--- Log opened Fri Jul 09 00:00:17 2010 00:28 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 00:41 -!- nsh [~nsh@druim.force9.co.uk] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 00:41 -!- nsh [~nsh@druim.force9.co.uk] has joined #hplusroadmap 00:49 -!- jennifer [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 00:56 -!- nsh [~nsh@druim.force9.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:12 -!- jennifer [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #hplusroadmap ["Leaving"] 01:15 -!- jennifer_ [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 01:26 -!- jennifer_ [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:31 -!- jennifer [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:09 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279558942.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:17 -!- splicer [~foo@92.39.2.11] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:52 -!- streety [~s0678364@cpat002.wlan.net.ed.ac.uk] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:58 < cluckj> kanzure well, I have an evil twin 04:02 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:04 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:09 -!- Noahj [~noah@24.38.188.78] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:26 -!- jennifer [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:58 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@75-147-59-54-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:08 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@75-147-59-54-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 05:35 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@75-147-59-54-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 06:13 -!- splicer [~foo@92.39.2.11] has quit [] 06:24 < kanzure> markus schmidt is up on the stream at the moment 06:25 < kanzure> http://www.tvworldwide.com/events/bioethics/100708/globe_show/default_go.cfm?live=1&type=flv 06:26 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: mheld] 06:26 < kanzure> "gutenberg of biology" >_> 06:30 < kanzure> "german ethics council" "ethics council of the german parliament" 06:33 < ybit> my ass hurts 06:34 < ybit> maybe i should sleep 06:34 * ybit creates more noise in the irc room 06:34 < ybit> noise! eek! 06:34 < kanzure> cool second time human enhancement has been brought up 06:36 < ybit> going on ~30 hours of no sleep, wondering if this will be broadcasts @ some other point, maybe on cpsan's site? 06:36 < kanzure> synbiosafe.eu had a documentary film? 06:36 < ybit> http://synbiosafe.eu/ for you clickers 06:37 < ybit> kanzure: hrm, http://www.synbiosafe.eu/DVD/Trailer.html 06:40 < kanzure> http://www.bio-fiction.com/ 06:40 < ybit> yar 06:42 < ybit> yay, no slides, time to rest the eyes 06:51 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has joined #hplusroadmap 06:53 < ybit> i like this guy :) 06:54 < kanzure> did you watch yesterday? 06:54 < ybit> nope 06:54 < kanzure> buchanan's talk is worth watching 06:54 < uniqanomaly> yeah, fuck religion 06:54 < kanzure> uh 06:55 < ybit> he's not saying this :P 06:55 < kanzure> uniqanomaly: i don't feel that your opinion on fucking theology is healthy 06:55 < ybit> do they have an archive of the talks? 06:55 < kanzure> ybit: actually, yes 06:55 < uniqanomaly> theology is *fucking* interpretation, not using religion to guide your life 06:56 < kanzure> uniqanomaly: there are some very thoughtful theologians that are not completely crazy 06:56 < uniqanomaly> perhaps, in oposite to stupid fucking fanatics believers who cannot think by themselves 06:57 < uniqanomaly> well, they just cant 06:57 < kanzure> can you go away? i don't know if you've ever said anything insightful in here 06:57 < uniqanomaly> ;-] 06:58 < uniqanomaly> please don't look at me, I'm not worth it 06:58 < kanzure> wtf? 06:58 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has quit [Quit: mheld] 06:58 -!- genehacker_ [~chatzilla@cpe-66-68-110-194.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 06:59 < kanzure> the transcriber sucks again 07:00 < uniqanomaly> ahahahah 07:00 < kanzure> ybit: are you watching the stream? 07:00 < kanzure> ybit: i just screwed something up.. can you copy and paste the entire transcript when it's done? 07:00 < ybit> hrm, i can try 07:01 < kanzure> hm http://www.streamtext.net/text.aspx?event=100708_bioethics&chat=false&control=false&header=false&footer=false&title=false&fs=12&bgc=333333&ff=Verdana&content-style=color:white 07:01 < kanzure> cool you can set chat=true 07:03 < ybit> is anyone else chatting? :) 07:05 < ybit> david who? 07:05 < ybit> David Rejeski 07:06 < kanzure> do you have all of the text from the previous speakers? 