--- Day changed Sun Apr 29 2018 02:49 -!- akrmn [~akrmn@79.red-83-54-170.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #joinmarket 03:51 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #joinmarket 04:01 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:37 < belcher> waxwing im going to merge the multiwallet PR 04:38 < belcher> and open an issue discussing how to merge together joinmarket-clientserver and joinmarket (i.e. replace jm with jm-cs) 05:09 < waxwing> belcher, cool thanks 05:18 -!- GitHub162 [GitHub162@gateway/service/github.com/x-vmdqhalugrzxrpkg] has joined #joinmarket 05:18 < GitHub162> [joinmarket-clientserver] chris-belcher pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vpBTf 05:18 < GitHub162> joinmarket-clientserver/master 86455c7 chris-belcher: Merge #133: Added support for Core's multiwallet feature... 05:18 -!- GitHub162 [GitHub162@gateway/service/github.com/x-vmdqhalugrzxrpkg] has left #joinmarket [] 05:18 -!- GitHub131 [GitHub131@gateway/service/github.com/x-ibvahjqjulzclmmi] has joined #joinmarket 05:18 < GitHub131> [joinmarket-clientserver] chris-belcher closed pull request #133: Added support for Core's multiwallet feature (master...multiwallet) https://git.io/vps42 05:18 -!- GitHub131 [GitHub131@gateway/service/github.com/x-ibvahjqjulzclmmi] has left #joinmarket [] 05:36 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:28 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has joined #joinmarket 08:17 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has quit [Quit: https://quanto.ga/] 11:47 -!- GitHub126 [GitHub126@gateway/service/github.com/x-agusytehpmmxdutb] has joined #joinmarket 11:47 < GitHub126> [joinmarket-clientserver] AdamISZ pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vpBWY 11:47 < GitHub126> joinmarket-clientserver/master 4fcd28b AdamISZ: Add note to explain how to manually install PyQt to virtualenv... 11:47 -!- GitHub126 [GitHub126@gateway/service/github.com/x-agusytehpmmxdutb] has left #joinmarket [] 11:50 < arubi> waxwing, re this ^, I'm still on it. it's pretty messy to get right in script-ish ways but I will have time to continue on the weekend :) 11:51 < waxwing> np at all, thanks for doing it 11:51 < arubi> np. say did you have time to look at scriptless scripts over ecdsa? very exciting.. 11:52 < arubi> I don't have intuition for paillier stuff so looking into that. hopefully I can understand it eventually 12:01 < waxwing> can't say i understand the underlying number theory really, although haven't really tried very hard, but it's just an encryption scheme with an additive homomorphism, you know like E(a+b) = E(a) + E(b). then they combine both keys and nonces with multiplication and do the sig equation in two parts. i mean you can easily see roughly how it works. 12:01 < waxwing> ah but i'm blethering only about the first part of it, how to do the ecdsa as 2PC. the other bit is how you do adaptor sigs, that's what's new over the earlier papers. i haven't even read it yet. 12:02 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #joinmarket 12:09 < arubi> so is that going to be the same one sig for two different keys, or one sig for one combined key? I'm guessing the it's the latter. I'm wondering if something like that can be useful for coinswap basically. well if you figure out more then I'd love to know 12:10 < waxwing> well yeah. if it works as I/we think, then sure, one could just do the protocol i outlined in that blog post, but with ECDSA. btw the paper refs my blog post :) shows how niche this stuff is, nobody's written it down anywhere else i guess. 12:11 < belcher> we briefly thought about using pallier ecdsa with coinswap 12:12 < waxwing> i'll try and get to grips with the adaptor sig bit now .. i just traced the basic algebra of the 2 party sig part, seemed like it made sense, although you never know until you code it. 12:12 < waxwing> belcher, yep i know. i was asking in wizards yesterday if anyone knew what had stopped anyone from doing it. 12:12 < arubi> hah, sweet. I didn't even get to that part yet then. just went diving into the older papers for paillier and lindel's :) 12:13 < waxwing> it seems a bit unclear. lindell's paper claims a huge speedup, but then for 2 party, doubt there's any issue there. 12:13 < arubi> right I remember you were suggesting it belcher (I think it was you who did?), now I feel like I wasted the opportunity to learn about it there 12:13 < belcher> yes, and i got the idea from gmaxwell and roasbeef 12:13 < waxwing> right, so to get it clear; at first the idea was more to have addresses with bigger anonymity set, wasn't it? 12:14 < waxwing> whereas if we can get it to do adaptor sigs, we can get rid of the hash preimage/htlc part. 12:14 < waxwing> in the adaptor sig version of the coinswap you can use nlocktime only based backouts. 