| --- Log opened Wed Dec 19 00:00:02 2012 | ||
| DoYouKnow | I mean, a plant, to have evolved the ability to close its leaves like that, taken alone... must have had some pretty picky vegatarians on its hunt | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| DoYouKnow | herbivores | 00:00 |
| DoYouKnow | and/or omnivores | 00:00 |
| DoYouKnow | also, it's toxic | 00:01 |
| @fenn | most things are | 00:01 |
| @fenn | "all is poison, and nothing is without poison. the dose alone makes the poison!" | 00:02 |
| @fenn | it's such bullshit that "native and or religious peoples" are permitted psychedelic drugs, and everyone else has to make do with television | 00:04 |
| @fenn | how is anyone more or less "native" or "religious" than anyone else? | 00:05 |
| @fenn | i'm sure the aspies would have a field day with that | 00:08 |
| -!- DoYouKnow [~doyouknow@75-28-180-206.lightspeed.bnsvil.sbcglobal.net] has left ##hplusroadmap [] | 00:11 | |
| @fenn | aw i was hoping it would say "success" | 00:12 |
| @fenn | ... sonoluminesence. hrmph. | 00:13 |
| @kanzure | fenn one day you will find someone to confer about conspiracy theories, but not today | 00:17 |
| @fenn | i think ms. lovecruft has the right idea http://www.patternsinthevoid.net/blog/2011/10/schizophrenia-is-a-chronological-disorder/ | 00:19 |
| @fenn | (roughly: you talk to yourself but get the time order wrong, so you believe somebody else is talking) | 00:20 |
| jrayhawk | schizophrenia also has strong correlation with intestinal permeability and inflammation | 00:20 |
| @fenn | and oxidative stress too (?) | 00:21 |
| * fenn mumbles something about mercury toxicity and magnesium deficiency | 00:22 | |
| @fenn | anyway, first step is for someone to define the problem | 00:23 |
| @fenn | then we can solve the problem | 00:23 |
| jrayhawk | http://chriskresser.com/the-truth-about-toxic-mercury-in-fish is kinda interesting | 00:23 |
| @fenn | i don't think people are getting mercury poisoning from fish | 00:24 |
| jrayhawk | River systems are highly variable, there. | 00:25 |
| @fenn | oh, i forgot about freshwater fish | 00:25 |
| @fenn | (why would you eat that :P) | 00:26 |
| jrayhawk | one hell of a lot lower barrier to entry to fish in a river | 00:26 |
| archbox_ | >L.Ac | 00:27 |
| jrayhawk | I concur. | 00:27 |
| jrayhawk | >L., as you so rightly said, Ac. | 00:27 |
| @fenn | um, what? | 00:28 |
| @fenn | lactobacillus acidophilus? | 00:28 |
| @kanzure | i t's his password | 00:28 |
| @kanzure | *or it's his password | 00:28 |
| chido | freshwater fish is the traditional christmas dinner where I come from | 00:29 |
| jrayhawk | And, of course, swordfish is often available at markets. | 00:29 |
| chido | but I guess once a year isn't that poisonous | 00:29 |
| archbox_ | fenn: Licensed Acupuncturist | 00:29 |
| archbox_ | kanzure: what password? | 00:29 |
| @fenn | so chris kresser is an acupuncturist. i hope that means he knows more about nutrition than your average medical doctor | 00:31 |
| jrayhawk | oh yes, just a bit | 00:31 |
| archbox_ | also, you should take diluted water instead of any real treatments | 00:32 |
| @fenn | why don't we have usb mass spectrometers yet | 00:33 |
| @kanzure | because nmz787 is lazy | 00:33 |
| @fenn | do i have to do everything around here? | 00:33 |
| @kanzure | oh wait, he wasn't doing a mass spec | 00:33 |
| chido | how does one dilute water I wonder | 00:33 |
| @fenn | gosh it's not that hard to answer the question "is this contaminated with mercury" | 00:33 |
| archbox_ | chido: it's because H2O holds fingerprints | 00:33 |
| archbox_ | you have to fingerprint the water in your water so you get more hydrated | 00:33 |
| jrayhawk | chido: well, first you dehydrate it | 00:33 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk has the right idea | 00:34 |
| jrayhawk | chido: in reducing water, you can get concentrated SUPERWATER | 00:34 |
| @fenn | archbox_: i hope you realize homeopathy and acupuncture are from two entirely different continents | 00:34 |
| jrayhawk | chido: then you dilute your superwater in water to get a homeopathic water response | 00:34 |
| chido | sounds fun | 00:34 |
| @fenn | not that all of homeopathy is bad (they invented oral zinc for colds, and various magnesium therapies) | 00:34 |
| archbox_ | fenn: you know what we call alternative medicine that works? | 00:34 |
| @kanzure | archbox_: i suspect that fenn is about to roflstomp all over you here | 00:35 |
| chido | archbox_: regular medicine? | 00:35 |
| archbox_ | :< | 00:35 |
| @kanzure | archbox_: have you actually read about homeopathy | 00:35 |
| jrayhawk | or acupuncture, for that matter | 00:35 |
| @fenn | is this AdrianG? | 00:35 |
| @kanzure | fuck not this guy | 00:35 |
| jrayhawk | or even the efficacy of Standard of Care | 00:35 |
| archbox_ | nah | 00:36 |
| @fenn | a large part of the problem with how medicine is practiced is most doctors don't know it, and don't have time to find the "correct" answer | 00:37 |
| chido | I quite enjoyed Singhs book Trick or Treatment on this topic, I wonder if anyone else did | 00:37 |
| @fenn | it's not like "house" | 00:37 |
| archbox_ | fuck http://chriskresser.com/the-truth-about-flu-shots-and-what-to-do-instead | 00:37 |
| archbox_ | >So, that means avoiding foods that tend to weaken the immune system such as excess sugar, refined flour, unprepared grains perhaps and legumes, industrial seed oils, and other highly processed and refined foods. | 00:37 |
| @fenn | they walk in, look at your chart, glance at you, write a prescription for adderall or cipro | 00:37 |
| archbox_ | what | 00:38 |
| archbox_ | how come i've never gotten adderall yet | 00:38 |
| archbox_ | why are they holding out on me :( | 00:38 |
| @fenn | because you didn't ask for it? | 00:38 |
| archbox_ | whelp | 00:38 |
| @kanzure | fenn: i had this intense week of testing away-from-home when i was little, and that's how i got prescribed stimulants. it was not a walk-in procedure -_-. | 00:38 |
| @fenn | that's because you're a mutant | 00:39 |
| @kanzure | hit by a radioactive crt, etc.. | 00:39 |
| archbox_ | kanzure: what are the best stimulants? | 00:39 |
| @fenn | define "best" | 00:39 |
| archbox_ | few sides, I guess. Modafinil? | 00:40 |
| @fenn | modafinil has side effects too | 00:40 |
| archbox_ | I mean, this is ##hplusroadmap. what do you guys take? | 00:40 |
| @fenn | dry mouth, nausea, angstyness | 00:40 |
| archbox_ | >Trouble sleeping | 00:41 |
| jrayhawk | i try to sleep properly | 00:41 |
| archbox_ | who da fuck put that there | 00:41 |
| @kanzure | sleeping is for the weak | 00:41 |
| @kanzure | and the tired | 00:41 |
| archbox_ | whelp | 00:41 |
| @kanzure | as kirka put it, sleepy people are just depressed | 00:41 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: how much melatonin? | 00:41 |
| @fenn | actually i slept fine on modafinil, and woke up feeling great | 00:41 |
