--- Log opened Thu Oct 14 00:00:18 2010 00:25 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 00:27 -!- Phreedom [~quassel@109.254.6.63] has joined #hplusroadmap 00:27 -!- Phreedom_ [~quassel@109.254.6.63] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:28 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has joined #hplusroadmap 00:31 < kanzure> lawl wtf http://www.programming.e-cnc.com/ 00:39 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.110.55] has quit [Quit: codeshepherd] 00:56 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: rwallace, uniqanomaly_, ferrouswheel 01:07 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: augur, memorex, ybit2, Overand, shepazu, marainein, andares, Ian_Daniher, QuantumG, ToyKeeper, (+14 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) 01:09 -!- JaredW [~JaredW@122-57-90-65.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #hplusroadmap 01:13 -!- JaredW [~JaredW@122-57-90-65.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:24 -!- wrldpc2 [~benny@205.241.56.114] has quit [Quit: wrldpc2] 01:34 -!- Phreedom_ [~quassel@109.254.6.63] has joined #hplusroadmap 01:34 -!- Phreedom [~quassel@109.254.6.63] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:55 -!- JaredW [~JaredW@122-57-90-65.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has joined #hplusroadmap 01:55 -!- Netsplit over, joins: rwallace, uniqanomaly_, ferrouswheel 02:00 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.110.55] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- memorex [~durp@97.67.109.107] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- marainein [~marainein@220.253-225-136.VIC.netspace.net.au] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- anelma [~elmom@hoasnet-fe29dd00-137.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- QuantumG [~qg@rtfm.insomnia.org] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- shepazu [~schepers@adsl-69-181-196.rmo.bellsouth.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:00 -!- nchaimov 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joined #hplusroadmap 07:14 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.110.55] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:26 -!- codeshepherd_ [~Deepan@122.167.69.190] has joined #hplusroadmap 07:30 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.110.55] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 07:30 -!- codeshepherd_ is now known as codeshepherd 07:52 -!- masked [masked@bewifi.org.au] has quit [Changing host] 07:52 -!- masked [masked@hpavc/masked] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:16 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.69.190] has quit [Quit: codeshepherd] 08:19 -!- Phreedom [~quassel@109.254.17.41] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 08:21 -!- Phreedom [~quassel@109.254.17.41] has joined #hplusroadmap 08:27 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:31 < kanzure> http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/FSF-initiates-Respects-your-Freedom-hardware-endorsement-1107844.html 08:35 -!- nimak [~nima@75.45.231.162] has quit [Quit: leaving] 08:50 < kanzure> in-browser chemical structure editor http://scitouch.net/ketcher-demo/ketcher.html 09:05 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:52 -!- Guest47872 is now known as drazak 09:54 -!- augur [~augur@129.2.129.34] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:01 -!- metaliving [~victorere@129.133.197.199] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:20 -!- rwallace [~rwallace@86-45-7-93-dynamic.b-ras2.prp.dublin.eircom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 10:24 -!- rwallace [~rwallace@86-43-168-229-dynamic.b-ras2.prp.dublin.eircom.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:24 -!- memorex [~durp@97.67.109.107] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:32 -!- Juul [~Juul@user-387g06n.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:38 -!- rwallace [~rwallace@86-43-168-229-dynamic.b-ras2.prp.dublin.eircom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:40 -!- dbolser [~dmb@bioinformatics.org] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 10:42 -!- rwallace [~rwallace@86-43-165-255-dynamic.b-ras2.prp.dublin.eircom.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 10:59 -!- augur [~augur@129.2.129.34] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:00 -!- memorex [~durp@97.67.109.107] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:01 -!- augur [~augur@129.2.129.107] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:11 -!- uniqanomaly_ [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-127.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:11 < kanzure> java api for solidworks http://www.abraxis.com/niceguy/swjava/ 11:15 < kanzure> looks like that's by Jim Sculley 11:16 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-127.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:53 -!- uniqanomaly_ [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-127.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:57 -!- uniqanomaly [~ua@dynamic-78-8-80-127.ssp.dialog.net.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 12:01 -!- DeltaVirtue [~CryptoQui@c-174-51-234-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: DeltaVirtue] 12:09 -!- Juul [~Juul@user-387g06n.cable.mindspring.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:12 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:46 -!- klafka_ is now known as klafka 12:52 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has quit [Quit: memorex] 13:08 -!- mheld [~mheld@65.88.2.5] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:10 -!- rwallace [~rwallace@86-43-165-255-dynamic.b-ras2.prp.dublin.eircom.net] has left #hplusroadmap [] 13:12 -!- mheld [~mheld@65.88.2.5] has quit [Client Quit] 13:15 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:19 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:25 -!- ybit2 is now known as ybit 13:26 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:26 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has quit [Client Quit] 13:28 < kanzure> kevin kelly's new book "what technology wants" is out 13:28 < kanzure> http://www.kk.org/books/what-technology-wants.php 13:29 < kanzure> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0670022152/ref=nosim/kkorg-20 13:34 -!- ybit [~quassel@unaffiliated/ybit] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:37 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-75-69-89-109.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:37 < kanzure> http://io9.com/5663276/a-gorgeous-homemade-time-machine-running-on-open-source-hardware 13:38 < kanzure> hmm are these guys genuinely interested in open source hardware standards? 