2015-10-01.log

--- Log opened Thu Oct 01 00:00:44 2015
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]00:01
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]00:02
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:15
-!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:16
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]00:17
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:27
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@119246245241.ctinets.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:33
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@119246245241.ctinets.com] has quit [Changing host]00:33
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:33
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@2601:647:4c01:89ce:7029:d819:5d31:9c7] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:34
-!- blackwraith [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]00:34
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:37
-!- trippysalmon [~Rob@ip4da81ded.direct-adsl.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:40
-!- davec [~davec@cpe-24-243-251-52.hot.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]00:40
-!- davec [~davec@cpe-24-243-251-52.hot.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:41
-!- rustyn_ is now known as rustyn00:49
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@216-15-123-91.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards00:51
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]00:52
-!- the`doctor [~matt@162.211.151.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]00:52
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]00:57
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:08
-!- NLNico [~NLNico@unaffiliated/nlnico] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:08
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]01:11
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:11
-!- rubensayshi [~ruben@91.206.81.13] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:22
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:33
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@216-15-123-91.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: GGuyZ]01:41
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:45
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]01:48
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has joined #bitcoin-wizards01:49
-!- Oizopower [uid19103@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-coxbxonpivkedjei] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]01:59
-!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-36-133-241-201.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]02:10
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@2601:647:4c01:89ce:7029:d819:5d31:9c7] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]02:30
-!- rustyn [~rustyn@unaffiliated/rustyn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]02:31
-!- rustyn [~rustyn@unaffiliated/rustyn] has joined #bitcoin-wizards02:32
-!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards02:40
-!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]02:43
-!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]02:43
-!- Darknes is now known as penjenayah02:45
-!- CoinMuncher [~jannes@178.132.211.90] has joined #bitcoin-wizards02:46
penjenayahhello02:47
-!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #bitcoin-wizards02:56
-!- the`doctor [~matt@162.211.151.91] has joined #bitcoin-wizards02:59
-!- JackH [~Jack@host-80-43-141-235.as13285.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards03:12
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]03:19
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards03:21
nshin general, multiple provers are more powerful03:21
nshi tried to think about how multiple provers might be used to make a zk-snark-based blockchain more efficient03:21
nshbut not very hard03:22
nshi think the answer i got was: salmon03:22
nshso i probably forgot to carry a one at some point in the calculations03:22
-!- agorecki [~agorecki@unaffiliated/agorecki] has joined #bitcoin-wizards03:57
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:01
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:06
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:09
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]04:12
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]04:14
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:15
-!- AaronvanW [~ewout@80.174.233.182.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:18
-!- AaronvanW [~ewout@80.174.233.182.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Changing host]04:18
-!- AaronvanW [~ewout@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:18
-!- the`doctor [~matt@162.211.151.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]04:19
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]04:24
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:25
-!- azariah [azariah@Tricholoma.Update.UU.SE] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:30
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]04:37
-!- p15x [~p15x@127.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:41
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]04:54
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]04:55
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]04:59
-!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has joined #bitcoin-wizards04:59
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:03
-!- CodeShark_ [~CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]05:11
-!- face [~face@mail.hmel.org] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:11
-!- Iriez [wario@distribution.xbins.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]05:12
