| --- Log opened Sun Dec 09 00:00:35 2012 | ||
| --- Day changed Sun Dec 09 2012 | ||
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| yashgaroth | nmz787: anyone doing mAb drug studies will need huge libraries of mutants, albeit mutants of a specific region in the gene | 00:31 |
|---|---|---|
| yashgaroth | phage display panning would be the keyword(s) | 00:34 |
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| nmz787 | cool | 01:18 |
| nmz787 | fenn: http://www.rp-photonics.com/chirped_mirrors.html | 01:18 |
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| @kanzure | neat, this http module supports rotating proxies https://github.com/icodeforlove/node-requester | 06:06 |
| @kanzure | diybio/europe crap http://www.diybio.eu/european-meetup-sprouts-4-projects/ | 06:24 |
| curt1s | why is it crap | 07:26 |
| curt1s | because they banned u? | 07:26 |
| @kanzure | no | 07:26 |
| @kanzure | it's crap because they don't type transcripts | 07:26 |
| @kanzure | and there's only *one* blog post from 50 people that showed up? fuckers | 07:26 |
| curt1s | haha | 07:27 |
| @kanzure | http://blog.fsck.com/2012/12/building-a-keyboard-part-1.html | 07:27 |
| curt1s | maybe they are doing super secret stuff | 07:27 |
| @kanzure | rails error page repl https://github.com/charliesome/better_errors | 07:27 |
| @kanzure | curt1s: i doubt it. | 07:27 |
| Mariu | tell them to unban you | 07:29 |
| @kanzure | i think it's more apt to say they removed me | 07:29 |
| Mariu | ah | 07:29 |
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| @fenn | key64 looks suspiciously like a flat kinesis | 09:03 |
| @fenn | well anyway, i'm not sure why you linked to that. pretty boring project | 09:04 |
| @fenn | why bother with a 3d printed case if it's flat? | 09:06 |
| @fenn | http://deskthority.net/photos-videos-f8/drug-dispensing-model-m-keyboard-t4569.html | 09:10 |
| @fenn | "I can see how the save and emergency save buttons can come in handy in a medical environment." | 09:11 |
| @fenn | i was thinking of making/selling stuff like this http://deskthority.net/mice-other-input-devices-f3/russian-wood-mouse-t4532.html | 09:13 |
| @kanzure | novelty keyboards? meh | 09:15 |
| @fenn | the wooden mouse has an LCD screen? | 09:18 |
| @fenn | showing total distance and distance per this session | 09:18 |
| @kanzure | ah i only glanced at the keyboard | 09:19 |
| @fenn | it's not a novelty keyboard | 09:20 |
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| Urchin[Emacs] | there was a cellphone that ran on punchcards | 09:33 |
| curt1s | http://www.openculture.com/2009/12/sapolsky_breaks_down_depression.html | 09:40 |
| curt1s | interesting 1 | 09:40 |
| Mariu | nice | 09:41 |
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| archels | "our biochemistry levels change" | 09:49 |
| @kanzure | sigh | 09:50 |
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| -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+b audy!*@*] by kanzure | 09:58 | |
| @kanzure | is dtrace any good? https://github.com/dtrace4linux/linux | 10:02 |
| chris_99 | is it similar to ptrace? | 10:04 |
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| Urchin[Emacs] | kanzure: it's supposed to be excellent | 10:45 |
| Urchin[Emacs] | haven't used it though | 10:46 |
| archels | "Subsequent studies from our | 11:00 |
| archels | laboratory showed that subtotal decortication (involving the | 11:00 |
| archels | prefrontal area) resulted in a significant delay in the onset of" | 11:00 |
| archels | nice experiment that must have been... | 11:01 |
| archels | "chemical ablation of dopaminergic terminals in the striatum" | 11:03 |
| archels | haha the first author is called Saadé | 11:04 |
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| -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [-b audy!*@*] by kanzure | 11:38 | |
| jrayhawk | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58OabCRCx_Q saade is a human dynamo | 12:56 |
| jrayhawk | http://evolutionarypsychiatry.blogspot.com/2012/03/depression-genetic-faustian-bargain.html http://evolutionarypsychiatry.blogspot.com/2012/11/inflammation-and-depression-cause-or.html are also interesting | 12:57 |
