--- Log opened Thu May 16 00:00:14 2019 00:33 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has quit [] 00:33 -!- periffis [~g@205.123.244.26] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:35 -!- A__ [~A@219-89-6-58-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:37 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:38 -!- A__ [~A@219-89-6-58-fibre.sparkbb.co.nz] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:51 -!- periffis [~g@205.123.244.26] has quit [Quit: periffis] 02:07 < archels> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vl6jn-DdafM 02:07 < yoleaux> We Are Going - YouTube 02:08 < archels> NASA moon base announcement by 2024 02:08 < fenn> unfortunately it just means "keep doing the stupid thing, but harder" 02:09 < fenn> there is zero traction for this in congress, it's all mike pence, so the nasa administrator is trying to spin it as "we need more money from congress to do their pork barrel projects faster" 02:10 < fenn> it's sad really. there are a lot of talented people at NASA whose lives are being wasted 02:11 < fenn> SLS will fly once, and then be shelved, because it will be too expensive to run 02:12 < fenn> the orbital platform makes no sense at all until there is a fuel production facility on the lunar south pole 02:12 < fenn> zubrin calls it "the lunar toll-booth" because it imposes a delta-v cost to stop there before going anywhere else 02:14 < fenn> it has nothing to do with "mars and beyond" until it has lunar propellant available 02:14 < fenn> mars and moon are the same delta-v, you get no benefit from stopping at the moon first on your way to mars 02:17 < fenn> sure you get to leave some astronauts in a can for months and watch them get sick from zero-g and radiation, but that's not my idea of a space program 02:18 < fenn> the nasa administrator's job should be to accomplish goals, not increase the size of the nasa budget 02:20 < fenn> perhaps the only good thing to come out of all of this is the Commercial Lunar Payload Services program 02:21 < fenn> this sort of program is what got SpaceX started, but back then it was for earth orbit instead of lunar surface 02:21 -!- periffis [~g@66.205.193.3] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:08 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181168.unknown.vectranet.pl] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:23 < archels> fenn: details aside, the main thing I'm getting from this is that we seem to be dreaming into the right direction 03:28 -!- mrdata__ [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:30 -!- mrdata_ [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 03:39 < fenn> by and large, most people don't care about space colonization at all. there's been a recent uptick in interest, almost entirely due to SpaceX landing rockets and the falcon heavy launch, which provided the first major space-related spectacle in decades. but that doesn't translate into a sane policy-making institution in the federal government 03:39 < fenn> nasa has expressed interest in "going to mars, some day, in the future, eventually" since even before the moon landing in 1969 03:40 < fenn> but they still poo-pooh even basic "living off the land" stuff like making methane from CO2 03:41 < fenn> it boils down to two related problems: the politicians are in charge, and most politicians have no idea how anything actually works 03:45 < fenn> I won't be celebrating until colonization is an explicit goal, meaning, people living permanently in space, mostly independently of earth's resources 03:49 < fenn> I have a feeling NASA will soon become irrelevant, with China and commercial services making up the majority of launches and infrastructure on orbit 03:51 < fenn> when cost to launch comes down far enough that you no longer have to spend more than the payload's weight in gold on engineering costs, suddenly a much larger set of people can participate 03:53 < archels> China and other countries being on the US' tail will probably drive policy forward 03:53 < archels> obviously the US wants to have a permanent moon base before the Chinese establish one 04:01 < fenn> sure they want it, but it's hard to recover from the current level of entrenched dysfunction 04:06 < juri_> NASA is a jobs program, not a space exploration agency. until that changes, private efforts are our best bet. 04:06 < fenn> maybe a real sputnik moment like "china has landed nuclear missiles on the moon" will be enough to wake up the rest of congress 04:08 < juri_> i doubt it. 04:09 < fenn> yeah i can't really imagine what it would look like 04:09 -!- adamsky1 [~adamsky3@178235181168.unknown.vectranet.pl] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:10 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181168.unknown.vectranet.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:10 < fenn> apparently, even the certain destruction of the biosphere as we know it is not enough to motivate significant action 04:13 < fenn> sorry to be such a downer 04:14 < fenn> there's actually a lot of exciting stuff happening in space recently 04:14 < fenn> starlink is launching tomorrow, the first 60 satellites of 12,000 04:16 < fenn> today i suppose 05:13 -!- purpleshift [purpleshif@gateway/vpn/mullvad/purpleshift] has quit [Quit: .] 05:40 -!- l_wl [~l_wl@pool-173-66-183-216.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:40 -!- l_wl [~l_wl@pool-173-66-183-216.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:37 -!- adamsky1 [~adamsky3@178235181168.unknown.vectranet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:49 -!- purpleshift [purpleshif@gateway/vpn/mullvad/purpleshift] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:50 < kanzure> .title https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLowKtXNTBypGqImE405J2565dvjafglHU 06:50 < yoleaux> Building an 8-bit breadboard computer! - YouTube 06:50 < kanzure> (40 videos) 07:27 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 07:37 -!- mrdata__ is now known as mrdata 08:08 -!- NikopolSohru [~Nikopol_@5.79.76.37] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:08 -!- NikopolSohru [~Nikopol_@5.79.76.37] has quit [Changing host] 08:08 -!- NikopolSohru [~Nikopol_@unaffiliated/nikopolsohru] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:22 -!- strages [uid11297@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hrtkymjwsmxudplf] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:37 < nmz787> anyone here know how to deal with liability of having a high-school student do "intern" lab work in my house/garage/shed? 09:38 < nmz787> I have a feeling it means business license, business insurance... 10:05 < kanzure> well at the very least you should look into a liability waiver and then into insurance 10:05 < kanzure> insurance industry is deep and weird and there's all sorts of fun things you could find 10:11 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffffff@2606:6000:ca81:3100:906c:c6da:c5f7:c9ec] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:45 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has quit [] 10:50 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:53 < nmz787> I've always heard liability waivers aren't worth the paper 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[~ffffffff@cpe-76-176-31-235.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:01 -!- TC [~talinck@98.29.27.253] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:38 -!- periffis [~g@66.205.193.3] has joined ##hplusroadmap 23:56 -!- spaceangel [~spaceange@ip-86-49-16-65.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined ##hplusroadmap --- Log closed Fri May 17 00:00:14 2019