| --- Log opened Tue Apr 23 00:00:05 2013 | ||
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| kanzure | i am having trouble remembering all of the tiny nodejs packages. | 01:24 |
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| kanzure | hm.. this looks thorough: https://github.com/hyperandroid/Automata | 01:44 |
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| rigel | so apparently phantomjs had selenium support built-in | 02:36 |
| rigel | but then not so much, and ghost.py was suggested | 02:36 |
| rigel | part of my problem, i guess, is that i am using the webdriver'd ff instance both for automation and for probing | 02:38 |
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| kanzure | rigel: phantomjs recently had a webdriver implemented, yes. | 03:07 |
| kanzure | ghost.py isn't really similar, but yours truly has a few commits in that repo anyway. | 03:07 |
| kanzure | lots of folks like casperjs, but i've never wanted it. | 03:08 |
| kanzure | phantomjs has the webkit remote debugger enabled if you want to use that for development | 03:10 |
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| nmz787_ | makoLime: nope, I usually use irssi | 04:01 |
| * nmz787_ nmz787 | 04:02 | |
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| makoLime | nmz787, oh, so the "Page closed" quit message is... irssi refering to tabs as pages? | 04:22 |
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| superkuh | Lame. NASA's STI Reports are still censored by the Dept. of Homeland Security but their RSS feed still updates with titles and summaries. Such a tease. The service has been censored for going on a month now. | 04:27 |
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| nmz787 | makoLime: not sure what you're talking about | 04:32 |
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| delinquentme | le weh | 07:58 |
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| kanzure | brownies: since you like glowing crap so much, http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/antonyevans/glowing-plants-natural-lighting-with-no-electricit | 11:45 |
| kanzure | who the hell pledged $10,000? | 11:46 |
| kanzure | it's at $15666 and they are spamming my inbox with crap like "WE ALREADY REACHED 20% OF OUR GOAL" | 11:47 |
| ParahSailin | ah geez | 11:47 |
| kanzure | so.. i think they just pledged their own money in that. | 11:47 |
| ParahSailin | definitely | 11:47 |
| kanzure | i really don't like omri ("mr. genome compiler").. it's not a compiler, stop lying to me. | 11:48 |
| ParahSailin | omri? | 11:48 |
| kanzure | also, nobody likes adobe air/flash. | 11:48 |
| kanzure | this is one of omri's projects | 11:48 |
| ParahSailin | man theres so much absolute trash | 11:48 |
| ParahSailin | and the sad thing is, there's not really much useful stuff that _can_ be done at the current level of technology | 11:49 |
| kanzure | omri also raised something like $500k for his "genome compiler". | 11:49 |
| kanzure | there's a lot of useful things that could be done.. the vast majority of lab equipment has no open source equivalent. | 11:49 |
| ParahSailin | so no chance of weighing out the bad | 11:49 |
| ParahSailin | what would it take to marshall the resources to do that | 11:53 |
| kanzure | first thing is to figure out how to make the incentives align | 11:53 |
| kanzure | there may or may not be a market for open source equipment. imagine that there's no market for it. even if there's no market, those devices are still worth having and using for our development activities. so the incentives are still tricky to figure out in that case. | 11:54 |
| ParahSailin | i think pirated illumina would be a pretty killer app | 11:54 |
| kanzure | the software? | 11:54 |
| ParahSailin | no, the machine | 11:54 |
| kanzure | well, biocurious is theoretically doing a teardown of an illumina today or tomorrow or w/e.. hopefully they document enough of it that we can ship it off to china. | 11:55 |
| kanzure | i've asked them to also get a copy of any hard drives or ROMs on chips and shit, but they just looked at me confused. so it might not be a thorough teardown.. | 11:55 |