12:14 < waxwing> which is interesting partly because Core uses nlocktime by default 12:14 < belcher> yes, to use coinswap where the addresses look like p2pkh 12:15 < belcher> it was very interesting in the case where segwit gets held up for ages, as a way to get privacy using much less block space 12:15 < waxwing> oh right yeah 12:21 < arubi> ah crap freenode HS going down, cya on the other side 12:22 < belcher> join cyberguerilla HS 12:22 < belcher> there is a relay 12:23 < arubi> oh right 12:23 -!- arubi [~ese168@gateway/tor-sasl/ese168] has quit [Write error: Connection reset by peer] 12:24 -!- dx25_ [~dx25@97.119.180.105] has joined #joinmarket 12:24 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/CgRelay] [cgan/arubi] phew 12:24 -!- arubi [~ese168@gateway/tor-sasl/ese168] has joined #joinmarket 12:25 < arubi> ah well that was fast, assuming that's all of it 12:26 -!- dx25 [~dx25@97.119.186.121] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 13:17 -!- dx25_ [~dx25@97.119.180.105] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:21 -!- player1 [~player1@172.94.114.113] has joined #joinmarket 13:21 < player1> hi 13:29 < waxwing> player1, don't ask to ask :) 13:33 < player1> ok I managed to get the qt client running on Ubuntu by applying a fix written by waxwing: simply copying the PyQt4 and sipconfig.py etc from the python2.7 packages folder to the JM client server site-packages folder. I ran a few test transactions and deactivated, re-activated the jmvenv and eventually I managed to break it and was getting the old error when trying to load the QT client: 13:34 < player1> ImportError: No module named PyQt4 13:35 < player1> I managed to fix it by installing JM again and simply moving the config, wallet file and cmtdata across then applying the same fix mentioned above. I am just running JM from a different location this time 13:35 < player1> seems to be working so far 13:35 < player1> I will try to recreate the error 13:36 < waxwing> hmm hard to see how it can sort of just stop working, i mean specifically, how it can somehow "lose" the pyqt4 package in the virtualenv. if it works once it should keep working. 13:36 < player1> this is all just for research purposes on my part, I am just tinkering with it to see how the software works so no probs in terms of losing bitcoins, I am big enough and ugly enough to look after that side of things :) 13:36 < player1> the weird thing is the package is in the folder, I can see it. I even tried copying it again 13:36 < waxwing> could be some error like you thought you were in the venv when you weren't , the files were deleted/removed somehow (!?). else, anyone else have an idea? 13:37 * arubi kinda guesses two virtualenvs 13:37 < waxwing> heh don't think lack of Qt4 will lose bitcoins :) 13:37 < waxwing> arubi, hmm .. like loading one inside another? 13:37 < arubi> no just having two distinct directories 13:38 < arubi> maybe more than one jm directory, and venv in each 13:38 < player1> I only had one directory 13:38 < arubi> hm 13:38 < waxwing> what happens if you accidentally source the activate script while inside? does it error? never thought about that. 13:38 < waxwing> or just switch 13:38 < arubi> I think it's set up to handle it 13:39 < arubi> iirc 13:40 < player1> I will carry on playing with it. I managed to fix the issue for now just by reinstalling everything in a new dir 13:40 < arubi> yea the first thing the script does is deactivate itself 13:59 < player1> I have my bitcoin client running over tor, does JM need to be configured to run over tor or will it do that automatically? 14:00 < belcher> it needs to be configured 14:00 < arubi> player1, yes, it should be in the joinmarket.cfg file. commented out at first 14:00 < belcher> but even tor wont do much 14:00 < belcher> by default joinmarket uses an electrum server, so that server can see all your addresses and link them together 14:01 < belcher> the best privacy comes from telling joinmarket to connect to your own bitcoin core node, since that downloads the entire blockchain and scans it for your addresses instead of sending them to a server 14:01 < belcher> and bitcoin core has mostly the same privacy whether you use tor or not 14:01 < player1> I have it setup to go through my node. I will take a look at the conig file. 14:02 < belcher> ah ok, as long as its through your node its most of the way there 14:02 < belcher> it isnt by default because setting up a full node is a bit of a hassle :P 14:03 < player1> No hassle for me :) I just wondered if any of the irc traffic needed to go over tor 14:03 < belcher> ahhh 14:03 < belcher> yes, tor certainly helps there 14:03 < belcher> oh right so i misunderstood, you meant irc not the blockchain interface 14:03 < player1> yeah 14:04 < belcher> yeah they're in the joinmarket.cfg file commented out 14:04 < player1> k I am taking a look 14:04 < belcher> one of them is 6dvj6v5imhny3anf.onion:6697 