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00:17 < cjd> <random musing>: wonder how hard it would be to do a mimblewimble/ringct/snark type thing except instead of payment it was WoT "trust level" so that you can do anonymous decentralized forums with some sort of moderation
00:18 < cjd> so you vote on the quality of messages w/o (anyone) knowing who posted them
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11:31 < gleb> This looks interesting: "SABRE: Protecting Bitcoin against Routing Attacks"
11:31 < gleb> https://nsg.ee.ethz.ch/fileadmin/user_upload/publications/ndss19-final252.pdf
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13:27 < gmaxwell> gleb: at least it's doing something different that makes sense.
13:29 < gmaxwell> my summary,  /24 announcements are more resistant to route hijacking because (0) longest match wins, (1) most networks filter out any prefix longer than 24 bits (I don't see the paper saying it, but I know it to be true),  (2) for multiple versions of the same route, networks are going to prefer the closer origin which is usually not the hijacker.
13:30 < gmaxwell> So the centeral idea on their work is that if you run a relay network with nodes on diversely placed /24 announcements, it's much harder for a route hijacker to disrupt it.
13:31 < gmaxwell> We could also make use of factors 0/1/2 in Bitcoin peer selection to generally harden the network.
13:31 < gmaxwell> E.g. try to get some peers that are in existing /24 announcements. though doing that would increase other vulnerablties.
13:34 < gmaxwell> BlueMatt: phantomcircuit: ^ that seems at least mildly relevant to your interests.
13:34 < gmaxwell> The paper manages to confused fibre protocol with matt's public relay network, sadly :(
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13:37 < gmaxwell> Perhaps I'm missing part of the paper, but I don't see what the software component of their work really accomplishes, beyond something like "run fibre on hosts selected to be on /24 announcements"
13:39 < gmaxwell> gleb: I think it makes for another example of why we'd like to handle more peers.  After reading this, I'd love to add an additional 3 outpeers to nodes that go to only peers in /24 announcements in distinct ASNs (and probably treat them like inbound for privacy purposes).
13:41 < BlueMatt> gmaxwell: oh, thats cool, yea, I guess that makes sense
13:41 < BlueMatt> I mean could also just fucking sign messages ala betterhash
13:41 < BlueMatt> but, whatever
13:42 < gmaxwell> BlueMatt: the hijack still breaks connectivity if you're signing messages.
13:42 < gmaxwell> BlueMatt: and the /24 trick will prevent that.
13:42 < gmaxwell> so e.g. if an attacker's goal is to inhibit the propagation of a competing miners' blocks... he'll announce more specifics of the miner's prefixes... maybe even route back all non-bitcoin traffic. :P
13:43 < BlueMatt> true, I suppose, but at least it breaks connectivity and you can fall back to another pool/solo mining
13:43 < BlueMatt> instead of giving the attacker hashrate
13:43 < gmaxwell> yes. for pool the obvious first move is ... fix the fking mining protocol.
13:43 < BlueMatt> well for blocks specifically betterhash relays blocks both from miners and the pool :p
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13:54 < phantomcircuit> gmaxwell, uh how?
13:54 < phantomcircuit> like make a list ourselves?
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