13:38 < kanzure> http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2010/10/automating-the-maker-revolution.html 13:38 < kanzure> http://www.adafruit.com/blog/2010/10/14/automating-the-maker-revolution/ 13:38 < kanzure> i don't know why marcin could never quite get convinced 13:44 < kanzure> the humanity+ conference has only one slot available for a talk.. should i choose joseph jackson or forrest higgs? :( 13:46 -!- killall-9 [~paulc@diana.null.ro] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:51 -!- augur_ [~augur@129.2.129.34] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:51 -!- augur [~augur@129.2.129.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 14:32 -!- klafka [~klafka@129.21.75.13] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:39 -!- M-xDaeken [~Daeken@cpe-98-14-145-73.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:01 -!- metaliving [~victorere@129.133.197.199] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:25 -!- M-xDaeken [~Daeken@cpe-98-14-145-73.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 15:28 < kanzure> comments have been left on http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v467/n7316/full/467634a.html 15:29 -!- mheld [~mheld@c-75-69-89-109.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: mheld] 15:52 < fenn> i think i should set up a filter blocking out anything written by annalee newitz 15:53 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279397903.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:53 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279397903.dsl.bell.ca] has quit [Client Quit] 15:54 -!- Alystair [Alystair@bas1-toronto10-1279397903.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:03 < kanzure> fenn: you're better off just filtering out io9 16:05 * kanzure is trying to figure out how to automatically generate commit messages for changes to CAD files O_o 16:06 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:06 < kanzure> (humans will approve/rewrite these messages) 16:06 < kanzure> bay area reprap meeting at techshop 7pm 16:07 -!- memorex [~durp@130.160.184.183] has quit [Client Quit] 16:10 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:21 -!- mheld [~mheld@166.137.139.19] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:21 < kanzure> hi mheld 16:21 < mheld> Hey y'all 16:21 < kanzure> fenn: mheld will be in your area soon 16:22 < mheld> (and kanzure) 16:22 < fenn> welcome 16:22 < fenn> kanzure: is there a canonical webpage for skdb yet? 16:22 < mheld> Thanks, fenn 16:22 < kanzure> do'h 16:22 < kanzure> uh uhh 16:22 < fenn> (again) 16:22 < fenn> would like to reply to adafruit ala "we're doing this see" 16:22 < kanzure> you can link to http://diyhpl.us/cgit/skdb/ if you want, but no 16:23 < kanzure> frankly the dokuwiki page just had lots of rhetoric iirc 16:23 < kanzure> could you maybe think of something better and i'll go do that? 16:26 < fenn> yeah but it's my rhetoric :( 16:26 < fenn> what i mean is advocating "wikis of all sizes and shapes" sucks 16:27 < kanzure> shouldn't she know that? 16:27 < kanzure> i don't think it was your rhetoric, wasn't it mine? 16:27 < kanzure> why don't we have a whitepaper 16:31 < mheld> I'm planning on heading over to SF for an undetermined period of time, any thoughts as to what I should hit up? 16:32 < kanzure> mheld: stop by noisebridge, biocurious, hacker dojo (near anybots), techshop, singularity university (at NASA Ames in mountain view) 16:32 < kanzure> maybe langton? 16:33 < mheld> Heh, sounds fun. Anybody here from those places? 16:33 < kanzure> well there's actually #noisebridge and #hackerdojo but yes 16:34 < mheld> Ah 16:34 < mheld> I'll check those out too 16:38 < fenn> i guess i'm "from" all of those places (except singularity university) 16:38 < kanzure> oh also siai house if you like cults 16:38 < fenn> they also have a lot of whiteboards 16:39 < fenn> and juice 16:39 < kanzure> fenn: mheld and i were talking a few min ago in #startups 16:39 < kanzure> and i mentioned the whiteboards :( 16:39 < mheld> Haha 16:39 < kanzure> 16:19 < mheld> kanzure: http://singinst.org/aboutus/opportunities/visiting-fellow 16:39 < kanzure> 16:19 < kanzure> whiteboards are what i remember most 16:39 < kanzure> 16:19 < kanzure> they aren't exaggerating on that. 16:39 < fenn> anyway langton is a much cooler cult, we are expanding in all directions wildly 16:39 < mheld> I may have to bug you when I get back to my mahoney 16:40 < mheld> Machine 16:40 < kanzure> langton isn't a very good cult, who's your leader 16:40 < fenn> is mahoney your machine's name? 16:40 < kanzure> distributed control cult 16:40 < fenn> kanzure: we're controlled by the intestinal microflora we share 16:40 < kanzure> kinky 16:40 < mheld> Haha, iPhone spellcheck 16:41 < kanzure> (he's on an iphone :() 16:41 < mheld> Gotta run 16:41 < mheld> Ttys 16:41 -!- mheld [~mheld@166.137.139.19] has quit [Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi] 16:41 < kanzure> somehow i respect him less for trying irc on an iphone 16:42 < kanzure> is this like a reverse hipster maneuver 16:42 < fenn> i was just setting up irssi on my (new to me) nexus one 16:42 < fenn> it's sorta difficult scrolling back with screen 16:43 < fenn> not sure why 16:43 < jrayhawk_> I'm told tmux is a lot more pleasant than screen, fwiw. 16:44 < kanzure> fenn: i'm writing a solidworks plugin 16:44 < fenn> you'll pry my screen from my cold titanium endoskeleton 16:45 < kanzure> and i'm trying to automatically generate commit messages 16:45 < kanzure> (which will be human reviewed) 16:45 < fenn> well it's rather hard to capture the intent of a geometry change, isn't it 16:45 < kanzure> i can't decide between (1) comparing the last saved file with the latest version 16:45 < kanzure> or (2) just append a list of changes as the user goes along 16:45 < fenn> i think save points should be commits 16:45 < kanzure> with solidworks i can do per-entity tracking 16:45 < kanzure> are you sure? i usually save even when i'm half-way through 16:45 < fenn> otherwise you get too many insignificant changes and the signal to noise ratio goes into the pooper 16:45 < kanzure> i obsessively save 16:45 < kanzure> as much as i alt+tab perhaps 16:46 < kanzure> i.e. i might add a few more sketches or a new object, and save, but that doesn't mean my endmill adapter is done 16:46 < fenn> with infinite undo and automatic saving, "save" is just another word for "take a snapshot of this state and preserve it for later easy finding" 16:47 < kanzure> have you used google docs, in particular their revision control? 