--- Log opened Tue Sep 27 00:00:29 2011
00:23 < fenn> wow talk about a raw deal; discover antigravity and lose your job: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_Podkletnov
00:28 < fenn> re: neutrinos, the effect is less than .0025 percent; do you think they'd be reporting on it if it went the other direction? no, so please let's stop talking abotu it
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01:22 < archels> fenn: good point
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01:49 < kanzure> hahah
01:49 < kanzure> http://startupkoolaid.com/
01:49 < kanzure> "peter thiel's 20 under 20: preschool is for wimps get them out early!"
02:40 < kanzure> graphviz is AT&T?
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04:22 < fenn> i think what this mostly reveals is that TV contains a lot of images of talking heads: http://www.tgdaily.com/general-sciences-features/58630-brain-imaging-reveals-the-movies-in-our-minds
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06:40 < archels> http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21128315.700-rat-cyborg-gets-digital-cerebellum.html
06:40 < archels> Can anyone find the paper for this? Matti's homepage sucks.
07:03 < fenn> thanks for telling us the name of the paper, newscientist~
07:04 < fenn> i imagine it follows on the work detailed here http://www.neuro.iastate.edu/Uploads//VerschureMintz_Neurocomp_2001.pdf
07:05 < fenn> interesting that it cites a paper by "J.S. Albus" the same james albus that worked at NIST building stewart-platform-ish robocranes, and wrote "people's capitalism" about the coming robot revolution
07:06 < fenn> oh, he's dead. blargh.
07:07 < fenn> i had meant to write to him
07:07 < foucist> fenn: dang, how long had you meant to before he died?
07:08 < fenn> a couple years
07:19 < archels> fenn: cheers
07:29 < fenn> "James was born on May 4, 1935 and passed away on Sunday, April 17, 2011.
07:29 < fenn> James was a resident of Kensington, Maryland. No further public information is available."
07:29 < fenn> um, what?
07:31 < fenn> usually they list all of their relatives etc
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08:39 < fenn> interesting list of names: http://hanson.gmu.edu/friends.html
08:41 < fenn> surprising how many of those people i know
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09:15 < kanzure> drrrrrlllll
09:17 < kanzure> youtube is blasting me with lifetechnologies ads.
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11:34 < eudoxia> look, everybody
11:34 < eudoxia> http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/09/one-third-of-sun-like-stars-have-earth.html
11:41 < kanzure> what's the minimum lawsuit for patent litigation that has ever gone over?
11:41 < kanzure> like if a product is making $50k/year and you have a patent against it, are you gonna go after it?
11:59 < kanzure> huh there is a makerbot tv show now
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11:59 < kanzure> and they have been hiring.. guess they are using that money for something
11:59 < kanzure> i'm kinda interested in what they will do with $10M
11:59 < kanzure> most of it will probably be hiring on more people
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12:45 < fenn> s/kword/kturd/  >:(
13:06 < kanzure> fenn: what's up?
13:07 < kanzure> did you see bruce's OHANDA-but-better thing?
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13:41 < kanzure> hrmm..
13:41 < kanzure> http://www.opensourcehardware.org/
13:42 < kanzure> it's weird how phillip's groupies are taking over things
13:44 < kanzure> "ayah is our informally elected leader. we trust her, respect her and she's demonstrated to everyone her commitment to all of us doing oshw. if there are any ownership of anything like domains, trademarks, etc, we'd like her to have it and then transfer anything to the oshw foundation/org once we have that."
13:45 < kanzure> bleh
14:05 < jrayhawk> yes, because succession battles are always such a good idea
14:06 < jrayhawk> especially in intellectual movements
14:12 < kanzure> i think the reality is that philip has just been working on greasing the gears for months now
14:12 < kanzure> and he's just bringing it out into public
14:12 < kanzure> so there's no way bruce is going to be able to change or direct things in any reasonable/useful manner
14:13 < kanzure> wow what the heck
14:13 < kanzure> philip torrone just sent an email to bruce (publicly) asking him to "please stop using the open source logo"
14:16 < jrayhawk> I wonder what'll happen when Stallman dies.