07:06 < ybit> i saw some of your stuff in email 07:06 < ybit> nothing here though: http://www.bioethics.gov/meetings/transcripts/ 07:06 < kanzure> um 07:06 < kanzure> that's not what i'm asking 07:06 < kanzure> on the live stream page, there's a stream of text 07:06 < ybit> right 07:06 < kanzure> i'm asking you to copy and paste that 07:06 < kanzure> into, say, an email 07:07 < ybit> oh, i was waiting until they ended 07:07 < kanzure> k 07:09 -!- danielfalck [~chatzilla@pool-71-111-61-3.ptldor.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:09 -!- danielfalck [~chatzilla@pool-71-111-61-3.ptldor.dsl-w.verizon.net] has left #hplusroadmap [] 07:12 < kanzure> interdigitate? 07:12 < kanzure> "interdigitation - An interlinking that resembles the fingers of two hands being locked together" i guess 07:13 -!- ybit [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:24 -!- ybit-grr [4c1df68b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.29.246.139] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:26 < ybit-grr> as i was saying before losing cnxn, kanzure, i sent you the log that i had since i figured you are now logging 07:27 < ybit-grr> heather lady? 07:27 < ybit-grr> kanzure: hope you're logging these people's names :) 07:39 -!- splicer [~patrik@h126n1c1o261.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:44 < kanzure> diybio-nyc update http://codexlib.blogspot.com/2010/07/problem-of-modern-web-centric-age.html 07:51 -!- streety [~s0678364@cpat002.wlan.net.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:53 -!- ybit [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:00 < ybit-grr> go you server for getting back on your feet 08:04 -!- ybit-grr [4c1df68b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.29.246.139] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:08 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:18 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:24 < ybit> http://www.streamtext.net/text.aspx?event=100708_bioethics&chat=true&control=true&header=true&footer=true&title=true&fs=12&bgc=333333&ff=Delicious&content-style=color:white 08:24 < ybit> chat=true does nothing 08:37 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 08:48 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 09:06 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-209.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:20 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-94-166.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 09:24 < kanzure> ybit: it makes a chat room for me :) 09:33 < kanzure> okay, emailed out the day-two transcript 09:37 < kanzure> http://groups.google.com/group/diybio/tree/browse_frm/thread/08b5da86b61a8154/c383a5b14adea1a3?rnum=1&_done=%2Fgroup%2Fdiybio%2Fbrowse_frm%2Fthread%2F8b5da86b61a8154%3F#doc_8011b22bc6ee0501 09:41 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@75-147-59-54-NewEngland.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 10:25 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@198.105.45.124] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:28 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@18.214.1.207] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:56 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 11:00 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@18.214.1.207] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 12:57 < kanzure> "it is possible to push a human's visible spectrum into the IR range, with a long treatment of Vitamin A (http://www.edkeyes.org/blog/050825.html)" 12:58 < kanzure> http://www.edkeyes.org/blog/050825.html 12:58 < kanzure> "No behavioral studies were done, but they did extract the retinas and perform some spectral analysis, with the result that there was indeed some alteration of the photopigments, specifically the addition of a second form with sensitivity shifted redward by about 20nm." 13:00 < kanzure> http://vm.uconn.edu/~lundquis/links.html#sensation 13:03 -!- streety [~Jonathan@host86-179-78-107.range86-179.btcentralplus.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:07 -!- streety [~Jonathan@host86-179-78-107.range86-179.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:08 < cluckj> cool 13:08 < cluckj> time to get some vitamin a 13:13 < kanzure> Sekuler, R., and Blake, R. (1994). Perception (3rd ed.). Springfield, Ill.: Thomas. pg 62-63 13:13 < kanzure> Rubin, M. L., and Walls, G. L. (1969). Fundamentals of visual science. Springfield, Ill.: Thomas. 