| --- Log opened Sat Jun 09 00:00:35 2012 | ||
| -!- lichen|2 is now known as lichen | 00:03 | |
| Mokbortolan_1 | You know what'd be fun | 00:12 |
|---|---|---|
| yashgaroth | scrabble? | 00:13 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | adding tDCS functionality to an emotiv headset | 00:13 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | scrabble would be fun too | 00:14 |
| yashgaroth | mightn't the signal from the tDCS interfere with the headset somehow? I'm not good with electricity | 00:15 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | oh, you | 00:15 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | 'd have to make it a switch | 00:15 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | you wouldn't have the emotiv on at this time | 00:16 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | unless you got really clever | 00:16 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | of course, adding anything to it at all will probably screw up the signals | 00:16 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | heck, the unit might have been adjsuted to the exact electrical characteristics of that particular soldering job and wirelength, and messing with it at all will throw that off | 00:18 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | or maybe not | 00:18 |
| yashgaroth | you could probably set something up to deconvolute them...but that would rely on tDCS devices being more standardized | 00:19 |
| yashgaroth | rather than "I made this in my garage, stick it on your head" | 00:19 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | I wouldn't want to stick any tDCS device that I make on anybody else's head | 00:21 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | it's mine, all mine! | 00:21 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | you know | 00:22 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | oh, you could just alter the pads | 00:23 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | take out the gold disc connector | 00:24 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | put in something to block what's left | 00:24 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | and run a wire along the back | 00:24 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | maybe paint it on with something sturdy | 00:24 |
| yashgaroth | what would that do | 00:27 |
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| Mokbortolan_1 | nothin' | 00:40 |
| Mariu | \o | 00:41 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | o/ | 00:41 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | at that point of course you'd add a microprocessor or three and control each channel independently | 00:43 |
| Mokbortolan_1 | but, that's a given | 00:44 |
| yashgaroth | ah okay | 00:44 |
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| hhh | In ##philosophy transhumanism is being discussed | 05:32 |
| hhh | Maybe some of you are interested? | 05:32 |
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| Burninate | (11:45:52) (Burninate) How far does "heroic measures" extend? | 08:49 |
| Burninate | (11:46:38) (Burninate) When someone is probably going to die of something, it tends to make the rules about safety less strict | 08:49 |
| Burninate | (11:46:57) (Burninate) I'm not sure if this is strictly drugs with a chance of side effects, or surgery, or what though | 08:49 |
| Burninate | (11:47:37) (Burninate) I'm thinking perhaps it includes beta-amyloid blockers of untested efficacy... given the alternatives | 08:49 |
| n_bentha | Burninate, are you talking about stim-packs like in starcraft? | 08:51 |
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| Burninate | I'm talking about the purported Alzheimer's vaccine | 08:51 |
| n_bentha | oh, sorry. i had no idea what beta-amyloid blockers are/were | 08:52 |
| n_bentha | kanzure, u there? there's a bot that a friend has in another chat that posts titles of links automatically. | 08:53 |
| n_bentha | do you want me to get more info about it for you? | 08:53 |
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| Burninate | Alzheimer's is kind of a big deal for anyone interested in transhumanism & living forever. To even care for the section of the Baby Boomers who are going to get it statistically, at present standards of care, has been suggested to cost more than the rest of the health care system combined. | 09:00 |
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| -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [-b *!*Omega@started.the.rvlution.net] by kanzure | 09:29 | |
| @kanzure | n_bentha: No, I don't want a linkbot. epitron's linkbot is a global disaster. it might be nice if it only did shitty urls or urls that people fail to describe, but it doesn't. | 09:30 |
| epitron | hahah | 09:32 |
| epitron | nobody is as passionately against linkbots as you | 09:32 |
| epitron | apparently you enjoy the aesthetic of urls | 09:32 |
| epitron | a_better_approach_we_should_all_talk_like_this_how_about_it | 09:32 |
| epitron | or rather | 09:32 |
| epitron | a_better_approach_we_should_all_talk_like_this_how_ab | 09:33 |
| epitron | a_better_approach_we_should_all_talk_like_this_h,12877171 | 09:34 |
| epitron | do capitalization, punctuation, and spaces mean nothing to you? | 09:34 |
| @kanzure | epitron: i think a youtube linkbot would make sense | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | and one for those fucking awful nyt/wsj links would be nice | 09:45 |
