--- Day changed Wed Feb 24 2010
00:00 < ybit> http://openfarmtech.org/weblog/?p=1586 :: Marcin and crew team up with Gaia to offer Ph.D programs in the following:
00:00 < ybit> 1. Business Model for an Open Source, Resilient Community
00:00 < ybit> 2. Creating Advanced Civilization from Scrap Metal
00:00 < ybit> 3. Modern Steam Engines for Renewable Energy Applications
00:00 < ybit> 4. LifeTrac: Design and Fabrication of a Universal Utility Machine
00:00 < ybit> 5. Scalable, Open Source Product Development (OSPD) Pipeline
00:00 < kanzure> http://sites.google.com/site/fablablinks/
00:01  * ybit sticks with the neuroeng dept at GT for his post-graduate studies
00:01 < ybit> http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://minduploading.org
00:05 < kanzure> http://lare-india.blogspot.com/
00:09 < ybit> kanzure: on an indian kick are we?
00:09  * ybit read some china-u.s. analyst point out recently that america will leverage its relation with india to counteract china's rise
00:10 < ybit> read +where
00:14 < katsmeow-afk> india is too small
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00:18 < ybit> katsmeow-afk: i don't think 1.* billion is small
00:19 < ybit> +in population
00:21 < kanzure> ybit: no, someone else is, i'm just relaying the links
00:22 < kanzure> http://api.creativecommons.org/rest/dev/
00:22 < kanzure> documentation: http://api.creativecommons.org/docs/
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00:43 < katsmeow-afk> i didn't say it was small in absolute terms, i said "too small", technologically and in industrial might and demand for raw materials mostly
00:43 < katsmeow-afk> compared to usa and China and russia, and possibly EU
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00:44 < katsmeow-afk> yeas, they are 4th or 5th in a lot of stuff, but i think there's a large gap there, where china just won't care
00:45 < katsmeow-afk> china is carring less about the usa too, they just sold off $32billion in usa debt they had financed
01:00 < genehacker> well at least they managed to sell it
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02:05  * fenn glances at the looming backlog
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02:10 < fenn> what a dumbass. you make sure the chip works BEFORE you implant it into your body
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02:13 < fenn> also i don't get what implanting an RFID chip has to do with transhumanism.. does implanting a dog with ID make it a transcanine?
02:16 < fenn> ps: I lied, SBC does throttle you for torrenting, they're just slower about it than comcast
02:22 < QuantumG> of course it's transhumanist
02:22 < QuantumG> was he electronically identifiable before he had the implant?
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02:53 < fenn> he's still not any more "electronically identifiable" - he just has an RFID chip stuck in his arm
02:54 < fenn> no more or less transhuman than carrying an rfid card in your pocket
02:54 < fenn> except you can't remove it easily
02:54 < fenn> to me that seems disempowering
02:54 < fenn> and, it's not like bad guys won't know it's there either
02:55 < fenn> someone can steal your implanted rfid too
02:59 < QuantumG> so putting a computer in your arm wouldn't make you any more transhuman either?
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03:08 < genehacker> well if the computer was powered by your blood sugar...
03:08 < genehacker> you might get transhuman points
03:09 < fenn> a Burner chick told me about this flaming zen garden today: http://pyroboy.com/photos/flaming_zen_garden/zen_garden_with_stone.php
03:09 < fenn> it's such a simple obvious idea yet for some reason not common at all
03:09 < genehacker> saw one at maker faire
03:10 < genehacker> there is a company selling them
03:13 < fenn> QuantumG: not particularly, if it didnt interact with your arm in any significant way beyond just being there
03:14 < QuantumG> so is there some workable definition you're using for transhuman here or is it just your gut feel?
