--- Log opened Mon Oct 19 00:00:01 2015
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01:58 < poppingtonic> fenn: I watched it on Saturday. Much better than the book :)
02:00 < fenn> yep they actually managed to make a movie without injecting any ridiculously bad scientific errors
02:01 < fenn> sorta disappointed their computers ran MovieOS instead of some kind of linux though
02:03 < fenn> and most of the engineering problems were cut but i can see why they chose to do that
02:03 < fenn> what i don't really get is why they cut out mark watney's super snarky personality
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02:12 < poppingtonic> There were hints of it...
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02:12 < poppingtonic> And in the book the OS was a version of Linux
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02:17 < poppingtonic> .title http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10670-014-9694-x
02:17 < yoleaux> The Epistemology of the Precautionary Principle: Two Puzzles Resolved - Springer
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05:47 < kanzure> at least the hex editing scene was accurate
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06:17 < archels> Other maps represent action plans and goals, serving not as a sensory representation but as ‘source code’ that underlies behavior [73].
06:17 < archels> source code? seriously
06:18 < poppingtonic> what's that from?
06:19 < archels> "Flexible cognitive resources: competitive content maps for attention and memory"
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06:47 < kanzure> "Physical principles for scalable neural recording" http://syntheticneurobiology.org/PDFs/13.10.marblestone.pdf
06:47 < kanzure> check out page 6 table 1
06:49 < kanzure> "Summary of modalities, models, assumptions and conclusions" for various neural recording modalities
06:53 < kanzure> what happened ot the voltage reporter contrast agent. why isn't that listed.
06:53 < poppingtonic> what is spike sorting?
06:57 < poppingtonic> http://www.scholarpedia.org/article/Spike_sorting
06:57 < kanzure> archels: gimme some theoretical, speculative, but plausible things to make neurons (and brains) do to make them easier to record from
06:57 < kanzure> having neurons and axons voluntarily grow up and around electrodes might be useful
06:59 < kanzure> there was a paper that we were reading in here that studied the outcome differences based on speed of impact of microelectrode array. fast insertion velocity caused less long-term damage. having brain experience zero long-term damage would be nice, but maybe requirs very slow 1 mm/day insertion rate.
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07:01 < kanzure> then there was the "jordan miller" idea (wasn't his idea, but i'm gonna call it his idea anyway) of growing neural tissue (using 3d printer deposition of cells) on an existing neural recording scaffold. but neural mass probably wont be doing the interesting things that anyone would want to be studying in the first place. (although i suppose studying of non-functional blobs of neural tissue is still a useful thing to do for now....)
07:02 < kanzure> if direct contact with axons would be useful then you could prolly select for neurons that have axons that wrap around electrode tips like a helix.
07:02 < kanzure> er, like a spiral
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07:10 < kanzure> curious to see max density of microparticle delivery to brain extracellular matrix. wonder if we can get uniform distribution of payloads.
07:10 < kanzure> .title http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4489602/
07:10 < yoleaux> Localized delivery of non-viral gene-bearing nanoparticles into the rat brain following focused ultrasound-mediated BBB opening
07:12 < kanzure> someone was working on a similar microparticle delivery system (in tandem with focused ultrasound), but there was also something about receptor targeting for even further localization..
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07:19 < kanzure> if the brain was flat then you wouldn't have the tissue depth problems that come with optogenetic recording
07:21 < fenn> you also wouldn't have as much long-range communication
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07:23 < kanzure> hm?
07:28 < fenn> neurons from opposite sides of sulci/gyri will communicate even though they are too far apart in cortical sheet distance
07:31 < kanzure> hmm well if you had a two dimensional sheet of neurons then maybe you could correct for that with electronics
07:32 < kanzure> but probably need higher fidelity than we know how to do with current electronics
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07:34 < kanzure> what we really need is brain surface display of chromatophores
07:39 < kanzure> "Cephalopods such as the octopus have complex chromatophore organs controlled by muscles to achieve this, whereas vertebrates such as chameleons generate a similar effect by cell signalling. Such signals can be hormones or neurotransmitters and may be initiated by changes in mood, temperature, stress or visible changes in the local environment."
07:39 < fenn> "Institute for the Study of the Neurotypical" http://isnt.autistics.org/index.html
07:39 < kanzure> cool so we already have cell-signalling chromatophores
07:41 < fenn> just glue a cuttlefish to your brain. they're called cephalopods for a reason
07:43 < kanzure> are you mocking me :P
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07:51 < abetusk> Peto's paradox: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/13/science/why-elephants-get-less-cancer.html?referer&_r=2&utm_content=buffer89a10&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
07:55 < nsh> is this accessible for anyone? (should be ~16Mb pdf): http://booksc.org/dl/36029940/849731  -->   http://libgen.io/scimag/get.php?doi=10.1142/9789812831323_0023
07:55 < nsh> actually, i think i've got it
07:56 < nsh> just at a snail's pace
08:09 < kanzure> https://littlemaninmyhead.wordpress.com/2015/09/28/so-you-want-to-learn-to-break-ciphers/
08:29 < poppingtonic> "After my reply, the author modified his design and sent it for publication, carefully making sure that the sci.crypt people didn’t see his updated design in the time frame of the publication attempt.  The author claims that the paper was published (see bottom of page), but the updated paper made no acknowledgement of the insecurity of the previous version or my finding.  The evidence for the security in the updated paper is pret
08:29 < poppingtonic> Haha!
