--- Day changed Sun Dec 14 2014
00:04 < nmz787> juri_: so it seems you have posted to the google group about crashing and it seems no one else is working on this... :/  ugh, this is difficult to decide on what to use
00:04 < nmz787> juri_: which escad was consuming hours?
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00:19 < juri_> oh, that's so fixed...
00:19 < juri_> i've taken over as maintainer.
00:19 < nmz787> i am totally new to haskell as of downlaoding this
00:20 < nmz787> (also make test doesn't work for me, when replacing the _home var with ~/.cabal/bin/)
00:20 < nmz787> i am writing a test script in python now to generate stl
00:20 < nmz787> for them all
00:21 < juri_> this is my first haskell project.
00:22 < juri_> anyway, to bed with me.
00:22 < ebowden> Night juri_.
00:22 < nmz787> 'night
00:23 < juri_> i'll be back at it first thing in the morning.
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02:09 < delinquentme> kanzure, do you have chat logs indexed for chat rooms other than ##hplusroadmap ?
02:28 < nmz787> juri_: when I try to run linear_extrude(height=20, translate(h) = [sin(h), 0, 0]){  square( size = [5, 5] ); }  I get this error extopenscad: coercing OVal to a -> b isn't always safe; use a -> Maybe b (trace: 0.0 -> [0.0,0.0,0.0] )
02:33 < nmz787> oh, juri_ , I guess this is what I wanted linear_extrude(height=20, translate(h) = [sin(h), 0]){  square( size = [5, 5] ); }
02:45 < nmz787> .tell chris_99 this is my first attempt at CAD for that microfluidic mixer http://imgur.com/4XgSEWH
02:45 < yoleaux> nmz787: I'll pass your message to chris_99.
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03:16 < nmz787> .tell chris_99 check it out rendered here: https://github.com/nmz787/microfluidic-cad/blob/master/implicitCAD/output/sinusoidal_mixer.stl
03:16 < yoleaux> nmz787: I'll pass your message to chris_99.
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03:19 < nmz787> kanzure juri_ I don't quite like the looks of the intersection of the central square and the translated square... I had the quality cranked up pretty high and it didn't seem to make a huge differece (tried a few values between 1 and 200)
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03:50 < archels> hmm I think I encountered a similar situation once, where I had to make a sinusoidal channel with constant spacing between the walls
03:50 < archels> as I recall it was a bit of nag
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05:08 < jrayhawk> kanzure: vsftpd strikes me as a very bad idea and i am disabling it
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05:26 < kanzure> thanks
05:27 < kanzure> there exist preserved samples of len sassaman brain matter https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/diybio/LMfqPUR0OCA
05:32 < kanzure> .to delinquentme yes, i have logs of other irc channels but they are not available by public http
05:32 < yoleaux> kanzure: I'll pass your message to delinquentme.
05:33 < kanzure> .to genehacker nmz787's microfluidic mixer http://imgur.com/4XgSEWH
05:33 < yoleaux> kanzure: I'll pass your message to genehacker.
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05:43 < kanzure> hello eudoxia
05:43 < eudoxia> kanzure: what's up
05:43 < kanzure> there exist preserved samples of len sassaman brain matter https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/diybio/LMfqPUR0OCA
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05:46 < eudoxia> but why
05:47 < kanzure> because they didn't do cryonics
05:48 < eudoxia> i wonder what the size of the samples is
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07:18 < kragen> also
07:18 < kragen> I don't remember if Meredith ever told me how he killed himself
07:18 < kragen> but lots of suicide methods don't provide much opportunity for cryonics
07:18 < kragen> she did, however, cryopreserve what she cryopreserved, rather than just dunking it in formalin
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09:35 < heath> last update was dec.6 for gnusha.org/logs
09:36 < kanzure> because logbot isn't running
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11:14 < nmz787> archels: you do microfluidics?
11:17 < nmz787> before going to sleep I turned the quality on that mixer up from 2 to 3000 and it ended up producing an STL of 115 MB
11:18 < kanzure> this is why you shouldn't use stl -_-
11:18 < kanzure> but fine don't listen to us
11:22 < nmz787> the only other output it seems is STEP
11:22 < nmz787> for implicitCAD
11:22 < nmz787> my point was actually that the higher-res looks prety decent
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11:22 < nmz787> over what I thought was relatively ugly last night
11:28 < nmz787> kanzure: you did realize this is the source of the STL https://github.com/nmz787/microfluidic-cad/blob/master/implicitCAD/sinusoidal_mixer.escad
11:28 < nmz787> ?
