--- Log opened Mon Sep 21 00:00:32 2015
--- Day changed Mon Sep 21 2015
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00:38 < justanotheruser> maaku: nah, I'm not trolling, I just realized my first question had a trolly vibe because it was meant to be open ended
00:38 < justanotheruser> 22
00:39 < justanotheruser> living forever should probably be the first goal since it gives you time to achieve other goals
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05:54 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=86272c56 Rusty Russell: scalingbitcoin: improve IBLT transcript. >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/bitcoin-block-propagation-iblt-rusty-russell/
05:54 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=9cb4f4ea Bryan Bishop: Merge pull request #2 from rustyrussell/master >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/
06:07 < kanzure> "how to make ink in the middle ages" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10249820
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06:46 < kanzure> "one of the most unique scumbags i've come across [in pharmaceutical investing]" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10251805
06:52 < archels> .gc "plantoids"
06:52 < yoleaux> archels: Sorry, that command (.gc) crashed.
06:52 < archels> oh well. it's like humanoids, only different.
06:57 < kanzure> "encryption might be the reason why we haven't heard from aliens" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10251369
06:58 < kanzure> "Another interesting way to speculate is the "under our nose" concept, which is the concept that the existing distribution of stars and galaxies, as well as the recorded background noise, might be the byproduct of alien intervention. Binary star systems are a popular speculative example of "starivore" civilizations that consume entire stars that have been moved into the alien civilization's own star system, and perhaps some combination ...
06:58 < kanzure> ... of multiple stars in a single system are not "naturally" occurring in the absence of alien influence. To an unsuspecting observer, some forms of distant astronomical-scale engineering could be mistakenly interpreted as natural astrophysics that the observers then incorporate into their standard models when refactoring to account for all of the observed data... Usually the simple explanations are correct, but when your models require ...
06:58 < kanzure> ... really insane updates to handle the observed data, perhaps there are other explanations? At the same time though, what recourse would have if 99% of the visible universe was already astro-engineered?"
07:00 < kanzure> "Another reason is that unless they want to communicate with other species, they'd use only the minimal signal strength that is required for the signal to reach its destination, not a signal strength that is several orders of magnitude higher."
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07:07 < kanzure> that sort of intervention should probably be bounded in a few ways, like amount of time necessary to move a certain percent of stellar mass over how many millions of years
07:09 < kanzure> https://blog.torproject.org/blog/learning-more-about-gfws-active-probing-system
07:12 < maaku> justanotheruser: you're probably still in or just graduated from college?
07:12 < maaku> at that age I was very confused about how to contribute
07:13 < kanzure> http://weputachipinit.tumblr.com/
07:14 < maaku> i needed a real job to learn project management skills which ultimately taught me how to tackle a decades-long project
07:15 < maaku> "getting things done" was my personal introduction and I still recommend it. getting on top of tasks is good and necessary, but the bigger takeaway in this context is the "how to plan a project" chapters
07:20 < maaku> justanotheruser: put "live forever" in the middle of a whiteboard and mind-map. when you run out of room, recursively mind-map nodes that need the most clarity
07:20 < maaku> when you order stuff at the end you'll have a critical path to work on
07:21 < maaku> (I could just tell you what to do, but better to teach a man to fish...)
07:21 < maaku> (and also validate my own extrapolations)
07:22 < kanzure> thumb ring thing for palm/thumb input http://finrobotics.com/
07:26 < kanzure> ouch, factom sent me a really lousy recruitment email
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07:27 < kanzure> maaku: i used to like the idea of brain-in-a-jar for life extension reasons, but the brain itself experiences aging and keeping things in a jar wont really be helpful on that front. oh well.
07:28 < kanzure> maaku: another thought that has been v. helpful for me (which also lead to some of my next-generation cryonics ideas) is that good solutions don't necessarily need to work within my lifetime; these sorts of problems are hard enough that we should be pretty damn happy with a solution that takes 100-200 years (as long as there is minimal handwaving).
07:32 < kanzure> important to throw out the "living forever as a 20 year old greek god" as an initial goal
07:32 < kanzure> "send mostly robots" is still true and will continue to be true
07:38 < kanzure> it is strange how adamant mike darwin has been that rational engineering is the only valid approach for life extension. but metabolism and cellular physiology has combinatorial explosion of problems and i doubt it's going to be a finite list of things to "rationally fix".
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08:31 < maaku> what is "rational engineering"
08:31 < kanzure> like rational protein design instead of bruteforce directed evolution selection projects
08:32 < kanzure> things like "find analytical solution for ligand binding using our knowledge of pi bonds and amino acid folding"
08:32 < maaku> oh. does he realize even traditional engineering isn't done that way anymore?
08:32 < kanzure> go on?
08:32 < maaku> e.g. the Orion space capsule. evolutionarily designed heat shield
08:33 < kanzure> well, i mean, he agrees that there are many ways to use evolutionary techniques for optimization with respect to some parameters or outputs
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08:34 < maaku> yeah but more and more -- especially in biology, but also elsewhere -- design is done by simulating tons of different options and hand tweaking the best ones
08:35 < kanzure> there are many problems where the search space is too large to get any productive results like that
08:35 < maaku> kanzure: well regarding cryonics I refuse to accept a plan A that involves getting frozen .. too many ways that can go wrong
08:36 < kanzure> cryonics plan A is "selectively breed mice to survive cryonics" not "at end of life, freeze yourself and ope for the best"
08:36 < kanzure> *hope
08:36 < maaku> doesn't mean I'm not signed up (/ in the process of doing so) with Alcor, but that's plan B
08:37 < maaku> what I mean is I'm constraining things I'm willing to work on to 30-year horizons
08:38 < kanzure> i'm not convinced that all 30-year-possible-solutions are discoverable by constraining idea selection process to 30-year-horizon constraint
08:40 < maaku> kanzure: well it is true one should pre-filter the brainstorming phase
08:40 < maaku> but I think there are possibilities for longevity escape velocity in that time frame
08:40 < kanzure> there are ways to convert 300 year plans into 30 year plans, using various transforms, but those plans are going to look v. strange and not easily found by employing that initial constraint
08:41 < maaku> hrm maybe we are talking past each other
08:41 < kanzure> this is a minner nitpick though
08:41 < kanzure> minor
08:42 < maaku> my plan involves getting Freitas/Merkle nanotools in the hands of Aubrey de Grey, and I think that's doable on the order of 30-years
08:42 < kanzure> well, cheap focused ion beam equipment and cheap atomic force microscopy equipment would certainly help aubrey-types out.
