| --- Day changed Tue Jun 29 2010 | ||
| kanzure | carbon hype! http://designfiles.org/~bryan/hplus-summit-2010/d1s1-3-andrew-hessel.html | 00:20 |
|---|---|---|
| kanzure | choo-choo! let's all get aboard the carbon express. | 00:21 |
| genehacker | diamond train? | 00:30 |
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| Alystair | hm this is unhealthy | 01:41 |
| Alystair | 55 hours with no sleep so far | 01:41 |
| Alystair | maybe I should pass out | 01:41 |
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| kanzure | biocurious on makezine http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2010/06/biocurious_a_hackerspace_for_biotec.html | 04:21 |
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| pmetzger | morning. | 06:53 |
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| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone. | 06:58 |
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| phryk | Morning to you, too. | 07:14 |
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| streety | afternoon | 07:25 |
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| pmetzger | morning | 07:32 |
| kanzure | pmetzger: how did the meeting go last night | 07:37 |
| pmetzger | not bad. Went through chapter 1. | 07:37 |
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| kanzure | "citsci genomics study" | 08:15 |
| kanzure | wtf | 08:16 |
| kanzure | http://www.odesk.com/jobs/Biology-Blog-Bootstrap_~~5937b95b671c3777 | 08:16 |
| kanzure | "am looking for someone to find articles on Biohacking and home biology labs. " | 08:16 |
| kanzure | someone is hiring someone to find articles for them? | 08:16 |
| kanzure | but what about: http://openwetware.org/wiki/DIYbio/FAQ#Has_DIYbio_been_in_the_news.3F | 08:16 |
| streety | fairly standard for the spam blogs | 08:17 |
| streety | pay someone in a developing country to write low quality but 'unique' posts and then throw up advertising and wait for the long tail search results | 08:18 |
| pmetzger | I'm really worried about all that infosmog eventually fucking the net. | 08:21 |
| pmetzger | luckily google seems to rate such things very low. | 08:21 |
| streety | It depends a lot on the query. Clearly they receive enough visitors for the site to be profitable on average | 08:24 |
| kanzure | pmetzger: you know about 'autoblogs'? | 08:25 |
| pmetzger | not under that name, but I can guess what they are. | 08:25 |
| pmetzger | scrapers + publish = make a few pennies here and there. | 08:26 |
| pmetzger | and reduce the quality of information on the network. | 08:26 |
| pmetzger | I had a friend who made a few hundred k a year for a couple of years gaming google before google figured it out... | 08:26 |
| kanzure | basically what some of them do is scrape the google.com/trends site and then find blogs that have that content | 08:27 |
| kanzure | then you ride the spike for 'trending topics' | 08:27 |
| kanzure | of course, there are others that just scrape rss feed data from whatever sites the spammers are targeting | 08:27 |
| streety | bonus points for automatic domain registration, automatic customisation of templates etc | 08:28 |
| * kanzure nods | 08:28 | |
| kanzure | i cry a little bit every day for knowing any of that. | 08:28 |
| pmetzger | and then archive.org preserves the crap forever. | 08:30 |
| pmetzger | I hate spammers of all sorts. Sigh. | 08:30 |
| kanzure | maybe i should throw up some kickstarter projects | 08:38 |
| kanzure | and then throw money at the projects | 08:38 |
| kanzure | to artificially inflate their popularity? | 08:38 |
| kanzure | O_o | 08:38 |
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| streety | what sort of fees does kickstarter charge? | 08:42 |
| streety | 5% apparently which isn't too bad | 08:43 |
| kanzure | 5% | 08:43 |
| kanzure | http://www.kickstarter.com/help/faq#WhatFeesDoesKickChar | 08:43 |
| streety | 1-2% above credit card fees | 08:44 |
| streety | catch you later | 08:45 |
| kanzure | cya | 08:45 |
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| kanzure | "where is diybio right now?" | 09:03 |
| kanzure | "somewhere between the kitchen and the garden" | 09:03 |
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| JayDugger | Good afternoon, everyone. See you all this evening. | 09:28 |
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| kanzure | "And an FDA devices DIYBio meetup on Thursday the 24th" anybody have the details on this? | 10:29 |
| bkero | Everybody's going to show up and get V&'d for being POTENTIAL BIOTERRISTS | 10:30 |
| genehacker | FDA and DIYbio? | 10:30 |
| kanzure | federal death administration | 10:32 |
| kanzure | or is it fascist death administration? | 10:32 |
| genehacker | fascist death administration | 10:33 |
| genehacker | according to some rightwing radio personalities I think | 10:33 |
| kanzure | http://www.meetup.com/BioCurious/calendar/13781670/ | 10:33 |
| kanzure | " | 10:33 |
| kanzure | "The Business of Drug and Device Development - regulation and approval essentials | 10:33 |
| kanzure | " | 10:33 |
| kanzure | "The Business of Drug and Device Development - what you need to know about regulation and the approval process " | 10:33 |
| kanzure | host: srihari yamanoor | 10:34 |
| kanzure | "As an entrepreneur, one of the most important balls you will juggle will be regulation. As you get more serious about your endeavor and seek funds you will notice that investors and others will seek out your "regulatory plan". It is key to develop a thorough understanding of the regulatory process, what the FDA looks for, and the strategies companies adopt to ensure as smooth an approval process as possible." | 10:34 |