11:29 < eudoxia> i think kanzure doesn't like openscad either but i don't remember why
11:29 < nmz787> technically that is ExtOpenScad... though I'm not too clear of the differences
11:30 < nmz787> I'd like to figure out how to accomplish the same with cadQuery today
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11:50 < nmz787> archels: I'm not sure a sinusoidal channel with constant wall spacing would still have edges that were sin waves though
11:55 < archels> nmz787: nah, just dabble in CAD
11:57 < archels> I think what I did back then was to take the sinewave as the centre of the channel, and project along a vector orthogonal to its derivative
12:04 < nmz787> mmm, yeah I was thinking it might be something to do with the derivative/tangential lines
12:04 < nmz787> center of channel didn't occur to me, but yeah sounds decent
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12:30 < nmz787> kanzure: if svg was to be used, I think for things like that sine wave mixer there would need to be some internal representation... that way we could increase/reduce the quality as needed. Since it appears that you need to create things like a sine wave by evaluating the math yourself and drawing vectors
12:30 < kanzure> then don't use svg for evaluation
12:31 < nmz787> and also you might want to adjust the channel parameters, like round cross-section, or square.
12:31 < nmz787> One thing that heekscad has is something called heekscnc, which made me think about edge effects during manufacturing
12:32 < nmz787> like, your beam or etch might not give you a straight wall or sharp corner
12:32 < nmz787> but maybe at a large enough resolution you don't even notice that
12:32 < nmz787> so it would be case dependent
12:32 < nmz787> and thus we should have a knob to adjust
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13:12 < poppingtonic> paperbot: http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11229-013-0279-z
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13:18 < delinquentme> kanzoo
13:18 < yoleaux> 13:32Z <kanzure> delinquentme: yes, i have logs of other irc channels but they are not available by public http
13:18  * delinquentme mind blown
13:18 < delinquentme> kanzoo
13:19 < delinquentme> kanzure, two things: how did yoleaux pattern match kanzoo ?? and what is kanzure btw?
13:20 < kanzure> yoleaux will pester anyone that has pending messages waiting for them
13:20 < kanzure> kanzure is a pseudonym i picked in 2003 to maximize searchability
13:22 < kanzure> "mammals around 129 million years ago"
13:27 < nmz787> "t introduced the first stock ticker in 1866, and a standardized time service in 1870. The next year, 1871, the company introduced its money transfer service, based on its extensive telegraph network. "  I wonder if someone hacked that, back then...
13:27 < nmz787> (Western Union)
13:33 < kanzure> false, western union was actually established 280 million years ago
13:33 < kanzure> around the time of the african sea llama
13:34 < kanzure> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4zwGFyCrcF8/UjCt1H1UeiI/AAAAAAAAAbI/iKp6mowhKdY/s1600/Sea+Llama.jpg
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14:22 < delinquentme> kanzure, etymology ?
14:22 < delinquentme> and can I get moar info on the past logs?
14:25 < kanzure> which past logs are you looking for?
14:25 < kanzure> there is no particular etymology. maybe some japanese stuff but i was 13 so give me a break.
14:28 < delinquentme> heheh
14:28 < delinquentme> no judgement :D I mean look @ mine
14:28 < delinquentme> kanzure, I was interested in shit loads of logs for some programming languages
14:28 < delinquentme> python or ruby would be ideal
14:29 < kanzure> 450 MB python.log
14:29 < kanzure> 401 MB rubyonrails.log
14:29 < kanzure> 276 MB git.log
14:29 < kanzure> 519 MB reprap.log
14:30 < kanzure> 443 MB jquery.log
14:30 < delinquentme> could I get the python and git dumps?
14:32 < kanzure> as soon as i figure out how to enable symlinks
14:36 < kanzure> welp i'm out of ideas
14:40 < fenn> cp
14:40 < kanzure> i'm not going to copy a 500 megabyte log file -_-
14:41 < fenn> omg 1 cent of storage space
14:41 < kanzure> all that disk writing just seems unnecessary
14:41 < kanzure> this shit ain't backed up on that end
14:41 < kanzure> jrayhawk: whenever that colossal amount of storage space shows up... let us pretend to consider backing things up.