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03:14 < fenn> should i go to "hackers and founders" @ dogpatch labs, or "ARdevmob" @ COLLAB, or both? (approximately same time tomorrow)
03:14 < genehacker> perhaps we should set up a percent cyborg definition
03:15 < genehacker> 0.01% man with wrist watch
03:15 < fenn> genehacker: i wouldnt have any problem with someone ranting about their implant on #hplusblahblahblah if it was in any way shape or form cybernetic
03:15 < genehacker> 0.05% man with wrist watch loaded with sensors
03:15 < fenn> genehacker: the simple fact of the matter is, tongue piercings are not "transhuman"
03:15 < QuantumG> did you hear about the "compass sense" mod?
03:15 < genehacker> 0.1% man with wristwatch and cellphone
03:15 < fenn> yes
03:15 < fenn> i plan to make one
03:16 < QuantumG> is that transhuman?
03:16 < fenn> yes
03:16 < genehacker> 3% cyborg
03:16 < QuantumG> ahh.. I like it when we agree on something :)
03:16 < genehacker> I want one too
03:16 < Utopiah> genehacker: are you making an official "cyborg scale"?
03:16 < fenn> a compass sense tongue piercing would be interesting
03:16 < genehacker> I might
03:16 < QuantumG> I'd like that compass sense to be implanted
03:17 < genehacker> what happens if it breaks?
03:17 < QuantumG> .. and if you could make it not set off metal detectors that'd be awesome
03:17 < fenn> the way i see it, implanted tech will be obsolete by the time it's FDA approved
03:17 < genehacker> so what if it sets off metal detectors?
03:17 < QuantumG> they'll make you take it off
03:17 < superkuh> Implant FPGA?
03:17 < genehacker> I'd care more about what would happen to it if you got exposed to high magnetic fields
03:18 < fenn> in order to keep up, you basically HAVE to use wearable tech, unless it's something that directly interfaces with blood or nervous system etc
03:18 < QuantumG> if it was a piercing though..
03:18 < fenn> superkuh: have you compared today's FPGA's with 10 years ago?
03:18 < genehacker> I once had a watch with one of those digital compasses in it, played around with some NIB magnets and totally messed it up
03:18 < QuantumG> but a small enough compass should be fine for metal detectors
03:18 < superkuh> fenn: No. It was meant more as a joke.
03:19 < genehacker> it might feel weird if it was hooked up to wetware
03:19 < QuantumG> I wonder if there's a way to do time similar to the compass thing
03:19 < QuantumG> where you can "sense" the time, perfectly
03:19 < genehacker> AGGH THE WORLD IS SPINNING
03:19 < fenn> i used to have that sense
03:19 < fenn> wake up 2 minutes before your alarm goes off]
03:20 < genehacker> I wonder if you can integrate more than senses
03:20 < fenn> point at the ceiling and school lets out
03:20 < QuantumG> yeah, I mean, someone says "what time is it?" and you can immediately say "7:19pm"
03:20 < fenn> i was actually thinking about this today
03:20 < genehacker> if you could emulate part of a brain and have it talk to your brain via a tactile interface
03:20 < fenn> neuromancer
03:20 < fenn> and how totally awful it would be to always have a clock superimposed over your vision
03:21 < fenn> you could rig it up to display the estimated number of seconds left in your life, for extra goth points
03:22 < Utopiah> (or estimated heartbeats)
03:23 < genehacker> IE understand a language via tactile or visual interface(trippy colors from a language cortex)
03:23 < QuantumG> if you did have a subsecond accurate time sense, would your memories be automatically timestamped?
03:23 < fenn> probably not
03:23 < genehacker> apparently the human time sense is quite subjective
03:24 < fenn> my dreams sometimes have altitude information, but my memories don't
03:24 < fenn> likewise with smell
03:24 < Utopiah> QuantumG: IMHO we dont have precise timestamps because in our daily life and based on our average lifespan we just dont require it, having it "on demand" with watches or high precision clocks seems to be enough (but, if the pace accelerates and survival requires more precise micro-management, it might becomes required)
03:24 < genehacker> altitude information?
