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| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone, | 06:12 |
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| kanzure | beepity boop | 08:26 |
| JayDugger | When did you learn the binary language of moisture evaporators? | 08:26 |
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| kanzure | azonenberg: yo.. looks like geoff replied | 08:31 |
| kanzure | summer courses for 'neuron' simulator http://www.neuron.yale.edu/neuron/static/courses/nscsd2012/nscsd2012.html (san diego / may) | 08:36 |
| kanzure | "In five days of intensive lectures, demonstrations, and hands-on exercises, this course will cover the principles and practice of the design, construction, and use of models in the NEURON simulation environment." | 08:37 |
| kanzure | "It is designed primarily for those who are concerned with models of biological neurons and neural networks that are closely linked to empirical observations, e.g. experimentalists who wish to incorporate modeling in their research plans, and theoreticians who are interested in the principles of biological computation." | 08:37 |
| kanzure | regarding that pbs/news hour crap from yesterday.. cathal linked to this (which seems like it was made for this?) http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/02/09 | 08:40 |
| kanzure | you know.. the fbi has a shockingly low response time to my emails | 08:48 |
| kanzure | this last one was a 30 second response time | 08:48 |
| kanzure | webgl game http://www.webgl.com/2012/05/webgl-game-cube-2-sauerbraten/ | 08:55 |
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| katsmeow-afk | kanzure, maybe they know what the email is as you compose it, that gives them more time | 09:20 |
| nuba | nah, they've already predicted you'd be sending that email, that gives them way more time. | 09:24 |
| katsmeow-afk | which tells me all those new computer clusters ae online and used for prediction, as well as monitoring | 09:24 |
| kanzure | so by not not sending the email i'd be breaking the law? | 09:25 |
| * nuba goes back to lurking the shadows again -- I've already said too much! | 09:25 | |
| nuba | ;) | 09:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | let us know if you get an email answering that question | 09:26 |
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| kanzure | physical basis of ion channel dynamics http://www.ccs.fau.edu/~liebovitch/dyn.html | 10:13 |
| kanzure | "A Numerical Approach to Ion Channel Modelling Using Whole-Cell Voltage-Clamp Recordings and a Genetic Algorithm" | 10:14 |
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| kanzure | hrm i thought there was a database of ion channel kinetic models somewhere | 10:16 |
| kanzure | channeldb sounds right but i don't see any actual data anywhere? | 10:18 |
| kanzure | http://www.genesis-sim.org/hbp/channeldb/xml/text/ | 10:18 |
| kanzure | http://www.genesis-sim.org/hbp/channeldb/xml/text/Ca_hip_traub91.txt | 10:19 |
| kanzure | <backwardRate class="ParameterizedHHRate" A="177.99999999999997" B="20000.0" C="-1.0" D="1.0" E="0.008899999999999998" F="0.0050"/> | 10:19 |
| kanzure | well that's enraging | 10:19 |
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| kanzure | aha here we go.. http://channelpedia.epfl.ch/ionchannels/188/hhmodels/1.channelml | 10:24 |
| kanzure | from http://channelpedia.epfl.ch/ionchannels/188 | 10:24 |
| kanzure | <transition expr="v &neq; 10 ? (0.01*(10-v))/(exp((10-v)/10) - 1.0)" to="m" name="alpha" expr_form="generic" from="m0"/> | 10:24 |
| kanzure | <transition expr="0.125 * (exp(-v/80))" to="m0" name="beta" expr_form="generic" from="m"/> | 10:24 |
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| delinquentme | Found a pitt company whos running microluidic diagnostics | 10:24 |
| delinquentme | apparently theres a solid proto lab @ CMU? | 10:25 |
| kanzure | most universities will have their own foundry yes | 10:26 |
| kanzure | oh neat.. NEURON+python http://www.davison.webfactional.com/notes/installation-neuron-python/ | 10:37 |
| kanzure | http://www.davison.webfactional.com/notes/accessing-hoc-python/ | 10:37 |
| delinquentme | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__seh5fKDLY << how to build medical electrodes for those playing with brain stimulation :D | 10:50 |
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| kanzure | https://github.com/languages/VHDL/created <-- vhdl hardware projects | 11:29 |