14:42 < fenn> you wanna live forever, kid
14:42 < fenn> live free and wild, copy files everywhere
14:42 < kanzure> now that steve coles is dead they have been posting various plans to the grg mailing list
14:42 < kanzure> the latest set of plans is for more donation drives
14:43 < kanzure> "and getting more facebook likes"
14:43 < kanzure> 1 like = 1 immortal
14:43 < fenn> is that the new altcoin
14:43 < kanzure> "likes" were a feature that facebook implemented in 1706
14:43 < kanzure> old timey times
14:44 < kanzure> my point is that relying on donation drives to come up with your plans for life extension research and financing is not a good plan
14:44 < delinquentme> how to fund life extension?
14:44 < fenn> am i missing something here, why aren't there billionaires throwing piles of money at life extension research?
14:44 < delinquentme> get everyone involved in a mechanical turk type thing
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14:45 < delinquentme> fenn, there are! but you must factor in coping mechanisms
14:45 < fenn> i mean it's not like they can spend it on anything else
14:45 < kanzure> i sent them a rant telling them they are morons and they should be planning for a project to take 100 years, or even 10,000 years
14:45 < kanzure> because unreasonably colossal problems require unreasonably good plans
14:45 < eudoxia> the grg people or the billionaires?
14:45 < kanzure> grg people
14:45 < kanzure> fenn is talking about the billionaires
14:45 < kanzure> my best guess at this point is that billionaires don't have anyone good to spend the money on
14:46 < kanzure> aubrey is not a bad person, but he's not going to hedge his bets correctly
14:46 < delinquentme> billionaires struggle to vet talent
14:46 < fenn> i wouldn't invest in a researcher who hedges his bets anyway
14:46 < kanzure> there is no reasonable talent in this
14:46 < kanzure> fenn: by invest you mean fund, and why not?
14:46 < fenn> they have to be monomaniacally devoted to $(theory) in order to pursue it to completion
14:46 < eudoxia> apparently some kind of {m|b}illionaire hired mike darwin to travel around the world collecting data on how fucked we are as a civilization
14:46 < kanzure> cryonics and brain uploading, for example, what's not to like going after two hard things?
14:47 < delinquentme> kanzure, what du mean about reasonable talent?
14:47 < kanzure> and you don't just hire a single person obviously, but you do need at least one person that knows how to fucking plan
14:47 < fenn> kanzure: well i was thinking you "invest" money and your return is not dying
14:48 < kanzure> delinquentme: nobody has demonstrated any capacity for good planning for life extension research
14:48 < fenn> other people not dying is a side benefit
14:48 < kanzure> lots of people tiptoe around topics and they want to maximize youthfulness for 1000s of years, that's bullshit
14:50 < kanzure> you really can't talk about things like extreme amounts of organ-specific life support systems, organ perfusion, replacement, organ markets, brain scanning, cryonics, as reasonable solutions to life extension, because people want some elixir or whatever
14:50 < kanzure> perhaps actual life extension just sounds too ridiculous or something
14:50 < fenn> did you read mike darwin's thing about "high technology" vs "futile technology"
14:51 < poppingtonic> Can you really plan for things like this? Maybe the fact that nobody has demonstrated any capacity for good planning for life extension research means that we don't really understand the problems well enough *in principle* to plan for solving it.
14:51 < kanzure> brain uploading in principle is a good plan for a dying body
14:51 < eudoxia> it would probably be easier to convince people to fund WBE over cryonics, since cryonics requires, as darwin put it, commitment to the extent that a cryonics org should "be able to weather a war lasting centuries", while uploading is "scan & done"
14:51 < eudoxia> well, you have to pay the power bills, et cetera
14:52 < fenn> http://chronopause.com/chronopause.com/index.php/2011/05/30/going-going-gone/index.html
14:52 < kanzure> cryonics does not require centuries -_-
14:52 < poppingtonic> revival, maybe...
14:52 < kanzure> you can run many wonderful cryonics experiments involving less than a whole month of suspension (or whatever the period is being called)
14:52 < kanzure> you don't even need humans
14:53 < kanzure> "geroprotection"?