14:17 < kanzure> shit's all fucked up here
14:22 < kanzure> jrayhawk: i've sent you an email demonstrating the crazy
15:09 < kanzure> jrayhawk: how do i do private piny repos?
15:21 < jrayhawk> You probably need to upgrade for those. I'll go give that a shot.
15:27 < kanzure> hooray upgrades
15:28 < jrayhawk> '/var/log/dpkg.log.12.gz:2010-09-03 01:55:01 status installed pinyadmin 0.7' oh, you may have beat me, then
15:28 < jrayhawk> oh, wait, 2010, durrr
15:28 < jrayhawk> I can read, I swear.
15:33 < jrayhawk> oh yeah, let me know if ever the i386 userspace irritates you
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15:34 < jrayhawk> I assume the 4G addressing ceiling is something you might run into if you're doing complex CAD rendering on there.
15:38 < kanzure> huh?
15:38 < kanzure> 4G.. what?
15:38 < jrayhawk> 4GiB is what 32 bits of addressing can get you
15:39 < jrayhawk> this is a tad low given we have 24GiB accessible to you on that machine
15:42 < jrayhawk> You have separate configs for gnusha.{org,net,com}; should I fold those into one using SeverAlias?
15:45 < jrayhawk> there are also two versions of 004-heeskcad.org because you haven't been doing symlinking; I assume I can delete the inactive one in sites-available/ and replace it with the active one in sites-enabled
15:45 < jrayhawk> Yeah, I guess the old one looks unimportant.
15:48 < jrayhawk> Or I can RedirectMatch everything on gnusha.{com,net} over to gnusha.org, which would be better for pagerank
15:50 < kanzure> jrayhawk: a single serveralias is fine
15:50 < kanzure> jrayhawk: redirectmatch is also fine
15:50 < kanzure> heekscad.org is no longer mine anyway :x
15:50 < kanzure> i doubt anyone will be requesting heekscad.org content from the server heh
15:51 < jrayhawk> Noted!
15:51 < jrayhawk> Are you planning on ever bringing that back?
15:55 < jrayhawk> Do you want your canonical name to be gnusha.org or www.gnusha.org?
15:56 < jrayhawk> I will assume gnusha.org unless told otherwise.
15:57 < kanzure> thanks, yes :)
15:58 < kanzure> i don't know about heekscad.org- nobody seemed to yell at me when i took it down
15:58 < kanzure> and now he's moved things over to http://github.com/heeks/heekscad anyway
16:02 < jrayhawk> structory.com is also unregistered
16:07 < kanzure> haha those bastards :p
16:08 < jrayhawk> do you want my dumb little command CGIs available
16:09 < jrayhawk> i guess I'll do everything but newuser for now.
16:09 < jrayhawk> Since I need the cgi infrastructure to get private cgit working.
16:09 < jrayhawk> And everything else is free and innocuous.
16:10 < kanzure> your cgis are fine? i don't particularly have anything against them
16:15 < kanzure> haha now the sparkfun ceo is turning anti-bruce-perens
16:15 < kanzure> amazing
16:21 < jrayhawk> Well, as I've said before, people who've spent time around Bruce have learned not to trust him with vocational authority.
16:24 < jrayhawk> if I get you a free SSL certificate from startcom or something can i move cgit over to secure.diyhpl.us?
16:25 < jrayhawk> it would make my life easier
16:25 < jrayhawk> i guess it doesn't matter that much; people attempting to look at private repos on the insecure interface with just get a 'permission denied' error
16:41 < jrayhawk> oh hello, there's an eric hanson on this server
16:42 < kanzure> it was made like ten minuets ago
16:42 < kanzure> minutes
16:42 < kanzure> i needed a place to share a screen session with him
16:42 < jrayhawk> Ah soh
16:43 < kanzure> huh nitobi is moving apache to the apache foundation
16:47 < kanzure> "this repo is theoretically private!"