-!- AaronvanW [~ewout@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]05:16
-!- sparetire_ [~sparetire@unaffiliated/sparetire] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:26
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]05:35
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:37
-!- p15x [~p15x@127.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]05:44
-!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]05:47
-!- Iriez [wario@distribution.xbins.org] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:50
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:51
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards05:56
-!- roxtrong_ [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:00
-!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:00
-!- roxtrongo [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]06:03
-!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-75-230.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:12
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:16
-!- roxtrong_ [~roxtrongo@191.113.116.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]06:29
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]06:32
-!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:40
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]06:41
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-81-69.dyn.mit.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards06:55
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-81-69.dyn.mit.edu] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]07:00
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@2601:647:4c01:89ce:7029:d819:5d31:9c7] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:08
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:11
-!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]07:14
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has quit [Quit: Bye]07:15
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:15
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:17
-!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:23
-!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@56-197-ftth.onsbrabantnet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:29
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]07:31
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:33
-!- rubensayshi [~ruben@91.206.81.13] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]07:34
-!- rubensayshi [~ruben@91.206.81.13] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:35
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]07:35
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:35
-!- zooko [~user@172.56.9.30] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:41
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@c-73-202-109-21.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]07:42
-!- c0rw1n is now known as c0rw|away07:47
-!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-36-133-241-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:51
-!- shen_noe [~shen_noe@wired018.math.utah.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:54
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]07:56
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:57
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards07:57
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]07:57
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has quit [Quit: Bye]08:01
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:02
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:07
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:08
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@74-95-207-205-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:12
-!- sneak [~sneak@unaffiliated/sneak] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]08:13
-!- sneak [~sneak@unaffiliated/sneak] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:14
-!- kyuupichan [~Neil@ad042217.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]08:14
-!- grandmaster [dansmith3@gateway/shell/bnc4free/x-xywargtjdimaxkhc] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:22
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:23
-!- kyuupichan [~Neil@ae053102.dynamic.ppp.asahi-net.or.jp] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:25
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-81-69.dyn.mit.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:26
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]08:32
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-81-69.dyn.mit.edu] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]08:34
-!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:35
-!- alferz [~alferz@unaffiliated/alfer] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]08:36
-!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:38
-!- alferz [~alferz@unaffiliated/alfer] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:44
-!- alferz [~alferz@unaffiliated/alfer] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]08:48
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:48
-!- eudoxia_ [~eudoxia@r167-57-151-75.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:48
-!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-75-230.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]08:49
-!- eudoxia_ [~eudoxia@r167-57-151-75.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Client Quit]08:49
-!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:52
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]08:57
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has joined #bitcoin-wizards08:57
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-2-199.dyn.mit.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:01
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-2-199.dyn.mit.edu] has quit [Client Quit]09:01