| archbox_ | fenn: yeah it seems pretty tame compared to amphetamine salts | 00:41 |
| jrayhawk | I don't know, I haven't taken a blood test for that. | 00:42 |
| archbox_ | thanks guys | 00:42 |
| archbox_ | fenn: how do i ask for moda? | 00:42 |
| @fenn | you order it from india online | 00:43 |
| archbox_ | ><@fenn> they walk in, look at your chart, glance at you, write a prescription for adderall or cipro | 00:43 |
| archbox_ | I see nothing about india there | 00:43 |
| archbox_ | were you talking about western medicine or eastern? | 00:43 |
| @fenn | adderall is not modafinil | 00:43 |
| @fenn | a doctor won't give you a prescription for modafinil | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | oh so schedule II drugs are easier to get than schedule IV. cool | 00:44 |
| @fenn | unless you're a pilot or have narcolepsy | 00:44 |
| @fenn | hey man i didn't write the rules | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | whelp | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | so is adderall pretty cool?> | 00:44 |
| @kanzure | why are you here | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | kanzure: h+ | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | biohacking | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | noots | 00:44 |
| archbox_ | I already take noopept, l-theanine, and caffeine | 00:45 |
| @fenn | what benefit do you get from l-theanine? | 00:45 |
| archbox_ | fewer sides from caffeine, relaxing | 00:45 |
| @fenn | "L-theanine is a glutamic acid analog with chemical similarities to the inhibitory neurotransmitter, γ-aminobutyric acid (GABA)" probably why i didn't like it | 00:47 |
| archbox_ | http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21040626 | 00:47 |
| archbox_ | it's in green tea | 00:47 |
| archbox_ | it's natural bro. obviously safe | 00:48 |
| @fenn | i know | 00:48 |
| archbox_ | then what _do_ you take? | 00:48 |
| @fenn | well, i've tried lots of stuff and had some success, but not as much luck figuring out what exactly i did | 00:49 |
| archbox_ | how long have you guys been into transhumanism? Surely you have developed some form of a stack | 00:50 |
| @fenn | i like b vitamins, piracetam, noopept, chocolate, magnesium citrate, fish oil, butter, cordyceps, chlorella, DMAE, and various other racetams and tryptamines | 00:51 |
| archbox_ | we are on like the same stack | 00:51 |
| @fenn | that's not a stack, that's a pile | 00:52 |
| archbox_ | esp. since they are powders :< | 00:52 |
| archbox_ | i'm on b complex, sulbutiamine, benfotiamine, noopept, cocoa, magnesium glycinate, fish oil, cordyceps, chlorella, reishi, bacopa, handful of other things | 00:52 |
| @fenn | reishi fucked me up.. i guess i have naturally low blood sugar | 00:53 |
| archbox_ | oh? You got hypoglycemic? | 00:53 |
| archbox_ | sorry to hear that :( | 00:53 |
| @fenn | i thought it would help with altitude sickness | 00:53 |
| archbox_ | how much did you take? | 00:54 |
| @fenn | probably too much.. i boiled one sliced mushroom in water for a few hours and drank 1/4 of that | 00:54 |
| archbox_ | wow. thanks for the heads up | 00:54 |
| archbox_ | I won't try megadosing it | 00:54 |
| archbox_ | anyway, thanks for the help. 'night fellows | 00:55 |
| @fenn | hm maybe i'll try bacopa again | 00:56 |
| @fenn | woah "In a clinical study with six patients, benfotiamine lowered AGE by 40%" | 00:57 |
| @fenn | oh "inhibits formation of AGE" | 00:58 |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 01:01 | |
| wrldpc | There seems to be no desire on part of the Marine Corps to adopt substantive change in the way they handle science and technology. I don't know if it's because the MC is slaved to the Navy but you'd think somebody would press for greater autonomy given the fact that the MC *is* a much smaller, more versatile force. | 01:05 |
| wrldpc | and everyone is constantly bitching about the budget. "we don't have money for this money for that" ffs just cut the ties to these shitty legacy proprietary software archons and pursue the open source route. | 01:06 |
| @fenn | lol "We calculated that you need to vaccinate between 33 and 99 people to prevent a single case of flu" | 01:07 |
| jrayhawk | http://chriskresser.com/pioneering-researcher-alessio-fasano-m-d-on-gluten-autoimmunity-leaky-gut is also quite good | 01:09 |
| @fenn | that quote was from someone at cochrane.. hard to get any more mainstream "show me the evidence" than that | 01:09 |
| wrldpc | does grapefruit juice universally produce greater bioavailability of compounds or only a select few? | 01:12 |
| wrldpc | the piracetam I'm taking in conjunction with the choline seems to do nothing … and I'm up to like 3-5g doses. | 01:13 |
| @fenn | piracetam doesn't do anything in some people, and even when it does, it's not obvious | 01:14 |
| @fenn | it's more obvious when taken with other drugs | 01:14 |
| @fenn | the effect is higher muscular coordination and being able to say exactly what you mean | 01:16 |
| @fenn | the grapfruit juice effect is complicated, because some chemicals are inactivated by cyp3a4 and others are deactivated by it | 01:16 |
| @fenn | activated* | 01:16 |
| @fenn | that is, many "drugs" are actually pro-drugs | 01:17 |
| bkero | wrldpc: congratulations, your body produces enough of those already | 01:18 |
| @fenn | your body doesn't produce either of those | 01:19 |
| wrldpc | what else can I stack with it to make it pop? I've tried huperzine … I think DMAE too. | 01:19 |
| wrldpc | yeah DMAE but the pills are ridiculous. | 01:19 |
| @fenn | try caffeine | 01:20 |
| wrldpc | I was hoping Cortex would bring the CX ampakines to market. Never happened. Their stock tanked. | 01:20 |
| wrldpc | rog | 01:20 |
| @fenn | aw that's too bad | 01:20 |
| @fenn | oh, vinpocetine works with caffeine nicely as well | 01:21 |
| @fenn | i don't typically drink caffeine drinks because i have a slow metabolism and it lasts for ~12 hours | 01:22 |
| @fenn | and then i build up a tolerance after a couple weeks | 01:23 |
| @fenn | it's great if you have to exercise though | 01:23 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk: i read a lot about "organ meats" but what is that exactly? | 01:29 |
| wrldpc | I've heard a Marine Corps martial arts instructor comment on how the chocolate-covered coffee beans get him through the early hour training sessions. | 01:29 |
| @fenn | i'm not about to start eating cow brain (assuming i could get it) | 01:30 |
| @fenn | dammit i just want my food to come in shelf-stable bricks, is that so much to ask/ | 01:33 |
| @fenn | come on, really? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Bull_penis_cocktail.jpg | 01:36 |
| bkero | ... | 01:36 |
| bkero | do I really want to click that? | 01:37 |
| jrayhawk | Cow brain is an excellent source of K2 | 01:37 |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 01:38 | |
| @fenn | fuck that i'll eat natto | 01:38 |
