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| --- Day changed Thu Apr 28 2016 | ||
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| fluffypony | https://bitslog.wordpress.com/2016/04/28/uncle-mining-an-ethereum-consensus-protocol-flaw/ | 02:13 |
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| instagibbs | bsm1175321, have you read the DECOR+ paper | 13:46 |
| instagibbs | sounds very slightly braidish, and was wondering if you could tldr it | 13:46 |
| instagibbs | Sergio is claiming it's much more resistant to selfish mining, might warrant a look | 13:47 |
| katu | instagibbs: vitalik had a lot of blabbing about it before i think | 13:49 |
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| instagibbs | katu, but he apparently didn't use it, and instead used something more broken? | 13:53 |
| instagibbs | (according to Sergio) | 13:53 |
| katu | personally i think its useless complexity which adds nothing of value. the whole notion that orphan hashrate is somehow "wasted" is ludicruous. | 13:54 |
| katu | top hashrate nodes are merely incentivized to exchange blocks fast. as long they have all equal chance in visibility, orphans are simply invisible loss. | 13:55 |
| katu | aka orphans penalize your shitty connectivity, so better fix that. | 13:55 |
| katu | (invisible, as in, spreads out equally) | 13:55 |
| belcher | wouldnt that mean all the miners end up physically close to each other ? | 13:56 |
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| katu | belcher: even better, they can enforce latencies in tit-for-tat fashion. so you'd get a cloud where everyone has 50ms equal with each another. | 13:57 |
| katu | remember oldschool dota? it worked like this. | 13:57 |
| belcher | what does that mean? enforcing latencies | 13:58 |
| belcher | why do miners do that | 13:58 |
| katu | belcher: if they want fairness, they should run consensus to establish equal grounds. | 14:00 |
| katu | this is all assuming very low block times which would call for much more structured, not merely ad-hoc, network topology | 14:00 |
| katu | in broad sense, it would separate the problem into different domain, with no need to actually polute the block chain with it | 14:01 |
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| instagibbs | katu, i don't "care" about orphans, but I care about "unfair" mining strategies | 14:17 |
| instagibbs | fast block times don't interest me | 14:18 |
| katu | its not like cheating, its geography | 14:18 |
| belcher | increase block interval to 1h | 14:18 |
| katu | what belcher said, simplest solution | 14:18 |
| instagibbs | belcher, if mining hashrate didn't change much, that might be a good idea yeah | 14:18 |
| instagibbs | problem is new hashrate will get deprecated while you still have high variance | 14:18 |
| katu | but up to minute is manageable - with 100ms block propagation jitter theres almost no "unfairness" | 14:18 |
| katu | that is, measurable one | 14:18 |
| instagibbs | block propagation isn't nearly that good today | 14:19 |
| katu | its good enough for bitcoin | 14:19 |
| katu | but for rapid fire block intervals, really think about fixing network topology first | 14:19 |
| katu | for example self-organize according to "heard it from there first" bias | 14:20 |
| katu | and perhaps avoid transmitting whole blocks, you can simply blindly trust its hash and verify as the rest its txes arrive later (meanwhile you already mine on top of it). | 14:22 |
| katu | if some peer abuses this window, simply drop em, that way they get isolated and their cheating gets counter productive | 14:22 |
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| --- Log closed Fri Apr 29 00:00:00 2016 | ||
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