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09:11 -!- sorki is now known as srk 09:18 < lsneff> Elon is now the richest person in the world 09:22 < fenn> no, satoshi nakamoto is 09:22 < fenn> but neither of them can sell 09:23 < fenn> ok maybe not 09:26 < lsneff> nakamoto has something like 40 billion in btc at this point 09:26 < lsneff> assuming their still alive and the keys aren't lost 09:26 < lsneff> *they're 09:27 < fenn> the point is, a valuation calculated as num_share * stock_price is useless 09:27 < fenn> you can't sell all of your stock without it tanking 09:27 < fenn> especially a figurehead like musk 09:30 < lsneff> right 09:33 < L29Ah> it's useful when you're an aspiring commie drawing another infographic pamphlet 09:36 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:37 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:45 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:51 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:54 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:55 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:05 < apotheon> L29Ah: That's an amusing take. 10:24 < fltrz> the aspiring commie will argue that doesn't change a thing: if the bitcoins are sold to known to be equally greedy humans, the value should be unaffected. 10:25 < fltrz> the starement that the value would thank without such evidence is an admission of relative greediness 10:25 < fltrz> *tank 10:25 < fltrz> (greediness of the current holder) not L29Ah or anyone using his argument 10:27 * fltrz ogles his new medal of stalin for IRC 10:27 < fltrz> relative greediness is between seller and buyer 10:28 < L29Ah> well there's a law of diminishing marginal utility 10:29 < fltrz> if nakomoto were to publicly spend his coins on an almost never ending blowjob, the value would probably tank but because of our group estimation that the money will circulate in less greedy hands for a prolonged period 10:29 < fltrz> (before it is captured by greedy hands again) 10:31 < fltrz> the oppressive efficiency is related to the free circulation half life 10:31 < L29Ah> and even w/o it we can talk about a market for spaceflight development that, as with virtually any other tech development, depends on angel investors and shrinks with the investors leaving it 10:32 < L29Ah> as you have only so many people believing in it 10:34 < fltrz> jsut like you only have so many people believing in wormholes, which if possible essentially invalidates rocket flight (or cars) 10:34 < apotheon> L29Ah: There isn't a law of diminishing marginal utility in the labor theory of value, as far as I'm aware. 10:36 < fltrz> to predict market movements you want to know for each currency how fast money is moving from greedy to less greedy hands and vice versa 10:36 < apotheon> fltrz: The problem with wormholes seems to be the energy consumption. 10:37 < fltrz> one could have questionnaire s for biotech people, questionnaires for ethereum holders, ... 10:37 < apotheon> fltrz: I seem to recall reading about an estimate that basically the entire mass of Jupiter would have to be losslessly converted to ghost radiation to open a wormhole wide and (time-wise) long enough to send a human through. 10:37 < L29Ah> apotheon: the labor theory of value can be countered with trivial examples anyway, i never talked to a commie that holded onto it 10:37 < apotheon> Thus, reaction engine space travel still seems more efficient. 10:37 < fltrz> apotheon, I believe elementary particles are wormholes? do they consume energy? theres a difference between wormholes in general and specifically mass / gravitaqtion wormholes 10:38 < apotheon> L29Ah: Oh, really? I've talked to commies who adhere to it. 10:38 < apotheon> fltrz: I don't know about energy consumption at quantum scale. I was just talking about something I read once about the energy cost about opening one up to human scale. 10:39 < apotheon> Elementary particles *being* wormholes is new to me, though. 10:39 < fltrz> apotheon, these are calculations for specific approaches, not fundamental requirement calculations 10:39 < apotheon> I haven't read theoretical physics stuff for years. 10:39 < apotheon> (and what I did read wasn't academic per se) 10:40 < fltrz> I can concoct you an icecream for $1000 dollar, doesn't mean there isn't a cheaper way to concoct one 10:40 < apotheon> sure 10:41 < apotheon> Do you know of cheaper ways to open up human-scale wormholes? 10:41 < apotheon> Like I said, I haven't been reading about this stuff for quite a while. 10:42 < apotheon> . . . kinda like how commies who believe in the labor theory of value haven't been reading about economics for quite a while. 