
17:04 -!- roconnor [~roconnor@host-45-58-252-201.dyn.295.ca] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:05 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
17:08 -!- c0rw1n_ [~c0rw1n@24.187-243-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
17:16 -!- jtimon [~quassel@227.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
17:19 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
17:21 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:23 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:23 -!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:30 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
17:35 -!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
17:35 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@unaffiliated/debruyne] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
17:40 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
17:43 -!- tromp [~tromp@rtc35-225.rentec.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:46 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:53 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
17:53 -!- SireWolf [~TimothyJo@194.140.198.146.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
17:58 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
17:58 -!- r0ach [~r0ach@107-217-214-192.lightspeed.jcvlfl.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:00 -!- p15 [~p15@33.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:01 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kofsoblsqwiqihcv] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
18:02 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
18:02 -!- atgreen [~green@CPE687f74122463-CM00fc8d24cab0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:02 < r0ach> I have a theory that you don't understand Bitcoin unless you can define it in one sentence
18:02 -!- atgreen_ [~green@CPE687f74122463-CM00fc8d24cab0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:03 < r0ach> After years, I can finally do so:
18:03 < r0ach> "The purpose of mining is to create a permanent two way peg, decentralized exchange, which thus results in a permissionless system."
18:08 -!- zooko [~user@2601:281:8001:26aa:759f:a191:9026:e4fa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:16 -!- ghtdak [~ghtdak@unaffiliated/ghtdak] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:26 -!- proslogion [~proslogio@unit060.acavpn.strath.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
18:33 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} "transferable hash-cash karma"
18:35 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
18:49 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
18:50 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:55 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2605:e000:1525:802f:fdfc:5f36:c775:b936] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
18:56 -!- Jeremy_Rand_2 [~user@ip68-97-35-223.ok.ok.cox.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:03 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
19:06 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:17 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
19:19 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
19:20 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:23 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Client Quit]
19:23 < kanzure> "tor 224 proposes moving hidden service addresses to full ed25519 keys rather than truncated hashes of RSA keys amongst other things"
19:23 < kanzure> https://gitweb.torproject.org/torspec.git/tree/proposals/224-rend-spec-ng.txt
19:23 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:24 < bsm1175321> 2.5 years old... :-/
19:25 < bsm1175321> I think this has been posted here before, but it gives me pause about Curve25519: http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-March/028824.html
19:29 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
19:29 < bsm1175321> In the Bitcoin space, I find myself filling a niche where I'm doing network and data analysis, and while that post gives me pause, I'm convinced of the wisdom and attention to detail of they cryptographers in the Bitcoin space (especially the libsecp256k1 authors).  So I'm not so motivated to dig deeply into the curves and algorithmic comparisons. (and I hope I never will be)
19:31 < bsm1175321> Speaking of which, I'd love to see a speed comparison of ed25519 and libsecp256k1...anyone know of one?
19:32 < bsm1175321> gmaxwell claims ed25519 is not faster than libsecp256k1.  But I'd love to see numbers.
19:33 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:35 < bsm1175321> https://people.xiph.org/~greg/re_Courtois_1004.txt
19:38  * bsm1175321 invites others to ##crypto to debate the security of the two curves.  I know not the answer.
19:40 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:49 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
19:49 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2605:e000:1525:802f:fdfc:5f36:c775:b936] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
19:49 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2605:e000:1525:802f:fdfc:5f36:c775:b936] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:51 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:52 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Client Quit]
19:56 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
19:58 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:03 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20:05 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
20:06 -!- _rht [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uyxhriqmwlfseuok] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:09 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.169.174] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:10 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:11 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:11 -!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:11 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.169.174] has quit [Client Quit]
20:12 -!- d4de [~d4de@197.38.169.174] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:16 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
20:18  * bsm1175321 fails in ##crypto
20:20 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hwfsrszzyidlutgp] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
20:24 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:25 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20:25 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} that was an entertaining read
20:26 -!- xaptah [kaptah@hilla.kapsi.fi] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:26 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:27 < bsm1175321> @shen, indeed, what was your favorite part?
20:27 -!- binaryFate_ [~binaryFat@2607:ff48:aa81:800::a15f:1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:27 -!- tromp__ [~tromp@rtc35-225.rentec.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:27 -!- jbenet_ [sid17552@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ofosgwlbckxttkzl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:29 -!- STRML_ [~STRML@unaffiliated/strml] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:30 -!- _rht_ [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xmjacdhgquyqjsbh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:30 -!- coup_de_shitlord [~coup_de_s@irc.tox.im] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:30 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} in bold "I did not know that BitCoin is using secp256k1.
20:30 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} I am surprised to see anybody use secp256k1 instead of secp256r1. " lol
20:31 -!- whiteunicorn_ [uid139385@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gplyioxesmknhopc] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:31 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} (in the linked article)
20:31 -!- jtremback_ [sid67723@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-brjmiduhcaxgmoco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:31 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:32 -!- aspect__ [uid151486@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kkmodwcmxqrneoaf] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:32 -!- CodeShark_ [sid126576@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cdgauumfyfimwahl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:32 -!- null_rad- [Elite7851@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-kflumdgmlpowhkxk] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:32 < bsm1175321> I really feel for the NSA.  It's so hard to hide your crypto-key in the parameters of other people's crypto algorithms.