| ParahSailin | they really got a gaiix that they can completely tear down | 11:56 |
| ParahSailin | i have such a hard time believing that | 11:56 |
| ParahSailin | i might even bet money on that | 11:57 |
| ParahSailin | the theory of illumina isnt that complicated, it might not even be that hard to reverse engineer | 12:05 |
| ParahSailin | tricks are the flow cell surface preparation and the clustering wet chemistry | 12:06 |
| ParahSailin | who knows, the patents might even cover how those work | 12:06 |
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| kanzure | makerbot industries trying to patent obvious things http://forums.reprap.org/read.php?1,201914,201954 | 13:14 |
| ParahSailin | well, the legal definition of obvious is simple composition of things that are patented | 13:17 |
| kanzure | guess i better start filing for patents on socially networked transcranial brain things. | 13:18 |
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| kanzure | stupid glowplant is up to $20k :( | 13:26 |
| kanzure | pft "We will be printing our DNA with Cambrian Genomics who have developed a revolutionary laser printing system that massively reduces the cost of DNA synthesis." | 13:27 |
| kanzure | "Funds raised will also be used to support our work to develop an open policy framework for DIY Bio work involving recombinant DNA." | 13:27 |
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| kanzure | fuck those assholes. "open policy framework.." how about no? | 13:27 |
| kanzure | "The framework will include recommendations for what kinds of projects are safe for DIY Bio enthusiasts " | 13:27 |
| kanzure | what the hell is this shit :( | 13:27 |
| kanzure | "Genome Compiler is software, designed by Omri and his team, which allows a user to easily design genetic sequences and order them online. The software includes a large database of genetic parts and a beautiful interface so you can easily combine them to create your desired results." | 13:28 |
| kanzure | this is not a compiler. what a liar. | 13:28 |
| ParahSailin | what printing dna? | 13:29 |
| ParahSailin | laser printing dna? | 13:29 |
| kanzure | fenn wrote some notes in the logs about what cambrian genomics is actually doing.. it's something like "let's use sequencing to reduce the cost of gene synthesis" or something. | 13:32 |
| ParahSailin | i should just give up doing honest work and be a charlatan | 13:33 |
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| ParahSailin | the upshot is that we won't have any more how-do-i-make-a-glowing-plant posts on diybio | 13:42 |
| kanzure | no they are going to increase :( | 13:43 |
| ParahSailin | kanzure: lets do a charlatan kickstarter to get money to divert towards a useful open hardware | 13:45 |
| kanzure | well it seems that people only donate if they like the video and the rewards | 13:45 |
| kanzure | and the rewards seem to have to be actual products, which i don't really want to do. that's low margins and a lot of work.. | 13:45 |
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| kanzure | ParahSailin: how about you just tell me what you want to do and i just pay for it | 13:49 |
| kanzure | ParahSailin: isn't that easier? | 13:49 |
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| ParahSailin | hm | 13:54 |
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| makoLime | nmz787, you sometimes use an IRC client that has "page closed" as its quit message. I wonder what that is. | 16:05 |
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| ThomasEgi | makoLime, a webchat client? | 16:13 |
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| makoLime | ThomasEgi, I'd presume so. | 16:16 |
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| SphericalMouse | Sup? | 16:31 |
| kanzure | busy being annoyed at omri | 16:31 |
| kanzure | trying to pick projects to dump money into | 16:31 |
| SphericalMouse | ? | 16:32 |
| kanzure | how goes the teardown? | 16:32 |
| SphericalMouse | happens sunday | 16:32 |
| kanzure | drats. | 16:32 |
| SphericalMouse | filled up in under a day | 16:32 |