16:47 < kanzure> i obsessively save 16:47 < kanzure> crap 16:47 < kanzure> it's awful-- it's like "revisions 24,050 to 24,394" without an explanation 16:48 < fenn> heh that's neat to see my laptop irssi session scroll magically in synchrony 16:49 < kanzure> i guess some people might want "micro revision mode" 16:50 < kanzure> but i don't know how to do the opposite (only revision/save on major milestones or changes) 16:51 < QuantumG> "save" also often means "remove the revision history" 16:51 < kanzure> wtf? please explain 16:52 < QuantumG> well, say you have infinite undo and automatic saving 16:52 < kanzure> actually, in solidworks, once you save you no longer have undo (i mean, when you reopen the file you no logner have undo) 16:52 < QuantumG> obviously it's using a revision control system of some sort to save changes 16:52 < fenn> that's an evolutionary remnant from age when we had limited storage space to keep udno history 16:52 < fenn> not a behavior you actually want to keep 16:52 < kanzure> so maybe i can have it pop and say "undo history is about to eb lost, would you like to save?" 16:52 < kanzure> or something 16:53 < QuantumG> so often people have a "Save" command that actually produces a version of the data without the revision history 16:53 < QuantumG> often so whoever you give the file to can't see the changes. 16:53 < kanzure> let's say you're making a cnc machine in solidworks 16:53 < QuantumG> (that lead to that state) 16:53 < fenn> i think that sort of thing should be explicit 16:53 < kanzure> and you've started today, and made the base designs 16:53 < kanzure> should it be committing on each time you save the file (since you're afraid you might lose the work) 16:53 < kanzure> or should it only commit.. when? when you reach milestones? 16:54 < kanzure> but how would it detect that? 16:54 < kanzure> "save" should be tied into my plugin and should be synonymous with 'commit' IMHO 16:54 < kanzure> i.e., totally passive to a user's typical workflow 16:54 < QuantumG> well, normally revision control is explicit.. but there's no reason why you couldn't have continuous snapshots on a regular interval. 16:54 < fenn> in the context of solidworks, well, you have all this baggage from the history of UI development over the last 30 years 16:55 < kanzure> continuous snapshots on a regular interval doesn't give you usable commit messages 16:55 < kanzure> except maybe "edge 'bob' has been changed" 16:55 < kanzure> but that's way different from a person's commit message 16:55 < kanzure> although maybe people just write awful commit messages, so i shouldn't let them? 16:55 < QuantumG> yeah, the commit message would be something like: autosave [date/time] 16:56 < QuantumG> and you'd ignore them when looking at revision history I guess 16:56 < kanzure> but then you're cluttering up my repo 16:56 < kanzure> oh 16:56 < kanzure> ok when would a user write a commit message, if ever? 16:56 < fenn> 'save' also might mean 'share this with others' 16:57 < QuantumG> I guess when they want a retrievable milestone 16:57 < kanzure> ok maybe a File->New Milestone button or something 16:57 < kanzure> actually, i was thinnking that whenever a commit happens, it auto-generates the text, 16:57 < kanzure> and the human reviewsi t and changes it if he wants 16:58 * fenn jeers at the absurdity of a 'file' menu 16:58 < fenn> you're never going to get auto-generated text worth a crap, so don't autogenerate any text at all, just leave it blank please 16:58 < kanzure> i think it could be pretty good.. "changed 2 edges" 16:59 -!- wolfspraul [~wolfsprau@lucia.q-ag.de] has joined #hplusroadmap 16:59 < kanzure> or "changed: 2 edges, 5 surfaces, entity names: [list]" 16:59 < kanzure> (git auto-generates this for files, although it doesn't provide any information on each file in the commit message itself) 16:59 < fenn> saw this at autodesk, it's a list of commands sorted by frequency, and edges going to whatever command is next in the sequence http://www.autodeskresearch.com/img/infovis/command_usage_arc/ArcDiagramsFig6.png 17:00 < fenn> so 50% of your autocommits will be 'erased something' 17:00 < fenn> i just dont see any of those commands telling me anything useful 17:01 < fenn> you should autogenerate a thumbnail of whatever was on the screen when you hit save 17:01 < fenn> that would be killer 17:01 < kanzure> those are commands, not the entity names on which they operate 17:02 < kanzure> solidworks renders a bitmap image for each save you do 17:02 < kanzure> it's a separate part of the .sldprt file, you can even extract it with some linuxy tools 17:02 < fenn> how linuxy? 17:02 < kanzure> which is how windows explorer displays the model on the file icon 17:02 < fenn> as in, runs on linux? 17:02 < kanzure> fenn: linux enough to have been posted to OM.. one sec 17:02 < kanzure> http://groups.google.com/group/openmanufacturing/browse_thread/thread/16fd8ebe6c677f2c 17:03 < kanzure> sudo apt-get install libgsf-bin 17:03 < kanzure> gsf cat mydrawingfile.SLDDRW PreviewPNG > preview.png && eog preview.png 17:03 < kanzure> png, not a bitmap. my bad 17:04 < QuantumG> so I discovered why I was down on OpenCog 17:04 < QuantumG> I wasn't looking at the latest branch. 17:04 < fenn> neato 17:05 < kanzure> fenn: how important do you feel writing a non-solidworks-based solidworks file writer/reader is? 17:05 < QuantumG> there's only 60 files out of 1100+ that haven't been modified in 2008.. and I guess it's because they're good enough. 17:05 < QuantumG> s/in/since/ 17:05 < kanzure> .sldprt has a zlib-compressed section that is just raw parasolid data that could be extracted/tested, if i sat aside some time 17:06 < fenn> just seeing the preview is a massive boost in "do i care enough about this file to figure out how to run solidworks" 17:07 < kanzure> heh 17:08 < fenn> what's the difference between .sldprt and .sldasm? just whether you reference an external file in an assembly or not? 17:08 < kanzure> do you have sw-reverser.zip? 17:09 < fenn> no 17:09 < kanzure> bunch of old solidworks files and other formatsi saved 17:09 < kanzure> dunno about .sldprt/.sldasm differences.. maybe .sldasm doesn't have parasolid data? 17:11 < kanzure> anyway, to solve up the previous issues: (1) commit messages will be whatever (unless user goes to file->save as and explicitly writes a commit message in a box i add), (2) all commits will have a preview png, (3) autosave & save will do microrevisioning/commits without user review of commit message 17:11 < kanzure> when should the revision state be pushed 17:12 -!- mheld [~mheld@pool-173-76-224-45.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:12 < fenn> when the user tells it to 17:12 < kanzure> my goal is zero user interaction 17:12 < fenn> i'm not exactly excited about trying to build this into an existing (closed source) commercial application 17:13 < kanzure> heh' guess i should tell you what i've been doing 17:13 < fenn> it seems hard enough to get it right even when we _can_ futz with every element of the UI 17:14 < fenn> you need to have explicit "share with the rest of the world" because otherwise everybody is looking at half baked useless crap 17:14 < fenn> you don't publish a half written draft 17:14 < kanzure> huh? 17:14 < kanzure> one of your messages switched topics i think? 