since thats also the same place as the onion #joinmarket channel 14:07 < player1> nothing is commented out in my config file, do you just change “socks5 = true, true” and then add the onion addresses in host? 14:08 < arubi> hmm the file should be pretty big with lots of comments 14:08 < player1> let me take a look at the repo 14:08 < arubi> you can see how the default file will look like here : jmclient/jmclient/configure.py 14:08 < player1> ok 14:09 < arubi> basically if you remove the current joinmarket.cfg (just rename it I) and run a script, it should create itself 14:09 < player1> yeah I remember it created it when I started it first time 14:09 < player1> ok 14:10 < arubi> run a script == just any of the scripts, say wallet-tool.py. I believe that should create the .cfg 14:10 < player1> I got it 14:10 < player1> thanks, that makes sense 14:10 < arubi> cheers 14:14 < player1> This is a neat piece of kit you guys have made, I am having a lot of fun playing around with it 14:16 < belcher> glad you like it 14:16 < belcher> how did you hear about it? 14:16 < player1> word of mouth 14:17 < belcher> cool 14:17 < player1> also I used to use some software you might have called Chainalysis for my old job and I remember this was one of their “blackholes” 14:17 < player1> *migh have heard of 14:18 < belcher> very very interesting 14:18 < belcher> yes someone else had an account there and got in touch with us, we gave him some addresses to try 14:18 < belcher> apparently they just display a % linkage 14:18 < player1> bitmixer failed because it was centralised and a single person could be targeted and influenced. What I like about this is that it’s just code and you guys are authors. It is distributed system. 14:18 < player1> yeah LE hated it 14:18 < belcher> like "from this address, X% goes to exchanges, Y% to casinos, Z% to mining pools, etc etc" 14:19 < player1> LE don’t like losing ‘visibility’ 14:19 < belcher> well its like that with gold 14:19 < player1> the problem might be that in the future exchanges will be forced to run whitelist only policy 14:19 < belcher> LE can still control things in that if someone shows up with lots of gold at a bank, they need to fill out paperwork 14:19 < belcher> im mostly interested in bitcoin fungibility 14:19 < player1> as in the burden is on the customer to proove the source of funds 14:19 < belcher> yes 14:20 < belcher> such a whitelist could be a bit of a disaster for fungibility, depending on the details 14:20 < player1> there are already laws for fiat at the moment 14:20 < player1> but it just applies to MSBs and Banks 14:20 < player1> it sure will be a disaster, we’re sleep walking right in to it imo 14:20 < belcher> yep, if you show up with large amounts of cash then you fill out paperwork, its fungible but also lawful 14:20 < belcher> LN should help too, since on-chain only the channel opening and closing txes are visible 14:21 < player1> the problem is that right now none of the banks trust each other and the financial system just grinds to a halt with all this overhead of enhanced KYC 14:21 < player1> too much procedural KYC creates a kind of ‘red queen’ effect on the system where they have to run to stand still 14:21 < belcher> interesting 14:22 < player1> it’s happening right now, even attorney escrows are being flagged for eKYC 14:22 < player1> the banks don’t even trust the law firms lol 14:22 < belcher> trusted third parties are security holes, as someone famous said 14:22 < player1> too much risk in case the money turns out to be linked to OFAC or something 14:22 < player1> yeah 16:03 -!- lnostdal [~lnostdal@77.70.119.51] has joined #joinmarket 16:11 -!- player1_ [~player1@193.150.9.247] has joined #joinmarket 16:14 -!- player1 [~player1@172.94.114.113] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 16:14 -!- player1_ is now known as player1 16:16 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@unaffiliated/stopanddecrypt] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:22 -!- player1_ [~player1@172.94.114.131] has joined #joinmarket 17:24 -!- player1 [~player1@193.150.9.247] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:24 -!- player1_ is now known as player1 17:50 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:09 -!- dx25 [~dx25@97.119.180.105] has joined #joinmarket 20:06 -!- AgoraRelay [~jmrelayfn@p5DE4A448.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20:15 -!- StopAndDecrypt [~StopAndDe@unaffiliated/stopanddecrypt] has joined #joinmarket 20:19 -!- AgoraRelay [~jmrelayfn@p5DE4A6AA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #joinmarket 21:54 < waxwing> (re: comments in the joinmarket.cfg: when you run the joinmarket-qt.py and make edits to settings, it overwrites joinmarket.cfg and unfortunately loses all the comments.) 22:11 -!- Giszmo [~leo@190.208.29.202] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]