| --- Day changed Mon Apr 07 2008 | ||
| kanzure | so "what's built in" will have to be a way to specify dependencies or relations to other packages, I guess | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| kanzure | at some point we are going to have to restrict the possible types of relations between entities or functions or processes | 00:01 |
| kanzure | "depends on" "requires for execution" "is a child of" | 00:01 |
| fenn | i was thinking GNU 'units' would be a good set of functionality to start | 00:01 |
| kanzure | what are GNU units? | 00:01 |
| fenn | its a software program for converting between different units | 00:01 |
| fenn | like foot, meter, inch, micron | 00:02 |
| kanzure | http://www.gnu.org/software/units/ | 00:02 |
| kanzure | ah | 00:02 |
| kanzure | no, I was thinking of the package file format standards | 00:02 |
| kanzure | but I suppose you are to | 00:02 |
| kanzure | so, the package deals with some sort of 'units' | 00:02 |
| kanzure | it has to be able to specify this for input/output | 00:02 |
| kanzure | specifying both a relation between pckg X and pckg Y while also speccing out the unit conversions | 00:03 |
| kanzure | is intense. | 00:03 |
| fenn | how else do you do it without simply specifying requires: package Y | 00:04 |
| kanzure | because there are different types of 'requirements' | 00:04 |
| kanzure | you can have a requirement for compiling the package and understanding it | 00:04 |
| kanzure | you can have a requirement for the final physical form | 00:04 |
| kanzure | just like a person-on-a-chair system requires the chair under the person | 00:05 |
| fenn | compiling? you mean building? | 00:05 |
| kanzure | nah, I mean preprocessing | 00:05 |
| fenn | i dont understand | 00:05 |
| kanzure | well, putting together a project usually means you're going to do some simulations first | 00:05 |
| fenn | are you talking about software or chunks of metal? | 00:05 |
| kanzure | or at least a verify-check | 00:05 |
| kanzure | both, since you have software on autogenix that represents the metal that you are placing together | 00:05 |
| kanzure | and then you have different types of 'require'ments in the final metal chunks you're putting together | 00:06 |
| kanzure | there are many types of 'require' | 00:06 |
| fenn | i'm gonna go out on a limb and say that software requirements are so easy to meet that we can ignore that for now | 00:06 |
| kanzure | huh? you can't ignore that in a specification | 00:06 |
| kanzure | that was the whole point of having a specification heh | 00:06 |
| kanzure | can you convince me of otherwise | 00:07 |
| fenn | package X has specifications in "quantum bogosity units" provided by libbogo | 00:08 |
| fenn | so when you have something which depends on bogosity (such as X) autogenix will consult libbogo. if the library is not installed it will be fetched by <insert software package manager here> | 00:09 |
| fenn | joe cell device: conflicts: bogons > 1.2 nanosuits | 00:10 |
| kanzure | package X will have to specify dependency on bogosity | 00:10 |
| kanzure | now, package X can also depend on package Y | 00:11 |
| kanzure | although is it really a package if it depends on other things? | 00:11 |
| kanzure | hrm | 00:11 |
| fenn | package X itself doesnt need bogosity, you just need bogosity code to interpret the specifications | 00:11 |
| kanzure | sure | 00:11 |
| fenn | that's implied from the way specs are structured | 00:12 |
| kanzure | you mean the physical implementation of package X, the final form, does not require bogosity | 00:12 |
| kanzure | bogosity is backend, i.e. preprocessing | 00:12 |
| fenn | i guess it could look like PHB side-effect: bogosity::bogons 1 suit | 00:13 |
| fenn | bogosity:: is the package | 00:13 |
| fenn | er.. | 00:14 |
| fenn | bogosity:: is the code module | 00:14 |
| fenn | bogons is the unit type | 00:14 |
| fenn | suit is the unit | 00:14 |
| fenn | PHB is the package, which provides other functionality such as 'management' | 00:14 |
| kanzure | this is feeling more and more like the CPAN perl modules ... the perl modules for CPAN are uploaded in a wiki-like format, but with code as well, which is then downloaded. The code itself provides library | 00:15 |
| kanzure | functions. But in our case, the script would be the entire package, and would have various inputs and a standardized way of accessing the features and querying whatever it is that the package implements. | 00:15 |
| kanzure | hm | 00:15 |
| kanzure | I thought you were making a humorous remark: "PHB side-effect - they need 1 suit" with the rise of PHBs, but anyway | 00:15 |
| fenn | now maybe sometimes you do need software in order to build something, such as for example cad/cam files to run the cnc machine | 00:15 |
| kanzure | right | 00:15 |
| kanzure | I think it will always be the case | 00:16 |
| kanzure | suppose the case of a chair | 00:16 |
| kanzure | a chair-package can manage all of the various ways to specify the chair | 00:16 |
| kanzure | and have all sorts of fun parameters | 00:16 |
| kanzure | actually | 00:16 |
| kanzure | a chair would be a virtual reference to a set of operations to make a chair with other packages | 00:16 |
| fenn | pointy-haired-boss raises the local bogosity field | 00:16 |
| kanzure | such as lathes ands oon | 00:16 |
| kanzure | aha | 00:16 |
| fenn | sorry i couldnt think of a specialized unit | 00:17 |
| fenn | bogons might be useful anyway | 00:17 |
| fenn | er, the concept i mean | 00:17 |
| fenn | i guess you could have anti-bogons | 00:17 |
| fenn | "chair" could be an alias | 00:18 |
| fenn | or it could be a functionality provided by different models of chair | 00:19 |
| fenn | then autogenix solves which model of chair to use based on the constraints | 00:19 |
| kanzure | well, chair is really just an object formed by specific lathe motions and wood inputs | 00:19 |
| mechie | . | 00:19 |
| mechie | hahahahahahaha | 00:19 |
| kanzure | so chair itself should be a very small file, just stuff based off of human specs on movement | 00:19 |
| fenn | well, when you write the chair module you get to figure this stuff out | 00:20 |
| fenn | ejector seat provides chair, and also some other functions :) | 00:20 |
| fenn | also there's some parameter relating to how comfortable the chair is in newton*hours/dolor | 00:21 |
| fenn | a rock is a chair, for some low value of comfort | 00:22 |
| kanzure | so maybe we should just write down everything we can think about of a certain object or package that we envision | 00:23 |
| fenn | gnu units allows arbitrary unit definitions if you provide your own definition file | 00:23 |
| kanzure | and then revise it until it fits for a general case | 00:23 |
| kanzure | interesting | 00:23 |
| kanzure | that's good | 00:23 |
| fenn | i think specialized units should be based on functionality | 00:24 |
| fenn | whereas built-in should be physical properties | 00:24 |
| kanzure | it just seems like this is relying on a TOE | 00:25 |
| kanzure | sigh | 00:25 |
| fenn | there's only so many physical properties | 00:25 |
| kanzure | hey, what if we go steal file formats from other projects | 00:25 |
| kanzure | SBML for systems biology | 00:25 |
| kanzure | CAD for cad stuff | 00:25 |
| kanzure | and uhh, molecular biology has their own file format I believe | 00:25 |
| fenn | sure, that's part of the package's source code | 00:25 |
| kanzure | chemistry for their molecules (SMILES and so on) | 00:25 |
| fenn | i'm just talking about the "control" file, which determines logical relationships between packages | 00:26 |
| kanzure | hm | 00:26 |
| fenn | i guess you could look at the special-format data while traversing the dependency tree, but it might get really hairy (and slow) | 00:27 |
| fenn | obviously you can't compute everything from first principles | 00:27 |
| kanzure | yes, I was thinking we have to draw a line somewher | 00:27 |
| kanzure | *somewhere | 00:27 |
| kanzure | where engineering becomes a practice of "well, it's good enough" instead of "this will absolutely, in every aspect, work" | 00:28 |
| fenn | capability of becoming a TOE is better than being limited by arbitrary decisions in the beginning | 00:29 |
| fenn | doesnt mean you have to support everything | 00:29 |
| kanzure | true | 00:29 |
| kanzure | just being extensible enough | 00:29 |
| kanzure | so that our awkward thoughts here don't hinder us in the future | 00:29 |
| kanzure | I was thinking I need to go find a software engineer or computer scientist bulldog | 00:29 |
| kanzure | and bring him in here to help come up with some rocksolid specs | 00:30 |
| kanzure | I need some sleep, however | 00:30 |
| kanzure | g'night | 00:30 |
| fenn | the oscomak specs looked pretty bad | 00:30 |
| fenn | me too, night | 00:30 |
| kanzure | specs? | 00:30 |
| kanzure | I didn't see anything | 00:30 |
| fenn | their 'aluminum bolt' | 00:30 |
| kanzure | hm | 00:30 |
| fenn | http://kurtz-fernhout.com/oscomak/prototype.htm | 00:31 |
| kanzure | eh | 00:32 |
| -!- kanzure [n=bryan@cpe-70-113-54-112.austin.res.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving."] | 00:33 | |
| fenn | mechie: yndrome, persons with NT or persons who have NT. Though it seems that most persons with NT would prefer to be referred to as neurotypicals, NTs or even normals, nobody cares about their opinions; after all, they are seriously ill, and clearly do not know what is best for them. | 00:33 |
| mechie | ? | 00:34 |
| -!- Aulere [n=dragon_d@131.229.176.252] has quit [] | 00:43 | |
| mechie | i'm confused :D | 00:44 |
| fenn | http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Neurotypical_syndrome | 00:44 |
| mechie | thought you were talking about myers briggs NT | 00:45 |
| mechie | and? | 00:46 |
| mechie | :) | 00:46 |
| mechie | awefully quiet | 00:48 |
| mechie | awfully | 00:48 |
| * epitron stands in awe of the silence | 01:02 | |
| mechie | i'm laying on the couch | 01:02 |
| epitron | Enki-2: hey dood... i haven't heard much from you in here | 01:03 |
| epitron | are you not into the biotech stuff as much as these two? | 01:03 |
| mechie | probably cuz someone hereeeeeee | 01:03 |
| mechie | is probably really mean | 01:03 |
| mechie | :D | 01:03 |
| epitron | Enki-2: kanzure told me that you were interested in collaborative information systems and that kinda thing | 01:04 |
| epitron | mechie: it's ok we're just lowly NT's | 01:04 |
| epitron | we deserve it | 01:04 |
| mechie | haha | 01:04 |
| epitron | :D | 01:04 |
| mechie | sure sure :D | 01:05 |
| * mechie puts on imagineer helmet | 01:05 | |
| epitron | LESSER BEINGS MUST PAY FOR THEIR INFERIORITY | 01:05 |