14:53 < fenn> less than a day
14:53 < eudoxia> well darwin has always been a bit of a fatalist, so he probably believes like eleitl there's a good chance of civilizational collapse
14:53 < kanzure> civilizational collapse is another topic, in my opinion
14:53 < kanzure> oops yes i don't know why i said a month
14:54 < fenn> eleitl keeps harping about peak oil because he lives in germany and apparently nuclear power doesn't exist there
14:54 < poppingtonic> you kinda want to factor XRisk in any future scenario, so I don't see a problem with that.
14:54 < kanzure> nice "Polio victims on Iron Lung support in a school gymnasium in the mid-1950s"
14:54 < kanzure> xrisk should not factor into my rant about doing basic projects -_-
14:54 < eudoxia> well that's true
14:55 < kanzure> "“Halfway technology represents the kinds of things that must be done after the fact, in efforts to compensate for the incapacitating effects of certain diseases whose course one is unable to do very much about. By its nature, it is at the same time highly sophisticated and profoundly primitive… It is characteristic of this kind of technology that it costs an enormous amount of money and requires a continuing expansion of hospital ...
14:55 < kanzure> ... facilities… It is when physicians are bogged down by their incomplete technologies, by the innumerable things they are obliged to do in medicine, when they lack a clear understanding of disease mechanisms, that the deficiencies of the health-care system are most conspicuous…"
14:56 < poppingtonic> so does he use civilizational collapse as a way to say "oh, but there may be bigger problems/priorities than cryonics.."?
14:56 < kanzure> "A minority of scientists at that time believed that it might be possible to defeat Polio by the expedient of a vaccine,14 and so an intense competition for funds began between those who sought to secure more Iron Lungs to support the ever growing legion of patients with respiratory paralysis, and those who sought to understand the fundamental basis of the disease (in the context of their technological era) and treat it by eliminating it.15"
14:56 < kanzure> i wasn't aware they were directly competing for the same money, that sounds dumb
14:57 < poppingtonic> or is it in the interest of cryonicists and their supporters to work to reduce XRisk (or fund people who do)...
14:57 < eudoxia> mainly he argues that cryonicists have been dreaming too much about Drexlerian nanotech, and successful, collapse-proof cryonics requires actual involvement of people in their cryonics providers
14:58 < poppingtonic> kanzure: I wasn't saying that they're competing. I might have phrased that question in a bad way.
14:58 < eudoxia> hmm, darwin hasn't posted anything on his blog for more than two years now, that's a shame
14:59 < eudoxia> last i read from him in New Cryonet he was planning a post about embalming and chemical preservation that i was looking forward to read
15:00 < poppingtonic> "When cryonics was conceived, the majority of people dying in the US did so with substantially intact brains; the incidence of dementia in people dying at the age of ~70 in the 1960s was ~1%.3 Currently, the incidence of dementia in Americans dying at the average lifespan (78.3) is ~30%"
15:01 < kanzure> one of the paragraphs of my rant to grg was telling them that being more comprehensive about plans and hedges they can identify items that can accelerate life extension research
15:01 < kanzure> for example, one of the major hurdles is the economic cost of molecular biology research
15:01 < kanzure> by focusing on very cheap, very precise equipment, they can reduce those costs dramatically and get results across the board (not just in life extension research)
15:02 < kanzure> (assuming that usable results would cost $100's of trillions of dollars, a 1000x reduction in basic research costs would be pretty damn great)
15:02 < kanzure> ((although this is just one example of something that clever hedging can help with))
15:03 < fenn> "dammit jim, i'm a doctor, not an insturment designer"
15:03 < kanzure> yes it is a little odd how most of grg are doctors
15:03 < fenn> not really, seeing as how gerontology is a medical field
15:04 < poppingtonic> re the quote, gerontology research (SENS) seems even more important now.
15:04 < kragen> nuclear power no longer exists in germany, but I suspect that solar imported from Spain will make up the difference within a decade
15:04 < fenn> kragen: i was being sarcastic; a blind spot doesn't make something just go away
15:05 < kanzure> where's muh thoriums
15:05 < kragen> in thuh ground
15:05 < fenn> in norway
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15:06 < kragen> although as I recently pointed out on #swhack, hot-dry-rock geothermal fossil energy is even more abundant than thorium, and requires no new research to take advantage of
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15:06 < kragen> but silicon photovoltaic is so far ahead of it on the cost and adoption curve that I think it won't be adopted in the near future
15:06 < kragen> also, doesn't cause earthquakes
15:07 < fenn> how would geothermal cause earthquakes?