10:43 < L29Ah> apotheon: well, when it comes up, i counter it, and then we talk about other stuff; maybe i just happen to keep myself away from people who can't admit such problems with their theories 10:44 < apotheon> That's probably a wise policy. 10:44 < apotheon> I mostly only notice that kind of thing when *other* people are discussing it. I don't tend to engage with people like that, myself. 10:45 < apotheon> I don't know if that's because I'm smart or just lucky. I've heard it's smarter to be lucky than it is lucky to be smart. 10:46 < fltrz> apotheon, I believe entanglement implies a wormhole connection, so the energy requirement would be very low 10:46 < fltrz> at least for information 10:47 < fltrz> also wormholes imply time travel 10:48 < apotheon> "time travel" in the relativistic sense, I take it 10:48 < fltrz> consider creating a wormhole (i.e. a pair of portals), you can age one portal with respect to the other, by accelerating one while not the other (think twin paradox) or by placing one portal at a higher elevation for a while and then returning to the same elevation 10:48 < L29Ah> bitcoin just fell $3k down, did something just happen in the US? 10:49 < fltrz> apotheon, no, actual forwards and backwards travel of information, but not beyond the point of generation / destruction of the pairs 10:49 < apotheon> ah 10:49 < apotheon> That's interesting. 10:51 < fltrz> classical physics with time travel becomes indeterministic (multiple histories are possible) and may explain quantum mechanics 10:53 < fltrz> also, total regulatory hell, because pragmatic use of wormholes will spontaneously result in relative aging, and having a free market of wormholes results in the sneakiest, cleverest user of bits from the future to gain total power 10:54 < fltrz> also, only unconditionally secure crypto remains secure 10:54 < apotheon> I'm using wormholes for time travel in a novel I'm writing, actually. 10:54 < fltrz> if you need nightmare scenario's you can tap shoulder occasionally 10:55 < apotheon> That only gets used once -- well, twice, I guess -- as a framing mechanism for the story and to set up the stakes, and it happens under rather extreme (end of the world, basically) conditions. 10:56 < apotheon> Speaking of time-travel-sorta, I wish Tenet was a better movie. 10:56 < fltrz> I enjoyed it morally but yeah, the physics is just nonsense 10:57 < fltrz> I especially liked how the bad guy turns out to be the most moral person, and the good guys are evil. 10:57 < fltrz> similar to rick and morty really 10:58 < lsneff> L29Ah: a couple exchanges are down 10:58 < fltrz> its a font attack or washington unrest? 11:00 < fltrz> I've been blabbering in different places about possible infinite loops in font rasterizers, and how a string may be crafted to crash a specific application 11:01 < fltrz> economic and secure data systems should use monospace fonts 11:03 < lsneff> i imagine that it's generally pretty difficult for an attacker to replace the font description that an application uses 11:05 < apotheon> Proportional fonts are good for print. 11:06 < fltrz> lsneff, assuming no control of font, an attacker who knows the font, size, rasterizer, etc used on say a trading platform, or a wallet application etc could take the application specific settings and look for a specific subpixel horizontal advancement / offset that crashes hangs the rasterizer for a specific glyph. to ensure the rasterizer will be confronted with the offset he just needs to find a non negative linear combination of glyph 11:06 < fltrz> advancements at those settings, so the attack string looks like random characters and then finally the mortal glyph at its mortal offset 11:06 < apotheon> I see people use proportional fonts in their IDEs once in a while. That's . . . insane. 11:07 < lsneff> fltrz: poetic 11:07 < lsneff> I use a font with ligatures in my text editor 11:08 < fltrz> we should really have provably terminating rasterizers 11:08 < apotheon> What about in IRC? æ 11:08 < apotheon> (re: ligatures) 11:09 < fltrz> consider a website comment system, one malicious actor can cause all browsers with default settings to crash the tab 11:10 < apotheon> sweet 11:11 < apotheon> . . . assuming they're all using the same font, which is totally possible with the way fonts are downloaded along with the HTML these days. 11:13 < fltrz> its unclear to me though if browsers prebuild a set of controlled offset bitmaps, but that seems unlikely given the large number of fonts and glyphs, a countermeasure would be to quantize the offset to limited precision fixed point to lower the probability of finding a mortal offset 11:14 < fltrz> not quantizing gives the attacker more surface 11:14 < apotheon> yet more evidence for my general thesis that IEEE 754 is premature optimization 11:20 -!- CryptoDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lqcdjhxgvuqykuee] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 11:24 < fltrz> I was investigating rasterizers for gamma correction, and had some ideas on how to make them better (and faster) with a crazy idea (combining the concepts of integral imagees and procedural textures into one concept: procedural texture that represents the integral image) and came to conclusion such a thing would be much easier to formally prove secure, since it wouldn't need a rasterizer 11:25 < fltrz> but I don't really have the time to do this for free 11:26 < fltrz> no loops, only a finite tree of control flow 11:29 < fltrz> we can lower probability or eliminate with monospace, but we can't nanny all front-end designers, so its mandatory that proportional font renderers become secure 11:31 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:34 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:34 < fltrz> procedural images that represent interal images also allow for some things that are impossible otherwise: instead of planar intensities, also linear and point intensities, so as you zoom in say a grid line or curve maintans the same single pixel width of a certain color 11:35 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:35 < fltrz> i.e. infinitesimally thin lines or dots 11:36 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:36 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:36 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:38 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:42 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:42 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 11:44 < apotheon> fltrz: Can you get a Google Summer of Code sponsorship to work on that? 11:46 < lsneff> fltrz: student? 11:46 < fltrz> apotheon, thats a good question, I have no clue how the proposal process works? at some point the proposal process might consume more time than actually implementing it 11:46 < fltrz> lsneff, nope, no degree, work in factory 11:46 < apotheon> Ah, then no, I don't think you qualify. 11:47 < fltrz> (dropped out of physics, personal problems) 11:47 < apotheon> I don't qualify because I'm old. 11:47 < lsneff> I did gsoc back in... I guess it would be 2018 11:47 < fltrz> does gsoc even pay? is it higher than a european year of tuition? 11:47 < apotheon> The proposal process *for you*, if you qualify of course, shouldn't be too bad. The way I understand it, a sponsoring org handles all the bureaucracy, so the student working on the project doesn't have to go through all that crap. 11:48 < apotheon> The sponsoring org pays the student working on the project. 11:48 < lsneff> fltrz: you seem to be knowledgeable, any particular reason you picked a factory rather than a software engineering job 11:48 < lsneff> gsoc pays $6000 usd for the summer, adjusted for cost-of-living in your country 11:48 < fltrz> lsneff, optimize free time over income, if I had picked a software job I would be working on the same data plumbing job over and over and have no time to learn and get ideas 11:49 < fltrz> lsneff, I wouldn't need to turn a profit, just cover the cost of living and taxes that I would otherwise spend for food and rent. approximately 500 or 600 a month estimate 11:49 < apotheon> The last time I had a less technical job it involved dealing with people, and my brain was too exhausted from that at the end of the day to do anything interesting. 11:50 < lsneff> Google actually dishes out the stipend 11:50 < apotheon> Oh, does it? 11:50 < lsneff> Yeah, that's so organizations that actually have no money can have gsoc students 11:50 < apotheon> I'm not too knowledgeable about the internal logistics, having never been young enough or org-y enough to be a part of it. 11:51 < lsneff> The org actually receives some money as well 11:51 < fltrz> apotheon, sure, but you can learn to think about what you want in a physical repetitive job, also, working part time is what frees up the time while most real software jobs demand higher comittment 11:51 < apotheon> lsneff: Nice. 11:51 < lsneff> Yeah, I see where you're coming from fltrz 11:51 < apotheon> lsneff: Do you have any idea how much the org gets? 11:51 < lsneff> Maybe $500? 11:51 < apotheon> That's about ten hours of time for a professional. 11:52 < lsneff> Yep, it's not intended to compensate for mentoring time. 11:52 < apotheon> I wonder if that would be sufficient to pay someone (on a contract basis) to help with the bureaucracy of GSOC and leave a little bit after the fact. 11:52 < lsneff> the bureaucracy is very minimal 11:52 < apotheon> I guess the problem would be that the person handling the bureaucracy would have to be hired before you even know if your org will be accepted. 