| epitron | TORTURRREEE | 01:05 |
| mechie | because i don't speak in technical jibber jabber? | 01:05 |
| mechie | :D | 01:05 |
| epitron | (we've never forgiven rats for the bubonic plague) | 01:05 |
| mechie | rats are awesome | 01:05 |
| epitron | wha? you must've picked up some jabber | 01:05 |
| mechie | but not the jibber | 01:06 |
| epitron | ahh | 01:06 |
| epitron | does that mean you can read it, but not speak it? | 01:06 |
| mechie | yes | 01:06 |
| mechie | same with chinese | 01:06 |
| epitron | *nodnod* | 01:06 |
| mechie | people can talk to me but i can't talk back | 01:06 |
| epitron | MAN i'm so happy | 01:06 |
| epitron | I HAVE A DIGITAL WATCH! | 01:06 |
| mechie | xtc? | 01:06 |
| mechie | haha | 01:06 |
| epitron | with seconds! | 01:06 |
| mechie | OH MAN THAT IS SO HIGH TECH | 01:06 |
| epitron | it's so awesome | 01:06 |
| epitron | it's one of the oldschool ones with 3 buttons | 01:06 |
| mechie | i went back to cave men time | 01:07 |
| epitron | MODe, LIGHT, and START/STOP | 01:07 |
| epitron | CASIO | 01:07 |
| mechie | i'm not even wearing a watch | 01:07 |
| mechie | I JUST LOOK AT THE SKY AND GO LIKE | 01:07 |
| mechie | "it's 6 o clock" | 01:07 |
| mechie | XD | 01:07 |
| epitron | wow | 01:07 |
| mechie | hahaha | 01:07 |
| epitron | what if it's overcast? | 01:07 |
| mechie | oh | 01:07 |
| mechie | then it's sleepy time | 01:07 |
| epitron | i like your philosophy | 01:07 |
| mechie | or you can tell what time it is by traffic | 01:08 |
| epitron | please send me some literature | 01:08 |
| mechie | haha | 01:08 |
| epitron | i'm reading a review of karl popper's "the open society and its enemies" | 01:09 |
| epitron | it's called "the open society and its ambivalent friends" | 01:10 |
| mechie | orly | 01:11 |
| mechie | where | 01:11 |
| epitron | books.google.com | 01:18 |
| epitron | it's a book of essays called "the primacy of persons and the language of culture" | 01:18 |
| epitron | i dunno if it's got anything useful in it or not :) | 01:18 |
| epitron | "These essays diagnose the present situation of Western thought by making explicit the philosophical presuppositions to which it is committed. They include theological affirmations, reflections on epistemology, conceptual.." | 01:19 |
| mechie | so... is it rather dry so far | 01:21 |
| epitron | hell yes | 01:22 |
| mechie | gj | 01:22 |
| epitron | i'm having trouble converting it into english :) | 01:22 |
| mechie | good thing you're reading it | 01:22 |
| epitron | "But just because it is a tract as well as a scholarly and analytical exercise, The Open Society becomes of interest in and must be responsible to a public much larger than that which, e.g., Popper's exegesis of Plato, will be debated in tome and journal." | 01:22 |
| epitron | what the fuck is he saying | 01:22 |
| mechie | it means... it's not important :D just fluff ! | 01:23 |
| epitron | i think he's saying that the public will read it | 01:23 |
| mechie | it sounds like... tax law | 01:23 |
| epitron | hahah | 01:23 |
| mechie | which 99.9% of the nation understands | 01:24 |
| mechie | oops | 01:24 |
| mechie | doesn't | 01:24 |
| epitron | same difference | 01:24 |
| mechie | i hate reading tax :\ | 01:24 |
| epitron | i've never had that rite of passage | 01:24 |
| epitron | i just use tax software | 01:24 |
| mechie | i read this stuff at work | 01:24 |
| mechie | it's awful | 01:24 |
| epitron | ahh | 01:24 |
| mechie | and i have to translate it into my reports | 01:25 |
| mechie | but with numbers | 01:25 |
| epitron | hahah | 01:25 |
| epitron | so part of your job is translating tax laws? | 01:25 |
| mechie | no | 01:25 |
| mechie | no one else wants to do it | 01:25 |
| mechie | so they dump it on the intern | 01:25 |
| mechie | hahahaha | 01:25 |
| epitron | gotcha | 01:25 |
| mechie | there's only 1 MAN in the company who understands all of it | 01:26 |
| mechie | i like him because he's sarcastic :D | 01:26 |
| epitron | oh man | 01:26 |
| epitron | you gotta have a sense of humour if you understand the tax code :) | 01:26 |
| mechie | yeah | 01:26 |
| epitron | this review hasn't yet talked about any of popper's ideas | 01:27 |
| mechie | is he just talking about why you should read it? | 01:28 |
| epitron | he's just talking about people who like or dislike or read his book or don't read his book or comparing him to don quixote | 01:28 |
| mechie | ahhh ok | 01:29 |
| epitron | this guy sounds like one of those people who are very eloquent speakers, and like to hear themselves talk | 01:29 |
| epitron | and say nothing | 01:29 |
| epitron | :) | 01:29 |
| mechie | *AHME* | 01:29 |
| mechie | AHEM* | 01:29 |
| mechie | i can think of a feewwwww. | 01:29 |
| epitron | you don't mean... | 01:29 |
| epitron | o_O | 01:29 |
| mechie | O_o OH DO I | 01:30 |
| epitron | snap to the ap | 01:30 |
| mechie | @_@ DUN DUN DUN!!!!!! | 01:30 |
| epitron | OH! speaking of snap | 01:30 |
| mechie | oh yes | 01:30 |
| epitron | i saw a cool history channel program | 01:30 |
| mechie | i should reattach zoner's leg. | 01:30 |
| epitron | it was a re-enactment of cicero's famous court case that made him a powerful man | 01:30 |
| epitron | where he bitchslaps this other powerful dood who stole a bunch of farms | 01:31 |
| epitron | it's so awesome | 01:31 |
| epitron | it's like matlock times 100 | 01:31 |
| mechie | haha | 01:31 |
| epitron | law and order times 50 | 01:31 |
| mechie | the last thing i watched on history channel was the dogfights | 01:31 |
| mechie | :< | 01:31 |
| mechie | not the animal dogs. | 01:31 |
| epitron | I ask you... QUI BONO! | 01:31 |
| mechie | the airplanes | 01:31 |
| epitron | oh, i don't watch the channel | 01:31 |
| mechie | oh | 01:32 |
| epitron | i just download stuff from the documentary torrent sites | 01:32 |
| epitron | anything that looks interesting | 01:32 |
| mechie | oh i'm trying to slow down on that :( | 01:32 |
| epitron | it's usually not very good though :) | 01:32 |
| mechie | i just rather leave it on tv | 01:32 |
| mechie | but i haven't been able to watch anything lateley | 01:32 |
| epitron | so you don't have to organize it? | 01:32 |
| mechie | -e | 01:32 |
| mechie | well maybe :> | 01:32 |
| mechie | i don't mind d/l anime though | 01:32 |
| mechie | but movies and w/e are iffy | 01:33 |
| mechie | unless they're chinese movies | 01:33 |
| epitron | it all depends on what's important to you | 01:33 |
| epitron | apparently western TV is not worth the trouble :) | 01:33 |
| mechie | ah ok | 01:33 |
| mechie | i miss my documentaries though -_- | 01:33 |
| mechie | i miss those open surgery docs | 01:33 |
| mechie | :D | 01:33 |
| epitron | mvgroup.org | 01:33 |
| epitron | :D | 01:33 |
| epitron | hahah | 01:33 |
| mechie | reality shows w/e | 01:33 |
| epitron | live organs are so funky | 01:33 |
| mechie | i knooowwwwwww | 01:34 |
| epitron | all squirmy and gooey | 01:34 |
| mechie | killing animals and then opening up are also funky | 01:34 |
| * mechie coughs | 01:34 | |
| epitron | have you done that? | 01:34 |
| mechie | everyone in pharmacy has | 01:34 |
| epitron | interesting | 01:34 |
| epitron | i've only ever cut open cold formaldehyde-soaked things | 01:35 |
| mechie | poison the rats | 01:35 |
| epitron | haha | 01:35 |
| epitron | we'll never forgive the rats! | 01:35 |
| mechie | hahah yeah | 01:35 |
| mechie | but i don't know why | 01:35 |
| mechie | i liked gorey things back then | 01:35 |
| mechie | which made me want to be a surgeon -ish person | 01:36 |
| mechie | which also led me to surf your damn stileproject site | 01:36 |
| epitron | hey that's not my site | 01:36 |
| mechie | ok ok ok | 01:36 |
| epitron | i just contributed jokes | 01:36 |
| mechie | fine! | 01:36 |
| epitron | or rather | 01:36 |
| epitron | i just made jokes on irc | 01:36 |
| epitron | and stile stole them | 01:36 |
| mechie | haha | 01:36 |
| epitron | and put his name on them | 01:36 |
| mechie | nice | 01:37 |
| epitron | :D | 01:37 |
| mechie | hey | 01:38 |
| mechie | did you ever frame your metablolic pathway poster | 01:39 |
| epitron | no, i don't have a big enough wall :) | 01:39 |
| mechie | neither do i :D | 01:39 |
| epitron | haha | 01:39 |
| mechie | except in my living room | 01:39 |
| epitron | i could do the ceiling in my room | 01:39 |
| mechie | but my bro would kill me | 01:39 |
| mechie | but the diagrams are so small | 01:39 |
| mechie | :\ | 01:39 |
| epitron | doesn't he already kill you? | 01:40 |
| mechie | well yes | 01:40 |
| epitron | you moving out soon? :) | 01:40 |
| epitron | i think i am. | 01:40 |
| mechie | i told my mom | 01:40 |
| mechie | when i graduate | 01:40 |
| mechie | she seems fine with it because she knows my bro is an asshole | 01:40 |
| mechie | arrogany | 01:40 |
| mechie | arrogant | 01:40 |
| mechie | asshole | 01:40 |
| mechie | THE ONES WHO THINK THEY KNOW A LOT (well they do) BUT ARE SO FRUSTRATED THAT THEY TAKE IT OUT ON YOU | 01:41 |
| epitron | your bro sounded more like he was pushing himself really hard | 01:41 |
| epitron | and he'd project his feelings of inadequacy on you | 01:41 |
| epitron | there was a perfect example that you told me about | 01:41 |
| mechie | well he was kind of chicken | 01:42 |
| epitron | right | 01:42 |
| mechie | i didn't know he was so scared of people | 01:42 |
| epitron | what did he do again? | 01:42 |
| mechie | oh trying to go on interviews to find a new job | 01:42 |
| mechie | he was too chicken to go on them | 01:42 |
| mechie | he didn't like feeling dumb | 01:42 |
| mechie | so he stayed at his current place because it's safe | 01:43 |
| mechie | but then he projected all the anger on me | 01:43 |
| epitron | and what did he say to you? | 01:43 |
| mechie | telling me i'm lazy | 01:43 |
| mechie | and i have no initiative | 01:43 |
| mechie | and that i need a job | 01:43 |
| mechie | and nagged me every day to apply to jobs and go on interviews | 01:43 |
| epitron | hahah | 01:43 |
| mechie | and lectured me on how i'm bad w/ communicating with people | 01:43 |
| mechie | and that i'm so scared | 01:43 |
| mechie | (i was confused) | 01:44 |
| epitron | haahahahahahahahh | 01:44 |
| epitron | oh! i'm reading an awesome book that you shoudl check out | 01:44 |
| epitron | it's all about weird dysfunctional family dynamics | 01:44 |
| epitron | and optimal family dynamics | 01:44 |
| mechie | will it make me not feel depressed | 01:44 |
| epitron | and one of the authors is john cleese | 01:44 |
| mechie | hahah cleese | 01:44 |
| mechie | <3 | 01:44 |
| epitron | the idea i wanna tell you about is complicated | 01:45 |
| mechie | ok | 01:45 |
| epitron | it took them about 30 pages to lay it out | 01:45 |
