--- Log opened Tue Jul 20 00:00:12 2010 --- Day changed Tue Jul 20 2010 00:00 < fenn> foo?? does something supposedly but never seems to work 00:00 < fenn> i can't remember why i liked bpython over ipython 00:02 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 00:02 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@93.182.130.54] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 01:12 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:15 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@124.72.19.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:16 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 02:21 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:22 -!- nsh [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 02:23 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:23 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279558760.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:25 < heath> someone just recommended vimprobable: http://www.vimprobable.org/ 02:25 -!- heath is now known as ybit2 02:25 * Utopiah likes Vimperator a lot (despite Flash/PDF/... awkwardness) 02:27 < ybit2> i use firefox and chromium for most everything atm 02:28 < Utopiah> try http://vimium.github.com/ then, very limited compared to Vimperator so far but maybe it will catchup 02:47 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:01 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:06 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:16 -!- kyb3R [~kyb3R@80-186-120-40.elisa-mobile.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:18 -!- kyb3R [~kyb3R@80-186-150-145.elisa-mobile.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:44 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 03:47 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@124.72.19.30] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:00 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:04 -!- Splicer [~Patrik@92.39.2.9] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:14 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:28 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:00 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:02 -!- mheld_ [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:02 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:04 -!- ybit2 [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:05 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:06 -!- mheld_ [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 05:08 -!- mheld_ [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:23 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:40 < bdesk> fenn: probably because #python loves bpython and hates ipython 05:43 -!- superkuh [~hukrepus@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 05:44 -!- superkuh [hukrepus@c-24-245-50-49.hsd1.wi.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:44 -!- superkuh [hukrepus@c-24-245-50-49.hsd1.wi.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 05:44 -!- superkuh [hukrepus@unaffiliated/superkuh] has joined #hplusroadmap 06:23 < kanzure> bdesk: 06:23 < kanzure> and i guess everyone else that cares 06:23 < kanzure> http://hplusmagazine.com/ is back 06:26 < Splicer> weee 06:55 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:02 -!- cluckj [~cluckj@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:02 -!- cluckj [~cluckj@cpe-72-231-169-163.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:07 -!- nima [~nima@adsl-75-45-241-55.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:07 -!- nima [~nima@adsl-75-45-241-55.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:11 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:15 -!- Splicer [~Patrik@92.39.2.9] has quit [Quit: Lämnar] 07:19 -!- mheld_ [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: mheld_] 07:48 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:53 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:58 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:00 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:01 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:01 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:10 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@93.182.130.26] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:10 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 08:13 -!- Noahj [~noa@24.38.188.78] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:15 -!- Noahj1 [~noah@c-24-62-35-233.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 08:15 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.74.74.plusnet.ptn-ag2.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:38 -!- SeH_ [~SeH_2@c-71-61-176-250.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:45 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@124.72.19.30] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:47 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [] 09:29 -!- splicer [~patrik@h126n1c1o261.