13:14 < kanzure> "The following story dramatizes how photopigments determine what one can see. During World War II, the United States Navy wanted its sailors to be able to see infrared signal lights that would be invisible to the enemy. Normally, it is impossible to see infrared radiation because, as pointed out earlier, the wavelengths are too long for human photopigments. In order for humans to see infrared, the spectral sensitivity of some human photopigme 13:14 < kanzure> " Vision scientists knew that retinal, the derivative of vitamin A, was part of every photopigment molecule and that various forms of vitamin A existed. If the retina could be encouraged to use some alternative form of vitamin A in its manufacture of photopigments, the spectral sensitivity of those photopigments would be abnormal, perhaps extending into infrared radiation. Human volunteers were fed diets rich in an alternative form of vitamin 13:14 < kanzure> "Over several months, the volunteers' vision changed, giving them greater sensitivity to light of longer wavelengths." 13:15 < kanzure> "Though the experiment seemed to be working, it was aborted. The development of the "snooperscope," an electronic device for seeing infrared radiation, made continuation of the experiment unnecessary (Rubin and Walls, 1969). Still, the experiment demonstrates that photopigments select what one can see; changing those photopigments would change one's vision." 13:16 < cluckj> hehe 13:16 < kanzure> "snooperscope" really? that's the best name they could come up with? 13:17 < cluckj> still a sweet experiment 13:17 < cluckj> I wanna augment my vision! 13:18 < kanzure> cluckj: have you seen http://designfiles.org/papers/Emergence%20of%20novel%20color%20vision%20in%20mice%20engineered%20to%20express%20a%20human%20cone%20photopigment.pdf 13:18 < kanzure> basically they spliced in a human cone photopigment 13:18 < kanzure> and the mice could see colors 13:19 < cluckj> haha 13:20 < cluckj> yeah, I saw that last year 13:20 < cluckj> pretty cool 13:20 < cluckj> there's been some success with genetically-modified viruses injected into the eye 13:20 < cluckj> I bet that soon we could get some sweet photopigments spliced in... 13:21 < kanzure> http://amasci.com/amateur/irgoggl.html 13:22 < cluckj> that's also cool 13:27 < kanzure> http://radar.oreilly.com/2010/07/hardware-hacking-heaven-at-osc.html 13:27 < kanzure> interesting.. there's no mention of open source hardware licensing issues :/ 13:27 < kanzure> man, it's weird how i care about that 13:27 < kanzure> i guess i don't want it to fuck anyone's life up 13:28 < kanzure> http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2010/public/schedule/topic/Hardware 13:29 < kanzure> oh i guess it's mostly software layer stuff for hardware platforms 13:42 < kanzure> http://openhardwaresummit.com/ 13:42 < kanzure> lovely.. the deadline was yesterday 13:47 < kanzure> and nobody mentioned it in the blogs 13:48 < kanzure> or anywhere on the net 14:06 < kanzure> On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 4:05 PM, Alicia Gibb wrote: 14:06 < kanzure> > Holy cats! How did find out? Lol, we actually haven't officially opened it 14:06 < kanzure> > up yet :) We're planning on announcing it next week. So you have time! 14:07 < kanzure> but.. then why was the deadline yesterday? 14:07 -!- uniqanomaly_ [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-231.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:09 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-94-166.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 14:12 < kanzure> bad link though- it's actually http://openhardwaresummit.org/ 14:13 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:36 < AJollyLife> kanzure: thanks for the link i passed it on to a friend and shes super interested 14:38 < kanzure> which link :P 14:44 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@198.105.45.124] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 14:58 < ENKI-][> http://www.newyorker.com/archive/1992/03/02/1992_03_02_036_TNY_CARDS_000362534?currentPage=all#ixzz0tCYi089K 15:00 < ENKI-][> it occurs to me that while the LINF spec for 5g computers is bullshit, it should be possible to not only create a spec for speed of logical inference measurement that is measurable, but one that is more or less computable 15:02 < ENKI-][> because for a well-defined n and a well-defined big-o expected case for logical inferences you can determine the LINF rate for anything with a defined FLOP rate 15:03 < ENKI-][> unfortunately, even high-LINF parallel systems are kind of useless. but, i'm a scruffy 15:34 < kanzure> http://www.dragonjar.org/biohacking-conceptos-basicos.xhtml 15:34 < kanzure> 15:28:05 omg/user: hey bryan how hard would it be to design a platform of actuated variable-length variable-compliance mechanical struts with damage-tolerant power and communications buses made of cheaply mass-producible interchangeable units (user) 15:37 -!- uniqanomaly_ [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-231.