--- Log opened Tue Nov 14 00:00:14 2017
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05:14 < kanzure> blort
05:16 < Kanzure_> Sir can I have your what's app number
05:17 < Kanzure_> Where I can talk to you one to one
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05:22 < kanzure> Kanzure_: type this: /query kanzure hello
05:28 < kanzure> Kanzure_: and then press enter or "send message"
05:29 < Kanzure_>  Ok
05:29 < Kanzure_> Sir
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05:31 < Kanzure_> Query Kanzure hello
05:31 < kanzure> Kanzure_: maybe you should email me instead kanzure@gmail.com
05:32 < Kanzure_> Ok sir right
05:32 < Kanzure_> Thanks
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06:45 < Qfwfq> Interpreters are ideologically suspect, most have capitalist semiotics and pay-per-use APIs. Must implement English more better, yes?
06:47 < kanzure> huh?
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06:53 < kanzure> https://www.lesserwrong.com/posts/SJKowjkGF7z2sS98f/in-defence-of-epistemic-modesty
06:53 < kanzure> bleh
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08:52 < superkuh> It was a quote (or close to a quote) from "The Lobsters" short by Charles Stross (later made into the book, "Accelerando" with other shorts).
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09:27 < kanzure> https://www.nasa.gov/images/content/632141main_vonbraun.jpg
09:35 < kanzure> webassembly stuff https://github.com/mbasso/awesome-wasm
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09:48 <@fenn> what happened to all the abundance post-scarcity open p2p mailing list people? did they lose interest and drift apart? is it still circling around the same attractor? did they make any progress?
09:49 <@fenn> i stopped paying attention after open manufacturing petered out
09:49 < kanzure> it's all michel bauwen emails https://lists.ourproject.org/pipermail/p2p-foundation/2017-October/thread.html
09:50 <@fenn> yes but that particular mailing list was always michel bauwen's personal soap box
09:50 <@fenn> there was a whole constellation of blogs and satellite mailing lists populated by others
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09:52 < kanzure> ironic that a month after the bitcoin announcement there was a big post-scarcity push
09:53 <@fenn> because bitcoin is based on principles of artificial scarcity?
09:55 < kanzure> right.
09:55 < kanzure> what would progress even be for that group
09:57 <@fenn> well one of their goals was to turn economics into the study of not just scarcity but also abundance, so i suppose getting together some sort of academic credibility in the form of an institute
10:05 <@fenn> perhaps making some policy recommendations and receiving an agreement from some official body to follow those recommendations
10:06 <@fenn> yes it's super boring
10:06 <@fenn> i'd rather redirect all this cognitive effort to designing replicators
10:08 < kanzure> "let's design replicators" would have been progress from that group
10:08 < kanzure> (although admittedly they were probably the wrong people to focus on such an effort, in knowledge/skills i mean)
10:09 <@fenn> it's plausible they could have secured funding to hire mechanical engineers and process engineers to do the dirty work
10:09 < kanzure> economic policy proposal -> do direct dirty work? i dunno if we have actually seen that ever.
10:10 <@fenn> mumble mumble mao's backard foundries
10:10 <@fenn> backyard
10:11 <@fenn> .wik great leap forward
10:11 < yoleaux> "The Great Leap Forward (Chinese: 大跃进; pinyin: Dà Yuèjìn) of the People's Republic of China (PRC) was an economic and social campaign by the Communist Party of China (CPC) from 1958 to 1962." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_leap_forward
10:13 < kanzure> maybe a proposal like a self-replicating city... china likes building cities, so why not a city that builds cities.
10:13 < kanzure> call it a "smart city". there you go media lab, your next big project.
10:13 <@fenn> i'd settle for a self replicating fab lab
10:14 < kanzure> joi ito sounded like a raving lunatic last week http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/stanford-2017/joi-ito/
10:17 < kanzure> met nick szabo, asked him about his replicators, he didn't have much to say (might have been a hired actor, i dunno)
10:17 < gradstudentbot> Should have gone to med school.
10:17 < kanzure> (he was talking about radio)
10:17 <@fenn> what about radio
10:17 <@fenn> http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/stanford-2017/weak-signal-radio-communications-for-bitcoin-network-resilience/
10:17 < kanzure> bitcoin over radio things
10:18 <@fenn> this is like little brother mesh network
10:19 < kanzure> i have been so focused on biology that i don't really know what the non-biology replicator approach is supposed to look like anymore
10:19 < kanzure> xentrac's concept is something about sand and ceramics
10:19 < kanzure> your concept is "get a bunch of necessary machines and go do things"
10:19 <@fenn> for bitcoin mesh backup networks to matter you need to do analysis in the presence of intentional jamming, not just loss of existing links
10:19 < kanzure> and the 3d printer buttheads think they can print their way out of their hole
10:20 <@fenn> hey i did write about a sand clay salt replicator
10:21 < kanzure> xentrac still doesn't want to speak with me because he thinks i'm going to enslave everyone or whatever, perhaps you could chat with him sometime about what his thinking is
10:21 <@fenn> i dont know what that's about
10:21 < kanzure> censorships
10:21 < kanzure> vs moderation
10:21 < kanzure> it's stupid.