15:07 < kanzure> poppingtonic: fwiw sens and gerontology or only partially overlapping
15:07 < kanzure> but this distinction doesn't matter prolly
15:07 < kanzure> *are only
15:07 < kragen> fenn: enhanced geothermal extraction involves fracking, which induces seismicity
15:07 < fenn> the problem is the word "gerontology" has been hijacked by do-nothings
15:07 < kragen> e.g. the Basel program was abandoned due to induced seismicity
15:08 < fenn> hm i figured "hot dry" were important for some reason
15:08 < kanzure> i had assumed gerontology was ocined by do-nothings
15:08 < fenn> like, the steam coming out is free of droplets
15:08 < kanzure> *coined
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15:09 < kragen> no, you use a secondary coolant circuit of deionized water to drive the turbines with supercritical steam
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15:09 < kragen> "hot" is important because it's heat energy you're interested in
15:10 < fenn> meh those aren't real earthquakes anyway
15:10 < kragen> "dry" just clarifies that we're talking about rock that you have to inject coolant into in order to get the heat out, unlike traditional geothermal where you just harness the steam coming out
15:12 < delinquentme> offhand does anyone know what the market value of 1 gallon of rocket fuel in orbit is?
15:13 < fenn> depends what it's made of, but around $40k
15:13 < delinquentme> fenn any source on that?
15:14 < fenn> just estimating at $10k/kg
15:14 < delinquentme> I wanted to say I watched a video from some orbital mining company which I was far more impressed with
15:15 < eudoxia> you guys should read The Rocket Company, it's a pretty good book about a hypothetical reusable rocket and it's on libgen
15:15 < eudoxia> i like to think elon musk read it and was inspired by it to create spacex
15:15 < fenn> there's nothing to mine in orbit but empty tanks
15:17 < delinquentme> fenn, satellites which use fuel to maintain their positions / trajectories
15:17 < fenn> presumably people would be pay more to put fuel IN the satellites
15:18 < kanzure> almost as if hall effect thrusters might be useful or something
15:19 < fenn> for low earth orbit you can use geodynamic propulsion, which is basically a reaction mass free ion drive
15:19 < fenn> er, maybe i made that word up
15:19 < delinquentme> ion drives are real
15:19 < eudoxia> why waste money pumping fuel into satellites (many different satellites, with different kinds of tank, which aren't meant to be refueled), when you can just have a tiny tug go around, give satellites the occasional boost and be done with it
15:19 < fenn> but the theory stands, since there are ions flying around in low earth orbit that can be co-opted
15:20 < eudoxia> i mean, if you're going to refuel, you have to boost to the satellites and away from them
15:20 < kragen> eudoxia: can you do that?
15:20 < delinquentme> eudoxia, i want a satellite tug
15:20 < delinquentme> =[
15:20 < kragen> hmm, good point
15:20 < kragen> if you can refuel you can sat-tug
15:20 < kragen> but you may not be able to do either very often
15:20 < fenn> eudoxia: refuel once and the satellite can reboost many times
15:20 < eudoxia> the fuel that you're pumping into the satellite would be better used tugging the satellite
15:20 < fenn> otherwise you're lugging your own weight around for no reason
15:20 < delinquentme> kragen, yeap you can... theres actually a really smart team working on  asteroid 'extinction events'  with that specitic tech
15:21 < eudoxia> fenn: or you could retrofit electrodynamic cables to satellites
15:21 < delinquentme> and curiously enough .. .just the passive mass of an object to ever so slightly deflect big mean asshole-roids
15:21 < fenn> that's a good plan too
15:21 < kragen> can you deflect asteroids by electrically charging them with a particle beam?
15:21 < delinquentme> Oh and don't forget the spaceship and drilling and nuclear bombs and " I DOOONNTT wann misssa thang "
15:22  * delinquentme lelz
15:22 < eudoxia> i never got the whole argument "if we blow up an asteroid we'll just blow it into small still-deadly pieces"
15:22 < kragen> presumably the charge will go away eventually because the solar wind is full of ions, but does that take a sufficiently long time to be useful?