| kanzure | photo everything. get the ROMs off the chips. | 16:33 |
| SphericalMouse | have you done group teardowns before? | 16:33 |
| kanzure | no. i've done teardowns before on my own, though. | 16:33 |
| SphericalMouse | I'm just wondering how to best present it | 16:34 |
| kanzure | get one of those mirror-based overhead projectors to show the smaller parts on a wall | 16:35 |
| SphericalMouse | that would just cast a shadow | 16:35 |
| SphericalMouse | maybe having a camera guy linked into a projector | 16:35 |
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| kanzure | ParahSail1n: ask SphericalMouse about your teardown woes | 17:09 |
| SphericalMouse | ? | 17:11 |
| kanzure | SphericalMouse: give him a minute, geeze.. | 17:11 |
| SphericalMouse | just saying im here is all | 17:12 |
| kanzure | okay | 17:12 |
| ParahSail1n | hey | 17:24 |
| ParahSail1n | you have access to a ga2x? | 17:24 |
| SphericalMouse | depends, the ones at biocurious are just GAs | 17:26 |
| SphericalMouse | might have some 2xs at work | 17:26 |
| SphericalMouse | what do you need? | 17:33 |
| ParahSail1n | you were reverse engineering one? | 17:34 |
| SphericalMouse | no, we use them as test platforms | 17:35 |
| ParahSail1n | what does your work do? | 17:36 |
| SphericalMouse | though that would an amusing case of lost knowledge | 17:36 |
| SphericalMouse | we make DNA sequencers | 17:37 |
| ParahSail1n | illumina competitor? | 17:37 |
| SphericalMouse | not quite | 17:38 |
| kanzure | just think of the benefits for your employer: if you can prove that illumina's software is wrong, that would be a net gain. | 17:40 |
| kanzure | hint: embedded stuff is usually wrong in a number of ways, unless it happens to be nasa.. | 17:40 |
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| SphericalMouse | does anyone use GAs any more anyways? | 17:42 |
| ParahSail1n | i think that the embedded stuff is not likely to be a problem with the illumina systems | 17:42 |
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| ParahSail1n | because all the embedded stuff has to do is transmit the images to the RTA software on the computer | 17:42 |
| SphericalMouse | not even that | 17:42 |
| kanzure | well, i'd also be willing to take a stab at the software on the computer. | 17:43 |
| kanzure | which i do not have. | 17:43 |
| ParahSail1n | kanzure, i can give you a password to download casava and olb if you want | 17:43 |
| kanzure | sure. not right now. stuffing my face with food and acting like i can write javascript. | 17:43 |
| ParahSail1n | casava's like 1.5 GB | 17:44 |
| kanzure | what's in it? | 17:44 |
| ParahSail1n | i forget if casava includes the rta software or if its just deindexing and miscellaneous stuff | 17:45 |
| SphericalMouse | http://www.illumina.com/software/genome_analyzer_software.ilmn | 17:45 |
| ParahSail1n | there's a shitty mapper included i think | 17:45 |
| SphericalMouse | not sure if it is much use without test images though | 17:46 |
| kanzure | most of the time vendors put extra software on, or they make mistakes in the product and release other software online | 17:46 |
| ParahSail1n | i might have test images somewhere | 17:46 |
| ParahSail1n | hm, looks like illumina doesnt require login anymore http://support.illumina.com/documents/MyIllumina/6e422abb-dc36-4d09-b223-0eafef26ddc5/CASAVA_v1.8.2.tar | 17:47 |
| kanzure | i am also curious about their security.. do they have significant blocks against just dumping your own software onto the device, etc. | 17:47 |
| SphericalMouse | you mean while connected to the computer? | 17:50 |
| kanzure | that's also worth exploring i think | 17:51 |
| kanzure | what is their connection anyway? | 17:51 |
| kanzure | usb? has anyone sniffed it? | 17:51 |
| SphericalMouse | think its usb, but maybe usb to serial | 17:52 |
| SphericalMouse | the GA is elegant in its lack of pretense | 17:53 |
| kanzure | ah yes... "elegant" http://med.fsu.edu/userImages/6-Illumina--HiSeq-2000.jpg | 17:54 |
| SphericalMouse | thats a hiseq | 17:55 |
| ParahSail1n | hm the server at work must not be the one that is hooked up to the ga2x's | 17:55 |