| jrayhawk | Usually people are talking about liver, though, which has a lot of interesting stuff in it. | 01:38 |
| jrayhawk | ha ha wow, that's a brave position to take | 01:38 |
| jrayhawk | i guess i haven't really tried natto, i wonder if it's more disgusting than shark | 01:39 |
| @fenn | i'd think saliva glands would be a good source of k2 | 01:39 |
| jrayhawk | hm. interesting thought. | 01:40 |
| @fenn | another think you won't find at the store | 01:40 |
| @fenn | at least i can just buy natto | 01:40 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, carving meat out of a jaw is not an efficient use of time. | 01:41 |
| jrayhawk | http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/Benefit-Of-Cod-Liver-Oil.html | 01:41 |
| jrayhawk | but don't eat bear liver. never eat bear liver. | 01:42 |
| jrayhawk | enough retinol in an ounce to kill you. | 01:42 |
| @fenn | i hear it will cure pimples :P | 01:42 |
| @fenn | if your skin doesnt slough off first | 01:42 |
| -!- sylph_mako [~mako@103-9-42-1.flip.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] | 01:43 | |
| -!- Jaakko96 [~Jaakko@94-194-89-130.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 02:20 | |
| -!- Mariu [Jimmy98@89.41.57.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 02:23 | |
| -!- lichen_ [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 03:00 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] | 03:03 | |
| -!- Jaakko96 [~Jaakko@94-194-89-130.zone8.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] | 03:41 | |
| -!- erasmus [~esb@unaffiliated/erasmus] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:10 | |
| -!- _Sol_ [~Sol@c-174-57-58-11.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 05:58 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@95.5.68.26] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:31 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@95.5.68.26] has quit [Changing host] | 06:31 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:31 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~asdfasdf@pool-71-182-199-191.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:38 | |
| -!- Charlie [~quassel@64.31.59.70] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:45 | |
| -!- Charlie is now known as Guest68002 | 06:45 | |
| wrldpc | natto is gross man! | 06:48 |
| -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@gw-ko-kostr2.inka-online.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:52 | |
| -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@gw-ko-kostr2.inka-online.net] has quit [Changing host] | 06:52 | |
| -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 06:52 | |
| -!- EnLilaSko [~Nattzor@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 07:25 | |
| -!- delinquentme [~asdfasdf@pool-71-182-199-191.nwrknj.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 07:29 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@vredebest.xs4all.nl] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:00 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@vredebest.xs4all.nl] has quit [Changing host] | 08:00 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@unaffiliated/yorick] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 08:00 | |
| -!- abetusk [~abetusk@cpe-24-58-232-122.twcny.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 08:30 | |
| @kanzure | "The winner of the 2012 Feynman Prize for Experiment is the team of Gerhard Meyer, Leo Gross, and Jascha Repp for their work to produce images of molecular orbitals and charges detailed enough to identify the structure of individual molecules, as well as metal-molecule complexes. They have also been able to precisely make and break individual chemical bonds." | 09:42 |
| @kanzure | "The winner of the 2012 Feynman Prize for Theory is David Soloveichik of University of California, San Francisco, for his general theory of DNA displacement cascades. In particular, he has shown that they are Turing-complete, and so can be made to run any general-purpose computer program." | 09:43 |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 09:44 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 09:44 | |
| -!- lichen_ is now known as lichen | 10:08 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 10:18 | |
| nmz787 | those feynman guys sound like hot stuff | 10:19 |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@unaffiliated/yorick] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 10:20 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@vredebest.xs4all.nl] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:21 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@vredebest.xs4all.nl] has quit [Changing host] | 10:21 | |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@unaffiliated/yorick] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:21 | |
| @kanzure | nmz787: these prizes are from foresight institute | 10:23 |
| @kanzure | foresight was hosting the reprap/gada prize for a while until it turned out they may or may not have been taking money out of it (nobody was able to really clarify this) | 10:24 |
| @kanzure | which is about when i stepped up to move that prize fund out of foresight and into another org | 10:24 |
| nmz787 | did you? | 10:41 |
| nmz787 | find a new place for it? | 10:41 |
| @kanzure | humanityplus | 10:42 |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-53-184-243.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:48 | |
| eudoxia | which as it turns out wasn't that great an org either | 10:49 |
| @kanzure | well, my goal was to make sure the money stays put | 10:50 |
| @kanzure | not, in that case, to fix the entire transhumanist organization community | 10:50 |
| -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-35.wireless.umd.edu] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:53 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] | 10:56 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 10:56 | |
| @kanzure | spider-built spider decoys http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/12/spider-building-spider/ | 11:02 |
| @kanzure | http://blog.perunature.com/2012/12/new-species-of-decoy-spider-likely.html | 11:02 |
| @kanzure | wtf wired has pop-up ads now? | 11:03 |
| nmz787 | kanzure: is there any way to review the code for something liek this https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/remove-google-redirects/ccenmflbeofaceccfhhggbagkblihpoh/details | 11:06 |
| @kanzure | yes | 11:07 |
| @kanzure | get the .crx file and unzip it | 11:08 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: here it is.. http://paste.ubuntu.com/1450596/ | 11:11 |
| -!- sylph_mako [~mako@103-9-42-1.flip.co.nz] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:20 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] | 11:25 | |
| @kanzure | nmz787: fenn knows autorouting things, btw | 11:31 |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 11:37 | |
