--- Log opened Sat Jan 05 00:00:21 2013
00:01 <@kanzure> aha maybe botbrew.. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1446541
00:01 <@kanzure> uses http://api.viglink.com/api/click?format=go&drKey=1359&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.xda-developers.com%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D1446541&v=1&libid=1357372793042&out=http%3A%2F%2Fcode.google.com%2Fp%2Fopkg%2F&ref=http%3A%2F%2Fplus.url.google.com%2Furl%3Fsa%3Dz%26n%3D1357372654920%26url%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.xda-developers.com%252Fshowthread.php%253Ft%253D1446541%26usg%3DoXKrL9XeSVES_PcHHU0oY9p5cWY.&title=%5B5%2F20%5D%20BotBrew%3A%20*nix%20tools%20an
00:01 <@kanzure> oops
00:01 <@kanzure> wait a sec.. i know the viglink guy. i need to go yell at him.
00:11 <@kanzure> http://botbrew.com/
00:12 <@kanzure> or this one seems to just install a small debian in a chroot https://github.com/guardianproject/lildebi
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01:04 <@kanzure> neat. sane armel packages from debian.
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04:02 < saurik> kanzure: it is called Ubuntu
04:02 < saurik> you download Ubuntu Core and install it into a chroot
04:02 < saurik> and by "install", I pretty much mean "tar -zxvf", potentially followed by a mount --bind of /proc and /sys if you care
04:04 < saurik> apparently that's pretty much the same answer they gave you on #android
04:04 < saurik> (although their answer is based on my old instructions; I now just recommend Ubuntu Core)
04:04 < saurik> 08:11:24 < ar> kanzure: with android, you can just get yourself a debian in a chroot on sdcard with ext4 format
04:04 < saurik> 08:11:43 < ar> kanzure: provided that you have rooted your phone
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04:26 < JayDugger> saurik, have you done that?
04:28 < saurik> yes?
04:28 < JayDugger> To what use did you put it?
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04:29 < saurik> gdb, strace, wget; I think I used the compiler some to test some things
04:29 < saurik> subversion to get my customized home directory profile
04:30 < JayDugger> I had done the same for while, but found no use for it. I didn't do any development on it, so there our use cases differ.
04:30 < saurik> I don't use android for anything but testing and hacking, so my use cases there will be weird
04:31 < saurik> on my iphone I'm more likely to drop to a console to do things like whois
04:31 < saurik> ping
04:31 < saurik> host
04:31 < saurik> ssh
04:31 < JayDugger> Fair enough, yeah.
04:31 < saurik> (although I realize there are apps for ssh)
04:31 < saurik> a lot of people use irssi
04:31 < saurik> (although I prefer keeping that on a server that I ssh to with screen)
04:32 < JayDugger> I found the lack of a full-size keyboard a crippling disadvantage.
04:33 < JayDugger> So none of those examples were very useful to me in practice. I wondered if you'd found something I missed.
04:34 < JayDugger> You had: development.
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09:47 < archels> hmm, I've been naming my bibtex entries with two decimals for the year. I guess I'm part of the problem
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11:06 <@kanzure> saurik: the downside of a chroot is that it's isolated from the android things. i would be happy if i could just overwrite the default binaries. wget is crippled and busybox wget also sucks.
11:06 < saurik> define "isolated"
11:07 < saurik> mount --bind is your friend
11:07 <@kanzure> processes?
11:07 < saurik> processes are a global namespace
11:07 <@kanzure> welp that was my only real concern.
11:18 < jrayhawk> chrooted programs can also break out of chroots if ever that becomes desirable
11:19 < jrayhawk> chroot is there for convenience, not for security
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12:02 <@kanzure> "I don't know; I haven't followed this stuff for years." -- aaronsw
12:02 <@kanzure> well.. that was a dead end.
12:05 <@kanzure> "made in china" http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?cat=7
12:05 <@kanzure> "factory floor quotation/making a bom" http://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=2776
12:10 < brownies> kanzure: inspiring stuff.
