--- Log opened Wed Dec 01 00:00:08 2010
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08:01 < kanzure> archels: woo, he's closing the telexlr8 thing
08:01 < kanzure> wow he spent money on it?
08:01 < archels> no way
08:02 < archels> Due to criticism?
08:03 < kanzure> no because he's broke
08:03 < QuantumG> Senate Hearing on Transition and Implementation: The NASA Authorization Act of 2010 webcast is currently going on http://bit.ly/g8dkZb
08:03 < archels> oh, heh, so there's a chance of the whole thing coming back at some point.
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08:15 < kanzure> floating architecture http://www.waterstudio.nl/en
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08:19 < archels> I think those are some students/recent graduates.
08:22 < kanzure> open-science meeting later today (1730 GMT) http://okfnpad.org/sciencewg-meetings
08:28 < kanzure> edit this heavily and you could be coauthored into Nature Genetics: http://www.wikigenes.org/GWAS.html?wpc=12
08:33 < archels> as one of over 9000 co-authors.
08:34 < archels> Nice wiki though, with the authorship extensions.
08:37 < kanzure> this webpage is awesome in so many ways
08:37 < kanzure> http://www.grg.org/meetings/announce.html
08:37 < kanzure> (also effective)
08:47 < archels> E-mail: snelson@ucla.edu/A>
08:48 < kanzure> bioethics presentation on synthetic life http://diybiology.blogspot.com/2010/11/synthetic-life-new-industrial.html
08:49 < kanzure> i think gregory haebnick was on bioethics.gov at one point
09:04 < kanzure> flying car http://www.mavericklsa.com/
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10:48 < archels> woo, Photons to Phenomenology arrived already.
10:48 < archels> also, it's huge!
12:02 < kanzure> got my first complainer about meetlog.txt
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12:06 < archels> Removal request?
12:09 < kanzure> yep
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12:54 < kanzure> dbolser: do you know michal galdzicki?
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13:34 -!- Topic for #hplusroadmap: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-n39RK4inzg http://designfiles.org/~bryan/hplus-summit-2009/ http://heybryan.org/
13:34 -!- Topic set by kanzure [] [Mon Jan 11 11:14:52 2010]
13:34 [Users #hplusroadmap]
13:34 [ archels] [ epitron       ] [ JaredW   ] [ niftyzero1] [ saurik     ] 
13:34 [ asdf30 ] [ eridu         ] [ joshcryer] [ Noahj     ] [ shepazu    ] 
13:34 [ augur  ] [ fenn          ] [ jrayhawk ] [ nsh       ] [ sseehh     ] 
13:34 [ bkero  ] [ ferrouswheel  ] [ kanzure  ] [ nsh-      ] [ superkuh   ] 
13:34 [ CIA-62 ] [ fitzsim       ] [ killall-9] [ opensanta ] [ ToyKeeper  ] 
13:34 [ clemux ] [ GarethTheGreat] [ mage2    ] [ Overand   ] [ Utopiah    ] 
13:34 [ ctime  ] [ gnusha        ] [ mayko    ] [ pasky     ] [ |Helleshin|] 
13:34 [ dbolser] [ gourneau      ] [ mjr      ] [ phreedom  ] 
13:34 [ drazak ] [ Ian_Daniher   ] [ nchaimov ] [ phryk     ] 
13:34 [ elmom  ] [ Jappe2        ] [ niftyzero] [ QuantumG  ] 
13:34 -!- Irssi: #hplusroadmap: Total of 47 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 47 normal]
13:34 !niven.freenode.net [freenode-info] channel flooding and no channel staff around to help? Please check with freenode support: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp
13:34 -!- Channel #hplusroadmap created Fri Jan 29 23:48:24 2010
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13:43 < kanzure> gnusha: welcome back
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14:31 < kanzure> "biohacking" added to the dictionary http://www.oed.com/public/latest/latest-update
14:31 < QuantumG> Gregory Kaebnick sounds like a tosser to me
14:32 < kanzure> celtic punk band?
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15:14 < kanzure> dear internet please stop sending me email
15:16 < fitzsim> kanzure: how did the history rewriting experiment go?