03:24 < fenn> yeah.
03:24 < fenn> got a problem with it?
03:24 < genehacker> never heard of that one
03:25 < fenn> well, you can tell if you're in the mountains or just some random hilly woods
03:25 < genehacker> height above sealevel?
03:25 < QuantumG> well, when I think about any memory I can call to mind how I was feeling.. was I cold?  what did I see, hear, smell?  So if you had an accurate time sense, why wouldn't it be just as memorable?
03:26 < fenn> it's something about the air, the smell? the temperature? dT per breath vs humidity?
03:27 < fenn> QuantumG: you're saying you have eidetic memory?
03:27 < Utopiah> QuantumG: maybe we currently can attach minute precise timestamps to memories but we dont make the effort of doing it because it doesn't worth the extra precision
03:27 < QuantumG> I think we simply don't have a subsecond time sense
03:28 < genehacker> nope
03:28 < fenn> people don't have ANY time sense
03:28 < fenn> humans*
03:28 < genehacker> nerve transmission speed is on the order of slow(wrt to electrical systems)
03:29 < fenn> thank you for the demonstration, genehacker 
03:30 < QuantumG> and no, I don't have eidetic memory.. but I can certainly remember stuff that I sensed :)
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03:31 < Utopiah> (my life example) when I check wiki edits or code updates, I usually care less about precision the older it is
03:33 < QuantumG> any ideas how long wikipedia keeps the "keep me logged in" cookie?
03:33 < QuantumG> it seems like mere hours
03:33 < Utopiah> should be indicated inside the cookie
03:34 < QuantumG> says: Remember me (up to 30 days)
03:34 < QuantumG> let's have a look at what it's really doing..
03:35 < QuantumG> gives me 4 cookies, 3 of which expire in 30 days, 1 expires at the end of the session
03:38 < QuantumG> killing my browser and restarting has no effect.. so that session cookie seems irrelevant.. so I guess the problem is simply that I don't notice a month passing these days
03:46 < Utopiah> http://graphjam.com/2010/02/23/funny-graphs-university-computer/
03:47 < QuantumG> I just used a cookie editor addon to change the expiration date to 2015 :)
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03:54 < fenn> graphjam is just not funny, at all
03:55 < Utopiah> Im sure there is a graph for that too
03:58 < fenn> graphjam funniness level vs time:  |_________________________
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04:19 < fenn> does the name "stephan branczyk" sound familiar?
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04:41 < genehacker> http://www.openstructures.net
04:41 < genehacker> have at it, if you haven't already
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08:08 < JayDugger> Hello, danielfalck.
08:08 < danielfalck> hi JayDugger 
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11:20 < kanzure> meh: http://opensourceforamerica.org/guidelines
11:32 < kanzure> list of data packages: http://ckan.net/tag/read/science
11:36 < kanzure> alternative to vectornti http://www.crimsonbase.com/download
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11:49 < kanzure> http://blog.reprap.org/2010/02/broadening-reprap-participation.html
11:49 < kanzure> also, i posted some comments on there
11:55 < JayDugger> Any takers on the offer?
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13:08 < kanzure> http://www.contraptor.org/contraptions
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13:38 < kanzure> open access directory http://oad.simmons.edu/oadwiki/Main_Page
13:45 < kanzure> wtf is this? http://ask.slashdot.org/ok.txt
13:47 < kanzure> "The biggest difference between time and space is that you can't reuse time. -- Merrick Furst"
13:51 < kanzure> ain't pokemon grand? http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h142/grumphis/misc%20comics/fighttothedeath.gif
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13:58 < strages> I <3 the Open Manufacturing mailing list and this channel :D thanks for all the excellent links
13:58 < strages> so much good information
13:59 < strages> also, does anyone have any experience with a BPM Personal Modeler 2100?  Can't seem to find any documentation on it beyond the patent for the technology it uses.