| jrayhawk | yeah not being able to copy and paste links from the google search index was the most annoying change they've made | 11:53 |
| jrayhawk | ddg thankfully doesn't do that | 11:53 |
| @kanzure | it's too bad that nobody has figured out how to make exact symbol search work | 11:55 |
| @kanzure | i mean, work in the sense that it doesn't cost them too much money or resources | 11:55 |
| @kanzure | "As to “making chemistry available to a wider audience”, I don’t want to prejudge and then be surprised, but from where I sit, scholarly articles are much less accessible than they were 10 years ago." | 11:57 |
| @kanzure | "Just look at our cancellation list. Or do the scary exercise of seeing how many journals in Worldcat have less than 10 current subscribing institutions listed." | 11:58 |
| @kanzure | huh i didn't know that worldcat shows that | 11:58 |
| @kanzure | oh it's probably just has-a-physical-print-version information | 11:58 |
| @kanzure | fenn: hah, that merckindex url was apparently not supposed to be public... | 12:00 |
| @kanzure | "I am sending this message on behalf of PerkinElmer Informatics to clarify the conditions under which The Merck Index 14th Edition can be accessed online from PerkinElmer, following messages posted on CHMINF-L pointing out an "open" URL that allowed apparently free access." | 12:00 |
| @kanzure | "Online access to The Merck Index 14th Edition provided by PerkinElmer Informatics is only available at http://themerckindex.cambridgesoft.com: apart from a free two week trial, this requires payment of a license fee and access is controlled by username/password or IP authentication." | 12:00 |
| @kanzure | "Access via any other URL is not approved. The "open" URL posted on CHMINF-L (http://themerckindex.chemfinder.com) was made open inadvertently, and has now been closed." | 12:01 |
| @kanzure | "PerkinElmer Informatics apologizes for any misunderstanding or confusion created by the unintended open access." yeah uh.. that's not what Open Access means. | 12:01 |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-53-184-243.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 12:17 | |
| -!- Simurg [~Shehrazad@78.174.34.203] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:21 | |
| -!- Simurg [~Shehrazad@78.174.34.203] has quit [Changing host] | 12:21 | |
| -!- Simurg [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:21 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 12:22 | |
| @kanzure | is ChemDraw or ChemBio worth anything to anyone? | 12:36 |
| @kanzure | or ChemScript | 12:37 |
| nmz787 | jrayhawk: does nixtimilaztion fix gliadin? | 12:43 |
| nmz787 | kanzure those progs look OK | 12:43 |
| -!- Simurg is now known as ElixirVitae | 12:46 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has left ##hplusroadmap [] | 12:48 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@78.174.34.203] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:53 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@78.174.34.203] has quit [Changing host] | 12:53 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 12:53 | |
| @kanzure | HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 999 No Hacking | 12:55 |
| @kanzure | iis is a bitch | 12:55 |
| -!- emancipate [~emancipat@50.14.1.36] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:00 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-53-184-243.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 13:02 | |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has quit [Quit: wrldpc] | 13:40 | |
| jrayhawk | nmz787: Possibly! There are a lot of processing techniques in traditional cultures to increase digestability, including soaking, roasting, sun-drying, and fermenting that are known to bust up phytates, lectins, and may do the same for prolamines, but it'd be very hard to fight contamination issues. | 13:45 |
| jrayhawk | Flour does not like being contained. | 13:45 |
| -!- yorick [~quassel@unaffiliated/yorick] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 14:10 | |
| -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-53-184-243.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 14:14 | |
| -!- lichen_ [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:25 | |
| -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] | 14:28 | |
| -!- Simurg [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:31 | |
| -!- ElixirVitae [~Shehrazad@unaffiliated/shehrazad] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] | 14:34 | |
| -!- Simurg is now known as ElixirVitae | 14:34 | |
| @kanzure | http://inventors-against-patents.org/ | 14:42 |
| @kanzure | looks like they have nobody listed, haha | 14:43 |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 14:46 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-35.wireless.umd.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 14:48 | |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has quit [Quit: wrldpc] | 15:07 | |
| -!- pan4x [panax@131.247.116.140] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 15:42 | |
| chris_99 | a friend of mine is trying to do a sixth-sense type project, and we're thinking of different low powered actuators, just wondering if you guys have any ideas? | 16:06 |
| -!- EnLilaSko [~Nattzor@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 16:18 | |
| -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 16:20 | |
| @kanzure | "They don't use that selector as far as I know, because it's very brittle. Something like [class|='span'] would only match classes starting with 'span-' if they are the first class in the class list. So it wouldn't match something like '<div class="stacked span-5"></div>'" | 16:25 |
| @kanzure | gah | 16:25 |
| -!- lichen_ is now known as lichen | 16:54 | |
| -!- TheBeast666 [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] | 17:25 | |
| -!- safitan [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:28 | |
| -!- TheBeast666 [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 17:33 | |
| -!- safitan [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] | 17:35 | |
| -!- phryk [~phryk@static.39.216.9.176.clients.your-server.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 18:08 | |
| -!- ParahSailin [~parah@unaffiliated/parahsailin] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 18:11 | |
| -!- ParahSailin [~parah@adsl-69-151-150-200.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:12 | |
| -!- ParahSailin [~parah@adsl-69-151-150-200.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has quit [Changing host] | 18:12 | |
| -!- ParahSailin [~parah@unaffiliated/parahsailin] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:12 | |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:12 | |
| archbox_ | hey guys intranasal insuling can double memory performance in healthy adults. Is anyone here gonna jump on that? | 18:22 |