15:18 < kanzure> i need to give it one more shot
15:18 < kanzure> but 
15:18 < kanzure> let me make it public
15:18 < fitzsim> ok
15:19 < fitzsim> FWIW, I thought the last attempt was pretty darn good
15:19 < fitzsim> it includes all history in one fast git repo
15:20 < fitzsim> the fact that there are discontinuities that disrupt git blame all the way back to the initial revisions is not a huge deal, IMO
15:20 < fitzsim> since those discontinuities actually happened in the original SVN repo
15:20 < kanzure> no no now it's personal
15:20 < fitzsim> :-)
15:21 < fitzsim> can you put the next attempt at nanoengineer-fixed2 ?
15:22 < fitzsim> so that we can differentiate?
15:23 < kanzure> uh, crap
15:23 < kanzure> i just deleted nanoengineer-fixed.git and am replacing it at the moment
15:23 < kanzure> i mean, deleted the public-facing nanoengineer-fixed (i do have a copy of it)
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15:33 < kanzure> fitzsim: ok nanoengineer-fixed.git has my fake merge commit in it now (or you can wait until it's done pushing tags)
15:34 < kanzure> run git log then /Bryan Bishop
15:35 < kanzure> i forget the commit id
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15:51 < kanzure> fenn: what's with the gmail address
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16:10 < kanzure> http://www.foresight.org/challenge
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16:36 < fitzsim> kanzure: c44f805cb57a2a65a6f99335397a46b1dd69d3ef looks to represent cad-Nanorex, but the cvs2svn messages says it creates branch 'MERI'
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16:41 < fitzsim> kanzure: looks like git logging still stops at the merge:
16:41 < fitzsim> $ git log sim/src/cube.mmp
16:41 < fitzsim> commit 43d8c03f12c9adaa1e7df6844d85c20acba7aaba
16:41 < fitzsim> Merge: 72b3a14 aebedd7 802d33a
16:41 < fitzsim> Author: Bryan Bishop <kanzure@gmail.com>
16:41 < fitzsim> whereas cube.mmp was introduced 2004-06-30
16:44 < fitzsim> it could be that git doesn't recognize the file moving from src/cube.mmp to sim/src/cube.mmp
16:44 < fitzsim> but that's the general problem of recognizing these file-subset branchpoints and mergepoints
16:44 < QuantumG> automatic background removal with Kinect.. gee, that's 15 minutes work,, I guess you could spend some time doing a nice smoothing algorithm to get rid of jaggies.
16:45 < fitzsim> QuantumG: I want him to make the program remember the different faces of an object as it's rotated
16:45 < QuantumG> yeah.. I think ROS has modules to do that
16:45 < fitzsim> QuantumG: so that it can display in the 3D view not just what's currently showing, but everything it's seen of the object
16:46 < QuantumG> yeah
16:46 < QuantumG> you need to recognize features and stitch the 3d scene together
16:46 < joshcryer> Apparently it costs MS about $50 to make a Kinect.
16:46 < joshcryer> It has no real processing hardware, you do it all yourself.
16:48 < QuantumG> yeah, it's a calibrated depth camera and regular webcam
16:48 < QuantumG> with a tilt motor
16:49 < kanzure> yes i know it stops at the merge (that's what i'm fixing)
16:49 < QuantumG> the depth camera is cheap because they use image techniques to infer depth from the texture projector
16:50 < QuantumG> people have done this in visible light for years.. they just did it in hardware and IR.
16:50 < kanzure> woo i'm down to 60,319 unread emails
16:51 < QuantumG> that's disgraceful
16:51 < kanzure> i think it's p. good considering.
16:51 < QuantumG> hey, I'll trade you my credit card debt for your inbox
16:51 < joshcryer> Is half of that spam?
16:51 < kanzure> joshcryer: no, none of it is spam
16:52 < joshcryer> kanzure, you won't be able to catch up until nerd rapture.
16:52 < kanzure> there's a rumor going around that my inbox email curves predict the singularity
16:56 < joshcryer> kanzure, do you at least prioritize some people so that, erm, you can be contacted?
16:57 < joshcryer> eg, say I emailed you about my uber code project.
16:57 < QuantumG> is that like, mailing lists or something kanzure?
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16:58 < joshcryer> Ahh, didn't think about that.