-!- kmels [~kmels@186.64.110.122] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:04
-!- JackH [~Jack@host-80-43-141-235.as13285.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]09:12
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]09:12
-!- Yoghur114 [~jorn@g227014.upc-g.chello.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:13
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]09:13
-!- instagibbs [~greg@pool-108-31-210-40.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]09:13
-!- jl2012 [~jl2012@unaffiliated/jl2012] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:14
-!- instagibbs [~greg@pool-108-31-210-40.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:15
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:18
-!- wiz [~sid1@tor-exit.echelon.nsa.network] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]09:26
-!- wiz_ [~sid1@tor-exit.echelon.nsa.network] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:27
-!- DocHex [~DocHex@193.28.228.45] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:28
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]09:28
-!- instagibbs [~greg@pool-108-31-210-40.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]09:29
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]09:32
-!- prom3th3us [~prom3th3u@unaffiliated/prom3th3us] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:33
-!- the`doctor [~matt@static-108-47-15-123.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:37
-!- instagibbs [~greg@pool-108-31-210-40.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:38
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]09:45
-!- zooko [~user@172.56.9.30] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]09:57
-!- zooko [~user@172.56.9.30] has joined #bitcoin-wizards09:58
-!- bsm1175321 [~bsm117532@38.121.165.30] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:00
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:07
-!- se3000 [~SE@38.125.163.3] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:07
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]10:07
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@74-95-207-205-SFBA.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]10:08
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:10
amillerthere are so many interesitng things in this new memory-hard pow paper10:15
amillerthere's a part on "Algorithm Binding" that basically tries to prevent you from finding a solution and grinding it to get solutions with different hashes10:16
amillerthe way they pull that off is clever, but i don't understand it well yet10:16
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]10:17
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]10:20
-!- bildramer [~bildramer@p4FE649E1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]10:21
-!- bildramer [~bildramer@p4FE649E1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:23
-!- zooko [~user@172.56.9.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]10:27
-!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]10:27
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:28
-!- rubensayshi [~ruben@91.206.81.13] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]10:29
-!- DocHex [~DocHex@193.28.228.45] has left #bitcoin-wizards []10:33
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]10:34
maakujgarzik: have you looked at the risc-v isa? is there a reason you prefer moxie?10:35
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:42
-!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:42
bsm1175321So memory-hard POW seems to be a loser to me. There are a lot of CPUs and GPUs in this world that could be suddenly reallocated to attack a chain. Satoshi's notion of CPU-only mining fails for the same reason. Big clusters exist... and a virus could suddenly dump a lot of GPU power on a chain.10:44
bsm1175321ASICS, for better or worse, can't be used for any other purpose, and there exists no other hardware that could be suddenly reallocated to attack bitcoin.10:45
justanotheruserbsm1175321: have you read asic-faq.pdf?10:45
bsm1175321Not yet...but it looks like I wholeheartedly agree.10:47
bsm1175321His (4.4): Memory hardness is undesirable.10:48
gmaxwellbsm1175321: dunno if that really is a great argument. Yes those things are true and risks, but they have to be considered _relative_ to the alternative. It's not clear to me that botnets are worse than industrial mining. The costs you are thinking about are one time and are spread across operation. Many miners today consider their hardware 'free' (already paid for).10:49
gmaxwellA greater argument, is to look at the effect in practice, e.g. ethereum, new as it is, has serious mining centeralization problems which exist completely independantly of any asic implementation of their design.10:50
bsm1175321Let's put it another way: I think widely dispersed ASICs, at the network edges is the most possible secure mining situation.10:50
bsm1175321e.g. mine transactions on submission, merge-mine them to get blocks.10:50
bsm1175321Ethereum will see farms of GPUs (which already existed anyway for scrypt).  But a farm of GPUs can be reallocated to a different algorithm and a different chain.  The existence and use of GPU farms is a serious problem for centralization, I'd argue it's worse than ASIC centralization since it can be reallocated.10:52
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]10:53
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards10:54
jgarzikmaaku, moxie simulator is very small and easy to audit + intentionally written to align well with gcc/clang internal compiler primitives10:57
maakujgarzik: also true of risc-v ;)10:58
jgarzikmaaku, in hindsight, the moxie arch maintainer hangs out on freenode and we can ask for stuff :)10:58