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 09:30 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@93.182.130.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 09:40 < kanzure> haha someone finally found my fake twitter accounts :) 09:40 < kanzure> http://www.reddit.com/r/reddit.com/comments/crbfh/this_guy_has_2700_gmail_accounts_link_to_text/ 09:44 < bdesk> wtf 09:48 < bkero> kanzure: You realize you just gave me the most massive gmailfs FUSE RAID ever constructed, right? 09:50 < kanzure> "fuse raid"? 09:50 < kanzure> fusefs? 09:50 < kanzure> i have no idea what you just said 09:53 < bkero> kanzure: FUSE = filesystem in user space 09:53 < bkero> RAID = Redundent array of Inexpensive Disks 09:53 < bkero> Redundant 09:53 < bkero> SOmeone made a filesystem that has storage backed by gmail 09:54 < kanzure> ah 09:54 < kanzure> right, yes i've used that before 09:56 < bkero> Imagine setting that up with 2200 accounts, then RAIDing them together. 09:56 < kanzure> mmm 10:06 < splicer> feed from second day of BIOFAB meeting just stared: http://www.biofab.org/communitymeeting 10:07 < bdesk> kanzure: whatever those accounts are, im pretty sure they are violating someones terms of service 10:09 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:25 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 10:44 < kanzure> bdesk: they are not real accounts.. try a few of them. 10:47 < kanzure> http://torrentfreak.com/worlds-first-pirate-internet-provider-launches-in-sweden-100720/ 10:49 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:52 < kanzure> should i be watching the biofab stuff or doing "work" 10:57 < bdesk> i like the ideas of the pyscholar and apt-get-hardware-store projects 10:58 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:01 < kanzure> bdesk: :) 11:01 < kanzure> random assertion? 11:01 < kanzure> bkero: are you going to mozilla drumbeat 2010? 11:03 < kanzure> bdesk: oh, btw, on the pyscholar front 11:03 < kanzure> i was trying to rally up some interest from the zotero folks 11:03 < kanzure> zotero.org is commonly known for the firefox extension but they also have an open source server package thing going on 11:03 < bkero> kanzure: Isn't that in Europe? 11:03 < kanzure> where people can synchronize papers across their different firefox sessions 11:03 < bkero> I don't think they're going to fly me over there. 11:03 < kanzure> bkero: if they really loved you, they would fly you over 11:03 < kanzure> you're doomed 11:04 < bkero> kanzure: lol, maybe when I'm not an intern 11:04 < kanzure> bdesk: so, recently they had a major version shift or update (or finally went open source on the server-side software?) 11:04 < kanzure> bdesk: so i used that as an opportunity to suggest something related to pyscholar 11:04 < kanzure> in particular, i think it's a terrible idea that zotero's "translators" (scrapers) are on the user-side 11:05 < kanzure> right now the workflow goes like this: you go to a website that has the paper you want, you press scrape, javascript starts parsing the page and extracting the metadata 11:05 < bdesk> you want it to be server side so they can cache it and have a huge database? 11:05 < kanzure> but i suggested this: you press the button, it sends the HTML content to zotero.org, and zotero.org has an actively maintained set of scrapers 11:05 < kanzure> welll 11:05 < kanzure> caching would be hawt, but no 11:06 < kanzure> there'd just be one single point of failure 11:06 < bdesk> are the scrapers user-written ? 11:06 < kanzure> so everyone would update the translator to make it work on the server-side.. so that way you always have up-to-date scrapers 11:06 < kanzure> scrapers/translators are sorta user-written.. that's the primary contribution that user-developers make to the zotero project 11:07 < bdesk> how are the translators kept up to date now? 11:07 < kanzure> someone notices it's broken and eventually someone else fixes it, submits it to zotero.org, and the firefox extension will eventually check for an updated version 11:07 < bdesk> does the firefox plugin say something like 'click here to upgrade your PLOS scraper'? 11:08 < kanzure> i want to say yes but i can't remember ever reading a message like that 11:08 < bdesk> so you would prefer the translators to be written in python so they could be more easily incorporated into the borg? also will the javascript translators run without the browser? 11:09 < bdesk> javascript seems to be drinking more and more of python's milkshakes 11:09 < kanzure> theoretically the javascript translators *could* run without a browser.. i.e. something like mozilla-spidermonkey but a lot of it is heavily browser-dependent and integrated with the DOM 11:09 < kanzure> also i haven't ever successfully used a non-browser implementation of javascript 11:10 < kanzure> i don't know if scrapers should be written in python- that's definitely one possibility 11:10 < bdesk> i was just using python as an example of a more server-side language that you were suggesting. 