| mechie | describe it with ascii | 01:45 |
| epitron | so just read the book | 01:45 |
| mechie | haha | 01:45 |
| epitron | it's called "Life and how to survive it" | 01:45 |
| mechie | oh yeah aren't you an older brother | 01:45 |
| epitron | yep | 01:45 |
| mechie | are you an asshole | 01:45 |
| mechie | :D | 01:45 |
| epitron | hmmm | 01:45 |
| epitron | sometimes | 01:45 |
| mechie | it's ok :> | 01:46 |
| epitron | we have a different dynamic though | 01:46 |
| epitron | i just like to be right :) | 01:46 |
| epitron | and so does he | 01:46 |
| epitron | so we argue | 01:46 |
| mechie | yeah me too | 01:46 |
| epitron | and one of his friends pointed out that we were BOTH right | 01:46 |
| epitron | and arguing different aspects of the same thing | 01:46 |
| epitron | we were arguing over interpretation or something | 01:46 |
| mechie | ahh | 01:46 |
| epitron | haha | 01:46 |
| mechie | i don't think my bro and i fight over interpretation that much | 01:46 |
| epitron | it's funny... | 01:46 |
| mechie | we think alike pretty much | 01:47 |
| epitron | you stop listening to the content of what someoen is saying, and just listen to their tone of voice | 01:47 |
| epitron | you think they're accusing you of something | 01:47 |
| mechie | yup | 01:47 |
| epitron | but they're not | 01:47 |
| mechie | I AM JUST DEAF. | 01:47 |
| epitron | anyhow, generally my bro and i get along :) | 01:47 |
| mechie | SORRY. | 01:47 |
| epitron | i always like when he comes back to visit | 01:47 |
| mechie | in your basement? | 01:48 |
| mechie | :D | 01:48 |
| mechie | my cousin is in my basement | 01:48 |
| epitron | yeah :D | 01:48 |
| mechie | :D | 01:48 |
| epitron | i'm living in his old pad right now | 01:48 |
| epitron | he set it up really nice | 01:48 |
| mechie | ahhh gamer? | 01:48 |
| epitron | when he moved to calgary, i just moved in | 01:48 |
| epitron | yep | 01:48 |
| mechie | nice | 01:48 |
| mechie | my house = all gamers | 01:48 |
| epitron | when you turn off the lights, there's 500 led's | 01:48 |
| mechie | rofl | 01:48 |
| mechie | how do you sleep | 01:48 |
| epitron | in another room :D | 01:48 |
| mechie | :D | 01:48 |
| epitron | there's 2 rooms down here | 01:49 |
| mechie | rich! | 01:49 |
| epitron | more like SPACE EFFICIENT | 01:49 |
| mechie | liessssssssssssssssssss | 01:49 |
| mechie | man i have so much crap | 01:49 |
| mechie | electronics + tools + plants + baby grand piano | 01:49 |
| epitron | haha | 01:50 |
| mechie | i wonder how i'd move all of this | 01:50 |
| mechie | oh yeah wtf do i do w/ lumber | 01:50 |
| epitron | do you ever wish for a giant house so you can setup a special room for every interest? | 01:50 |
| mechie | which makes me rethink the whole apartment thing | 01:50 |
| mechie | yes | 01:50 |
| mechie | YES | 01:50 |
| mechie | YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS | 01:50 |
| mechie | all the time | 01:50 |
| epitron | me too :D | 01:50 |
| mechie | :D | 01:50 |
| epitron | i also want a room that's full of tropical plants | 01:50 |
| mechie | i'd need a special room just for drying lumber | 01:50 |
| mechie | omg i always wanted a conservatory | 01:51 |
| epitron | a small indoor rainforest | 01:51 |
| mechie | and study plants | 01:51 |
| epitron | drying lumber? | 01:51 |
| mechie | yeah | 01:51 |
| mechie | you have to dry out your lumber before you use it | 01:51 |
| epitron | but don't you do that in a shed or something? | 01:51 |
| mechie | otherwise when warps | 01:51 |
| mechie | well suureeeeeeeee | 01:51 |
| mechie | :< | 01:51 |
| mechie | if you have one :< | 01:51 |
| * mechie builds one | 01:52 | |
| mechie | ok now i do | 01:52 |
| epitron | OK FINE you can have a lumber room | 01:52 |
| mechie | NO IT"S OK I JUST MADE ONE IT IS FINE | 01:52 |
| epitron | you got a bit of a paradox | 01:52 |
| mechie | i know | 01:52 |
| mechie | it's going to warp | 01:52 |
| mechie | and collapse | 01:52 |
| epitron | unless | 01:52 |
| epitron | it DRIES ITSELF | 01:52 |
| epitron | O_O | 01:52 |
| mechie | O_O | 01:52 |
| epitron | which brings us back to synthetic biology | 01:52 |
| epitron | and engineering autonomous systems | 01:52 |
| mechie | hahahahah | 01:52 |
| epitron | god i love my new atch | 01:53 |
| mechie | atch? | 01:53 |
| epitron | wuh | 01:53 |
| epitron | wuh | 01:53 |
| epitron | watch! | 01:53 |
| mechie | oh | 01:53 |
| mechie | hahahahah | 01:53 |
| * mechie out of it | 01:53 | |
| epitron | long day? | 01:53 |
| mechie | maybe | 01:54 |
| mechie | feel rather woozy | 01:54 |
| mechie | been feeling tired lately | 01:54 |
| mechie | btw my mom made her own bread starter | 01:55 |
| mechie | she used the word "CULTURE" | 01:55 |
| mechie | oOoOoo :D | 01:55 |
| epitron | haha | 01:56 |
| epitron | naomi was into that | 01:56 |
| mechie | did she use grapes | 01:56 |
| epitron | she liked to show me her little sourdough culture | 01:56 |
| mechie | yeahhhh | 01:56 |
| epitron | no.. | 01:56 |
| epitron | i don't know how she started it | 01:56 |
| epitron | she also makes cashew cheese | 01:56 |
| mechie | what | 01:56 |
| mechie | how | 01:56 |
| epitron | and kimchi | 01:56 |
| epitron | i dunno... | 01:56 |
| mechie | lull kimchi... | 01:57 |
| epitron | there's recipes on the itnernet | 01:57 |
| mechie | my mom is into baking a lot because there's a set recipe to follow | 01:57 |
| mechie | i tend to just skim recipes and play around | 01:57 |
| epitron | yeah | 01:57 |
| epitron | i laughed when you told me about the time she didn't have any chocolate chips | 01:57 |
| mechie | yeah | 01:57 |
| mechie | hahahha | 01:57 |
| epitron | and you were like "PFTTT WHATEVER" *mash up candybar* | 01:57 |
| mechie | I HAVE HO CHIPS | 01:57 |
| mechie | I CANNOT MAKE THIS | 01:57 |
| mechie | WHAT DO I DO | 01:57 |
| mechie | OH NO | 01:58 |
| mechie | mmmmm candy bar cookies | 01:58 |
| epitron | :D | 01:58 |
| epitron | did i tell you that my aunt works for a chocolate company? | 01:58 |
| fenn | you need an automated generalized recipe markup language | 01:58 |
| mechie | i'd send you some but i think customs would get it | 01:58 |
| mechie | which one | 01:58 |
| epitron | effem foods | 01:58 |
| mechie | don't know what that is but continue | 01:58 |
| epitron | they make starburst and skittles and mars and that coconut one | 01:58 |
| mechie | ohhhh ok | 01:59 |
| mechie | Almond Joy? | 01:59 |
| epitron | no.. | 01:59 |
| epitron | mounds? | 01:59 |
| mechie | hmmm | 01:59 |
| mechie | time to ask pookie | 01:59 |
| epitron | haha | 01:59 |
| epitron | i don't wanna bring pookie in here | 01:59 |
| epitron | he'd turn into a scientist | 01:59 |
| mechie | ahh there it is | 01:59 |
| mechie | it is coconut | 01:59 |
| mechie | almond joy is similar but just w/ almonds added | 02:00 |
| epitron | it's actually BOUNTY | 02:00 |
| mechie | oh | 02:00 |
| mechie | AND NOT THE TOWELS | 02:00 |
| epitron | (i have a big bag of candy that she gave me last time i was at her place) | 02:00 |
| epitron | mmmmm | 02:00 |
| epitron | (what towels?) | 02:00 |
| mechie | http://www.candydirect.com/bars/Bounty-Bar.html | 02:01 |
| mechie | oh we have paper towels called Bounty | 02:01 |
| epitron | that's the one | 02:01 |
| epitron | haha | 02:01 |
| epitron | we do as well | 02:01 |
| epitron | there is room for 2 bounties | 02:01 |
| mechie | http://www.quickerpickerupper.com/ | 02:01 |
| mechie | ahhh ok | 02:01 |
| mechie | i've never tried those | 02:02 |
| epitron | they're good | 02:02 |
| mechie | i'm not big into coconut | 02:02 |
| epitron | it's like ... | 02:02 |
| epitron | oh | 02:02 |
| mechie | unless they're coconut cupcakes | 02:02 |
| epitron | well, then you're fucked! :) | 02:02 |
| mechie | is it all coconut :( | 02:02 |
| * epitron <3 coconut | 02:02 | |
| epitron | basically :) | 02:02 |
| mechie | <3 coconut cupcakes | 02:03 |
| epitron | it's a pellet of shredded coconut | 02:03 |
| epitron | with about a 2mm coating of chocolate | 02:03 |
| epitron | there are 2 pellets per "bar" | 02:03 |
| mechie | ahhh ok | 02:03 |
| epitron | separate | 02:03 |
| epitron | so you don't have to eat it all at once | 02:03 |
| epitron | (if you did, it would be too much coconut) | 02:03 |
| mechie | cuz that'd be disgusting | 02:03 |
| mechie | yes | 02:03 |
| epitron | also it allows for more chocolate surface area | 02:03 |
| epitron | oh creepy | 02:07 |
| mechie | ? | 02:07 |
| epitron | chevron's new slogan is "human energy" | 02:07 |
| mechie | haha | 02:07 |
| epitron | HELLO MATRIX | 02:07 |
| mechie | I KNOW | 02:07 |
| epitron | did you see the glofish that kanz posted? | 02:11 |
| mechie | no | 02:11 |
| mechie | how could i tell what is what | 02:11 |
| epitron | http://glofish.com/ | 02:11 |
| mechie | i have no pookie | 02:11 |
| mechie | o ok | 02:11 |
| epitron | I KNOW! | 02:11 |
| epitron | hmmm | 02:11 |
| epitron | i know | 02:11 |
| mechie | plus there are a million links | 02:11 |
| mechie | and nothing to filter | 02:11 |
| mechie | oh | 02:12 |
| mechie | i think they sell these in asian stores | 02:12 |
| mechie | :\ | 02:12 |
| epitron | really? | 02:12 |
| mechie | yeah | 02:12 |
| epitron | i wonder if they die faster | 02:12 |
| mechie | hmmm i don't know | 02:13 |
| mechie | if i wanted fish i'd try to do saltwater | 02:13 |
| epitron | ohh man | 02:13 |
| mechie | oh geez | 02:13 |
| epitron | i love saltwater tanks | 02:13 |
| mechie | i thought there was something wrong w/ my eyes | 02:14 |
| epitron | my friend daniel had one... it was awesome | 02:14 |
| mechie | the stupid words on that jar were moving | 02:14 |
| epitron | wow, you ARE out of it | 02:14 |
| mechie | ass to eye. ass to eye. | 02:15 |
| mechie | you friend "had" one | 02:15 |
| mechie | did they all die :D | 02:15 |
| epitron | what | 02:16 |
| epitron | oh | 02:16 |
| epitron | was that a poem? :) | 02:16 |
| mechie | no | 02:16 |
| mechie | did the fish die | 02:16 |
| epitron | (my friend moved from montreal to calgary) | 02:16 |
| epitron | (or CAL-GAH-REE as they say) | 02:16 |
| mechie | how do you say it | 02:17 |
| epitron | CALguhree | 02:17 |
| mechie | oh ok | 02:17 |
| epitron | i can skype you to demonstrate | 02:17 |
| mechie | no it's ok | 02:17 |
| epitron | you sure? | 02:17 |
| mechie | yes | 02:17 |
| epitron | i'm all ready here | 02:17 |
| epitron | all skyped up | 02:17 |
| mechie | haha | 02:18 |
| epitron | skypin' to the max | 02:18 |
| mechie | your accent isn't very different from ours | 02:18 |
| mechie | other than some subtle differences | 02:18 |
| epitron | i know, i'm joking :) | 02:18 |
| mechie | i kno | 02:18 |
| mechie | i wanted to make fun of noeld and ub | 02:18 |