17:01 < QuantumG> fitzsim: I've yet to see a computer vision system that's actually reusable.. maybe there's one in ROS.
17:03 < QuantumG> I'd like to see a computer vision scene that could actually detect unknown objects.. sensibly separating them from other objects/background.. and automatically build a model of movement of objects in the world.
17:03 < QuantumG> s/scene/system/
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17:51 < kanzure> joshcryer: yes i prioritze recent stuff and people who are actually talking directly to me
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17:52 < QuantumG> do you sort mailing lists out of the inbox?
17:53 < QuantumG> .. are you on any mailing lists that are actually good?  cause that open manufacturing one was horrid
18:02 < kanzure> too much paul fernhout?
18:03 < kanzure> yes i filter mailing lists out of my inbox
18:12 < kanzure> ohh wait i know what's going on
18:12 < kanzure> i was using imap for a while and didn't synchronize which emails i read/replied to
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18:34 < joshcryer> Freaking mailing lists.
18:35 < joshcryer> I used to be on a few of them but I couldn't keep up and my time isn't *that* constrained.
18:46 < kanzure> another one..
18:46 < kanzure> http://hplusmagazine.com/editors-blog/ben-goertzel-interviews-max-more-future-transhumanism-and-optimization-disorder
19:04 < eridu> kanzure: I dropped off the diybio mailing list because it was getting too bio-y and not enough h+-y, which is a shame because it seems like diybio ate diyh+
19:09 < kanzure> "diybio ate diyh+" is that good or bad?
19:13 < eridu> I'm referring to the google group mailing lists
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19:13 < kanzure> and diybio ate diyh+ in the sense that they hated the concept and wanted it to go away?
19:14 < eridu> no, in the sense that diybio consumed diyh+ such that while diybio gets lots of traffic and seems to have lots of things that is relevant to diyh+, diyh+ gets little traffic
19:14 < eridu> that's bad for me, because I have little interest in how to refrigerate things or build centrifuges, or do other bio stuff, but if I unsubscribe I miss the diyh+ stuff
19:16 < kanzure> i actually stopped using the diyh+ mailing list because the moderator is a bit flaky (though otherwise a good person)
19:16 < kanzure> i.e. if you build that place up as a waterhole and the moderator is nowhere to be found then it's doomed anyway
19:16 < kanzure> on the other hand, wta-talk certainly isn't the place or that
19:16 < kanzure> *for that
19:17 < eridu> wta-talk has too much LIBERAL DEMOCRACY TECHNO-PROGRESSIVISM blowhardery
19:18 < eridu> what's the guy's name, Mike Treder? I was on wta-talk for about a week before I just got sick of him
19:18 < kanzure> haha
19:18 < kanzure> yes i agree
19:19 < kanzure> the organization was kind of.. uh.. run by a guy trying to promote his "democratic transhumanism" idea of politics
19:19 < kanzure> for a few years.
19:19 < kanzure> anyway the organization isn't all spectacular for anyone wanting to actually do transhumanist stuff
19:19 < eridu> yeah
19:20 < eridu> is it not run by that guy anymore?
19:20 < kanzure> no but it's not really "run"
19:21 < eridu> ...what is it?
19:23 < kanzure> it's ben goertzel and a board of directors sending lots of emails back and forth
19:23 < kanzure> actually most of the board of directors don't even know about wta-talk
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19:25 < eridu> so it's been reduced to an echo chamber?
19:29 < kanzure> well no 
19:29 < kanzure> they send lots of emails to each other about hplusmagazine and how important PR is
19:29 < QuantumG> PR is important.. without PR you don't have PR
19:29 < QuantumG> btw, PR
19:30 < kanzure> my PR is bigger than your PR
19:30 < QuantumG> I expect that's true
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19:52 < joshcryer> Fuck PR.
19:54 < kanzure> agreed
19:54 < kanzure> also http://fuckdeath.org/
19:56 < joshcryer> http://www.lesstalk.co.cc
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19:56 < joshcryer> I was supposed to put something there but I was too distracted to do it, haha.
19:58 < kanzure> less | talk
19:58 < kanzure> you need to read the manpages again methinks
19:58 < QuantumG> at least hexdump -C `which talk` | less
20:01 < QuantumG> have I mentioned that all twins are evil?