| archels | http://edgarmatias.com/papers/chi96/ | 13:19 |
| @kanzure | archels: what is it? | 13:19 |
| archels | some interface design from 1996 | 13:21 |
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| AdrianG | jrayhawk, http://www.openculture.com/2009/12/sapolsky_breaks_down_depression.html | 13:54 |
| jrayhawk | Yes, that's what I was responding to. | 13:54 |
| AdrianG | oic | 13:54 |
| jrayhawk | the sapolsky thing is rather old; we have better genetic research and can tie things into inflammation a lot more obviously, now. | 13:54 |
| AdrianG | what is the salopolsky thing | 13:58 |
| AdrianG | cortisol? | 14:04 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk: thanks for the articles.. she mentions difficulty assimilating folate but also inflammation caused by grains. but the major source of folate is grains, (well, beans) so it's a complicated message | 14:20 |
| jrayhawk | She's referring to folic acid being basically unmetabolizable by humans. | 14:24 |
| @fenn | oh that's what she meant by "folks with methylation issues" | 14:25 |
| jrayhawk | (nutritionists fucked up 'folate' and 'folic acid' and they mean the opposite of what's implied by naming convention) | 14:25 |
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| @fenn | i didnt know that. does it matter? | 14:26 |
| jrayhawk | in the sense that the 'folic acid' reinforcement we've been sold on as 'folate' is actually a free radical with no useful pathway | 14:27 |
| jrayhawk | Now we have to actually say 'tetrahydrofolate' in order to mean anything specific or useful. It is a bit of a mouthfull. | 14:28 |
| @fenn | sorry, what? it's a free radical? i don't believe that | 14:28 |
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| @fenn | are you saying that since it's not fully methylated it does more harm than good? | 14:29 |
| jrayhawk | Yes? http://jn.nutrition.org/content/136/1/189.short http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15824266 http://www.ajcn.org/content/85/1/193.abstract http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35874922/ns/health-diet_and_nutrition/t/your-breakfast-giving-you-cancer/ http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19190501 http://cebp.aacrjournals.org/content/16/7/1325.abstract http://jnci.oxfordjournals.org/content/101/6/432.full | 14:31 |
| jrayhawk | http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17697404 'golly this genetically novel chemical sure sticks around for a while' | 14:34 |
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| @fenn | that's a lot to read through, and i'm fighting with web browser issues at the moment | 14:48 |
| @fenn | "whereas folate deficiency in normal tissues increases the rate of neoplastic transformation, high doses of folic acid may accelerate the progression of existing neoplastic lesions to cancer" doesn't sound so bad really. reminds me of the china study boondoggle | 14:48 |
| @fenn | (from that last link) | 14:49 |
| @fenn | i wish scientific journals displayed responses inline, the way blog comments work | 14:50 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, an uncomfortable number of those are epidemiological. | 14:50 |
| @fenn | why don't they just supplement with the fully methylated form in the first place? | 14:51 |
| jrayhawk | I don't think the USDA/FDA has ever been particularly concerned with empirical evidence | 14:52 |
| @fenn | if you didnt catch my meaning, in the campbell study used to justify the china study, the rats fed protein had more tumors because they were still alive | 15:00 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, that was pretty hilarious. | 15:01 |
| @fenn | i wonder how much harder it is to do all-cause mortality epidemiology than from a single disease | 15:01 |
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| @fenn | it looks like they're tracking individuals in this prostate cancer study at least | 15:04 |