13:59 < strages> Makers Local 256 has one, and it works short of actually spraying wax
13:59 < strages> but it thinks it's printing
14:00 < strages> we think it's a problem with the piezo element in the spray head and it'd be nice to have documentation before taking the head apart to fix it
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14:05 < ybit2> good to see your around strages, my only exp with that machine is seeing it there at the hackerspace
14:05 < ybit2> s/your/you
14:05 < strages> I idle and try to keep up with the flow of information
14:06 < strages> we got everything working on it short of the spray head
14:07 < strages> we can step it through every step using manual commands, feed it stl files, the lot
14:07 < strages> all from reverse engineering and reading the patent
14:08 < kanzure> i still can't seem to read it: http://ldc.upenn.edu/myl/llog/steno2.gif
14:09 < strages> oh man that's hard to follow
14:09 < kanzure> http://wpcontent.answers.com/wikipedia/en/c/cf/Steno-example.gif
14:10 < kanzure> http://ldc.upenn.edu/myl/llog/steno_alphabet.gif
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14:20 < kanzure> http://sf.net/projects/wirelessrope
14:20 < kanzure> http://crawdad.cs.dartmouth.edu/ "a community resource for archiving wireless data at dartmouth"
14:20 < kanzure> "wireless topology discovery project" http://sysnet.ucsd.edu/wtd/wtd.html
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14:44 < strages> excellent finds kanzure!
14:44 < strages> I've been looking for some new ways to repurpose old PDAs
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14:53 < strages> I have about a dozen PDAs, all capable of wifi or wifi being added through a card of some sort
14:54 < strages> some can do bluetooth
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15:20 < kanzure> http://code.google.com/p/emcfab
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16:50 < kanzure> http://objects.reprap.org/wiki/RepLab
16:51 < kanzure> wtf
16:51 < kanzure> http://objects.reprap.org/wiki/RepLab_Working_Group
16:52 < kanzure> http://dev.forums.reprap.org/list.php?128
16:53 < kanzure> "I need to email the skdb group and see if they want to help us on this. (By merging, maybe.) If we don't coordinate, they're going to be busy trying to be a superset of us, while we're busy being a superset of everything." (sebastien bailard)
16:55 < kanzure> http://dev.forums.reprap.org/index.php
17:00 -!- Noahj [~noah@ip68-230-157-203.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:05 < kanzure> http://socialactions.pbworks.com/Social+Entrepreneur+API+--+funding+conference+call+notes
17:07 -!- genehacker [~chatzilla@wireless-128-62-101-168.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:07 < ybit2> did anyone ever get a total from this? http://fab.cba.mit.edu/about/fab/inv.html
17:07 -!- ybit2 is now known as heath
17:07 < kanzure> http://http://cookingforgeeks.com/
17:07 < kanzure> ybit: no, but http://designfiles.org/skdb/doc/BOMs/comparison/fablab.yaml
17:08 < kanzure> and this has some data: http://designfiles.org/skdb/doc/BOMs/ultimate-tool-buying-guide.yaml
17:08 < heath> i've got all those files pulled up
17:09 -!- heath is now known as x-tehgreat
17:09 < x-tehgreat> :)
17:09 -!- x-tehgreat is now known as ybit2
17:12 < genehacker> http://news.slashdot.org/story/10/02/24/1812244/Use-Open-Source-Then-Youre-a-Pirate
17:12 < genehacker> excellent we can all be enemies of the state
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17:52 < ybit> it's over 2 million
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17:58 < ybit> that isn't quite diy imho
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18:36 < kanzure> http://makerbot.wikidot.com/
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19:01 -!- Irssi: #hplusroadmap: Total of 32 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 32 normal]
19:41 < kanzure> http://blog.pietrosperoni.it/2005/05/25/tag-clouds-metric/
20:06 < kanzure> updated: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/meetlog/2010-01-01_to_2010-02-24.png
20:08 < kanzure> aww.. it seems to match my web traffic curve
20:08 < kanzure> that's, not good
20:08 < kristianpaul> http://www.downes.ca/
20:08 < kristianpaul> kanzure: hey men :)
20:08 < kristianpaul> man*
20:08 < kristianpaul> whatever :p
20:08 < kanzure> kristianpaul: hm?