11:53 < lsneff> Oh, for the org? I'm not sure 11:53 < lsneff> I suspect it's pretty simple 11:53 < apotheon> I guess there are probably specific registered org-type requirements, too, though. 11:53 < fltrz> I wonder if theres a better model I can explore, like push some other projects on back burner, code this up, publish the code with extremely restrictive license, so it can be checked out, then do a crowdfunding for me to put it in permissive software license? 11:54 < apotheon> I have an org -- in a way, I kinda *am* the org -- that I'd love to get involved in that process, but the fact I loathe bureaucracy and am basically the whole org myself, paying out of my own bank account for everything, makes that seem totally unworkable. 11:54 < fltrz> I think crowdfunding platforms require the project to not be finished... 11:54 < apotheon> Yeah, I think so. 11:55 < lsneff> fltrz: I think a patreon-style fund-raising system might approximate what you're looking for 11:55 < fltrz> which is ridiculous because its perhaps one of the few actual solutions 11:55 < fltrz> where both parties know what they get 11:55 < lsneff> I don't think there are any micro-grant style crowdfunding platforms that are more similar to kickstarter than patreon 11:55 < fltrz> lsneff, I don't like asking people for blind faith 11:56 < fltrz> what trouble could I get in for pretending I am still coding it? 11:56 < apotheon> 1. Don't tell people on IRC it's already done. 11:56 < apotheon> 2. . . . 11:56 < apotheon> 3. Profit! 11:57 < apotheon> Somewhere in 2 is the fact you throw away your entire VCS history, just in case. 11:57 < apotheon> fltrz: What do you consider a "permissive" license? 11:57 < fltrz> I think the requirement is absurd. I bet a platform that intentionally goes for this model would have success: license-blackmail-gogo.org finished projects you'll have to sponsor to see end up in public domain 11:58 < lsneff> What platform are you thinking about? 11:58 < fltrz> apotheon, hypothetical license-blackmail-gogo.org could allow a negotiation process between backers and coders? 11:59 < apotheon> I don't think "pay enough and it'll be opened up" fits with the Kickstarter approach, which (as far as I recall) requires there to be specific, personally delivered bennies in some sense. 11:59 < apotheon> I think IndieGoGo can handle the "pay up and it becomes free" thing, though. 11:59 < apotheon> I don't think I got those backward. . . . 12:00 < apotheon> . . . but maybe IndieGoGo requires it to still be in development. 12:00 < fltrz> I had the impression they all require unfinished projects in fine print, but squeeze their eyes in practice for all the commercial finished products using it as an advertising platform because its where the money's at 12:00 < lsneff> There are plenty of kickstarters and indiegogos that are just people selling pre-existing products. 12:01 < apotheon> I've seen Kickstarter projects that are already done in the basic design/development phase but need additional money to turn it into an actual "product". 12:01 < fltrz> lsneff, yeah I also see it happening all the time, but I'm paranoid for getting in trouble 12:01 < apotheon> I guess you could just slap a slight increase in price onto it and send out a pack of stickers to backers, or something like that. 12:01 < lsneff> but, also, kickstarter and indiegogo aren't the right places for programming projects really 12:01 < lsneff> Unless you plan on making an actual consumer product 12:02 < fltrz> would license-blackmail-gogo.org be legal in most jurisdictions? 12:02 < apotheon> "it depends" 12:02 < fltrz> I can imagine companies and unions complaining because the smart guys leave em 12:03 < apotheon> There have been questions about whether Kickstarter is legal in its present form, trying to decide whether it should be subject to the same rules as more traditional business investment mechanisms. 12:03 < apotheon> If you do something interesting, someone will claim it should be regulated half to death. 12:07 < lsneff> fltrz: I've actually seen a couple examples fo github sponsors being used in that manner. e.g. if the sponsorship increases by n amount, I'll open-source x project. 12:09 -!- mrdata [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 12:12 -!- sanehatter [~sanehatte@141.98.255.145] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:12 < fltrz> lsneff, first time I hear about that, where do I see examples? what initial license do they use? 12:13 -!