--- Log opened Sat Feb 19 00:00:03 2022
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07:12 < kanzure> speaking of giant lasers https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ei_GZnrr1nw
07:14 < kanzure> oh it's not a laser?
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08:20 < lsneff> Anyone know the context for this? https://mobile.twitter.com/leecronin/status/1495052137964916736
08:20 < lsneff> .t
08:20 < saxo> For the last decade people have been telling me the digitization of chemistry was impossible. They said it was too complicated, sensitive and expensive. Our chemical programming langauge runs on cheap hardware and can make any molecule or material. #chemputation https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FL98nl0WUAQ1Xf_.jpg (@leecronin)
09:45 < fenn> trying out some rotting edge software...
09:45 < fenn> superkuh have you found a good system for making twitter look like RSS that still works?
09:46 < fenn> superkuh: btw your blog's RSS doesn't work, and it points to 127.0.0.1
09:49 < superkuh> Only in RSS readers that use the tag.
09:49 < superkuh> Within the tag the tag is correct.
09:49 < superkuh> I guess some readers must only parse one?
09:50 < superkuh> fenn, nitter mirrors are the way to get RSS feeds these days.
09:50 < superkuh> I haven't run my own scripts in years.
09:50 < fenn> ok that sounds easy enough
09:53 < fenn> hmm, except it doesn't actually work
09:53 < superkuh> Fixed the rss generation. Thanks.
09:54 < fenn> ah i guess some nitter mirrors havent implemented RSS and instead of a proper error give "user not found"
09:58 < heath> https://github.com/zedeus/nitter/wiki/Instances
09:59 < superkuh> nitter.pussthecat.org has been pretty reliable.
10:03 < fenn> with blogspot i can usually get the 500 most recent blog posts as RSS. is this what should typically be expected?
10:05 < fenn> i'm not sure whether i'm doing something wrong, some software is misconfigured on your or my end, or you are only publishing the last post because RSS is only supposed to show "news" as in "recently published things" not "everything ever in a non-sucky data format"
10:05 < fenn> the latter is what i really want
10:08 < fenn> looks like a software bug on my end (quiteRSS)
10:09 < superkuh> The RSS feed is made of whatever files matching a name pattern have been modified in the last month or two.
10:11 < superkuh> It is not meant to give you a list of every post ever. That's on the blog index as a link.
10:11 < fenn> a few minutes ago blog/rss.xml had a bunch of entries like
10:11 < fenn> was that a mistake?
10:12 < superkuh> Could be an unintended consequence of changing from 127.0.0.1 to superkuh.com.
10:12 < superkuh> All my stuff is very hacky. This actually is just a perl script that takes out an unordered list I already generate for "recent files".
10:13 < superkuh> There should never be relative urls though.
10:14 < fenn> ok i am just being confused because i haven't really messed with rss before
10:14 < superkuh> I use QuiteRSS (0.18.12) too. It looks fine to me. But who knows...
10:15 < fenn> it seems like if i had kept this feed reader running for the past 5 years i'd have a copy of every post in its database, but since i didn't do that i can't go back and get the posts and stuff them into it now
10:15 < superkuh> Right. But there's this link for that, http://superkuh.com/blog/recent31337.html
10:15 < superkuh> I guess I could run the rssgen script against this one too to make an all posts rss feed.
10:15 < fenn> how do i use that with an rss reader?
10:16 < fenn> do i have to add some xml header and footers?
10:16 < superkuh> I use someone elses code in the form of the perl module XML::RSS::SimpleGen; http://superkuh.com/rssgen.pl.txt
10:17 < superkuh> Er, wrong one.
10:17 < superkuh> But you get the idea.
10:20 < superkuh> http://superkuh.com/rss-all.xml
10:20 < superkuh> There. That should update from now on too.
10:28 < fenn> thanks! i had almost made my own but recent31337.html changed spontaneously while i was hacking on the perl
10:34 < fenn> hm well it still doesnt really do what i want
10:36 < fenn> that's because your blog has a weird page format tho, no individual posts
10:37 < fenn> i thought "For sure the RSS evangelist superkuh would be the perfect target upon which to test out this unfamiliar software" - ha ha! murphy strikes again!
10:38 * fenn gives up procrastinating and attempts to do $productive_activity instead
10:40 < superkuh> Eh, I guess I could change the regex in the blogrssgen-all.pl to take the second individual page link in the [].
10:46 < fenn> oh there are individual post pages after all
10:46 < superkuh> Just gotta get this regex right...
10:50 < kanzure> soooo CPAN is still around?
10:51 < fenn> the problem is that the recentXXX.html makes links pointing to blog.html instead of the individual posts
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10:55 < superkuh> For every year, yeah.
11:16 < superkuh> Okay. Finally fixed.
11:22 < fenn> superkuh: works better with pub dates. almost unbelievably i dont think the perl module can generate that field http://fennetic.net/irc/superkuh_rss.xml
11:23 < fenn> so i hammered it into place with vim
11:25 < fenn> :%s/Test: \(\d\d\d\d-\d\d-\d\d\)-\d<\/description>/\1<\/pubDate>/
11:26 < fenn> i forget how to use perl
11:26 < fenn> mangling text this way is what it's good for right?
