--- Day changed Sun Feb 28 2010
00:06 < kanzure> lawl at business plans specifically referencing "I Am Legend"
00:36 < avicenna> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sqWeKPRCKw
00:36 < avicenna> wow
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02:50 < JayDugger> Good morning, everyone.
02:57 < ybit> hi JayDugger 
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06:05 < kanzure> bluh? http://groups.google.com/group/aiko-platform
06:24 < JayDugger> Another New Zealand group?
06:31 < Utopiah> is there a wiki for legal documents? I mean several sites like GNU or CC provide licenses but what about NDAs?
06:32 < JayDugger> Utopiah: not to my knowledge, but I suspect they exist.
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09:27 < JayDugger> Anyone have contact with, or belong to the Dallas Personal Robotics Group? (dprg.org)
09:37 < Utopiah> (regarding my earlier question : Legal Forms from LawDepot.com - Trusted Do-it-Yourself Legal http://www.lawdepot.com/ )
10:34 < katsmeow-afk> from what i have heard, "legal depots" are frequently out of dat on federal laws, and totally out of touch with state laws
10:35 < katsmeow-afk> they may or may not have improved
10:37 < Utopiah> you mean I shouldn't trust a resource just because it calls itself "trusted"? ;)
10:38 < katsmeow-afk> trust me
10:38 < Utopiah> thanks
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12:18  * kanzure just got an email from <norris.chuck@mail.ru> and feels suspicious
12:19 < kanzure> hey wait a second, chuck norris doesn't have a dali mustache >:(
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13:05 < QuantumG> http://designfiles.org/papers/Measurement_of_Gravitomagnetic_and_Acceleration_Fields_Around_Rotating_Superconductors.pdf
13:05 < QuantumG> nice paper
13:09 < kanzure> hrm.. yet another one?
13:09 < kanzure> http://openmaterials.org/2010/02/22/openstructures-everyone-designs-for-everyone/
13:09 < kanzure> http://www.openstructures.net/pages/1
13:10 < kanzure> utilihab, makerbeam, contraptor, ..
13:10 < kanzure> http://www.intrastructures.net/Intrastructures/About_-_what_we_are..html
13:15 < kanzure> yet-another-modular-construction-system
13:15 < Utopiah> http://vanish.cs.washington.edu/ (not sure to understand the point)
13:18 < kanzure> http://elifarley.amplify.com/2010/01/27/opensource-cars-transportation/
13:18 < kanzure> stalk: elifarley cruz
13:18 < kanzure> http://www.google.com/reader/shared/elifarley
13:19 < kanzure> oh, actual name: Elifarley Callado Coelho Cruz (ugh)
13:19 < kanzure> can't seem to find an email address
13:19 < kanzure> i wanted to answer his question :/
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13:35 < QuantumG> but let's cut to the chase here:  designfiles.org/papers/Current_Research_in_Gravito-Electromagnetic_Space_Propulsion.pdf
13:36 < kanzure> hrm where was i reading about electromagnetic propulsion before?
13:36 < QuantumG> probably on crazy alley
13:36 < kanzure> no, no, it was a NASA researcher and his wife that i met..
13:36 < QuantumG> this stuff has been the domain of crackpots for so long, it was really brave of ESA to even try investigating it
13:38 < kanzure> oh it was just electric propulsion
13:38 < kanzure> fooey
13:38 < kanzure> http://richard.hofer.com/electric_propulsion.html
13:38 < QuantumG> ahh, ok
13:38 < kanzure> aha, but electromagnetic propulsion is mentioned there
13:38 < QuantumG> I'll use this opportunity to pimp this then: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eaoOuirvsCs
13:39 < kanzure> the guy was doing a RF plasma-based electron source with an asymmetric magnetice feld
13:39 < kanzure> *magnetic field
13:40 < QuantumG> oh, you might be talking about the magnetoelectric wheel stuff I posted
13:40 < QuantumG> different magic
13:41 < kanzure> nope (?) http://designfiles.org/papers/electric_propulsion/ (just uploaded)
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13:41 < kanzure> anyway, it's definitely unrelated
13:42 < kanzure> i fail
13:43 < kanzure> hm i should probably rename that to plasma_propulsion
13:43 < QuantumG> heh, anyway I'm reading this stuff so I have some idea of how far away from experimental demonstration it is
13:44 < QuantumG> like, this shit is TRL0
13:44 < QuantumG> not even demonstrated in a lab environment
13:44 < QuantumG> not even fully agreed upon as experimentally verifiable physics
13:45 < QuantumG> at least, that's what I think.. maybe I'm wrong, and I can only study reviews like this to find out
13:47 < kanzure> why is rob carlson called a "diybio guru"? doesn't he charge $100k to make thermocyclers etc.? what does he do that makes him related to the diybio community?