17:14 < fenn> 'when should the revision state be pushed' 17:14 < kanzure> ok 17:14 < mheld> eyh y'all 17:14 < kanzure> dropbox does. 17:15 -!- mheld [~mheld@pool-173-76-224-45.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:16 -!- mheld [~mheld@pool-173-76-224-45.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:16 < mheld> hey y'all 17:16 < fenn> that thought trainwreck came from me thinking about how to switch between branches from inside solidworks 17:16 < fenn> but solidworks has no conception of revision history, the undo would get all screwed up. you really need to build the UI from the ground up around having a revision control system backend 17:17 < kanzure> undo state doesn't get saved anyway, so i don't know what you're talking about 17:17 < fenn> undo state IS revision history 17:17 < kanzure> not really-- the programs assume a single HEAD, so a single branch 17:17 < fenn> yeah, and that's not good 17:18 < kanzure> well, it's what the users are doing and using 17:18 < fenn> not when you want to merge in (some but not all) changes from your buddy 17:18 < fenn> and then go back and edit the seamlessly merged history 17:19 < kanzure> "not when.." well they don't do merges like that anyway ;) 17:19 < kanzure> i'm sure they would if they (easily) could 17:19 < fenn> most programs will blast away the "redo" history once you make any changes at all 17:19 < kanzure> yep. 17:19 < fenn> fuck that 17:19 < fenn> i put all that effort into making downstream changes, i don't want to have to do it again. that's what computers are for 17:20 < kanzure> lol "vaults" http://picasaweb.google.com/dscarlsbad/2009WorkGroupPDMIn11Steps?feat=flashslideshow#5253885998063329362 17:20 < QuantumG> I think it's 3ds max that lets you edit the change log by inserting actions 17:20 < fenn> to give the pointy haired boss a sense of security 17:21 < QuantumG> pretty soon that becomes like programming 17:21 < QuantumG> (which is not necessarily a bad thing) 17:21 < kanzure> it is programming (autolisp) 17:21 < kanzure> except.. screwed up 17:22 < fenn> looks like a tube weaving machine (the funky radially symmetric metal thing on slide 1) 17:23 < kanzure> the next few slides explain pdmworks and "the vault" (basically, centralized version control, with lots of locks) 17:24 < fenn> i'm not interested in pdmworks 17:24 < fenn> the whole 'pdm' mindset is so far from where i'd like to be 17:25 < kanzure> thomas paviot was doing a plm thing before/while he started pythonocc 17:25 < fenn> their paradigm is "a moment of pure divine inspiration proceeds through various levels of bullshitification until it ends up on the consumer's breakfast plate, drizzled in marketing goop and with a hastily scribbled note saying where to call in case of total annihilation" 17:25 < QuantumG> so there's a question for ya 17:25 < fenn> it's a very one-way street 17:26 < kanzure> yep 17:26 < QuantumG> did you decide that you're going to have a programming language that produces these cad models? 17:26 < kanzure> QuantumG: lolcad, but that's not what we're talking about 17:26 < QuantumG> so that's what you're doing with lolcad? cool 17:27 < fenn> lolcad is just a library from what i gather 17:27 < kanzure> sorry, fenn is right 17:27 < kanzure> you'll just be using python 17:27 < QuantumG> python bindings to it or something then? 17:27 < QuantumG> right 17:27 < kanzure> i fugre why reinvent the wheel 17:27 < kanzure> figure 17:27 < QuantumG> (it's pretty bad when I start reading kanzure's mind) 17:27 < fenn> again, i prefer names that describe the thing being named 17:27 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/lolcad.git 17:27 < kanzure> skdb is an awful name 17:27 < fenn> indeed 17:27 < kanzure> k 17:28 < kanzure> i think it's my fault anyway 17:28 < QuantumG> it's always your fault 17:28 < fenn> yeah, i wanted to call it autogenix 17:28 < kanzure> also a bad name :P 17:28 < kanzure> (although not as bad) 17:28 < kanzure> uh, so anyway 17:28 < kanzure> fenn: if i am going to do revision control correctly with cad, i'll do it via lolcad if anything 17:28 < fenn> lolcad is just a library 17:29 < fenn> you'd have to make an actual user interface in order to "do it correctly" 17:29 < kanzure> how about the opengl terminal? 17:29 < fenn> it's really hard to specify "that corner" by typing on a command line 17:29 < kanzure> entities in a sketch should have names, period 17:29 < fenn> you can't name every corner 17:29 < kanzure> yes you can 17:29 < jrayhawk_> 17:21:06 omg/jblake: I'm very firmly in the "generate a commit every time anything at all changes (even more frequently than autosaving is) and just give them an 'autogenerated commit' message" camp. 17:29 < fenn> no 17:29 < kanzure> alphabet, whatever 17:29 < jrayhawk_> 17:22:16 omg/jblake: It's not like commit messages are useful for anything except sharing patches, and you'd just rebase into a prettier patch series if you wanted to do that. 17:30 < jrayhawk_> 17:24:16 omg/jblake: (It's worth noting that I have a 155MiB git repo that I use regularly with about 43% of the commit messages literally "Noise.") 17:30 < jrayhawk_> 17:25:11 omg/jblake: If I only look at commits from the last year, it's 92% "Noise.". 17:30 -!- jrayhawk_ is now known as jrayhawk 17:30 < kanzure> fenn: what's with your newfound insistence on clicky UIs? 17:30 < QuantumG> so, a cad design is an object with many child objects, like lines and points and whatever. You could have a tree structure to show the parent-child relationships, and a visualizer to show the current state of the object. So if you select a point in the tree it does something in the visualizer to indicate what point you've selected, and maybe you can move the point in the visualization, so then you have the beginnings of an editor. 17:30 < kanzure> a clickable UI doesn't exclude naming conventions for geometries 17:31 < kanzure> jrayhawk: jules sucks and he should just be in here. 17:31 < fenn> humans have a very strong inbuilt comprehension of geometry, and all that goes to waste when using a command line 17:31 < fenn> if we're doing something like PCB design, i agree, command line makes a lot more sense 17:32 < kanzure> so is it still just a library if it includes clicky routines for the opengl viewport 17:32 < kanzure> and is it bad if it remains "just a library" 17:32 < fenn> QuantumG: i don't agree with your premise "a cad design is an object with many child objects" 17:32 < fenn> but i dunno why you brought that up anyway 17:32 < kanzure> or were you trying to make another point with that just-a-library comment :P 17:33 < kanzure> QuantumG: yeah, i was planning on having a "zoom/move to recently changed geometry portion" function in the wxWidgets interface, plus a few shortcut keys to go back to previous/default view 17:33 < kanzure> alibre.com has a zoom/switch-to-interacted-segment functionality, it's pretty hot :) 17:33 < fenn> kanzure: i'm enthusiastically for keeping lolcad tightly scoped as just a binding to useful functions for reading writing and modifying nurbs geometry and various file formats that store nurbs geometry such as STEP 17:34 < kanzure> hm 17:34 < fenn> in other words, there should be more than one interface that uses lolcad 17:34 < fenn> apologies if i'm rambling incoherently today 17:34 < kanzure> wasn't the original complaint that nobody would use lolcad if they can't see what they are doing? 