* jgarzik &10:59
gmaxwellmaaku: that would be atgreeen.11:00
gmaxwellMight want to make up a comparison table.11:00
maakujgarzik: I'm just concerned about standardizing on something that hasn't seen the rigerous deployment testing, and doesn't have a vibrant community behind it11:00
maakugmaxwell: yeah I'm in the process of doing that11:00
-!- Dizzle__ [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:02
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]11:02
-!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]11:05
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]11:06
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:07
maakuit wlil be biased though, because on the metrics I care about RISC-V seems to have a clear advantage, so I was inquiring to see what other people cared about here...11:08
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]11:10
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:14
kanzuremaaku: i would imagine at some point that we are going to throw lots of different architectures against snarks benchmarks11:15
kanzurei don't even remember the conventional cpu performance benchmark test suite names... but i think they still exist.11:15
kanzure(rather, this would be for picking benchmarks for snark proofs, at least to the extent that we cull irrelevant benchmarks)11:15
gmaxwellmaaku: where can I find a turn key toolchain and simulator for riscv?  It was pretty darn easy to get moxie going.11:16
jgarzikfg11:18
jgarzikmaaku, the core of moxie is basically directly integrated into the various GNU toolchains - the simulator is the sim GDB uses etc.   toolchain convenience level is very high.11:19
jgarzikand we can malleate moxie to do what we need11:20
maakugmaxwell: https://github.com/riscv/riscv-isa-sim and https://github.com/riscv/riscv-gnu-toolchain ; also look at all the riscv user repos11:22
maakugmaxwell: it's not as clear to review as the moxie switch statement though, so my intention was to spend an afternoon/weekend refactoring and simply to exhaustive testing to validate11:24
jgarziksim is quite a bit bigger11:25
maakugmaxwell: actually https://github.com/riscv/riscv-tools is the one-stop-shop11:26
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]11:27
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:27
jgarzikmaaku, initial reaction - overly modularized and flexible to the nth degree11:27
maakujgarzik: that's a minus?11:28
jgarzikmaaku, took me just a couple lines to patch in a crypto instruction to moxie in a local branch11:28
maakuoh the simulator, yeah agreed11:28
jgarzikI do think projects can be too-flexible and over-engineered to the point where there is lots of effort expended to accomplish simple tasks.11:28
* jgarzik is in the "simple is beautiful" club :)11:29
-!- belcher_ [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:29
maakubut in terms of things to fix, that one's pretty small -- since the ISA is stable we just write a separate, simple interpreter for consensus code11:29
maakuand do a one-time exhaustive test against the reference implementation11:29
jgarzikhmm that translates to "write a clean one from scratch" which is where we are with Moxie11:30
maakumy point is more that they have done lots of work / learning from industry on the risc-v side to optimize the isa for circuit implementation and compiler targetability11:31
maakuthe developers of risc-v being the inventors of RISC/MIPS11:31
kanzuremaaku: you're trying to emphasize existing developer adoption and knowledge of risc stuff?11:31
maaku"knowledge of" no, "iterated design" yes -- risc for example is specifically architected to minimize circuit size for a minimal implementation (it outcompetes industry on this)11:32
maakuwhich as noted above, might be useful for snark efficiency11:32
maakuand definately would be useful for efficient fpga implemenations11:32
kanzurewhat was the latest verdict on the zk-snark cpu approach versus zk-snark asic approach?11:33
kanzurebtw did you see this from other day http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/simons-institute/a-wishlist-for-verifiable-computation/11:33
maakukanzure: application specific -- do you want to regenerate the proving keys for each application is the question11:33
kanzurei thought we didn't want any keys at all in the setup?11:33
kanzuresee pm (briefly)11:33
maakujgarzik: and also, active developer community exists, e.g. with annual conferences, research programs at university, hobbyist communities getting chips fabed, etc.11:34
maakujgarzik: one thing I worry about is adopting an ISA that we end up being the sole users of11:34
-!- c-cex-yuriy [uid76808@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lhboignssfuxdutu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:35
jgarzikmaaku, We're iterating largely on the software side.  I think FPGA or silicon would be cool but not so high value because that increases the difficulty to observe the sandbox.   A field solution is gonna be a bit java-VM-esque in that it mixes low level (RISC instructions) with very high level (crypto instructions, jumps to magic addresses where crypto functions are implemented)11:37
jgarzikmaaku, so of all that you listed, I'd probably weigh "active developer community" the highest11:37
jgarzikmaaku, but weight against the ability to do something interesting and radical in a few lines of easy to audit code11:37
gmaxwellFWIW, RISC V apparently has a specced way to add accelerators. I've not looked into it. (presumably the same thing could be specced for moxie)11:38
maakujgarzik: well I've been more favoring lower level opcodes than "hash256" or "checksig"11:38
jgarzikmaaku, moxiebox takes two routes:  (1) CRYPTO instruction with a sub-instruction implementing familiar SHAx_TRANSFORM operation, and (2) high level magic runtime calls that are implemented natively11:39