| mechie | but i couldnt :( | 02:18 |
| epitron | haha | 02:18 |
| mechie | so i just make fun of ub's purse. | 02:18 |
| epitron | you gotta be from the south to do it | 02:18 |
| epitron | southerners can tell the difference between canadian and northern US accents | 02:18 |
| epitron | or at least, the one i knew could | 02:19 |
| mechie | well you do say ou/oo's differently | 02:19 |
| epitron | maybe she was unique | 02:19 |
| epitron | yeah, that's basically it :) | 02:19 |
| mechie | but that wasn't big enough for me to make fun of | 02:19 |
| epitron | get those dogs in the HEWS | 02:19 |
| epitron | HOOSE | 02:19 |
| epitron | ah well | 02:19 |
| mechie | i like how there are so many diff accents in NYC | 02:20 |
| epitron | you can always just call us beady-eyed flapping-headed freaks | 02:20 |
| mechie | no that's me :( | 02:20 |
| epitron | (no that's canadians on south park :) | 02:20 |
| mechie | (oh you trash cans) | 02:20 |
| epitron | hahaha | 02:20 |
| epitron | anyhow, yeah, i liked that about NYC | 02:20 |
| epitron | except for the one person who was SCREAMING ON THE NIGHT TRAIN | 02:20 |
| epitron | LIKE A DRUNKEN IDIOT | 02:21 |
| mechie | was it me | 02:21 |
| mechie | jk | 02:21 |
| mechie | do you remember which line it was | 02:21 |
| epitron | i dunno are you a gino? | 02:21 |
| epitron | i was going to trenton | 02:21 |
| mechie | to NJ? | 02:21 |
| epitron | yeah | 02:21 |
| mechie | you were on the Path train | 02:21 |
| mechie | orrrr | 02:21 |
| epitron | i see | 02:21 |
| mechie | NJ Transit Rail road | 02:21 |
| mechie | oh wait i don't think path goes there | 02:21 |
| epitron | hmmm | 02:21 |
| mechie | it's too far south | 02:21 |
| epitron | it was elevated | 02:21 |
| mechie | n/m | 02:21 |
| mechie | yeah i think you were on the railroad | 02:22 |
| epitron | ok | 02:22 |
| mechie | jeremy lives in trenton | 02:22 |
| mechie | it was like a 2 hour ride right? | 02:22 |
| epitron | you mean, when he's not living in manhattan? | 02:22 |
| epitron | uhmm | 02:22 |
| epitron | i can't remember | 02:22 |
| epitron | it didn't seem that long | 02:22 |
| mechie | yeah | 02:22 |
| mechie | i think him and tom are married by now! jk | 02:22 |
| epitron | there was a long wait for the train | 02:22 |
| mechie | you were probably etertained by something | 02:22 |
| epitron | hahaha | 02:23 |
| epitron | no, i was very annoyed by the drunken idiot | 02:23 |
| epitron | i was trying to read my book | 02:23 |
| mechie | ahhh | 02:23 |
| epitron | it should've felt loonnngg | 02:23 |
| mechie | lots of those around :) | 02:23 |
| epitron | yeah | 02:23 |
| mechie | NYC used to be worse | 02:23 |
| epitron | it was 2am on a friday or saturday night | 02:23 |
| mechie | schizos everywhere | 02:23 |
| mechie | then all the hipsters and yuppies cleaned it up | 02:23 |
| epitron | it could've been 2 hours... | 02:23 |
| epitron | it was awesome to walk through trenton at 4am | 02:24 |
| mechie | maybe the 2 hours included the wait time... | 02:24 |
| epitron | from the train station to the house | 02:24 |
| mechie | you walked? | 02:24 |
| epitron | never having visited ny before | 02:24 |
| epitron | yep :D | 02:24 |
| epitron | it was only about 5 blocks | 02:24 |
| epitron | i was told to look out for bloods and crips | 02:24 |
| mechie | oh i have no idea where trenton train station is | 02:24 |
| mechie | depends which part of trenton | 02:24 |
| mechie | yeah | 02:24 |
| epitron | and to not have a red or blue handkerchief on me | 02:24 |
| mechie | i still wore those colors :\ | 02:24 |
| epitron | it's on the border between the gang territories | 02:25 |
| epitron | haha | 02:25 |
| mechie | stupid gangs ugh | 02:25 |
| epitron | ok | 02:25 |
| epitron | so what should i name the new bot | 02:25 |
| epitron | something nerdy | 02:26 |
| mechie | you're bringing one here? | 02:26 |
| epitron | like SirIsaac | 02:26 |
| mechie | no | 02:26 |
| mechie | make it really stupid | 02:26 |
| mechie | just cuz | 02:26 |
| epitron | seymour | 02:26 |
| epitron | hahaha | 02:26 |
| epitron | like some kinda crazy wackadoo! | 02:26 |
| mechie | hmmmmmmmmm | 02:26 |
| mechie | moonbeam. | 02:26 |
| mechie | hahahahahha | 02:26 |
| epitron | ehhh fuggedaboutit! | 02:26 |
| epitron | ya crazy wackadoo!! | 02:26 |
| mechie | you say that to me irl and i punch you! | 02:27 |
| epitron | how about | 02:27 |
| epitron | squishy | 02:27 |
| epitron | whaaa | 02:27 |
| mechie | squishee | 02:27 |
| epitron | whatcha gettin all punchy for | 02:27 |
| mechie | i like to punch | 02:27 |
| epitron | you some kinda wackadoo or sumthin? | 02:27 |
| mechie | >:| | 02:27 |
| epitron | eh tony look at the wackadoo over heauh! | 02:27 |
| epitron | she thinks she can take me! | 02:27 |
| mechie | i can :( | 02:27 |
| epitron | ah ha ha | 02:27 |
| epitron | come on sweetie show me whatcha got | 02:28 |
| * mechie kicks epitron in the nads | 02:28 | |
| * mechie kicks epitron in the nads | 02:28 | |
| * mechie kicks epitron in the nads | 02:28 | |
| * epitron collapses | 02:28 | |
| * epitron vomits | 02:28 | |
| mechie | it's ok we can get you new ones | 02:28 |
| mechie | stop being a drama queen | 02:28 |
| epitron | crazzyy.... wacka... doo... *faint* | 02:28 |
| epitron | so names! | 02:28 |
| epitron | punchie | 02:28 |
| epitron | flakey | 02:28 |
| mechie | pudgie | 02:28 |
| mechie | lullz | 02:28 |
| epitron | haha | 02:29 |
| epitron | i like it | 02:29 |
| mechie | i still call my dog pookie sometimes | 02:29 |
| mechie | damnit | 02:29 |
| epitron | maybe this will fix it | 02:29 |
| mechie | maybe | 02:29 |
| mechie | oh god he farted | 02:29 |
| epitron | we could give it a biology name too | 02:29 |
| epitron | like MENDEL | 02:29 |
| mechie | i'm in pain | 02:30 |
| epitron | hahahaha | 02:30 |
| mechie | where is the gas mask when i need it | 02:30 |
| epitron | so much stink from such a tiny animal | 02:30 |
| mechie | (yes we have such things) | 02:30 |
| epitron | haha | 02:30 |
| mechie | ok it passed | 02:30 |
| mechie | MOVING ON..... | 02:30 |
| epitron | stinkee | 02:31 |
| mechie | Sir Pudgie Mendel | 02:31 |
| epitron | hahahah | 02:31 |
| epitron | Churchill Babington | 02:32 |
| mechie | i don't like the flow! | 02:32 |
| epitron | Emil Adolf von Behring | 02:33 |
| epitron | Otto Fritz Meyerhof | 02:33 |
| mechie | hmmm | 02:33 |
| epitron | Frederick Grant Banting | 02:33 |
| mechie | maybe if it sounded more like chocolate | 02:33 |
| epitron | Carl Peter Henrik Dam | 02:34 |
| epitron | Edward Adelbert Doisy | 02:34 |
| epitron | OMG | 02:34 |
| epitron | Ernst Boris Chain | 02:34 |
| epitron | what an awesome name | 02:34 |
| mechie | for your dog :< | 02:34 |
| epitron | how about krebs | 02:34 |
| epitron | that's a good bot name | 02:34 |
| mechie | maybe | 02:34 |
| epitron | i think it would grow on us :D | 02:35 |
| mechie | hmmmmmmmmm | 02:35 |
| mechie | we could take out our maps and pick something | 02:35 |
| mechie | nah too lazy | 02:35 |
| epitron | nah, it should be whimsical | 02:36 |
| mechie | like drug OTC names? XD | 02:36 |
| epitron | there are so many wacky biology names | 02:36 |
| epitron | i wish i could remember them | 02:36 |
| mechie | yeah i can't remember them anymore | 02:36 |
| epitron | where you're sitting in glass, eyes glazed over, then the teacher says a funny word | 02:36 |
| epitron | like GOLGI BODY | 02:36 |
| epitron | and it sticks | 02:37 |
| mechie | yeh | 02:37 |
| epitron | s/glass/class/ | 02:37 |
| mechie | and where everything in chem class looks like a bunch of emoticons | 02:37 |
| mechie | org chem* | 02:37 |
| epitron | hhah | 02:37 |
| mechie | i think people thought i was high | 02:38 |
| mechie | so anyway | 02:38 |
| mechie | Tirlenol is cute | 02:38 |
| epitron | the name or the person | 02:38 |
| mechie | name | 02:38 |
| mechie | is that the type you wanted? | 02:38 |
| epitron | hmm | 02:38 |
| epitron | but then we'll get nick collisions | 02:38 |
| epitron | tirlas and the bot will fight | 02:39 |
| mechie | oh wait are you changing pookie's name? | 02:39 |
| epitron | no, i'm making a new bot that will absorb all this channel's text :) | 02:39 |
| mechie | oh god i feel sorry for it | 02:39 |
| epitron | he will have a different personality | 02:39 |
| epitron | hahah | 02:39 |
| mechie | now i'm tempted to make it sound retarded | 02:39 |
| epitron | i could call him ecoli | 02:39 |
| epitron | haha | 02:40 |
| epitron | GO FOR IT | 02:40 |
| mechie | WHY DOES NOTHING COME TO MINDDDDDDDDDDDDDD | 02:40 |
| epitron | start riffin' | 02:40 |
| epitron | EWW http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Celldeath.jpg | 02:41 |
| mechie | i'm thinking of something... slow moving like a blob | 02:41 |
| epitron | "Incomplete differentiation in two toes (syndactyly) due to lack of apoptosis" | 02:41 |
| mechie | heh my bio teacher wrote books on cell death | 02:41 |
| epitron | ok i'm calling him krebs :D | 02:41 |
| mechie | niiiceeee | 02:41 |
| mechie | ok | 02:42 |
| epitron | actually, how about just Hans Adolf :) | 02:43 |
| mechie | sounds like an arrogant prick | 02:43 |
| epitron | exaaaactly | 02:43 |
| mechie | noooo we have too many of thooseee | 02:43 |
| mechie | unless hans is always wrong | 02:44 |
| -!- krebs [n=krebs@208.106.116.196] has joined #hplusroadmap | 02:44 | |
| -!- krebs [n=krebs@208.106.116.196] has quit [Client Quit] | 02:44 | |
| -!- epitron is now known as krebs | 02:44 | |
| krebs | crap, someone's got the name | 02:44 |
| -!- krebs is now known as epitron | 02:44 | |
| mechie | figures | 02:44 |
| -!- mechie is now known as mech0r | 02:44 | |
| epitron | eih it'll be ok | 02:44 |
| -!- krebs [n=krebs@208.106.116.196] has joined #hplusroadmap | 02:44 | |
| epitron | HELLO HANS ADOLF KREBS | 02:45 |
| epitron | !chat | 02:45 |
| krebs | HELLO HANS ADOLF KREBS | 02:45 |
| epitron | :D | 02:45 |
| mech0r | FUCKING A | 02:45 |
| epitron | it begins | 02:45 |
| mech0r | !chat | 02:45 |
| krebs | it begins | 02:45 |
| mech0r | !chat | 02:45 |
| krebs | it begins | 02:45 |
| mech0r | :( | 02:45 |
| epitron | !chat | 02:45 |
| krebs | it begins | 02:45 |
| epitron | !chat | 02:45 |
| krebs | FUCKING A | 02:45 |
| epitron | :D | 02:45 |
| mech0r | hh | 02:45 |
| mech0r | HELLO HANS ADOLF KREBS it begins FUCKING A | 02:45 |
| epitron | !chat | 02:46 |
| krebs | HELLO HANS ADOLF KREBS it begins | 02:46 |
| epitron | haha | 02:46 |
| epitron | i love that plugin | 02:46 |
| mech0r | yup | 02:46 |
| epitron | http://heybryan.org/ | 02:46 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Bryan Bishop's home page | 02:46 |