13:47 < QuantumG> http://www.spacevidcast.com/spaceup-video-grid/
13:47 < QuantumG> (will kill your computer/bandwidth, use at your own risk)
13:51 < kanzure> is nasatv torrented?
13:52 < QuantumG> nope
14:03 < kanzure> meh: http://opengovtracker.com/
14:13 < QuantumG> in regards to gene doping
14:13 < QuantumG> they should just start the Transhuman Olympics now
14:13 < QuantumG> it'll be like Nascar, except the athletes are the cars.
14:15 < kanzure> i'm sure the olympians outcasted from the old games would love to compete
14:16 < QuantumG> oh, and did you see this?  http://bit.ly/akQxyS
14:16 < kanzure> i've inherited a server from an old startup and i'm supposed to be doing some maintenance on it
14:16 < kanzure> there's about five user accounts each with their own weird /home/ dir structure, various important docs, and an svn repo that they all shared
14:16 < QuantumG> sounds like work, why bother when we have the internet?
14:16 < kanzure> QuantumG: yes
14:17 < kanzure> i'm not really sure what i should do- should i respect their old file system structure and standards, or go totally nuclear on it?
14:19 < QuantumG> nuclear
14:30 < fenn> transhuman olympics would be a cool thing for humanity+ to focus on
14:30 < fenn> i mean actually get rolling
14:33 < QuantumG> preferably before it is made illegal
14:35 < fenn> gene doping?
14:36 < fenn> there's all kinds of other stuff athletes aren't allowed to do in competitions but is still legal
14:36 < fenn> btw i hate that phrase, let's please use something more specific
14:38 < fenn> how about "gene enhancement" :P
14:38 < QuantumG> for sure
14:39 < fenn> btw anki (the memory program) is pretty cool
14:39 < fenn> supermemo clone
14:39 < fenn> maybe i'll actually retain my japanese this time
14:41 < fenn> i wonder if there's a way to apply it to music practice
14:42 < QuantumG> are you gunna give it a go?
14:43 < fenn> i've been doing the "core 2000" vocabulary all day
14:43 < fenn> i started out with just kanji but it's a terrible thing to do to yourself
14:43 < QuantumG> oh sorry, I thought you were referring to some gene enhancement for memory
14:44 < fenn> core 2000 has funny pictures that convey the meaning of the word in context, and recordings of japanese speech
14:45 < QuantumG> neat
14:45 < fenn> it's a software program based on psychological research from like 1893, which apparently has been completely ignored by the educational hegemony
14:45 < fenn> more here if you care http://www.wired.com/medtech/health/magazine/16-05/ff_wozniak?currentPage=all
14:46 < QuantumG> oh, that's typical.. I honestly don't know why people who write a revolutionary PhD thesis (or whatever) have the expectation that their work will be picked up and commercialized.. 
14:46 < fenn> because that's what we're taught in school/tv/parents
14:47 < fenn> the only voice of reason is comic strips like PhD
14:47 < QuantumG> and, what's more, it seems to me that if you put all that effort into writing something like that and really believed it was revolutionary, you couldn't find better source material for a startup
14:48 < QuantumG> but some people are just not entrepreneurial I guess
14:48 < QuantumG> ok, summary of http://designfiles.org/papers/Current_Research_in_Gravito-Electromagnetic_Space_Propulsion.pdf
14:48 < fenn> it's a big jump to go from having some committee/advisor breathing down your neck for years to no pressure at all except what you put in
14:49 < fenn> is that about the cone shaped waveguide with no exits?