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08:44 < poppingtonic> In a "it's actually not funny" way.
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09:37 < kanzure> short guide to servo (the browser) https://gist.github.com/paulrouget/2f00941e6e82aeecad23
09:39 < chris_99> nmz787, i'm thinking of possibly getting one of the spectrometers like yours, just wondering, did you pay $200, for the grating that has a 3nm res
09:39 < kanzure> http://www.symmetrymagazine.org/article/october-2015/is-the-universe-getting-bigger-or-am-i-getting-smaller
09:39 < kanzure> "Control of REM sleep by ventral medulla GABAergic neurons" http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v526/n7573/full/nature14979.html http://news.berkeley.edu/2015/10/15/researchers-find-neural-switch-that-turns-dreams-on-and-off/
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09:47 < poppingtonic> kanzure: Which of the modalities in the summary you posted are you interested in tackling?
09:49 < kanzure> my intention was only to test which things fall out easily if i apply the "speculative biology is allowed" concept
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09:58 < kanzure> teratoma comments from other day were result of me looking for any animals that have bone in their brain. so far no results.
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10:54 < maaku> kanzure: where was that avenue of research leading you?
10:59 < kanzure> huh?
11:00 < kanzure> the value of speculation is that most solutions are wrong and broken, but some can be reappropriated for similar purposes that wouldn't have been otherwise considered.
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11:48 < kuudes> hmm... canadian elections tonight, but no predictions on predictionbook? :-/
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13:14 < kanzure> http://www.technologyreview.com/view/542601/the-science-surrounding-cryonics/
13:15 < kanzure> "successfully cryopreserving and later transplanting sheep ovaries and rat limbs, and routinely recovering rabbit kidneys after cooling to -45 °C. "
13:15 < kanzure> "carrying out a Defense Department-funded clinical trial to induce profound hypothermia (body temperatures of less than 10 °C) in critically injured trauma victims"
13:22 < kanzure> .title http://echo.jpl.nasa.gov/asteroids/2009FD/2009FD_planning.html
13:22 < yoleaux> 2009 FD and 2015 TB145
13:24 < kanzure> http://www.anishathalye.com/2015/02/07/an-asynchronous-shell-prompt/
13:24 < kanzure> http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/impactofsocialsciences/2015/09/08/wikipedia-amplifying-impact-of-open-access/
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14:13 < poppingtonic> "On the other hand, the fully functional brain self-organizes from a
14:13 < poppingtonic> less-structured precursor during development and learning. If we
14:13 < poppingtonic> understood the rules governing these self-organization processes, we
14:13 < poppingtonic> could begin to know which aspects of the brain’s complexity are
14:13 < poppingtonic> relevant or ir- relevant, at different scales and in different types
14:13 < poppingtonic> of neural computation. The apparent complexity will likely continue to
14:13 < poppingtonic> pile on, however, at least until we understand the principles
14:13 < poppingtonic> underlying brains and minds much better, so that we know something
14:13 < poppingtonic> about what to look for and what to expect.
14:13 < poppingtonic> "
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15:42 < poppingtonic> "
15:42 < poppingtonic> Against the background of longstanding “uniformist” vs. “specialist”
15:42 < poppingtonic> debates, and in contrast to accounts under which functional
15:42 < poppingtonic> specialization derives principally from di ferences in input, we argue
15:42 < poppingtonic> for a conception of the cortex as a computationally heterogeneous
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16:56 < kanzure> someone randomly mentioned to me 4698 gene yeast paper from http://gnusha.org/logs/2015-10-12.log
16:56 < kanzure> but used some description about fasting that i don't remember from the paper
16:56 < kanzure> http://www.cell.com/cell-metabolism/abstract/S1550-4131%2815%2900465-9
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17:29 < maaku> kanzure: you have need for a fullstack web engineer with a bio engineering background?
17:32 < kanzure> not directly at the moment, but i know a few places to send one
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19:29 < kanzure> star wars trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGbxmsDFVnE
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19:33 < catern> "i will finish, what you started" the fight of PROOOOOOOOTOOOOOOOOOOMAAAAAAAAAAAN
19:34 < drethelin> so is the implication that luke becomes newvader there
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19:41 < kanzure> drethelin: nope, different actor
19:41 < kanzure> that video even shows that character unmasked, sooo... no.
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--- Log closed Tue Oct 20 00:00:01 2015