20:09 < kristianpaul> i just said hello
20:09 < kanzure> oh. hi
20:09  * kanzure is gone for 20min
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21:00 < kanzure> was just reading: http://it.slashdot.org/story/10/02/24/185235/Latvian-Robin-Hood-Hacker-Leaks-Bank-Details?art_pos=7
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21:56 -!- JayDugger [~duggerj@2001:0:53aa:64c:1c80:1f70:52c6:ef50] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:02 < kanzure> hey JayDugger 
22:07 < kanzure> an MBA student/grad just opted to work for gnusha/us
22:07 < kanzure> what do i do now
22:07 < kanzure> (for free)
22:09 < JayDugger> Hello, kanzure.
22:10 < JayDugger> Take advantage of your volunteer's willingness.
22:10 < JayDugger> Remember the work comes at no cost, but it still has value.
22:10 < kanzure> dunno how to best (ab)use him
22:11 < JayDugger> I doubt anyone volunteers to crap work. :)
22:11 < kanzure> my dad was an MBA/project-manager type.. but he basically *looked* like a big secretary
22:11 < JayDugger> Yeah, project management's like that.
22:11 < JayDugger> Secretaries, excuse me--executive assistants--don't get held accountable for the work of others.
22:12 < kanzure> so what do they do? other than make power points and do lots of conference calls
22:12 < JayDugger> You might place the volunteer on project management for gnusha.
22:12 < kanzure> yeah but what would that mean
22:12 < JayDugger> Or perhaps look at various business models for Open Source Hardware development.
22:12 < JayDugger> Nonsense.
22:12 < kanzure> hrm
22:13 < JayDugger> If he's serious, then he volunteered for the opportunity to make a meaningful contribution.
22:13 < kanzure> he's definitely serious :)
22:13 < kanzure> i just don't know my MBA ABCs
22:13 < JayDugger> If he's competent, then a few tests are in order--unless you've already determined that.
22:13 < JayDugger> Well, I have some experience, but not much.
22:14 < JayDugger> Perhaps asking your Dad how best to take advantage of the fellow would teach you the most.
22:14 < kanzure> blah i wish my dad was around
22:14 < kanzure> he's dead
22:14 < JayDugger> I don't know if that's practical.
22:14 < JayDugger> Ah.
22:14 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/dad/2009-01-11_AustinAmericanStatesman_obit.png
22:14 < JayDugger> (remove foot from mouth)
22:14 < kanzure> what's really fucked up is that i had to write his obit :/
22:14 < JayDugger> My sympathies for the recent death.
22:15 < JayDugger> Do you know any of your father's professional colleagues?
22:15 < JayDugger> Perhaps one of them might have good suggestions?
22:15 < kanzure> hm, they do tend to have good suggestions
22:15 < kanzure> when i needed a lawyer a few weeks ago i called one of 'em up
22:15 < kanzure> and got a super awesome lawyer who did some free work for me
22:16 < JayDugger> Excellent.
22:16 < JayDugger> You might get lucky twice.
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22:44 < kanzure> bkero: tim schmidt is on jabber at the moment if you want to hit him up for reprap parts
22:44 < bkero> kanzure: Ok, what's his handle again?
22:45 < kanzure> timschmidt@gmail.com
22:51 < bkero> kanzure: thanks
22:51  * bkero hits him up.
