--- Day changed Sat Jan 12 2019
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03:33 < nothingmuch> i've been gathering papers that define chain analytic heuristics or quantify fungibility/anonymity, with the goal of translating them to a general model from which i hope to obtain simplified metrics that don't assume transaction independence (e.g. wasabi estimates anon set as # of indistinguishable outputs, w/ limited notion of history, botlzmann & non derived mappings approach uses a 
03:33 < nothingmuch> combinatorial approach within a single tx)
03:34 < nothingmuch> anyway, i would really appreciate any references that you guys think might be important to take into account
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03:43 < nothingmuch> (and of course happy to discuss preliminary thoughts, though i'm still thoroughly confused so... caveat emptor)
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04:41 < user__> I am having a problem with yield generator.  Any one online to help? 
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04:55 < Sentineo> user___: just please ask your question, much higher probability it will get answered that way - versus if you do not ask it :) 
04:58 < user___> I setup my yelid generator three days ago and I saw the order apper on https://joinmarket.me/ob/
04:59 < user___> I have then reboot ubuntu server and now the order does not show up when I run the script.  it gets to "listening on 21783 connection made starting client"
05:00 < user___> but does not show up on https://joinmarket.me/ob/.  I think on the first day when it did the next line was something like jm deamon started.  So I am trying to figure out what is wrong
05:00 < user___> I bet it is something that didn't get restarted on reboot
05:03 < user___> also sometimes I get "Cannot reconnect to drop nick, no connections avalible" this message doesn't always show up and takes a minute or two after luanch of the script
05:15 < user___> Is my IRC working?  Can some send a message to confirm
05:16 < waxwing> user___, 
05:16 < waxwing> yes     
05:16 < waxwing> you are right about this: "JM daemon setup complete" means it's working, if you don't see that it isn't (yet)
05:17 < waxwing> if you don't see that after about a minute, take a look at the IRC login messages. if you don't see a connection to one of the IRC servers, remove that one from joinmarket.cfg, that might fix it.
05:18 < waxwing> currently i have only [MESSAGING:server1] with cgan
05:19 < waxwing> i actually don't remember when i edited it, but you can comment out the one that's [MESSAGING:server2] and see if that fixes it (if that IRC server is down it will block your startup if you try to connect to it
05:19 < waxwing> also it might depend on if you're connecting to the hidden service or the clearnet version of the IRC server (you'll see both shown in the default config)
05:20 < user___> doing clearnet at the moment
05:20 < user___> server 1 and 2 are listed  (Tor are commented out)
05:21 < waxwing> yes, i'm using tor, so can't be sure you'll replicate, but i'm able to connect fine if choosing only cgan
05:21 < waxwing> let me try the others, hold on
05:22 < user___> Do i have to have the server setup to for tor?  Or can I just turn it on the joinmarket.cfg and see if it works
05:23 < waxwing> you just have to have tor running
05:23 < waxwing> but try just removing the agora server from your config, first
05:23 < waxwing> i've just tried adding back agora to my config and it's not connecting (this is tor, but that might not matter)
05:23 < user___> I also notice a great deal less orders since I have not been able to connect.  Maybe the irc server are having trouble.  Any one else online that can connect to clearnet
05:23 < waxwing> it looks like we're just on cgan for now
05:23 < waxwing> just try to connect to cgan
05:25 < user___> Do i just uncomment the cgan and comment out cyberguerrilla and anarplex?
05:25 < waxwing> user___, if you mean 'i notice less orders on joinmarket.me/ob', that doesn't matter, it's not authoritative and it's pretty much guaranteed not to be. if you want to get a list of offers you should run the obwatcher script locally
05:25 < waxwing> cgan = cyberguerrilla, sorry
05:25 < waxwing> it should show as [MESSAGING:server1]; does it?
05:26 < waxwing> if it doesn't you might have the old version of the messaging config, i suggest moving that joinmarket.cfg to a different filename, run again and edit the re-created default config.