17:34 < kanzure> i'm fine with decoupling the visualiation from lolcad, that's the whole point yes 17:35 < kanzure> but the only option for users is something like heekscad/opencascade 17:35 < kanzure> which totally defeats the purpose of me avoiding OCC 17:35 -!- jblake [~jblake@pool-173-50-136-176.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:35 < fenn> the only option to do what? 17:35 < kanzure> to visualize their lolcad-generated STEP file 17:35 < fenn> oh, right 17:35 < fenn> yeah there should be a 'generate view' program 17:35 < fenn> or function, or whatever 17:35 < kanzure> my nurbs visualizer is "immediately update the view" 17:35 < fenn> a program that calls that function 17:36 < QuantumG> ahh, but ya see, the "undo history" is a program to create a lolcad object 17:36 < fenn> a very simple wrapper script 17:36 < kanzure> openscad/povray "generates once in a blue moon" is idiotic 17:36 < fenn> yeah i dont get why openscad takes so long to render 17:36 < kanzure> it's because their rendering strategy is retarded 17:36 < kanzure> they don't actually use opengl or anything 17:36 < fenn> QuantumG: i'm fine with that 17:36 < kanzure> it's like compiling a program.. just to render it 17:37 < fenn> QuantumG: as long as i can modify the source code for the original modification and then show the result after other (in-UI) changes have been applied 17:37 < kanzure> QuantumG: lolcad gets to have (1) revision control of .py files that import the library, and (2) python-god-given introspection of your CAD objects 17:37 < fenn> s/original modification/original import/ 17:37 < kanzure> jblake: obviously we're not talking about revision control via solidworks plugins, now. 17:38 < kanzure> jblake: but basically we came to the conclusion that using the preview png embedded in .sldprt files as the commit message or an indicator would be useful. 17:38 < fenn> is there a way to get the screen shot instead? 17:38 -!- ybit [~ybit@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:38 < kanzure> fenn: from .sldprt files? 17:38 < fenn> preview png is always from the same angle, right? 17:38 < kanzure> the preview png is the screenshot that solidworks last saved 17:38 < kanzure> no 17:38 < fenn> ok 17:38 < kanzure> just, last angle you were using 17:38 < fenn> good 17:39 < fenn> not so good for catalog of parts, but good for revision control 17:39 < fenn> would be nice to have two thumbnails of the part 17:39 < kanzure> ever try to load a huge directory of thumbnails of any sort :P 17:39 < fenn> one for last commit, another from an isometric view that's the same for all members of that part family 17:39 < kanzure> thingiverse does stl2pov to render the object.. i could do server-side view rendering for each commit pretty easily 17:40 < fenn> does solidworks save the view settings? 17:40 < fenn> like where you were zoomed in on and what angle 17:40 < kanzure> for your last view. dunno about anything else 17:40 < fenn> ok 17:41 < kanzure> wouldn't be hard to save zoom magnitude, camera vector 17:41 < fenn> you could theoretically do some script that opens up solidworks, switches to a standard isometric view, and take a screenshot, yes? 17:41 < kanzure> (if needed) 17:41 < kanzure> yep 17:41 < kanzure> headless solidworks is doable. 17:42 < fenn> where would you run it? 17:42 < jblake> precommit hook? 17:42 < kanzure> fenn: amazon ec2 17:42 < fenn> somehow you'd have to communicate with a windows instance inside a VM 17:42 * kanzure has been making a vmware image 17:42 < kanzure> *cough* 17:44 < fenn> yes and OF COURSE we are all using our gratis student editions of said software 17:44 < fenn> so anyway, how do you talk to the vm? 17:44 < kanzure> http 17:44 < kanzure> also ssh 17:45 < kanzure> jblake: precommit hooks where? 17:45 < fenn> in the git repo on server side 17:45 < jblake> omg If you're generating these thumbnails for commit messages, then presumably you have a local solidworks running, because otherwise you would not have just generated a commit? 17:45 < fenn> so when i push to dev.gnusha.org it renders everything as it gets integrated into the gnusha repo 17:45 < jblake> er, feh. stupid irc. 17:46 < kanzure> jblake: well, there's two things going on there 17:46 * fenn mumbles something about a bot to bridge with omg/wallhack 17:46 < kanzure> one, the preview in .sldprt already 17:46 < kanzure> two, i suppose you would do a headless solidworks yes 17:46 < kanzure> buttbot doesn't do butt bridging, and for good reasons 17:48 < fenn> an unfounded statement of your value system, an opinion 17:48 < kanzure> :P 17:48 < kanzure> i wouldn't be upset. 17:49 < fenn> some people won't be running our plugin, we get solidworks files all the time being posted to thingiverse 17:50 < kanzure> huh? 17:50 < jblake> o i c 17:50 < kanzure> oh i see. 17:50 < kanzure> fuck 17:51 < kanzure> screw you 17:54 < kanzure> fenn: have you played with amazon ec2 yet? 17:54 < kanzure> http://www.arenasolutions.com/democenter/index.html 17:54 < fenn> huh? "SolidWorks pioneered the ability of a user to roll back through the history of the part in order to make changes, add additional features, or change the sequence in which operations are performed. Later feature-based solid modeling software has copied this idea." 17:55 < kanzure> hmmm 17:55 < kanzure> oh 17:55 < fenn> i know a fair amount about ec2 but i haven't used it yet 17:55 < kanzure> they are talking about the parametric file format 17:55 < kanzure> so, i.e., changing the sketch dimensions and then re-applying the extrudes, chamfers, etc. 17:55 < jblake> It seems like they're fairly obviously talking about the rollback bar. 17:55 < kanzure> which isn't the same thing as what we're talking about 17:55 < kanzure> uh, rollback bar? 17:55 < fenn> well, it is, sorta 17:56 < kanzure> i've never seen a rollback bar 17:56 < jblake> In the hierarchy of the part you have open, there's a little bar below the last thing in the list. 17:56 < kanzure> oh. 17:56 < kanzure> i thought that was a graphics error :x 17:56 < jblake> Grab it, and pull it up. It rolls back the project to only show you stuff that happened above the bar. 17:57 < jblake> That's why aspects of the project can only be defined in terms of things above them in the hierarchy. 