--- Log opened Fri Apr 21 00:00:32 2017 00:02 -!- skeuomorf [~skeuomorf@unaffiliated/skeuomorf] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:08 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:12 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:16 -!- zaus [43bcd720@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.67.188.215.32] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:17 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:20 -!- MoALTz [~no@77-254-9-16.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:36 -!- zaus [43bcd720@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.67.188.215.32] has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 00:43 -!- kenshi84 [~kenshi84@i121-114-136-163.s41.a008.ap.plala.or.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 01:02 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:04 -!- CubicEarth [~cubiceart@c-67-168-4-85.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined 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joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:54 -!- hellothere [d44cf092@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.76.240.146] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:55 < hellothere> hey guys, is there a way to get the BIP44 path of a specific address hash, assuming I have the xpub? 02:55 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@2604:2000:c591:8400:ec56:fe7a:ed70:280c] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:57 -!- thrmo [~thrmo@unaffiliated/thrmo] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:59 < hellothere> (wrong channel I think, sorry) 02:59 -!- hellothere [d44cf092@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.76.240.146] has left #bitcoin-wizards [] 03:04 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@66.red-88-11-249.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:04 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@66.red-88-11-249.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has quit [Changing host] 03:04 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:09 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:11 -!- fieldsofgold [~fieldsofg@110.93.234.9] has quit [Ping 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has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 05:35 -!- mountaingoat [~mountaing@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mountaingoat] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 05:36 -!- kmels [~kmels@190.14.133.6] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:37 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:39 -!- cz [~cz@host109-147-227-82.range109-147.btcentralplus.com] has left #bitcoin-wizards [] 05:39 -!- cz [~cz@host109-147-227-82.range109-147.btcentralplus.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:54 -!- mountaingoat [~mountaing@unaffiliated/mountaingoat] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 06:08 < andytoshi> it's borderline -wizards, the question is whether you can preimage a hash, and the answer is no :) 06:25 -!- MoALTz [~no@77-254-9-16.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:27 -!- HostFat [~HostFat@93-39-178-182.ip77.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 06:30 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 06:43 -!- MoALTz [~no@77-254-9-16.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 06:58 < tromp__> unless P=NP :-) 07:06 < nsh> only for large cardinals who adhere to the antipope 07:07 < nsh> (log-bot been having connection issues, looking at https://botbot.me/freenode/bitcoin-wizards/) 07:09 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:13 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:16 < kanzure> nsh: http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-wizards/ 07:25 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@c-73-170-224-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: oleganza] 07:26 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@c-73-170-224-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:27 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@c-73-170-224-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 07:28 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:28 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:30 < nsh> ty 07:33 -!- gm2053 [~gm2051@2a02:c7d:12e:100:e407:340d:9c40:469d] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:34 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@5ED2CA1D.cm-7-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:35 -!- gm2051 [~gm2051@2a02:c7d:12e:100:84d0:5615:5e47:1a2f] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:36 -!- gm2052 [~gm2051@2a02:c7d:12e:100:b571:c37e:1f05:a513] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:38 -!- gm2053 [~gm2051@2a02:c7d:12e:100:e407:340d:9c40:469d] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:38 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:43 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:48 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:49 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@5ED2CA1D.cm-7-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:50 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:54 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:57 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:00 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:01 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:21 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:26 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:30 < adiabat> hellothere: if it's like m/44/0/0/5 or something, you can try guessing it 08:30 -!- fieldsofgold [~fieldsofg@221.120.220.11] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:31 < adiabat> iterate through commonly used bip44 derivation paths from the xpub and see if there's a match. For most wallets that could work. 08:33 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@5ED2CA1D.cm-7-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:33 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:33 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@5ED2CA1D.cm-7-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:38 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@5ED2CA1D.cm-7-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:49 -!- abpa [~abpa@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:13 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@52.119.113.96] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:31 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gugvjkehqjakawvx] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:55 -!- Guest12838 [~justin@47.148.176.74] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:55 -!- fieldsofgold [~fieldsofg@175.110.114.23] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:59 -!- Guest12838 [~justin@47.148.176.74] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:05 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] 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Leaving] 16:26 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:28 < luke-jr> andytoshi: https://github.com/opentimestamps/python-opentimestamps/issues/12 I'm just waiting for libsecp256k1 to support sign-to-contract before adding non-spammy proof-of-existence to Knots.. 16:35 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has quit [Quit: laurentmt] 16:37 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:38 -!- dnaleor [~dnaleor@78-23-74-78.access.telenet.be] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:39 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:40 -!- dnaleor [~dnaleor@78-23-74-78.access.telenet.be] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:40 -!