jgarzikI've pushed infrastructure for #2 to public repo, currently testing the rest11:39
kanzurewould be interesting to demonstrate risc-v developer/user community interest before pulling trigger somehow- if we have to shoulder all of that work and maintenance then might as well stick to simple reviewable stuff if nobody else except bitcoiners are going to bother11:39
jgarzikmaaku, Thus, I agree that opcodes should implement low level discrete operations, a la CISC today11:40
jgarzik#1 gets proposed as addition to moxie architecture11:41
jgarzik#2 is just a runtime convention11:41
gmaxwellmaaku: by lower level you mean sha256 instead of hash256 or?  ... if you go any lower than sha256 you immediate add a couple kilobytes of bytecode for just a hash function, and take a 100 fold performance loss.11:41
gmaxwell(well I suppose you can expose the raw compression function as a middle step with only a moderate performance loss, but surely no lower)11:42
-!- kmels [~kmels@186.64.110.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]11:43
kanzuresomeone around here should infiltrate libsnark team11:43
kanzureheck, i should do this11:43
kanzures/infiltrate/contribute to/11:44
-!- NLNico [~NLNico@unaffiliated/nlnico] has quit [Quit: Leaving]11:45
-!- nullbyte [NSA@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-jnxkuswngnaeyipc] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:45
gmaxwellin any case, your snark comparison is straight forward; you port your VM to the circuit compiler from C that amiller linked to earlier. And figure out how big the circuit is.. then multiply it by the compiled size for that VM on some benchmark code.11:47
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:50
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-108-93.dyn.mit.edu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:51
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has quit [Quit: Bye]11:54
-!- CodeShark_ [~CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:56
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]11:56
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]11:56
-!- dstadulis [~maider@172.56.31.160] has joined #bitcoin-wizards11:59
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:02
-!- CodeShark is now known as CodeShark__12:03
-!- CodeShark_ [~CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has quit []12:03
-!- CodeShark [CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:03
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@ip-64-134-238-237.public.wayport.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:11
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:12
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]12:15
-!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:16
-!- Dizzle__ [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]12:16
maakugmaxwell: i mean single run of the full sha256 compression round12:24
nsh--12:25
nsh<amiller> there are so many interesitng things in this new memory-hard pow paper12:25
nsh<amiller> there's a part on "Algorithm Binding" that basically tries to prevent you from finding a solution and grinding it to get solutions with different hashes12:25
nsh-- which paper?12:25
maakuan opcode that takes a 512 bit block (memory pointer) and 256 bit midstate (registers) and runs a round of sha25612:25
maakulikewise instead of checksig, have EC point multiply, add, square, etc.12:26
tromp__nsh: eprint.iacr.org/2015/94612:27
jgarzikmaaku, yes -- that is precisely what my CRYPTO/SHA256_TRANSFORM mod to moxiebox does12:28
jgarzikdoesn't perform any setup, just operates on a block12:28
nshty12:28
gmaxwellmaaku: trying to construct a verify out of multiply/add/square is a guarenteed huge slowdown. FWIW.12:28
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:29
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]12:30
maakugmaxwell: did you miss the etc.?12:33
maakuthere should be accelerators for all the basic operations.12:33
maakuthere shouldn't be a monolithic "checksig" opcode12:33
* nsh takes edict notes12:34
-!- CoinMuncher [~jannes@178.132.211.90] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]12:36
gmaxwellmaaku: the basic operator to get a fast verify is fairly specific to a verify though.12:37
Elielcouldn't you structure the script format so that new scripts can re-use parts of older ones without having to actually include the older ones? That way you could have a script language without any complex predefined OPs and implementations can choose to accelerate specific pure subfunctions of it with native code.12:47
Elielkind of like how the urbit whitepaper suggested implementing subtraction despite the base bytecode only supporting addition.12:48
jgarzikI've also been thinking about how to ship deterministic code around the Internet...12:50
Elielhttp://urbit.org/preview/~2015.9.25/materials/whitepaper12:50
jgarzikyou might wind up such binary codelibs from site X and Y or chain transaction X and Y as dependencies12:50
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@50-0-242-54.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:51
-!- nullbyte [NSA@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-jnxkuswngnaeyipc] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]12:53
-!- pavel__ [~paveljani@79-98-72-216.sys-data.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards12:59
-!- paveljanik [~paveljani@unaffiliated/paveljanik] has quit [Read error: No route to host]12:59
-!- pavel__ [~paveljani@79-98-72-216.sys-data.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]12:59
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-108-93.dyn.mit.edu] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]12:59
-!- paveljanik [~paveljani@unaffiliated/paveljanik] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:00