| kanzure | "The class will discuss the approval processes primarily focused on drugs and medical devices. We will talk about the different stages of the approval process involved in therapeutics. This will be followed by a discussion on medical device approval process. We will discuss the various classes of medical devices, how to determine the classification of your device. | 10:34 |
| genehacker | it's long and arduous | 10:34 |
| kanzure | "Frequently, your devices and drugs will go through clinical trials in Europe, Mexico and other locations. We will discuss the need for this, how to initiate clinical trials in these locations, and how to work with the FDA throughout the process to ensure that the trials meet the standards for safety and effectiveness, essential for approval." | 10:34 |
| kanzure | this is pretty crazy | 10:34 |
| genehacker | WE'LL JUST CALL IT A SUPPLEMENT INSTEAD | 10:34 |
| kanzure | why is this being hosted at biocurious | 10:34 |
| bkero | HERBAL SUPPLEMENT | 10:34 |
| bkero | All natural | 10:35 |
| kanzure | while i fully support proper device testing, why not just make it a kit for a device instead of selling the device | 10:35 |
| genehacker | HERBAL POTASSIUM DICHROMATE | 10:35 |
| kanzure | let the person who sells the fully assembled device bare the cost of FDA nonsense | 10:35 |
| genehacker | someone managed to pass off potassium dichromate as a supplement | 10:36 |
| genehacker | results weren't pretty as potassium dichromate is an excellent oxidizing agent | 10:36 |
| pmetzger | DIY and regulation are not very compatible. | 10:36 |
| genehacker | pmetzger | 10:36 |
| pmetzger | the whole diy spirit is to play with things without spending much cash. | 10:37 |
| genehacker | I got some books for you | 10:37 |
| pmetzger | try to innovate in a lightweight way. | 10:37 |
| pmetzger | genehacker: what sort of books? :) | 10:37 |
| pmetzger | I own too many books. :) | 10:37 |
| genehacker | engineering books | 10:37 |
| pmetzger | OOOH! :) | 10:37 |
| AJollyLife | blasphemy! | 10:37 |
| AJollyLife | what is this "too many books" you speak of | 10:37 |
| pmetzger | No, seriously. I live in a 900sqft apartment, and every wall is bookshelves. | 10:38 |
| kanzure | hmm derek jacoby is at singularity university | 10:38 |
| pmetzger | And I no longer have space on said bookshelves. | 10:38 |
| pmetzger | jacobi you mean? | 10:38 |
| pmetzger | The last time I re-orged the books to fit, I took about 20 book moving boxes down to the used bookstore to sell and I didn't notice the change in the size of my collection. | 10:39 |
| kanzure | pmetzger: no, it's Derek Jacoby <derekja@gmail.com> | 10:39 |
| AJollyLife | i guess i can understand that. i have been trying to shift more to e-books where possible | 10:39 |
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| bkero | AJollyLife: epub? :3 | 10:44 |
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| AJollyLife | bkero: mostly. i've got a nook, and it works quite well with epub | 10:45 |
| kanzure | gah i need to keep 'ryan bethencourt' and 'ryan ogle' separate in my mind. ogle is the one who runs genoblasts.com, right? | 10:45 |
| bkero | AJollyLife: I went the nook route as well. Have you had much luck converting PDFs? | 10:45 |
| AJollyLife | bkero: try calibre, but i usually dont bother with pdf's on the nook | 10:45 |
| AJollyLife | there is also a nookdevs channel :) | 10:46 |
| bkero | I have a 10 gig PDF collection. ePubs are harder to come by | 10:46 |
| bkero | s/come by/pirate/ | 10:46 |
| lepton | I just got a Hanvon N516 and I'm running openinkpot on it | 10:46 |
| lepton | I'm pretty happy | 10:46 |
| lepton | Though it's PDF display is very so-so | 10:46 |
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| lepton | Not as good as my old Booken Cybook 3, | 10:46 |
| AJollyLife | its not as nice as my old irex illiads, but more durable | 10:47 |
| lepton | I've had moderatly good success converting my PDF library (for novels, not journal articles) into epub | 10:47 |
| bkero | lepton: how much did you pay for it if you don't mind me asking? | 10:47 |
| lepton | I used calibre for the conversion^ | 10:47 |
| lepton | $200 | 10:47 |
| AJollyLife | the nook wifi only is only $!50 | 10:47 |
| AJollyLife | *150* | 10:47 |
| lepton | I'm thinking about CNCing an aluminum replacement for it's plastic body | 10:47 |
| bkero | Nook with 3G is only $200 :P | 10:48 |
| lepton | I know! That's what made me decide to get an ebook again | 10:48 |
| AJollyLife | meh, i would have bought the wifi only one if I had a choice | 10:48 |
| lepton | But the n516 seemed nice to mee | 10:48 |
| bkero | I'd have paid the $150 too, I paid $260 instead for the 3G | 10:49 |
| lepton | I almost went with the nook... I had hoped openinkpot would do better with PDF's than the nook | 10:49 |
| lepton | but I don't think that's the case | 10:49 |
| bkero | Nook PDF problems are entirely the screen | 10:49 |
| bkero | That screen doesn't look much better :/ | 10:49 |
| AJollyLife | its not high enough resolution really | 10:49 |
| genehacker | don't use aluminium, it has no fatigue limit | 10:50 |
| genehacker | and thus will develop random fractures over repeated load cycles | 10:50 |
| bkero | genehacker: What's a load cycle in the context of an ebook reader? | 10:51 |
| genehacker | being jostled around in a backpack | 10:51 |