| jrayhawk | His seven countries study was also based on a positive correlation between 'animal protein' and 'total cholesterol' coupled with a positive correlation between 'total cholesterol' and 'colorectal cancer' rather than just directly using the (inconveniently) negative 'animal protein' and 'colorectal cancer' correlation | 15:04 |
| jrayhawk | cambell is such an amazing scumbag | 15:04 |
| @fenn | ah but it's what people want to believe | 15:05 |
| @fenn | i wonder how long it will take for mainstream nutrition research to get straightened out | 15:06 |
| @fenn | doctors are still repeating ancel keyes' mediterranean diet as truth | 15:07 |
| jrayhawk | to be fair, the mediterranean diet is a hell of a lot better than what people eat now | 15:07 |
| jrayhawk | the mediterranean diet involves *whole seafood* | 15:08 |
| jrayhawk | CRAZINESS | 15:08 |
| @fenn | heh | 15:08 |
| @fenn | no, it's definitely the radon in the air | 15:08 |
| @fenn | :P | 15:09 |
| @fenn | http://www.island-ikaria.com/nature/springs.asp | 15:09 |
| @fenn | of recent wired-magazine fame | 15:09 |
| @fenn | oh, nytimes, same thing | 15:10 |
| @fenn | another case of telling people what they want to hear, "social connectedness cures cancer!" | 15:11 |
| @fenn | or was it napping | 15:11 |
| jrayhawk | well, either decreases cortisol, so sounds good to me | 15:11 |
| @fenn | http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/magazine/the-island-where-people-forget-to-die.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0 | 15:11 |
| @fenn | yeah but they explicitly mention the neighboring island where people also nap and drink wine etc has much lower life expectancy | 15:12 |
| @fenn | odd that the authors completely ignore the hot springs in favor of wine and napping | 15:13 |
| @fenn | does anyone else use light text on dark backgrounds in web browsers? if so, how did you go about doing it? | 15:18 |
| @fenn | i'm futzing with bookmarklets and css and realizing there's a lot more to it | 15:18 |
| archels | try the Opera browser | 15:20 |
| jrayhawk | I think most browsers have a CSS override option. | 15:22 |
| @fenn | i'd like to maintain the ability to switch back and forth on a per-tab basis | 15:24 |
| * superkuh seconds Opera. | 15:25 | |
| jrayhawk | dur, i didn't mean seven countries study, I meant Diet, Life-style and Mortality in China | 15:27 |
| jrayhawk | i'm confusing my hack epidemiologists | 15:27 |
| @fenn | heh | 15:27 |
| @fenn | a redundant phrase | 15:27 |
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| @fenn | "Most computer manufacturers right now (1990) are introducing products which are no different essentially than what was introduced by Xerox and Apple in 1982." | 16:52 |
| @fenn | but now we have the iPad! | 16:53 |
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| AdrianG | http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=U9eAiy0IGBI | 17:39 |
| jrayhawk | I am, admittedly, fitted with a telephone and radio. | 17:57 |
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| @kanzure | gee thanks python http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7583867/monkey-patching-datetime-produces-strange-results | 18:21 |
| @kanzure | why isn't wheezy on 2.7 at least? | 18:21 |
| @kanzure | oh wait maybe i'm using squeeze. | 18:21 |
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| brownies | i can never keep track of the debian version names | 18:43 |
| brownies | there's no fucking rhyme or reason, and all the names are terrible to boot | 18:44 |
| jrayhawk | http://www.debian.org/releases/ congrats, you can now keep track of debian version names | 18:48 |
| @kanzure | brownies: something about toy story | 18:56 |
| juri_ | sid. its the only release. | 19:07 |
| jrayhawk | this is the correct answer. | 19:07 |
| juri_ | if it doesn't work in sid, bloody well get on fixing it. | 19:08 |
| brownies | jrayhawk: hot damn. thanks. | 19:15 |
| brownies | we're either on lenny or squeeze. | 19:16 |
| brownies | i am mildly annoyed that they couldn't just use alphabetical order. -_- | 19:16 |
| jrayhawk | I think they've run out of speaking characters to name releases after, so you have a chance to lobby for a new system. | 19:17 |
| jrayhawk | i think the toy story thing was just a perensism anyway | 19:18 |