15:22 < eudoxia> sure, the total kinetic energy of the asteroid chunks will be the same, but with many chunks you have a better surface area to volume ratio
15:22 < eudoxia> and more of the asteroid would burn up in the atmosphere
15:22 < fenn> kragen what would the charge push against
15:23 < kragen> fenn: other electrically charged bodies nearby?
15:23  * fenn thinks back to the early days of rocketry
15:23 < fenn> there's nothing nearby... it's space
15:23 < kragen> I'm just thinking that sending electrons to an asteroid might be easier than sending solid objects including baryons to it
15:23 < eudoxia> tbh we can just blow asteroids to smithereens and there's no need to resort to esoteric things like pulling the asteroid with the gravity of a probe
15:23 < kragen> doesn't that depend on the timescale we're talking about, fenn?
15:24 < eudoxia> kragen: you mean the solar wind?
15:24 < kragen> eudoxia: I did say "the solar wind" at one point, but I'm not sure if that's the point you're asking about
15:25 < fenn> given a choice of shooting an asteroid with electrons or a laser, the laser is better because there is no blurring of the beam due to like charge repulsion
15:25 < kragen> I mean we're talking about objects with chaotic orbits, which is the whole reason we're not sure if they're going to hit us or not in the first place
15:25 < eudoxia> a negatively charged asteroid braking against the positively-charged solar wind
15:26 < kragen> eudoxia: hmm, I hadn't thought about that approach
15:26 < eudoxia> it probably wouldn't work, it would just be an extremely inefficient magnetic sail
15:26 < fenn> it wouldn't be magnetic at all
15:27 < fenn> the helium particles would go straight at it
15:27 < kanzure> those iron lungs were probably made from military scrap metal
15:27 < kragen> fenn: if you can develop a charge on the dark side of the asteroid that persists for years, you can exert a force on it over years
15:27 < fenn> i wonder if an electrodynamic tether would work with solar wind as the charge carrier
15:28 < kragen> while a laser will only be exerting a force on it at the time that it is shining on it
15:28 < kragen> unless you can somehow use the laser to charge the asteroid, e.g. ablating the parts of the asteroid with one or another net charge
15:29 < fenn> kragen this happens on the moon at sunrise/sunset already
15:29 < fenn> the dust shoots hundreds of meters up, then presumably contacts the solar wind and falls back down
15:30 < kragen> that's interesting
15:30 < fenn> that was the point of LADEE, to study what happens
15:32 < fenn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Atmosphere_and_Dust_Environment_Explorer#Atmospheric_glow
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15:47 < kanzure> .wik rna integrity
15:47 < yoleaux> "The RNA integrity number (RIN) is an algorithm for assigning integrity values to RNA measurements." — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RNA_integrity_number
15:49 < kanzure> .title http://tim-smith.us/arrgh/index.html
15:49 < yoleaux> aRrgh: a newcomer's (angry) guide to R
15:49 < kanzure> finally something that speaks to me
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16:20 < jrayhawk> "14:41 < kanzure> jrayhawk: whenever that colossal amount of storage space shows up... let us pretend to consider backing things up." what storage space? and stuff is backed backed up, though /srv/ikiwiki is excluded since it's supposed to be cache
16:21 < kanzure> oh okay then
16:24 < jrayhawk> seagate has 8tb drives selling for $260 now
16:24 < kanzure> is that price competitive
16:24 < kanzure> erm i mean.. per tb.
16:28 < jrayhawk> yes
16:30 < jrayhawk> though it's seagate, so $/(TiB*year) is going to be somewhat more depressing
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17:19 < kanzure> "The fact that with all the 25 years of NIA & 15 years of Ellison Medical Foundation research grant support (including part via AFAR) we remain an aging research community (or a "club") and not an Industry
17:19 < kanzure> (such as the over one trillion dollar, 2,000+ companies BioTech Industry) is very telling."
17:19 < kanzure> "We remain basically without any/many products, have less than a dozen companies and our market capitalization is, at best & generously, only $3-4 billion (with a "B" NOT a "T"). There are very clear reasons for this situation.
17:19 < kanzure> LDIC (Longevity Dividend Initiative Consortium ) was initiated at the June 2010 AGE Board to help remedy that critical problem. The objective of the LDIC was to unite all of the larger 501(c)(3) non-profit aging research organizations
17:19 < kanzure>  to work together to get significantly mor aging research funded, with a logical strategy. The first part of LDIC's Mission was completed in June 2013 with Buck joinning ."