11:11 < kanzure> a lot of what the scrapers tend to be are just xpaths.. //[a@id='5']/div/[div@class='390141']/font 11:12 < Utopiah> you can use Google V8 as a VM to run JavaScript outsde of the browser and rather efficiently as that (that's what NodeJS is based on) 11:12 < bdesk> so you could somehow incorporate these into pyscholar, or you would rather just steer zotero towards becoming something you could use instead of pyscholar? 11:12 < kanzure> zotero.org is a pretty interesting community.. i've never seen any other "community of scraper writers" 11:13 < bdesk> where is most of the community? 11:13 < kanzure> bdesk: well, if zotero is successfully steered in that direction, pyscholar would probably just use a zotero-web-api thing under the hood but still otherwise be the same 11:13 < kanzure> bdesk: the mailing list (maybe the forums?) 11:13 < kanzure> i.e. zotero-dev 11:13 < kanzure> http://groups.google.com/group/zotero-dev 11:14 < kanzure> lawl "If contributing a site translator, please post the JS file to the Files section and then send a note to the list." 11:14 < kanzure> awful.. 11:14 < bdesk> you mean awful compared to github or something? 11:16 < kanzure> why not just email a patch, or give out svn access, or something 11:18 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:19 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:23 < kyb3R> I used to use zotero, but not anymore 11:24 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:24 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:24 < kanzure> yeah i don't use it so often any more either 11:24 < kanzure> the interface is pretty clunky- probably works best if you have a few extra monitors to spare 11:25 < kyb3R> nowadays I'm satisfied with lyx and Pybliographic 11:25 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:26 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:29 < kyb3R> and Dia satisfies most of the graph needs 11:29 < kyb3R> but who knows, perhaps another kind of set next year 11:30 < kanzure> huh? why is dia/graphviz relevent here? does zotero do some sort of graphing funtion 11:30 < kanzure> *function 11:30 < kyb3R> it was a bit off-topic 11:30 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Client Quit] 11:31 < kyb3R> nevermind 11:32 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@93.182.130.86] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:33 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:34 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:35 < kanzure> oh i guess you might mean graphing the citation tree 11:35 < kanzure> well, in some cases it's a network :/ 11:36 < kanzure> how does this monitor for new publications by an author? http://codingseed.com/ 11:36 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:37 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:38 < bdesk> i wonder if there is a citation cycle 11:39 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@93.182.130.86] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:43 < kanzure> sometimes people cite an article that is forthcoming (i.e. something they reviewed) 11:44 -!- streety [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 11:49 -!- nima [~nima@adsl-75-45-241-55.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 11:49 -!- nima [~nima@unaffiliated/nima] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:00 -!- Noahj1 [~noah@c-24-62-35-233.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:02 -!- klafka [~klafka@129.21.68.103] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:04 -!- Noahj1 [~noah@c-24-62-35-233.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:11 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:11 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:14 -!- genehacker [~chatzilla@cpe-66-68-110-194.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:37 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:43 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:52 < kanzure> "The position of the ISSCR Task Force is that the provision of an untested experimental or innovative therapy to more than two participants is a departure from recommended pratice and should be tested in a regulated and authorized clinical trior prior to being offered for sale." 12:52 < kanzure> actually that's not so bad 13:21 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:21 -!- elmom [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:24 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 13:29 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:33 -!- genehacker [~chatzilla@cpe-66-68-110-194.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:35 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:36 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:43 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 13:46 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:48 < kanzure> what is ginkgo bioworks going to do if biobricks don't deliver on their promises? 13:52 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:54 < cluckj> who owns them? 13:58 < kanzure> who owns what? ginkgo or biobrick parts? 