14:49 < QuantumG> take one superconducting solenoid, add one superconducting disk on top, and spin it up.
14:50 < QuantumG> propellant propulsion: serves four.
14:50 < fenn> er, did they test it?
14:50 < fenn> sounds simple enough
14:50 < QuantumG> nope
14:50 < QuantumG> its a proposal for an experiment
14:50 < QuantumG> that no-one has done
14:51 < QuantumG> based on the only theory that explains the observed effect of an experiment that has been done, and repeated.
14:52 < QuantumG> not that anyone believes this theory
14:52 < fenn> this stuff would be so easy to test if we had a halfway decent orbital infrastructure
14:52 < QuantumG> but it's the best one around
14:52 < fenn> 1) build experiment 2) see if it changes orbit 3) profit
14:52 < QuantumG> well, the great thing about this experiment is that it is testable in the lab
14:53 < QuantumG> but, yes, if you could get a free ride to space you could probably test it cheaper
14:53 < fenn> hell it's gotta be easier to build than gravity probe B
14:54 < QuantumG> that said, if you really believed in this stuff you could skip testing it and just build a large scale unit (like, a 1m solenoid/disk)
14:54 < QuantumG> no-one can debate you if it produces enough thrust to lift itself
14:54 < fenn> that's what the "lifter" people thought :P
14:55 < QuantumG> well true.. it would have to lift its own power source too
14:55 < QuantumG> then no-one can argue
14:55 < fenn> hm
14:55 < QuantumG> cause you'd be launching payloads
14:55 < QuantumG> and you wouldn't freakin' care if they didn't believe you
14:55 < fenn> there are a lot of uses even if thrust/weight << 1
14:55 < QuantumG> "oh, you disagree with my theory?  that's nice, I'll be over here in my hovercar."
14:56 < fenn> i.e. gravity-wave signalling
14:56 < fenn> interplanetary travel
14:56 < fenn> asteroid harvesting
14:56 < QuantumG> yeah sure, but so long as the first step of your business plan is 1) get this into space, you're not going anywhere
14:56 < fenn> construction equipment
14:57 < fenn> satellite refueling
14:57 < QuantumG> is there a down-to-earth use for thrust/weight < 1?
14:57 < fenn> aerostats (cheap communications towers)
14:58 < fenn> zeppelin propulsion (if efficiency is high enough)
14:59 < QuantumG> well, superconducting solenoids/disks are not exactly light
14:59 < fenn> maybe even regular airplanes
14:59 < fenn> says who
14:59 < fenn> what matters more, the total current capacity or the volume of space enclosed?
15:00 < QuantumG> 92g/mol
15:00 < fenn> and, if the video game "mass effect" is to be believed, it'll give us all superpowers like the ability to shoot black holes from our eyes
15:01 < QuantumG> sweet
15:01 < fenn> QuantumG: did you ever meet dan fredriksen? (DanF_DrC)
15:02 < QuantumG> I wish someone had told me that mass effect was set in an O'Neill Colony, I might have actually played it
15:02 < QuantumG> nope
15:02 < fenn> ok, well, um, uh, nevermind
15:02 < fenn> it wasn't an o'neill colony
15:03 < fenn> it was just this thing which looked sorta like one, but had artificial gravity, which sort of defeats the point of building it in that shape
15:04 < QuantumG> hmm?  it had a large rotating toroid to generate artificial gravity.
15:04 < fenn> this? http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Citadel
15:05 < QuantumG> yep
15:05 < QuantumG> http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/Citadel_and_Galactic_Government
15:05 < QuantumG> was the one I was looking at but yeah
15:08 < fenn> i think "down" is along the arms, along the axis of the cylinder
15:08 < fenn> except in the torus part, for whatever reason
15:08 < fenn> or i could just be confused
15:08 < fenn> someone is confused, dammit!