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13:35 <@kanzure> "I can easily provide plasmids for engineered LOV domains if requested."
13:35 <@kanzure> uhh yes please?
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15:00 < chris_99> for open source hardware-y stuff, what licence have you guys used before
15:00 <@kanzure> there's no legitimately great license for open source hardware because hardware is covered by patent law, not copyright law.
15:00 <@kanzure> thingiverse encouraged the use of creative commons (cc-by-sa)
15:00 <@kanzure> bruce perens encouraged the use of tapr or whatever
15:00 <@kanzure> some people use gpl
15:01 <@kanzure> i believe reprap is gpl
15:01 < chris_99> aha, cheers, yeah i'm looking at the creative commons ones at the moment
15:03 <@kanzure> *no legitimately great copyright license
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15:42 < juri_> tapr is winning, in my book.
15:43 <@kanzure> there are tens of thousands of things on thingiverse using cc instead of tapr
15:43 <@kanzure> how is that winning..?
15:43 < juri_> i mean, its got my vote, not that people use it. ;P
15:43 <@kanzure> also, cern wrote their own custom copyright license for open hardware things
15:44 < juri_> interesting. didn't know of that one.
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15:50 <@fenn> juri_: why do you prefer tapr? i don't remember the details, but i didn't like some aspect of it
15:53 <@fenn> i think this has changed since i last looked at it
15:55 < chris_99> is this the website for tapr? - http://www.tapr.org/
15:55 <@fenn> "Unlike the GPL, the OHL is not primarily a copyright license." what then, is it?
15:55 < chris_99> er ignore that
15:59 <@fenn> also, oddly enough, circuit board layout is considered "artwork" in the sense of a painting or a drawing, and can be copyrighted. this never really made sense to me. how thin do i have to slice my mechanical contraption for it to be considered artwork?
16:05 < chris_99> heh thats interesting
16:06 < brownies> going the other direction, how many paintings do you have to stack together vertically before the sum of the paintings stops being art?
16:06 <@kanzure> obviously we should patent picasso
16:09 <@fenn> can you use vhdl to specify a circuit board schematic? the whole placing pictures on a diagram thing just seems limited in various ways
16:10 <@fenn> like, you might want some specific degree of ambiguity in pin assignment in order for an autorouter to do its job
16:10 <@kanzure> i haven't seen vhdl to pcb because most people check the masks or routing before they put it on silicon
16:12 <@fenn> wut
16:12 <@fenn> i just mean using vhdl to create the netlist, instead of a drawing of a schematic
16:12 <@fenn> i actually don't know how vhdl works or whether it's even the appropriate tool fror the job
16:13 < chris_99> what do you mean by netlist in this respect, vhdl makes use of little logic units on the FPGA
16:15 <@kanzure> vhdl is used in far more contexts than fpga
16:16 <@fenn> "a hardware description language used in electronic design automation to describe digital and mixed-signal systems"
16:16 < chris_99> oh ok, didn't realise that, thought it was only used on FPGAs
16:16 <@fenn> it's usually only used for FPGA or ASIC design, not PCB design
16:17 <@fenn> 9-value logic types.. why not just introduce a full type system
16:18 <@fenn> oh it does have types
16:20 <@fenn> anyway, if the autorouter is something wild like topor and has full control over part placement, why restrict it by making arbitrary choices about which package types or pins to use
16:21 <@fenn> at some point you're just making arbitrary choices to limit the search space
16:21 <@fenn> i'd rather let the computer do as much of the optimization work as possible, and EDA is well enough formalized to let that happen at a very high level
16:22 <@fenn> as opposed to say HMI/UI which has terrible formalism
16:22 < chris_99> i don't get what you mean, how are you restricting it, in the VHDL
16:23 <@fenn> by saying "pin 9 connects to pin 10" or something like that
16:23 <@fenn> every specification limits the set of possible circuits
16:23 <@fenn> s/limits/constrains/
16:24 <@fenn> you might run into a situation where it's impossible to optimize away some bit of topology, but if you change the pinout it suddenly becomes possible
16:25 <@fenn> then you can do the circuit on a single layer board, or whatever
16:25 <@fenn> currently this is a tedious manual process of try-it-and-see
16:26 <@fenn> there's an analogous situation in the choice of components to use, all the way back up to the design phase
16:29 < juri_> its just compilers and specs. the question is what level you want to describe your object, and what the tools will let you do. i've worked with very limited tools that would do part picking, based on a description of the function the board needs to perform.