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:38 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has quit [Quit: mheld] 15:42 < fenn> variable compliance seems hard 15:42 < fenn> also, define cheap 15:43 < fenn> damage-tolerant communication is fairly easy, just use ethernet 15:46 < kanzure> uh i guess you could talk to him in the chat room he's in 16:07 -!- streety [~Jonathan@host86-179-78-107.range86-179.btcentralplus.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:11 -!- streety [~Jonathan@host86-179-78-107.range86-179.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:14 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:19 -!- Ian_Daniher [~it@nat-pool-128-107.olin.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 16:27 < fenn> this kinda takes the fun/mystery out of pi: 4 * (1/1 - 1/3 + 1/5 - 1/7 + 1/9 - ...) 16:31 < ENKI-][> 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 34 55? 16:32 < jrayhawk> that's taking the fun/mystery out of spirals 16:32 < jrayhawk> different thing 16:36 < fenn> how did i manage to make it through school without learning that series expansion for pi? 16:40 < fenn> How much pi could you see? Naturally, the brothers had considered this project. They had imagined a computer built from the universe. Here's how they estimated the machine's size. It has been calculated that there are about 1079 electrons and protons in the observable universe; this is the so-called Eddington number of the universe. 16:40 < fenn> 10^79 16:41 < fenn> "If pi doesn't show systematic behavior until more than ten to the seventy-seven decimal places, it would really be a disaster," Gregory said. "It would be actually horrifying." 16:41 < fenn> "I wouldn't give up," David said. "There might be some other way of leaping over the barrier--" 16:42 < fenn> the restaurant at the end of the universe 16:56 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:01 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:03 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:08 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:20 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: kristianpaul, egeste, ghchinoy, fenn 17:22 -!- Ian_Daniher [~it@nat-pool-128-107.olin.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:22 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:25 -!- Netsplit over, joins: fenn 17:25 -!- Netsplit over, joins: egeste 17:25 -!- Netsplit over, joins: kristianpaul, ghchinoy 17:27 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:38 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:42 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:49 -!- jennifer [~jennifer@c-76-103-252-106.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:03 < kanzure> not a terrible representation of diybio 18:03 < kanzure> http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-07-08/man-made-life-a-boon-with-risks-for-terror-and-error.html 18:04 < kanzure> http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2010/07/bioethics-council-hears-pleas.html 18:04 < kanzure> http://news.opb.org/article/8161-when_in_doubt_about_emerging_science_create_a_commission/ "U.S. Presidents, faced with potentially controversial biomedical research, have found an easy out: Create an ethics commission, and ask them to figure it out." 18:12 < fenn> "Create a superintelligent AI, and ask them to figure it out" 18:37 < kanzure> "You may wonder why we are offering all these details about specific countries, patenting of chemical processes, and pharmaceutical products. For a very simple reason: if patents were a necessary requirement for pharmaceutical innovation as claimed by their supporters, the large historical and cross country variations in the patent protection of medical products should have had a dramatic impact on national pharmaceutical industries." 18:37 < kanzure> "In particular, at least between 1850 and 1980, most drugs and medical products should have been invented and produced in the United States and the United Kingdom, and very little if anything in continental Europe." 18:37 < kanzure> "Further, countries such as Italy, Switzerland and, to a lesser extent, Germany, should have been the laggards of the pharmaceutical industry until recently. Instead the opposite was true for longer than a century." 19:16 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:45 -!- klafka [~klafka@96.237.129.81] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:04 < fenn> "as the material heats up, it changes the spacing between its layers, which means that lets a slightly different light wavelength through, changing color effectively. So all you have to do is put this at the focal plane of your camera, shine a reference light through it, and take an image of that, ... letting you see a heat image with a regular camera." http://redshiftsystems.com 20:13 < fenn> i wonder what happened to the "lenslet" optical DSP 20:16 < fenn> a vector optical analog computer.. zoinks 20:19 < fenn> 3d flash terrain map: http://kosmosnimki.ru/3d/ 20:42 < fenn> "When your dreams become reality, they are no longer your dreams." 