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| azonenberg | kanzure: just saw it, havent read it yet | 12:05 |
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| kanzure | _Sketch_: o_____o | 12:44 |
| _Sketch_ | kanzure: aaaaaaa | 12:44 |
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| kanzure | Juul: wb | 13:05 |
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| thyla | I'm honestly getting kinda sick-and-tired of singularitans | 14:16 |
| thyla | especially those running around saying "HUman level AI in 7 years herp derp durr" | 14:17 |
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| Juul | kanzure, thanks | 15:02 |
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| jrayhawk | well, at this point, transhumanism looks like the only alternative to AI takeoff, so you're probably in the right place | 15:35 |
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| kanzure | hrm so i wrote up this nootropic simulation proposal and sent it to randal | 15:43 |
| kanzure | it looks like there's no nootropicdb for simulation the effects of neutraceuticals on receptors/channels | 15:43 |
| kanzure | but those graphs are in the literature | 15:43 |
| kanzure | presumably simulating small neuronal networks with nootropically-modulated activity would help show overall impact or what modulators would be more useful/performant | 15:44 |
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| Cat4D | e | 15:50 |
| Cat4D | i cant remember the results fo the studies we did | 15:50 |
| Cat4D | you need to always encourage the system to bring up the levels of available materials, but NOT increase the electrical load on the neurons | 15:51 |
| Cat4D | and no fking stimulants | 15:51 |
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| ParahSailin | well im learning a lot about sequencing | 16:47 |
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| kanzure | "Aufgrund unzumutbarer Kosten und Bezugsbedingungen hat das Direktorium des Zentrums Mathematik beschlossen, alle abonnierten Elsevier-Zeitschriften ab 2013 abzubestellen" | 17:07 |
| kanzure | http://www.ma.tum.de/Mathematik/BibliothekElsevier | 17:07 |
| kanzure | abonnierten means abort i think.. so i'm pretty sure they are shitting on elsevier subscriptions | 17:08 |
| kanzure | nope. wait. | 17:09 |
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| katsmeow-afk | i have been looking online almost all day, and can find RO filter canisters, but not the connectors to hook up to them, or holders to put them into,,, anyone have a clue they can share? | 18:33 |
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| katsmeow-afk | ah : "membrane housing" | 18:46 |
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| delinquentme | so what about Quid | 18:48 |
| delinquentme | anyone have shit to say on them? | 18:48 |
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| kanzure | beepity boop | 19:39 |
| kanzure | #brlcad is investigating nanoengineer | 19:39 |
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| kanzure | roksprok: :P | 20:02 |
| kanzure | guess the military was too much for you | 20:02 |
| roksprok | yep | 20:02 |
| roksprok | also the realization that i knew nothing about CAD | 20:03 |
| kanzure | http://brlcad.org/ | 20:03 |
| roksprok | is it run by the military | 20:04 |
| kanzure | yep | 20:04 |
| roksprok | ah....'ballistics research laboratory | 20:05 |
| roksprok | how good are we at positioning atoms? like how far away are we from where the examples on nanoengineer's github can be built? | 20:07 |
| kanzure | there's a lot of really great content about that in the nanosystems roadmap from foresight institute | 20:07 |
| kanzure | www.foresight.org/roadmaps/Nanotech_Roadmap_2007_main.pdf | 20:07 |
| kanzure | www.foresight.org/roadmaps/Nanotech_Roadmap_2007_WG_Proc.pdf | 20:07 |
| kanzure | blah where's my http | 20:07 |
| kanzure | http://www.foresight.org/roadmaps/Nanotech_Roadmap_2007_WG_Proc.pdf | 20:07 |
| kanzure | http://www.foresight.org/roadmaps/Nanotech_Roadmap_2007_main.pdf | 20:07 |
| roksprok | where we're going we don't need http | 20:08 |
| kanzure | here is a list of remaining technical challenges: | 20:09 |
| kanzure | http://www.molecularassembler.com/Nanofactory/Challenges.htm#TCDMS | 20:09 |
| delinquentme | seriously I question this idea that a product wont sell itself | 20:23 |