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16:37 < chris_99> oh interesting, i'm just playing around with Quartus, Altera's software
16:37 < chris_99> and you have a little pin planner application to map pins to the VHDL variables
16:38 < chris_99> so the VHDL doesn't handle that directly
16:38 < chris_99> (from my limited understanding)
16:38 < juri_> makes sense.
16:39 < chris_99> yup
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18:20 < delinquentme> I'm thinking that having a authenticity token shouldn't be an issue when trying to login with mechanize
18:20 < delinquentme> right?
18:20 <@kanzure> you have to pull that token from the page before sending your request
18:21 <@kanzure> if it's embedded in the same form, then mechanize will send it with the rest of the request parameters
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18:29 < delinquentme> yeah doing that
18:29 < delinquentme> but it hangs
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18:50 <@kanzure> delinquentme: run mechanize through http://mitmproxy.org/ and see what requests it's sending
18:51 < delinquentme> kanzure, bamf .. but i upgraded to a newer version of mechanize and it handles the cookies ??
18:51 < delinquentme> I think thats what caused the issue
18:51 <@kanzure> bamf?
18:51 < delinquentme> lol
19:04 < delinquentme> http://imgur.com/xoSUH
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20:50 < delinquentme> kanzure, isn't something like that built into chrome?
20:52 <@kanzure> sure, but not for mechanize
20:56 <@kanzure> the other day i saw a node/npm package for debugging node servers using webkit inspector
20:56 <@kanzure> :/
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21:06 <@kanzure> ah right, qwerty was originally patented.
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21:49 < delinquentme> kanzure, you're done lots of scraping ja?
21:49 < delinquentme> you def prefer JS-based options?
21:49 < delinquentme> bc this mechanize is starting to get ehhhhhh
22:02 <@kanzure> it depends on the goals but yes i've done lots of browser-driven scraping
22:02 <@kanzure> i'm apparently the maintainer of pyphantomjs, a python rewrite of phantomjs (a headless webkit browser driven by javascript)
22:04 <@kanzure> node-chimera is also worth looking at if you're ever considering phantomjs
22:04 <@kanzure> but this is probably the best https://github.com/substack/schoolbus
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23:38 <@kanzure> xx: hi
23:38 < xx> hello
23:39 <@kanzure> what brings you around here?
23:39 < xx> #reddit-nootropics topic
23:39 <@kanzure> okay. you're welcome to stay but there's an anti-reddit bias in here.
23:39 < xx> cool. whyÉ
23:39 < xx> ?
23:40 <@kanzure> every user tends to be the same, no differentiation, same crappy imgur links, same unwillingness to read books, etc., it's just tiring and not worth our effort. so no yolo/trollolo/imgur/til/tldr/etc..
23:41 < xx> hah basically no internet troll character role playing /trolling. perfect
23:41 < brownies> heh. imgur is completely out eh?
23:41 < yashgaroth> aww man but http://i.imgur.com/pGDZ8.gif
23:42 < brownies> funny how guilt by association works. i suppose they are oddly similar crowds, though.
23:42 <@kanzure> the creepy thing is that the stereotype is correct.
23:42 < brownies> of autistic fast food workers, or of redditors?
23:42 < brownies> ...but perhaps i repeat myself. ;)
23:42 <@kanzure> i'm gonna assume that was the aspergerking image and not click
23:43 < brownies> yeah
23:43 < yashgaroth> 'twas
23:43 <@kanzure> so fucking predictable
23:43 < xx> lol
23:43 < xx> oh wow
23:43 < xx> fenn:
23:43 < xx> o/ hai buddy
23:44 <@fenn> hello again
23:44 < xx> your channel looks neat. i'll idle here if you don't mind :>
23:45 <@fenn> what is with the pointy smiley face? is that another reddit-ism?
