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09:13 < jeremyrubin> realtbast[m]: uniderctionals payment channels are definitely channels, you can actually build a pretty good network just off of one way flows
09:15 < realtbast[m]> jeremyrubin: but in their case, every time the channel is updated, they make an on-chain transaction (if that hasn't changed recently), that's why I'm saying it really isn't a channel (it doesn't decouple you from on-chain if every off-chain payment requires an on-chain transaction to be broadcast)
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09:30 < riclas> that's the understanding i had too.
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11:57 < realtbast[m]> Hey, spec meeting in 5! Are folks around or is it DST mess yet?
11:58 < vincenzopalazzo> realtbast: hello, I'm around!
11:58 < realtbast[m]> hey!
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11:59 < realtbast[m]> I got a quick q for you: regarding the c-lightning crash when receiving a legacy onion, is that on latest master?
11:59 < vincenzopalazzo> realtbast: yes
12:00 < vincenzopalazzo> there is a PR by rusty ready to be merged
12:00 < realtbast[m]> ok great, as long as it's fixed before a release it's all good
12:00 < vincenzopalazzo> ps: not sure that it crash, but I see a report on IRC this morning
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12:01 < vincenzopalazzo> realtbast[m]: yes! need to be merged this PR https://github.com/ElementsProject/lightning/pull/5139
12:01 < realtbast[m]> perfect!
12:01 < niftynei____> iirc rusty removed all the legacy onion code in master, but realized that was a mistake and has a PR open to add it back
12:02 < rusty> niftynei____: that's actually a different PR... that's the legacy onionmessage.... today's task will be to restore legacy onion.
12:02 < realtbast[m]> hah
12:02 < rusty> (I was clearly on a bit of a "CLEAN ALL THE THINGS" trip...)
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12:02 < realtbast[m]> I really wanted to pull the trigger as well and remove this code, it does simplify our type hierarchy a lot!
12:03 < rusty> Prev release we stopped making legacy by default... this release we won't ever make them.  THen next(?) we remove sipport...
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12:03 < realtbast[m]> But well, real world takes time to update
12:03 < rusty> realtbast[m]: yeah, I'll also stick in more logging so I can measure on my node.
12:03 < realtbast[m]> Is cdecker running network probing at the moment? Could it be him creating that much legacy onion volume?
12:04 < rusty> cdecker[m]: not that I know of...
12:04 < realtbast[m]> I've already caught answer from Breez and Muun, it's not them. Could be strike with their pre-payment probe though
12:04 < bitromortac_> ls -lhtr
12:04 < bitromortac_> lol :)
12:04 < rusty> hmmm.... if it's just probes maybe I *should* break it this release :)
12:04 < BlueMatt[m]> we doing a call?
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12:05 < realtbast[m]> yes!
12:05 < realtbast[m]> https://meet.jit.si/Lightning-Spec-Meeting
12:05 < realtbast[m]> Agenda here: https://github.com/lightning/bolts/issues/971
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12:30 < rusty> #action rusty to patch spec to change default from legacy to tlv if we don't know better.
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13:14 < roasbeef> related re musig2 in libsecp: https://github.com/bitcoin-core/secp256k1/issues/997
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13:47 < cdecker[m]> I'm not probing at the moment. Also limiting my probing to 1/min when I do, so that traffic can't be mine 
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