| bkero | It's very hard to quantify that into cycles :P | 10:51 |
| genehacker | there are ways to make reasonable guesses | 10:52 |
| genehacker | my laptop has undergone sufficient load cycles that it has developed fatigue cracks | 10:52 |
| genehacker | reasonable guesses are what they use to make sure airplanes don't fall out of the sky | 10:53 |
| bkero | Sure, but they usually base that off empirical evidence | 10:53 |
| lepton | bkero: it's actually pretty easy to calculate | 10:57 |
| lepton | You're right about that as aluminum's failure mechanism, but that's pretty trivial for something like an ebook reader, imo | 10:57 |
| lepton | Compared to plastic with an ebook screen, if a machine out an aluminum case, I'll be better off :) | 10:58 |
| lepton | *eink screen | 10:58 |
| AJollyLife | the smaller size ebook readers are not too bad, but I had two illiads die on me :( | 10:59 |
| lepton | My cybook died pretty quickly (6") from me accidently sitting on it | 11:00 |
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| bkero | lol | 11:03 |
| bkero | I really want an eink screen in a laptop | 11:04 |
| bkero | Since all I use a laptop for is firefox and a terminal, I think I'd be alright | 11:04 |
| AJollyLife | hmm. not sure if there is a vnc client yet for the nook | 11:04 |
| AJollyLife | there is a vnc server.. | 11:04 |
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| bkero | Nook is a bit too sluggish running android for something like that to be very usable | 11:05 |
| bkero | I still think that the browser is a joke | 11:05 |
| AJollyLife | im pretty sure the eink refresh rate is slower than the hardware | 11:05 |
| lepton | I've found that openinkpot seems to hang if I press a button while the screen is refreshing | 11:06 |
| lepton | Which is sad, I don't have having to reset the device twice in one coffee shop sitting :/ | 11:06 |
| lepton | That disrupts my smug sense of satisfaction about running open software on all my devices | 11:06 |
| AJollyLife | im fairly happy with my nook | 11:06 |
| bkero | I've only had a single hardware problem with it | 11:07 |
| bkero | The side buttons for page flips | 11:07 |
| bkero | Plastic is a bit too brittle, it cracked on one side. | 11:07 |
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| AJollyLife | bkero: go tell b&n they will replace it | 11:21 |
| bkero | AJollyLife: Really? | 11:21 |
| bkero | It's pretty small, almost trivial. I can only see it if I look at the side while I press the button | 11:21 |
| AJollyLife | bkero: yeah, you are not the only one to have that problem | 11:22 |
| bkero | Really? | 11:22 |
| bkero | They'll just replace it? | 11:22 |
| AJollyLife | yep | 11:22 |
| bkero | Well shit | 11:22 |
| bkero | Awesome | 11:22 |
| AJollyLife | yeah, i was not going to bother, then someone in the nookdevs forum said they had the same issue | 11:22 |
| bkero | I can do it in person? | 11:22 |
| AJollyLife | im hoping they fixed it with newer revisions | 11:22 |
| AJollyLife | dont know about that | 11:22 |
| AJollyLife | but if you call b&n they will ship you a new nook, and you just pack up your old one and send it back, they pay for shipping | 11:23 |
| AJollyLife | so the only annoyance is having to resoftroot your nook | 11:23 |
| AJollyLife | (assuming you softrooted it) | 11:23 |
| bkero | Awesome | 11:23 |
| bkero | I haven't softrooted it even | 11:23 |
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| * bkero has to go for lunch, but I'll continue this dialogue | 11:24 | |
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| pmetzger | http://wondermark.com/634/ | 11:41 |
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| pmetzger | if one has a CNC and can machine aluminum cases for one's e-reader, then even if they crack, one can machine a new case at will. :) | 11:41 |
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| AJollyLife | but the real danger is the screen getting damaged | 11:44 |
| AJollyLife | not the case | 11:44 |
| pmetzger | for me the real issue is that I only care about 8.5x11 PDFs in practice. | 11:49 |
| pmetzger | I want an e-reader that does *that*. :) | 11:49 |
| lepton | That's what I'm wanting, too | 11:52 |
| lepton | Why bother having a library of 10,000 technical papers, when you can't take them anywhere without a laptop or way too much paper | 11:53 |
| pmetzger | Maybe a commercial screen and laptop in a custom case.... | 11:53 |
| pmetzger | I take my laptop everywhere anyway. | 11:53 |
| pmetzger | the problem for me is only that the laptop is too distracting and consumes too much power. | 11:53 |
| AJollyLife | pmetzger: this is why i usually bring my netbook to conferences | 11:56 |
| pmetzger | netbooks are too small for me. | 11:57 |
| pmetzger | My hands cramp. | 11:57 |
| pmetzger | and the screens are tiny. | 11:57 |
| pmetzger | I use a 17" MacBook for a reason... | 11:57 |
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| AJollyLife | yeah, netbook is for travel/conferences | 12:00 |
| pmetzger | I carry the 17" laptop everywhere. I have a backpack with a special pocket for it from Tom Bihn. | 12:01 |
| AJollyLife | i <3 my tom bihn bags | 12:01 |
| pmetzger | I never see any reason to use another machine EXCEPT that I'd like a lightweight thing with O(24h) battery life and no function other than reading ebooks to keep me from getting distracted while reading. | 12:02 |
| pmetzger | to avoid continuous partial attention in other words. | 12:02 |