17:19 < kanzure> "The second part, effective fund raising, has not been started except to produce a "white paper" & a professional 15-minute film both explaining aging research & the economic incentives for stepping it up substantially."
17:19 < kanzure> tsk tsk
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17:37 < kanzure> http://dosen.narotama.ac.id/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/Machine-Intelligence-Survey.pdf
17:37 < kanzure> weird how anders put "open source" in a category outside of "industry" :(
17:37 < kanzure> (page 4-5)
17:38 < kanzure> "semantic web" oh my...
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17:46 < kanzure> this is a poorly written survey
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19:23 < kanzure> robocop https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ha4qlq_qUEU
19:23 < kanzure> iron man https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlJLQIH0byY
19:23 < kanzure> (musicz)
19:25 < kanzure> some strange elon musk propaganda http://images.bwbx.io/cms/2012-09-13/features_elonmusk38__01__405inline.jpg
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19:36 < kanzure> cluckj: welcome back
19:36 < cluckj> thanks
19:36 < kanzure> how's stuff
19:44 < cluckj> hectic as hell
19:46 < cluckj> how are you?
19:46 < kanzure> just coding
19:46 < kanzure> pretty great
19:49 < cluckj> nice
19:49 < cluckj> I'm chilling next to a now-sleeping infant
19:50 < kanzure> oh right, that happened
19:50 < cluckj> lol
19:51 < cluckj> in your defense I have left irc for three months at a time for no real reason at all
19:51 < cluckj> https://scontent-a-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t31.0-8/10847691_10152426839801510_6625221508381038468_o.jpg
19:54 < kanzure> "MXE wasn't designed at random; it was the chosen winner of a long series of tested compounds made by a chemist who had no other way to treat his phantom limb pain. "
19:55 < kanzure> from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8748467
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19:55 < kanzure> MXE chemist interview http://www.vice.com/read/interview-with-ketamine-chemist-704-v18n2
19:56 < kanzure> "Phenmetrazine is itself a "designer drug"; as sort of explained in the article, it differs from amphetamine by an oxygen and a couple of carbons forming a morpholine ring including the amine moiety, and its designers hoped it would have some of amphetamine's effects (like weight loss) with less side effects. As with most designer phenethylamines, this turned out badly, though not as badly as e.g. Fen/Phen. (There have been a lot of ...
19:56 < kanzure> ... "designer" phenethylamines; are you really sure that "derivatives [of phenmetrazine] have just started to appear on the grey market"? Are you sure PiHKAL doesn't have a few?)"
19:57 < cluckj> PiHKAL has all the fun ones
19:58 < kanzure> even if pihkal specified some that doesn't mean they were on the market
19:59 < cluckj> yes
19:59 < kanzure> superlogic to the rescue, i'll retreat to irc now
19:59 < nmz787> cluckj: nice job!
20:00 < cluckj> thanks, he did turn out pretty good
20:00 < cluckj> most of the time...
20:00 < nmz787> cluckj: I heard recently that there is some research that kids may understand higher math more easily than we thought, and actually burdened by learning things like arithmetic first
20:01 < kanzure> yisss parenting advice from hplusroadmap, let's do this
20:01 < cluckj> I will try to teach him calculus when he's 4
20:01 < kanzure> okay so what you want to do is get a skinner box and don't ever use it
20:01 < kanzure> you're the control group
20:02 < nmz787> i think it was more like fractals and dimensionality maybe
20:02 < cluckj> why do we need a control group?
20:02 < cluckj> oh
20:02 < nmz787> but yeah prob some calc concepts too
20:02 < nmz787> stuff heating and cooling
20:02 < cluckj> those are probably easier than calculus
20:02 < cluckj> the concepts are pretty easy to teach without the pen-and-paper math
20:04 < nmz787> hmm https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/LivingMathForum/info
20:05 < nmz787> http://www.livingmath.net/
20:06 < cluckj> oh my homeschoolers
20:09 < cluckj> hahaha sweet, math history
20:13 < cluckj> "Alfred Adler wrote, “Mathematics is pure language - the language of science. It is unique among languages in its ability to provide precise expression for every thought or concept that can be formulated in its terms.”"
20:13 < cluckj> >_<
20:20 < kanzure> linguists screw everything up
20:20 < kanzure> what has a linguist ever done for me?