20:01 < QuantumG> just thought I'd say that
20:01 < QuantumG> identical twins are more evil than non-identical twins.. and opposite sex non-identical twins are just annoying.
20:02 < kanzure> my mom is a twin
20:02 < kanzure> identical too
20:02 < kanzure> opposite sex non-identical twins are a scam
20:02 < QuantumG> yep, and look how you turned out
20:04 < kanzure> i was digging through my inbox today and saw some emails from you->me from 2007
20:04 < QuantumG> I dated a same sex non-identical twin in high school and my friend dated her less attractive sister (the debate continues as to which one was actually more attractive).. after comparing notes we confirmed, they're both evil bitches.  
20:05 < QuantumG> yeah, 6/25/07
20:06 < kanzure> fitzsim: bruce smith is on nanoengineer-dev now and is willing to answer questions
20:06 < kanzure> he explained to me in a private email that there was in fact a cvs2svn conversion at one point, and multiple cvs repositories that "might have" been merged into just the svn repo
20:07 < kanzure> but he's foggy on the details
20:07 < kanzure> since mark is there too, and soon probably others from nanorex, if we had a list of questions/issues or something, that would be nice
20:08 < kanzure> "what's with all the branches" is a big one to me, only they will know if there's some order to the madness
20:08 < QuantumG> example of something that can be designed in nanoengineer and actually built.. I expect the answer will be the structural dna stuff, but ya never know, they might surprise ya.
20:09 < joshcryer> I googled "man talk" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4iNPeJxQuc
20:09 < kanzure> cad/sim/Distribution differences
20:09 < kanzure> joshcryer: you do know what man is, right?
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20:10 < QuantumG> I know that less is more, more or less
20:10 < kanzure> whether or not we should rename the tags to something more sane (like "v1.0.1" and "v1.0.2") or if there's way too many references to the old stuff
20:10 < joshcryer> kanzure, heh
20:10 < joshcryer> kanzure, I was hoping google would give me a man page for talk.
20:10 < joshcryer> Since I've never heard of a talk command before.
20:10 < joshcryer> And it probably doesn't do what it sounds like it should do.
20:11 < QuantumG> crazy
20:11 < kanzure> talk is an intrusive way to open up a chat session with other users on the same unix system
20:11 < joshcryer> See, I knew it.
20:11 < QuantumG> back in ye olde days, one could log into a unix box and do "who" or just "w" and see who was on, then talk them.. and often get a discussion.
20:11 < joshcryer> Fucking computer should talk when I tell it to talk.
20:12 < joshcryer> That is, it should speak vocally.
20:12 < joshcryer> QuantumG, yeah, who is what I am familiar with.
20:12 < QuantumG> one could also do finger <username> and get information about that person..
20:12 < joshcryer> IRC has CTCP FINGER.
20:12 < joshcryer> It was all the rage in the 90s.
20:15 < QuantumG> finger johnc@idsoftware.com
20:15 < QuantumG> [idsoftware.com]
20:15 < QuantumG> finger: connect: Connection refused
20:15 < QuantumG> and it was a sad day when that stopped working
20:33 < eridu> talk is still enabled on some GNU/Linux machines, even newer ones
20:33 < kanzure> eridu: what do you think of hplusmagazine?
20:33 < eridu> this makes for interesting happenings when lecturers log into their account on said machines during lectures
20:34 < eridu> kanzure: I was pretty sure it had died for a while, since the RSS feeds just went dark
20:34 < eridu> kanzure: but now it seems to be yet another transhumanism blog of the "giddy about the future" variety
20:34 < eridu> it's sort of ironic to see a transhumanism magazine
20:35 < eridu> I know a lot of journalists, and they're all very painfully aware that magazines are the past
20:35 < kanzure> it did die for a while when ownership was transferred from betterhumans llc to humanity+
20:35 < kanzure> well it's not really a magazine any more (you can't pick it up in stores any more)
20:35 < kanzure> so it's really a blog
20:36 < kanzure> but you don't like the content?
20:36 < kanzure> i know your likely opinion but for the sake of actually gathering quantitative data on the issue..
