--- Day changed Mon Apr 23 2018 02:09 -!- Doug30Blanda [~Doug30Bla@ns334669.ip-5-196-64.eu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:36 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:10 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has joined #joinmarket 05:38 < adlai> waxwing: any statistics on whether the transactions are sw or not? 05:38 * adlai took down cjh for a while 05:40 < waxwing> adlai, well not on my end, i'm not monitoring anything and i'm only running one bot on SW, haven't run non-SW for ages. 05:41 < adlai> ahh. well i'll be the first to say that swjm seems to be a total and complete desert, in this latest flock of seagulls; but maybe i'm just the victim of a cruel and unusual isolation. 05:50 < waxwing> adlai, hmm, i did like 15-20 txs last 3-4 days. not exactly amazing, but not zero. otoh today it looks like nothing's happening. 05:51 < waxwing> so yeah it's more a case, i guess, of very small numbers of people on both sides of market, if you compare with 1.5 years ago. but then a few months ago there was basically nothing at all. 06:05 < adlai> ~20 months ago, the most common question around the tel aviv bitcoin embassy was "how many people are using ", with people quickly jumping to billions and billions and billions and billions and... no. 06:05 < adlai> i doubt more people actually use bitcoin on a daily basis than can be seen at a single bitcoin-related event. 06:10 < waxwing> yeah sounds right. kinda depends on meaning of "use" though. if you include speculators we're already in the millions, easy. if you don't, then maybe it's thousands :) 06:11 < waxwing> (ofc 90% of speculator activity is off-chain, but even the small amount of spillover to on-chain is pretty huge) 09:12 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:10 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] [Freenode/adlai] waxwing: any statistics on whether the transactions are sw or not? <-- nearly all joins are sw nowadays. I'm monitoring the pit (manually), and all re-announcements following the !hp-command are sw-announcements; also when they presumably 10:10 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] confirm, as the next bitcoin-block forces them reannounce again 10:11 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] havent seen any non-sw bots getting joins for many, many days 10:11 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] though even tho waxwing has seen tons of join (the pit action confirms again), i havent seen many on my bot(s). Looks like whoever is doing the joins is only using the cheapest makers. Mine isnt one of those. 11:03 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@unaffiliated/stopanddecrypt] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:22 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has joined #joinmarket 11:25 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 11:25 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has joined #joinmarket 11:35 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@c-73-215-253-208.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has joined #joinmarket 11:35 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@c-73-215-253-208.hsd1.nj.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:35 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@unaffiliated/stopanddecrypt] has joined #joinmarket 12:29 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-37-38-86-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:30 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-37-38-86-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #joinmarket 12:47 -!- GitHub129 [GitHub129@gateway/service/github.com/x-zeiyecxxlvcydlmg] has joined #joinmarket 12:47 < GitHub129> [joinmarket-clientserver] chris-belcher opened pull request #133: Added support for Core's multiwallet feature (master...multiwallet) https://git.io/vps42 12:47 -!- GitHub129 [GitHub129@gateway/service/github.com/x-zeiyecxxlvcydlmg] has left #joinmarket [] 13:02 < belcher_> as well as issue 693, theres also the annoying fact that joinmarket isnt that expensive to sybil and that could be improved by taking into account utxo age 13:02 < belcher_> maybe we should start a public relations drive informing people that joinmarket-segwit is better and they should use it 13:03 < belcher_> but yes now that demand for block space is low joinmarket is usable again 13:04 < belcher_> when demand for space goes up again, and if schnorr gets added to bitcoin then joinmarket could also be useful to make coinjoins-for-scalability insntead of coinjoins-for-privacy 13:05 < belcher_> btw how would it work to merg jm-cs together with jm, would we just move the original jm repos to another branch and overwrite it with jm-cs ? 13:24 < waxwing> belcher_, thanks for that multiwallet thing, that seems like a great step forward; are we in a position to use the "rescan back only to X height" thing? or i guess that's just a matter of advising the users? 