| kanzure | brownies: your turn.. | 20:23 |
| delinquentme | like I want to find a continuum of what TRULY must be sold | 20:23 |
| delinquentme | to something thats easier to sell | 20:23 |
| delinquentme | used cars are for example | 20:23 |
| delinquentme | a tad harder to sell than an iPad? | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | maybe? | 20:24 |
| kanzure | used cars are usually cheaper | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | i dead carcass rotting away with ebola | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | harder to sell than a pack of gum | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | yes? | 20:24 |
| brownies | eh? | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | now in that example what if your client is a researcher | 20:24 |
| delinquentme | that eases the sale of the carcass a bit | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | but can we agree that the gum is still an fairly easy sell? | 20:25 |
| brownies | depends, probably not if you're selling it to a gum factory | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | true. | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | what about a cell phone | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | I see this as a pretty *must have* | 20:25 |
| brownies | what about a walrus? this line of questioning is meaningless | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | i disagree | 20:25 |
| delinquentme | as stated brownies im looking for the continuum | 20:26 |
| kanzure | sir i would like one walrus | 20:26 |
| delinquentme | now if you concede that some things are easier to sell than others | 20:26 |
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| brownies | there is no grand unified theory | 20:26 |
| delinquentme | is it bad logic to therefore extrapolate that there could be extremes of that model? | 20:26 |
| brownies | it depends on what you're selling, when, to whom. | 20:26 |
| delinquentme | brownies, yes and by that generalization E=mc^2 is useless | 20:27 |
| brownies | *and how. heh. | 20:27 |
| kanzure | how is the most important part! | 20:27 |
| kanzure | yeesh | 20:27 |
| delinquentme | so what is at the level of being useful | 20:27 |
| brownies | that's not a ... what. that's not how logic works. | 20:27 |
| kanzure | the "what" is perhaps the least | 20:27 |
| kanzure | (if you did your job and identified the customer correctly, the "what" will be a given) | 20:28 |
| delinquentme | brownies, I'm trying to invalidate the idea that bc there is no grand unified theory | 20:28 |
| delinquentme | that there is no benefit in a continuum | 20:28 |
| kanzure | what ? | 20:28 |
| brownies | there is no objective metric here. | 20:28 |
| delinquentme | i stated the metric | 20:28 |
| kanzure | you started off by selling "an object can sell itself" | 20:28 |
| kanzure | *saying | 20:28 |
| delinquentme | harder vrs easier to sell | 20:28 |
| brownies | perhaps if the object is a good salesman, he can sell himself when he is looking for a job | 20:28 |
| delinquentme | tell me that that is an invalid matric | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | metric** | 20:29 |
| brownies | it is an invalid metric, for about the 3rd time, because you have no context. | 20:29 |
| brownies | harder vs. easier sell BY WHOM TO WHOM HOW WHEN. | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | brownies, we can flesh that out ad infinitum | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | sure lets add a billion vars so that its overfitted | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | no | 20:29 |
| brownies | nah, just those 4. | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | specifically NOT what im saying | 20:29 |
| delinquentme | yes each of which has a billion possible values | 20:30 |
| brownies | ok, fine, i'll humor you for a minute | 20:30 |
| brownies | go on | 20:30 |
| brownies | let us pretend this metric exists with no other context | 20:30 |
| delinquentme | ok so lets use the topical machine my liquid handler | 20:30 |
| delinquentme | would it be easier to a diagnostics lab for liquid handling | 20:31 |
| delinquentme | than a stick | 20:31 |
| delinquentme | YES. | 20:31 |
| delinquentme | a stick would err on the side of useless | 20:31 |
| kanzure | sell them a million sticks and you will finally be a salesman | 20:31 |