| kanzure | actually i guess that doesn't look as bad as the bage boxes like the rest | 17:55 |
| ParahSail1n | so they give you a proprietary computer to hook up to the sequencer? | 17:55 |
| SphericalMouse | just a dell | 17:56 |
| SphericalMouse | at least for the GA | 17:56 |
| ParahSail1n | i guess the machine doesnt have to be that fast, because it does like one cycle every few hours | 17:57 |
| nmz787 | howdy | 17:57 |
| nmz787 | this might be useful for ROM dumping the illumina http://conference.hitb.org/hitbsecconf2013ams/materials/D1T1%20-%20Travis%20Goodspeed%20-%20Nifty%20Tricks%20and%20Sage%20Advice%20for%20Shellcode%20on%20Embedded%20Systems.pdf | 17:58 |
| SphericalMouse | not really true, needs to process large data files. | 17:58 |
| ParahSail1n | but it has plenty of time to do that | 17:58 |
| SphericalMouse | the cycle time is the collection of those large files | 17:59 |
| ParahSail1n | oh, really? the cycle time is compute bound? | 17:59 |
| SphericalMouse | modern systems are faster too | 17:59 |
| SphericalMouse | not really | 18:00 |
| ParahSail1n | the cycle time is camera bound? | 18:00 |
| SphericalMouse | roughly | 18:00 |
| ParahSail1n | er, microscope | 18:00 |
| ParahSail1n | ah | 18:00 |
| SphericalMouse | these vary between models and configurations | 18:01 |
| nmz787 | SphericalMouse: have you seen the blu-ray drive sled stereolithography paper? | 18:03 |
| SphericalMouse | no | 18:03 |
| nmz787 | they made <1micron features in SU-8 using unmodified blu-ray optics @ 2 mm distance | 18:03 |
| ParahSail1n | wow | 18:03 |
| nmz787 | so the question i have is, can the drive spindle be moved about 1.5mm away from the lens in off-the-shelf drives (without removing the sled from the drive) | 18:04 |
| nmz787 | if so, you could simply wire up the spindle motor, sled translation motor, and laser | 18:05 |
| nmz787 | throw some polar coordinate software together | 18:05 |
| SphericalMouse | was the system in the paper 1d? | 18:06 |
| nmz787 | they took the sled and put it on an XY stage | 18:06 |
| nmz787 | and Z! then tested Z depths | 18:06 |
| nmz787 | and found 2mm was best | 18:06 |
| nmz787 | i guess with that thickness SU-8 at least | 18:07 |
| SphericalMouse | might have more to do with the focal plane of the laser than the su8 | 18:07 |
| SphericalMouse | how fast? was it? | 18:08 |
| SphericalMouse | I didn't work with these guys, but I sat near them https://str.llnl.gov/Mar12/spadaccini.html | 18:10 |
| nmz787 | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/High%20resolution%2C%20low%20cost%20laser%20lithography%20using%20a%20Blu-ray%20optical%20head%20assembly.pdf | 18:10 |
| nmz787 | did you know lars ullrich? | 18:10 |
| nmz787 | wait | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | no | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | ulrich schaff | 18:11 |
| SphericalMouse | no | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | who the hell is lars? | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | hah | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | drummer of metallica | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | lol | 18:11 |
| nmz787 | how about Greg Sommer? | 18:14 |
| nmz787 | he's a microfluidics guy | 18:14 |
| SphericalMouse | no, looks like he was at sandia, not livermore | 18:16 |
| nmz787 | ahh | 18:17 |
| SphericalMouse | got to go eat dinner, maybe back later | 18:17 |
| nmz787 | see ya | 18:17 |
| ParahSail1n | illumina's profit margin is 70% | 18:17 |
| SphericalMouse | thats a bit misleading. | 18:18 |
| ParahSail1n | seems it wouldnt be that hard to rip off their systems | 18:18 |
| SphericalMouse | ~lols~ | 18:18 |
| ParahSail1n | i wonder why BGI hasn't | 18:19 |
| SphericalMouse | because chemistry is hard, and so is precision engineering. Why else buy complete genomics | 18:20 |
| ParahSail1n | i dont think it's _that_ hard | 18:21 |
| SphericalMouse | its not hard to do it poorly. bit why doesn't everyone use ion torrent systems? | 18:22 |
| ParahSail1n | ion torrent is more expensive per data | 18:23 |