17:57 < kanzure> yeah, i usually just double click on the older/top-level features 17:59 < fenn> damn, you mean your puny software can't even violate causality? 18:02 < jblake> realistically in a constraint-based solver like solidworks there's no particularly good reason to disallow acausal systems 18:02 < jblake> the only reason they do appears to be so they can simplify their UI slightly :-/ 18:03 < kanzure> the top of solidworks feels a lot like a "ribbon" 18:03 < jblake> solidworks ui is hilariously better than the ribbon 18:04 < jblake> mostly just because it's so customizable 18:04 < fenn> what's "the ribbon"? 18:04 < jblake> use a new version of ms office 18:04 < kanzure> "the ribbon" was introduced in ms office 2008 18:05 < kanzure> i had the displeasure of using it throughout high school and college 18:05 < jblake> they got rid of customizable toolbars *and* the menubar at the same time 18:05 < fenn> oh, so, a shitload of buttons with cryptic diagrams? 18:06 < jblake> with a bunch of irritating whitespace, no consistent size for the buttons, and organized in a fairly arbitrary manner that the user isn't allowed to override 18:06 < kanzure> http://cybernetnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/07/OfficeThemes.jpg 18:07 < fenn> how the hell did 'clipboard' come to mean 'paste buffer' anyway 18:07 < jrayhawk> Everything had an 'office' metaphor for marketing purposes. 18:07 < jblake> the selection buffer is pretty clearly superior to clipboards anyway 18:08 -!- JaredW [~JaredW@122-57-90-65.jetstream.xtra.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 18:08 -!- JaredWigmore [~JaredW@219-89-68-252.ipnets.xtra.co.nz] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:09 < fenn> i'm still befuddled by shift-insert, never know what it's going to paste 18:09 -!- JaredWigmore is now known as JaredW 18:09 -!- augur_ [~augur@129.2.129.34] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:10 < jrayhawk> X has conflicting copy/paste extensions; shift-insert is almost always the client-to-client buffer. 18:10 < jblake> In most programs, shift-insert pastes from the clipboard. 18:10 < jblake> The selection buffer is a hell of a lot simpler to reason about. 18:11 < fenn> yeah, whatever is selected 18:11 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:13 < jblake> I suppose the big problem is that a bunch of xterms and mozilla programs got it in their heads that selecting something should *also* change the clipboard; that's mostly what winds up making the clipboard impossible to use. 18:13 < jblake> Older programs and toolsets that obey the very simple "PRIMARY is current selection; CLIPBOARD is last thing explicitly copied" rule are always predictable. 18:15 < jblake> Admittedly, cut buffers were just a huge mistake; fortunately everyone pretty consistently ignores them nowadays 18:16 < kanzure> what should i do with humanity+? 18:16 < QuantumG> kick it into high gear :) 18:16 < kanzure> they are begging me for something to do 18:16 < kanzure> but i don't really have a master scheme 18:16 < kanzure> esp. since most of them are more into media/advertizing 18:16 < jblake> master haskell is better, anyway 18:17 < fenn> kanzure is there actual money for media development? 18:17 < kanzure> nope, they want to raise money for their blog 18:17 < kanzure> but natasha/max and i figured it'd be better.. not to. 18:17 < fenn> "raise money for their blog" lol 18:17 < kanzure> :( it's so sad 18:17 < kanzure> humanity+: at the butt-end of tech 18:17 < fenn> first of all, blogs dont cost anything 18:17 < kanzure> this one does, oh man 18:18 < fenn> second, why are they paying money for something that's free? 18:18 < fenn> third what sort of business model is that? 18:18 < kanzure> it's not a business, it's a non-profit :P 18:18 < fenn> it is? 18:18 < kanzure> humanity+? 18:18 < fenn> well fuck i didnt even realie that 18:18 < fenn> go write some grants, or tell someone to write grants, or something 18:18 < QuantumG> I'd probably have to read something on humanity+ to give you a fair suggestion of what to do with it 18:18 < kanzure> yeah gada prize is successfully transferred (check is in the mail) 18:19 < kanzure> QuantumG: used to be the world transhumanist association 18:19 < fenn> plz take a picture of the check 18:19 < joshcryer> yeah pic of check plz 18:19 < kanzure> sure.. but why 18:19 < joshcryer> fun 18:19 < kanzure> don't banks snap shots of checks? 18:19 < fenn> so we know which account to hijack :{ 18:19 < kanzure> heh 18:19 < joshcryer> fenn, heh 18:20 < kanzure> get off my brain waves, joshcryer 18:20 < fenn> you can make a blog post about it 18:20 < kanzure> these them thoughts are copyrite 18:20 < kanzure> yeah, there's going to be a post eventually 18:20 < fenn> 'look, real money, fo realz, no srsly' 18:20 < kanzure> but first i wanted them to fix http://humanityplus.org/ 18:20 < QuantumG> ok, here's what to do with humanity+: track down medical people working on humanity+ interesting technology and incite them to do humanity+ type things with it. Promise them promotion. 18:20 < kanzure> like what kind of fucking website is that 18:20 < kanzure> i would rather have no website over that. 18:20 < kanzure> member database is a collection of lots of old csv files 18:21 < kanzure> why do they even have members, etc. etc. 18:21 < kanzure> the only reason i can think to use a 501c3 non-profit like humanity+ is for accepting tax-deductible donations 18:21 < kanzure> particularly for projects. 18:21 < fenn> get rid of 'topics' list 18:21 < fenn> did nobody realize it was the same content as the tag cloud? 18:21 < kanzure> it's "SEO" 18:21 < QuantumG> contact all the members and ask them if they would be interested in participating in some "plusing experiments" 18:22 < kanzure> QuantumG: sadly they don't know all of their members 18:22 < QuantumG> heh 18:22 < kanzure> and, on top of that, wta-talk has no idea what h+ is doing 18:22 < kanzure> it's like it's two different worlds 18:22 < kanzure> so anyway 18:22 < fenn> SEO has nothing to do with what is displayed visibly on the page 18:22 < kanzure> gada prize seemed like a good way to use humanity+ 18:22 < kanzure> fenn: ah, but it does when amy is doing the SEO 18:22 < kanzure> (she's a "UX person") 18:22 < kanzure> (who does SEO) 18:23 < fenn> eri is doing some experiment involving butter and coconut fat for improving reaction time/math problems, she needs volunteers 18:23 < kanzure> why would that need a 501c3 18:23 < fenn> seems like a way to get people at least interested 18:23 < kanzure> people pay to be members of humanity+ 18:23 < kanzure> i don't know why. 18:23 < kanzure> so, that's why i'm saying if i had a set of concrete projects, it would be helpful 18:24 < fenn> they don't know how else to contribute to what they think ought to be happening in the world 18:24 < kanzure> in terms of "we need to move money somewhere useful!" or something 18:24 < kanzure> who, the people running h+ or the members 18:24 < fenn> uh both 18:24 < kanzure> i think i have my head on straight pretty well 18:25 < kanzure> but i am probably biased? 