| archbox_ | insulin* | 18:22 |
| -!- abetusk [~abetusk@cpe-24-58-232-122.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:30 | |
| curtiss | sure why not | 18:54 |
| * curtiss snorts a fat rail of insulin | 18:54 | |
| archbox_ | o? | 18:54 |
| archbox_ | curtiss: do you do any legit biohacking? | 18:54 |
| @kanzure | legit? | 18:54 |
| @kanzure | yes i use git | 18:54 |
| curtiss | lol | 18:54 |
| curtiss | le git | 18:54 |
| archbox_ | wow | 18:54 |
| archbox_ | lol le meme face dot tumblr dot com | 18:55 |
| -!- archbox_ was kicked from ##hplusroadmap by kanzure [no reddit] | 18:55 | |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:55 | |
| jrayhawk | insulin is your glucose homeostasis hormone; shuttling glucose and BCAAs into your muscle and adipose tissue without actually having any incoming glucose is not a particularly safe thing to do to your blood sugar levels. | 18:55 |
| archbox_ | But it doubles your memory | 18:56 |
| jrayhawk | have fun with that | 18:56 |
| archbox_ | And intranasal mostly goes to your brain, not your other cells | 18:56 |
| archbox_ | wow | 18:56 |
| archbox_ | rude | 18:56 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: do you even biohack? | 18:56 |
| -!- archbox_ was kicked from ##hplusroadmap by kanzure [NO REDDIT] | 18:56 | |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:56 | |
| jrayhawk | oh, i see, so you're forcing glucose into your brain | 18:57 |
| archbox_ | kanzure: reddit? | 18:57 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: yeah it works really well | 18:57 |
| curtiss | it's true | 18:58 |
| curtiss | i went from 80 GB to 160 in one snort | 18:58 |
| archbox_ | okay is everyone in here just trolling? | 18:58 |
| archbox_ | Or am I the only one actually interested in h+? | 18:58 |
| curtiss | speak for yourself bro | 18:58 |
| jrayhawk | okay, see, the thing is, cells use up glucose metabolizing cofactors, and, when they run out of those cofactors, you get *neuronal insulin resistance* | 18:58 |
| jrayhawk | so this might be a neat party trick every once in a while, but you can't do it consistently | 18:59 |
| archbox_ | eh. so we need intranasal glucose metabolizing cofactors? | 18:59 |
| jrayhawk | you can't supercharge a cell; there are limits on oxidative stress | 18:59 |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 18:59 | |
| archbox_ | huh. so i need intranasal antioxidants | 18:59 |
| jrayhawk | you can't supplement away damage | 19:00 |
| jrayhawk | though i do encourage you to work very very hard on controlling cortisol and amping up glutathione production if you try this | 19:01 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: do you do anything? | 19:01 |
| archbox_ | and, thanks :) | 19:01 |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:02 | |
| -!- augur_ [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:03 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] | 19:04 | |
| jrayhawk | for the record, when you get muscular insulin resistance, it's physiologically normal, when you get hepatic insulin resistance, it's dangerous but easily reversable, when you get neuronal insulin resistance, you get permanent brain damage | 19:05 |
| @kanzure | transcriptic.com just raised $1.2M | 19:05 |
| archbox_ | th-thanks | 19:07 |
| AdrianG | jrayhawk: how do you know neuronal is not reversible | 19:07 |
| jrayhawk | the resistance is reversable, but a pile of neurons have apoptosed in the meantime. | 19:07 |
| jrayhawk | same would be true of hepatic cells, but they regrow pretty fast | 19:08 |
| archbox_ | so if i take noopept i'll get NGF and BDNF and i'll be good? | 19:09 |
| jrayhawk | muscle cells run fine on fat/ketones, so eh, they're fine | 19:09 |
| jrayhawk | http://vimeo.com/52645372 is a decent talk on why insulin signalling works the way it does | 19:10 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: do you study medicine? | 19:10 |
| jrayhawk | although the first half of it "please, low-carbers, shut up and leave me alone for the second half" | 19:11 |
| jrayhawk | +is | 19:11 |
| archbox_ | so doing keto fucks up your brain? | 19:12 |
| jrayhawk | Not terribly, though it usually does some thyroid downregulation once you hit leptin homeostasis for, like, a week. | 19:12 |
| archbox_ | ah, so you should supplement T3? | 19:12 |
| jrayhawk | Well, your muscles can actually use more glycogen than your liver can keep up with, so a certain amount of energy downregulation is called for. | 19:14 |
| archbox_ | this is all starting ot make sense | 19:14 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: did you know that you can order T3 online directly from merck and it's pretty cheap? | 19:14 |
| jrayhawk | the liver would be deriving that glucose from gluconeogenesis, which would be catabolizing tissues, most commonly muscle, for whatever period you don't have BCAAs in your bloodstream from food | 19:15 |
| archbox_ | I have BCAA powder | 19:15 |
| jrayhawk | Yes, but I assume you sleep at night. | 19:15 |
| jrayhawk | or, rather, you sleep for eight hours at some point | 19:15 |
| archbox_ | is it possible to put BCAA's in IV? | 19:16 |
| jrayhawk | Probably. | 19:16 |
| archbox_ | k i'll tell my doctor i'm going to do keto and hopefully get a prescriptoin | 19:16 |
| jrayhawk | http://chriskresser.com/thyroid you might want to do some reading on thyroid hormone pathways before attempting to goose everything with T3 | 19:17 |
| archbox_ | yeah i know about that | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | so obviously more T3 = better | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | put some stress off your thyroid | 19:18 |
| jrayhawk | uh, well, no | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | >mental slowing, depression, dementia, weight gain, constipation, dry skin, hair loss, cold intolerance, hoarse voice, irregular menstruation, infertility, muscle stiffness and pain | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | you want that shit? | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | by more i mean microgram doses | 19:18 |
| archbox_ | obviously railing a gram of T3 would kill you | 19:18 |
| jrayhawk | You're disrupting homeostatic feedback systems again without thinking about the consequences. You're going to drive the body to produce massive amounts of RT3 in response. | 19:20 |
| archbox_ | o? | 19:21 |
| archbox_ | still though | 19:22 |
| archbox_ | it's better than getting dry skin and fat | 19:22 |
| AdrianG | lol RT3 | 19:23 |
| AdrianG | jrayhawk: T3 is rx'd when you are producing too much RT3. dont be stupid. | 19:23 |
| AdrianG | also archbox_ | 19:23 |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:23 | |
| -!- augur_ [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] | 19:23 | |
| AdrianG | are you going to tell the entire world to buy T3 from merck | 19:24 |
| jrayhawk | Yes, standard of care is awful. | 19:24 |