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@ip-64-134-238-237.public.wayport.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]13:01
-!- michagogo [uid14316@wikia/Michagogo] has left #bitcoin-wizards []13:04
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@ip-64-134-238-237.public.wayport.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:06
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:07
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@ip-64-134-226-95.public.wayport.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:13
-!- Quanttek [~quassel@ip1f11db5b.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]13:18
-!- kmels [~kmels@186.64.110.122] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:18
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@ip-64-134-226-95.public.wayport.net] has quit [Quit: GGuyZ]13:19
-!- dstadulis [~maider@172.56.31.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]13:27
-!- bsm1175321 [~bsm117532@38.121.165.30] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]13:27
amilleri don't think has been linked here yet: ghassankarame.com/ripple.pdf13:28
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@2601:647:4c01:89ce:7029:d819:5d31:9c7] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]13:30
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@50-0-242-54.dsl.dynamic.fusionbroadband.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]13:30
-!- prom3th3us [~prom3th3u@unaffiliated/prom3th3us] has quit [Quit: prom3th3us]13:31
-!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@104-6-36-162.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving...]13:31
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:32
-!- bramc [~bram@38.99.42.130] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:33
-!- bramc [~bram@38.99.42.130] has quit [Client Quit]13:34
-!- prom3th3us [~prom3th3u@unaffiliated/prom3th3us] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:35
-!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: :)]13:35
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]13:40
gmaxwellamiller: have you seen the recent ripple frontrunning article? it was mildly interesting!13:43
amillerthis one: http://availableimagination.com/exploiting-ripple-transaction-ordering-for-fun-and-profit/13:44
amilleri loved it!13:44
-!- aj [aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]13:49
phantomcircuitgmaxwell, ahaha13:49
-!- aj [~aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:51
-!- LeMiner [LeMiner@unaffiliated/leminer] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]13:52
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]13:53
-!- LeMiner [LeMiner@unaffiliated/leminer] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:53
-!- aj [~aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]13:55
-!- bramc [~bram@38.99.42.130] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:55
-!- aj [aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:57
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@50.247.108.204] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:57
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@c-73-202-109-21.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards13:58
-!- prom3th3us [~prom3th3u@unaffiliated/prom3th3us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]14:03
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards14:04
-!- CodeShark [CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has quit []14:05
-!- CodeShark__ is now known as CodeShark14:05
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]14:15
-!- shesek [~shesek@77.127.57.113] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]14:17
-!- bramc [~bram@38.99.42.130] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]14:32
-!- moa [~kiwigb@opentransactions/dev/moa] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]14:33
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has joined #bitcoin-wizards14:52
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards14:56
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-47-144.dyn.MIT.EDU] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:02
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]15:02
-!- veleiro [~veleiro@fsf/member/veleiro] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]15:02
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-47-144.dyn.MIT.EDU] has quit [Client Quit]15:03
-!- veleiro1 [~veleiro@c-69-250-8-218.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:03
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:04
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Client Quit]15:05
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@ip-64-134-238-237.public.wayport.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]15:06
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:12
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:12
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]15:14
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:17
-!- damethos [~damethos@unaffiliated/damethos] has quit [Client Quit]15:19
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@76-255-129-88.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:22
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:23
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:26
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-47-144.dyn.MIT.EDU] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:29
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]15:31
-!- priidu [~priidu@unaffiliated/priidu] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]15:32
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]15:32
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:33
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]15:33
