--- Day changed Thu Jan 05 2017 00:32 -!- juscamarena [~justin@47.148.176.74] has joined #joinmarket 00:33 -!- juscamarena [~justin@47.148.176.74] has quit [Client Quit] 00:35 -!- juscamarena__ [~justin@47.148.176.74] has joined #joinmarket 00:35 -!- juscamarena_ [~justin@47.148.176.74] has joined #joinmarket 00:35 -!- juscamarena__ [~justin@47.148.176.74] has quit [Client Quit] 00:36 -!- waxwing [~waxwing@62.205.214.125] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:44 -!- waxwing [~waxwing@62.205.214.125] has joined #joinmarket 03:21 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:21 -!- luke-jr [~luke-jr@unaffiliated/luke-jr] has joined #joinmarket 03:34 < waxwing> lebeev: that was kinda rude. if you don't like the product, you can request a full refund :) 03:34 < waxwing> belcher: seems like you missed my update, i'll copy/paste here: 03:34 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:50:27 just to update people on https://github.com/AdamISZ/joinmarket-clientserver and https://github.com/AdamISZ/electrum-joinmarket-plugin : 03:34 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:50:50 for the former, it has sendpayment and tumbler (although i'm kind of merging the roles of these a bit) working; see scripts/README.md for instructions on usage 03:34 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:51:28 the daemon/client interaction and the IRC are now all using twisted instead of threads 03:34 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:51:47 the test suite is pretty thorough now 03:35 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:52:48 the plugin is working (well, it was before), i'm just trying to boil down the install as much as possible. i find i can get it working on a fresh ubuntu vm fine by just taking the release from each repo and running now. if anyone tries to run it as per the README let me know how it goes 03:35 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:53:27 although there are still lots of bits and pieces to improve, i think i'll get Joinmarket-Qt back working, because in theory i think it'll be fairly easy. 03:35 < waxwing> Dec 28 16:54:06 oh another thing, although it's "client/server", the scripts can be run as one process (client and server just run together), it's controllable as a config var, explained in the readme for the scripts 03:39 < waxwing> you were thinking of ghtdak who doesn't seem to lurk any more here, but hat tip to him for the IRC twisted code, that was useful. 03:39 < adlai> "that's a lot of letters" 03:39 < lebeev> waxwing: I don't think it's rude, it's a fine product and of tremendous value to me but the current joinmarket code is just objectively a mess 03:39 < waxwing> it was a pleasant surprise that almost zero change was needed to message_channel.py to do that. 03:39 < adlai> lebeev: you think jm's bad, have you tried reading the underlayer? and i'm not talking about irc, nor secp256k1 03:40 < waxwing> lebeev: well "a mess" is not an objective measure. i tend to agree, in various senses, which is why i think refactoring is important, and why i'm doing it. 03:42 < waxwing> lebeev: so since i at least partly agree, calling it rude is a bit off, let's just say, prefer to make constructive criticisms :) 03:45 < waxwing> i'm adding a tumbler interface now, before "renewing" the JM-Qt binaries as before. although no promises for TAILS, since there's a few new dependencies (twisted for one!) 03:45 < adlai> ;;seen tailsjoin-xt 03:46 < waxwing> lebeev: i should also mention that repo is specifically being worked on to support Taker functionality, there is no Maker as yet; it won't be hard to add it back, but deferring it (no pun intended) 03:46 * adlai giggles 03:46 < adlai> at least makers have an incentive to improve their code 03:46 < waxwing> :) 03:55 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: phantomcircuit, fluffypony, bad_duck, pigeons 03:55 -!- Netsplit over, joins: bad_duck 03:55 -!- Netsplit over, joins: pigeons 03:56 -!- Netsplit over, joins: phantomcircuit 03:56 -!- fluffypony [~fluffypon@coreteam.getmonero.org] has joined #joinmarket 03:56 -!