| archbox_ | nah, only biohackers | 19:24 |
| jrayhawk | Doctors do pretty much the same naive disruption of homeostatic feedback systems that archbox_ wants to do. | 19:24 |
| archbox_ | wow | 19:24 |
| archbox_ | >naive | 19:25 |
| jrayhawk | This is why the medical system is projected to bankrupt the economy by about 2030. | 19:25 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: so what do you recommend? | 19:25 |
| @fenn | increasing your iodine intake is a safe(r) way to start | 19:26 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, that's great for thyroid. | 19:26 |
| jrayhawk | Also psychological stress management, also oxidative stress management, also inflammation management | 19:26 |
| @fenn | seaweed, shrimp, ummm.. kelp powder perhaps | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | how much iodine? | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | I take KI | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | 150mcg | 19:27 |
| @fenn | well you're probably fine on iodine then | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | oh | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | what other drugs are good? | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | for thyroid? | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | aspirin? | 19:27 |
| archbox_ | (inflammation) | 19:27 |
| @fenn | are you saying you have the symptoms of hypothyroidism? | 19:28 |
| @fenn | because there is such a thing as hyperthyroidism too | 19:29 |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has quit [Quit: wrldpc] | 19:29 | |
| @fenn | oh i see, you want to do a ketogenic diet and not get t3 downregulation | 19:31 |
| @fenn | i think the answer there is to eat some carbs once a week | 19:31 |
| jrayhawk | Post-workout is best if you want to stay adapted. | 19:31 |
| jrayhawk | The peak in insulin is what matters, rather than the volume. | 19:32 |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] | 19:33 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] | 19:36 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 19:38 | |
| @fenn | "t3 increases the rate of protein degradation, and, in excess, the rate of protein degradation exceeds the rate of protein synthesis. In such situations, the body may go into negative ion balance." | 19:46 |
| AdrianG | negtive ion balance O.O | 19:47 |
| AdrianG | zomg | 19:47 |
| @fenn | do you ever have anything constructive to say? | 19:48 |
| AdrianG | actually increasing iodine wont necessarly make more T3 available centrally | 19:48 |
| jrayhawk | oh, right, you're still here | 19:48 |
| AdrianG | thats the dumbest thing ive ever heard. | 19:48 |
| jrayhawk | AdrianG: in general, if you want to cite standard of care, you should first look up the efficacy of the treatment you're describing | 19:48 |
| AdrianG | also, increasing T3 will not increase RT3. it will reduce T3. | 19:48 |
| jrayhawk | increasing t3 will reduce t3 | 19:48 |
| jrayhawk | got it | 19:48 |
| AdrianG | rt3, grow a brain to detect typos | 19:49 |
| AdrianG | it is metabolically impossible to produce more RT3 if exogenous T3 is given. | 19:50 |
| jrayhawk | oooohkay, where exactly does the T4 go, then? | 19:50 |
| AdrianG | T4 production will be suppressed by exogenous T3 | 19:51 |
| AdrianG | suppressed or attenuated, depending on the dose. | 19:51 |
| AdrianG | T4 production will fall, RT3 will be eventually cleared. | 19:51 |
| AdrianG | increasing iodine intake in hopes of producing more T3 is also far from guaranteed. | 19:52 |
| @fenn | it only matters if you're iodine deficient, however many people in america are deficient | 19:53 |
| AdrianG | you could have an ineffective transport of T4 thru BBB, and end up with peripheral thyrotoxicosis, while still centrally-deficient | 19:53 |
| AdrianG | much safer and effective to take a correct dose of T3. | 19:53 |
| @fenn | looking over this again, (i'm not thyroid expert) it seems like jrayhawk meant somatostatin, not RT3 | 20:00 |
| jrayhawk | No, it's a matter of tanking TBG levels and effectively getting T3 resistance. | 20:00 |
| jrayhawk | well, i guess T3 resistance is not the right way to think about it. | 20:01 |
| jrayhawk | genuine resistance is an actual thing and would look different | 20:02 |
| @fenn | reduced half-life? | 20:02 |
| jrayhawk | anyway, thyroid is annoyingly complicated and standard of care has really shitty efficacy for it | 20:05 |
| -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 20:07 | |
| AdrianG | lo | 20:08 |
| AdrianG | thats why replacing either l-thyroxine or T3, or in combination works most of the time. | 20:08 |
| AdrianG | because its just so shitty. | 20:08 |
| jrayhawk | It does nothing for the underlying etiology. | 20:08 |
| AdrianG | lol are you serious | 20:09 |
| jrayhawk | Yes? | 20:09 |
| AdrianG | wow. | 20:09 |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-69-138-251-193.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] | 20:12 | |
| AdrianG | in practical terms, etiology is not important. | 20:15 |
| AdrianG | GPs are there to provide treatment, not conduct research. | 20:15 |
| jrayhawk | Thyroid disregulation is a symptom, not a disease. GPs treating it as a disease are typically making the actual disease worse. | 20:17 |
| -!- Guest88126 [~archbox@ip72-201-163-66.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:17 | |
| -!- Guest88126 is now known as archbox_ | 20:17 | |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@ip72-201-163-66.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Changing host] | 20:17 | |
| -!- archbox_ [~archbox@unaffiliated/archbox] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:17 | |
| jrayhawk | Although in the scenario above the thyroid downregulation was physiologically normal and appropriate. | 20:17 |
| jrayhawk | The archbox_ one, that is. | 20:18 |
| archbox_ | thanks! | 20:18 |
| jrayhawk | hello! | 20:18 |
| jrayhawk | Or, rather, the long-term ketosis one | 20:18 |
| AdrianG | jrayhawk: in what scenario | 20:18 |
| AdrianG | ketosis? | 20:18 |
| archbox_ | ya | 20:19 |
| archbox_ | keto | 20:19 |
| jrayhawk | "Disease management" vs "health care" is the pithy shorthand. | 20:25 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: are you an eastern doctor? | 20:26 |
| * fenn giggles | 20:27 | |
| jrayhawk | i would tell you, but the scapulae tell me it would bring me bad fortune | 20:29 |
| archbox_ | whelp | 20:30 |
| archbox_ | do you guys take aspirin daily? | 20:30 |
| @fenn | i used to, but decided against it | 20:30 |
| archbox_ | ah, due to the ulcers? | 20:30 |
| archbox_ | or were you bleeding too much? | 20:30 |
| @fenn | no, because it blocks prostaglandin synthesis | 20:31 |
| archbox_ | ah. Exercise? | 20:31 |
| jrayhawk | NSAIDs are pretty nasty in general. | 20:31 |
| @fenn | i wasn't suffering any symptoms from aspirin, if that's what you're asking | 20:31 |