10:21 <@fenn> the bitcoin mailing list?
10:21 < kanzure> partly, but also other stuff in bitcoin community.
10:22 <@fenn> is he even involved in bitcoin at all?
10:22 < kanzure> he vaguely watches things
10:22 < kanzure> looks at daily news
10:23 < gradstudentbot> The paper was rejected.
10:26 < kanzure> .title https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7cs1zc/bulletproofs_a_radical_improvement_in_the/
10:26 < yoleaux> Too Many Requests
10:28 < gradstudentbot> Who used the last of the growth medium?
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11:01 < heath> .title https://www.nature.com/articles/nbt.3958
11:01 < yoleaux> Public views on gene editing and its uses | Nature Biotechnology
11:03 < heath> "Observation of giant conductance fluctuations in a protein" http://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/2399-1984/aa8f91
11:04 < heath> "Long-Fiber Carbon Nanotubes Replicate Asbestos-Induced Mesothelioma with Disruption of the Tumor Suppressor Gene Cdkn2a" http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(17)31171-5
11:04 < kanzure> "Here, we report the observation of remarkably high electronic conductance states in an electrochemically inactive protein, the ~200 kD α V β 3 extracellular domain of human integrin. Large current pulses (up to nA) were observed for long durations (many ms, corresponding to many pC of charge transfer) at large gap (>5 nm) distances in an STM when the protein was bound specifically by a ...
11:04 < kanzure> ...small peptide ligand attached to the electrodes. The effect is greatly reduced when a homologous, weakly binding protein (α 4 β 1) is used as a control."
11:06 < heath> "Sequence and entropy-based control of complex coacervates" https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-017-01249-1
11:09 < heath> "Programmable base editing of A•T to G•C in genomic DNA without DNA cleavage" https://www.nature.com/articles/nature24644
11:12 < gradstudentbot> Why did I go to grad school?
11:12 < heath> https://www.nature.com/articles/nnano.2015.64 it wasn't clear to me this was the paper which was retracted. this was sitting on my bedisde table waiting to be read
11:12 < heath> .title
11:12 < yoleaux> Retraction: DNA sequencing using electrical conductance measurements of a DNA polymerase | Nature Nanotechnology
11:12 < kanzure> because they said they could read 50k bp by electrically poking a polymerase, which is unbelievably high performance
11:12 < kanzure> and extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence... which the authors were unable to provide.
11:13 < kanzure> kent talked with the authors by email, he says it's a "synthetic biology x-files case".
11:13 < heath> .title http://retractionwatch.com/
11:13 < yoleaux> Retraction Watch - Tracking retractions as a window into the scientific process at Retraction Watch
11:15 < heath> .title http://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.0020124
11:15 < yoleaux> Why Most Published Research Findings Are False
11:16 < heath> i wish the title was "Why Most Published Research Findings are False, including this one"
11:19 < kanzure> .wik UK biobank
11:19 < yoleaux> "UK Biobank is a large long-term biobank study in the United Kingdom (UK) which is investigating the respective contributions of genetic predisposition and environmental exposure (including nutrition, lifestyle, medications etc.) to the development of disease. It began in 2007." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UK_Biobank
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11:37 <@fenn> “Manuscript Writer,” uses artificial intelligence (AI) to generate papers, according to the company that created it, sciNote LLC. A spokesperson explained the software generates a first draft the scientist should revise, and won’t write the Discussion, “the most creative and original part of the scientific article.”
11:38 <@fenn> .title https://scinote.net/
11:38 < yoleaux> Free Electronic Lab Notebook (ELN) | sciNote
11:38 <@fenn> now all we need is a universal experiment ontology and do away with the concept of a journal article for good
11:40 <@fenn> apparently they make their money by providing HIPAA compliance
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11:40 < kanzure> to the data in the paper?
11:42 <@fenn> HIPAA requires specific security prevautions about how raw data is handled
11:42 <@fenn> like "no hosting on a public FTP server" etc
11:42 <@fenn> and you have to prove you did it the way they want
11:42 <@fenn> which takes a lot of paperwork and is a pain in the ass
11:47 <@fenn> comment to retractionwatch: "Perhaps you could have a leaderboard for journals: the number of fraudulent papers identified in formal investigations that remain unretracted."
