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| morcos | bramc: yes that was the argument i tried to make. look at this awesome segwit thing that we so obvioulsy are going to include. oh btw, why are we still talking about blocksize when it turns out we have twice as much capacity as we thought without doing anything. | 04:27 |
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| aj | morcos: because anything less than 8x or 20x is as good as nothing? | 05:05 |
| aj | morcos: at least, i think that's the mindset | 05:05 |
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| bramc | if depth > 220: | 13:55 |
| bramc | raise IntegrityError("Impossibly deep proof") | 13:55 |
| bramc | This is very funny out of context: raise IntegrityError("Impossibly deep proof") | 13:55 |
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| kanzure | bramc: raise IntegrityError("Impossibly deep proof with depth={}".format(depth)) <--- more information is better. | 14:03 |
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| kanzure | "Can financial engineering cure cancer?" http://lfe.mit.edu/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/CanFECureCancer2013.pdf | 15:34 |
| kanzure | "Commercializing biomedical research through securitization techniques" http://lfe.mit.edu/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/nbt2012.pdf | 15:34 |
| kanzure | sorta off-topic, but interesting. | 15:34 |
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| aj | rusty: it looks to me like in the past couple of days, 31% of txns had 10k satoshi as their fee, and another 49.7% (!) had 9999 satoshi as their fee (ie fixed fee independent of size in bytes) | 16:31 |
| rusty | aj: wow, what is producing those?! | 16:31 |
| * rusty needs to revisit his heuristics then... | 16:32 | |
| rusty | aj: Don't tell me there's some wallet out there advertising lower fees than their competitors? :) | 16:32 |
| aj | rusty: maybe think of it as "not just advertising lower fees, but following through on that promise!" ? >_< | 16:33 |
| rusty | aj: "Now with dynamic fee support*" * - Fees will be adjusted on every new wallet release. | 16:34 |
| aj | rusty: oh, hey, i wonder how many actually blocks have their transactions order by decreasing fee-per-byte | 16:36 |
| rusty | aj: I graphed a recent v4 block, it was exactly as expected. | 16:36 |
| rusty | aj: a few priority txs at the front, then descending fee-per-byte, with about 20 little spikes where a dependent tx immediately followed its parent. | 16:37 |
| rusty | (I cut it from the HK tlk for lack of time, but let me dig it up) | 16:37 |
| rusty | aj: http://ozlabs.org/~rusty/diagrams/feerate.svg | 16:38 |
| aj | rusty: interesting. with CPFP would expect those peaks to be accompanied by troughs... | 16:39 |
| aj | rusty: (also, have you heard of log scales? :) | 16:40 |
| rusty | aj: yes. | 16:40 |
| rusty | aj: log scales are deceptive. Better to zoom in on the data you care about. | 16:40 |
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| aj | rusty: well i'll grant you they don't work so well when some fees are 0, but so long as you think in terms of "they're paying twice/half as much" i don't think they're deceptive... | 16:42 |
| rusty | aj: you always need a big disclaimer on log graphs. Sure, sometimes it's worth it, but generally I want to see the raw, zero-based data *first*, before any massaging like log scale or moving axes. | 16:43 |
| bramc | I'm making it so that valid proofs of inclusion and exclusion are canonical: That is, there's exactly one valid proof of either inclusion or exclusion with no variation possible. I don't know if this property is important for anything, but I can make it happen so I'm doing it. | 16:44 |
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| aj | rusty: oh, huh, median/percentile fees should be calculated by byte number rather than transaction number i guess | 16:52 |
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| rusty | aj: that graph is satoshi-per-kb. | 16:55 |
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| aj | rusty: satoshi-per-kb vs kb right? yeah, that's the right way to do it, but not how i was thinking | 16:58 |
| rusty | aj: Yeah, graphing x axis on byte offset would give a nice representation (area underneath == total fees). | 16:59 |
| kanzure | segwit bip draft pull request https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/pull/265 | 17:01 |
| bramc | It's a little odd to not be able to say where most of the transactions in the blockchain are coming from even when they have a very obvious commonality. That lends credence to the theory that most of the transactions in the blockchain are garbage. | 17:03 |
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| el33th4x0r | kanzure: thanks for the pointer to the pull request | 17:14 |
| el33th4x0r | "Transmission of signature data becomes optional" this doesn't sound like the right message to send out in a BIP. | 17:15 |
| kanzure | https://bitcoin.org/en/bitcoin-core/capacity-increases-faq | 17:17 |
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| brg444 | can I have a link for the segwit BIP? | 19:13 |
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| el33th4x0r | segwit bip draft pull request https://github.com/bitcoin/bips/pull/265 | 19:17 |
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| brg444 | thanks | 19:27 |
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| tulip | bramc: that's probably not the wrong thought to have. | 20:31 |
| tulip | recently it looks like a miner has removed their IsStandard checks and is mining stunningly large transactions. 568df930d2f7c930c0c31cc13a09f140ee541bd1859b34f59cb2a600609dd84d for example is almost 200KB and has 5000 (!) outputs. | 20:31 |
| bramc | tulip, That's odd, did it have a decent transaction fee? | 20:33 |
| tulip | zero. | 20:33 |
| tulip | it's likely that one was accepted out of band and had the fee paid some other way. there's a good number of crazy large transactions around, and have been for years, which seem to have no objective other than filling blocks. | 20:35 |
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| maaku | looks like a mining payout | 20:50 |
| maaku | mined by f2pool, and wangchun was saying earlier that he was trying to keep certain transactions in mempool | 20:51 |
| maaku | this would explain it | 20:51 |
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| tulip | could be. | 20:58 |
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| bramc | Note to self: Don't forget about branch nodes. That's kind of an important case. | 21:29 |
| bramc | I now have notes on my memory format in a comment in the code instead of scrawled on paper. This feels like a big improvement. | 21:29 |
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