| brownies | a what-ism? | 19:30 |
| juri_ | something specific to bruce perens. | 19:35 |
| brownies | oh i see. it's so specific it doesn't exist on google =P | 19:52 |
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| bkero | Someone is implementing transhumanism as a religion. http://www.neopax.com/praxis/index.html | 20:25 |
| * fenn cringes | 20:26 | |
| @fenn | this is just more zero state bs | 20:26 |
| @kanzure | how do we kill this | 20:26 |
| @kanzure | but really. | 20:28 |
| @fenn | mostly by not repeatedly linking to it | 20:28 |
| @kanzure | at this point the shitty parts of transhumanism are self-sustaining | 20:28 |
| strangewarp | I think I've found a way to undermine the Turing Church's philosophy, at least, but it would be done through a superior philosophy that swaps out Omega Point (which is mostly dumb) for Big Univese (which is arguably compelling) .. | 20:29 |
| @kanzure | i don't know how, it's not like they make any money | 20:29 |
| @kanzure | i suppose singularityu makes money | 20:29 |
| @kanzure | but it's not supporting all the other awful parts of transhumanism | 20:29 |
| @kanzure | wta was supposed to be supported by membership fees, except they have like 40 members only | 20:29 |
| @kanzure | paying $5/year.. so there's no way membership fees are feeding these terrible beasts. | 20:29 |
| @fenn | it doesn't cost anything to host a book on a website | 20:30 |
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| @kanzure | but there's people who are actively doing "only" shitty "transhumanism"-things. | 20:30 |
| strangewarp | Oh, this Praxis thing looks pretty sloppy | 20:31 |
| * strangewarp skim skim skim... | 20:32 | |
| @fenn | what i don't understand is why they're actively trying to draw parallels between transhuman ideas and vague religious christian themes | 20:32 |
| @kanzure | i blame giulio prisco and the mormon transhumanist group for that | 20:32 |
| @fenn | it's just gross | 20:32 |
| @kanzure | how are their christian themes going to help me make better death lasers? | 20:33 |
| @fenn | and on top of that, selling it for $3, why? just fucking publish it already | 20:33 |
| @kanzure | erm i mean wellness lasers | 20:33 |
| @fenn | and i liked the word "praxis", now it's been ruined | 20:34 |
| @fenn | bastard | 20:34 |
| strangewarp | Okay, he seems to be gathering the accoutrements of a religion, because he considers that to be important, but ergh | 20:34 |
| @kanzure | "Bryan, if your point was that technical skill(s) are required to be active in philosophy aiming at positive change through technology, I agree." | 20:35 |
| @kanzure | man i must not be clearly communicating my points | 20:35 |
| strangewarp | Like, why not just modernize cosmism with Big Universe, instead of going through the song-and-dance of sloppy gnostic techno-pantheism like this fellow seems to be doing | 20:35 |
| @kanzure | that was one of the guys replying to my "rant" against zero state.. | 20:36 |
| @fenn | "By dismissing out of hand spirituality (no matter how vaguely defined) it alienates a large percentage of the population. I hope this work goes some way towards rectifying that situation, and also some way towards blunting its naive materialist message" he lost me with the very last bit | 20:36 |
| @kanzure | why does alienation matter | 20:36 |
| @kanzure | and where is it written that transhumanism dismisses spirituality? | 20:36 |
| @fenn | well, it does matter, but you can't fix it by "blunting the message" | 20:36 |
| @kanzure | kurzweil's whole awful book was about spirituality and i hated it | 20:37 |
| @kanzure | (because of how careless ray was, not because spirituality) | 20:37 |
| @fenn | strangewarp: agreed, we need a new carl sagan, not another mckenna | 20:38 |
| @kanzure | carl sagan was terrible | 20:38 |
| @fenn | carl sagan was at least based in reality | 20:38 |
| @kanzure | while he was busy masturbating about the beauty of a flower, actual scientists were studying chromophores | 20:38 |
| strangewarp | fenn: Carl Sagan was not a cosmist | 20:38 |
| @kanzure | erm, sorry, chlorophyll | 20:38 |
| @fenn | he was a ... cosmologist | 20:38 |
