--- Log opened Tue Jun 04 00:00:46 2013
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08:42 < kanzure> bloop
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09:17 < kirka> hi
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09:19 < kanzure> kirka: hi.
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09:29 < kanzure> "Global League Of Oppressed Mad Men" (GLOOMM)
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11:43 < kanzure_> jrayhawk_: it occurs to me that the timeouts are probably not our fault, huh
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11:44 < jrayhawk_> freenode is awful
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11:45 < jrayhawk_> "synced in 303 secs"
11:45 < kanzure_> i think it treats persistence as optional or something
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14:33 < kanzure> shit phantomjs users say, https://groups.google.com/forum/?hl=en&fromgroups#!topic/phantomjs/UAnXS96ZcdM "perl is much more agile than js"
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14:55 < ParahSai1in> not as agile as a bobcat though
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15:05 < phillyj> hello all
15:05 < phillyj> just found out thunderbird chat can connect to irc
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16:19 < kanzure> .tell sbp just saw your pyphantomjs bug report. yes, pip installation is known to be broken. but also, pyphantomjs is very far behind phantomjs upstream.
16:19 < yoleaux> kanzure: I'll pass your message to sbp.
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16:30 < nmz787> http://www.washington.edu/news/2013/06/04/wi-fi-signals-enable-gesture-recognition-throughout-entire-home/
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16:54 < kanzure> haha the kickstarter/glow project guys are replying:
16:55 < kanzure> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/diybio/JuANbe9C1LQ
16:55 < kanzure> oh wait it was a private reply
16:55 < kanzure> ah his email wasn't approved
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17:15 < kanzure> nmz787: commercial use is explicitly allowed by open source
17:15 < kanzure> nmz787: dunno what you're talking about
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17:20 < abetusk> There are creative commons license that don't allow commercial re-use
17:21 < kanzure> yes, but those aren't open source
17:25 < kanzure> oh interesting, OSI doesn't list any of the creative commons licenses. hah.
17:26 < phillyj> nmz787: how do they solve interference?
17:26 < kanzure> well anyway, CC-NC has a lot of practical problems that make it basically worthless
17:35 < Urchin> as in?
17:36 < kanzure> any page that has ads can be considered commercial by CC-NC
17:40 < Urchin> makes sense, but I doubt someone would sue over it
17:41 < kanzure> http://dougsarchaeology.wordpress.com/2013/04/11/creative-commons-non-commercial-a-cruel-joke/
17:42 < kanzure> besides the argument i made above, he continues: "Basically, CC-NC is a joke when it comes to allowing other people to use the material. It is a cheap way for an organization to seem open when really they are not. You actually have more rights under Fair Use to use a work, because of the diminished emphases on non-commercial uses, than under CC-NC."
17:42 < kanzure> although i wasn't aware of that point about fair use providing more rights.
17:44  * kirka sleeps
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17:44 < kanzure> anyway, in a more pedantic sense, it's explicitly not open source because it prohibits commercial use, which is one of the guiding principles of open source.
17:47 < kanzure> i guess this guy is growing some arabidopsis thaliana: http://straightarabidope.wordpress.com/
17:47 < kanzure> ah, to their credit, the glow project did make a poll asking people what license to use and what to allow: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/antonyevans/glowing-plants-natural-lighting-with-no-electricit/posts/472077
17:47 < kanzure> http://s12.postimg.org/wnekjt459/Survey_results.png
17:47 < kanzure> "Yes, completely open - companies can sell" has the most votes
17:48 < kanzure> so theoretically they might abide by this.
17:48 < kanzure> http://glowingplant.com/community
17:48 < abetusk> kanzure, they already did
17:48 < abetusk> They put out a post saying they were going completely open
17:49 < kanzure> they already did what ?
17:49 < kanzure> oh, make a post.
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17:51 < abetusk> hmm..ok, so only a promise to go completely free
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17:52 < abetusk> "o we will release the seeds completely free of any commercial restrictions. "  http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/antonyevans/glowing-plants-natural-lighting-with-no-electricit/posts/472077?ref=email&show_token=da1810933680f5d3
17:52 < kanzure> ?ref=email
17:52 < kanzure> you donated
17:52 < abetusk> heh, whoops, you caught me
17:52 < abetusk> yes, I backed it
17:53 < kanzure> not an impressive conclusion for me to leap to.. but whatever :)
17:58 < kanzure> "And I've noticed many biologists being reluctant to even edit a pbworks or mediawiki, but they don't seem to have too much trouble with google docs."