| delinquentme | rebuttal? | 20:31 |
| delinquentme | like i mean its a useless example right? | 20:32 |
| delinquentme | something easier | 20:32 |
| delinquentme | what if I want to GIVE someone a new set of pipette tips I invented | 20:33 |
| delinquentme | is that easier than selling them an AF microscope? | 20:33 |
| delinquentme | TLDR ( and why im right ) | 20:33 |
| delinquentme | to say " nothing sells itself" is too simplistic | 20:33 |
| delinquentme | as well as absolute | 20:33 |
| delinquentme | so it has a high likelihood of being incorrect | 20:34 |
| delinquentme | now im really curious as to how you'd fight that | 20:34 |
| roksprok | i think expecting a three word phrase to not be simplistic is putting the bar too high | 20:35 |
| delinquentme | roksprok, yes yes but | 20:36 |
| delinquentme | saying that something that is noticeably GOOD | 20:37 |
| delinquentme | lets go so far as to say OBJECTIVELY good and value-additive | 20:37 |
| delinquentme | is easier to sell than something which is not | 20:37 |
| kanzure | didn't they ask you to give them a demo of your device? | 20:37 |
| kanzure | and you refused? | 20:37 |
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| delinquentme | kanzure, is that my response? | 20:37 |
| delinquentme | " its not ready? " | 20:38 |
| delinquentme | which i guess is honest | 20:38 |
| kanzure | i thought it was ready | 20:38 |
| delinquentme | brownies, | 20:38 |
| kanzure | but you refused to show them or something | 20:38 |
| kanzure | so they didn't buy it | 20:38 |
| delinquentme | kanzure, i have no proto | 20:38 |
| delinquentme | so theres nothing to show | 20:38 |
| delinquentme | I can show them pumps and folded acrylic | 20:38 |
| katsmeow-afk | and sketches of shafts pounded thru additional shafts so they slide back and forth | 20:41 |
| katsmeow-afk | err, steppers | 20:42 |
| brownies | what are you looking for here, exactly? | 20:46 |
| kanzure | brownies: haha | 20:46 |
| brownies | a stick is less useful to a lab technician than a pipette? sure, but notice how you've magically added context. | 20:46 |
| kanzure | delinquentme: answer :p | 20:46 |
| delinquentme | brownies, brownies this is to assist you in conceptualizing | 20:47 |
| brownies | i assure you that your oversimplified metaphors are helping no one | 20:47 |
| delinquentme | brownies, are you an economist? | 20:47 |
| kanzure | there are many reasons that people don't want to invest in something that doesn't exist.. (namely they aren't investors) | 20:47 |
| delinquentme | there is a reasonable complexity | 20:48 |
| brownies | not a professional economist, if that's what you mean | 20:48 |
| delinquentme | lets loosely call it "reality" | 20:48 |
| delinquentme | in which we need to attempt to model this "sell hard" vrs " sells itself " | 20:48 |
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| kanzure | the reason "cars" in your above examples sell themselves is because of peer recommendation | 20:49 |
| kanzure | people get cars because every other car is an advertisement | 20:49 |
| kanzure | not because the car asked them to buy it | 20:49 |
| brownies | also because the car company spent millions of dollars on marketing. | 20:49 |
| delinquentme | what I want to hear from you is a consent that some things are easier to sell ( sure ill even give you " in particular situations " ) | 20:49 |
| delinquentme | than other things | 20:49 |
| brownies | at this point it might be the case that everything is equally difficult for YOU to sell ;) | 20:49 |
| delinquentme | kanzure, yeah you're correct in that its hard to create an isolated system here | 20:50 |
| brownies | but yes, if i walk into a car dealership, it will probably be easier for them to sell me a car than a walrus. | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | brownies, lets not joke | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | kplzthnx | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | so | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | some things harder | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | some things easier | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | water in the desert to someone in a dehydrated state | 20:50 |
| brownies | i said i'd nod along with this construct of yours a while ago. so what's your point? | 20:50 |
| delinquentme | EASIER sell ... than water for someone sitting next to a brita pitcher | 20:51 |