18:25 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:25 < fenn> sorry that was a irc temporal crosstalk failure 18:25 < kanzure> heh 18:25 < fenn> a way to get members and officials interested in their organization 18:25 < kanzure> ok so who cares 18:26 < fenn> you do need a bit of momentum in order to start anything 18:26 < kanzure> h+ doesn't really cater to any transhumanists 18:26 < fenn> well why not 18:26 < kanzure> it certainly doesn't cater to me 18:26 < kanzure> because they are doing things wrong, so i need to provide them with that set of things that would be more helpful to me 18:26 < kanzure> so i was hoping you would elaborate on what that set might be 18:26 < fenn> yeah it's all "look at out twitter page about our twitter page" navel gazing 18:26 * fenn points at trans-tech.yaml 18:27 < fenn> any reason that's not up on the website? 18:27 < kanzure> because i abhor the website. 18:27 < QuantumG> they do some sort of news feed right? 18:27 < kanzure> right now i think it would be better with no website 18:27 < kanzure> until the organization has more of a direction/purpose/toolchain-for-something 18:27 < fenn> http://diyhpl.us/cgit/skdb/tree/doc/proposals/trans-tech.yaml 18:28 < fenn> fuck man, go at the website with a chainsaw 18:28 < kanzure> so you mean they should be carrying out the projects? 18:28 < fenn> tear out all the crap you don't like, add stuff you do like 18:28 < kanzure> fenn: it's webmastering-by-committee (at this point) 18:28 < fenn> then point at it 18:28 < kanzure> i was thinking i'd just stage my own version of a better site 18:28 < fenn> who is the committee? 18:28 < kanzure> the board of directors 18:28 < fenn> and do they not agree that the website sucks? 18:28 < kanzure> (max, natasha, tom, ben, ...) 18:29 < kanzure> well, they were going to install a new wordpress template but i don't think that fixes the systemic issues 18:29 < kanzure> anyway, the trans-tech.yaml suggestion is more interesting to me as talkfodder 18:29 < fenn> there should at the very least be some sort of front-page-visible taxonomy of "wtf is transhumanism anyway" 18:29 < fenn> .. wordpress template.. who gives a flying fuck what the css is 18:30 < kanzure> because they get to throw money at it and they feel better 18:30 < kanzure> anyway, 18:31 < kanzure> is there any value in directing lots of my own personal projects or other trans-tech.yaml-related-projects through humanity+? 18:31 < QuantumG> anyway, if you want something to spend money on, hire a "correspondent" to follow up on transhumanist internet news. 18:31 < kanzure> QuantumG: that's what hplusmagazine.com is (they pay RU Sirius) 18:31 < QuantumG> do they ask the questions transhumanists want to ask? 18:32 < kanzure> what? 18:32 < kanzure> why would that matter 18:32 < QuantumG> isn't that the point? 18:32 < kanzure> i'm not sure media/entertainment/news should be the point anyway 18:32 < QuantumG> nothing happens without information 18:33 < QuantumG> educating the public about the transhumanist point of view 18:33 < kanzure> i think we're not communicating well here 18:33 < kanzure> (1) why do we need a non-profit to run a blog? 18:33 < fenn> RU sirius is not a transhumanist 18:33 < fenn> he's a yippie mostly i think 18:33 < kanzure> (2) why do we need to pay RU Sirius to "educate the public" about human enhancement? 18:34 < kanzure> right now the rest of the world is educating humanity+ about how tech works, and they ain't listening :P 18:34 < kanzure> i don't know why i'm asking you guys to come up with ideas, why would you know the answer to these issues 18:34 < fenn> i think there needs to be more information on the webpage about what sort of things can be done and why we think they're a good idea 18:35 < kanzure> why would that need humanity+ 18:35 < joshcryer> I hate running websites. 18:35 < fenn> because it's not gathered into a convenient loation 18:35 < QuantumG> example: a medical team creates an implant that fixes (insert handicap here), the news media reports it as a medical miracle but no-one bothers to ask the doctor "what could this do for healthy people?" In comes the Humanity+ correspondent and gets the medical practitioner on the record as either supporting or refuting the transhumanist agenda. 18:35 < joshcryer> I hate thinking about running websites. 18:35 < fenn> stuff scattered across the net 18:35 < kanzure> ok fine, but that could just be any website 18:35 < kanzure> anders sandberg's site v2 18:35 < fenn> yeah, and anders isnt keeping up 18:35 < kanzure> yeah he's grown soft i think :( not sure 18:35 < fenn> anyway i gotta go solder something bbl 18:36 < joshcryer> Here's what you do. You put a big, 50 point font of a big H and a big + on the site. 18:36 < kanzure> website aside, i see humanity+ mostly as a vehicle for projects and funding, at best 18:36 < joshcryer> Then put a date. 18:36 < kanzure> stop thinking about the site, it doesn't matter 18:36 < joshcryer> Work toward that date and stop caring about the site. :P 18:36 < kanzure> joshcryer: http://diyhpl.us/ done? 18:36 < joshcryer> I see no deadline date! 18:37 < QuantumG> ya need progress to estimate a deadline :P 18:37 < joshcryer> I like the H+ logo though. 18:37 < kanzure> they paid a lot for it 18:37 * kanzure pouts 18:37 < joshcryer> Really? 18:37 < kanzure> yes 18:37 < joshcryer> You are serious?! 18:37 < joshcryer> OMG. 18:37 < kanzure> RU Sirius. 18:39 < joshcryer> QuantumG, that's why you estimate your dealine and triple how long you think it'll take, and you might be surprised when you make it. 18:43 < QuantumG> random thought: when will robotic construction leave the factory? 18:43 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:44 < joshcryer> Not soon enough. 18:45 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:45 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:45 < joshcryer> Dang factory robots are so ridiculously specialized I duobt they'd be able to do much useful stuff outside of them. 18:45 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:46 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:46 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:58 < kanzure> imho, it's the engineers who are making those specialized factories 18:59 < joshcryer> Job security baby. 19:04 < QuantumG> robots to put up a stadium.. that'd be awesome 19:05 < kanzure> human robots? 