16:47 < kanzure> i'm seeing it :P
16:48 < jrayhawk> Yeah, just fixed that
16:53 < jrayhawk> Okay, so, to show off some of my newer nuttier poorly documented features, try newrepo --disable-ikiwiki heekstest git://github.com/Heeks/heekscad.git
16:53 < jrayhawk> pinyconfig heekstest core.sharedrepository 0660
16:53 < jrayhawk> rebuildrepo heekstest
16:54 < kanzure> so if i change 0660 this will influence cgit and what usergroups can read the files?
16:54 < jrayhawk> Yeah.
16:54 < jrayhawk> after the rebuildrepo, anyway
16:55 < kanzure> and public is 0777?
16:55 < kanzure> have you given up since gitolite or what's the plna?
16:55 < kanzure> *plan
16:55 < jrayhawk> jrayhawk@gnusha:~$ pinyconfig a-private-repo core.sharedrepository poop
16:55 < jrayhawk> core_sharedrepository is not a legal tweakable, or poop is not a legal value for that tweakable.
16:56 < jrayhawk> Attribute (core_sharedrepository) does not pass the type constraint because: Must be one of 0666, 0664 (or all, everybody, world), 0660 (or true, 1, group), or 0640 (or false, 0). at /usr/sbin/pinyconfig line 43
16:56 < kanzure> eh ok
16:57 < jrayhawk> gitolite has badass access control, but it's hard to integrate with my current unix-oriented access model.
16:58 < kanzure> git-revisioned access control is a nice idea
17:00 < jrayhawk> i wonder how hard it would be to turn logfs into a VMS-style controlled filesystem
17:01 < jrayhawk> You can also see what happens with Ikiwiki enabled with http://diyhpl.us/a-private-repo (which I gave you access to)
17:03 < jrayhawk> Unfortunately the failure mode for access on http://diyhpl.us/cgit/ is a bit less graceful than on https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/
17:03 < jrayhawk> and I don't feel like fixing that
17:05 < jrayhawk> Should I make the piny.ikiwiki = 0 (disabled) case redirect the normal Ikiwiki URL to the cgit URL?
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17:11 < kanzure> buh?
17:11 < kanzure> i haven't slept in a very long time
17:11 < kanzure> and i'm confused
17:12 < jrayhawk> about?
17:12 < kanzure> if the repo is private you want to redirect to the cgit error page?
17:12 < kanzure> from ikiwiki?
17:12 < jrayhawk> I would be redirecting the Ikiwiki URL over to the *working* cgit URL
17:13 < kanzure> for a private repo?
17:13 < kanzure> maybe you meant redirect to the https cgit url?
17:13 < jrayhawk> Yeah.
17:13 < kanzure> ok that makes a little more sense
17:13 < kanzure> sounds legit to me
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17:33 < delinquentme> y howdy!
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18:20 < jrayhawk> http://diyhpl.us/piny-commands/
18:23 < jrayhawk> newuser doesn't work since I assume you don't want that, yet.
18:27 < jrayhawk> And, just to warn you ahead of time, because we don't really trust piny users, git dirs and git configs aren't writable by users; only objects/refs/etc.
18:28 < jrayhawk> you'll have to either sudo git config to do stuff or use pinyconfig (which is restricted)
18:28 < kanzure> wait what? i've used newuser in the past
18:29 < kanzure> is there any reason i shouldn't be using it
18:29 < jrayhawk> I mean, the public interface for newuser doesn't work.
18:29 < jrayhawk> on http://diyhpl.us/piny-commands/
18:29 < kanzure> oh that's probably cgi stuff huh
18:29 < kanzure> yep ok
18:31 < jrayhawk> https://secure.diyhpl.us/auth/lsaccess.cgi oh hey neat, this is broken due to unmanaged repositories
18:31 < jrayhawk> ugh, i suppose i should fix that
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18:31 < kanzure> unmanaged repos aren't necessarily evil right?
18:31 < diane> hey
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18:32 < jrayhawk> No, I intend for that to be supported, but the other mixed-management piny sites all compulsively use git-$reponame anyway, so I never noticed.