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08:43 < maaku> ion beam?
08:44 < kanzure> like scanning electron microscopy except instead of shooting electrons, you shoot ions at a surface
08:44 < kanzure> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focused_ion_beam
08:44 < maaku> kanzure: ah ok
08:44 < kanzure> oh wait "FIB should not be confused with using a beam of focused ions for direct write lithography (such as in proton beam writing)."
08:44 < kanzure> wtf
08:46 < kanzure> well i don't know what's real anymore
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09:33 < kanzure> (patent) multi-track multi-vehicle rollercoaster http://www.johnnyupsidedown.com/inside/pa31.pdf
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09:50 < kanzure> "Comments on a formal verification of polarssl" http://blog.regehr.org/archives/1261
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10:46 < CaptHindsight> kanzure: FIB can etch/mill as well as deposit materials, it's just poor writing
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10:47 < CaptHindsight> https://cmi.epfl.ch/metrology/files/Nova600/John_Melngailis/Lecture3.pdf  FIB deposition and etching
10:52 < CaptHindsight> https://cmi.epfl.ch/metrology/files/Nova600/John_Melngailis/Lecture2.pdf
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11:07 < CaptHindsight> https://www.jyu.fi/science/muut_yksikot/nsc/en/studies/ngs/course/meeting09/suutala_esitys  gets into how to change between deposition and milling
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12:28 < kanzure> "Capitalizing on prediction market manipulation with 'augmentation'" http://www.truthcoin.info/papers/5_PM_Manipulation.pdf
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15:12 < nmz787_w> oO, just received a tablet with integrated pico projector :)
15:13 < nmz787_w> I might try using it for some lithography once I get new photoresist and something working with litho on the laser etcher
15:20 < fenn> how's your ebay junk working out?
15:20 < nmz787_w> haven't got it yet... supposed to come this week, I think I splurged on it mid-last-week
15:20 < nmz787_w> need to re-up on resist. pretty sure the stuff I bought like 2 years ago is bad
15:20 < fenn> apparently it homes each axis by running into the end of travel
15:21 < nmz787_w> hahaha
15:21 < nmz787_w> great
15:21 < nmz787_w> that should be wonderful for repeatability over time
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17:34 < kanzure> "spams you every week with a community-annotated paper" http://fermatslibrary.com/
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17:45 < justanotheruser> maaku: there's like 30 different books titled "getting things done" on amazon, who's the author?
17:46 < kanzure> nah just lookup "GTD" on wikipedia
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18:08 < justanotheruser> kanzure: is this ##h+ approved?
18:08 < justanotheruser> "Official HPlusRoadMap Seal of Approval"
18:09 < justanotheruser> So should I read the book or is this good enough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Getting_Things_Done#/media/File:GTDcanonical.png
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18:39 < kanzure> justanotheruser: frankly i got too annoyed by all the "lifehackers" quoting GTD all the time, i'm probably never going to read the book
18:39 < kanzure> some random text about 21inc stuff https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3lucwl/21co_website_has_just_been_updated_introducing/cv9i0gb
18:44 < justanotheruser> I'm worried for the 21inc investors :(
18:45 < kanzure> nah don't be
18:46 < kanzure> first, even if it's a total disaster, balaji works for a16z and can probably get that fixed in a number of ways
18:46 < kanzure> second, mining is a good way to get around the problem of chargebacks
18:49 < kanzure> other than mining the other way to get around chargebacks is to sell your device for cash-only, but cash-only transactions have a bunch of problems (like: you have to get to the web to check whether the activation code is still valid to receive your initial BTC, but since you're paying in cash at somewhere else, the network is probably man-in-the-middling you or something nasty)
18:49 < kanzure> (although you could have at-home deliveries with cash payments, i suppose)
18:50 < kanzure> convincing users to check their received activation code, while the person is still there, is still a hard thing to do anyway
18:50 < kanzure> so mining seems like the only way to fix that
18:50 < kanzure> anyway, let's blow up some moons
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21:31 < StealerofSuns> test
21:31 < StealerofSuns> Greetings
21:45 < justanotheruser> yo
21:50 -!- Madplatypus [uid19957@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nwjzrqtxqtyimmev] has joined ##hplusroadmap
21:50 < StealerofSuns> I find it a bit humorous that the captcha thing to sign into freenode asks if I'm a robot considering the chat room I'm currently in
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22:14 < justanotheruser> I find it a bit humorous that you're using the web client
22:19 < StealerofSuns> This is my first experience with IRC, I was pointed in this direction from a reddit user
22:37 < justanotheruser> mhm
22:38 < justanotheruser> well if you're going to use irc regularly you should download a client. How did you find out about this channel
22:41 < StealerofSuns>  /r/transhuman
22:47 < StealerofSuns> I'm an engineering student and am very curious about H+ in general, as well as space exploration in equal measure
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--- Log closed Tue Sep 22 00:00:35 2015