- sanehatter [~sanehatte@141.98.255.145] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:13 < lsneff> fltrz: i don't have any examples on hand. it was something I say on twitter maybe 6 months ago, and looked into because it felt kind of absurd 12:13 < lsneff> It was some js library 12:14 < lsneff> I think both things were js something 12:14 < fltrz> I'd rather have a lump sum agreement and no commitment expected afterwards (i.e. fully finished fully documented, theory of operation etc), than a running welfare setup 12:15 < fltrz> literally license blackmail 12:16 < fltrz> then just set an exponentially decaying price with a timescale of choice 12:16 < lsneff> It's not a bad idea 12:16 < fltrz> price vs impatience 12:17 < apotheon> I've seen the decaying-price-over-time thing posited somewhere else. 12:18 < fltrz> perhaps with a fuzzer etc to find mortal glyph positions for different competing rasterizers 12:19 < lsneff> well, if you actually do want to make money from this 12:20 < lsneff> my suggestion is that you do write a fuzzer, show that font renders are broken, and then get sponsorship from patreon/github/etc to actually build a better system 12:20 < fltrz> I don't want to make money per se, just cover living expenses and perhaps a bit more for pushing back other projects 12:20 < apotheon> Yeah, that seems reasonable. 12:20 < apotheon> (re: fuzzer-then-solution) 12:21 < apotheon> Maybe I should find some way to take that approach to jump-starting a Patreon career. 12:21 < fltrz> people will cheap out and do like they did with timer resolution: quantize to lower resolution, so the problem persists but just becomes rarer 12:22 < fltrz> better to present problem and solution at same time 12:22 < lsneff> that's not exactly what happened with timers. they're not just quantized more now, there's some randomness mixed into them 12:23 < fltrz> lsneff, sure same trick will be done with fonts, coarser quantization and / or some randomness sure 12:24 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:44 < fltrz> hmm if nobody dares make explicit license-blackmail-gogo platform, perhaps it should be decentralized / smart contract 12:45 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:46 < fltrz> destroy the capitalist gulag from inside out :) 12:47 -!- spaceangel [~spaceange@ip-94-112-205-34.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:56 < L29Ah> i don't see how would it taint anyone involved 12:57 < L29Ah> just no one cares enough i guess 12:57 < fltrz> I don't understand what you mean with taint here? 12:57 < apotheon> Legally? 12:57 < fltrz> yeah legally 12:57 < fltrz> i see 12:58 < apotheon> I think a decentralized version would be better, anyway. 12:58 < apotheon> Speaking of that, I'm rather disappointed to hear the news about OpenBazaar shutting down. 12:58 < L29Ah> apotheon: both legally and otherwise, i don't see FOSS activists being ostracized, even those violating the laws don't seem to be 12:59 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:59 < L29Ah> it shows OpenBazaar wasn't decentralized in the first place 12:59 < L29Ah> i was poking the project every year and each time it wasn't clear how it works, like at all 12:59 < fltrz> whatever happened to the gitcoin idea? 12:59 < L29Ah> and for all those years they failed to make anything that looks like a protocol spec 12:59 < apotheon> I think there are convenience parts of it that aren't decentralized. 12:59 < apotheon> That was my impression. 13:00 < apotheon> . . . but because nothing filled in the convenience gaps, its usability is significantly diminished without the centralized part. 13:00 < L29Ah> they had this nice idea of burning money as a mean to obtain a cryptographically strong reputation, and they ditched it 13:01 < fltrz> uh, I just found an ethereum gitcoin project, but thats not what the original proposal was right? I think original gitcoin predated ethereum? 13:01 < apotheon> I'm not sure what's up with the gitcoin thing, or even what it was. 13:01 -!- Urchin[emacs] [~user@unaffiliated/urchin] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:02 < fltrz> it seems the name was hijacked by ethereum project? the original seems erased from web? 13:03 < fltrz> by *an ethereum project 13:03 < fltrz> I think gitcoin I refer to is from NameCoin era 13:04 -!- mrdata [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:07 < docl> 18:07 < drmeister> Now we are getting clean products for our insanely large molecules. 13:07 -!- sanehatter [~sanehatte@141.98.255.145] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:07 < docl> 18:07 < drmeister> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/rxl2ip9s/image.png 13:07 < docl> 18:09 < drmeister> Contrasted against what we were seeing for similar syntheses two weeks ago: 13:07 < docl> 18:09 < drmeister> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/fczhwoj4/image.png 13:07 < docl> from #clasp 13:09 < fltrz> is that software or chemistry? confused 13:10 < docl> both 13:10 < docl> software simulations of chemistry that controls robotics for synthesizing the molecules 13:12 < fltrz> I the name of the original project I had in mind was gitchain, https://github.com/gitchain 13:12 -!