20:45 < fenn> http://www.gapingvoid.com/Moveable_Type/archives/zzzzsteak12.jpg 20:52 < kanzure> i think pam non-stick cooking spray has an effect on my brain 20:52 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [] 20:52 < kanzure> does monocuortrichlormethane, difluorodichloromethane, or lecithin ring any bells for anyone? 20:53 < kanzure> i guess i meant monofluortrichlormethane 20:53 -!- jcluck [cluckj@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:54 < kanzure> Effects of exposure to Freon 11, 1,1,1-trichloroethane or perchloroethylene on the lipid and fatty-acid composition of rat cerebral cortex. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3387963 20:56 < klafka> lecithin does 20:56 < klafka> it's supposed to be a precursor to umm acetylcholine 20:56 < klafka> people recommend taking it w/ piracetam 20:56 < kanzure> hm that article was more about long-term effects on membrane composition (i.e. phospholipids) 20:56 < kanzure> klafka: any sources on that? 20:56 < klafka> on it being a precursor to acetylcholine? 20:57 * kanzure nods 20:57 < kanzure> i mean, anything in particular that you recommend linking to :P 20:57 < klafka> lemme see 20:57 -!- cluckj [sors@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:57 < klafka> i got a lot of this knowledge from the iminst a few years ago 20:57 < kanzure> no doubt 20:58 < kanzure> AJollyLife: you have some sources? 20:58 < kanzure> i know he hangs out on imminst nearly constantly :) 20:58 < klafka> i sorta stopped after i realized people were basically just dosing themselves on shit on the basis of supposition or really really scarce research 20:59 < klafka> and they'd get contradictory reports come out and everyone would switch off of one thing to something else 20:59 < klafka> so lecithin in the supplement world refers specifically to phosphatidyl choline 21:00 < kanzure> yeah, imminst.org users do *not* know how to design experiments 21:00 < fenn> http://photothrow.com if you can get past their horrific website "combines the art of photography and knitting" by switching colored threads around to make images 21:02 < fenn> i can provide anecdotal evidence that lecithin prevents "headaches" for lack of a better term after taking large doses of piracetam 21:09 < kanzure> a lot of the imminst.org stuff i'm seeing is about long-term dietary effects and so on 21:09 < kanzure> especially on brain composition 21:09 < kanzure> however, if it's a precursor to acetylcholine then i would expect to see more talk about neurotransmitters and their synthesis pathways 21:11 < kanzure> well, i guess this says it pretty clearly 21:11 < kanzure> http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/202/4364/223 "Lecithin consumption increases acetylcholine concentrations in rat brain and adrenal gland " 21:12 < kanzure> "Consumption of a single meal containing lecithin, the major source of choline occurring naturally in the diet, increased the concentrations of choline and acetylcholine in rat brain and adrenal gland. Hence, the concentration of acetylcholine in the tissues may normally be under direct, short-term nutritional control." 21:13 < kanzure> so is it bad of me to feel encouraged by the abstract since it maps to something i was suspecting might be happening? 21:14 < kanzure> pdf: http://designfiles.org/papers/neuro/Lecithin%20consumption%20increases%20acetylcholine%20concentrations%20in%20rat%20brain%20and%20adrenal%20gland.pdf 21:14 < kanzure> oops, nevermind 21:16 < kanzure> does anyone have access to that paper? 21:16 < fenn> This is a MEMS device consisting of a linear array of thin reflective ribbons that can be electrostatically driven up or down, with a separation of just a few microns, and movements of just a single micron. The general idea is very similar to the micromirror display chips from TI, but in this case instead of operating by the reflection of any type of light, the GLV chip works as a diffraction grating for a particular wavelength of laser, either r 21:17 < fenn> actually, nevermind, that is useless 21:21 < fenn> "so is it bad of me to feel encouraged by the abstract" - the point of an abstract is so you dont have to spend so much time reading the paper just to confirm your existing hunch 21:26 < kanzure> yeah but doesn't "hunch hunting" make me just as bad as imminst.org users? 