| SphericalMouse | but cheaper machines and faster runtimes | 18:24 |
| ParahSail1n | normally people dont need data faster when its so expensive | 18:25 |
| SphericalMouse | i'm not sure how the cheapest per data iontorrent runs stack up against the miseq costwise | 18:26 |
| ParahSail1n | seems like there's no reason to use miseq | 18:26 |
| SphericalMouse | better data quality I guess | 18:27 |
| ParahSail1n | its about the same or worse than hiseq | 18:28 |
| SphericalMouse | you dont always need tons of data | 18:28 |
| ParahSail1n | going to 150 cycles doesnt really get you anything useful | 18:28 |
| SphericalMouse | 2x150 | 18:28 |
| ParahSail1n | if you dont need tons of data, you can outsource it to someone who will run a fraction of a lnae | 18:28 |
| SphericalMouse | the hiseq is mostly 2x100 | 18:29 |
| SphericalMouse | yeah, I keep asking why not move to an all factory model. | 18:29 |
| SphericalMouse | not sure what the average turnaround time is in a genome factory | 18:30 |
| SphericalMouse | a few weeks maybe? | 18:30 |
| kanzure | for synthesis? up to a couple months. | 18:30 |
| SphericalMouse | sequencing | 18:30 |
| ParahSail1n | turnaround time is a few days longer than the machine's run time at ucdavis | 18:30 |
| ParahSail1n | and its <3k per lane | 18:30 |
| SphericalMouse | I wa spart of a project that tried to use davis a year ago, and it seemed like it was hard to get approval to get in at the time | 18:32 |
| SphericalMouse | maybe it was 2 years at this point. probably out of date, I guess | 18:33 |
| ParahSail1n | i guess there might be situations where faster data off ion torrent or proton one could be worth it | 18:35 |
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| SphericalMouse | workflow is important | 18:45 |
| SphericalMouse | i've heard complaints about the ~28 hour miseq runtime since you cant do a run a day | 18:45 |
| SphericalMouse | nmz787, what do you want to do with a direct write system? | 18:46 |
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| delinquentme | hey does anyone in here know how information is encoded along the magnetic strip of a master card? | 18:53 |
| delinquentme | specifically how much of the magnetics strip do I need to destroy so that any information is sufficiently difficult to retrieve? | 18:54 |
| ParahSail1n | intention is to destroy? | 19:01 |
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| delinquentme | ParahSail1n, correct | 19:03 |
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| delinquentme | so for example ... if the information is encoded across the entire strip ... if I cut it in half theres not much chance to reconstruct half the information | 19:04 |
| ParahSail1n | scrape it off? | 19:04 |
| delinquentme | not bad@ | 19:13 |
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| delinquentme | Juul, whats going on man!! | 19:36 |
| delinquentme | questionmarks. | 19:36 |
| Juul | :) | 19:37 |
| Juul | i'm chillin' at sudo | 19:37 |
| delinquentme | I'm sitting here sucking on coffee drawing venn diagrams | 19:37 |
| Juul | drawing venn diagrams with coffee mug stains? | 19:37 |
| rigel | see, THIS is what i'm fucking talking about | 19:37 |
| delinquentme | wondering if theres a quicker way than the normal step-wise education process to get thing into my brain | 19:37 |
| delinquentme | HA! | 19:37 |
| rigel | i implemented this class in python using selenium webdriver | 19:37 |
| delinquentme | not bad! | 19:37 |
| rigel | and now i can just swap out for https://github.com/detro/ghostdriver | 19:38 |
| rigel | i knew there was a reason i made myself do it that way | 19:38 |
| rigel | also dongs | 19:39 |
| rigel | lul | 19:39 |
| Juul | what's the reason for the standard -80 C freezers? | 19:40 |
| Juul | who concluded that -80 was the right temperature? | 19:40 |
| rigel | now all i need is to integrate https://github.com/murilobr/amf.js into my toolchain somehow | 19:41 |
| delinquentme | Juul, maybe engineering ? | 19:44 |
| Juul | delinquentme, possibly | 19:46 |
| Juul | i'm looking into building a small low-cost -80 freezer for diybio | 19:47 |