13:58 < cluckj> ginko bioworks 13:58 < kanzure> it's a tom knight thing 13:59 < kanzure> http://ginkgobioworks.com/about.html 14:03 < cluckj> hehe 14:07 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:11 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:11 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:14 -!- streety [~Jonathan@93.182.130.64] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:20 < fenn> i love when they put in the extra effort to let you know that they're using a mac: http://vonautomatisch.at/media/uploads/grappelli/grappelli.jpg 14:20 < fenn> mac snobs are cute in a disgusting sort of way 14:21 < kanzure> fenn: http://cupidtino.com/ 14:21 < kanzure> you can register on cupidtino once you buy your ipad 14:21 < fenn> sample size of 2 is not very large 14:21 < fenn> lol, really? is this an april fool's joke? 14:22 < kanzure> no it's real :( 14:22 < fenn> do i have to put gel in my hair to join? 14:22 < kanzure> ah this is more descriptive: http://cupidtino.com/about 14:22 < kanzure> "beautiful new dating site" 14:22 < kanzure> my kidneys hurt 14:23 < fenn> "do you wear all white and lay around on the floor? this site's for you!" 14:24 < kanzure> it's a bed 14:24 < fenn> self-identified as hipsters 14:24 < kanzure> "This site is designed exclusively for Apple fans, and can only be accessed using an Apple product (Mac, iPhone or iPad)." oh please 14:25 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 14:25 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:26 < fenn> "Sending messages is free. 14:26 < fenn> Reading them requires a paid membership ($4.79/month)." 14:26 < fenn> SIGN ME UP 14:27 < fenn> they must have put several minutes of hard thought into that business model 14:31 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:34 < kanzure> "Thank you for attending the special screening of Transcendent Man on July 21, 2010 at 7pm sharp. Doors will open at 6:30pm. The screening is sold out, so please plan to arrive early to find your seats prior to the start of the show." 14:35 < fenn> hate mail sent. 14:35 * fenn pats self on back 14:38 < ghchinoy> cool, kanzure, you'll have to post a review somewhere 14:38 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279558760.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:38 < ghchinoy> I haven't seen any of Kurzweil's movies yet :\ 14:38 < kanzure> ghchinoy: i'm not going to be in the area tomorrow 14:39 < kanzure> so i was going to give the ticket to fenn or bkero 14:40 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:41 < kanzure> ew andrew wants to outsource all the technical stuff for pink army to ginkgo bioworks :( 14:42 < ghchinoy> oof 14:42 < ghchinoy> Where is it, NYC? 14:43 < kanzure> near menlo park, californiaB[B[B[B[B 14:44 < ghchinoy> I've a friend in portola valley, dunno if he'd want to go... but it's all sold out? 14:44 -!- lepton [~john@80.sub-75-220-85.myvzw.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:47 < bkero> kanzure: :) 14:49 < bkero> :w 14:49 < bkero> :q 14:49 -!- klafka [~klafka@129.21.68.103] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:50 < bkero> Stupid terminal thingie 14:50 < nsh__> fenn, what you sending haetmael about? 15:04 < fenn> apple dating site 15:05 < fenn> i recommended that they start a new website with black background and for non-mac only 15:05 < fenn> charging 9.74/mo to read messages but not to send 15:09 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:12 -!- nsh__ [~nsh@87.112.30.216.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:19 -!- nimak [~nima@75.45.224.183] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:20 -!- lepton [~john@80.sub-75-220-85.myvzw.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 15:22 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:22 -!- nima [~nima@unaffiliated/nima] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:26 < kanzure> biohacklab hakerspace http://www.tmplab.org/2010/07/20/biohacklab-hackerspace/ 15:26 < kanzure> their name is /tmp/lab? hmm 15:27 < kanzure> http://www.lsdlive.org/biohack_101.pdf 15:27 < kanzure> http://www.lsdlive.org/biology/biohack_102.pdf 15:27 < kanzure> actual link to the first one is http://www.lsdlive.org/biology/biohack_101.pdf 15:33 < kanzure> http://coffeeandsci.wordpress.com/2009/09/08/biohackers-je-prefere-biopunks/ 15:33 < QuantumG> oh, french 15:34 < QuantumG> surprisingly understandable french 15:35 < kanzure> http://lianabrooks.blogspot.com/2010/07/how-to-design-your-own-virus.html 15:35 < kanzure> yeah :) 15:35 < kanzure> dunno what sung is talking about here http://friendfeed.com/bookhling/b4596719/so-consensus-seem-to-be-no-biohacking-without 15:36 < QuantumG> hey, next time you go to something that has a "bioethics" panel, I dare you to make open access and patent-free research a topic 15:36 < kanzure> why? 15:36 < kanzure> isn't that usually the topic? 