| @fenn | am i missing something here? | 20:39 |
| @fenn | what you mean by "big universe"? | 20:39 |
| strangewarp | I dislike conventional cosmists and I think their entire philosophical system needs an overhaul actually | 20:39 |
| strangewarp | cosmist =/= cosmologist | 20:39 |
| @fenn | oh i never read anything by hugo de garis | 20:39 |
| @kanzure | don't bother | 20:39 |
| @fenn | artilect war blah | 20:40 |
| @kanzure | hugo is up there with all the other humanityplus crapheads | 20:40 |
| @fenn | i like the idea of evolving three dimensional fpga's | 20:40 |
| @fenn | but i doubt that has anything to do with "cosmism" | 20:41 |
| @kanzure | have you ready any of his hplusmagazine posts? i want my money back. | 20:41 |
| @fenn | no, should i? | 20:41 |
| @kanzure | no of course not | 20:41 |
| @fenn | what's up with xiamen university | 20:42 |
| @kanzure | isn't that where hugo and goertzel went to get professorships | 20:42 |
| strangewarp | fenn: Big Universe is effectively modal realism for every rational causal topology, provided that one of three things is true: 1) Modal realist literalism; 2) Many-Worlds Interpretation of quantum mechanics; 3) multiple Big Bangs occurring over massive distances. | 20:42 |
| @kanzure | .... | 20:43 |
| strangewarp | Of course it's unprovable conjecture so I only consider it a mental plaything currently. | 20:43 |
| @fenn | modal realism? | 20:43 |
| @fenn | you can't define something i dont know by using other phrases i don't know | 20:43 |
| strangewarp | one second. | 20:44 |
| @fenn | "all possible worlds are as real as the actual world"? | 20:44 |
| @fenn | whatever that means | 20:44 |
| strangewarp | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modal_realism - So far as this being literally true, I think that's the most unlikely of the three. | 20:44 |
| @kanzure | any philosophy that relies on mwi being true or false isn't exactly a strong candidate to rely on | 20:44 |
| @fenn | if something is "real" but has no possible bearing on any outcome of any experiment, who cares | 20:45 |
| @fenn | people need to fix their stupid semantics | 20:46 |
| strangewarp | fenn: acausal trade; resimulation if cognitive materialism is true; etc | 20:46 |
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| strangewarp | still, I think the difference between my approach, and these Praxis / Turing Church people is, I fully recognize and admit that mine is a mental plathing that relies on like six different what-ifs | 20:47 |
| strangewarp | plaything* | 20:47 |
| strangewarp | anyway brb | 20:48 |
| @fenn | somehow we got derailed from bashing zero state, but i'm not convinced this was a bad outcome | 20:48 |
| @kanzure | i'm not convinced that "more philosophy" (even if it's better or more careful philosophy) is the right medicine against all of the terrible transhumanism philosophy that people get absorbed into | 20:48 |
| @fenn | at the very least, if you want to alienate people, start using specialist jargon | 20:50 |
| @kanzure | i really liked http://www.maxmore.com/extprn3.htm but apparently most of the people who read it didn't go on to actually improve their technology | 20:50 |
| @kanzure | one half of its readership consisted of giulio prisco who went off to try that "order of cosmoneers".. which was a wiki and second life thing. :( | 20:52 |
| @fenn | "Extropians strive to maintain the pace of progress by encouraging support for crucial research, and pioneering the implementation of its results." | 20:53 |
| @kanzure | "encouraging support" | 20:53 |
| @kanzure | bleh | 20:53 |
| @fenn | that's kind of wimpy isn't it | 20:53 |
| @kanzure | yes | 20:53 |
| @fenn | i was going to say "it doesn't actually say to improve technology" but i found that quote | 20:54 |
| @fenn | sorry to burst your bubble | 20:54 |
| @kanzure | well, it seems you and i live in a bubble where we both feel that this document is 1000x too weak | 20:54 |
| @fenn | maybe the earlier versions were better | 20:55 |
| @kanzure | the books listed under "READING" aren't going to get you anywhere.. where the hell is "Molecular Biology of the Cell" ? | 20:55 |
