2015-02-27.log

--- Log opened Fri Feb 27 00:00:06 2015
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hearngood afternoon wizards05:37
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gmaxwellHow Bitcoin users treat Bitcoin developers, episode 37:  "when you let devs control anything beyond where to put the commas and braces in the code it is almost never successful by any rational metric"09:21
intsagibbswe were discussing payment channel implementations a bit back, here's a hub-spoke model that I didn't see discussed: http://lightning.network/lightning-network.pdf09:21
fluffyponyoff topic, but...http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/27/arts/television/leonard-nimoy-spock-of-star-trek-dies-at-83.html09:25
gmaxwelloh thats sad. Indeed, OT but thanks.09:26
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justanotheruserThat's fine, he can just use 0.1 or even fork it to make the spacing prettier09:34
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fluffyponylol gmaxwell - my favourite are the users that complain about something: "devs are useless, they haven't fixed X in 6 months!" and then when you prioritise it after much complaining you get the other lot going: "this is not important, devs are wasting their time on this when they should be doing Y"09:37
intsagibbsgmaxwell: the CEO of Bitcoin wants to talk to you about your job performance09:38
fluffyponyand, of course, the loudest of them all haven't donated a cent or contributed a single line of anything09:38
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sipaintsagibbs: didn't Bitcoin file for bankruptancy?09:39
nef0No, I've heard Google is buying them09:40
fluffyponynef0: after the mess they left in Japan I don't know if Google is still interested09:42
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gmaxwellmoa: ah, seems they renamed it from semaphor to lightning network,  http://lightning.network/lightning-network.pdf10:04
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gmaxwellthis is the slids for a fancy optimizable micropayment hub approach. (I'm not sure when the paper on it will be available)10:05
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intsagibbsSays tonight on the webpage10:09
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zookoWhoa you can buy "foo.network"? brb10:09
intsagibbssocial.network(!!!)10:11
intsagibbsI'm assuming this hub/spoke has the same capital requirements as other approaches.10:12
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dgenr8it's so very optimistic to set the scalability requirements at ALL_HUMAN_TRANSACTIONS.  as if being able to buy a lego kit meant instant global domination10:31
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intsagibbsnapkin-math is necessary for the debate about what Bitcoin could/should be10:36
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intsagibbsthe 7B person goal is just saying you could literally let everyone interact directly with the blockchain. Slides show that's still impossible of course.10:40
dgenr8ah, well this lightning proposal is not about what bitcoin should be.  it's about creating some new complicated thing that involves bitcoin on the back end10:40
intsagibbsinteract in a meaningful way*10:41
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maakudgenr8: "bitcoin on the back end" basically describe the future of bitcoin13:35
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sipamaaku: maybe :)13:46
sipa(not saying that i disagree, but we don't know the future)13:47
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nsh(O/T: 'Abstract—We present an effective implementation of the PRIME+PROBE side-channel attack against the last-level cache. We measure the capacity of the covert channel the attack creates and demonstrate a cross-core, cross-VM attack on multiple versions of GnuPG. Our technique achieves a high attack resolution without relying on weaknesses in the OS or hypervisor or on sharing memory between attacker and victim.'13:53
nsh-- http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:XIEoJCdSMngJ:www.nicta.com.au/pub%3Fpslides%3D8432+&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk&client=ubuntu )13:53
nsh(update libgcrypt)13:53
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Elieldgenr8: that lightning proposal reminded me of ripple (the original routing idea, not so much any particular implementation) due to the way it suggests to move money.17:47
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Elielalthough, unlike ripple, it appears to require less trust in the people doing the routing.17:48
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nshEliel, anything online about this?18:11
Elielnsh: you mean the original ripple idea?18:12
nshno, this lightning proposal you're talking about18:12
Elielhttp://lightning.network/lightning-network.pdf18:12
nshty18:13
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gmaxwellEliel: no need to streach to try to find things to compare it to; it's a micropayment hub network; just improved.18:19
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dgenr8the instant-ness in these cosigned coin ideas comes from trust in the cosigner, just like trusting Visa (or the govt, in the case of cash).  That, and having pre-paid the "instant" transaction.18:59
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Luke-Jrdgenr8: the topic is not a mere cosigned coin idea19:00
Luke-Jrdgenr8: specifically, the cosigner can't screw you over19:03
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IriezCausing quite a lot of drama Luke-Jr.19:33
IriezFor the safety of children and all things holy, please stop.19:33
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kanzurewrong channel19:34
Luke-Jr(also, you have the wrong person)19:36
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