- dnaleor [~dnaleor@78-23-74-78.access.telenet.be] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:41 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has quit [Client Quit] 16:42 < andytoshi> luke-jr: it does actually, the signing function takes a nonce-computing function...usually this is NULL meaning "just use rfc6979" but you can provide a different one that hashes in aux data 16:42 < andytoshi> hm, maybe i should PR to put one in that does sign-to-contract so there's something halfway standard in place 16:42 < gmaxwell> thats not sign to contract. 16:42 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 16:43 < gmaxwell> sign to contract needs to use the auxdata to take a struct that can return the underlying nonce. 16:43 < gmaxwell> I think I've implemented it at least twice, but the structure of the code is such that it's kinda slow so I'm not happy with it. 16:43 < andytoshi> gmaxwell: if i write a function that does rfc6979, computes the corresponding public nonce, hashes that with aux data, and adds the hash to the result of 6979 before returning, isn't that sign-to-contract? 16:44 < gmaxwell> (the problem is that the nonce function returns K ... not Kinv and kG. which means you need to do multiple multiplies for no real reason...) 16:44 < andytoshi> ohh i see 16:44 < andytoshi> yeah, you need the original nonce 16:48 -!- smk [4ad8c7ae@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.216.199.174] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:59 -!- abpa [~abpa@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 17:01 -!- Pr0t3us [~Pr0t3us@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/pr0t3us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:11 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nbtbyfaoknexlkrh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:15 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 17:17 -!- Hard_Line [~Jamie76@146-115-158-74.c3-0.frm-ubr1.sbo-frm.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:27 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:33 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@198-27-130-210.static.sonic.net] has quit [Quit: oleganza] 17:42 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:44 -!- Aranjedeath 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ZZZzzz...] 20:17 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@206.15.84.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:22 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:27 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 20:27 -!- boing_ [~boing@79-67-101-50.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 20:30 -!- boing [~boing@79-67-101-50.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20:40 -!- pro [~pro@unaffiliated/pro] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:59 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:00 -!- legogris [~legogris@128.199.205.238] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:00 -!- legogris [~legogris@128.199.205.238] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:11 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:12 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [~Chris_Ste@unaffiliated/chris-stewart-5/x-3612383] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:16 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:20 -!- [7] [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:20 -!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:24 -!- _whitelogger [~whitelogg@uruz.whitequark.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:25 -!- _whitelogger [~whitelogg@uruz.whitequark.org] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:30 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 21:31 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:36 -!- _whitelogger [~whitelogg@uruz.whitequark.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:37 -!- _whitelogger [~whitelogg@uruz.whitequark.org] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:43 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 21:50 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@c-73-170-224-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 21:53 < Taek> One thing I think that works not so well about bitcoin today is that you don't discount for future fees when you receive money 21:53 < Taek> for example, it's completely useless to me if you pay me 1 btc in all dust outputs 21:54 < Taek> I'll never be able to spend that 21:54 < Taek> It might make sense to start discounting the utxos when you receive them 21:55 < Taek> As that will give you a more realistic view of what your balance actually is 22:02 < Guest12838> Taek, sounds like a UX nightmare. I can see it being reasonable to show a max spendable balance with fees deducted from the 'real' balance when you first think of it. But as fee rates change, imagine a user seeing his/her bitcoin balance fluctuate up and down unless that becomes the norm. 22:02 < Guest12838> Unless that's the norm, most would freak out ha* 22:09 < Taek> It's already a ux nightmare on the other end though 22:09 < Taek> you get posts like "I had to pay $35 in fees to spend $60" 22:10 < Taek> You couldn't just adjust a user's visible balance as the fee market changed though, that would never be comfortable for a normal user 22:11 < Taek> Maybe you could have some field like 'Fee debt' that estimated the amount of fees you'd have to spend to spend all of your money 22:17 < Taek> It's a lot more relevant for people variable sized payments 22:17 < Taek> like exchanges 22:17 -!- oleganza [~oleganza@c-73-170-224-149.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: oleganza] 22:23 < Taek> *people accepting variable sized payments 22:25 < Guest12838> Taek, the fee debt changes with time, though. 22:26 < Taek> I imagine that'd be less frustrating than seeing your actual displayed balance change though 22:26 < Guest12838> I can't imagine fees triple or something, and a user will have the same problem but just having to pay more than what their 'fee debt' portion originally said :P 22:27 < Guest12838> can* 22:27 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:27 -!- fieldsofgold [~fieldsofg@110.93.234.9] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:27 < Taek> that's true, but it happens anyway. In one scenario the user knows what's happening though, and in the other they are just blindsided by the fees and go 'wtf' 22:27 < Guest12838> Well for those spending most of it. I guess it would slightly better for smaller payments not spending a huge chunk of the balance. 22:27 < Guest12838> Either way it's wtf 22:28 < Taek> but at least one lets you see that it's a bad idea to receive small payments 22:29 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:29 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:31 < Guest12838> Taek, lol, just imagine when 2nd layer systems start being the norm onchain balance, off chain LN balance, off chain spendable LN balance(nodes online and there being a routes out), and fee balance. rip 22:32 < Taek> Off chain spendable balance hopefully only becomes relevant if you are trying to spend it all at once 22:33 < Taek> but yeah, the complexity starts to add up 22:39 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zeihefkadpegnfmf] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:42 -!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:51 -!- Guest12838 is now known as juscamarena 23:02 -!- jtimon [~quassel@9.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:02 -!- jtimon_ [~quassel@9.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:04 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:09 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:12 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:12 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@2604:2000:c591:8400:fd17:6fc3:e19b:a0bb] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:21 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@2604:2000:c591:8400:fd17:6fc3:e19b:a0bb] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:28 -!- MoALTz [~no@77-254-9-16.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:29 -!- goksinen [~goksinen@cpe-74-71-4-175.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards --- Log closed Sat Apr 22 00:00:03 2017