| archbox_ | weren't you saying earlier to remove inflammation, jrayhawk ? | 20:31 |
| archbox_ | wouldn't an NSAID do that? | 20:31 |
| @fenn | yes but you can develop vasculature problems, see the vioxx recall for example | 20:32 |
| jrayhawk | That would mitigate inflammatory response to an inflammatory agent, but that just makes things easier for the inflammatory agent. | 20:32 |
| archbox_ | cuz COX2 inhibition? | 20:32 |
| archbox_ | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rofecoxib#Other_COX-2_inhibitors | 20:32 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk: that's assuming it's some kind of infection, which is often not the case | 20:32 |
| @fenn | in first world anyway | 20:33 |
| jrayhawk | First world has intestinal permeability; they're pretty much fucked anyway. | 20:33 |
| archbox_ | is taking 40-81mg aspirin really that much of a COX-2 inhibitor? | 20:33 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: dat gluten | 20:33 |
| @fenn | no, 81 is a pretty low dose | 20:34 |
| archbox_ | oh. were you taking a full aspirin a day? | 20:34 |
| archbox_ | for longevity people usually just take one baby aspirin or half | 20:34 |
| archbox_ | so 40 or 81 | 20:34 |
| @fenn | "COX-2 mediates the synthesis of prostaglandins responsible for pain and inflammation." is only half of the story | 20:35 |
| archbox_ | o? | 20:35 |
| @fenn | it also synthesizes prostaglandins which are vasodilatory and inhibit platelet aggregation | 20:37 |
| @fenn | the great thing about biology is there's so much to learn... :\ | 20:39 |
| @fenn | hormones are complex and complicated. i'm looking at this to try to get a better answer for you http://www.itmonline.org/arts/lox.htm | 20:40 |
| -!- wrldpc [~wrldpc@203.105.94.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 20:40 | |
| archbox_ | Oh, I realize that COX-2 inhibitors can fuck you up. I was asking if 81mg aspirin would do this | 20:43 |
| archbox_ | aspirin isn't much of a COX-2 inhibitor, right? | 20:43 |
| @fenn | it inhibits cox-1 and cox-2 | 20:43 |
| @fenn | irreversibly, on a mole-for-mole basis | 20:44 |
| @fenn | but fortunately we're making new cox proteins all the time | 20:44 |
| archbox_ | this sounds like aspirin acts differently from COX-2 inhibitors: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspirin#COX-1_and_COX-2_inhibition | 20:44 |
| @fenn | the idea behind cox-2 selective inhibitors was to prevent the side effects from inhibiting cox-1 | 20:45 |
| @fenn | but it didn't work as intended, because it turns out we need cox-2 also (duh) | 20:45 |
| @fenn | it's fine for short-term injury treatment, but not if you take it continuously every day for years | 20:46 |
| jrayhawk | archbox_: the quick summary of inflammation/oxidation management: stop eating grains and legumes, greatly curtail fructose and linoleic acid, eat a lot of nutrient-dense foods, including seafood and organ meats, get sunlight or supplement with a lot of D3, avoid cortisol-inducing stresses, be gentle to your intestinal flora and give them lots of soluable fiber and try not do dump too many alkali or antiseptic agents down there. | 20:47 |
| jrayhawk | am i missing anything | 20:47 |
| @fenn | magnesium | 20:47 |
| jrayhawk | oh yeah, industrial agriculture sucks, try to find long-term organic farms with fresh produce | 20:48 |
| jrayhawk | though fossil fuel agriculture actually screwed up some stuff pretty permanently in some areas, so i guess magnesium supplementation might be necessary :/ | 20:50 |
| @fenn | water purification systems block the main magnesium source in the diet | 20:51 |
| jrayhawk | oh yeah, long-term hardcore ketosis was also hell on my gut flora | 20:51 |
| jrayhawk | i guess keto does not necessarily mean zero carb, but some people seem to treat it that way | 20:52 |
| @fenn | i never understood why keto was regarded as a good thing | 20:53 |
| @fenn | acetone in your blood? | 20:53 |
| jrayhawk | Eh, acetone's not particularly scary. | 20:53 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: is it okay that i take r-faction alpha lipoic acid? | 20:54 |
| archbox_ | and yeah i basically eat paleo so what you said is what i do | 20:54 |
| jrayhawk | Oh, yeah, Alpha lipoic acid is neat stuff. Popular in eastern medicine, too! | 20:54 |
| archbox_ | yeah i thought of it when you mentioned the omega 6 (even though they aren't related they sound similar :< ) | 20:54 |
| archbox_ | ALA vs. LA | 20:55 |
| jrayhawk | actually more obnoxious is ALA vs ALA | 20:55 |
| archbox_ | fuck | 20:55 |
| archbox_ | yeah | 20:55 |
| jrayhawk | Alpha lipoic acid and alpha linoleic acid | 20:55 |
| @fenn | as long as nobody starts selling pills with "essential omega 6" we'll be fine | 20:56 |
| archbox_ | they do | 20:56 |
| archbox_ | rip | 20:56 |
| jrayhawk | Alpha lipoic acid has lots of neat metabolic effects and alpha linoleic acid's primary useful function is competing with LA for receptors | 20:56 |
| jrayhawk | which is to say alpha linoleic acid is actually pretty useless | 20:56 |
| archbox_ | :< | 20:56 |
| jrayhawk | fenn: I dunno, I'd be perfectly willing to eat an AA pill. | 20:57 |
| archbox_ | hey, some small percent of it can be converted to EPA and DHA | 20:57 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk: to what benefit? | 20:57 |
| jrayhawk | I mean, assuming it hasn't been heat treated and esterified to hell and back. | 20:57 |
| jrayhawk | AA is complimentary to DHA for neural construction. | 20:57 |
| archbox_ | fenn: muscle gainz | 20:57 |
| archbox_ | oh | 20:57 |
| archbox_ | jrayhawk: there's quite a bit of AA in animal products, no? Do organ meats have a lot? | 20:58 |
| jrayhawk | Yeah, liver and egg yolks are the big ones. | 20:58 |
| archbox_ | specifically: chicken hearts (because I eat those probably more often than I should) | 20:58 |
| archbox_ | I have livers sometimes too | 20:59 |
| jrayhawk | Heart is almost entirely protein. | 20:59 |
| archbox_ | yeah I cook it in fat | 20:59 |
| archbox_ | I usually use coconut oil or butter/ghee for cooking | 20:59 |
| jrayhawk | fenn: also the elongase reaction throws off a shitload of cytokines, so the more AA you have, the less your body will attempt to manufacture. | 20:59 |
| jrayhawk | s/so/and/ | 21:00 |
| -!- erasmus [~esb@unaffiliated/erasmus] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] | 21:00 | |
| @fenn | i thought AA was pro-inflamatory | 21:01 |
| @fenn | from barry sears, "The simple definition of an anti-inflammatory diet is one | 21:02 |
| @fenn | that prevents the excess production of AA | 21:02 |
| @fenn | hereby reducing the | 21:02 |
| @fenn | key substrate for the generation of pro-inflammatory eicosanoids. | 21:02 |
| * fenn grumbles about pdfs | 21:03 | |
| jrayhawk | He's right! We totally want to avoid production! | 21:03 |
| archbox_ | fenn: not necessarily, but it ay cancel out the benefits of omega 3's | 21:03 |
