--- Day changed Tue Mar 21 2017 00:19 -!- juscamarena_ is now known as juscamarena 00:49 -!- Yohkii [~Yohkii@unaffiliated/yohkii] has joined #joinmarket 00:53 -!- xcvvcx [53e42f33@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.228.47.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:53 -!- q-biq_ [q-biq@153.92.126.244] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:01 -!- q-biq [q-biq@153.92.126.244] has joined #joinmarket 01:01 -!- q-biq [q-biq@153.92.126.244] has quit [Changing host] 01:01 -!- q-biq [q-biq@unaffiiliated/q-biq] has joined #joinmarket 01:12 -!- Michail1 [~michail@michail.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 01:22 -!- q-biq [q-biq@unaffiiliated/q-biq] has quit [Quit: mirkk] 01:23 -!- q-biq [q-biq@153.92.126.244] has joined #joinmarket 01:23 -!- q-biq [q-biq@153.92.126.244] has quit [Changing host] 01:23 -!- q-biq [q-biq@unaffiiliated/q-biq] has joined #joinmarket 01:38 -!- Yohkii [~Yohkii@unaffiliated/yohkii] has quit [Quit: Mutter: www.mutterirc.com] 02:04 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@62.90-149-73.nextgentel.com] has joined #joinmarket 02:09 -!- xcvvcx [53e42f33@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.228.47.51] has joined #joinmarket 02:35 -!- Michail1 [~michail@michail.com] has joined #joinmarket 02:52 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:05 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #joinmarket 03:17 < nkuttler> um, can't i change the password for an existing wallet? 03:19 < nkuttler> never mind.. didn't get an error on non-existing wallet 03:47 -!- yamaguchino [~yamaguchi@203.205.48.217] has joined #joinmarket 04:26 -!- FASDFSF [~FASDFSF@unaffiliated/fasdfsf] has joined #joinmarket 05:04 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:17 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 05:19 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has joined #joinmarket 05:29 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@62.90-149-73.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 06:18 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:23 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:27 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:27 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:32 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:37 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:41 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:42 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:46 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:46 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:50 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:51 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:55 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 06:56 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:00 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:00 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:05 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:05 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:09 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:10 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:14 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:14 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:19 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:19 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:23 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:23 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:25 -!- OverlordQ [~ovrlrdq@mediawiki/OverlordQ] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:26 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 07:29 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 07:47 -!- andytosh2 is now known as andytoshi 08:21 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:24 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has joined #joinmarket 08:32 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #joinmarket 08:34 < Michail1> I see absoffer and reloffer as messages. I also see hp2, but can't find that in the code. What is that? 08:49 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:05 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has joined #joinmarket 09:05 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has quit [Client Quit] 09:24 < ananteris> just running "python wallet-tool.py wallet.json" to show my level-0 addresses is hanging forever at "importing 200 addresses into account ..." 09:24 < ananteris> is that normal? 09:25 < weex> hanging forever is not normal 09:25 < ananteris> for a first run using bitcoin-rpc ?? 09:25 < weex> i'm not sure, maybe check if bitcoind's busy? 09:25 < weex> does bitcoin-cli getinfo come back quick? 09:26 < weex> i do believe it has to import them to bitcoind's wallet 09:26 < weex> but i'm not sure how/when it does that 09:28 < waxwing> is the bitcoind instance synced ananteris ? 