15:36 < QuantumG> no. 15:37 < QuantumG> usually "bioethics" is just a euphemism for "why amateurs shouldn't be doing this" 15:37 < fenn> seconded 15:37 < kanzure> maybe i just think differently, to me it's an issue of "ethics of innovation" (because primarily a lot of "innovation" involves lots of shady unethical bullshit) 15:37 < kanzure> but you're right most people probably don't consider that 15:38 < QuantumG> and also "how can we add more regulation to this?" 15:38 < QuantumG> which is just a left-over from the 60s when they were calling for licensing of genetic engineering researchers 15:38 < QuantumG> and they never stopped 15:39 < kanzure> can anyone find names behind /tmp/lab in paris or biohacklabhackerspace? 15:40 < Utopiah> /tmp/lab has its own wiki and #frlab on freenode 15:41 < kanzure> ooh lots of nice activity in there 15:41 < Utopiah> not right now because of Estive Numerique 15:41 < Utopiah> http://www.estivenumerique.org/ south of France 15:47 -!- genehacker [~chatzilla@cpe-66-68-110-194.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:51 < fenn> philippe langlois (philippelanglois(at)free.fr), st. eloy, france 15:52 < Utopiah> yes 15:58 < kanzure> Utopiah: do you know amael assour? 16:04 < Utopiah> nop I dont think so, what is he working on 16:04 < Utopiah> ? 16:06 < cluckj> hah 16:07 < cluckj> just for that I'm going to put myself on a bioethics panel at the next conference I go to 16:09 < kanzure> how do indian phone numbers work 16:10 < kanzure> if i want to make a call to, say, somewhere in karnataka and only have this for a phone number: 23666061 16:11 < kanzure> i know the country code is 91 and bangalore has a prefix of 80, but i'm not sure how to put that together (for instance, is it 9180?) 16:12 < cluckj> let me see if my roommate is around 16:13 < cluckj> nope, sorry 16:13 < kanzure> "No prefix is required to call from one landline to another in the same STD area. A prefix of "0+STD code" is required to dial from a landline phone in one STD code area to another. A prefix of "0+STD code" is required to dial from a mobile phone in India to any landline number, irrespective of STD area." 16:13 < cluckj> his family lives in india 16:13 < kanzure> wtf is this shit 16:15 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-219-130.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:16 < kanzure> ok i guess it's 99-80-23666061 16:16 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:25 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-219-130.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Quit: uniqanomaly] 16:35 -!- lepton [~john@m3b0536d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:37 -!- Traveler08 [~fn-javach@96.49.148.166] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:40 < kanzure> hi Traveler08 16:55 < fenn> bkero: going to ephemerisle? there will be giant floating hamster balls 16:57 < bkero> fenn: hvent heard of it before 16:57 < fenn> http://fenn.freeshell.org/not_ephemerisle.png 16:58 < fenn> http://groups.google.com/group/floating-festival 17:00 < fenn> more background info http://ephemerisle.org/ 17:01 < fenn> btw you wouldnt happen to have any junky bicycles would you? 17:02 < fenn> someone i know wants to make a bike boat 17:10 -!- AJollyLife1 [~Jolly@unaffiliated/ajollylife] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:11 -!- AJollyLife [~Jolly@unaffiliated/ajollylife] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 17:32 -!- AJollyLife1 is now known as AJollyLife 17:35 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:36 -!- Traveler08 [~fn-javach@96.49.148.166] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:40 -!- mheld [~mheld@216.214.247.202] has quit [Quit: mheld] 18:30 -!- nimak [~nima@75.45.224.183] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:30 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:46 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:59 < kanzure> i have no idea what bre is talking about here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XouksnwOoA4 18:59 -!- JayDugger [~duggerj@pool-173-74-76-197.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:07 -!- genehacker [~chatzilla@cpe-66-68-110-194.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 19:08 < bdesk> that is viral marketing for warner brothers 19:10 < klafka> what's DCP? 19:10 < bdesk> it's an ad 19:11 < kanzure> bdesk: how do you know? 19:11 < bdesk> that is like wondering about the secret message for the decoder ring in your breakfast cereal 19:12 < kanzure> i don't eat cereals much, maybe this is why i am confused 19:13 -!- jennifer2 [~jennifer@c-67-180-253-94.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:14 < klafka> is anyone here going to defcon? 19:14 < klafka> out of curiosity 19:15 < QuantumG> I'm sure my coworkers are 19:15 < JayDugger> No. 19:15 < klafka> a bunch of people i know are doing deco/dj'ing for it 19:16 < bdesk> sounds like a corporate trade show 19:16 < klafka> it's a big hackercon 19:16 < bdesk> i know that it used to be 19:16 < klafka> idk it doesn't seem super trade showy 19:17 < klafka> but i'm only seeing it from one side 19:17 -!