| @fenn | AA is the substrate that gets turned into pro-inflammatory eicosanoids | 21:03 |
| archbox_ | may* | 21:03 |
| archbox_ | anitinflammatory benefit, that is. | 21:03 |
| archbox_ | fenn: the body only does that when it needs inflammation | 21:04 |
| archbox_ | AA doesn't cause chronic inflammation | 21:04 |
| archbox_ | If you never get inflammation then you won't get much benefit from exercise | 21:04 |
| @fenn | bah | 21:04 |
| archbox_ | whelp :< | 21:05 |
| archbox_ | yeah fenn over in ##nutrition we had a big discussion awhile ago about AA. | 21:05 |
| jrayhawk | http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?aid=1304684 http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayFulltext?type=1&fid=1304764&jid=BJN&volumeId=98&issueId=03&aid=1304756 http://content.karger.com/ProdukteDB/produkte.asp?Doi=236447 | 21:06 |
| @fenn | jrayhawk: do you have like a zillion bookmarks all sorted and ready ot go? | 21:07 |
| @kanzure | why not? | 21:07 |
| jrayhawk | Sorta. I keep meaning to put this in a wiki. | 21:07 |
| @fenn | i used to have a good bookmark file but lost track of it once i joined this channel :P | 21:08 |
| jrayhawk | In the context of a diet deficient in DHA, I am perfectly willing to believe that piling AA on the lipid fire is a bad idea, of course. | 21:09 |
| @fenn | i wonder if AA is the reason for the "butter mind" phenomenon | 21:18 |
| @fenn | (the observation that eating half a stick of butter improves simple math problem reaction times) | 21:19 |
| @kanzure | maybe instead of a titlebot we can have a bookmarkbot | 21:19 |
| jrayhawk | well, that and the saturated fat | 21:20 |
| @fenn | why would saturated fat affect the brain? | 21:20 |
| jrayhawk | IIRC the QSers doing that butter testing were starting from a SAD diet, which is fairly deficient | 21:20 |
| archbox_ | MCT's do something beneficial, no? | 21:20 |
| @fenn | anyway coconut oil didn't show the effect | 21:21 |
| jrayhawk | ah, interesting | 21:21 |
| jrayhawk | okay | 21:21 |
| -!- aristarchus [~aristarch@unaffiliated/aristarchus] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 21:23 | |
| @fenn | this sounds useful for wearable computing (p300 eeg wave) "Generally speaking, improbable events will elicit a P3b, and the less probable the event, the larger the P3b." | 21:26 |
| @kanzure | dump everything after 5min when an improbable thing does not occur? | 21:27 |
| @fenn | you could automatically trigger high-def recording when a p3b is observed | 21:27 |
| @kanzure | you need it before it's observed | 21:27 |
| @fenn | the problem is determining whether it exists or not; usually it's being observed in a lab setting where the stimulus is known and controlled by the experimenter | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | jrayhawk: where's arachidonate come from? | 21:28 |
| @fenn | kanzure: easy enough to store a ring buffer of n seconds | 21:28 |
| nmz787 | last week a friend and i discussed a wide-band SDR that monitored your head | 21:29 |
| nmz787 | he mentioned it being possible with phased arrays maybe | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | so you can shape the antenna | 21:30 |
| @kanzure | nmz787: you should ask fenn about autorouting things | 21:30 |
| @fenn | autorouting sucks | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | fenn autorouting is needed | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | or at least length matching | 21:30 |
| @fenn | supposedly altium works okay but it's very expensive | 21:30 |
| nmz787 | and curve addition | 21:30 |
| @fenn | length matching is a different beast | 21:30 |
| @fenn | just add more squiggles | 21:31 |
| @fenn | i think both kicad and gEDA (and eagle) do length matching | 21:31 |
| @fenn | the neat thing about phased arrays is you can do the "beam forming" after the fact | 21:32 |
| @fenn | i like the idea of topo router, and supposedly there was a plugin written for gEDA, but it's not maintained and there's no documentation | 21:33 |
| jrayhawk | nmz787: most mammals, including humans, are reasonably good at elongating/desaturating linoleic acid to archadonic acid | 21:34 |
| @fenn | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TopoR | 21:34 |
| jrayhawk | in humans, there's a big 'oh shit' inflammatory signal in doing so, though; presumably it signals a diet low in animal protein | 21:35 |
| @fenn | so perhaps taking GLA along with AA will reduce inflammation | 21:37 |
| jrayhawk | Might be true. | 21:38 |
| jrayhawk | There are also ways of influencing the pathway. "Having enough of certain nutrients in the body (including magnesium, zinc, and vitamins C, B3, and B6) helps promote the conversion of GLA to DGLA." | 21:39 |
| -!- aristarchus [~aristarch@unaffiliated/aristarchus] has quit [Quit: Leaving] | 21:52 | |
| -!- augur [~augur@c-98-218-127-183.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 22:09 | |
| -!- emancipate [~emancipat@50.14.1.36] has quit [Quit: .] | 22:22 | |
| nmz787 | GLA being a non inflammatory arachidonic derivative? | 22:24 |
| jrayhawk | GLA also being useful and also being costly for the body to manufacture | 22:29 |
| jrayhawk | costly in terms of inflammatory signaling | 22:29 |
| @kanzure | IV owns "Accelerando Development, LLC" | 22:37 |
| @kanzure | charles stross should hurry up and die so he can roll in his grave | 22:37 |
| @kanzure | it looks like transcriptic is leading angel list's online investment feature | 22:40 |
| @kanzure | i thought transcriptic was just sent to me in their announcement email because they identified me as having looked at it before | 22:40 |
| @kanzure | but it seems instead to be the default that everyone sees | 22:40 |
| nmz787 | do we know this guy http://www.instructables.com/member/argon/ | 22:58 |
| @fenn | i've never met him | 23:10 |
| -!- phryk [~phryk@static.39.216.9.176.clients.your-server.de] has joined ##hplusroadmap | 23:45 | |
| @kanzure | "Myhrvold started buying equipment for the research kitchen in the Intellectual Ventures lab. Much of the equipment was standard cooking equipment, but it also included items such as rotor-stator homogenizers, ultrahigh-pressure homogenizers, freeze-dryers, a 50 G centrifuge,[1] ultrasonic baths, and rotary evaporators.[9]" | 23:46 |
| @kanzure | "The laboratory already included other high-tech and industrial equipment,[10] a 100-ton hydraulic press,[10] a large water-jet cutter, an electrical discharge machine, and automated milling machines." | 23:46 |
| @kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Myhrvold | 23:47 |
| @kanzure | i thought IV just had lots of holding companies | 23:47 |
| @fenn | didnt they do the laser mosquito shooter | 23:47 |
| @fenn | oh, he wrote modernist cuisine, cool | 23:51 |
| @fenn | gah, only the CTO of microsoft would patent a geoengineering scheme for reversing global warming | 23:52 |
| --- Log closed Thu Dec 20 00:00:04 2012 | ||
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