20:32 -!- jbenet [sid17552@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-idwfuqbkoxrbwwui] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- binaryFate [~binaryFat@2607:ff48:aa81:800::a15f:1] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- kaptah [kaptah@hilla.kapsi.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- tromp [~tromp@rtc35-225.rentec.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- nugit [~xix0r@50.248.81.65] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- jtremback [sid67723@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-adwmpbvbmybcgyol] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- null_radix [Elite7851@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-skmdtdhsrohvqgmd] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- da2ce7_mobile [~da2ce7@opentransactions/dev/da2ce7] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- stqism [~coup_de_s@freebsd/user/stqism] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- STRML [~STRML@unaffiliated/strml] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- _rht [uid86914@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uyxhriqmwlfseuok] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- aspect_ [uid151486@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ttryurccfrpavvsj] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:32 -!- CodeShark [sid126576@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mwjdjgsntuuptsod] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:33 -!- aspect__ is now known as aspect_
20:33 -!- whiteunicorn [uid139385@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xykfhljodugqtvwv] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:33 -!- PsychoticBoy [sid27029@pdpc/supporter/active/psychoticboy] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:33 -!- davout [~david@unaffiliated/davout] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:33 -!- CodeShark_ is now known as CodeShark
20:33 -!- supasonic [~supasonic@172-11-188-117.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20:33 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:b8e2:1c9c:fe32:8ba2] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:34 -!- _rht_ is now known as _rht
20:34 -!- nugit [~xix0r@50.248.81.65] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:34 -!- devrandom [~devrandom@unaffiliated/niftyzero1] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:34 -!- jron [~okok@ec2-54-161-129-226.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20:34 -!- davout [~david@unaffiliated/davout] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:34 -!- jron [~okok@ec2-54-161-129-226.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:34 -!- devrandom [~devrandom@unaffiliated/niftyzero1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:34 -!- da2ce7_mobile [~da2ce7@opentransactions/dev/da2ce7] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:35 -!- zooko [~user@2601:281:8001:26aa:759f:a191:9026:e4fa] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20:35 -!- tromp_ [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit []
20:35 -!- jbenet_ is now known as jbenet
20:36 < MRL-Relay> {-shen} * facepalm
20:37 -!- PsychoticBoy [sid27029@pdpc/supporter/active/psychoticboy] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:37 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:39 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:39 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:40 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
20:42 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:47 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
20:48 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20:50 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:50 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:51 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Client Quit]
20:51 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-122-14-46-190.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
20:52 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
20:52 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@173.205.24.114] has quit [Client Quit]
21:07 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
21:09 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:13 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:15 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:19 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xulgqzrnvyuemgox] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:33 -!- Guest25_ [~textual@pool-173-56-32-23.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:37 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:45 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
21:51 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
21:54 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-82-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:00 -!- phiche [~Adium@37.250.160.217.bredband.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:02 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:03 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:04 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:05 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:11 -!- yrashk [uid1568@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ydeawnfykqbihzuz] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
22:15 -!- Guest25_ [~textual@pool-173-56-32-23.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
22:19 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:21 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:23 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
22:29 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: johnwhitton]
22:30 -!- zwischenzug [~zwischenz@189.221.42.86.cable.dyn.cableonline.com.mx] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
22:31 -!- johnwhitton [~johnwhitt@c-71-202-223-50.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:33 < Taek> so, was talking to some people about lightning, and a bottleneck issue came up
22:33 < Taek> if you have 2 weeks (or whatever time period) to settle, there's the potential risk that some major counterparty breakdown will require a bunch of people to settle simultaneously
22:34 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@174-25-22-102.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:34 < Taek> potentially, more settlements needed than there are available transactions
22:34 < Taek> therefore, fraud would succeed against at least some of them
22:34 < Taek> to avoid this, I was thinking that you could destroy bitcoins to temporarily increase the blocksize
22:34 < Taek> e.g. 25btc destroyed to increase the blocksize by 1mb for 1 block
22:35 < Taek> this gives you an unsustainably expensive way to temporarily increase the block size
22:35 < Taek> no miner would ever do it, and users would only do it if there was an emergency reason to get a ton of transactions though
22:35 < Taek> *through
22:52 -!- Emcy [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust916.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:52 -!- Emcy [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust916.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
22:52 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
22:58 < Luke-Jr> Taek: typically the idea is to freeze maturity periods during full blocks
22:59 < Taek> aren't we more or less expecting blocks to always be full?
23:01 -!- markus-k [~markus-k@designnet.work.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:14 < rusty> Luke-Jr: yeah, that's why it
23:14 < rusty> Taek: yeah, that's why it's "idea" not "proposal".
23:15 -!- Don_John [~Don@250-223-114-134.nat.resnet.nau.edu] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
23:15 < rusty> Taek: Though it's a but more subtle.  It's not clear you want to immediately drop to blockchain, as failure may be transient.  So it might not be such a rush...
23:17 < Taek> rusty: as long as there's no failure mode where you can guarantee that there's not (in the short term) enough space for everyone to settle, it's not a huge worry for me
23:17 < Taek> and, though I don't understand all the implementation details, at a high level that doesn't really seem like a difficult guarantee to provide
23:18 -!- PRab [~chatzilla@c-68-34-102-231.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
23:19 -!- metric [~metric@199.127.226.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
23:20 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:20 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:b8e2:1c9c:fe32:8ba2] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
23:26 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
23:40 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:44 -!- metric [~metric@199.127.226.246] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:45 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rfdlxuidtiqycfts] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:45 -!- tromp [~tromp@ool-18be0bd8.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
23:50 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xulgqzrnvyuemgox] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
23:53 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
23:54 -!- PRab [~chatzilla@c-68-34-102-231.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
23:57 -!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has joined #bitcoin-wizards
--- Log closed Thu Mar 31 00:00:15 2016