17:58 < kanzure> god damn it why don't biologists like wikis?
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18:03 < kanzure> ParahSai1in: tell me things about vaguely-novel ways of constructing indexes for sequence searching?
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19:19 < phillyj> kanzure: is there some post moderation going on in DIYbio mail-list?
19:20 < phillyj> that guy Anthony Evans said his posts were being moderated (SciAM article topic)
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19:43 < kanzure> phillyj: diybio is moderated by mac cowell and jason bobe, i have never been a moderator and i have never known the exact settings they use.
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22:41 < kanzure> wow, only 24 projects on microryza have been completely funded.
22:41 < kanzure> https://www.microryza.com/discover click "funded"
22:41 < kanzure> guess they haven't grown. at all.
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23:50 < nmz787> he seeemed to send two messages, so maybe it wasn't really moderated?
23:50 < kanzure> you might be seeing the messages after they were moderated
23:50 < kanzure> but earlier today you weren't able to see them through the web interface
23:51 < nmz787> huh, i never see anything in web
23:51 < kanzure> i only mention the web because i linked to it
23:51 < nmz787> the message you replied to is the same timestamp as my message
23:52 < kanzure> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/diybio/JuANbe9C1LQ
23:52 < nmz787> yours says 5:32, mines 3:32
23:52 < kanzure> yeah but gmail auto-sorts
23:52 < nmz787> which is right, 2 timezones
23:52 < nmz787> hmm
23:52 < nmz787> show original
23:52 < nmz787> then?
23:52 < nmz787> ctrl-f what?
23:53 < kanzure> https://groups.google.com/group/diybio/msg/724a4482a4d033c3?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect
23:53 < nmz787> Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 15:32:48 -0700 (PDT)
23:53 < nmz787> From: Antony Evans <antonyevans@gmail.com>
23:53 < nmz787> To: diybio@googlegroups.com
23:54 < kanzure> Received: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 17:15:20 -0700
23:54 < kanzure> (this is the second one)
23:54 < kanzure> my email was at 16:43 and his was at 17:15
23:54 < nmz787> his second, right?
23:55 < kanzure> yes
23:55 < kanzure> X-Received: by 10.50.118.10 with SMTP id ki10mr3160094igb.7.1370396005116; Tue, 04 Jun 2013 18:33:25 -0700 (PDT)
23:55 < kanzure> so i think mac or jason approved it at 18:33
23:55 < nmz787> X-Received: by 10.50.176.137 with SMTP id ci9mr561665igc.16.1370395944339;
23:55 < nmz787>         Tue, 04 Jun 2013 18:32:24 -0700 (PDT)
23:55 < nmz787> for the first msg
23:55 < kanzure> maybe these headers are faked
23:56 < nmz787> hmm
23:56 < nmz787> well it says he sent it at 15:32 PDT
23:56 < nmz787> and we received at 18:32
23:56 < nmz787> 33 in your case
23:57 < kanzure> ok so he took 40 seconds or w/e to approve the next email
23:57 < nmz787> seems more like 3 hours
23:57 < nmz787> 40 seconds seems like a weird routing lag maybe?
23:58 < kanzure> jason sent an email about stewart brand at 18:42 so i'm gonna say it was jason
23:58 < nmz787> propagating from web to email
23:58 < kanzure> nope, 40 seconds between approving two emails is normal
23:58 < kanzure> antony sent two emails
23:58 < kanzure> so jason approved both emails individually
23:58 < nmz787> but aren't we talking about the same email?
23:58 < nmz787> i thought you pasted your header from the first email
23:58 < kanzure> this is the second email https://groups.google.com/group/diybio/msg/724a4482a4d033c3?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect
23:59 < nmz787> oh shit
23:59 < kanzure> this is the first email https://groups.google.com/group/diybio/msg/ee8b976696bbb9ee?dmode=source&output=gplain&noredirect
23:59 < nmz787> i checked the second emails headers
23:59 < nmz787>         Tue, 4 Jun 2013 18:33:23 -0700 (PDT)
23:59 < nmz787> huh
23:59 < nmz787> i didn't think they moderated
--- Log closed Wed Jun 05 00:00:16 2013