- nima [~nima@adsl-75-45-226-58.dsl.sfldmi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:22 < bdesk> http://www.net-security.org/article.php?id=1157 19:24 < kanzure> speaking of vulnerability markets, i really enjoy reading dacho danchev 19:24 < kanzure> *danho danchev 19:24 < kanzure> grr 19:24 < kanzure> *dancho 19:25 < kanzure> http://ddanchev.blogspot.com/ 19:35 < fenn> who the hell came up with 'ecards' anyway, and were they distributing malware? 19:35 < fenn> i just dont see how it could be a good thing 19:37 < fenn> and that blog doesnt say anything about vulnerability markets 19:37 < fenn> also how the heck do you sell a secret 19:38 < fenn> "i know something. pay me a million bucks or else." 19:38 < JayDugger> I'll give you $20 for your credit card number and CCV. 19:38 -!- jennifer2 [~jennifer@c-67-180-253-94.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:38 < fenn> nah usually people will give it if you just ask 19:39 < fenn> "name? dob? ssn? cc?" 19:39 < fenn> i wonder if people will ever get as uptight about sharing other sorts of information as they are with ssn's 19:39 < JayDugger> Sure. No. No. No. 19:39 < JayDugger> Yes. 19:40 < fenn> you don't count, you're a libertarian 19:40 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:40 < JayDugger> eVerify caused a great deal of grief where I work. 19:40 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:40 < fenn> wha's that 19:40 < JayDugger> So did the employer trying to apply TSA guidelines to non-pilots. 19:41 < fenn> what, like you arent allowed to drink 24 hours before going to work? 19:41 < JayDugger> Another silly government program designed to ensure only citizens and green card holders get to work at companies with certain kinds of Federal contracts. 19:42 < klafka> TSA guidelines to non-pilots seems quite a bit more than that 19:42 < fenn> if the US outsources defense contractors we'll have no industry left 19:42 < JayDugger> Graduate schools. 19:42 < klafka> isn't defense contracting like ~30% of our GDP at this point ? 19:42 < JayDugger> Not hardly. 19:42 < fenn> personally i don't care, but it seems like a stupid strategy to have no business model beyond intellectual property laws 19:42 < klafka> and grad school is almost all foreign too 19:43 < fenn> right 19:43 < JayDugger> No, its mostly foreign customers. 19:43 < fenn> sth like 80% non-american grad students? 19:43 < JayDugger> That's not the same thing. 19:43 < klafka> our only export, graduate degrees 19:43 < JayDugger> Hardly. 19:43 < fenn> and coca cola 19:43 < JayDugger> There you go. :) 19:43 < fenn> (the brand, not the soda) 19:43 < klafka> heh 19:44 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 19:44 < bdesk> we can have a business model built on synergy, and the intellectual property laws are just regulations that protect our synergy. 19:45 < fenn> to quote Neo, "I know CSS!" 19:45 < JayDugger> http://www.flickr.com/photos/gregsaul/sets/72157624163677669/ 19:45 < JayDugger> Photos from the SketchChair project on Make's blog today. 19:46 < fenn> if you can't baffle 'em with bullshit, pile it higher and deeper 19:46 < JayDugger> http://gregsaul.co.nz/SketchChair/ 19:46 < JayDugger> Actual project page, not the layers of blog references available through Make. 19:47 -!- heath [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:47 < fenn> being 2d kinda makes it "so what" 19:47 < JayDugger> ? 19:48 < fenn> if it automatically sliced and made tab-slot 2d shapes for abitrary 3d shapes, that would be something 19:48 < JayDugger> It only makes chairs, fenn. 19:48 < fenn> am i missing something? how does it make the curved "butt" part in the one the guy is sitting on 19:49 < fenn> compound curvature 19:49 < JayDugger> As we said in defense contracts when the customer wanted something for nothing: "Sorry, not in scope." 19:49 * fenn watches the friggin video.. gawd! 19:50 < JayDugger> Good night, everyone. 19:50 -!- JayDugger [~duggerj@pool-173-74-76-197.dllstx.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:50 < fenn> i remember back in the old datys when webpages had explanations on them 19:52 < fenn> i like the physics integration into the cad process, that's neat 19:58 < fenn> oh, it's with takeo igarashi (maybe?) 19:58 < kanzure> "i remember back in the old days when web pages had explanations on them" :( 19:58 < fenn> he did various other sketching interfaces, like stuffed animal draw 19:59 < fenn> http://www-ui.is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp/~takeo/teddy/teddy.htm 20:00 < fenn> http://www-ui.is.s.u-tokyo.ac.jp/~takeo/research/rigid/index.html 20:01 < kanzure> i forget what they call this technique in cartoon animation studios 20:01 < kanzure> where they don't quite have 3D modeling, but there's some sort of useful manipulation process going on 20:12 < kanzure> "Google relies on Twilio [twilio.com] for their audio transcription." huh i didn't know that 20:21 -!- niftyzero1 [~miron@dsl081-070-214.