| mech0r | i wonder if he'll get irritated | 02:46 |
| mech0r | bryan | 02:46 |
| epitron | *shrug* | 02:46 |
| epitron | we can turn it off | 02:46 |
| mech0r | because he knows what all the links are already | 02:47 |
| mech0r | o | 02:47 |
| mech0r | can it do.. | 02:47 |
| epitron | he's not posting them for his own benefit though :) | 02:47 |
| mech0r | !figlet O_O | 02:47 |
| krebs | ____ ____ | 02:47 |
| krebs | / __ \ / __ \ | 02:47 |
| krebs | / /_/ / / /_/ / | 02:47 |
| krebs | \____/____\____/ | 02:47 |
| krebs | /___/ | 02:47 |
| mech0r | allriigghhttt | 02:47 |
| epitron | !figlet YESSS | 02:47 |
| krebs | __ __ ____ ____ ____ ____ | 02:47 |
| krebs | \ \/ // __// __// __// __/ | 02:47 |
| krebs | \ // _/ _\ \ _\ \ _\ \ | 02:47 |
| krebs | /_//___//___//___//___/ | 02:47 |
| krebs | 02:47 | |
| mech0r | !figlet <3 | 02:47 |
| krebs | __ ____ | 02:47 |
| krebs | / / |_ / | 02:47 |
| krebs | < < _/_ < | 02:47 |
| krebs | \_\/____/ | 02:47 |
| krebs | 02:47 | |
| mech0r | no that looks like something else! you fail! | 02:48 |
| epitron | ewww | 02:48 |
| epitron | it looks like a 3 with a bow | 02:48 |
| mech0r | boomerang | 02:48 |
| mech0r | which somehow reminds me | 02:49 |
| mech0r | i want to make something ridiculous out of wood | 02:49 |
| epitron | HMMM | 02:51 |
| epitron | how aobut little hula dancers | 02:51 |
| mech0r | :( | 02:51 |
| epitron | wood gas mask? | 02:51 |
| mech0r | :( | 02:51 |
| epitron | i give up :D | 02:51 |
| mech0r | i know me too | 02:52 |
| mech0r | UNTIL | 02:52 |
| mech0r | i look at inhabitat again | 02:52 |
| epitron | oooo | 02:52 |
| epitron | wood stove! | 02:52 |
| mech0r | some guy made a bench out of tennis balls | 02:52 |
| epitron | make a tennis ball out of a bench | 02:52 |
| mech0r | doesn't sound very bouncy | 02:52 |
| epitron | make it out of rubber plants | 02:53 |
| epitron | rubber bench! | 02:53 |
| epitron | (i think i'm losing it now too) | 02:53 |
| mech0r | (it's late) | 02:53 |
| epitron | ((whoa it's monday)) | 02:53 |
| mech0r | you didn't take your pills? | 02:53 |
| mech0r | i have work. | 02:53 |
| epitron | (((where were you digital watch!!!))) | 02:53 |
| epitron | meh, i don't have to get up early | 02:54 |
| mech0r | i do | 02:54 |
| epitron | i don't need to take sleeping pills :) | 02:54 |
| epitron | you know what i thought was silly | 02:54 |
| epitron | over the counter sleeping pills are just antihistamines | 02:54 |
| mech0r | me cutting off zoner's leg. | 02:54 |
| mech0r | like benadryl? | 02:54 |
| epitron | i dunno :) | 02:54 |
| epitron | it's the same stuff though | 02:54 |
| epitron | i looked it up | 02:54 |
| mech0r | oh | 02:54 |
| mech0r | drugs r such a scam | 02:55 |
| mech0r | sigh | 02:55 |
| mech0r | there were no major breakthrough really | 02:55 |
| epitron | haha | 02:55 |
| mech0r | just a reboxing of everything | 02:55 |
| epitron | did you ever see Brain Candy? | 02:55 |
| mech0r | no | 02:55 |
| epitron | that's great | 02:55 |
| mech0r | IS IT | 02:55 |
| epitron | it's the Kids in the Hall movie | 02:55 |
| mech0r | oh | 02:55 |
| epitron | it's about drug companies | 02:55 |
| mech0r | did they somehow mke drug companies seem interesting | 02:56 |
| epitron | yep :D | 02:56 |
| epitron | it was about the people at the top | 02:56 |
| epitron | the crazy rich bastards | 02:56 |
| mech0r | yupppp | 02:56 |
| mech0r | too much about profit | 02:57 |
| epitron | anyhow, i won't tell you any more | 02:57 |
| epitron | it's wacky | 02:57 |
| mech0r | cliffhanger! | 02:57 |
| epitron | http://www.torrentz.com/search?q=brain+candy | 02:57 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: brain candy torrent search | 02:57 |
| mech0r | damn i ran out of room | 02:57 |
| mech0r | i'll save it | 02:57 |
| mech0r | the link | 02:58 |
| epitron | sayonara, anime! | 02:58 |
| mech0r | i've deleted like almost all of it from laptop | 02:58 |
| mech0r | if i was on my pc it wouldn't matter | 02:58 |
| epitron | ahh | 02:58 |
| epitron | man i wanna see this movie again | 02:58 |
| mech0r | brain candy eh | 02:59 |
| mech0r | time to imdb | 02:59 |
| mech0r | i'm sleepy now | 03:00 |
| epitron | only one cure for that | 03:01 |
| mech0r | 5 cans of coke | 03:01 |
| epitron | You know what you must do. | 03:01 |
| epitron | haha | 03:01 |
| epitron | !topic add krebs is now servicing the channel. try !help | 03:07 |
| krebs | epitron, you don't have 'topic' permissions here | 03:07 |
| epitron | oops :D | 03:07 |
| epitron | !topic add krebs is now servicing the channel. try !help | 03:08 |
| -!- krebs changed the topic of #hplusroadmap to: http://heybryan.org/ http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/ http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Self-replication | krebs is now servicing the channel. try !help | 03:08 | |
| mech0r | :D | 03:08 |
| mech0r | NO IM TOO SMART TO ASK FOR HELP | 03:08 |
| epitron | hahah | 03:08 |
| mech0r | if it DOESN'T WORK | 03:09 |
| mech0r | YOUR BOT IS DUMB | 03:09 |
| epitron | that's only true when it's tmrd's bot :D | 03:10 |
| mech0r | haha :D | 03:11 |
| -!- kanzure [n=bryan@cpe-70-113-54-112.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap | 07:21 | |
| kanzure | Hey krebs. | 07:21 |
| kanzure | Ruby bot? | 07:21 |
| kanzure | http://biopunk.org/ emailed me | 07:28 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Biopunk.org - Index page | 07:28 |
| kanzure | http://www.dnatube.com/ | 07:38 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: DNATube.com Scientific Video Site | 07:38 |
| -!- kanzure [n=bryan@cpe-70-113-54-112.austin.res.rr.com] has quit ["Leaving."] | 08:01 | |
| -!- kanzure [n=bryan@cpe-70-113-54-112.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap | 17:41 | |
| kanzure | !help | 17:42 |
| krebs | help topics: 6 core modules: auth, basics, config, httputil, remote, userdata; 73 plugins: alias, autoop, autorejoin, azgame, babel, bans, bash, cal, chanserv, chucknorris, debug, deepthoughts, delicious, dice, dict, digg, dns, eightball, excuse, factoids, figlet, forecast, fortune, freshmeat, grouphug, hl2, host, imdb, insult, iplookup, karma, keywords, lart, lastfm, linkbot, markov, math, modes, nickserv, q, quiz, quote, reaction, realm, remind, | 17:42 |
| krebs | remotectl, ri, roshambo, rot, roulette, rss, salut, script, search, seen, shiritori, shortenurls, slashdot, spell, theyfightcrime, threat, time, topic, translator, tube, twitter, unicode, urban, url, usermodes, weather, wheeloffortune, wserver; 1 plugin ignored: use help ignored plugins to see why; 2 plugins failed to load: use help failed plugins to see why (help <topic> for more info) | 17:42 |
| kanzure | fenn: http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Skdb#File_format | 17:52 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Societal engineering knowledge database - Biohack | 17:52 |
| kanzure | epitron: You around? | 17:54 |
| kanzure | Anissimov might need some emergency hosting. | 17:55 |
| epitron | ohm, sure | 18:03 |
| epitron | what's he need hosted? | 18:03 |
| kanzure | Anissimov | 18:04 |
| kanzure | he was on the front page of digg | 18:04 |
| epitron | ok | 18:26 |
| epitron | well, give me some more info | 18:26 |
| epitron | or maybe tell him to talk to me :) | 18:26 |
| epitron | i can't seem to find him on digg either | 18:27 |
| epitron | you wanna give me some hints? | 18:27 |
| kanzure | ah, he says everything is okay | 18:27 |
| epitron | ok :) | 18:27 |
| epitron | can you give me the link to his thing? I'm curious what this is now :) | 18:28 |
| kanzure | well, it's down | 18:28 |
| epitron | hahah | 18:28 |
| kanzure | so | 18:28 |
| kanzure | http://web.archive.org/web/20070814121108/http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/blog/ | 18:28 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Accelerating Future | 18:28 |
| epitron | probem SOLEVD | 18:28 |
| epitron | which article was dugg? | 18:29 |
| kanzure | it was obviously something in 2008 | 18:32 |
| kanzure | so I don't know | 18:32 |
| epitron | :) | 18:37 |
| kanzure | http://digg.com/general_sciences/10_Futuristic_Materials | 18:38 |
| kanzure | that may have been it | 18:38 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Digg - 10 Futuristic Materials | 18:38 |
| fenn | not in archive | 18:54 |
| epitron | http://funtarded.com/pics/show/2368 | 19:04 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: 1_gigabyte_is_so_much_less_manly_today.jpg :: Funtarded! | 19:04 |
| -!- Enki-2 [n=weechat@c-71-234-190-248.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] | 20:05 | |
| -!- Enki-2 [n=weechat@c-71-234-190-248.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 20:11 | |
| -!- mech0r [n=DION102@cpe-74-73-121-30.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit ["[04:12] <meK3> go fuck opt [04:12] <[TOP]kotton> i will [04:12] <[TOP]kotton> now [04:12] <[TOP]kotton> we can go all night me"] | 20:22 | |
| -!- Nevermore [n=nevermor@131.229.176.252] has joined #hplusroadmap | 20:54 | |
| -!- Nevermore [n=nevermor@131.229.176.252] has left #hplusroadmap [] | 20:54 | |
| kanzure | who was Nevermore? | 20:57 |
| -!- Aulere [n=nevermor@131.229.176.252] has joined #hplusroadmap | 21:05 | |
| -!- drazak [i=drazak@drazak.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 21:19 | |
| kanzure | Welcome drazak. | 21:19 |
| kanzure | check the /topic | 21:19 |
| * drazak waves | 21:19 | |
| -!- BDrago1 [n=noah@ip68-14-89-105.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 21:24 | |
| kanzure | Hey Noah. | 21:24 |
| kanzure | Please stick around. | 21:24 |
| BDrago1 | Hi. I shall. | 21:24 |
| -!- BDrago1 is now known as Noahj | 21:24 | |
| kanzure | recent topics of interest are in the /topic | 21:24 |
| drazak | heh | 21:24 |
| kanzure | Noah and I go way back, a year at least | 21:26 |
| Noahj | Yeah, although I still haven't caught up | 21:26 |
| Noahj | Right now I'm putting a piezo on my throat and overmodulating it to make music, also, I'm compiling the cvs version of gnuitar to do guitar effects. With the ultimate goal of doing a guitar solo with my throat. I don't know if that's cyborgy enough to qualify mentioning on this channel, though. | 21:27 |
| kanzure | maybe if you speak in Taylor polynomials it'll be cyborgy enough | 21:28 |
| Noahj | Hmm, I think I'd have to be using the piezo as a speaker for that | 21:31 |
| Noahj | What do these have to do with cyborgs? | 21:32 |
| kanzure | yanking your chain | 21:32 |
| Noahj | Ah. Well... that's, uh, a good way to flush a toilet if the thing on the side is broken, I guess. | 21:33 |
| Noahj | I feel like I've stopped an important discussion or something | 21:36 |