09:29 < waxwing> Michail1: the hp2 message is a privacy preserving commitment to a utxo, used for rate limiting to prevent spying attacks. 09:30 < waxwing> but it's sent by a different maker than the one who receives the request, you'll see some function like transfer_commitment 09:31 < ananteris> weex: there's about a 2s delay for bitcoin-cli getinfo 09:31 < ananteris> waxwing: it's synced, and pruned down to 2G 09:33 < ananteris> got it 09:33 < ananteris> the IO is shit on this machine but it works.. just really slow, ty for the responses 09:33 < waxwing> huh, that does sound bad. 09:34 < waxwing> ananteris: hang on, did you set bitcoin-rpc in the config? 09:34 < waxwing> i guess you must, otherwise the log messages would have told you. 09:35 < ananteris> yeah, it's all configured correctly but the system is under a lot of load, it's just barely running is all 09:50 -!- MaxSan [~one@185.9.19.107] has joined #joinmarket 09:51 < ananteris> does the tumbler randomize output sizes for addresses?? eg if you start it with three addrs at level-0 each with .1BTC, and specify 2 output addresses.. will they each have .15BTC or some random percentage of the total .3 09:53 < weex> it's random 09:53 < waxwing> yeah it's a power law distribution 09:54 < waxwing> the tumbler algorithm attempts to address amount and timing correlation attack by randomising 09:55 < ananteris> is it known if increasing your number of output addresses increases your privacy past a certain point? 09:55 < waxwing> well reducing it to 1 is certainly a bad idea :) 09:55 < waxwing> and more is generally going to be better 09:56 < waxwing> there's a wiki page (most likely you've read it?) 09:57 < ananteris> I have, was just wondering if any really smart people had figured out that you don't gain any more privacy past X or something 09:58 < waxwing> i see. i wouldn't imagine there's some cutoff like that. you might find my tumbler_privacy.md interesting if you're trying to guage the strengths/weaknesses of the algo. or maybe not. 09:58 < waxwing> one thing's for sure, i will never remember whether it's guage or gauge 09:58 < waxwing> stupid word 10:02 < ananteris> english is tarded like that 10:04 < ananteris> what's not really clear in the wiki is the transaction costs, it mentions more coins being more expensive but is that actually the case? why? wouldn't it require the same old regular transaction fee for higher BTC amounts? 10:05 < waxwing> more coins more expensive? no it doesn't say that does it? 10:05 < waxwing> are you talking about the paragraph at the start with a warning about fees? 10:06 < waxwing> i was trying to point out that for *low* amounts, bitcoin transaction fees dominate, and can lead to a very large cost. for high amounts, coinjoin fees may dominate and are much more likely to be reasonable. 10:06 < waxwing> on the former point, the number of counterparties * the number of transactions determines how big the tx fees are going to be. 10:06 < ananteris> I guess it doesn't the second paragraph reads like the percentage changes 10:06 < waxwing> it was written several months ago, of course the numbers are worse today. 10:07 < ananteris> roughly how many transactions are required for a tumble? is the default insane_txfee field in joinmarket.cfg still insane? 10:08 < waxwing> absurd_fee_per_kb was 150000 which is too low now, i think we merged a bump to 250000 (?) in develop. anyway, you can just reset it. 10:08 < ananteris> 250000 is about right these days? 10:08 < waxwing> how many: default settings iirc lead to ~ 10 txs; but obv parameter settings will change it and there is some randomness by default (which you can remove if you like) 10:09 < waxwing> yeah i'd say that's reasonable as a sanity check today. up to you. 10:09 < waxwing> it deliberately crashes if your estimate is above it, so bear that in mind. 10:09 < ananteris> does it crash before it starts or sometime during 10:11 < waxwing> when it gets the estimate, so each tx 10:12 < ananteris> is tx_fees=3 still wise? 10:13 < ananteris> ah nm, that just uses bitcoind to get a dynamic price it looks like 10:13 < waxwing> i think so. i'd go between 3 and 10 depending on the use-case. some people use even higher, but the difference between 10 and 15 is likely negligible. 10:14 < Michail1> waxwing - thanks re: hp2 10:14 < waxwing> of course you *could* argue that super-low fees is antisocial, but i don't think anyone is going to argue that too seriously. 10:15 < waxwing> and the real super-low fees would even be way lower than the 10-15 estimate from core most likely. 10:33 < GithubBot5678> [joinmarket] AdamISZ pushed 2 new commits to develop: https://git.io/vyxid 10:33 < GithubBot5678> joinmarket/develop f0f84a6 Peter Banik: fix for minsize > maxsize AssertionError in yield generators 10:33 < GithubBot5678> joinmarket/develop f961e4d Adam Gibson: Merge #720: fix for minsize > maxsize AssertionError in yield generators... 