| Juul | i'm not going to blindly design for -80 though | 19:47 |
| rigel | dry ice? | 19:48 |
| rigel | yeah, dry ice | 19:48 |
| delinquentme | oh wow | 19:48 |
| rigel | just like food freezers are targeted at 28-30f | 19:49 |
| delinquentme | how do commercial ones get that low? | 19:49 |
| rigel | in a pinch, you can load it up with dry ice to keep a -80c freezer cool | 19:49 |
| delinquentme | I'd assume the PSU and the heat exchanger are the expensive parts | 19:49 |
| delinquentme | rigel, I dont think Juul is trying to fix a one off | 19:49 |
| delinquentme | I think hes after building something that can be replicated | 19:49 |
| rigel | i was making comments about design | 19:49 |
| Juul | rigel, you're saying they designed them based on the approximate temperature of dry ice | 19:50 |
| Juul | could be | 19:50 |
| rigel | and why -80c was likely chosen | 19:50 |
| delinquentme | ohhh | 19:50 |
| Juul | it's about 78 if i remember | 19:50 |
| rigel | yeah -78c | 19:50 |
| rigel | so, a couple degrees cooler than that | 19:50 |
| rigel | dry ice is easily available | 19:50 |
| Juul | I'll have to see if there is some research on different temperatures | 19:50 |
| Juul | no reason to spend more money on a -80 capable pump if -40 is fine | 19:51 |
| rigel | how will you stabilize -40 if something breaks down | 19:51 |
| rigel | i think that's part of the issue | 19:51 |
| rigel | design for failure | 19:52 |
| rigel | at -40 what are your options, -80, which is a substantial temperature difference, or 0, which is a substantial temperature difference | 19:52 |
| Juul | do you think there will be damage to cells by varying between -40 and -80? | 19:53 |
| Juul | i guess that's likely | 19:53 |
| rigel | for storage you want stable temperature | 19:53 |
| Juul | ok, good point | 19:53 |
| rigel | if you have to store things at -40, get a failure, and then dump a bunch of dry ice on them in the interim | 19:54 |
| rigel | then you either let them thaw back to -40 or you keep them at -80 | 19:54 |
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| Juul | thanks for the logic | 19:57 |
| Juul | i'm gonna bike home and cook some dinner | 19:57 |
| Juul | later | 19:57 |
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| ParahSail1n | i think you can get -80s pretty cheap on auction | 20:12 |
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| delinquentme | best options for getting a static address to forward to a dynamically assigned IP? | 21:01 |
| klafka | hey delinquentme how are you liking it out here | 21:29 |
| klafka | or are you in eugene now | 21:29 |
| klafka | all up in oregon | 21:29 |
| delinquentme | klafka, hahah nah dude im here right now in the mission kicking ass | 21:31 |
| delinquentme | loving the shit out of lIFEEE | 21:31 |
| delinquentme | also got a bike! | 21:31 |
| klafka | ah awesome | 21:31 |
| klafka | yeah you need one there :P | 21:31 |
| klafka | i got done with a psychedelic conference this weekend | 21:32 |
| klafka | hey kanzure do you remember a ferrouswheel ? | 21:32 |
| kanzure | yes i remember ferrouswheel | 21:34 |
| kanzure | joel pitt | 21:34 |
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| kanzure | rigel: what do you need amf for? | 21:36 |
| kanzure | flash serialization? | 21:36 |
| klafka | i met his partner at the maps conference | 21:37 |
| klafka | it was really weird how it happened | 21:37 |
| abetusk | any recommendations for things to check out in Boston while I'm there? | 21:41 |
| kanzure | bosslab | 21:42 |
| kanzure | avery louie | 21:43 |
| kanzure | alec resnick.. he's probably at sprouts. | 21:43 |
| kanzure | this guy http://edboyden.org/ | 21:43 |
| klafka | yeah omg | 21:43 |
| klafka | can you just like go up to his lab and be like 'hay guys sup' | 21:43 |
| kanzure | probably | 21:43 |
| kanzure | there's a lot of fablab people at mit so there's probably at least one or two different events going on | 21:44 |
| kanzure | i think jason bobe (diybio) still lives in boston? who knows. george church's group would be fun to visit. | 21:45 |
| klafka | what are they doing these days | 21:47 |