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20:37 < eridu> I have no strong feelings about it
20:37 < eridu> it doesn't have the ghetto aesthetic that other blogs like Next Big Future have
20:37 < eridu> it's basically just a slightly more bubblegum SingularityHub
20:38 < eridu> from what I can remember right now
20:38 < joshcryer> Is anyone going to be videoing the Cal-Tech conference?
20:39 < kanzure> joshcryer: yes techzulu will be livestreaming
20:39 < kanzure> eridu: haha they actually use next big future as an example "well clearly that blog works so we should get paid to run our magazine"
20:39 < kanzure> the exact logic confuses me
20:40 < eridu> real magazines don't get paid to run their magazines
20:40 < joshcryer> I'll have to tune in thanks kanzure.
20:41 < kanzure> anyway, i should apologize for humanity+ or something
20:41 < joshcryer> Yes please.
20:41 < kanzure> it's embarrasing that i haven't got my act together yet on that front
20:41 < joshcryer> I want to see this crazy guys Seasteading panel.
20:42 < QuantumG> Seasteading yah!  
20:42 < eridu> what are you planning on doing with it?
20:42 < joshcryer> kanzure you should shave for your next picture.
20:42 < joshcryer> I can't grow a beard either. Better to shave that crap off than let anyone come near you with a camera.
20:43 < kanzure> eridu: just getting down to business (i.e. diy/transhumanism stuff without the pr)
20:43 < kanzure> humanity+ is probably not the vehicle for that
20:43 < kanzure> and i apologize for bothering you all with their problems
20:43 < eridu> I haven't been bothered
20:43 < joshcryer> You reminded me that there was a conference coming up, so I don't care. :P
20:44 < QuantumG> trans means cross right?  don't we already have enough cross humans?
20:44 < joshcryer> I see it more as 'beyond.'
20:45 < QuantumG> techzulu? what's that? how do I see this seasteading talk?
20:45 < joshcryer> Or 'across'
20:45 < QuantumG> just say superhumanism.. everyone knows what that is
20:45 < joshcryer> I agree.
20:45 < joshcryer> Let's call ourselves superhumans.
20:46 < QuantumG> or perhaps put a german slant on it.. what could possibly go wrong?
20:47 < joshcryer> QuantumG, looks like techzulu has ustream/justin.tv/stickcam as their video stream provider. I'll just use their ustream feed on the day the conf. happens.
20:47 < QuantumG> what day would that be?
20:47 < joshcryer> heh.
20:47 < joshcryer> 4-5th :)
20:47 < joshcryer> so, it really is a busy week starting, tomorrow
20:48 < QuantumG> awesome, something else to watch.
20:48 < joshcryer> yeah :)
20:48 < QuantumG>  the British Navy has put the aircraft carrier HMS Invincible up for sale on an eBay-like website.
20:49 < QuantumG>  over the years her engines, pumps and gear boxes were cannibalized for use in other ships.
20:50 < QuantumG> $1.5 million
20:56 < kanzure> yeah i have to admit the whole "everyone is transhumanist!" thing is a little useless
20:56 < kanzure> it really doesn't help me figure out who's serious about this
20:58 < joshcryer> QuantumG, http://www.boattrader.com/listing/1981-CUSTOM-Tanker-96381865
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20:59 < joshcryer> I suggest we call ourselves Nerds Announcing Zealous Intelligence. 
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21:01 < QuantumG> heh
21:02 < QuantumG> kinda makes you wonder how many ships there are beached that you could go "liberate"
21:03 < joshcryer> Movie called Manufactured Landscapes shows people intentionally beaching boats about to be retired, and poor third worlders go and cut the metal up.
21:03 < joshcryer> There's in fact a beach where they take tankers to die.
21:03 < QuantumG> yeah, saw that
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22:15 < kanzure> fitzsim: hooray
22:15 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/cgit/nanoengineer-fixed/commit/?id=31003d0de7c25ae138da033865e3016e26bd4db5
22:16 < kanzure> if you look at the parents you'll see what i did.
22:20 < kanzure> you can now successfully run git log --follow sim/doc/TableforBsdata.xls for instance
22:22 < kanzure> i think this means everything is fixed, so i'm replacing the public-facing nanoengineer.git
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--- Log closed Thu Dec 02 00:00:07 2010