| Noahj | But I guess on this channel most people are probably distracted by their tRMS machines or whatever | 21:36 |
| kanzure | I'm off talking with drazak, waiting for fenn to get back online so that we can discuss the updates to the skdb article I threw together, | 21:37 |
| kanzure | Aulere is off studying for psych, epitron is doing who knows who, Enki-2 is conversing in #wrongplanet, and krebs is a bot | 21:37 |
| * drazak is conversing, and reading the calc book | 21:37 | |
| kanzure | cal book | 21:38 |
| kanzure | calc = calculator | 21:38 |
| kanzure | cal = calculus | 21:38 |
| Aulere | cog neuro actually, but yeah | 21:39 |
| Noahj | Ca = California and CA = Cellular Automata? | 21:39 |
| fenn | meep | 21:39 |
| Noahj | Except Ca's probably also an element | 21:39 |
| drazak | beep? | 21:39 |
| kanzure | fenn: http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Skdb please check out the big giant paragraphs - I think I've narrowed down some ideas | 21:39 |
| Noahj | Yeah. | 21:39 |
| Noahj | Calcium. | 21:39 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Societal engineering knowledge database - Biohack | 21:39 |
| kanzure | but please excuse the massive paragraph structure | 21:39 |
| drazak | CA is calcium | 21:40 |
| drazak | 45.5 formula weight | 21:40 |
| drazak | 23? atomic number | 21:40 |
| Noahj | 20, I thought | 21:41 |
| Noahj | Anyway, Ca is calcium | 21:41 |
| Noahj | CA is cellular automata I hope. But it gets ambiguous... | 21:41 |
| fenn | i'm playing with 'phun'.. if you throw enough stupidity at a problem it begins to look quite biological: http://fennetic.net/pub/irc/phun.png | 21:41 |
| krebs | [Link Info] type: image/png, size: 263,410 bytes | 21:41 |
| Noahj | Hey, I just installed that today | 21:41 |
| Noahj | But I can't use it because of proprietary nvidia drivers not working unless I've got kernel sources that match my current kernel | 21:42 |
| kanzure | -- without my influence, fenn, I did no linking to Noah | 21:42 |
| Noahj | And I installed a binary kernel because I'm lazy | 21:42 |
| drazak | ew, binary kernels | 21:42 |
| Noahj | Yeah, yeah | 21:42 |
| Noahj | I ought to recompile. I will. | 21:42 |
| drazak | mmmm gentoo (not genkernel, genkernel is shit) | 21:42 |
| Noahj | yeah, sabayon is worse though | 21:42 |
| drazak | sabayon is a POS | 21:43 |
| Noahj | Sabayon is like genkernel to the whateverth | 21:43 |
| Noahj | Yeah. Well. I've learned that the hard way. | 21:43 |
| Noahj | Debian sucks on this machine so I figured I'd install gentoo, but I didn't have two months | 21:43 |
| fenn | kanzure: synthetic serendipity? | 21:43 |
| kanzure | fenn: hm? | 21:43 |
| drazak | debian is nice on servers | 21:44 |
| Noahj | Serendipity? What? Is this peacefulness or a CMS? | 21:44 |
| Noahj | Debian is nice on old machines, too | 21:44 |
| Noahj | It's annoying to have to compile everything | 21:44 |
| drazak | (or Serendipity the chocolate parlor?) | 21:44 |
| drazak | gentoo is nice too, if you do distcc | 21:44 |
| fenn | serendipity is fortuitous coincidence | 21:44 |
| Noahj | Yeah, synthetic chocolate? | 21:44 |
| Noahj | Distcc? | 21:44 |
| Noahj | Oh, yeah, serenity is peacefulness. I always get those messed up. | 21:45 |
| drazak | distributed c compiler | 21:45 |
| kanzure | fenn: how so? (not your last message) | 21:45 |
| Noahj | Oh, right, I heard about that a couple years back | 21:45 |
| drazak | it's a gcc/g++ extension, it allows compilation over the network | 21:45 |
| Noahj | Where would I distribute it to, though? | 21:45 |
| Noahj | I've got no cluster to speak of | 21:45 |
| drazak | just another machine | 21:45 |
| Noahj | Well, none at all. If I did have one, though, I probably wouldn't speak of it :-D | 21:45 |
| kanzure | Noah. You get free machines from MIT. | 21:45 |
| Noahj | Yeah, gentoo is slow on all my machines | 21:46 |
| drazak | you can add lots of machines, all they need to do is run a distcc compiler | 21:46 |
| drazak | Then you did gentoo wrong :P | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Well, yeah, there was that one. But my father took it to do lawyerly stuff on | 21:46 |
| drazak | what WM? | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Ion. Well. I used to use ion. | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Before the guy who wrote it went loco. | 21:46 |
| * drazak uses fluxbox | 21:46 | |
| drazak | which is very minimal | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Yeah, I'm on fluxbox now | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Yeah, but fluxbox is annoying. It uses windows and not tabs. | 21:46 |
| Noahj | Wmii is nice. | 21:46 |
| drazak | althought it doesn't have all the... WMIMPC? compliance hooks | 21:47 |
| Noahj | Anyway yeah, mostly compiling X takes a lot of time | 21:47 |
| drazak | I wouldn't mind giving my fluxbox a little eyecandy, with compiz-fusion | 21:47 |
| Noahj | I go through eyecandy phases | 21:47 |
| kanzure | Enki-2: now would be a good time to jump in with your xu88 stuff for these two | 21:47 |
| fenn | kanzure: ew, natural language specifications, suck | 21:47 |
| Noahj | xu88? | 21:47 |
| kanzure | fenn: unfortunately that's how papers are published | 21:47 |
| fenn | kanzure: that's what we're trying to get away from | 21:47 |
| drazak | Noahj: I sort of like the zoom in thing | 21:47 |
| kanzure | fenn: that's how we've been collecting all of our data | 21:47 |
| drazak | some of my monitors go up to 2048x1536 | 21:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: it's just tagging and ontologies | 21:48 |
| drazak | and it'd be nice to be able to have all of that real estate, and still be able to read | 21:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: we need multiple "approach ontologies" for the content | 21:48 |
| Noahj | I made a theme that made KDE look like windows media centre, back when such things were hip | 21:48 |
| drazak | ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwww | 21:48 |
| Noahj | Whoa, that's severly high-res | 21:48 |
| drazak | yeah | 21:48 |
| Noahj | I also used to use enlightenment. Which is essentially fluxbox with eyecandy. | 21:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: I guess you're right. | 21:48 |
| fenn | kanzure: a "readme" is okay, but it shouldnt be the source code too | 21:48 |
| drazak | e11 is niceish | 21:48 |
| Noahj | I used to glue monitors together and use xinerama | 21:48 |
| Noahj | e17 is much better | 21:49 |
| Noahj | e...11? | 21:49 |
| Noahj | I thought the first one was, like, 15 | 21:49 |
| kanzure | fenn: but I do not see the necessity of automating it all, actually. That's the only reason to move away from natural-lang-desc, right? | 21:49 |
| Noahj | What's this natural language thing? It sounds important. | 21:49 |
| kanzure | Noahj: http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Skdb | 21:49 |
| krebs | [Link Info] title: Societal engineering knowledge database - Biohack | 21:49 |
| drazak | http://drazak.net/misc/pics/dcao0011.jpg | 21:49 |
| krebs | [Link Info] type: image/jpeg, size: 460,390 bytes | 21:49 |
| kanzure | CPAN/apt for engineering and knowledge in general | 21:49 |
| drazak | my favourite poster :D | 21:49 |
| kanzure | instead of just software | 21:49 |
| drazak | Noahj: http://drazak.net/misc/pics/dcao0066.jpg is that monitor, it's 19" | 21:50 |
| krebs | [Link Info] type: image/jpeg, size: 465,648 bytes | 21:50 |
| kanzure | fenn: we have to decide if this just has to be the CPAN/aptitude equivalent for more than software, or if we want the hardcore automation for finding the self-replicators | 21:51 |
| drazak | Noahj: but uhm, I used enlightenment when I was helping the fork of the Arcane linux project, which lasted for all of 6 months(the fork, called Divine), as it came already compiled | 21:51 |
| fenn | a lot of scientific and engineering papers dont give you all the information, they just summarize what they did | 21:51 |
| kanzure | I guess ultimately they are always modeling | 21:51 |
| kanzure | so the trick is to translate the models into the right format | 21:51 |
| fenn | or handwave away the source code because of whatever reason | 21:51 |
| kanzure | indeed | 21:51 |
| kanzure | "reminder: write code here" | 21:51 |
| drazak | Noahj: my servers are in that picture too, haha, and the KVM | 21:51 |
| kanzure | okay, so then I forsee two splits | 21:52 |
| kanzure | (1) the formalized knowledge, automated and encoded as software and various queryable datasets | 21:52 |
| kanzure | (2) the knowledge stuff, see my AutoScholar ref in those paragraphs | 21:52 |
| Noahj | Nice keyboard | 21:52 |
| kanzure | not a split | 21:52 |
| fenn | i want it to be automated or at least 'processable' otherwise it's just wikipedia or hobbycircuits.com | 21:52 |
| kanzure | but it's the same system | 21:52 |
| kanzure | fenn: true enough | 21:52 |
| Noahj | Is that a model M? | 21:52 |
| kanzure | yes, it's an M | 21:52 |
| kanzure | I asked that same damn question | 21:52 |
| drazak | Noahj: yeah, kanzure's already lusting over it | 21:52 |
| Noahj | Is it dvorak? | 21:52 |
| Noahj | Heh | 21:52 |
| drazak | I have 4 of them, too | 21:52 |
| drazak | nah | 21:53 |
| Noahj | I think I have one of those somewhere | 21:53 |
| drazak | I might rearrange one for Dvorak though | 21:53 |
| Noahj | I'm just too lazy to do anything about it | 21:53 |
| drazak | all of those have the keyheads that pop off | 21:53 |
| Noahj | Yeah | 21:53 |
| Noahj | It's very similar to the keyboard on my portable 8088 | 21:53 |
| Noahj | Which, one of these days, is going to be useful. I swear it on my pretty floral bonnet. | 21:54 |
| drazak | rofl | 21:54 |
| kanzure | fenn: okay, so it's a way to digest wikipedia and the rest of the knowledge bases (KBs) out there -- so we can queue up information per various topics, then let our programmers (i.e., us) go over it and formalize it | 21:54 |
| fenn | i dont see the difference, actually | 21:54 |
| fenn | oops | 21:54 |
| kanzure | well, I want to do something like | 21:54 |
| kanzure | apt-get install graphene-physics | 21:54 |
| kanzure | and then apt-get install graphene-simulators | 21:54 |
| kanzure | or something | 21:54 |
| kanzure | where we can do apt-cache search graphene | 21:54 |
| kanzure | and get back a list of ontologies related to graphene software | 21:54 |
| drazak | ew apt! | 21:54 |
| fenn | that's just plain debian | 21:54 |
| kanzure | sure | 21:54 |
| kanzure | but I'm giving an example :) | 21:55 |
| fenn | it should already work, provided you have the software | 21:55 |
| kanzure | but the difference is category organizations I think | 21:55 |