18:34 < jrayhawk> s/No/Yes/ # or something; lingual convention is confusing here!
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18:46 < jrayhawk> 18:57 < jrayhawk> would you like me to enable anonymous account registration on diyhpl.us
18:46 < jrayhawk> 18:58 < kanzure> piny shells?
18:46 < jrayhawk> 18:58 < jrayhawk> Yeah.
18:46 < jrayhawk> 18:58 < kanzure> yeah that's fine
18:47 < kanzure> hm?
18:47 < kanzure> oops i've probably contradicted myself somewhere
18:48 < jrayhawk> From a week ago or so. So, the options for anonymous account registration are 1) SSH (see ssh newuser@piny.be ) with no email verification and 2) CGI with email verification
18:48 < kanzure> i would prefer #1
18:48 < kanzure> but let's hold off on it until i complain enough about the email thing
18:49 < jrayhawk> Uh, so you want SSH, WWW, both, or neither right now?
18:49 < kanzure> neither right now is ok
18:49 < jrayhawk> hooray, less work for me
18:49 < kanzure> is this in pinyconfig?
18:50 < jrayhawk> No, the CGI would be enabled in the apache config, and the SSH stuff involves some PAM and ssh_config wizardry.
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18:59 < kanzure> Creating piny repo this-is-a-very-long-repository-name-because-i-do-not-remember-testing-that-here
18:59 < kanzure> description: hello
18:59 < kanzure> hee
18:59 < jrayhawk> oh yeah, i forgot i implemented notifications
19:02 < joshcryer> skdb link in the topic goes to an empty directory.
19:02 < kanzure> the fuck
19:02 < jrayhawk> uh oh
19:02 < kanzure> i blame jrayhawk
19:02 < jrayhawk> that's fair
19:11 < jrayhawk> That'll be fixed in ten minutes while things rebuild.
19:11 < kanzure> sounds important
19:11 < kanzure> bruce wants some articles for an open hardware technical journal
19:11 < kanzure> i should probably write something about skdb
19:11 < kanzure> or lolcad
19:12 < joshcryer> Nice.
19:12 < kanzure> or i guess it's better form to write about other projects
19:12 < joshcryer> Who is bruce?
19:12 < joshcryer> Oh, the Creative Commons Bruce?
19:12 < kanzure> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruce_Perens
19:12 < joshcryer> Lawson?
19:12 < joshcryer> Ahh, right!
19:12 < kanzure> http://perens.com/about/introduction/
19:13 < joshcryer> Yes, yes, I saw your link about the open hardware mailing list a few days back.
19:13 < joshcryer> When I clicked there was nothing archived yet.
19:13 < joshcryer> (don't feel like joining since I wouldn't be participating)
19:13 < kanzure> *shrug* too many email lists and other shit
19:13 < kanzure> why do people keep forking
19:14 < kanzure> i keep trying to send email back to one place but it isn't working
19:14 < joshcryer> Hackers love recreating the wheel.
19:15 < jrayhawk> http://xkcd.com/927/ Standards
19:15 < jrayhawk> so clearly we need a new mailing list that will encompass all the other mailing lists
19:15 < joshcryer> I understand it on a personal level since I feel like it's a waste of time to learn someone elses failed implementation in the futile hope that it will do what I want.
19:16 < joshcryer> I spent several hours coaxing Imagemagick into converting a 500mb tiff for me, for instance. I will likely never use Imagemagick again, ever.
19:17 < jrayhawk> I... uh... don't think ImageMagick qualifies as a failed implementation.
19:18 < jrayhawk> AFAIK it's more widely used than GD and libgimp
19:20 < joshcryer> Yeah, it's not really Imagemagick's fault that it ate all of my ram while converting a tiff but for some magic reason if I converted it first into a png using a different program it could manage without doing that.
19:21 < joshcryer> It's the fault of competing operating systems, cometing hardware standards, etc, etc.
19:22 < jrayhawk> What do operating systems and hardware standards have to do with an almost-pure ANSI C program?