| @kanzure | or horowitz's thing? | 20:55 |
| @fenn | i've been comparing the new THX-1138 to the old THX-1138 and wondering what happened. it's almost as bad as the new star wars | 20:56 |
| @kanzure | shit, "the selfish gene" is on the reading list. that's a terrible suggestion. | 20:56 |
| @fenn | not if your business is spreading philosophy | 20:56 |
| @kanzure | and "Ayn Rand: Atlas Shrugged"... hah. | 20:57 |
| @fenn | meh | 20:57 |
| @kanzure | you asked about earlier versions.. here's v2.5: http://www.aleph.se/Trans/Cultural/Philosophy/princip.html | 20:57 |
| strangewarp | [21:48] <@kanzure> i'm not convinced that "more philosophy" (even if it's better or more careful philosophy) is the right medicine against all of the terrible transhumanism philosophy that people get absorbed into | 20:58 |
| @fenn | i would hope that for the majority of people who find this document interesting, the principles are self-evident and need no elaboration | 20:58 |
| strangewarp | Alas, I've got to provisionally agree with that :/ | 20:58 |
| @kanzure | fenn: well, maybe they do need elaboration. | 20:58 |
| @fenn | it's the people who don't find them self-evident that we need better persuasive arguments | 20:58 |
| @kanzure | no not even persuasion.. it just needs to be explicitly written down in the first place | 20:58 |
| @kanzure | "yo dawgs, go sign up for a community college class on something you don't know but need to know to do these things" | 20:59 |
| @fenn | or slip it in as subliminal suggestion somehow | 20:59 |
| @fenn | i don't even know | 20:59 |
| @kanzure | the "what next?" shouldn't be "here's some fucking awful philosophy books" | 20:59 |
| @fenn | i haven't read about 80% of those books | 21:00 |
| @kanzure | why didn't davidad end up gushing philosophical rhetoric anyway? | 21:00 |
| @kanzure | did mit beat some sense into him? i mean he was surrounded by kurzweil and others for years. | 21:01 |
| @fenn | he was never into philosophy as far as i can tell | 21:01 |
| @fenn | i did read "prometheus rising" and was quite underwhelmed | 21:02 |
| @fenn | it's sort of like reading "hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy" and expecting to get an actual map of the galaxy | 21:03 |
| @kanzure | here's v2.01 from 1992-08-07 http://artofhacking.com/IET/OCCULT/live/aoh_extropia.htm | 21:03 |
| @fenn | heh /IET/OCCULT/ | 21:05 |
| juri_ | wow. that's a lot of crazy. for referene, i'm both a taoist and a singularist. i have the 'simplicity' edict all fouled up. | 21:06 |
| @kanzure | so i see 10 paragraphs on self-determinism and other obvious philosophy things and nothing like "yo dudes, go learn how to weld" | 21:06 |
| juri_ | learning to contribute constructively to the commons is not something that's taught. | 21:06 |
| @fenn | extropians@gnu.ai.mit.edu hehe | 21:06 |
| @kanzure | (while you might not ever weld again, knowing about possible welds and why that wont work is fairly important) | 21:06 |
| @kanzure | fenn: yeah, it was hosted on the same server | 21:06 |
| @kanzure | it's a shame that the GNU philosophy didn't leak over much. | 21:10 |
| @kanzure | or any comprehension of the free software movement | 21:11 |
| @fenn | well at least these are actionable: " We practice and plan for biological and neurological | 21:11 |
| @fenn | augmentation through means such as effective cognitive enhancers or | 21:11 |
| @fenn | psychology" | 21:11 |
| @fenn | "smart drugs", computers and electronic networks, General Semantics | 21:12 |
| @fenn | and other guides to effective thinking, meditation and visualization | 21:12 |
| @fenn | techniques, accelerated learning strategies, and applied cognitive | 21:12 |
| @kanzure | oh how convenient.. things that don't require doing anything. | 21:12 |
| @kanzure | except buying drugs | 21:12 |
| @fenn | using computers and electronic networks was a big deal in 1992 | 21:13 |
| juri_ | as an old BBS sysop, i'm here to tell you it wasn't. | 21:13 |
| @fenn | :( | 21:13 |
| @fenn | come on, drugs + internetz + meditation + philosophy = teh infinite super powerz | 21:14 |
| @kanzure | what bothers me is that nobody questioned that equation | 21:15 |