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:22 < AJollyLife> klafka: im going to defcon (and most hacker cons for that matter) 20:22 < AJollyLife> klafka: bdesk: defcon is not tradeshowey, blackhat is sorta, rsa certainly is 20:23 < klafka> neato 20:23 < klafka> well be sure to check out the party, my friends are gonna do some epic deco 20:40 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:47 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:47 < AJollyLife> klafka: which party? there are tons of parties at bh/dc 20:47 < klafka> the official one? 20:48 < AJollyLife> freakshow? black and white ball? who are your friends? 20:48 < kanzure> "who are your friends?" i ask myself that every morning 20:48 < klafka> scott is organizing it iirc 20:48 < klafka> great_scott 20:49 < AJollyLife> ahh, hes playing the zombie ball 20:49 < klafka> zebbler and kate are doing deco, and let's see i think great_scott, ProfessorPious, Afromonk, Sugarpill are DJ'ing 20:50 < AJollyLife> https://www.defcon.org/html/defcon-18/dc-18-entertainment.html 20:50 < AJollyLife> dc/bh has so many parties 20:50 < klafka> yeah 20:51 < klafka> well they are largely non-overlapping it seems 20:52 < AJollyLife> no way 20:52 < AJollyLife> http://www.securityaegis.com/blackhat-and-defcon-parties/ 20:52 < AJollyLife> much overlap 20:52 < klafka> oooh 20:53 < klafka> oh i was just looking at the official ones or whatever 20:53 < klafka> i am maybe gonna try and go next year 20:53 < klafka> <_< 20:53 < AJollyLife> im at most hackercons out there...but defcon is especially busy for me, too many competitions 20:53 < klafka> aah 20:53 < klafka> do they take papers or presentations or posters or whatever? 20:54 < AJollyLife> yeah, you can apply to be a speaker. no posters. 20:54 < klafka> is it more like an academic con or more like a hobbyist con? 20:54 < AJollyLife> its a hackercon....closer to hobby con i guess 20:54 < AJollyLife> blackhat is more of an corporate con 20:54 < AJollyLife> neither are very academic 20:54 < klafka> aah i see 21:04 -!- Phreedom [~quassel@109.254.6.63] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 21:05 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:12 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-76-119-90-161.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: mheld] 21:16 -!- Noahj1 [~noah@68-116-199-177.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:22 -!- streety [~Jonathan@93.182.130.64] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 21:22 -!- streety [~Jonathan@93.182.130.34] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:36 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:36 -!- splicer [~patrik@h126n1c1o261.bredband.skanova.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:52 < kanzure> bdesk: a non-browser version of javascript http://www.mozilla.org/rhino/ 21:53 < QuantumG> there's some server-side-javascript thing too 21:53 < QuantumG> node.js ? 21:53 < QuantumG> apparently some people are into it. 22:10 -!- niftyzero1 [~miron@dsl081-070-214.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:14 -!- niftyzero1 [~miron@dsl081-070-214.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has quit [Client Quit] 22:14 -!- niftyzero1 [~miron@dsl081-070-214.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:19 -!- Splicer [~Patrik@92.39.2.10] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:34 -!- jennifer2 [~jennifer@c-67-180-253-94.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 22:44 < bkero> kanzure: you can get tracemonkey outside of javascript 22:46 -!- jennifer2 [~jennifer@c-67-180-253-94.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:31 < Splicer> who are the main transhumanist thinkers at the moment? kurtzweil, max-more, anders sandberg, who else? 23:32 < kanzure> kurzweil doesn't really associate himself with transhumanism 23:32 < kanzure> max hasn't written anything interesting in a decade (or so) but is publishing a book with his old writings 23:32 < kanzure> anders mellowed out and became an ethicist 23:32 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:33 < Splicer> who is left then? 23:33 < kanzure> uh 23:33 < Splicer> I thought kurzweil was the transhumanist posterboy 23:33 < Splicer> postergranpa 23:33 < kanzure> no.. he's the posterboy for "the law of accelerating returns" and economics-in-the-singularity 23:34 < Splicer> isn't the singularity key in transhumanism? 23:34 < kanzure> not necessarily 23:34 < Splicer> I didn't know he didn't call himself a transhumanist 23:34 -!- streety [~Jonathan@93.182.130.34] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 23:34 < kanzure> a singularity could be caused byu transhumans i guess but it's not an inevitably 23:34 < kanzure> *inevatability 23:35 < kanzure> http://kurzweilai.net/ 23:35 < kanzure> *by 23:35 < fenn> kurzweil is transhumanist he just doesn't use thw rod 23:35 < fenn> s/thw rod/ the word/ 23:35 < kanzure> god damn it what's wrong with the lags 23:36 -!- streety [~Jonathan@93.182.130.38] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:36 < fenn> dunno what a 'transhumanist thinker' is anyway 23:36 < Splicer> s there someone at the moment doing what sandberg did? 23:36 < Splicer> is 23:37 < kanzure> what exactly did anders do? 23:37 -!