| AJollyLife | i <3 my nook for travel, and it also fits nicely in my blazer pocket | 12:06 |
| klafka | AJollyLife, tom bihn bags are awesome | 12:09 |
| pmetzger | too small for my technical PDFs, UI isn't great, proprietary interfaces. | 12:09 |
| pmetzger | (nook) | 12:09 |
| pmetzger | but I do like the general idea of the nook and kindle. | 12:09 |
| AJollyLife | klafka: pmetzger: i own two tom bihn bags | 12:09 |
| klafka | i've never known anyone else to know about them | 12:10 |
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| klafka | i have the brain bag | 12:10 |
| pmetzger | the one is generally enough for me. I can put two days of clothes and my tools in it and go. | 12:10 |
| klafka | yeah i can fit a bunch of clothes + laptop + cables | 12:10 |
| pmetzger | I have a brain bag + snake charmer for my cables. | 12:11 |
| pmetzger | 17" brain cell. | 12:11 |
| klafka | aah i should get a snake charmer thing | 12:11 |
| pmetzger | and a freudian slip for my notebooks etc. | 12:11 |
| AJollyLife | ive got a brainbag and a....um | 12:11 |
| AJollyLife | i had a braincell then lost it in india | 12:12 |
| pmetzger | I sometimes think about getting a scott evest. | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | i have a brainbag and an aeronaut | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | pmetzger: ive had lots of scottevests | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | im wearing one right now | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | id have more but my stupid ex'gfs dog ate them | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | er. actually, i should say my ex gf's stupid dog. | 12:12 |
| AJollyLife | pmetzger: every year they have an anniversary sale, around the start of the year. wait for then for the best deals | 12:13 |
| pmetzger | problem is, I don't need one enough, and in the summer they're probably too hot, at least in NY. | 12:14 |
| AJollyLife | i would not pay full retail...and you could easily wear the lighter ones in nyc | 12:14 |
| AJollyLife | I mostly wear mine indoors here in florida | 12:14 |
| pmetzger | I think you may have different standards for the temperature range you find comfortable. | 12:15 |
| AJollyLife | probably, im usually cold | 12:15 |
| pmetzger | I'm generally too warm except in quite frigid temperatures. | 12:15 |
| klafka | hmm i've never heard of these before | 12:15 |
| klafka | the first and only line of ipad compatible clothing | 12:15 |
| klafka | lol | 12:15 |
| AJollyLife | ive been wearing them for 5 years or so | 12:16 |
| klafka | do they have weather ratings on them? | 12:16 |
| AJollyLife | so convenient | 12:16 |
| AJollyLife | they have a page someplace showing which ones they suggest for what sort of weather | 12:16 |
| klafka | aah | 12:16 |
| pmetzger | photographers vests are another option I've considered but they're less attractive. | 12:17 |
| klafka | the cold of rochester ny is far more severe than most hoodies can ahndle | 12:17 |
| klafka | *handle | 12:17 |
| AJollyLife | pmetzger: it depends what you want to use them for, depending on the model you can get some really nie scott-e-vests | 12:18 |
| AJollyLife | most of the models i really liked they dont sell anymore though :( | 12:18 |
| klafka | they are wicked pricey | 12:19 |
| AJollyLife | klafka: i would not pay retail for them, their best sale every year is the anniversary sale sometime near the start of the year | 12:19 |
| klafka | cool | 12:20 |
| klafka | yeah | 12:20 |
| klafka | wise man | 12:20 |
| kanzure | weird scipy 2008 animation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnaF24aVWTE | 12:36 |
| kanzure | i'm looking over old slides to scipy conferences | 12:44 |
| kanzure | http://conference.scipy.org/SciPy2009/slides.html | 12:44 |
| kanzure | http://conference.scipy.org/SciPy2008/slides.html | 12:44 |
| kanzure | in general the slides tend to suck | 12:44 |
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| kanzure | and there doesn't seem to be any videos on the net | 12:44 |
| kanzure | any suggestions for how to do the presentations tomorrow? | 12:45 |
| AJollyLife | kanzure: what are you trying to do? | 12:46 |
| kanzure | what? i'm trying to prep for a good presentation :P | 12:47 |
| kanzure | i'm presenting on pythonOCC and datapkg | 12:48 |
| AJollyLife | good books on slide development include slideology, and presentationzen | 12:48 |
| kanzure | go look at the scipy2008 slides (linked above) | 12:49 |
| kanzure | it doesn't look like the audience is going to be happy with slides without ridiculously long blocks of text & code | 12:49 |
| pmetzger | doing a good presentation is mostly a matter of having done a lot of presentations and having seen a lot of them. it is hard to teach. | 12:49 |
| AJollyLife | kanzure: thats not a presentation, thats a document | 12:50 |
| kanzure | well how do these technical conferences work anyway? | 12:50 |
| kanzure | are you supposed to present code and best practices, or just pictures and rhetoric? | 12:50 |
| kanzure | i presented at texas linux fest earlier this year, and it went over mildly okay | 12:50 |
| kanzure | but i have a feeling i should have been more technical | 12:51 |
| kanzure | seeing as how the people in the audience /built/ debian and the kernel.. | 12:51 |
| kanzure | the people in my audience are probably core python devs and swig devs | 12:51 |
| AJollyLife | yeah, really depends on teh audience. at the least you need the more technical info available | 12:51 |