- pigeons is now known as Guest73955 03:56 -!- fluffypony [~fluffypon@coreteam.getmonero.org] has quit [Changing host] 03:56 -!- fluffypony [~fluffypon@unaffiliated/fluffypony] has joined #joinmarket 04:09 < waxwing> ooh that's interesting, last two messages on this chan are in the opposite order on the other side of the bridge (on cgan) 04:29 -!- swulf-- [~Unknown@180.183.152.158] has joined #joinmarket 04:32 -!- swulf-- [~Unknown@180.183.152.158] has left #joinmarket ["Leaving"] 04:40 < waxwing> nopara is really quite irrepressible :) https://youtu.be/4IRp90sntiM 06:11 -!- quitobro [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has joined #joinmarket 06:15 -!- gowness [~gowness@herp.xyz] has quit [Quit: smokebomb] 06:15 -!- gowness [~gowness@herp.xyz] has joined #joinmarket 06:17 -!- quitobro_ [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has joined #joinmarket 06:17 -!- quitobro_ [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has quit [Client Quit] 06:18 < quitobro> morning guys :) 06:19 -!- Giszmo [~leo@46.128.114.214.dynamic.cablesurf.de] has joined #joinmarket 06:24 < quitobro> for the makers in the room: what % of your BTC holdings do you offer thru joinmarket for joins? 06:35 < waxwing> quitobro: not too much; it is a hot wallet after all. i mean, i haven't heard of anyone losing coins via joinmarket yet, but you can't be too careful. 06:35 < waxwing> savings should be in some variant of a cold wallet. 06:35 < waxwing> i mean a lot of bitcoiner type people are crazy risk tolerant, but, shrug, it's up to you. 06:36 < quitobro> good point. if someone compromised my VPS they'd still need either the mnemonic or the passphrase right? but yea i'm not really a security expert more of an amateur 06:36 < waxwing> you shouldn't really use a vps for this type of thing. you don't have full control over that machine. 06:43 < quitobro> it looks like my yg script isn't making my full BTC balance available for offers. what gives? 06:47 < quitobro> what do you guys (makers) out there set for your max mix depth? when you deposit BTC to your coinjoin wallet, do you split it 5 ways to a particular mix depth? 06:52 < quitobro> lastly, what kind of annualized return are you guys earning (makers again)? 06:55 < quitobro> just to confirm - a 'mixdepth' is a block of addresses when you run the wallet tool, right? e.g. all the addresses at `m/0/3/0/000, m/0/3/0/001, m/0/3/0/002, m/0/3/0/003, m/0/3/0/004, m/0/3/0/005` 08:39 -!- quitobro_ [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has joined #joinmarket 08:40 -!- quitobro_ [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has quit [Client Quit] 09:40 -!- instagibbs [~instagibb@pool-100-15-114-3.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:19 -!- Guest73955 is now known as pigeons 10:42 < quitobro> just to confirm - a 'mixdepth' is a block of addresses when you run the wallet tool, right? e.g. all the addresses at `m/0/3/0/000, m/0/3/0/001, m/0/3/0/002, m/0/3/0/003, m/0/3/0/004, m/0/3/0/005` 10:42 < quitobro> *ping!* 10:42 < waxwing> yeah that's right 10:45 < quitobro> thanks @waxwing 10:46 < quitobro> @waxwing and i should deposit coins to the largest mixdepth, i.e. n = 5 10:46 < quitobro> the group which starts with m/0/4/0/000 10:47 < quitobro> for more join combos? 10:47 < waxwing> no, generally it's fine to just deposit to mixdepth 0 10:47 < waxwing> doesn't matter too much, over time your coins will spread out over the mixdepths 10:47 < quitobro> and i don't want to deposit to the 'internal' addresses right 10:47 < waxwing> this is by design it makes for better privacy for everyone 10:47 < waxwing> quitobro: read the guides on the wiki 10:48 < quitobro> i have but i'll re-read 'em 10:48 < waxwing> https://github.com/chris-belcher/joinmarket/wiki/Using-the-JoinMarket-internal-wallet 10:48 < quitobro> tx 11:18 < quitobro> some more q's 11:18 < quitobro> 1. what kind of annualized return are you guys earning (makers again)? 11:18 < quitobro> 2. are you guys running your bots on a VPS or like a local machine? 