20:21 < nmz787> "The climax, which is well presented, is the one-to-one pairing of the set of fractions with the positive integers (which in the language of Georg Cantor proves that the rational numbers are a countable set)."
20:21 < nmz787> lol, wut
20:22 < cluckj> uh, made perl I think
20:22 < kanzure> fact: perl is sentient http://users.dsic.upv.es/~jorallo/iq/iq.html
20:23 < cluckj> nice
20:23 < nmz787> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_ZHsk0-eF0
20:23 < yoleaux> Donald Duck - Mathmagic Land - YouTube
20:30 < nmz787> 'Sir Cumference and the Great Knight of Angleland'
20:34 < nmz787> "We'll never be promoted to S.U.E.O.T.U. [Supreme Unsurpassable Engineers of the Universe] in the Junior Woodchucks if we can't figure how to keep two trains from colliding! This engine's wheels travel 3 1/2 inches each time around!"
20:34 < nmz787> ' problem becomes quite complicated as they have to take into account the curvature of the track and the slippage of the wheels.'
20:35 < nmz787> 'Professor Brainwhiz is unable to solve the problem, as is the computer at the army base, but the three ducklings save the day.
20:35 < nmz787> '
20:38 < nmz787> .title http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/29042
20:38 < yoleaux> Error 403
20:42 < kragen> PG has a problem with automated queries
20:42 < kragen> "A Tangled Tale by Lewis Carroll"
20:44 < kragen> another thing that subterranean colonies would help with would be gamma ray bursts
20:45 < nmz787> http://www.amazon.com/Quantum-Physics-Babies-Volume-1/dp/1492309532/
20:45 < nmz787> http://www.amazon.com/Introductory-Calculus-For-Infants-Inouye/dp/0987823914
20:45 < kragen> we can't divert those, unlike asteroids, unless we have some way to figure out that they are about to happen; and they'd destroy enough of the ozone that the surface biosphere would be mostly destroyed, far worse than any asteroid impacts we've had so far
20:45 < nmz787> "My two year old loves this!"
20:46 < nmz787> i wonder if tesla's idea of charging the ionosphere would have any effect
20:46 < nmz787> i guess not
20:46 < nmz787> they aren't charged
20:46 < nmz787> we could pump some gamma absorber into the atmosphere
20:50 < kragen> like what?
20:50 < kragen> if we knew in advance maybe we could do something
20:51 < kragen> but our current theory is that we would have no advance warning
20:58 < nmz787> hmm, have you studied optical heterodyning more yet? maybe we could just blast the sky with a laser :P
21:01 < nmz787> 'if you're walking outside today, where your head beam'
21:01 < nmz787> wear*
21:07 < kragen> I spent some time today, coincidentally, reading about nonlinear optics, and in particular the optical Kerr effect
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21:12 < nmz787> "Some polar liquids, such as nitrotoluene (C7H7NO2) and nitrobenzene (C6H5NO2) exhibit very large Kerr constants. A glass cell filled with one of these liquids is called a Kerr cell. These are frequently used to modulate light, since the Kerr effect responds very quickly to changes in electric field. Light can be modulated with these devices at frequencies as high as 10 GHz. Because the Kerr effect is relatively weak, a typical Kerr cell ...
21:12 < nmz787> ... may require voltages as high as 30 kV to achieve complete transparency. This is in contrast to Pockels cells, which can operate at much lower voltages. Another disadvantage of Kerr cells is that the best available material, nitrobenzene, is poisonous. "
21:13 < kragen> you can find the things I thought were relevant at https://twitter.com/kragen/status/544220240822165504
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21:30 < nmz787> "typically optics start to go nonlinear at around 10⁸ V/m, i.e. 10 V/nm."
21:32 < nmz787> this sounds pretty trippy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-focusing
21:33  * nmz787 just watched Donald in Mathmagic Land
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21:48 < nmz787> "A trigatron is not one of the TRANSFORMERS or a Pokemon"
21:52 < nmz787> http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/pdf/A_terahertz_metamaterial_with_unnaturally_high_refractive_index.pdf
21:57 < nmz787> stacks of H's huh
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22:54 < kragen> nmz787: hmm, 10 V/nm would be 10¹⁰ V/m.  I should have said 0.1 V/nm or 100 V/μm
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