| epitron | who's going to whitelist all the urls? :) | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | also, wiley interscience links. those are the worst. | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | epitron: you could just write some heuristics | 09:45 |
| @kanzure | "hey, this url is made up completely of numbers and awful hashes, hurf durf am i doing this right" | 09:46 |
| epitron | think about this though -- if it titles *every* link, you no longer have to look at the url *ever*.... whereas, if it titles the link *sometimes*, it throws you for a loop | 09:46 |
| epitron | usability! | 09:46 |
| epitron | and.. | 09:46 |
| @kanzure | uh, no, you do have to look at the link to use it | 09:46 |
| epitron | simplicity! | 09:46 |
| epitron | you don't have to read it, you just have to click it :) | 09:46 |
| @kanzure | why would i indiscriminately click links | 09:47 |
| epitron | and only if you liked the title | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | like, i have a very hard time remembering youtube urls | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | well-named urls i have less trouble with | 09:47 |
| epitron | why would showing the link title make you more likely to indiscriminately click links? | 09:47 |
| epitron | that's ridiculous | 09:47 |
| @kanzure | because i don't want to click your shitty bit.ly links | 09:47 |
| epitron | so you're FOR link titles | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | .. yes, for shitty links. | 09:48 |
| epitron | so you want to whitelist every shitty link on the internet | 09:48 |
| epitron | gg | 09:48 |
| epitron | hf | 09:48 |
| epitron | :) | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | no, i think you're going in circles now | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | i said heuristics | 09:48 |
| epitron | do it up! | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | for example: if the title is in the url, don't tweet the fucken title | 09:48 |
| epitron | stop the global disaster that is the linkbot phenomenon enjoyed by many | 09:48 |
| @kanzure | no, this is your job. it's *your* bot. | 09:48 |
| epitron | nope! | 09:49 |
| epitron | i love my bot | 09:49 |
| epitron | you're the one who hates it | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | i said heuristics. | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | dsjfaksdfa | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | blah irssi | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | epitron: yes. i do hate it. | 09:49 |
| epitron | so the onus is on you | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | no, it's on people who want your bot in here. | 09:49 |
| epitron | hahah | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | it's been like five years or something.. spend 30 minutes of coding | 09:50 |
| epitron | no! | 09:50 |
| @kanzure | heh okay. | 09:50 |
| epitron | i want everything to be titled because if some things AREN'T, i have to put in extra effort when scanning through my irc history | 09:50 |
| epitron | you have to switch between link parsing and title parsing mental filters | 09:51 |
| @kanzure | cat log | grep http | 09:51 |
| epitron | what about youtube links? :) | 09:51 |
| @kanzure | exactly. | 09:51 |
| epitron | cat log | grep ^title: | 09:51 |
| epitron | done | 09:51 |
| epitron | actually, that's ridiculous | 09:51 |
| epitron | i'd never do that | 09:51 |
| @kanzure | pookie tweets some shit like "http://you.too.be/view?v=9204u190ru29049u1280414 tron dance" | 09:51 |
| epitron | anyhow, the problem here isn't pookie, it's your weird obsession with removal of information redundancy, and complete disregard of information fidelity | 09:52 |
| epitron | ... partial disregard, rather :) | 09:52 |
| klafka1 | kanzure what are you hating on? | 10:13 |
| @kanzure | klafka1: pookie | 10:15 |
| klafka1 | ah | 10:18 |
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| delinquentme | kk but yeah kanzure what I was on about was | 18:48 |
| delinquentme | really cool shit could build on this | 18:48 |
| delinquentme | ( duh ) | 18:48 |
| delinquentme | yeah stating the obvious | 18:48 |
| delinquentme | We didn't happen to pick up anyone whos a specialist in designing these circuits yet did we? | 18:49 |
| delinquentme | also http://www.genome.jp/kegg-bin/show_pathway?eco01100 | 18:50 |
| delinquentme | non-schema database to represent something like this? | 18:50 |
| @kanzure | specialist for what? | 18:52 |
| delinquentme | someone whos designed MF circuits before | 18:52 |
| delinquentme | is circuit the right term? | 18:52 |
| @kanzure | sure. | 18:54 |
| @kanzure | no, we don't have anyone that has done this before. | 18:54 |
| @kanzure | but that's not a problem, i don't mind learning theset hings. | 18:54 |
| @kanzure | *things | 18:54 |
| yashgaroth | MF? | 18:55 |
| @kanzure | microflora | 18:55 |
| delinquentme | oh i meant microfluidics | 18:55 |
| yashgaroth | what does microfluidics have to do with metabolic pathway diagrams | 18:56 |
| delinquentme | yashgaroth, you know about the "genome compiler" right? | 18:57 |
| delinquentme | this is my take on it | 18:57 |
| @kanzure | "the"? that's just their company name dude | 18:58 |
| yashgaroth | what does microfluidics have to do with metabolic pathway diagrams | 18:58 |
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| delinquentme | ... | 18:58 |
| delinquentme | .. | 18:58 |
| delinquentme | im explaining | 18:58 |
| yashgaroth | ah k | 18:58 |
| delinquentme | genome compiler is for designing a 1 off test run for engineering of an organism | 18:58 |
| delinquentme | hes got a great concept where you start off with specifying what inputs and output compounds you want to work with | 18:59 |
