--- Log opened Tue Oct 16 00:00:38 2018
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00:34 < cerulean_syzygy> words of peace, but no treaty, are a sign of a plot.
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01:51 < archels> kanzure: there are 400+ people here, it might upset my bank
01:52 < archels> besides, there was no coffee this morning before the start of the first plenary, so I've given up all hope
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03:16 < adlai> serious question, and it's not politics, it's antipolitics: how is "directed evolution" different from "intelligent design"? the terms could be swapped retroactively in all published materials, and there would be zero increase in semantic friction.
03:20 < TMA> adlai: it is a difference in manufacturing process
03:21  * adlai agrees, though confessing unfamiliarity with "directed evolution" outside the context of optimization algorithms
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06:02 < TMA> adlai: I am not versed in the creationist interpretation either.
06:05 < TMA> adlai: From what I understood it is just selection that is not 'natural' but 'divine'.
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09:40 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=565c76e0 Michael Folkson: Add Laolu Lightning Network talk transcript >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/sf-bitcoin-meetup/2016-07-18-laolu-osuntokun-lightning-network/
09:40 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=fb862645 Michael Folkson: Add link to video and slides >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/sf-bitcoin-meetup/2016-07-18-laolu-osuntokun-lightning-network/
09:40 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=47aaa829 Michael Folkson: Add space >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/sf-bitcoin-meetup/2016-07-18-laolu-osuntokun-lightning-network/
09:40 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=42788a32 Bryan Bishop: Merge pull request #18 from michaelfolkson/add-laolu-lightning-network >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/
09:42 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=93b5cfea Bryan Bishop: tweeter link >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/sf-bitcoin-meetup/2016-07-18-laolu-osuntokun-lightning-network/
09:46 < kanzure> artificial selection is not intelligent design... you don't know the link between phenotype and genotype and if you did you would skip all the selection steps.
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12:08 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=d2f1dbb5 Bryan Bishop: crispr tolerance might be a useful modification >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/genetic-modifications/
12:14 < kanzure> .tw https://twitter.com/psuvafan007/status/1050048990547300353
12:14 < yoleaux> Hilariously accurate $EDIT quote on intentionally misleading CRISPR reporting. “If you’re a science writer, CRISPR is probably the best click bait you can have in the title for any article you ever write . . . catnip for science journalists” @12:50 👏😂 http://wsw.com/webcast/chard2/edit/ (@psuvafan007)
12:15 < kanzure> https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidsable/2018/10/07/what-were-doing-right-and-what-can-be-better-about-ivf/#33c0ab46935d
12:16 < kanzure> http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/10/crop-protecting-insects-could-be-turned-bioweapons-critics-warn
12:17 < kanzure> "Insect Allies aims to use insects such as aphids or whiteflies to infect crops with tailormade viruses that can deliver certain genes to mature plants; it’s essentially gene therapy for crops. The goal, DARPA says, is to find a new way to protect plants growing in the field from emerging threats."
12:17 < kanzure> http://web.evolbio.mpg.de/HEGAAs/
12:18 < kanzure> https://www.technologyreview.com/s/612225/the-dna-data-storage-machine-thats-the-size-of-a-school-bus/
12:20 < kanzure> re: the recent human oogonia paper, see https://www.technologyreview.com/s/608452/a-new-way-to-reproduce/ and http://science.sciencemag.org/content/early/2018/09/19/science.aat1674
12:23 < kanzure> IVF and adolescent arterial hypertension http://www.onlinejacc.org/content/72/11/1267
12:24 < kanzure> .tw https://twitter.com/neuroecology/status/1038078758358605825
12:24 < yoleaux> Microwasp next to protozoans - it's smaller than some single-celled organisms (it's 50 um)! But it has eyes and ~7400 neurons whose nuclei are destroyed when it develops https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1467803911000946?via%3Dihub https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dmf-pMeXcAEcsBw.jpg (@neuroecology)
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12:31 < kanzure> "The FDA is prohibited from going germline" http://science.sciencemag.org/content/353/6299/545.long
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16:43 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=0a5dc075 Bryan Bishop: transcript: handling reorgs and forks >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/tokyo-2018/edgedevplusplus/reorgs/
16:45 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=fb9e6ad2 Bryan Bishop: add tweeter link >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/tokyo-2018/edgedevplusplus/reorgs/
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17:50 < heath> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TOGBG9g2tE
17:50 < yoleaux> "Algorithms for DNA Data Storage" by Ruthie Nachmany - YouTube
17:56 < adlai> kanzure: we don't know the links between your pronouns and your antecedents, and if we did, perhaps that statement would've been a little clearer :)
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17:57 < kanzure> you what
17:57 < adlai> my guess is that an intelligent proponent of intelligent design would believe that the sysadmin takes an active role in bitflipping the code vectors, which is way more work than most sysadmins i've encountered would care to do on a frequent basis.