| kanzure | ah here's a presentation from pycon08 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR3rIVLjA-U | 12:53 |
| lepton | I really like your "pull a debian on physical objects" line (I'm sure I'm misquoting) | 12:55 |
| lepton | That's a good one to throw out | 12:55 |
| kanzure | :) | 12:56 |
| kanzure | it only works when people have used debian | 12:56 |
| kanzure | which is like 0.00001% of the target audience | 12:56 |
| kanzure | or something | 12:56 |
| kanzure | lepton: btw, skdb development is going to kick back up again once i finish with this damn pystep minilibrary thingy | 12:57 |
| lepton | Yeah, I gues the Linux Fest is really the ideal for those sorts of comments | 12:57 |
| kanzure | to be honest i didn't get a /ton/ of feedback from the linux fest audience | 12:57 |
| kanzure | i got about 5 people interested and talking with me | 12:57 |
| kanzure | whereas hplus summit was more like 15 to 25 follow-ups | 12:57 |
| AJollyLife | h+ was a very engaged crowd | 12:58 |
| kanzure | the linux fest seemed to be more focused on "year of the desktop" | 12:58 |
| lepton | Nice to hear on skdb dev | 12:58 |
| kanzure | commits have been dwindling, if you haven't noticed ;) | 12:59 |
| lepton | We're pretty interested in trying to integrate some of our projects into skdb as test runs, or such | 12:59 |
| lepton | Haven't noticed | 12:59 |
| lepton | I've had my head stuck in EMC2 land for the past month | 12:59 |
| klafka | what does "pull a debian" mean | 12:59 |
| kanzure | for now the skdb workflow looks like: start a .git repository -> commit your designs (hopefully in openscad or pystep, or at worst STEP/IGES but not STL) -> define "interfaces" on the devices | 13:00 |
| kanzure | the interface definition is so that we can do assembly CAD | 13:00 |
| kanzure | like linking up two different CAD objects at their two specified interface vectors | 13:00 |
| kanzure | i.e. a screw in a hole.. | 13:00 |
| kanzure | also, just so that you can yell at me later | 13:04 |
| kanzure | one of the recent 'additions' that hasn't been really an addition is the acceptance of stub packages | 13:04 |
| kanzure | so that we can do dependency resolution even without having those dependencies resolved. | 13:04 |
| kanzure | i.e. here's a lot of stub packages: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/thingiverse/thingiverse_packages/ | 13:04 |
| kanzure | also while i'm at it | 13:05 |
| kanzure | i need someone with a makerbot or reprap to really ride my ass about hooking up skdb to a 3d goo squirter | 13:06 |
| kanzure | i.e. to demonstrate an apt-get-then-build-it-for-realz-yo workflow. | 13:06 |
| cluckj | that would rule | 13:08 |
| kanzure | klafka: "pull a debian" means that we use package maintainers to offset the pains of users. do you use apt-get? | 13:09 |
| fenn | i love how one of the features is 'nonradioactive' http://usa.hanvon.com/e-book_reader/196.shtml | 13:09 |
| klafka | aah | 13:09 |
| klafka | kanzure, no i don't use any debian based OS atm | 13:10 |
| kanzure | maybe there was a radioactive book reader in the past | 13:10 |
| klafka | but i am familiar w/ it | 13:10 |
| kanzure | and everyone got cancer in the eye | 13:10 |
| AJollyLife | im hoping what they are trying to say is they use nonemitting screens | 13:20 |
| fenn | wow the nook is only 480x144? | 13:20 |
| AJollyLife | im sure its more than that | 13:20 |
| AJollyLife | the eink side is 800x600 | 13:21 |
| fenn | oh it has multiple displays? | 13:21 |
| AJollyLife | i think you mean the lcd part is only 480x144 | 13:21 |
| AJollyLife | it has a top eink screen, and a bottom touch sensitive lcd screen | 13:21 |
| fenn | oh, right, so i can see the fancy book cover art P | 13:21 |
| fenn | "i hope you werent planning on imagining the main character as other than the hollywood interpretation" | 13:22 |
| fenn | i love how it was 1984 that Amazon deleted remotely.. almost makes you wonder if it was some kind of prank | 13:27 |
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| kanzure | fenn: any last minute suggestions for my pythonOCC talk and datapkg talk? | 13:48 |
| kanzure | pythonocc talk is 20min, datapkg is 10min | 13:48 |
| kanzure | oops, pythonocc is 15min | 13:48 |
| kanzure | oh it's at the at&t building at utexas.edu, convenient. | 13:49 |
| fenn | is pythonocc actually pythonic yet? | 13:51 |
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| fenn | i.e. does it segfault if you forget to intialize some thingybopper before using it | 13:52 |
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| kanzure | fenn: thomas and jelle will tell you to look at Level2API.py but it sucks. | 13:52 |
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| kanzure | so, no | 13:52 |
| kanzure | *so, no, it's not pythonic yet | 13:53 |
| fenn | makes me wonder if they arent better off using cython | 13:53 |
| fenn | swig is just such a pain in the ass | 13:53 |
| kanzure | is my usual talk style sufficient for a python conference? | 13:56 |
| kanzure | based off your "extensive" viewing experience at python conferences :P | 13:56 |
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| kanzure | so, since i'm going up to singularity university | 14:15 |
| kanzure | i was wondering if anyone has suggestions | 14:15 |
| klafka | you should try and get them to ascribe to some sort of plurality | 14:16 |
| kanzure | for things to pitch and propose that won't become victim to "falling behind the curve" | 14:16 |
| kanzure | s/curve/curves/ | 14:19 |