11:20 < quitobro> 3. additional bitcoins i deposit to any arbitrary mixdepth will be picked up by a running yield-gen script. y/n? 11:33 < waxwing> 3 yes 2 local 1 1% has been reported as common 11:41 < belcher> nice code waxwing 11:41 < belcher> the joinmarket-clientserver stuff, read over it a bit now 11:42 < waxwing> thanks; i think i said a while back, some of the design decisions are quite debatable, but just pressing ahead on the basis things can be changed later. 11:43 < waxwing> i've got tumble on the qt thing *basically* working now. i quite like this approach: the Taker has a schedule, so it's sort of by default a sequence rather than 1. and then, in schedule.py just ported in your tumble algo to generate. 11:44 < waxwing> what is not present is recovery; but i have this theory that, we can have it restart after re-reading the status of the wallet, if the previous run fails. 11:44 < belcher> yes i saw that, probably a good way to combine them 11:45 < waxwing> i guess that was inspired by the "idempotent" guy. it seems highly debatable what the right thing to do is. but i guess that is a valid approach. 11:45 < waxwing> don't see any reason why recovery couldn't be put back in if that was the right way. 11:46 < belcher> no reason i can see, i tried to do it a while ago but realised you need to use listtransactions and it would take a lot of new coded so i put it off 11:47 < waxwing> ok, i haven't thought about it yet. would it not be enough to read the current wallet contents, and generate a new schedule? ah i guess you mean because of destinations. 11:47 < waxwing> yeah. as you can see, haven't thought it through yet :) 11:48 < belcher> iv forgotten, i think its something like that 11:48 < belcher> back then i thought it could be done with a simple few lines but realised you need listtransactions 11:48 < waxwing> well, certainly the "first run" let's say could have persisted the successful txs anyway. perhaps augment the schedule file with a "completed" flag. 11:48 < belcher> which is fine, all wallets and blockchaininterfaces could have something like listtransactions 11:48 < waxwing> i think if you just persist on completion of each tx, it'd be enough, no? 11:49 < waxwing> that + wallet sync should give you all you need to know. 11:49 < belcher> there might be a time where the user ctrl+c's the tumbler when an unconfirmed tx happens, then the tumbler code doesnt see the confirmation so doesnt update the file 11:49 < belcher> though wait thats not the only way 11:50 < belcher> put a flag in the file "waiting for confirmation" and check next time it starts 11:50 < waxwing> i'd have in mind "completed" here as being broadcast 11:50 < belcher> got it 11:50 < belcher> ok 11:55 < belcher> waxwing check pm? 12:06 < adlai> messages on this chan are in the opposite order on the other side of the bridge <<<< if only we had some mechanism for agreeing on the ordering of messages 12:06 < belcher> lebeev in your view would/did using twister fix your perception that the code is a mess? 12:07 < waxwing> adlai: i quite like alphabetical 12:08 < waxwing> s/twister/twisted (that rings a bell actually there was some software called "twister" a couple of years back, and i don't mean mersenne) 12:08 < belcher> ah 12:08 < belcher> i agree some of the threads can be a bit messy and twisted is a nice alternative 12:08 < belcher> though code involving threads can be easier to understand sometimes 12:09 < waxwing> Q wasn't to me, but my feeling is: it helps corral complexity quite well. i guess the main drawback is a chunk of extra dependency, and the tracebacks can be .. interesting. 