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:34
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:45
-!- maraoz [~maraoz@50.247.108.204] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]15:48
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]15:49
-!- roasbeef [~root@104.131.26.124] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]15:51
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]15:51
-!- roasbeef [~root@104.131.26.124] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:52
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards15:55
nshindirectly blockchain relevant: http://arxiv.org/pdf/1203.6502.pdf  [QUANTIFYING CAUSAL INFLUENCES: channel analysis in DAGs for a measure of causal strength]15:57
-!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has quit [Quit: Leaving]16:01
-!- Logicwax [~Logicwax@c-76-126-174-152.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]16:06
-!- Yoghur114 [~jorn@g227014.upc-g.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]16:09
-!- kmels [~kmels@186.64.110.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]16:11
-!- Logicwax [~Logicwax@c-76-126-174-152.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards16:12
-!- jtimon [~quassel@95.131.169.244] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]16:13
-!- shaul [~shaul@static-108-30-103-59.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]16:25
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]16:29
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards16:32
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]16:40
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards16:42
-!- smk [9e557647@gateway/web/freenode/ip.158.85.118.71] has quit [Quit: Page closed]16:47
-!- c0rw|away is now known as c0rw|drnk16:57
-!- c0rw|drnk is now known as c0rw|zZz16:59
-!- the`doct1r [~matt@static-108-47-15-123.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:03
-!- notj [~notj@dhcp-18-189-47-144.dyn.MIT.EDU] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]17:06
-!- the`doctor [~matt@static-108-47-15-123.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]17:06
-!- DougieBot5000 [~DougieBot@unaffiliated/dougiebot5000] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:07
-!- nwilcox [~nwilcox@c-73-202-109-21.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]17:07
-!- the`doct1r [~matt@static-108-47-15-123.lsanca.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]17:08
-!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@56-197-ftth.onsbrabantnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]17:13
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]17:18
-!- joesmoe [~joesmoe@76.73.18.156] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]17:18
-!- joesmoe [~joesmoe@76.73.18.156] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:22
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]17:22
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:28
-!- bedeho [~bedeho@50-202-37-133-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:30
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:30
-!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zlanzwisceqmqisx] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]17:34
-!- rasengan [~rasengan@eyearesee.com] has quit [Changing host]17:44
-!- rasengan [~rasengan@pdpc/corporate-sponsor/privateinternetaccess.com/rasengan] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:44
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards17:53
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]17:58
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Excess Flood]18:01
-!- nsh [~lol@wikipedia/nsh] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:04
-!- PaulCapestany [~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:19
-!- PaulCapestany [~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded]18:21
-!- belcher_ [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]18:21
-!- PaulCapestany [~PaulCapes@204.28.124.82] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:21
-!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-36-133-241-201.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]18:28
-!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-36-133-241-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:29
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]18:44
-!- orik [~orik@168.156.40.22] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:45
-!- orik [~orik@168.156.40.22] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]18:50
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:53
-!- kmels [~kmels@184.62.151.186.static.intelnet.net.gt] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:53
-!- TBI [~TBI@84.48.195.20] has joined #bitcoin-wizards18:54
-!- King_Rex [~King_Rex@unaffiliated/king-rex/x-3258444] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]18:56
-!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]19:01
-!- TBI [~TBI@84.48.195.20] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]19:03
-!- TBI [~TBI@20.84-48-195.nextgentel.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:05
-!- the`doctor [~matt@162.211.151.91] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:07
-!- zooko [~user@2600:100e:b02c:327:4491:4416:b461:1e4e] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:10
-!- dstadulis [~maider@c-73-189-234-152.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:16
-!- orik [~orik@50.125.71.245] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]19:20
-!- the`doctor [~matt@162.211.151.91] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]19:20
-!- maaku [~quassel@173-228-107-141.dsl.static.fusionbroadband.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]19:30