05:26 < waxwing> in which you will now see [MESSAGING:server1] and [MESSAGING:server2]
05:26 < waxwing> and remove the agora one
05:27 < waxwing> in  my logs i see i've done 18 coinjoins in the last 24 hours, so the system is still working. you just have to connect to it.
05:28 < user___> thank you for the help.  I comment out agora and I now have "JM daemon setup Complete"
05:32 < user___> One last thing.  Because I am newb to this I am hoping to see my first succesful coinjoin to see the complete cycle.  I am reultcant to stake a ton of bitcion till I see it works.  
05:32 < user___> WIth that being said is lower the fees down to nothing the best thing to ecourage a join to happen?
05:40 < user___> signing off.  Thanks waxwing for you help
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05:59 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/CgRelayBot] [cgan/AlexCato] yes, lower fees will make sure you see a coinjoin faster
06:55 < waxwing> huh, how can you call .format() on a str object that has characters like '{' in it without it borking because it's looking for stuff to fill in the {} ?
06:55 < waxwing> if you see what i mean
07:00 < waxwing> (disconnected for a couple mins there in case anyone answered)
07:07 < nothingmuch> waxwing: isn't that contradictory? or do you mean for it to ignore all unresolveable placeholders?
07:08 < waxwing> nothingmuch, been ddg-ing a bit; it seems a fairly common problem; you have a string-ified json and you're calling .format() on the string
07:08 < waxwing> which doesn't like the single '{' etc ... you can 'escape' it essentially by replacing every '{' with '{{' and same for }
07:09 < waxwing> usually you should just avoid the problem, but i can't because this .format() appears in the guts of the colorizing package
07:09 < waxwing> so it seems you can solve it just using re.compile and so on and doing replacement before passing to log
07:10 < waxwing> https://stackoverflow.com/a/31280804 e.g.
07:11 < waxwing> hmm, doesn't always work, as per comment. need to check the regex.
07:11 < nothingmuch> *nod*, negating effects of unconditional call does make sense
07:12 < nothingmuch> anyway to pass additional args to .format()? i think you can change the bracket chars
07:13 < waxwing> not without editing the chromalog package i think
07:13 < waxwing> one might argue you should just break up the json and log each component individually; but it sounds tedious
07:15 < waxwing> e.g. we log a prettified json deserialized tx. or a list of utxos. etc.
07:17 < nothingmuch> kind of surprised there's no standard function for this afaict... maketrans seems cleanest
07:24 < waxwing> hmm why can't i just replcae every instance of '{' with '{{' and the reverse? that regex seems to completely not work in any but the simplest case
07:29 < nothingmuch> .translate(str.maketrans({ "{": "{{", "}" : "}}" })).format() ?
07:31 < waxwing> oh you just mention 'maketrans' and i didn't follow up. thanks for the tip, will give it a try nothingmuch 
07:33 < waxwing> x = '{"a": 2, "b": 3, "c": { "d": 3, "e": 7}}'
07:33 < waxwing> x.translate(str.maketrans({ "{": "{{", "}" : "}}" })).format()
07:33 < waxwing> '{"a": 2, "b": 3, "c": { "d": 3, "e": 7}}'
07:33 < waxwing> or am i being dumb and not calling it right
07:35 < nothingmuch> sorry, i added .format() because it seemed like it clarified the composition was the identify function
07:35 < nothingmuch> omitting .format() gives you the actual escaped string
07:35 < waxwing> oh heh got it :)
07:35 < waxwing> yeah, that seems to work. i guess .replace() might do fine too?
07:36 < waxwing> yeah that identity thing is a good idea, i might put in an assert to check it (especially while testing)
07:36 < nothingmuch> iirc that would require two passes, but i don't see why it wouldn't work given the replaced chars are mutually exclusive
07:36 < waxwing> right. thanks, didn't know about maketrans. oh, btw is it py3 only?