12:09 < belcher> plus little things like when tumbler.py asks for new destination addresses, if that also hangs the irc thread so it cant respond to pings, it would be disconnected from the server 12:09 < waxwing> but as you probably remember, my reason for making a new repo with a new structure wasn't principally about that. 12:09 < belcher> okay 12:10 < waxwing> here's one aspect of what's difficult in doing things like GUIs with the existing struct: there are things like raw_input() in places like wallet 12:10 < belcher> when i was fixing the patientsendpayment code now that 0.2 is live, i had a thought that it has a lot of duplicated stuff and is generally not very nice code 12:10 < waxwing> i.e. user interface not separated from library 12:10 < belcher> yep, agreed thats bad 12:10 < waxwing> duplication is another thing yeah, but that is a lot easier to address, it's just a question of doing it. 12:11 < waxwing> and it's one of those things that gets more annoying the longer you leave it, oh well, such is life :) 12:11 < belcher> should be a callback or class really, so the gui can override it with its own function that calls a QDialogBox or whatever 12:12 < waxwing> well i guess the other points i had in mind are explained in the para. at the start of the jm-cs readme 12:12 < belcher> i will read it 12:15 -!- instagibbs [~instagibb@pool-100-15-114-3.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #joinmarket 13:14 < quitobro> @belcher @waxwing i sent more BTC to my coinjoin wallet, but it isn't showing up as add'l max BTC volume in my yield gen offer 13:14 < belcher> next time it does sync_unspent() it will show up 14:10 < quitobro> @belcher by 'it' you mean the market itself? 14:10 < belcher> next time the yieldgen does sync_unspent() it will show up 14:33 -!- coins123 [~coins123@31.157.118.187] has joined #joinmarket 14:33 -!- coins123 [~coins123@31.157.118.187] has quit [Changing host] 14:33 -!- coins123 [~coins123@unaffiliated/coins123] has joined #joinmarket 14:36 < quitobro> @belcher ok or i could restart the yield gen i imagine 14:36 < belcher> that will also work 14:36 < belcher> would speed it up too if you dont feel like waiting for whenever the next time it calls sync_unspent() is 17:03 -!- quitobro [640c6e95@gateway/web/freenode/ip.100.12.110.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:07 -!- jdm_ [~jdm@unaffiliated/user1138] has joined #joinmarket 17:07 -!- jdm_ [~jdm@unaffiliated/user1138] has left #joinmarket ["Leaving"] 17:13 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: belcher, rotarydialer, midnightmagic, owowo, Lightsword, nanotube 17:14 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: iinaj, HugsNotDrugs, dserrano5, nkuttler, weex 17:14 -!- owowo [ovovo@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-sutgtiqxmxirkvkc] has joined #joinmarket 17:14 -!- Netsplit over, joins: dserrano5 17:14 -!- owowo [ovovo@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-sutgtiqxmxirkvkc] has quit [Changing host] 17:14 -!- owowo [ovovo@unaffiliated/ovovo] has joined #joinmarket 17:14 -!- owowo [ovovo@unaffiliated/ovovo] has quit [Changing host] 17:14 -!- owowo [ovovo@gateway/vpn/mullvad/x-sutgtiqxmxirkvkc] has joined #joinmarket 17:16 -!- Netsplit over, joins: belcher 17:16 -!- Netsplit over, joins: Lightsword 17:17 -!- Netsplit over, joins: midnightmagic 17:18 -!- Netsplit over, joins: rotarydialer 17:20 -!- Netsplit over, joins: nkuttler 17:23 -!- nanotube [~nanotube@unaffiliated/nanotube] has joined #joinmarket 17:26 -!- weex [sid152634@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hwspwgtjicsnfblt] has joined #joinmarket 17:26 -!- iinaj [sid110431@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-przmpgcycnvfxafp] has joined #joinmarket 17:26 -!- weex is now known as Guest29511 18:46 -!- Guest29511 is now known as weex 18:46 -!- weex [sid152634@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hwspwgtjicsnfblt] has quit [Changing host] 18:46 -!- weex [sid152634@fsf/member/weex] has joined #joinmarket 18:46 -!- Giszmo [~leo@46.128.114.214.dynamic.cablesurf.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:16 -!- swulf-- [~Unknown@180.183.152.158] has joined #joinmarket 20:21 -!- swulf-- [~Unknown@180.183.152.158] has left #joinmarket [] 21:06 -!- puddinpop [~puddinpop@unaffiliated/puddinpop] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:44 -!- zmachine [uid67411@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gbpueiqczvyktglu] has joined #joinmarket 23:44 < waxwing> https://www.reddit.com/r/joinmarket/comments/5m6izf/importing_119000_addresses_into_account/