| Noahj | Heh | 21:55 |
| kanzure | plus a distinction between processable data of the sort you are talking about | 21:55 |
| kanzure | and knowledge packages | 21:55 |
| kanzure | like the zips I keep on my site for later processing | 21:55 |
| kanzure | btw, Noah and drazak - I have various zips on my server spread out all over the place on CNTs, brain implants, synthetic biology, longevity science, take your pick and I have something | 21:56 |
| fenn | there could be different levels of 'processibility' | 21:56 |
| kanzure | hm | 21:56 |
| drazak | kanzure: maybe later | 21:56 |
| kanzure | human processibility would be the knowledge-base stuff | 21:56 |
| kanzure | and then computer stuff is obvious | 21:56 |
| kanzure | I like that | 21:56 |
| fenn | i.e. one is all natural language, straight from the webpage or journal | 21:56 |
| kanzure | right, with links to the next level down | 21:56 |
| fenn | two is related to other packages in the db | 21:56 |
| kanzure | for people to follow and engineer new stuff if they want to | 21:56 |
| fenn | three is basic units and physical properties | 21:56 |
| kanzure | this sounds like namespaces on the wiki | 21:56 |
| fenn | four is semantic/specialized units | 21:56 |
| kanzure | okay | 21:57 |
| kanzure | even if one layer fails | 21:57 |
| kanzure | the others will still work | 21:57 |
| kanzure | so stuff can still be made and so on | 21:57 |
| fenn | five is simulated and auto-analyzed? | 21:57 |
| kanzure | and the system will still be useful | 21:57 |
| kanzure | hm | 21:57 |
| kanzure | if that is five, then five is debug stuff / logs of processing ? | 21:57 |
| kanzure | including human todo lists of the content? | 21:58 |
| kanzure | one useful namespace would be a todo/workspace / scratchpad | 21:58 |
| fenn | output of simulations, automatic, no human intervention | 21:58 |
| kanzure | simulation output should be local, i.e. whoever the programmer is | 21:58 |
| kanzure | not on the server, although server daemons can take requests - sure | 21:58 |
| fenn | i guess | 21:58 |
| fenn | it's just data, it doesnt matter where you do the simulations | 21:58 |
| kanzure | okay | 21:58 |
| fenn | phun does weird stuff to your brain.. makes all the words bounce off the sides of the window and ideas bounce around in your brain | 21:59 |
| kanzure | so each namespace would have its own XML/wiki-like fileformat specs? | 21:59 |
| kanzure | (wiki-namespace, that is) | 22:00 |
| kanzure | do we want those to be our finalized layers? | 22:00 |
| fenn | yea each specialized code module would have an XML DTD (or whatever's fashionable these days) | 22:00 |
| fenn | schema | 22:00 |
| drazak | anywho | 22:00 |
| kanzure | is DTD anything like BNF? | 22:00 |
| drazak | I'm going to go off for the night | 22:00 |
| kanzure | g'night drazak | 22:00 |
| kanzure | nice meeting you | 22:00 |
| drazak | yep | 22:00 |
| -!- Enki-2 [n=weechat@c-71-234-190-248.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] | 22:00 | |
| fenn | not really, it's less of a grammar, more format | 22:00 |
| kanzure | hm | 22:01 |
| fenn | i dont really know much about it actually | 22:01 |
| kanzure | me either | 22:01 |
| kanzure | I just know that w3c is under intense ping fire | 22:01 |
| kanzure | from people requesting the DTD for each page load | 22:01 |
| fenn | well that's dumb | 22:01 |
| kanzure | maybe in the last 3 seconds it's changed! | 22:02 |
| fenn | everything should be bittorrent by now sheesh | 22:02 |
| kanzure | haha | 22:02 |
| fenn | like, apache3 mod_torrent | 22:03 |
| fenn | every hosted file becomes a torrent | 22:03 |
| kanzure | uhh | 22:03 |
| kanzure | Enki-2 has some thoughts on this | 22:03 |
| kanzure | but on the other hand I thought you were joking | 22:03 |
| kanzure | there's no reason to do DTD requests on each page load | 22:03 |
| kanzure | just cache it once | 22:03 |
| kanzure | it's not changing ;) | 22:03 |
| fenn | why would a DTD be on w3c server anyway? | 22:04 |
| kanzure | they do HTML definition stuff | 22:04 |
| kanzure | Tim Berners-Lee et al | 22:04 |
| fenn | ok, so real basic stuff | 22:04 |
| kanzure | absolutely | 22:05 |
| epitron | !chat | 22:05 |
| krebs | it's just tagging and ontologies | 22:05 |
| epitron | !chat | 22:05 |
| krebs | i might rearrange one for Dvorak though | 22:05 |
| kanzure | ? | 22:05 |
| epitron | !chat | 22:05 |
| krebs | Tim Berners-Lee et al | 22:05 |
| epitron | :D | 22:05 |
| epitron | he's learning | 22:05 |
| fenn | argh kill it! | 22:06 |
| epitron | !chat about i think | 22:06 |
| krebs | i think I've narrowed down some ideas | 22:06 |
| epitron | !chat about i think | 22:06 |
| krebs | i think I have 4 of them, too | 22:06 |
| epitron | !chat about i think | 22:06 |
| krebs | i think I'd have to be the source code too | 22:06 |
| epitron | !chat about i think | 22:06 |
| krebs | i think I'd have to be our finalized layers? | 22:06 |
| fenn | !chat about epitron | 22:06 |
| krebs | incorrect usage, ask for help using 'krebs: help chat' | 22:06 |
| epitron | !chuck 8 | 22:06 |
| krebs | Chuck Norris' tears cure cancer. Too bad he has never cried. [score=8.319] | 22:06 |
| -!- Enki-2 [n=weechat@c-71-234-190-248.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 22:06 | |
| fenn | stupid bot | 22:06 |
| epitron | must you knock everything fenn? | 22:06 |
| epitron | go get some antidepressants or something | 22:07 |
| kanzure | uhh | 22:07 |
| kanzure | you still play around with bots? | 22:07 |
| epitron | no, i just find them handy tools | 22:07 |
| epitron | for example | 22:07 |
| epitron | !urls search fenn | 22:07 |
| krebs | [2008/04/07 18:41:38] <fenn> http://fennetic.net/pub/irc/phun.png | 22:07 |
| epitron | !google the meaning of life | 22:07 |
| krebs | Results for the meaning of life: 1. Meaning of life - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meaning_of_life | 2. The Meaning of Life (1983): http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0085959/ | 3. The Meaning of Life: Intro: http://www.stevepavlina.com/blog/2005/06/the-meaning-of-life-intro/ | 22:07 |
| fenn | *cough irc client cough* | 22:07 |
| kanzure | fenn: heh | 22:08 |
| epitron | fenn: what if you close it? | 22:08 |
| epitron | or login from school? | 22:08 |
| epitron | or you want to show another person on irc a link? | 22:08 |
| kanzure | ssh into your client | 22:08 |
| epitron | it's there if you need it | 22:08 |
| kanzure | not to spam us though :) | 22:08 |
| epitron | yes, spamming is bad :) | 22:09 |
| epitron | i just wanted to demonstrate | 22:09 |
| fenn | can you at least turn off the link title "feature"? | 22:09 |
| epitron | sure | 22:09 |
| epitron | if you guys don't want that, it's toggleable | 22:09 |
| fenn | tak | 22:09 |
| epitron | i find it useful | 22:09 |
| kanzure | that's only because you don't visit links :) | 22:09 |
| kanzure | haha | 22:09 |
| epitron | do you want it disabled kanz? | 22:09 |
| epitron | yep! | 22:10 |
| epitron | ;) | 22:10 |
| epitron | so i take that as an implicit yes | 22:11 |
| kanzure | fenn: do you want to set a target date for formal specifications? If I have the concepts down, I can go off to write them. Don't know if everything is crystal clear yet. you? | 22:11 |
| fenn | kanzure: http://slip.sourceforge.net/ | 22:11 |
| krebs | [Link Info] | 22:11 |
| kanzure | ooh | 22:11 |
| kanzure | that looks interesting | 22:12 |
| kanzure | does this mean I have to learn python? :) | 22:12 |
| fenn | it's easy and readable and general | 22:12 |
| fenn | it's xml, not python | 22:12 |
| epitron | !config set url.display_link_info 0 | 22:12 |
| krebs | okay then :) | 22:12 |
| fenn | but learning python would be a good thing i think | 22:12 |
| kanzure | yes | 22:12 |
| epitron | python is a piece of piss to learn | 22:12 |
| epitron | it took me an hour | 22:12 |
| epitron | the language is so simple :) | 22:13 |
| kanzure | I still have to go searching through the docs from time to time | 22:13 |
| kanzure | there are some little quirks that I am not familiar with | 22:13 |
| epitron | well, i can help | 22:13 |
| kanzure | rather important ones, I might add | 22:13 |
| epitron | i know it quite well | 22:13 |
| kanzure | great | 22:13 |
| epitron | i'm also familiar with many standard libraries :) | 22:14 |
| kanzure | fenn: so you think that's a good implementation for the units namespace? | 22:14 |
| epitron | and handy language features | 22:14 |
| kanzure | I guess we want to distinguish classes of units versus instances of units | 22:14 |
| kanzure | or would we just tag it {{Category:it's this class}} ? | 22:15 |
| kanzure | ansewr is no, but I'm getting my neurons to fire | 22:15 |
| kanzure | *answer | 22:15 |
| fenn | i spose you could do module.class or class.method or something | 22:15 |
| kanzure | we need include statements | 22:15 |
| fenn | not really | 22:15 |
| kanzure | what's the alternative | 22:15 |
| kanzure | I guess all units are specifying themselves | 22:16 |
| kanzure | and shouldn't rely on others? | 22:16 |
| kanzure | but there are different ways to interpret units, IIRC | 22:16 |
| fenn | if special units always include the module name then you can just load the modules listed in the file | 22:16 |
| kanzure | for example, energy can be joules and other forms | 22:16 |
| fenn | the standard physical units cover a lot of ground | 22:17 |
| kanzure | okay | 22:17 |
| kanzure | good point | 22:17 |
| kanzure | there's no reason to not use the direct units anyway | 22:17 |
| kanzure | no 'meta-units' that are just simplified packages | 22:18 |
| kanzure | erm, that are just encapsulations | 22:18 |
| kanzure | or if we do allow encapsulations, it's easy to specify them with a #REDIRECT | 22:18 |
| fenn | could you explain that so i know what you're talking about? | 22:18 |
| fenn | an example | 22:18 |
| kanzure | hm | 22:18 |
| epitron | what are you guys trying to create an ontology for? | 22:18 |
| kanzure | unit: Newtons | 22:18 |
| fenn | building stuff | 22:18 |
| epitron | so, all physical matter? | 22:18 |
| kanzure | Newtons are really just kilograms * m/sec^2 | 22:18 |
| kanzure | but yet they are a unit | 22:19 |
| fenn | epitron: it's starting to look that way | 22:19 |
| kanzure | epitron: we hope to not go in circles | 22:19 |
| epitron | i think cyc has that already | 22:19 |
| epitron | along with ai rules | 22:19 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Skdb | 22:19 |
| epitron | you could leverage that | 22:19 |
| epitron | (i have a research copy of cyc somewhere) | 22:19 |
| kanzure | that's a "common sense" database | 22:19 |
| epitron | right, but it's also extendable with predicates :) | 22:20 |