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17:57  * adlai used the poetic plural, oops!
17:59 < adlai> how are y'all doing on that "million designer babies by 2030" goal? and also -- where does the line between "designer baby" and "fertilize five eggs and donate four to stem cell research" get drawn, in the context of this milestone on the roadmap?
18:00  * adlai would expect that "designer baby" is roughly equivalent to "hgp-write, with a smattering of plagiarism", but this is a complex question
18:04 < fenn> it doesn't need to be a fully synthetic genome to count as a designer baby
18:05 < fenn> the idea is something like, you go to a doctor and select the phenotype you want from an array of options
18:06 < fenn> if the most efficient way to accomplish that goal is to do a full synthetic genome, fine. but in the near term it could more easily be accomplished by using a base editor or embryo selection
18:08 < adlai> lol! select the phenotype, that's a good one. please keep up the subtle humor :D
18:08 < fenn> that's literally what the phrase means
18:09 < adlai> how about "select the option which seems most appropriate given actuarial data regarding the environment where the delivered genotype will be allowed to bud"
18:09 < fenn> i'm afraid the average parent isn't so rational
18:09 < adlai> otherwise, that doctor is an unwitting nitwit, selling unpriced options advertised as something else.
18:09 < adlai> well maybe the average parent should've been neutered at birth.
18:10 < adlai> /politics
18:10 < fenn> we gotta start somewhere
18:11 < fenn> anyway i'm just defining words, not promoting an agenda or plan
18:13 < adlai> thank you for offering a definition! that's the first step to the formation of coherent plans, and the understanding of whether their pursuit makes any rational sense .
18:15 < fenn> the whole "designer baby" concept was put together by bio-ethicist scaremongers in the first place
18:16 < fenn> a sci-fi dystopia where everyone is 50% more resistant to tuberculosis doesn't make good copy
18:19 < fenn> i guess it's like designer shoes or a designer purse
18:24 < fenn> some interesting stories about "savior siblings" http://www.frontlinegenomics.com/blog/11345/never-considered-myself-designer-baby/
18:31 < fenn> i've never heard this use of the phrase "designer baby" before
18:45 < kanzure> i think the goal was to convince adlai that directed evolution (iterative selection) was not the same thing as CAD-style intelligent deisgn
18:45 < kanzure> *design
18:45 < adlai> who's goal? i appreciate the difference between biology and computer science, if that's what you were worried about.
18:46 < kanzure> the conversation you're having had a purpose.
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18:48  * adlai does not understand the difference between "bioinformatics" and "computer science in the context of biology", but that's a separate story; and it's food o'clock for him anyway. thank you for the conversation!
18:50 < kanzure> what a confusing being.
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20:03 < nmz787> adlai: re "select the option which seems most appropriate given actuarial data regarding the environment" -- well time is gonna do this anyway (i.e. natural selection)
20:05 < nmz787> adlai: bioinformatics is pretty much CS in Bio... why is that confusing? I say "pretty much" because you also need a decent background in bio and biotech/molecular-bio to know how to approach solving the computationally-accelerated/benfitted problems in the biospace
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23:16 < kanzure> https://www.fightaging.org/archives/2018/10/discussing-the-longevity-investor-network/
23:20 < kanzure> https://www.fightaging.org/archives/2018/10/an-interview-with-james-peyer-of-apollo-ventures-2/
23:22 < kanzure> https://www.fightaging.org/archives/2018/09/an-independent-group-working-on-a-lysosens-medical-bioremediation-program/
23:22 < kanzure> https://www.fightaging.org/archives/2018/09/methuselah-fund-closes-initial-fundraising-reports-on-some-early-investments/
23:24 < kanzure> https://www.fightaging.org/archives/2018/09/rejuvenation-biotechnology-as-a-full-employment-program-for-ethicists/
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--- Log closed Wed Oct 17 00:00:39 2018