- sanehatter [~sanehatte@141.98.255.145] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:13 < fltrz> docl, but the page at https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp doesn't mention anything about molecular synthesis? 13:15 < fenn> it's a digital polymer like proteins or dna 13:15 < fenn> the mass spectrum look like they are getting a few addition or deletion errors 13:16 < fenn> er, i guess the top graph is a chromatography spectrum 13:20 < fenn> for the record i think "license blackmail" is a bad name 13:21 < fenn> blender for example was purchased by the community 13:21 < fenn> before that it was proprietary 13:23 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:24 < fenn> so "community purchase" is my generic term for the concept in a positive light 13:24 < fenn> you could also with themes of liberation or opening or whatever ideological tribe you prefer 13:26 < fenn> go with* 13:27 * fenn sleepz 13:27 < fltrz> open source community liberation platform lol 13:28 < docl> see http://gnusha.org/logs/2020-10-19.log 13:28 < fltrz> license blackmail is to the point and honest 13:28 < fltrz> docl, this is or isnt the same project https://github.com/clasp-developers/clasp ? 13:29 < docl> yes, that's it 13:29 * fltrz hands fenn a worker of the month medal while he sleepz 13:29 < fltrz> docl, why doesn't the github page mention anything about the chemistry, it looks like a random software project? 13:30 < docl> It's a lisp compiler. The project that does chemistry using it is called cando 13:31 < fltrz> GitHub - ram-compbio/CANDO: Computational Analysis of ... 13:31 < fltrz> [Search domain github.com/ram-compbio/CANDO] https://github.com/ram-compbio/CANDO 13:31 < fltrz> CANDO is a unique computational drug discovery, design, and repurposing platform. 13:31 < fltrz> GitHub - cando-developers/cando: Cando chemistry language 13:31 < fltrz> [Search domain github.com/cando-developers/cando] https://github.com/cando-developers/cando 13:31 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffffff@2601:5c4:c780:6aa0:5836:1bed:e9b1:c601] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:31 < Urchin[emacs]> is that the Common Lisp that ties in with C++? 13:31 < fltrz> same or diff projects? 13:31 < docl> Urchin[emacs]: yes, it does. uses llvm 13:32 < docl> fltrz: yes, that's the same project 13:32 < fltrz> why has it 2 repos on github? 13:32 < docl> not sure what the ram-compbio one is, but maybe a rebundle 13:33 < Urchin[emacs]> I know the author of clasp really made it for his nanotech research 13:33 < Urchin[emacs]> I've seen his talk at one point 13:33 < fltrz> docl, its annoying if a rebundle doesn't pick a unique name 13:54 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 13:59 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:11 -!- filipepe_ [uid362247@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dtzhoxnjsjmknzko] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:25 -!- yonkunas [uid403824@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-svkfskaxbmmilcsz] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 15:26 -!- CryptoDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rowalqqsdzperbpp] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:27 < fltrz> at some point its going to be more lucrative to exploit font bugs than try to concoct and convince the community :( 15:28 < fltrz> hell even without money you can substitute lucrative with efficient 15:28 < fltrz> *concoct a way to convince 16:05 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:08 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 16:10 -!- mrdata-- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:22 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:44 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:58 -!- hellleshin [~talinck@cpe-174-103-159-2.cinci.res.rr.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:02 -!- helleshin [~talinck@cpe-174-103-159-2.cinci.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:40 -!- mrdata- [~mrdata@unaffiliated/mrdata] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:06 -!- spaceangel [~spaceange@ip-94-112-205-34.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:27 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:30 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 18:33 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:57 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 19:25 -!