11:28 < fenn> so, yeah. i realize your blog is a pile of stuff hacked together over decades, so i dont expect everything to be perfect
11:30 < fenn> for a long time now i've wanted a way to strip out all the garbage and nav bars and ads and filler and visual-breaking CSS and stupid divs with image backgrounds, and just show the content in a regularized user interface, which ideally is a desktop application. it seems like RSS is an existing format for representing the content and the presentation layer works well enough, so it's just a matter
11:30 < fenn> of programmatically converting existing sites into RSS if they haven't been already
11:31 < fenn> but the "simple matter of programming" is too much of a job for one person to handle, even if converting each site is individually a mostly straightforward task
11:32 < fenn> there have been some academic attempts at "content extraction" (that's the keyword phrase you have to search for to find the relevant literature) but they never seem to actually lead to any sizable databases of downloadable content
11:33 < fenn> i want what happened with gopher in the bad old days to happen again. people "stealing" or "liberating" the content from its jail and redistributing over a regularized back end. i mean it's not even very much data to distribute, a few paragraphs of text and some dates
11:35 < fenn> https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2020/02/gopher-when-adversarial-interoperability-burrowed-under-gatekeepers-fortresses
11:36 < fenn> there are a lot of "entrepreneurs" doing automated scraping for dubious business purposes, but very few first-person users who want the content for themselves
11:36 < fenn> ... doing automated scraping
11:36 < fenn> unfortunately the former make life hell for people like myself who aren't running chrome-9000
11:37 < fenn> why would you categorically ban "dillo" as a user agent? it's insane
11:38 < fenn> the only explanation i can come up with is that some misbehaving robot was using it, and somehow the string made it onto a blacklist that is being circulated around various web admin mailing lists
11:45 < fenn> "Adversarial Interoperability. The pre-Gopher information landscape was dominated by companies, departments, and individuals who were disinterested in giving users control over their own computing experience ... Rather than pursuing an argument with these self-appointed Lords of Computing, the Gopher team simply went around them, interconnecting to their services without asking for permission.
11:45 < fenn> They didn't take data they weren't supposed to haveābut they did make it much easier for the services' nominal users to actually access them."
11:48 < fenn> however RSS "readers" are by definition read-only, and can't compete with the likes of tweetdeck on the social networks
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14:19 < muurkha> .t https://birdsite.xanny.family/V_Saggiomo/status/1495144392306434052#m
14:19 < saxo> Vittorio Saggiomo (@V_Saggiomo): 'It's 4 years after the Science chemputer paper, and still absolutely no info / BOM / instructions on how to reproduce one......' | Birdsite
14:19 < fenn> psh you expected CAD drawings? from academia?
14:20 < fenn> code? what you mean by "reproducibility"?
14:20 < muurkha> BOMs are standard in methods sections of chemistry papers
14:22 < fenn> supposedly general purpose reaction modeling software and databases have been secretly restricted by intelligence agencies, because it's actually super simple to make highly lethal substances (i.e. nerve gas) from commonly available chemicals, and it would be impossible to put the genie back in the bottle
14:25 < nmz787_> fenn: hmm, that makes sense
14:26 < nmz787_> I remember that vinegar thieves guy, at biohacktheplanet, who said they were using some reverse-synthesis stuff for their medical drug open-source thing
14:26 < nmz787_> but that it was a closed-source database/software, or something
14:26 < nmz787_> I can't remember exactly
14:27 < nmz787_> something something "scanning patents and academic papers for reaction pathways... AI, ML, blah blah"
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14:31 < fenn> the four thieves vinegar guy is a poser
14:32 < fenn> all ted talk and no substance
14:33 < fenn> maybe he could have collaborated with some real chemists, but i bet his anarchist zine style turned a lot of potential participants off
14:33 < fenn> and like, if you don't have anything, that's fine, but don't say you do have a thing when you don't
14:34 < fenn> i'd love it if the world had an anarchist zine chemical synthesis database, or whatever
14:34 < fenn> the real anarchist's cookbook, not a joke
14:35 < fenn> so many political radicals reject the entirety of science and systems, and end up shooting themselves in the foot because of it
14:36 < fenn> systems are used because they work, and things that work survive and persist
14:37 < fenn> a total rejection of systems means your implicit and illegible system will just end up being subverted by a parasitic system, because it hasn't been examined for flaws and vulnerabilities
14:37 < fenn> .g tyranny of structurelessness
14:37 < saxo> https://www.jofreeman.com/joreen/tyranny.htm
14:39 < fenn> i think there was a more succinct and direct version of this article
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14:48 < fenn> 'informal elites have been hiding under the banner of "anti-elitism" and "structurelessness." To effectively counter the competition from another informal structure, they would have to become "public," and this possibility is fraught with many dangerous implications. Thus, to maintain its own power, it is easier to rationalize the exclusion of the members of the other informal structure'
14:49 < fenn> (the rival/usurper informal structure)
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15:51 < kanzure> fenn: there used to be a reader mode software thing for browsers. i forget the name. google turned the concept into google amp viewer.
15:55 < kanzure> nsh might know the name of these.
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16:37 < nsh> it used to be a little book icon in the address bar in firefox but i don't see it anymore
16:37 < nsh> still available as extension but perhaps deprecated from the browser itself
16:38 < nsh> just a pretty basic restyling but was good for bypassing user-hostility often
16:38 < kanzure> what was it called though? threadless? threadform?
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16:39 < kanzure> 'reader viewer'
16:40 < nsh> the latter
16:40 < nsh> perhaps it depends on the page
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16:41 < nsh> yeah the icon changed too but i see it here: https://techdows.com/2020/05/this-is-firefoxs-redesigned-reader-mode.html
16:41 < nsh> https://i.imgur.com/PjsLbvo.png
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--- Log closed Sun Feb 20 00:00:04 2022