13:25 < waxwing> as to how that "merge" would work, good question, bit of a mess, the only thing i came up with was maybe have it in like 2 (or very few commits) that remove the previous form and then add the new one. only thinking that, to keep history. but it would still have huge 10K line commits or whatever number it is. 13:27 < waxwing> re: "isn't expensive to sybil", you mean specifically from maker side, since we do that taker side already. 13:28 < waxwing> oh belcher_ btw did you go to that mini-conference thing i mentioned? i didn't bother in the end, there weren't really any talks about bitcoin stuff. just one or two that were academically interesting. 13:28 < waxwing> but btw i will be in berlin for the lightning meetup next weekend, anyone else going? 13:28 < waxwing> https://www.meetup.com/Bitcoin-Lab-Berlin/events/249392922/ 13:30 < waxwing> i edited the link syntax in the PR 13:31 < belcher_> "rescan from height X" is trivial to add, basically a copypaste from EPS, so i can do that 13:31 < belcher_> yes maker-side sybil, the cost to fill the orderbook with your own maker sybils 13:31 < belcher_> i didnt go, which mini-conference? 13:31 < waxwing> the thing in london. sorry for vagueness i forget even where it was now. some University I *think* 13:32 < waxwing> this talk was part of it https://twitter.com/waxwing__/status/988394217931264000 13:33 < belcher_> hopefully the talks are on youtube 13:33 < belcher_> im travelling right now so the internet is less-than-good so ill watch them all when i get back 13:33 < waxwing> ok i was able to "remember" it via browser cache: http://ieee-sb2018.cs.ucl.ac.uk/#schedule 13:34 < belcher_> btw i may be giving a talk somewhere in london about EPS, there was that guy on twitter who wanted to start a london bitcoin meetup but without ICOs and similar 13:34 < belcher_> ah ucl 13:35 < waxwing> heh, i just noticed " As Bitcoin suffers from scalability and privacy issues that impede its wider adoption" heh, dummies, as if that's what's impeding wider adoption. 13:35 < waxwing> well ... i might give them privacy, depends i guess 13:35 < waxwing> belcher_, sounds good, ping me if it gets set up, i might find the ability to make it :) 13:36 < belcher_> 9th may is a possible date 13:37 < waxwing> ok, pretty soon then 13:39 < belcher_> hopefully it will be on a live stream with questions taken over irc, so being there in person might not be necessary 13:43 < belcher_> AlexCato have you considered that some yg bots might be yg-privacy-enhance and so would avoid public announcements 17:21 -!- Giszmo [~leo@pc-37-38-86-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:40 -!- Giszmo [~leo@ip-234-237-219-201.nextelmovil.cl] has joined #joinmarket 17:46 -!- Giszmo [~leo@ip-234-237-219-201.nextelmovil.cl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 18:03 -!- Giszmo [~leo@ip-141-237-219-201.nextelmovil.cl] has joined #joinmarket 18:06 -!- zorop [~zorezeeq@anon-41-238.vpn.ipredator.se] has joined #joinmarket 18:09 -!- zorop [~zorezeeq@anon-41-238.vpn.ipredator.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:12 -!- AgoraRelay [~jmrelayfn@p5DE4A2EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20:21 -!- AgoraRelay [~jmrelayfn@p5DE4A748.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #joinmarket 20:50 -!- Giszmo [~leo@ip-141-237-219-201.nextelmovil.cl] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:00 -!- arubi [~ese168@gateway/tor-sasl/ese168] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:01 -!- arubi [~ese168@gateway/tor-sasl/ese168] has joined #joinmarket 23:34 -!- belcher_ [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 23:40 -!- belcher_ [~user@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #joinmarket 23:42 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] belcher: sort of. If you see some !sw(abs/rel)offer directly following the !hp announcements in the pit (like within 1-2 minutes), then it's nearly certain that these were segwit joins 23:44 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] this of course would be gameable by just having some bots announce whenever they saw the !hp in the chat (and secretly do non-sw joins), but there's no real incentive to do that, especially not by any of the tracking companies 23:44 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] so i'd say that is highly unlikely 23:44 < waxwing> i think belcher_ was thinking of the algorithm where you don't always reannounce your offer, if you can avoid it. 23:45 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/AlexCato] yes, i was thinking along these lines as well. But since we do always see re-announces currently... we can deduct that they are segwit from what they re-announce 23:46 < waxwing> right, it's a natural confusion because i believe the original 'privacy-enhance' version that i wrote was like that. but we had a lot of back and forth discussion about different versions of the algo.