11:47 < kanzure> you want to incentiize journals to retract crap, though
11:47 < kanzure> otherwise they let it fester
11:47 <@fenn> yes, that's the idea
11:48 <@fenn> they want to stay off the retractionwatch leaderboard, so they issue retractions
11:48 < kanzure> retractions are considered negative, though
11:48 < kanzure> oh i see.
11:48 <@fenn> but unretracted fraudulent papers are worse
11:49 < kanzure> notyetretractedwatch
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12:00 <@fenn> joi ito's scalingbitcoin 2017 talk tl;dr "ICOs are bad because you can steal cookies from the cookie jar. don't be a scammer because scamming is bad mmkay"
12:01 <@fenn> also something about unbundling protocol layers being a good thing
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12:04 < kanzure> and also "By the end, we would come to a consensus, but everyone would disagree, and people would talk for hours, and then people would say we're tired let's just do something stupid. If you were in the room and you already had a chance to complain, there were some people much less likely to complain. So we let them talked in person, and they wouldn't complain any more online.
12:04 < kanzure> "
12:05 <@fenn> yeh but ICANN sucks so his opinion is disqualified
12:05 < kanzure> yes. also, "let's just put them in a room and shut them up online" is evil.
12:05 <@fenn> meh if it gives people an opportunity to feel like they have been heard, it seems ok
12:06 < kanzure> Why did the multithreaded chicken cross the road?
12:06 < kanzure> To To other side. get the
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12:09 < kanzure> .title https://bitesofcode.wordpress.com/2017/09/12/augmented-reality-with-python-and-opencv-part-1/
12:09 < yoleaux> Augmented reality with Python and OpenCV (part 1) | Bites of code
12:11 < kanzure> music! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JABIbHs_bi8
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12:39 < kanzure> .wik hyaluronic acid
12:39 < yoleaux> "Hyaluronic acid (HA; conjugate base hyaluronate), also called hyaluronan, is an anionic, nonsulfated glycosaminoglycan distributed widely throughout connective, epithelial, and neural tissues." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyaluronic_acid
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12:51 < kanzure> win 19
12:51 < kanzure> blah
12:52 < gradstudentbot> It's not really significant, but there's definitely a trend.
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13:13 < kanzure> .title https://www.stemsave.com/index.aspx
13:13 < yoleaux> Storing Stem Cells In Teeth For Your Family’s Future Health
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13:25 < kanzure> http://blobon.com.ar/degustu/
13:43 < kanzure> https://www.biospace.com/article/releases/neuropharm-group-plc-to-mull-voluntary-liquidation-to-return-cash-/
13:48 < heath> here's a better one...
13:49 < heath> nm
13:49 < heath> okay, i'll share
13:49 < heath> .tw https://twitter.com/joeerl/status/844570550773006336
13:49 < yoleaux> What do we want? Eventual consistency When do we want it? Now. (@joeerl)
13:50 < heath> s/better/another
13:52 < gradstudentbot> Oh a sales rep? No, I'm not busy, sure I have time to talk.
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14:03 < kanzure> "reality vs. kurzweil's expectations" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15698921
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15:17 < kanzure> hm
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15:32 < kanzure> delinquentme: if you pm sdaftuar then you will be able to get his attention
15:33 < delinquentme> ty kanzure pm sent
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17:04 < kanzure> AFM video of kinesin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jt3AM5Kfqw
17:06 < kanzure> about the intel management engine stuff https://www.cs.cmu.edu/~davide/bad_thing.html
17:09 < kanzure> "How (not) to train your spider: successful and unsuccessful methods for studying learning" http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/03014223.2015.1127263?journalCode=tnzz20
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18:54 < maaku> kanzure: I looked at storing stem cells or umbilical tissue when my kids were born, but it seemed somewhat wasteful given the costs involved and the possibility of future tools (stem cells from skin, or advanced bio/nano tech) 20+ years in the future
18:59 < kanzure> yep... just need to make sure they tikes keep their skin cells..
19:16 < kanzure> maaku: alex m was chatting about having to threaten legal action against hospital to get his kid's cord blood :-\
19:16 < kanzure> because they didn't want to hand it over (they weren't familiar with this i guess? or thought it was weird?)
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19:55 < kanzure> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2F-DItXtZs
19:55 < yoleaux> Episode 1 - Mongo DB Is Web Scale - YouTube
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22:55 < maaku> kanzure: weird
22:55 < maaku> I'm pretty sure there is hospital billing codes for umbilical cord extraction; they're a dumb hospital if they're leaving money on the table
22:55 < maaku> (assuming alex m is stateside)
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--- Log closed Wed Nov 15 00:00:15 2017