19:05 < QuantumG> that's what it is now :) 19:08 < masked> the pyramids weer built with biofeedback 19:08 < masked> were* 19:16 < joshcryer> Robots to put up an entire theme park, dude. 19:16 < joshcryer> Think big. 19:20 < masked> ooh 19:20 < masked> self-replicating rollercoasters?! 19:20 < masked> some crazy old nut 19:20 < masked> tried to tell me that credible scientists believe 19:21 < masked> that the pyraminds were build with a brain interface 19:21 < masked> for heavy machinery 19:22 -!- jblake [~jblake@pool-173-50-136-176.ptldor.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:31 < QuantumG> they were built by Ra's slaves before the uprising and the burying of the Stargate, duh. 19:31 < masked> not by chuck norris's fist? 19:35 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:43 -!- eridu [debian-tor@gateway/tor-sasl/eridu] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:46 < joshcryer> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cities_XL_2011 19:48 < joshcryer> looks like premodeled stuff 19:48 < joshcryer> shame 19:49 < fenn> kanzure i dont know how you managed to make a blank webpage fuck up my computer 19:50 < joshcryer> fenn, hahaha 19:50 < joshcryer> H+ is doomed if one of the better users' computer was fucked up by a blank webpage. 19:51 < fenn> well, it was using 100% cpu and making my music player skip 19:51 < fenn> reniced audacious and closed the webpage, now ok again 19:51 < fenn> H+ is doomed regardless 19:57 < fenn> QuantumG: if ra had antigravity and teleportation technology, why did he need so many slaves? 19:58 < fenn> like, we could just teleport this 50 ton brick to the top of the pyramid, but we're going to make you drag it there instead, out of spite 19:58 < superkuh> The revivals in the sarcophagus made them overly aggressive and evil. 19:59 < fenn> btw we need more robots to set up burning man, but currently the department of public works is staffed by masochists and won't tolerate any improvement upon their pain-filled existence 20:00 < fenn> (it's sort of like a theme park, if you were wondering) 20:11 < QuantumG> fenn: they're evil, they like seeing humans suffer 20:12 < masked> gizmodo.com.au/2010/10/robot-punches-humans-in-order-to-learn-asimovs-rules/ 20:14 < masked> http://www.bendigoadvertiser.com.au/news/local/news/general/how-to-invent-an-award/1775178.aspx 20:14 < masked> http://www.enterpriserobotics.com/ 20:14 < masked> a local guy made this robot 20:14 < masked> 'risper' 20:27 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:42 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:43 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:45 -!- CryptoQuick [~CryptoQui@c-174-51-234-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:46 -!- CryptoQuick is now known as DeltaVirtue 20:47 -!- DeltaVirtue [~CryptoQui@c-174-51-234-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Client Quit] 20:47 -!- DeltaVirtue [~CryptoQui@c-174-51-234-80.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:51 < fenn> there are no fluid lines going to those {hydraulic, pneumatic,?} cylinders 20:56 < fenn> what is it with australians and robots 20:57 < fenn> seemed like half of ##robotics was australian 20:58 < QuantumG> no idea 20:59 < QuantumG> but I expect it has something to do with Australia leading the way in robotic mining technology (don't know if that's cause or effect though) 21:02 < fenn> nobody i talked to had any experience with mining equipment at all 21:03 < fenn> they all basically taught themselves from the internet and made hobby robot + ai from scratch 21:07 < QuantumG> then, yeah, no idea 21:07 < QuantumG> friend of mine runs robotparts.com.au 21:11 < fenn> those are some expensive robot parts 21:11 < fenn> i dont think the dollar conversion ratio accounts for it 21:12 < fenn> some of them seem very specialized 21:13 < QuantumG> yeah, I've not seen anything on it I'd like to buy :) 21:13 < fenn> motor drivers maybe, all too expensive for my taste though 21:14 < kanzure> back from another one of dave's famous 10pm meetings. 21:14 < fenn> i can by Real(tm) industrial stuff from mesa electronics for those prices 21:16 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:17 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:20 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:20 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.6.161] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:25 -!- mheld [~mheld@pool-173-76-224-45.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: mheld] 21:39 < kanzure> i <3 patents http://www.google.com/patents?id=P4MpAAAAEBAJ&zoom=4&dq=5251294&pg=PA15#v=onepage&q&f=false 21:47 < joshcryer> patent imagination! 21:55 < QuantumG> http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1821690&cid=33904574 21:57 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 22:01 < kanzure> :( mark zuckerberg has a lower slashdot id than me http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=61425&threshold=1&commentsort=0&mode=thread&cid=5774175 22:04 < masked> strangely enough 22:05 < masked> i just went to meet someone regarding work 22:05 < joshcryer> I never signed up with /. 22:05 < masked> and it's the risper robot man haha 22:05 < masked> risper runs windows 7 22:05 < masked> vb and c# 22:05 < joshcryer> oh wow 22:05 < joshcryer> Here's an idea I had recently. 22:05 < joshcryer> OK so I can't make a magical replicator machine. 22:06 < joshcryer> That's super damn hard. 22:06 < joshcryer> But maybe I could make a robot cook. :) 22:06 < masked> isn't that an oven? 22:06 < kanzure> silence! 22:06 < kanzure> robo-oven 22:07 < joshcryer> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1191884/Flipping-brilliant-Now-Japan-invented-robot-cook-pancakes-breakfast.html 22:07 < joshcryer> But a general purpose cook, that takes recipes and... makes follows them. 22:07 < superkuh> My /. UID is 91035. 22:07 < joshcryer> http://www.business-opportunities.biz/2010/04/27/wok-robot-can-cook-600-chinese-dishes/ 22:09 < kanzure> steve rayhawk has 87427 http://slashdot.org/~srayhawk 22:09 < kanzure> and his only post was about a better way to do moderation :x 22:12 -!- memorex [~durp@97.67.109.107] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:28 < masked> no more flipping burgers 22:29 < masked> just builderburgers 22:44 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.69.190] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:09 -!- jennifer2 [~jennifer@c-67-170-193-255.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:30 -!- codeshepherd [~Deepan@122.167.69.190] has quit [Quit: codeshepherd] 23:38 -!- marainein [~marainein@220-253-13-67.VIC.netspace.net.au] has joined #hplusroadmap --- Log closed Fri Oct 15 00:00:17 2010