- juri_ [~juri@178.63.35.222] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:27 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 19:28 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 19:57 < fltrz> monism dictates that there is no separation between mind and matter, the mind is matter interacting. the brain is a very powerful thing and can fit physical matter (however coefficients etc are stored) to its environment. is it possible that the developing simple brain in different embryos / fetuses of the same organism (say humans) have certain dynamics in common because they are similarly connected to similar developing bodies in similar uterus's, 19:57 < fltrz> in similar mothers doing similar things ? is it finally thus possible that the brain (partially) helps direct embryonic or fetal development in a way that might be overlooked? 20:00 < fltrz> indications to the contrary would be babies born with serious brain defects but otherwise absolutely no defects in say the inner ear etc. indications however that this does happen would be that serious brain defects in newborns essentially always correspond with defects in organs with more direct connection to the brain 20:00 -!- darsie [~kvirc@84-113-55-200.cable.dynamic.surfer.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:02 < fltrz> r/ant out 20:11 < kanzure> .tw https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1050812486226599936 20:11 < saxo> @owillis About half my money is intended to help problems on Earth & half to help establish a self-sustaining city on Mars to ensure continuation of life (of all species) in case Earth gets hit by a meteor like the dinosaurs or WW3 happens & we destroy ourselves (@elonmusk, in reply to tw:1050811017221963776) 20:13 -!- Jayson_Virissimo [~Jayson@ip98-165-142-10.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:14 -!- CryptoDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rowalqqsdzperbpp] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 20:20 -!- Urchin[emacs] [~user@unaffiliated/urchin] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 20:49 -!- filipepe_ [uid362247@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dtzhoxnjsjmknzko] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 20:54 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 21:09 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:33 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 22:04 -!- Urchin[emacs] [~user@unaffiliated/urchin] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:33 < nmz787_> hmm, I wonder if nanoimprint replication of covid antibodies would be a saleable air filter media 22:34 < nmz787_> or like, "solvent free" cleaning wipes 22:35 < lsneff> as in, the antibodies would destroy any covid on the surface/air? 22:36 < nmz787_> or just sop it up 22:36 < nmz787_> do what antibodies do, bind 22:37 < nmz787_> nanoimprint replicas of antibodies have been proved effective for antigen capture decades ago 22:37 < nmz787_> (or at least more than 10 years) 22:37 < lsneff> how do you make the nanoimprints? 22:37 < nmz787_> smash the particles into soft plastic 22:39 < lsneff> wack 22:44 < nmz787_> someone else thought of it https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.28.120709v1 22:44 < nmz787_> .title 22:44 < saxo> “Monoclonal-type” plastic antibodies for SARS-CoV-2 based on Molecularly Imprinted Polymers | bioRxiv 22:48 < nmz787_> I was thinking roll 2 roll printing press style, but maybe you wouldn't be able to get enough surface area, for a cheap enough price 22:48 < nmz787_> I guess air filters are probably made of filament, not sheeting 23:01 -!- Jayson_Virissimo [~Jayson@ip98-165-142-10.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [] 23:06 < lsneff> Well, I just coded myself into a corner. I'm converting between a waveform dump format and a custom format that can be used to query and visualize the waveform and, during the conversion, it reads from an mmapped file with basically random access and tanks performance. 23:20 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 23:20 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:21 -!- HumanG33k [~HumanG33k@82-64-99-84.subs.proxad.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 23:31 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has joined ##hplusroadmap 23:50 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::2] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:55 -!- apotheon [~apotheon@copyfree/founder/apotheon] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:56 -!- apotheon [~apotheon@copyfree/founder/apotheon] has joined ##hplusroadmap --- Log closed Fri Jan 08 00:00:09 2021