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| kanzure | def update_parameters(self): | 14:29 |
| kanzure | super(self.__class__, self).update_parameters() | 14:29 |
| kanzure | am i doing it wrong? that produces a max recursion depth reached error | 14:29 |
| kanzure | i just want to call the super's update_parameters() as if i was making an instance of whatever the super is | 14:30 |
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| kanzure | weird, i don't think it's really calling the super. | 14:35 |
| kanzure | er, getting the parent class i mean | 14:35 |
| pmetzger | Who is paying your way to S.U.? It is insanely expensive, right? | 14:37 |
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| kanzure | pmetzger: yes, it's insanely expensive | 14:38 |
| kanzure | andrew hessel is paying. | 14:38 |
| kanzure | this is andrew: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=niQ0kkgPxJk (also, this is a good intro to synthetic biology) | 14:38 |
| pmetzger | paying personally? | 14:38 |
| kanzure | dunno, should i ask? is that something that uh.. that i should ask? | 14:39 |
| pmetzger | I'm guessing not... | 14:39 |
| pmetzger | (that is, I'm guessing he isn't paying personally.) | 14:41 |
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| klafka | kanzure, oh you're like going to attend the college | 14:51 |
| klafka | not just going to visit | 14:51 |
| klafka | or what have you | 14:51 |
| * kanzure nods | 14:51 | |
| klafka | is it a degree granting institute? | 14:51 |
| kanzure | no | 14:52 |
| kanzure | http://singularityu.org/ | 14:52 |
| kanzure | http://singularityu.org/people/faculty-advisors/ | 14:52 |
| klafka | are you doing the graduate studies program? | 14:53 |
| kanzure | i think so, yes | 14:53 |
| kanzure | i'm definitely not doing the executive thing :P | 14:53 |
| pmetzger | kiind of weird calling it a "university" when it is really a conference... | 14:53 |
| pmetzger | or something like a conference really. | 14:54 |
| klafka | mm | 14:54 |
| kanzure | nobody would pay $25k to go to it | 14:54 |
| kanzure | pmetzger: it's basically peter diamandis rackeetering again | 14:54 |
| kanzure | he also did 'space university' | 14:54 |
| lepton | The university monkier does seem to be a poor descriptor | 14:56 |
| klafka | kanzure, what track are you gonan do? | 14:56 |
| lepton | and the pricing does seem rather ludicris | 14:56 |
| kanzure | klafka: i think you're allowed to do everything | 14:56 |
| klafka | oh | 14:56 |
| klafka | i've never heard of these guys in the biotech/bioinfo | 14:56 |
| kanzure | yeah they have a pretty weak biotech program | 14:57 |
| klafka | lol "future studies and forecasting" | 14:57 |
| kanzure | i know andrew, ray, aubrey | 14:57 |
| klafka | with KURZWEIL | 14:57 |
| kanzure | daniel is doing 'cure together' .. surely there's more high class individuals to invite | 14:57 |
| kanzure | and one guy in 'developmental biology' lawl | 14:57 |
| bkero | AJollyLife: yo | 14:59 |
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| kanzure | random mention of "bio-hacking" http://www.archadia.nl/?p=134 | 15:32 |
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| jrayhawk | words inappropriately prepended by "clue" are bad enough, making a domain and book out of one is just begging not to be taken seriously | 15:41 |
| jrayhawk | re: cluetrain.com | 15:41 |
| kanzure | that's some backlog, sir. | 15:44 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, sorry, forgot how scrolled up irssi was. | 15:45 |
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| kanzure | genehacker: i'm presenting tomorrow on campus in the at&t building at 12:30 or something. | 15:48 |
| kanzure | on pythonocc | 15:48 |
| genehacker | about? | 15:48 |
| kanzure | http://pythonocc.org/ | 15:48 |
| kanzure | python + CAD | 15:48 |
| genehacker | ok | 15:49 |
| genehacker | I going on a tour of the UT powerplant at that time | 15:49 |
| lepton | pythonocc woo woo! | 15:49 |
| lepton | *goes back to work | 15:49 |
| genehacker | I have to model it | 15:49 |
| jrayhawk | Still, it's creepy to take nascent youth culture from Usenet circa fifteen years ago and pretend that it's paradigmicly fresh today. I wonder if self-promoting hacks will be coopting 4chan memes fifteen years from now. | 15:50 |
| jrayhawk | I should try writing a book applying Kibology to corporate management. | 15:50 |
| kanzure | 4chan: the next corporate management sparadigm shift | 15:51 |
| kanzure | "every corporation needs an internal 4chan board system" | 15:51 |
| kanzure | sparadigm? wtf | 15:51 |
| jrayhawk | the anonymous posting of ideas is important | 15:51 |
| jrayhawk | especially goatse | 15:52 |
| genehacker | hmmm.... let me see here | 15:52 |
| kanzure | jrayhawk: every once in a while a corporation needs an enema to make sure everything is flowing correctly | 15:52 |
| jrayhawk | haha | 15:52 |
| genehacker | where's my corporate management bullshitting framework | 15:52 |
| kanzure | genehacker: sorry, you're already living it | 15:53 |
| kanzure | (utexas.edu) | 15:53 |
| jrayhawk | sometimes the ass-end of the org chart needs to just let loose on the face of management | 15:53 |
| kanzure | i forsee thousands of poorly photoshopped images of corporate executives getting bum raped | 15:54 |
| genehacker | hardly | 15:54 |
| jrayhawk | sounds like somebody needs to put on his clueshoes and go out to his cluecar and drive out the the cluestore and buy a 12-pack of clue | 15:57 |
