2015-04-02.log

--- Log opened Thu Apr 02 00:00:09 2015
--- Day changed Thu Apr 02 2015
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* andy-logbot is logging01:05
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lmatteishello. is there a paper somewhere that explains how Namecoin works?02:13
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fluffyponylmatteis: #namecoin02:19
fluffyponyor #namecoin-dev02:19
lmatteisthanks02:19
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nsh.title http://www.reddit.com/r/crypto/comments/30wuxb/anyone_want_to_help_draft_some_cwes_for_elliptic/02:52
yoleauxAnyone want to help draft some CWEs for Elliptic Curve Crypto? : crypto02:52
nsh(Common Weaknesses and Exposures)02:52
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andytoshii think "known weak curve" is probably the only code worth having for curve parameters ... these things change as time ticks by and nobody is introducing known-broken curves to existing systems (are they?)07:44
pigeonsthe projects i know are scared and just using whatever NaCl supports (Curve25519 i guess)07:47
gmaxwellit's funny, because the NaCL implementation of signing with 25519 is some kind of adhoc, prestandard thing that doesn't match anything published.07:55
pigeonsyeah i think its a "nobody got fired for using IBM" sort of thing07:57
pigeonseverybody else is doing it, and we can appeal to djb as an authority07:58
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gmaxwellDJB is indeed awsome, but he's just one dude; its not like his code has been bugless. And his code is often very hard to review.  I suspect people doing that probably haven't completely thought through what happens if things do go wrong; its easy to throw rocks at just using nacl.08:00
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andytoshimmhmm, i recall some "random from [0, .. 2^255-19)" code posted here which was so bitshifty, long and uncommented that i said it was "probably backdoored" ... then we tracked it back to SUPERCOP/ed25519 (meaning djb had written it, and this was also our first clue it was doing modular reduction) and i revised it to "probably not". but tbh i couldn't tell and didn't want to wade through it ... if i08:09
andytoshiwas doing code review with him i'd make him add sipa-style invariant comments to every line at least08:09
andytoshiactually maybe it wasn't 2^255-19, it'd be crazy then to not just generate 255 random bits..08:11
gmaxwellYes, he writes a lot of code thats very difficulty to review. It's also almost always correct (certantly moreso than anything I write). But not always. :(08:18
andytoshiah, it was 2^252 + 27742317777372353535851937790883648493 ... the discussion was on the mornintg of 2014-06-06, https://download.wpsoftware.net/bitcoin/wizards/2014-06-06.html starting from 16:08:5708:20
gmaxwellyea, that function is a doozy. lol08:28
gmaxwellhttps://github.com/amjuarez/bytecoin/blob/296ae46ed8f8f6e5f986f978febad302e3df231a/src/crypto/crypto-ops.c#L160908:28
fluffyponysc_reduce is headache-worthy08:29
Anduckthat's sick08:30
fluffyponyI love how MRL-0003 reduces that entire thing down to 2 sentences -08:30
fluffypony4.1.11 sc_reduce08:30
fluffyponyTakes a 64-byte integer and outputs the lowest 32 bytes modulo the prime q. This is not a CryptoNote-specific function, but comes from the standard ed25519 library.08:30
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hearnit's like he said "magic numbers? i love magic shows!"08:34
andytoshihehe08:35
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fluffyponyeveryone saw the TrueCrypt report, right?08:36
fluffyponyhttp://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2015/04/truecrypt-report.html08:36
fluffyponymakes for interesting reading08:36
fluffyponytl;dr - TrueCrypt is basically well designed, bar some Windows PRNG issues08:37
gielbierfluffypony haven't seen it yet, thx for the link08:39
gmaxwellI don't think there are any unexplained magic numbers in libsecp256k1, unless you count test vectors. (if you happen to find any, whine.)08:40
kanzurei have been meaning to find an excuse to use https://github.com/Z3Prover/z308:44
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gmaxwellany more formal analysis on libsecp256k1 would be awesome.08:46
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rustyGreenIsMyPepper: why 40 days, BTW?16:29
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kanzurehmm what public/private keys have been baked into asics before? is there a scheme resistant to scanning electron microscopy reading the private key?17:28
kanzurefor example: maybe each chip individually has a different private key assigned to it, perhaps a child key from the manufacturer.17:28
kanzure(merely asking because i have spontaneously forgotten these things, and not because i have a project in mind)17:28
phantomcircuitkanzure, you mean in general or with bitcoin asics?17:29
kanzuregeneral17:29
kanzurei've definitely seen some people lifting private keys by looking at transistor layouts, where the private key was the same for all chips apparently. unfortunately i forget where i saw this..17:29
phantomcircuita tpm will generally have an rng and generate all of it's keys internally17:29
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phantomcircuitif there needs to be attestation or the like the manufacturer signs the public key before the device leaves the factory17:30
phantomcircuitkanzure, sure people do that with things like HDCP17:30
phantomcircuitwhere the security is fake and the points dont matter17:30
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