| @kanzure | uh, that's not how i would define a compiler | 18:59 |
| @kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compiler | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | as well as the model organism | 18:59 |
| @kanzure | also, it's not /his/ concept. | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | so! | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | thats cool and all | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | but do we *actually* want to design on off *trials* | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | no. | 18:59 |
| delinquentme | what we want is to perform the inputs and then get out candidate organisms | 19:00 |
| delinquentme | so that first step of that is mapping out the pathways that we're going to be tinkering in | 19:00 |
| delinquentme | once you've got database representations of those pathways *AND* the hardware ( either microfluidics or other scalable robotics ) | 19:01 |
| delinquentme | you can begin to develop a system that will iterate itself | 19:01 |
| delinquentme | ( which is where you can get real efficiencies ) | 19:01 |
| @kanzure | what you just described is called "synthetic biology". | 19:02 |
| delinquentme | you want machines to try thousands of parallel permutations | 19:02 |
| delinquentme | so the process that kanzure mentioned ^ needs to be kind of transplanted from the human realm to the machine | 19:03 |
| yashgaroth | anything you'd be designing in genome compiler/etc would be running inside a cell | 19:03 |
| delinquentme | right now were doing the sequencing and insertions, incubation, selection and verifications one at a time | 19:03 |
| delinquentme | theres already an open source calorimeter which could be used in the verification step | 19:04 |
| delinquentme | so like incubation is easy enough | 19:04 |
| yashgaroth | oh so you mean running the physical implementation via microfluidics | 19:04 |
| delinquentme | and something to electroporate the novel DNA into the model organism | 19:04 |
| delinquentme | well what kanzure is working on is cool because it hits on this pipeline in several places | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | 1 we need the DNA synthesis | 19:05 |
| @kanzure | (without the bullshit hype) | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | ^ | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | in addition! | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | the cutter would facilitate building up of the microfluidics for the liquid handling | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | so like that solves 2 of the biggest problems here | 19:05 |
| delinquentme | so then all thats left is ... programming, insertion, incubation and the verification step | 19:06 |
| delinquentme | and you've then got a system that you can program in specific nuances for it to try and its vastly more efficient than a group of researcher trying out a single permutation | 19:07 |
| delinquentme | because you can run thousands of them | 19:07 |
| delinquentme | THAT is a development pipeline | 19:07 |
| delinquentme | incubation is easy | 19:07 |
| delinquentme | electroporation ... like i've not rigged one up but im guessing its a little more than shock the shit out of the cells | 19:08 |
| delinquentme | but IDK how much more complex | 19:08 |
| delinquentme | but yeah thats how microfluidics ties in with maps of metabolic pathways for ecoli | 19:09 |
| delinquentme | and if one of the guys @ KEGG would respond we could save LOTS of time by just getting their DBs or making them an API or some shit | 19:09 |
| delinquentme | ... theres really no reason for them not to as I could scrape what I need off their website as its all there an exposed | 19:09 |
| delinquentme | but asking is mush faster... and we could make allies here | 19:10 |
| delinquentme | +1 ? | 19:11 |
| delinquentme | -1 ? | 19:11 |
| delinquentme | also I know the whole 'permutations' part is simplified | 19:12 |
| yashgaroth | what are you running thousands of permutations of? | 19:12 |
| delinquentme | thats where the knowledge of bio engineering comes in a bit more | 19:12 |
| delinquentme | so offhand you're going to want to try multiple pathways | 19:12 |
| delinquentme | perhaps one pathway has a predominant expression compared to another | 19:13 |
| delinquentme | so instead of having to insert a bunch of promoters you can work with fewer novel DNA insertions and have a more viable organism because of it | 19:14 |
| delinquentme | but the hypothesis is that the nitty gritty trial and error of getting candidate organisms | 19:15 |
| delinquentme | is going to happen at the DNA / expression / metabolic pathway level | 19:15 |
| delinquentme | so automate everything around that | 19:15 |
| yashgaroth | most work these days is just 'use the strongest possible promoter' but I can see how it would become useful | 19:17 |
| yashgaroth | you don't necessarily need to combine the two either, digitizing those pathways and designing the relevant microfluidics can be done separately | 19:18 |
| delinquentme | ohh certainly | 19:18 |
| delinquentme | I meant that right now that KEGG representation isn't wildly conductive to seqrch | 19:18 |
| delinquentme | search* | 19:18 |
| delinquentme | so like something thats indexed and in a database representation | 19:19 |
| delinquentme | OK tooduls all TTYL | 19:22 |
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| --- Log closed Sun Jun 10 00:00:36 2012 | ||
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