| @kanzure | the only people who questioned it were people who were wanting to inject their own religion/anti-religion crusades.. | 21:15 |
| @kanzure | and somehow zero state sees humanityplus as *too* extreme on the technology side. there isn't even a tech side in the first place! | 21:16 |
| @fenn | anything at all seems extreme when the goal is zero :( | 21:17 |
| @kanzure | what was that private transhumanist web group that claimed to be working on satellite software? | 21:18 |
| @fenn | ICEGODS? | 21:19 |
| @fenn | http://www.icegods.com/ | 21:20 |
| @fenn | i love that site for its extreme impedance mismatch with the rest of the world | 21:21 |
| @fenn | "Do not contact us, except as specified below. We do not reply otherwise. no part of this website may be copied for any purpose whatsoever" | 21:21 |
| @fenn | okay, that seems somewhat normal in the butt-headed business world | 21:22 |
| @fenn | it's just so optimistic, and so short on detail.. i wish there were more substance | 21:24 |
| @fenn | oh well | 21:25 |
| @fenn | so i've been thinking about head up displays and worrying about how to outfit an army of borgs with pico projector VRD's when they cost $400 each | 21:26 |
| @fenn | i found a thread written by some turkish EE professor that shows how to make a raster scanning laser projection TV for $10 in parts | 21:26 |
| @fenn | he's done a red/green version http://youtube.com/watch?v=NTpwygS8baY | 21:27 |
| @fenn | and there's some live video but it's somewhat boring | 21:28 |
| @fenn | well anyway it looks reasonably miniaturizable without requiring any access to lithography equipment | 21:28 |
| @fenn | basically a torsion rod with a mirror made of hard disk platter attached to the end, driven by a coil and ferrite bead | 21:29 |
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| juri_ | its amazing the computer technology people are discarding every day, and what it can be repurposed for. | 21:32 |
| @fenn | it's more amazing the worthless ends the amazing technology is put towards | 21:33 |
| @fenn | watching football? | 21:33 |
| strangewarp | fenn: Wow, that is a major source of angst for me actually | 21:34 |
| @fenn | it's easy to forget about when you live in a warehouse/lab in SF | 21:35 |
| @fenn | but not so here in boringland | 21:35 |
| @fenn | juri_: what brings you to this wretched city? | 21:36 |
| @kanzure | really? what about boringland, austin branch? i don't think i've ever spoken the words foot or ball to you. | 21:36 |
| strangewarp | I have a vague affection for the Broncos, solely because I have good childhood memories of that time they won the superbowl with John Elway... | 21:36 |
| strangewarp | but I always opt out of watching sports, because bleh | 21:37 |
| @kanzure | probably because you were fed lots of food and your people peopled you | 21:37 |
| strangewarp | yes exactly :p | 21:37 |
| * fenn mumbles something about finland | 21:38 | |
| strangewarp | Finland has the most metal bands per capita out of any country | 21:38 |
| strangewarp | trivia, but amusing | 21:38 |
| @kanzure | that's because snow turns your heart metal | 21:39 |
| strangewarp | also, because a strong welfare state encourages grassroots arts projects | 21:40 |
| juri_ | fenn: i'm on the other coast. ;) | 21:40 |
| @fenn | juri_: i'm in DC now, just too lame to make it over to the hackerspace | 21:40 |
| juri_ | oh! | 21:40 |
| juri_ | I actually came to DC to create a freegeek. | 21:41 |
| @kanzure | jigsaw? | 21:41 |
| juri_ | the one i was running was getting 'too successful'. i was tired of the big-fish-small-town problem. | 21:41 |
| @fenn | "too successful" how? | 21:41 |
| juri_ | until i stepped out, I was teaching classes that were packed 35 hours a week, was opening a branch office.. | 21:42 |
| juri_ | the place was run more like a freegeek + hackerspace. | 21:43 |
| @fenn | and this is a bad thing? | 21:43 |
| juri_ | it was a great thing. i decided to pack up ad move to DC, and start one here. | 21:43 |
| juri_ | at the point mayoral cantidates are trying to curry favor, its time to move. | 21:44 |