| jrayhawk | yeah, that's right, i went there | 15:57 |
| jrayhawk | re: sparadigm: i didn't think you were that poor, dude :( | 15:59 |
| genehacker | 4chan corporate management system leverages anonymous content posting with memetic propagation to enhance workforce performance | 16:01 |
| AJollyLife | bkero: whats up? | 16:02 |
| bkero | I dunno | 16:02 |
| bkero | Nook stuff | 16:02 |
| genehacker | does the nook have free 3g internet? | 16:04 |
| bkero | Yes | 16:04 |
| genehacker | holy shit that's awesome | 16:04 |
| genehacker | no download caps? | 16:05 |
| AJollyLife | bkero: genehacker: no it does not :P | 16:05 |
| bkero | AJollyLife: new android web browser app on the nook allows me to browse the web over it | 16:07 |
| AJollyLife | bkero: thats over wifi, not 3g. | 16:08 |
| bkero | AJollyLife: The original browser is over wifi, a stock android web browser can get data over 3g | 16:08 |
| AJollyLife | yes, if you replace the sim card with your own sim card | 16:08 |
| genehacker | so no free 3g then | 16:09 |
| AJollyLife | otherwise the existing sim is fairly locked down to bn stuff | 16:09 |
| bkero | I put my nook sim into a G1 and was able to poke around on the internet with it | 16:09 |
| AJollyLife | i mean, you are free to hop over to #nookdevs and ask there | 16:09 |
| bkero | Had to go through a B&N proxy, but it worked | 16:09 |
| AJollyLife | wha? interesting. hop over to #nookdevs and tell some other people? I had not tried it myself, but I was told it was quite locked down. i mostly bothered with reversing the drm myself | 16:11 |
| genehacker | so you figured out how to get free data over 3g? | 16:11 |
| kanzure | fenn: did you know about this? http://toddhuffman.pbworks.com/ | 16:11 |
| kanzure | designing a path to organism emulation http://hplusclub.com/tucson/presentation20071116/ | 16:12 |
| kanzure | http://www.amazon.com/Enhancing-Me-Enhancement-Science-TechKnow/dp/0470724099 | 16:12 |
| bkero | I'm working on data over 3g | 16:13 |
| kanzure | The Arrest of Biological Time as a Bridge to Engineered Negligble Senescence http://www.annalsnyas.org/cgi/content/abstract/1019/1/559 | 16:13 |
| kanzure | Selective Attention Affect Human Brain Stem Frequency-Following Response http://www.neuroreport.com/pt/re/neuroreport/abstract.00001756-200304150-00015.htm | 16:13 |
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| kanzure | guh? | 16:49 |
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| kanzure | while googling around for some stuff for my pystep file | 16:49 |
| kanzure | http://www.wikistep.org/index.php/Main_Page | 16:49 |
| kanzure | stalk: Tom Thurman | 16:50 |
| kanzure | stalk: Lothar Klein | 16:50 |
| kanzure | stalk: Giedrius Liutkus | 16:51 |
| kanzure | http://www.wikistep.org/index.php/User:Tom_Thurman | 16:51 |
| kanzure | http://www.wikistep.org/index.php/User:Lothar_Klein | 16:52 |
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| kanzure | weird. DIMENSIONAL_SIZE in AP214 is one of the few STEP entities with a constructor with a first parameter that is *not* the name (that's the second parameter, in this case) | 16:56 |
| kanzure | http://www.wikistep.org/index.php/GD%26T:_Implementation_Guidelines_For_GD%26T_Representation | 16:56 |
| kanzure | hm.. http://www.wikistep.org/im/index.php | 16:56 |
| kanzure | probably useful: http://www.wikistep.org/index.php/A_single_Piece_Part | 16:57 |
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| kanzure | http://www.steptools.com/support/stdev_docs/express/ap203/html/t_cc_de-06.html guh what a class name "cc_design_person_and_organization_assignment" | 17:01 |
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| bkero | echo index|nc ponderosa.osuosl.org 70 | 17:14 |
| bkero | Hell yea, GOPHER! | 17:14 |
| fenn | haha 'Yes, dear. But how will I "motherstalk" you if you're not on facebook?' | 17:19 |
| Alystair | I read that wrong | 17:47 |
| Alystair | I thought motherstalking was instead of adding your victim you add your victims mom | 17:47 |
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| JayDugger | Good evening, everyone. | 18:04 |
| ybit | hi JayDugger | 18:14 |
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| drazak | kanzure: did you take any math notes in mathematica? | 18:56 |
| kanzure | no, never | 19:04 |
| kanzure | i tried latex once, but it failed | 19:04 |
| kanzure | so i just did a simple html-based markup with <sup> and <sub> and such. | 19:04 |
| cluckj | so did my mom | 19:05 |
| * cluckj rimshot | 19:05 | |
| kanzure | http://instantrimshot.com/ | 19:05 |
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| fenn | woah, here's a question for the diybio people: why do my brussel sprouts taste like horseradish after sitting in the fridge overnight? | 19:26 |
| cluckj | are you eating them cold? | 19:30 |
| fenn | yeah | 19:35 |
| cluckj | sometimes refrigerating veggies changes how they taste | 19:39 |
| cluckj | try letting them come to room temperature | 19:39 |
| drazak | kanzure: I'm going to try it for a few days | 19:40 |
| drazak | kanzure: if it doesn't work well I'll give up | 19:40 |
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| kanzure | ... Step File Reading : /home/kanzure/code/pystep/sphere_attempt.step | 20:28 |
| kanzure | **** StepFile Error : At line 11, parse error **** | 20:28 |
| kanzure | ... STEP File Read ... | 20:28 |
| kanzure | 39 records (entities,sub-lists,scopes), 82 parameters | 20:28 |
| kanzure | Report : 27 unknown entities | 20:28 |
| kanzure | hm.. | 20:28 |