07:37 < nothingmuch> yes, i believe it is
07:39 < waxwing> yeah. i'll just do replace i guess since we still have py2 users.
07:44 < waxwing> thanks, seems to be ok now. these people who do logging packages are always too clever for their own good :)
07:45 < waxwing> like it has some trickery where you can define new log functions on the fly, but it borks flake checks. etc.
07:45 < nothingmuch> oi vey
07:45 < nothingmuch> i hate logging packages, i've never seen a sane one in any language i've ever used
07:46 < waxwing> yeah they're like the guys who did everything as a perl one liner in the old days :)
07:47 < nothingmuch> i don't get why it isn't obvious that logging packages should have no magic, i mean it's the thing that's supposed to give you sanity when things get confusing
07:48 < waxwing> so anyone ... got any more of them .. IRC servers?
07:48 < waxwing> (that support HS with no registration..)
07:51 < waxwing> hmm. does anyone know what's preventing agora connections? i just logged in over clearnet no problem (with hexchat), and there's 104 in the pit.
07:51 < waxwing> 121 on cgan.
07:56 < waxwing> Also as per about a week ago, if anyone's up for doing a test run of payjoin let me know. As before no rush. But I'd expect to be merging in the next week or two (it's basically done).
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08:29 < nothingmuch> waxwing: tomorrow i think i'm busy and no brain left today, but i will make some time to try on monday
08:29 < nothingmuch> just p2ep branch on jm-cs?
08:51 < waxwing> nothingmuch, yes; thanks; just let me know any time, no rush
09:41 < waxwing> arubi, any idea? i'll just restart it for the heck of it https://travis-ci.org/JoinMarket-Org/joinmarket-clientserver/jobs/478770557#L534
09:42 < arubi> alright let's see if it errors again (didn't catch it the first time)
09:55 < waxwing> arubi, seems like it fixed it.
09:56 < arubi> yep just saw, what was it the first time?
09:56 < waxwing> oh does the above link no longer show the error? sorry didn't think about that
09:56 < waxwing> it was completely impenetrable to me, something about fedora .. blob .. i forget
09:57 < waxwing> impenetrable doesn't mean long and complex, i just didn't know what it was saying
09:57 < arubi> ah alright, maybe just had an issue fetching the fedora docker
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13:32 < belcher> regarding the server, i wonder if we should adopt alternatives to agora IRC network which is only .onion, since from what i remember the hard part is finding one which has both .onion and clearnet
14:00 < belcher> is it worth keeping clearnet access to joinmarket? do people use clearnet joinmarket much? we could ask on twitter and reddit
14:01 < waxwing> someone came on today and said they were using it.
14:01 < waxwing> but: if we found a second server that was HS only that would be fine in my book
14:01 < undeath> the other question is: is it clever to use clearnet?
14:02 < belcher> if your threat model is that you're only hiding from a blockchain observer but not an adversary who tracks IP addresses, then using clearnet makes a lot of sense
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14:07 < technonerd> darkscience has onion and ssl only clearnet
14:16 < belcher> i remember considering them back in 2016 or whenever we last looked for clearnet+onion IRC networks
14:16 < belcher> i dont remember why we didnt use them, im just connecting to it now
14:18 < belcher> ok well i just connected with both clearnet and the .onion
14:18 < belcher> it seems to work fine for me
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14:27 < waxwing> registration?
14:27 < AgoraRelay> [agora-irc/CgRelayBot] [cgan/AlexCato] since you can always let some maker broadcast the JM transaction, I'm not sure if using clearnet is that big of a deal
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14:39 < belcher> the irc server knows your IP address, thats probably the issue people are worried about
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14:53 < belcher> ok iv registered the channels on darkscience
14:54 < belcher> the host are irc.darkscience.net and darksci3bfoka7tw.onion
14:54 < belcher> port 6697 and ssl enabled
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18:49 < ircpitisdown> dear admin, joinmarket irc pit is down. please help
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