19:23 < jrayhawk> I agree that the tiff processor should be better, though; there's no need for it to preallocate a framebuffer like that.
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19:24 < joshcryer> Oh so it's not just me? I thought it was because I run Windows.
19:24 < joshcryer> I was tempted to do a Linux live boot just to see if it would work there.
19:24 < jrayhawk> Unless you're using a really, really dumb frontend, it's almost certainly ImageMagick's fault.
19:25 < joshcryer> No, it was all command line, I read the entire manual assuming I was doing something wrong. I did memory limits, etc, nothing worked.
19:30 < joshcryer> I just think crap would be a lot easier if we started over from scratch. :P
19:31 < joshcryer> And I can understand why someone would sit down and say "I can do it better!"
19:31 < joshcryer> And thus, forks.
19:32 < kanzure> maybe a 500mb tiff file is a bad idea
19:34 < joshcryer> I was archiving a picture from 1914, it's heavily damaged. GIMP could load it but it was needing to be broken down because half the plugins would simply crash trying to work on it. Heh.
19:35 < kanzure> how much ram do you have
19:35 < joshcryer> 4gb
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19:38 < kanzure> hi strangewarp
19:38 < strangewarp> hihi
19:43 < ybit> what's the news? no access to my email, and i'm not going to reset password
19:43 < ybit> guess i could check google groups and the logs
19:44 < kanzure> openmanufacturing has some amusing stuff..
19:45 < ybit> i see
19:46 < ybit> hate to say hi/bye, but i have to
19:46 < kanzure> you jerk
19:48 < joshcryer> Hmm, will Bruce be selling his Technical Journal?
19:48 < kanzure> no most likely not
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20:31 < jrayhawk> 500mb tiffs are fairly common in scientific circles, too.
20:32 < kanzure> scientists are awful computer users
20:33 < jrayhawk> There isn't really an alternative; nothing else does arbitrary colorspaces.
20:33 < jrayhawk> This matters a fair amount for imaging outside visible spectra.
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20:40 < klafka> man i can't believe hwo little i accompolished
20:40 < klafka> also i resent that kanzure
20:40 < joshcryer> We should all move to Alaska.
20:40 < joshcryer> A major coop, a thousand people or more.
20:40 < joshcryer> And get the annual stipend.
20:40 < joshcryer> And use it to further goals for world domination.
20:40 < joshcryer> OK the math probably wouldn't work out...
20:41 < kanzure> ok how about instead we all stay where we are and work towards global domination
20:41 < kanzure> i guess in the end we do nothing
20:41 < kanzure> so uh.. mission accomplished guys
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20:46 < joshcryer> I just heard a guy on New Space say "Alaska ain't broke" while explaining the whole advanced FAA they have up there (since a lot of the people are only able to transport by plane). And then I remembered Alaska has oil money. Yeah, I'm out of it. :P
20:48 < joshcryer> Global domination is overrated anyway.
20:48 < joshcryer> Galactic domination is where it's at.
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23:21 < kanzure> hmm
23:21 < kanzure> http://olddocs.dotcloud.com/tutorials/celery/
23:32 < kanzure> jrayhawk: now philip is using bruce's past actions with osi and spi to oust him as a bad person
23:33 < kanzure> i can't blame him for not wanting to deal with the crap
23:34 < jrayhawk> Do... do you think people are unjustified for being bitter with Perens?
23:34 < jrayhawk> Because I have some bad news about your new buddy.
23:34 < kanzure> no
23:35 < kanzure> but he's not wrong about the grandstanding going on
23:37 < jrayhawk> Stupid personality battles are sort of a pattern with him.
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23:58 < CryptoQuick> if (width > window.innerHeight) {
23:58 < CryptoQuick> wait, what
23:58 < CryptoQuick> what was I even thinking
23:58 < CryptoQuick> oh, aspect ratio
23:58 < CryptoQuick> yeah, I guess if I wanted to know it was > 1.0 ...
--- Log closed Wed Sep 28 00:00:30 2011