10:35 < Michail1> Is there a benefit to having 50 vs 5 bitcoins in the joinmarket wallet? 10:42 < Michail1> Also, what address should I add more coins to? Meaning, I read that it should be at 0 depth. Example send various amounts of coins (because of the 20% issue) to: m/0/0/0/000, m/0/1/0/000, m/0/2/0/000, m/0/3/0/000, m/0/4/0/000 respectively? 10:46 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:46 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 10:47 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:49 -!- stachrom [55c3ffee@gateway/web/freenode/ip.85.195.255.238] has joined #joinmarket 10:50 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 10:55 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 10:55 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 10:56 < waxwing> if you're running a yield generator it doesn't matter too much, the 20% issue only applies to Takers not Makers. 10:57 < waxwing> just send the coins to 1 address is fine for that. 11:00 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 11:00 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 11:05 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 11:05 -!- akrmn [~akrmn@106.red-83-61-222.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #joinmarket 11:05 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:05 < Michail1> Maker: Ok, but how to add coins to the generator? Not to the original addy I sent to. Pick m/0/1/0/000 (first address is next external wallet) OR to m/0/0/0/001 (the next addy in the first HD wallet)? 11:05 < Michail1> ban Numin0us $#fix_connection :) 11:08 < waxwing> it doesn't matter too much. you can send to either. over time the coins will spread over the mixdepths. you can add to the same mixdepth if you like, just don't reuse an address (so, the second of your options is fine) 11:09 < Michail1> got it. 11:09 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:10 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 11:10 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:10 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 11:21 -!- MaxSan [~one@185.9.19.107] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:25 < ananteris> is there a "correct" way to pause/restart tumbling? or to adjust transaction fees while it's tumbling? 11:25 < pigeons> ctrl-c :) 11:26 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has joined #joinmarket 11:27 < waxwing> if you use the tumbler as described here: https://github.com/AdamISZ/joinmarket-clientserver/blob/master/docs/tumblerguide.md you can use --restart. also applies to the joinmarket-qt version. 11:31 < sturles> Installation instructions don't work on the latest Debian release. pip install -r requirements.txt claims: your setuptools is too old (<12) 11:32 < waxwing> you mean for main joinmarket repo right 11:32 < sturles> Yes. 11:32 < waxwing> iirc that'll be to do with secp256k1 11:32 < sturles> And libnacl 11:34 < ananteris> if you just ctrl-c out, is it best to way until your transactions in mempool actually get 5 blocks long?? 11:34 < ananteris> (before restarting with a higher tx fee rate) 11:36 < sturles> Actually just secp256k1. 11:36 < sturles> Any way around this? 11:36 < sturles> I hate to replace debian packages with something I have to keep up to date myself. 11:37 < sturles> Or perhaps this is the error?: pkg_resources.VersionConflict: (cffi 0.8.6 (/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages), Requirement.parse('cffi>=1.3.0')) 11:38 < Michail1> sturles - Mine is a fresh clean install of debian. For some reason secp256 took a while to install. no progress indicator, etc. 11:38 < ananteris> ugh... tumble.py has no option --restart 11:38 < sturles> Michail1: I don't worry about progress indicators. This just fails. 11:39 < sturles> Removing python-cffi means removal of: python-cffi python-cryptography python-ndg-httpsclient python-openssl 11:39 -!- andytoshi [~apoelstra@wpsoftware.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:39 -!- andytoshi [~apoelstra@unaffiliated/andytoshi] has joined #joinmarket 11:40 < waxwing> ananteris: 3 things, one note the info at the bottom of the tumbler wiki page, 2 there is a PR open 714 with a restart feature, 3 there is a --restart feature in the version I linked above. 11:42 < sturles> pip install --upgrade cffi fixed it! 11:42 < waxwing> sturles: yeah you just need to install secp256k1 somehow; i remember having similar problems in some environments, and indeed i remember problems with cffi being too old (e.g. windows) 11:42 < waxwing> ah great 11:42 < waxwing> somehow or other it was going to be possible 11:42 < Michail1> I didn't have 'that' issue. My install is 4 days old. Glad you got it. 11:55 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:59 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 12:03 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 12:04 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 12:08 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 12:08 -!