22:53 < ybit> http://labs.fhcrc.org/roth/
22:53 < ybit> supposedly this guy gave a presentation @ ted 2010
22:54 < ybit> as did people behind the following links:
22:54 < ybit> http://www.reasonproject.org/
22:55 < ybit> http://christakis.med.harvard.edu/
22:55 < ybit> http://www.good.is/post/spider-silk-strong-as-steel-could-replace-kevlar/
22:59 < kanzure> http://www.wired.com/magazine/2010/02/ff_algorithm/
22:59 < kanzure> http://www.staringispolite.com/likepython/
22:59 < kanzure> `  yo just print like "hello world" bro`
23:00  * ybit likes kanzure's first link
23:02 < kanzure> l1 minimization?
23:02 < ybit> hah, "like,pythong" is actually easy to follow
23:02 < ybit> python*
23:05 < Noahj> Does like python just, like, cut out all those unnecessary words? 
23:06 < Noahj> I just read that article in wired
23:06 -!- kristianpaul [~kristianp@190.7.148.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
23:07 < kanzure> here's some papers on it:
23:07 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/papers/Near-ideal%20model%20selection%20by%20l1%20minimization.pdf
23:07 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/papers/Stable%20signal%20recovery%20from%20incomplete%20and%20inaccurate%20measurements.pdf
23:07 < kanzure> Compressed sensing is basically just finding a best-fit interpolation
23:07 < kanzure> over all the available datapoints. It's really nothing more than
23:07 < kanzure> saying "we can identify noise pixels and remove them with 100%
23:07 < kanzure> accuracy, then replace them with pixels that represent the minimum
23:07 < kanzure> change over the function that generates the image."
23:08 < Noahj> It kinda seems like oct-tree 
23:08 < Noahj> Only backwards
23:08 < Noahj> I found one PDF on it I understood, but I don't have the math for the other one
23:09 < Noahj> http://www.ams.org/happening-series/hap7-pixel.pdf < this one
23:10 < kanzure> wtf
23:10 < kanzure> hey Noahj :) how are you
23:10 < Noahj> Hey
23:11 < Noahj> I'm drifting in and out of lethargy actually
23:11 < Noahj> But it's fun 
23:11 < Noahj> My brother and I just watched four episodes of gaogaigar, a mecha anime from 1997
23:12 < Noahj> It's about a mecha formed from a mechanical lion, a train, a plane, and huge drill thing
23:12 < Noahj> At fab academy, the makerbot still doesn't work
23:12 < Noahj> We'll probably have to re-wrap the extruder 
23:12 < Noahj> It's not getting up to temperaturee
23:13 < Noahj> *temperature
23:13 < Noahj> Our Z axis is also extremely kludge, the belt is glued together and the spindle things are the wrong sizes
23:13 < Noahj> We also got our threaded rod extremely cheaply
23:13 < Noahj> But I don't think those last things are terribly significant
23:21 < kanzure> wtf bre pettis is in austin for dorkbot-austin?
23:21 < kanzure> should i jump him
23:22 < Noahj> That's probably a prudent plan
23:22 < Noahj> RI's having our first hacker con: http://quahogcon.org/
23:22 < Noahj> It might be pretty lame 
23:22 < Noahj> But Dan Kaminsky is coming 
23:23 < Noahj> *spam spam spam*
23:27 < kanzure> sadly i think you're our only rhode islander :(
23:28 < Noahj> There're probably some Massachusettsians here though 
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23:36 < kanzure> how come all the girls have their first name .com? ratha.com, parijata.com, ..
23:36 < kanzure> it's a commercial empire :/
23:38 < QuantumG> I'd be .com too if that no-talent hack over at quantumg.com hadn't gotten it first
23:44 < kanzure> phone call with the MBA dood, saturday a 4pm
23:44 < kanzure> *saturday at
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23:51 < kanzure> netflix grand prize solution http://www.commendo.at/UserFiles/commendo/File/GrandPrize2009_BigChaos.pdf
23:52 < kanzure> http://blog.pietrosperoni.it/2005/05/25/tag-clouds-metric/