-!- Dr-G [~Dr-G@unaffiliated/dr-g] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:32
-!- Dr-G2 [~Dr-G@x4d08db7d.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]19:35
-!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@2605:6000:1018:c0b1:a1c9:8c88:1cd9:581f] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:36
-!- kmels [~kmels@184.62.151.186.static.intelnet.net.gt] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]19:36
-!- hazirafel [~ufoinc@176.106.227.80] has quit [Quit: Leaving]19:38
-!- zooko [~user@2600:100e:b02c:327:4491:4416:b461:1e4e] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]19:41
-!- maaku [~quassel@botbot.xen.prgmr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:44
-!- maaku is now known as Guest1853219:45
-!- Guest18532 is now known as maaku19:45
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:47
-!- CodeShark is now known as CodeShark_19:54
-!- CodeShark [CodeShark@cpe-76-167-237-202.san.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards19:54
gmaxwellhttp://smbc-comics.com/index.php?id=3878  sounds like our discussions19:58
-!- rabidus [~lauri.j@uhiainen.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]20:11
-!- sparetire_ [~sparetire@unaffiliated/sparetire] has quit [Quit: sparetire_]20:14
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards20:20
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Client Quit]20:24
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@76-255-129-88.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]20:25
-!- snthsnth [~snthsnth@c-98-207-208-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards20:28
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards20:40
-!- [7] [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has quit [Disconnected by services]20:41
-!- TheSeven [~quassel@rockbox/developer/TheSeven] has joined #bitcoin-wizards20:42
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]20:50
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards20:54
-!- orik [~orik@50-46-139-225.evrt.wa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]21:06
-!- rabidus [~lauri.j@uhiainen.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards21:29
-!- c-cex-yuriy [uid76808@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lhboignssfuxdutu] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]21:35
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]21:52
-!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@76-255-129-88.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:00
-!- paveljanik [~paveljani@unaffiliated/paveljanik] has quit [Quit: Leaving]22:04
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@216.9.110.4] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:11
-!- mjerr [~mjerr@p5B209075.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:12
-!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-36-133-241-201.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]22:27
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:29
-!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@216.9.110.4] has quit [Quit: GGuyZ]22:44
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:45
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit]22:47
-!- bramc [~bram@99-75-88-206.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]22:50
-!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cqagjdkmetvhples] has joined #bitcoin-wizards22:51
-!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]22:54
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:01
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit]23:02
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:03
-!- notj [~notj@c-76-119-235-83.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]23:14
-!- snthsnth [~snthsnth@c-98-207-208-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]23:15
-!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Excess Flood]23:33
-!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:33
-!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Excess Flood]23:35
fluffyponyso Reddit is down for maintenance, but for when it's back up: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3n6u0n/as_unlikely_as_it_might_sound_i_generated_an/23:38
fluffypony"As unlikely as it might sound, I generated an address on Blockchain.info that had been previously used."23:38
-!- Luke-Jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:38
fluffypony"Has anyone ever generated an address on Blockchain.info only to find that it had previously been used? This happened to me recently, and I've now seen $20 flow through this address that I have never used. I've been trying to get an answer from them on ZenDesk but it's been a few days and I haven't been given any answers."23:38
fluffyponyand that, kids, is why you don't code your own PRNG in Javascript...23:38
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:38
-!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Client Quit]23:39
gmaxwelloh no, _again_23:39
fluffyponygmaxwell: I am surprised and shocked...and shocked and surprised23:39
gwillengmaxwell: as the whale said to the bowl of petunias...23:43
fluffyponygwillen: now if only we knew why, exactly, the bowl of petunias thought that23:44
gmaxwelltheir code on github hasn't change since july. but it's been out of sync with the site many times.23:44
gmaxwelldid the user say what they were using?23:45
-!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:47
fluffyponygmaxwell: nope, that's the only thing they said23:51
-!- snthsnth [~snthsnth@c-98-207-208-241.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:53
-!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@56-197-ftth.onsbrabantnet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards23:58
--- Log closed Fri Oct 02 00:00:45 2015

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!