- Numin0us_ [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:12 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:17 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 12:27 -!- rdymac [uid31665@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vktdjcgftlcwgcsk] has joined #joinmarket 13:05 -!- FASDFSF [~FASDFSF@unaffiliated/fasdfsf] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:11 -!- MaxSan [~one@46.19.137.116] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 13:13 < ananteris> hmmm... so if you have a tumble that was interrupted, and you have coins mixed at depth 0 and 1, whats the correct way to fix it with the default client? 13:14 < waxwing> again, see the note at the bottom of the wiki page 13:17 < ananteris> the note at the bottom only says how to view the keys with wallet-tools 13:17 < waxwing> https://github.com/JoinMarket-Org/joinmarket/wiki/Step-by-step-running-the-tumbler#tips--further use the -m flag to SEE higher 13:20 < ananteris> should probably be "use" instead, i thought that was reffering to wallet-tools.py 13:20 < waxwing> no, that part is referring to wallet-tool 13:21 < waxwing> but yes, it's also -m to specify tumbler start mixdepth. 13:22 < ananteris> do you accept PR's for the wiki? 13:22 < waxwing> you can edit it directly, but i don't believe github has PRs for wikis, no 13:22 < waxwing> if you want to edit it, you can just let us know here i guess, that's one simple way 13:23 < waxwing> it's a point of annoyance actually that github notification doesn't alert on wiki edits, does it? 13:24 < waxwing> (that Q to anyone :) ) 13:56 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has joined #joinmarket 14:12 -!- MaxSan [~one@213.152.161.181] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:35 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:a13f:8188:f469:ba12] has joined #joinmarket 15:31 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:a13f:8188:f469:ba12] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:51 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:78d1:8bfb:b4ea:b8b] has joined #joinmarket 15:53 < ananteris> if a tumble is running correctly should you ever see failures to source commitments? 16:17 -!- MaxSan [~one@91.214.169.69] has joined #joinmarket 17:10 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:11 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-240-13-215-201.cm.vtr.net] has joined #joinmarket 17:11 < Michail1> re: wiki - no, it doesn't. I know it's been requested many times. 17:20 < Michail1> https://help.github.com/articles/about-notifications/ --- not the wiki though 17:45 < belcher> it's a point of annoyance actually that github notification doesn't alert on wiki edits, does it? <---- it does for me 17:51 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:01 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:78d1:8bfb:b4ea:b8b] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:26 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:c84f:637c:a539:8948] has joined #joinmarket 18:28 < Michail1> belcher - not from what I can find unless you setup specific requests 18:28 < Michail1> https://github.com/gogits/gogs/issues/2216 18:28 < Michail1> a service hook 18:29 < Michail1> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8407917/how-can-you-track-or-be-notified-of-changes-to-github-wikis 18:44 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has joined #joinmarket 19:01 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:c84f:637c:a539:8948] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 19:36 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:81d4:d3d4:bd70:694f] has joined #joinmarket 20:04 -!- Numin0us [~Numin0us@unaffiliated/numin0us] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:16 -!- cbits_ [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:215e:8be1:3488:df70] has joined #joinmarket 20:20 -!- cbits [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:81d4:d3d4:bd70:694f] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:32 -!- hugsnotdrugs1 [~afree@c-67-171-137-67.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined #joinmarket 20:50 -!- cbits_ [~cbits@2607:f380:a61:650:215e:8be1:3488:df70] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:18 -!- hugsnotdrugs1 [~afree@c-67-171-137-67.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:51 -!- cbits_ [~cbits@139.182.205.184] has joined #joinmarket 22:57 -!- cbits_ [~cbits@139.182.205.184] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:55 -!- cbits [~cbits@47.148.176.74] has joined #joinmarket