- streety1 [~Jonathan@91.143.127.68] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 23:37 < kanzure> write a paper on superintelligent superobjects? 23:37 < fenn> calculated some back of the napkin things relating to jupiter brains 23:37 < kanzure> heh 23:37 < fenn> i liked some of his pov-ray art 23:38 < fenn> (some of it) 23:38 < Splicer> He and max more made some efforts towards a transhumanist philosophy 23:38 < kanzure> for those who didn't know: the physics of information processing superobjects www.jetpress.org/volume5/Brains2.pdf 23:38 < kanzure> er 23:38 < kanzure> http://www.jetpress.org/volume5/Brains2.pdf 23:39 < kanzure> sure, max wrote some lists of extropian/transhumanism principles.. 23:39 < kanzure> extropian principles http://www.maxmore.com/extprn3.htm 23:39 < Splicer> is anyone doing that now? 23:39 < kanzure> but honestly that sort of document doesn't impress me 23:39 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:39 < kanzure> it's good that someone wrote it down though.. at least there's that. 23:40 < Splicer> i give up 23:40 < kanzure> what?? 23:40 < Splicer> is there someone at the helm of transhumanism? 23:40 < fenn> no 23:40 < Splicer> thank you 23:40 < kanzure> not at all 23:40 < fenn> you're welcome 23:41 < fenn> good luck herding cats, to whoever tries 23:41 < Splicer> the extropians were at the helm form a while.. they had a TAZ going 23:41 < fenn> hm rhino might have actually been useful if they wrote it in C 23:42 < kanzure> then WTA/james hughes fucked them in the ass 23:42 < fenn> what's a TAZ? 23:42 < fenn> oh, autonomous zone 23:42 < fenn> never heard about that 23:43 < Splicer> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporary_Autonomous_Zone 23:43 < kanzure> max has seriously toned down his anarchistic writings 23:43 < kanzure> to the extent that he has asked me not to publish those original articles from the extropy journals 23:43 < kanzure> :( 23:43 < QuantumG> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporary_Erogenous_Zone <- doesn't exist but should 23:44 < fenn> kanzure: what's his reasoning? 23:44 < kanzure> searching for extropy+TAZ on google brings up a lot of high quality results 23:44 < kanzure> fenn: i think you just get gradually less daring as you get older 23:44 < kanzure> has to keep his consulting gigs, etc. 23:45 < kanzure> also he asked me to hold the sex articcles 23:45 < kanzure> *articles 23:45 < kanzure> ocean colonization from extropy #5 http://www.telesterion.com/ocean.htm 23:45 < Splicer> it was a temporary zone 23:46 < fenn> kanzure: maybe he should change his name to 'tim' 23:46 < fenn> tim id 23:46 < kanzure> his original name was tim o'something 23:46 < kanzure> or tom'osomething 23:46 < fenn> oh, damn i got it wrong 23:46 < kanzure> T. O'Connor 23:47 < kanzure> oh hm 23:47 < fenn> i thought it was tom o'reilly 23:47 -!- Joeconyers [~Joe@ool-182fafef.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:47 < kanzure> you're thinking of tim o'reilly (social media bullshit) 23:47 < fenn> no 23:48 < kanzure> have you met thomas mccabe yet? 23:48 < fenn> no, why? 23:48 < kanzure> he wants to do a hostile takeover of humanity+ for some reason 23:49 < fenn> i first read about cyclomatic complexity a few months ago 23:49 < kanzure> he's a guy slightly younger than me who somehow weasled his way into singinst.org social circles and now is hot 23:49 < kanzure> "and now is hot" <- i don't know what i was typing 23:50 < fenn> so, not the same guy 23:50 < kanzure> not the same guy 23:50 < kanzure> http://www.rationalfuturist.com/ 23:50 < fenn> oh, i argued with him a little over email 23:50 < kanzure> he's a lesswrong/morewrong/whatever-fame-before-lesswrong advocate 23:50 < kanzure> s/fame/came/ 23:51 < fenn> moreright? 23:51 < fenn> lol 23:52 < kanzure> ah i was thinking of overcomingbias.com 23:52 < kanzure> i met him on the net back in 2006 or 2007 but met up with him when i was hanging out with steve and anna 23:52 < kanzure> so the whole eliezer cult thing.. was strong with this one. 23:53 < kanzure> "world peace through world domination" http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/works/worlddomination.htm 23:53 < kanzure> oh boy. 23:54 < kanzure> coming from anyone else that'd be funny 23:54 < kanzure> but since michael is one of the executives for singinst.org, not so much helping the "we're not trying to take over the world with ai" argument 23:55 < kanzure> so anyway 23:55 < kanzure> i'm not really sure there's anyone qualified to be "at the helm" 23:55 < kanzure> so far some people have tried to take this role 23:55 < kanzure> by hostile takeover and arguing bullshit and rhetoric 23:59 < kanzure> Splicer: you know, aubrey might fit that role- although he's focusing on a subset of the overall problem space, and isn't really taking initiative in anything but life extension and longevity research 23:59 < Splicer> Does he call himeslf transhumanist? --- Log closed Wed Jul 21 00:00:13 2010