15:08 < QuantumG> hehe
15:09 < QuantumG> I was looking at some space settlement stuff the other day.. cause I couldn't remember how they were slowing down the lunar material that they shoot up to L2 with a mass driver
15:09 < QuantumG> http://www.nss.org/settlement/ColoniesInSpace/colonies_chap06.html
15:10 < QuantumG> giant freakin' catcher's mits
15:10 < QuantumG> http://www.nss.org/settlement/ColoniesInSpace/fig0612.gif
15:10 < QuantumG> dreaming big sure was popular after Apollo
15:14 < fenn> i dont see anything wrong with the idea
15:15 < fenn> off to meet some family for $meal_of_day
15:59 < kanzure> http://grey.colorado.edu/emergent/index.php/LeabraStartup running emergent (neuroscience software) from the command line, video tutorial
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16:20 < kanzure> ooh: http://rednails.rubyforge.org/ template-driven data scraping
16:28 < CIA-47> pyscholar: kanzure master * r649cb3d / doc/url.txt : link to rednails (inspiration?) - http://bit.ly/alyKXn
16:28 < kanzure> http://code.google.com/p/python-spidermonkey/
16:37 < kanzure> http://help.infochimps.org/help/show/InfiniteMonkeywrench hm..
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17:48 < kanzure> http://archive.amsuess.com/pool/contrib/o/openscad/openscad_2010.02-1.dsc
17:48 < kanzure> http://archive.amsuess.com/pool/main/o/opencsg/opencsg_1.3.0-1.dsc
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19:02  * katsmeow-afk hmms at kanzure
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19:06 < kanzure> katsmeow-afk: hm?
19:06 < kanzure> gah it's infectious!
19:07 < katsmeow-afk> oh, you gave me an idea
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20:00 < JayDugger> What's the command for the channel-bot's help?
20:00 < kanzure> !help
20:00 < hplusbot> kanzure: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
20:01 < kanzure> you're welcome
20:01 < JayDugger> Will privately messaging the bot work? so as to avoid filling the logs with trivia?
20:03 < JayDugger> Yes, and yes.
20:03 < JayDugger> Thanks, kanzure.
20:19 < JayDugger> How 'bout that. Anders publicly admits to using Modafinil.
20:19 < kanzure> does he synthesize it himself?
20:19 < JayDugger> I doubt it.
20:20 < kanzure> anders_sandberg--
20:20 < JayDugger> See his latest blog post, which links to the Times Online.
20:20 < JayDugger> http://www.aleph.se/andart/archives/2010/02/out_of_the_closet.html
20:22  * kanzure just got done reconfiguring trac and svn stuff on a server that showed up at his doorstep
20:23 < kanzure> i was expecting the file system to be much more of a mess. it's not *too* bad
20:23 < JayDugger> Secondhand box?
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20:23 < kanzure> JayDugger: nah, startup and NDAs and contracted work :/
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21:03 < kanzure> "To avoid sexual innuendo, the Wii should've been named the Perfect Nintendo Entertainment System, or PNES for short"
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21:12 < kanzure> hm i'm not sure how these guys were doing development
21:12 < kanzure> everything was under apache
21:12 < kanzure> and they had their www root under svn
21:12 < kanzure> and then they had local copies in their /home/ of www
21:13 < kanzure> but no alternative apache configurations, so were they pushing changes before they knew whether or not they would work?
21:13 < kanzure> s/pushing/committing/
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21:37 < kanzure> oh lovely they had uncommitted code in the root www working copy *written on top of* a tagged version :/
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23:05 < ybit> kanzure: did you ever recall the word from orion's arm where people choose to ignore rl and spend all their time in sl?
23:06 < kanzure> no
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23:11 < ybit> http://old.orionsarm.com/glossary.html
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23:58 < kanzure> accelerometers attached to fingers as a keyboard: http://www.sigchi.org/chi97/proceedings/paper/fkm.htm
23:58 < kanzure> 200 symbols/min and 52 symbols in total. ehh
23:58 < kanzure> if that's only one hand, then at most you're talking about 80 wpm
23:58 < kanzure> which is actually better than all the damn alternatives