| kanzure | anything look fundamentally wrong with the file? http://designfiles.org/~bryan/sphere_attempt.step | 20:29 |
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| kanzure | updated graph: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/meetlog/2009-07-01_to_2010-06-29.png | 20:40 |
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| fenn | LengthMeasure isn't capitalized | 20:48 |
| fenn | are you using any validation tools? | 20:51 |
| kanzure | no. just loading it up into opencascade | 20:52 |
| kanzure | i get a parse error on each line that begins with # | 20:53 |
| kanzure | oh | 20:53 |
| kanzure | semicolons are required | 20:53 |
| kanzure | dur | 20:53 |
| kanzure | well that didn't fix it. | 20:54 |
| kanzure | s/"/'/g fixed a lot of the errors | 20:55 |
| kanzure | and replacing 'e' with 'E' on line 28 fixed up another error | 20:56 |
| kanzure | now i don't get any parse errors but i only see: | 20:56 |
| kanzure | Report : 16 unknown entities | 20:56 |
| kanzure | i think line #20 needs some work | 20:57 |
| kanzure | hm.. that didn't do it | 21:00 |
| kanzure | if anyone is interested | 21:00 |
| kanzure | http://designfiles.org/~bryan/step.py | 21:00 |
| kanzure | i run this, fix the newline errors surrounding the numbered lines, throw it into a .step file | 21:01 |
| kanzure | then i open up heekscad and load in the .step file, and see the generated errors in the console (the opencascade output) | 21:01 |
| kanzure | then i tweak the .step file until it seems like it's working | 21:01 |
| kanzure | the file that step.py generates should be a simple sphere in heekscad | 21:01 |
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| kanzure | aww shucks | 22:03 |
| kanzure | http://www.pythonocc.org/resources/presentations_events/scipy-2010-python-for-scientific-computing-conference/ | 22:03 |
| kanzure | "Presentation will be made by Bryan Bishop, one of the advanced and most experienced pythonOCC users." | 22:03 |
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| fenn | who knew | 22:14 |
| * ybit wiggles | 22:15 | |
| kanzure | "hurrah we can get it to not crash immediately!" --> most experienced user | 22:15 |
| ybit | :) | 22:15 |
| ybit | data logging in the mtm machine... hrm.. | 22:16 |
| fenn | fwiw, the general rule of thumb is, "if you're using metaclasses, you're doing it wrong" | 22:16 |
| kanzure | fenn: any ideas for a visual representation of b-rep? for csg there's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Csg_tree.png | 22:16 |
| kanzure | i guess i can just list out elements of a b-rep data structure (shell, loop, surfaces, faces, edges, vertices) | 22:18 |
| fenn | maybe something from http://opencascade.blogspot.com/2009/02/topology-and-geometry-in-open-cascade_12.html or http://opencascade.blogspot.com/2009/02/topology-and-geometry-in-open-cascade_27.html | 22:19 |
| fenn | for example you'd explain why a sphere has an edge, if you know :) | 22:19 |
| fenn | but i think the cylinder pic shows how it's two circles and a warped rectangle | 22:19 |
| fenn | er, cylinder pic: http://opencascade.blogspot.com/2009/02/continued.html | 22:20 |
| kanzure | hm i don't know why the sphere has an edge, actually. is it the seam of the surface wrapping back on itself? | 22:20 |
| fenn | http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ZnQO9nI8DrY/SZ8Pqv6R6uI/AAAAAAAAAHs/PReM6FM2Fog/s1600-h/face-normals.PNG | 22:20 |
| fenn | maybe show just the yellow lines | 22:20 |
| fenn | yeah it's the edges of the surface that's wrapped around spherical space | 22:21 |
| kanzure | how is the rectangle 'warped' in the case of the cylinder? | 22:22 |
| kanzure | you mean warped around the base circle's geometry? | 22:22 |
| fenn | maybe better illustration http://www.ann.jussieu.fr/~perronnet/mit/shapes.gif | 22:23 |
| fenn | in the cylinder, it's a surface transformed into a spherical manifold... | 22:23 |
| * kanzure is listening to http://listen.grooveshark.com/#/search/songs/?query=dj%20kewlaid%20berry%20blue%20vocal%20trance%20mix%20004 | 22:23 | |
| fenn | if you use a diagonal line it turns into a helix | 22:24 |
| kanzure | i am now addicted to grooveshark. | 22:24 |
| * fenn listens | 22:24 | |
| kanzure | how is that a 'better' illustration :P | 22:24 |
| fenn | more 'stuff' | 22:24 |
| kanzure | these are python programmers, not perl monks | 22:25 |
| kanzure | they can only tolerate so much | 22:25 |
| fenn | and it shows vertex, edge, shell, solid | 22:25 |
| ybit | fenn: nice diybio email :P | 22:27 |
| fenn | or you could do something like http://www.kxcad.net/autodesk/Autodesk_VIZ_Help/graphics/il_nurbs_sweep2.jpg | 22:27 |
| kanzure | man, this would be much easier to show with a demo | 22:34 |
| fenn | more nurbs http://www.nakl.t.u-tokyo.ac.jp/~masuda/top_images/cmp.jpg | 22:37 |
| fenn | http://www.cadcamcomponents.com/images/gw3df_examples/Multi-Blend-Surface.jpg | 22:41 |
| fenn | http://www.web3d.org/x3d/specifications/OLD/ISO-IEC-19775-X3DAbstractSpecification/Images/NurbsTrimmedSurface.png | 22:43 |
| fenn | the last two together explain the concept nicely | 22:45 |
| fenn | this is kinda cool for a flash toy http://www.neuroproductions.be/uploads/blog/examples/nurbs1/NurbsTest.swf | 22:48 |
| kanzure | guess i'm back | 22:48 |
| kanzure | kxcad.net is the retarded brother of xkcd.com | 22:48 |
| kanzure | also, /sleep | 22:50 |
| drazak | kanzure: do you think it would be useful to post calc notes somewhere on the internet | 23:09 |
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