--- Log opened Wed Dec 05 00:00:43 2018
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04:02 < pasky_> if nuclear scientists were making the public policy in 1942-45, the world might be a better place
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07:29 < kanzure> https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/11/do-gut-bacteria-make-second-home-our-brains
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09:45 < Jenda`> pasky_: can you elaborate a bit? (not flaming, interested in that opinion)
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10:34 < kanzure> "Livebirth after uterus transplantation from a deceased donor in a recipient with uterine infertility" https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(18)31766-5/fulltext
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14:16 < pasky_> Jenda`: Richard Rhodes, "The Making of the Atomic Bomb" is pretty insightful in this regard - some of the scientists, in particular Leo Szilard and Max Born, were thinking very hard still early in the Manhattan project about the long-term implications and predicted the cold war nuclear arms race pretty clearly, and lobbied intensely (but failing badly) to keep open communication with soviets and the
14:16 < pasky_> soviet scientists to prevent that.
14:17 < pasky_> e.g. http://www.thenuclearworld.org/the-science-politics-of-leo-szilard/ (the Politics section), but I really recommend the book (or the audiobook), it's pretty awesome
14:18 < pasky_> actually that link I randomly googled out has some good discussion
14:18 < pasky_> heh, > Winston Churchill’s dictum that “science should be on tap, not on top”
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15:25 < nsh> nmz787, not sure re: blind people and nerve-muscle-consciousness-generalised-focus stuff
15:25 < nsh> if i had to guess i'd say blind people do all the same kinds of abstract focusing they just don't receive photonic data to the same extent
15:26 < nsh> and concomitantly perhaps don't use muscles that specifically focus the eyes as photonic stereoreceivers
15:26 < nsh> but the rest is largely the same
15:27 < nsh> the brain/neocortex still operates on some kind of holographic principles and consciousness is still nontrivially related to subtle muscle tension patterns
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15:27 < nsh> so optics obtains even for the blind, and sequential modulation obtains even for the death
15:28 < nsh> really that we think we hear sounds and we see visual things is as much reflective of optics and signal processing being hugely fundamental informational aspects of higher information processing
15:28 < nsh> than it is a consequence of the fact that we have photosensors and audiosensors
15:29 < nsh> just as if we didn't move we'd probably still have conceptions of space
15:29 < nsh> because if you have any amount of information that isn't the most trivial amount, then you end up with space of some kind
15:29 < nsh> and eventually you end up with something resembling optics and something resembling music
15:55 < kanzure> "Researchers discussing He’s feat frequently refer to the case of Martin Cline, a hematologist at UC Los Angeles who in 1980 conducted pioneering gene therapy research in other countries rather than wait for his own institution to approve his proposed studies. In the aftermath of intense media scrutiny, Cline resigned as chief of his school’s hematology-oncology division and lost several ...
15:55 < kanzure> ...NIH grants. “I regret to say this, but I think the consequences of my experiment set the field back several years because of all the regulations and oversights,” says Cline, who is retired and living in Stinson Beach, California. Cline says he paid a high price for what he now sees as having moved too fast. “I lost a significant part of a career I loved,” says Cline, who switched to ...
15:55 < kanzure> ...oncology."
15:56 < kanzure> in other words, these people are bullies, and the way to deal with bullies is to display completely overwhelming orce
15:56 < kanzure> completely overwhelming force
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15:57 < kanzure> from https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/12/after-last-weeks-shock-scientists-scramble-prevent-more-gene-edited-babies
15:58 < kanzure> https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-12-05/china-fiercely-decries-he-jiankui-s-human-gene-editing
15:59 < kanzure> "“How could Dr. He and [his] team change the gene pool of the human species without considering the need to consult other parts of the human species?”"
15:59 < kanzure> it's not like natural mutations consult the other parts of the human species...... what are they smoking?
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16:30 < nsh> how do you know natural mutations are not undertaken in consultation with the rest of the species?
16:30 < nsh> that's an incredibly strong assertion...
16:30 < nsh> it's only supported by the complete lack of imagination of everyone
16:30 < nsh> but not by any actual facts
16:32 < kanzure> well that's okay, anything can be established by a sufficiently strong imagination
16:32 < nsh> also it's trivially false by virtue of organism<->environment<->cohort feedback systems
16:32 < nsh> but it may also be false directly in the process of mutation
16:32 < nsh> but that would require things to be connected in far less trivial ways than we currently imagine them
16:32 < nsh> (which they are, but not necessarily in those ways)
16:51 < kanzure> from catalog "During this year's SynBioBeta, we announced our collaboration with Cambridge Consultants in building our PartyBus. When completed early next year, we will be able to encode information in DNA at a speed of 1TB/day, for about 1/1,000,000 the cost of what's been possible before. We are speaking with companies now for early-access pilot projects in 2019."
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17:17 < fenn> "I waited to disembark while an old woman tried to descend the stairs. She was a back-country Moor, a nomad from the open desert. For minutes she hesitated in the doorway. She gripped the rails and surveyed the angle. Her problem was not physical inability but understanding. These were her first stairs: she had climbed them to get on the airplane, and now she had to figure a way down."
17:31 < kanzure> why not just watch what the other bipedals do
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19:55 < kanzure> .wik guanfacine
19:55 < yoleaux> "Guanfacine (trade names Estulic, Tenex, and, in extended release form, Intuniv) is a sympatholytic drug  used to treat hypertension and attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD).  It is a selective α2A receptor agonist." — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guanfacine
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--- Log closed Thu Dec 06 00:00:43 2018