| brownies | these lab technicians presumably already have a solution for handling their liquids | 20:51 |
| delinquentme | that one can develop a continuum of harder vrs easier sales | 20:51 |
| delinquentme | and if we can make a continuum | 20:51 |
| delinquentme | there are inherently things at both sides of that line graph | 20:51 |
| brownies | sure. anything priced at below market value will sell itself to any theoretically rational actor. | 20:52 |
| delinquentme | and im not even talking about the Liquid handler | 20:52 |
| brownies | *significantly below | 20:52 |
| delinquentme | which is a ton of people are all very anti-my liquid handler here | 20:52 |
| kanzure | non-existant liquid handler has a $0 market value :p | 20:52 |
| delinquentme | wtf is that about | 20:52 |
| kanzure | not at all dude | 20:52 |
| kanzure | we like it | 20:52 |
| kanzure | but you want to start a business around it | 20:52 |
| brownies | i'm not sure how this rambling talk about continuums of sales difficulty is going to help you sell a liquid handler | 20:53 |
| delinquentme | brownies, its your presumption that the sale of the LH is what I was on about | 20:53 |
| kanzure | well then what are you talking about? | 20:53 |
| delinquentme | im saying that I disagree with Thiels idea that "nothing sells itself" | 20:53 |
| brownies | no, i have no idea wtf you're going on about, and i'm just trying to drag you back to something somewhat useful. | 20:53 |
| delinquentme | because thats fucking stupid and simplistic | 20:53 |
| delinquentme | ahh | 20:53 |
| delinquentme | i derped | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | i didnt mention that I'm waxing on about this: | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | http://blakemasters.tumblr.com/post/22405055017/peter-thiels-cs183-startup-class-9-notes-essay | 20:54 |
| roksprok | and its three words! what three words aren't stupid and simplistic? | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | roksprok, context | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | please | 20:54 |
| kanzure | oh.. you're complaining about peter thiel? meh | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | disregard the words .. or count or whatever you know what he meanc | 20:54 |
| delinquentme | means * | 20:54 |
| roksprok | his point is that it is easy for engineers to overlook sales | 20:55 |
| roksprok | i thought it was a good read | 20:55 |
| roksprok | especially the part about palantir and SpaceX | 20:55 |
| roksprok | i had always wondered how those huge contracts got handeled | 20:56 |
| delinquentme | oh I agree | 20:56 |
| delinquentme | but I dont agree w the specific parts | 20:56 |
| delinquentme | SEX | 20:59 |
| delinquentme | hear me out | 20:59 |
| delinquentme | Does sex appeal | 20:59 |
| delinquentme | need to be sold? | 20:59 |
| delinquentme | or does it sell itself? | 20:59 |
| yashgaroth | ooh yeah you can handle my liquids baby | 21:00 |
| delinquentme | tell me where on the continuum of: | 21:00 |
| delinquentme | Hard Sell --------------------------------- Sells Itself | 21:00 |
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| delinquentme | yashgaroth, ha | 21:00 |
| delinquentme | thanks | 21:00 |
| delinquentme | appresh | 21:00 |
| kanzure | opengl trouble with nanoengineer | 21:14 |
| kanzure | http://pastebin.mozilla.org/1617867 | 21:14 |
| kanzure | (from starseeker on gentoo) | 21:15 |
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| delinquentme | That’s not true at all. And since the best people tend to make the best companies, the founders or one or two key senior people at any multimillion-dollar company should probably spend between 25% and 33% of their time identifying and attracting talent. | 21:18 |
| delinquentme | I agree with this | 21:18 |
| katsmeow-afk | i think you need a product that sells first, or you can't meet payroll or the power bill | 21:19 |
| kanzure | katsmeow-afk: unless you know how to sell to investors | 21:19 |
| katsmeow-afk | i don't, case closed | 21:20 |
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| klafka | http://whatshouldwecallgradschool.tumblr.com/post/21497005108/when-there-is-no-food-at-the-seminar | 22:01 |
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| --- Log closed Sat May 05 00:00:01 2012 | ||
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