| juri_ | I thought it would be ironic to take an idea from portland, optimize it in arkansas, the go to DC to show the east coast how it's done. ;) | 21:46 |
| @fenn | well, good luck | 21:46 |
| juri_ | I'll need it. | 21:47 |
| juri_ | going from serving a population of ~100K to DC is a major scale change. | 21:48 |
| @fenn | you have to remember DC's more like a third world country, lots of petty corruption, massive wealth stratification and segregation | 21:49 |
| juri_ | um. you do know what arkansas is like, right? ;) | 21:49 |
| @fenn | everyone in arkansas is poor | 21:50 |
| juri_ | not everyone. there's the tysons, the waltons... | 21:50 |
| @fenn | do they actually live there? | 21:50 |
| juri_ | yes. | 21:50 |
| juri_ | I still have equipment with 'walton college of business' stamped on it. | 21:51 |
| @fenn | (lived, past tense) http://voices.yahoo.com/walton-hunt-tyson-gone-corporate-titans-7591806.html | 21:51 |
| juri_ | at university auction, i used to check for that 'quality sticker'. as it meant the gear was tossed away long before being useless. | 21:51 |
| juri_ | oh, yes, not the origionals, but their descendants. | 21:52 |
| juri_ | AKA, the brats who get to blow the money. | 21:52 |
| @fenn | i find it interesting that walton-backed First Solar has been so successful. they must know something, or else have enough clout to make any business successful | 21:53 |
| @kanzure | "stark industries terminal hijack system" hrm | 21:53 |
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| @fenn | i wonder why nobody has mass produced these vibrating mirror laser televisions yet | 21:56 |
| @fenn | it's such a simple and straightforward idea | 21:56 |
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| @fenn | there were vibrating mirror head up displays in the 80's that used LEDs | 21:57 |
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| @fenn | (before solid state lasers were invented) | 21:57 |
| -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+b augur!*@*] by kanzure | 21:58 | |
| @fenn | kanzure: i hope you're /msg'ing them to explain why the ban | 21:59 |
| @kanzure | nope. but i'm removing the bans whenever. | 22:00 |
| @kanzure | actually augur seems sort of stable for the moment | 22:01 |
| -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [-b augur!*@*] by kanzure | 22:01 | |
| augur | yeah my computer wasnt waking from sleep properly | 22:01 |
| augur | sorry about that | 22:01 |
| @fenn | i wish steve mann provided more info on his fiber optic glasses http://wearcam.org/presenceconnect/cement348351356368decon.jpg | 22:07 |
| @kanzure | isn't he a professor and obligatted by law/the gods to publish in obscure journals? maybe it's published. | 22:07 |
| @fenn | it might be in his image processing textbook somewhere, but i doubt it | 22:08 |
| @fenn | i haven't seen any concrete plans of any of his HMD gear anywhere | 22:08 |
| @fenn | i actually got to see one close up at singularity summit; it was just a myvu crystal and beagleboard, exactly what i had come up with independently | 22:09 |
| @kanzure | where did myvu.com go anyway? | 22:09 |
| @fenn | they were sleazeball IP whores from the start | 22:10 |
| @fenn | more importantly, "who has the microoptical technology license now?" | 22:10 |
| @fenn | is it really that hard to make a grid of microscopic OLED | 22:12 |
| @fenn | the rest is just lenses and mirrors | 22:12 |
| @fenn | i've never used a fiber optic light pipe.. i wonder how much "image" you can pack into one | 22:13 |
| @fenn | it would really simplify the whole system | 22:13 |
| @fenn | maybe light pipe is the wrong phrase | 22:14 |
| @fenn | i get the impression they're in the kilopixel range at max | 22:19 |
| @fenn | "the higher resolution bundles feature 20,000 leeched fiber pixels." | 22:20 |
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| abetusk | anyone up? Anyone feel like letting me brag? | 23:02 |
| @kanzure | no | 23:02 |
| abetusk | always so grumpy | 23:02 |
| @kanzure | liar | 23:05 |
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| --- Log closed Mon Dec 10 00:00:49 2012 | ||
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