| fenn | last time i looked at cyc it didnt make any sense to me | 22:20 |
| epitron | and it can do processing | 22:20 |
| epitron | fenn: check out doug lenat's google tech talk | 22:20 |
| kanzure | Enki-2 might suggest predicate logic via prolog | 22:20 |
| epitron | fenn: their website is confusing | 22:20 |
| epitron | prolog is kinda brute force | 22:20 |
| kanzure | this is a brute force project ;) | 22:21 |
| epitron | i don't think people use prolog for large problem spaces | 22:21 |
| epitron | right but it's also incredibly huge in scope | 22:21 |
| kanzure | fenn: it's okay, problems will just show up as we go | 22:21 |
| kanzure | so as long as our software base is extendable we're ok | 22:21 |
| epitron | you can't use a brute force algorithm... it'll take eons | 22:21 |
| kanzure | the Newton = kg * m/sec^2 problem is not much of one | 22:21 |
| fenn | prolog eh.. that's like java isnt it | 22:21 |
| kanzure | is it? | 22:21 |
| epitron | it's nothing like java | 22:22 |
| fenn | i mean, its a crappy language that they use in universities and standards bodies | 22:22 |
| kanzure | at least it doesn't blow sun up your ass | 22:22 |
| kanzure | or maybe it does- I've never used it | 22:22 |
| kanzure | does Sun have an influence on prolog? | 22:22 |
| epitron | it's a languge for specifying logical constraints, then giving you particular solutions | 22:22 |
| epitron | it's what oldschool AI people thought AI would be | 22:23 |
| epitron | until they realized how intractible real world problems are when specified like that | 22:23 |
| epitron | kanzure: prolog is an academic language | 22:23 |
| epitron | :) | 22:23 |
| fenn | hmm ok | 22:23 |
| epitron | people use it for problems that require that kind of programming | 22:23 |
| epitron | but usually the problems can't be very big | 22:23 |
| fenn | why is it limited to small programs/ | 22:24 |
| epitron | and if it's a common problem, people also usually reimplement the problem solver in another language and sell that | 22:24 |
| epitron | (like scheduling problems) | 22:24 |
| epitron | fenn: because it has to enumerate all possible states of your logical system | 22:24 |
| epitron | it's like O(n!) or something :) | 22:25 |
| fenn | why dont they use lazy evaluation then! | 22:25 |
| epitron | where n is the number of binary variables | 22:25 |
| epitron | uhmmm.. because it's not a functional language | 22:25 |
| epitron | it can optimize by caching previous states | 22:25 |
| epitron | but that doesn't help with states that aren't dependant on previous ones | 22:26 |
| epitron | also, it's usually not worth it to cache anything | 22:26 |
| epitron | because you'd blow out your RAM pretty fast | 22:26 |
| epitron | i'm sure there are more advanced logic solvers that use fancy optimization techniques to prune search space | 22:27 |
| epitron | but pure logic is limited | 22:27 |
| epitron | pure logical systems don't exist in nature... (except maybe at the lowest level) | 22:28 |
| epitron | (but to simulate the universe from the lowest level, you'd need an insanely powerful computer) | 22:28 |
| epitron | (basically you'd need another universe) | 22:29 |
| epitron | :D | 22:29 |
| fenn | well, prolog is something, but i dont think its worth using | 22:30 |
| epitron | me either | 22:30 |
| epitron | i recommended cyc :) | 22:30 |
| fenn | i'm watching the google talk.. well listening to it | 22:30 |
| epitron | sweet | 22:31 |
| epitron | i'm not sure you want to use the cyc inference engine, but their ontology seems quite well thought out | 22:31 |
| fenn | i bet cyc has a symbol grounding problem | 22:31 |
| epitron | at the least it would be good to yank data out of | 22:31 |
| epitron | what's a symbol grounding problem | 22:31 |
| epitron | nevermind, reading wikipedia | 22:32 |
| fenn | just a big blob of words | 22:32 |
| kanzure | we don't need just one ontology, epitron | 22:32 |
| epitron | yeah, it's more than that. it has relations | 22:32 |
| kanzure | many ontologies | 22:32 |
| kanzure | many approaches | 22:32 |
| kanzure | many ways to find what you are looking for | 22:33 |
| kanzure | while an overall search engine of all of the content would, of course, also be included | 22:33 |
| epitron | *sigh* | 22:33 |
| epitron | i guess i have to read your crazy wiki page. hold on. | 22:33 |
| fenn | no, i mean the words are related to each other, but it doesnt know what a square looks like, or how to build a bridge | 22:33 |
| kanzure | yep | 22:34 |
| epitron | right, but any AI would benefit hugely from something like cyc | 22:34 |
| fenn | yes of course | 22:34 |
| fenn | (if it works) | 22:34 |
| epitron | it's a shortcut to learning all the common-sense knowledge that it takes us the first 4 years of our lives to learn :) | 22:34 |
| epitron | kanzure: this wiki page is kinda confusing | 22:37 |
| fenn | another thing, not sure if its a problem, is that humans use categories, not strict logical relations | 22:37 |
| epitron | "the idea is to come up with as much social knowledge as possible (stuff that can't be derived from first principles on the spot) and then connect all of the components together and fish out the Hamiltonian paths." | 22:38 |
| epitron | what's social knowledge? :) | 22:38 |
| fenn | categories are a lot more fuzzy error resistant | 22:38 |
| epitron | fuzzy categories are fuzzy | 22:38 |
| epitron | tight categories are not :) | 22:38 |
| fenn | epitron: social knowledge is knowledge spread throughout a society | 22:38 |
| epitron | it all depends on how you define their boundaries | 22:38 |
| fenn | i'm pretty sure all categories are fuzzy | 22:39 |
| epitron | what about the category of all people who are exactly 5 feet tall | 22:39 |
| epitron | without shoes | 22:39 |
| fenn | that's not a category | 22:39 |
| epitron | when they wake up | 22:39 |
| epitron | :D | 22:39 |
| epitron | why isn't that a category? | 22:39 |
| epitron | category | 22:40 |
| epitron | n 1: a collection of things sharing a common attribute; "there | 22:40 |
| epitron | are two classes of detergents" [syn: {class}, {family}] | 22:40 |
| epitron | anyhow this is off the point | 22:40 |
| epitron | how is societal knowledge different from "stuff that can't be derived from first principles"? | 22:40 |
| epitron | you just mean, things that require experience? | 22:40 |
| fenn | some societal knowledge can be derived from mathematics | 22:41 |
| fenn | but then you have to derive it | 22:41 |
| fenn | i'm not interested in deriving things, because it's so hard to prove that it's right without actually testing it out | 22:42 |
| fenn | it might be useful later on though | 22:42 |
| fenn | there's a lot of 'probably's in cyc's output, i'd like to explicitly specify those assertions | 22:44 |
| epitron | so by societal knowledge, you just mean knowledge? | 22:44 |
| fenn | yeah pretty much | 22:45 |
| fenn | but it will be used by a disparate group of users | 22:45 |
| epitron | so this is some kind of collaborate knowledge system | 22:46 |
| fenn | people who dont necessarily know each other or have the same focus and goals | 22:46 |
| epitron | i think the wiki page would be better if it didn't talk about implementation before it's described the goals :) | 22:47 |
| fenn | um, it does | 22:48 |
| -!- Noahj [n=noah@ip68-14-89-105.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 22:50 | |
| epitron | "The societal engineering knowledge database (skdb) is kind of like aptitude, yum, CPAN, rpm, etc., in that it hosts modules (blackboxes) for projects, whether digital or physical." | 22:52 |
| epitron | that's implementation | 22:52 |
| fenn | ok maybe not | 22:52 |
| fenn | wah. | 22:52 |
| epitron | you guys are attemping to solve a pretty difficult problem by yourselves | 22:52 |
| epitron | you should probably try to combine your efforts with other people who are trying to do the same thing | 22:53 |
| fenn | jeez this guy throws some AI jargon around like there's no tomorrow | 23:01 |
| fenn | "a small number of what we call sibling disjoint assertions in the knowledge base take the place of billions of class level disjointness assertions and hundreds of trillions of instance level non-set membership assertions" | 23:02 |
| kanzure | epitron: yes, the wiki page needs more work. I learned about OSCOMAK or whatever yesterday, and knew it was the same thing, but then realized that the wiki page didn't make this clear. | 23:17 |
| kanzure | epitron: also, there may be a better introduction on the self-replication page that describes the goals | 23:18 |
| kanzure | remember the idea about fishing out Hamiltonian cycles to find self-replicators? | 23:19 |
| kanzure | I remember you not being interested in that | 23:19 |
| kanzure | so that's probably why you don't remember. | 23:19 |
| epitron | haha | 23:19 |
| epitron | i'm not interested in the technical details until i know what the point is :) | 23:19 |
| epitron | that's all | 23:19 |
| kanzure | I've already told you the point | 23:19 |
| kanzure | you're still disinterested | 23:19 |
| kanzure | :( | 23:19 |
| epitron | ok :) | 23:19 |
| epitron | it's not that it's not cool | 23:19 |
| epitron | i just don't care about the nitty gritty | 23:19 |
| epitron | just like you probably don't care about the nitty gritty of whtaever weird esoteric thing i find intersting | 23:20 |
| kanzure | nope, remember I have my Infinite Motivator Drive. | 23:20 |
| epitron | i'm sure i can run it down :) | 23:20 |
| Aulere | epitron: have you *seen* heybryan.org? I wouldn't be so sure ;-) | 23:26 |
| kanzure | no, he hasn't | 23:27 |
| kanzure | he doesn't click on links. | 23:27 |
| Aulere | hehe | 23:28 |
| epitron | kanzure: i do click on your links | 23:38 |
| epitron | then i am confronted with a confounding mess of details | 23:38 |
| epitron | :) | 23:39 |
| epitron | and i close them | 23:39 |
| epitron | some of the pages are good... i can tell what it's about by the Table of Contents | 23:39 |
| epitron | but there's generally no introduction or summary | 23:39 |
| epitron | i mean, i'm not saying it should be different... | 23:40 |
| epitron | if you're working on something on the cutting edge, it has to be a mess first | 23:40 |
| epitron | you organize it and figure out the underlying coherent structure as you go along | 23:40 |
| epitron | but i don't wanna read it | 23:40 |
| epitron | :) | 23:40 |
| kanzure | I did a quick speed-post over at the Slashdot article on RepRap | 23:58 |
| kanzure | http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=514462&cid=22996516 | 23:58 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