23:45 <@kanzure> nah :> has been around for much longer than reddit
23:45 < xx> hmmm nop im pretty sure it's not. i don't go there. something i picked up from blackberry texting?
23:46 < brownies> no, :< and his brother :> have been around for a very long time
23:46 <@kanzure> :> is often explained as devilish grin.
23:46 < xx> ^
23:46 < xx> i see it more as a witty/amused smile
23:46 <@kanzure> :< is sad mustache man
23:46 < brownies> i always saw :< as "sad and moustachoied"
23:46 < xx> ^ i prefer it on :( <
23:46 < brownies> ah, good.
23:47 < xx> i also like this smiley a lot >>> C:
23:47 < xx> annnd this ^-^ andd  ^_~
23:47 < yashgaroth> ok let's step it down a notch
23:47 < xx> those are the smileys i use a lot. along with :3 <
23:47 < xx> oops okay.
23:48 < brownies> i use =) because no one uses = as the face for some reason
23:48 < yashgaroth> :V
23:48 < xx> the equal sign is farrrrr
23:48 -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+o yashgaroth] by kanzure
23:48 < xx> V_V
23:48 <@yashgaroth> @:V
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23:49 < xx> so it's basically the same users of #reddit-nootropics except without the active trolling
23:49 < xx> i liek.
23:50 <@kanzure> actually AdrianG is muted in here because he doesn't ever contribute useful messages
23:50 < xx> Transhumanism ftw. I can't wait until there is nothing natural left.
23:50 < xx> hahahahaha
23:50 < xx> oh dear
23:50 < xx> I'm so going to laugh at him for that
23:51 < xx> where is erasmus?
23:51 <@kanzure> i think i permabanned him
23:51 < xx> <3 marry me.
23:51 < brownies> i feel like all nootropics conversations on the internet are basically the same anyway
23:51 < xx> they are.
23:52 <@kanzure> klafka and i were writing a nootropic search engine for a while
23:52 < xx> its like this: amphetamine amphetamine amphetamine KETAMINE amphetamine amphetamine
23:52 < brownies> there's a large peanut gallery contingent, a decent showing of piracetam users, and a couple lunatics pumping experimental chemicals into their brains
23:52 <@kanzure> and then he got employed and became a loser
23:53 < xx> lol
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23:54 <@fenn> there's no standard test battery to compare results, even if people did any kind of quantitative objective testing
23:54 < xx> so is there any drug that has been created to make you perma happy?
23:54 <@fenn> i shouldn't whine so much. at least cognistats allows downloading of test results now
23:54 < xx> or not yet?
23:54 <@kanzure> you don't need a drug for that, you can just directly stimulate the correct regions of the brain dude.
23:55 < xx> teach me
23:55 <@fenn> yes it's called L-DOPA
23:55 <@kanzure> bah
23:55 <@fenn> only problem is you die of a heart attack after a month of using it
23:55 <@kanzure> xx: why though? wireheading is not exactly our collective interest.
23:56 < xx> it's my interest. I'm a chronic depressed hedonist.
23:56 < xx> chronically*
23:56 <@kanzure> oh great.
23:56 < archbox> xx: :<
23:56 < xx> another one of those, amirite kanzure
23:56 < xx> ohai archbox  ^-^
23:56 < xx> <3
23:56 < xx> archbox ftw!
23:56 < archbox> xx ftw <3
23:56 < xx> tehe :3
23:56 <@kanzure> what the hell guys
23:57 < xx> excuse our emotions.
23:57 < xx> we'll resume acting like human robots.
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23:59 < brownies> you could experiment with supplementing 5-HTP and that other one that's a dopamine precursor
23:59 < brownies> is that L-Dopa?
23:59 < xx> I'm currently on effexor.
23:59 < brownies> n.b. i am not your lawyer, doctor, dentist, accountant, psychiatrist, etc.
--- Log closed Sun Jan 06 00:00:00 2013