21:28 < kanzure> hrm i should dig out my old mediawiki hdd.. i had a lot of notes on acetylcholine and sustained attention 21:33 < kanzure> uh maybe not 21:33 < kanzure> From The Transhumanist Wiki 21:33 < kanzure> Jump to: navigation, search 21:33 < kanzure> Previous (Suspended animation) 21:33 < kanzure> Next (Symbol) 21:33 < kanzure> er 21:33 < kanzure> http://transhumanistwiki.com/wiki/Sustained_attention 21:34 < kanzure> "Repeated pretreatment with amphetamine sensitizes increases in cortical acetylcholine release" 21:34 < kanzure> i suppose my massive adderall intake might have something to do with it 21:38 < kanzure> "Human Retinas Synthesize and Release Acetylcholine" gur? 21:43 < kanzure> fenn: what do you think the likelihood of semantic sensemaking leading to any meaningful results in neuroscience? 21:43 < kanzure> part of the reason for human_brain.yaml was so that i could have a way to automatically query my 'knowledge' of the brain 21:43 < kanzure> without having to review every single paper evar 21:59 -!- kive [~kive@unaffiliated/kive] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:00 -!- kive [~kive@www.kive.me] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:06 -!- klafka [~klafka@96.237.129.81] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:09 < kanzure> experience vault for lecithin: http://www.erowid.org/experiences/subs/exp_Lecithin.shtml 22:11 < kanzure> "lipotrophics cause the liver to produce lecithin" 22:24 -!- jcluck [cluckj@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:24 -!- jcluck [~cluckj@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:10 < fenn> i think human_brain.yaml is a great start 23:10 < fenn> i was just telling someone about it yesterday 23:10 < fenn> aurelia had gotten out her 'human brain coloring book' for some reason 23:11 < fenn> btw, 'machinery of life' by goodsell is a book i could just look at for hours 23:12 < kanzure> my original scheme was to write some python library for navigating human_brain.yaml 23:12 < kanzure> so, there's supposed to be some sort of standardized coordinate system for brains and so on 23:13 < kanzure> but in reality, there's no mapping of different anatomical structures to the coords 23:13 < kanzure> unless you have an fmri data set that you are playing around with 23:13 < fenn> seems difficult, as it's sort of relational, i.e. 'from this lobe to this crevice is X' 23:13 < kanzure> part of my scheme was to just say screw it and instead just work on it from a semantic layer 23:13 < kanzure> right 23:13 < kanzure> so instead, why not just some semantic navigation thingy 23:13 < kanzure> where you could query "what is left of this structure" 23:13 < kanzure> interactive fiction style i guess (?) 23:14 < fenn> i think you would need some kind of graphical/coordinate based system to make any sense of it 23:14 < kanzure> the allen brain institute released some software for navigating their mouse brain data in 3d 23:14 < kanzure> dunno if you remember me showing you that 23:14 < kanzure> you could turn on/off gene expression in different regions, and see a highlighted region of the brain in opengl 23:14 < kanzure> but it wasn't granular at all 23:14 < kanzure> not to the level of detail of individual pathways, thalamocortical circuits, or things like that 23:15 < fenn> wait a minute, lecithin is supposedly a psychotropic? 23:15 < kanzure> is it? 23:16 < fenn> oh, no, just "a cure to brain ailment" 23:16 < kanzure> yeah erowid didn't deliver :( 23:18 < kanzure> what i would like is a map or general approximation of the different wiring diagrams of the brain 23:18 < kanzure> and the f 23:18 < kanzure> low of neurotransmitters and inhibitory or excitatory pathways 23:20 < fenn> like a kegg diagram sort of? 23:20 < kanzure> or http://reactome.org/ i guess 23:21 < fenn> just throw a couple million dollars a few neuroscience institutes at it 23:23 < kanzure> btw i'm thinking about applyingbtw i'm thinking about submitting a talk to http://openhardwaresummit.org/ 23:23 < kanzure> sigh irssi 23:24 < fenn> reactome is much easier to jump into 23:24 < fenn> kegg has like crashed my browser or something 23:24 < kanzure> i just deleted a full copy of kegg from davinci the other day 23:25 < fenn> is there even any info about openhardwaresummit anywhere? did you just find their stub page with google? 23:25 < kanzure> there's no info about it out there 23:26 < kanzure> so yeah it was random googling 23:26 < kanzure> hm wait a sec.. they changed their page 23:26 < kanzure> well, my email had the relevant content 23:41 < kanzure> i don't get it: http://www.luxresearchinc.com/ 23:50 -!- JayDugger [~duggerj@pool-173-74-76-197.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:51 < JayDugger> Good morning, everyone. --- Log closed Sat Jul 10 00:00:17 2010