| kanzure | george church is busy finding the next 200 companies to play co-founder at | 21:48 |
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| abetusk | I feel weird about just dropping in without anything specifically to talk about | 21:49 |
| kanzure | usually the protocol is to send an email in advance | 21:49 |
| abetusk | yeah, I should have planned better | 21:49 |
| kanzure | ask about any presentations, or if someone could give you a tour if they're into that, etc. | 21:49 |
| kanzure | turns out people love blabbing about their projects. | 21:49 |
| kanzure | also if you have particular lab expertise that you think they would benefit from, you should offer to do a presentation or whatever. | 21:50 |
| kanzure | although usually it is very obvious if they want that. | 21:50 |
| kanzure | this one time, paul rothemund was in town | 21:51 |
| kanzure | and i swear at least two grad students were assigned to tracking him down and getting him to show up to do presentations | 21:51 |
| klafka | oh kanzure that's a great idea | 21:54 |
| abetusk | ok, thanks kanzure. I'll try and send some emails out when I'm there and see if they can squeeze me in before I leave | 21:54 |
| juri_ | kanzure: if you're looking for some reverse engineering.. we should talk more. as a 'found engineer', i build most of the things I own out of whatever others throw away. that involves a lot of reverse engineering. i've also helped random strangers build thousands of PCs over the last few years (again, out of what others throw away). do you have something small you'd like dox'd, and re-engineered? | 22:40 |
| kanzure | juri_: how about the rest of http://github.com/openyou/emokit 's protocol | 23:03 |
| juri_ | um, why would i bother? | 23:04 |
| juri_ | (one second, getting a URL) | 23:04 |
| kanzure | huh? you just asked for interesting things to reverse engineer? | 23:04 |
| kanzure | my answer seems reasonable. | 23:04 |
| juri_ | http://mirage335.dyndns.org/wiki/BiosignalAmplifier | 23:05 |
| juri_ | I;ve been working with the developer of that. ---^ | 23:05 |
| kanzure | what about it? | 23:05 |
| kanzure | ok. | 23:05 |
| juri_ | so, why would i work on reverse engineering the proprietary one, when there's an open attempt to do the same task? | 23:05 |
| kanzure | the reason that emokit is interesting is because there's a consumer headset that people are buying. | 23:06 |
| juri_ | want one of mirage's kits? that can be aranged. | 23:06 |
| kanzure | because why would i use that kit when i can just use openeeg? fuck. | 23:06 |
| kanzure | there might be a reasonable answer to that question | 23:08 |
| juri_ | However, as of 2012-03-14, the already well published Common-Mode Shield Driver and AC Coupling Feedback seem not to have been implemented. | 23:08 |
| juri_ | so, mirage's kit is less noisy. i've been meaning to work on his cabling (esata instead of sata), but haven't found the time. | 23:09 |
| kanzure | i'm not sure if modulareeg is part of openeeg, if that's what you mean | 23:09 |
| kanzure | oh wait modulareeg is | 23:09 |
| juri_ | yes, it is. | 23:09 |
| kanzure | yes yes i corrected myself yeesh | 23:09 |
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| juri_ | no fair. i've been working so hard to get one over on you.. ;P | 23:10 |
| kanzure | shouldn't be that hard. | 23:10 |
| juri_ | 'kanzure, you are the WRONG one! WRONG-o-WRONG-o-WRONG!' i've even got a dance made up. | 23:10 |
| kanzure | alright | 23:11 |
| juri_ | still, in this case, i think my effort is better spent improving the open alternatives. | 23:11 |
| kanzure | the open alternatives to modulareeg? | 23:11 |
| juri_ | no, either modulareeg or mirage's toy. | 23:11 |
| juri_ | either way, the one you want reverse engineered.. is there a reason to use it over a modularEEG/biosignalamp? | 23:12 |
| kanzure | no, it's terrible and i hate it | 23:12 |
| kanzure | but that was partly why i started reversing the protocol | 23:12 |
| kanzure | in general, this hatred extends to all eeg. i'm not sure if an eeg project being open source is enough to get me excited these days. :( they just end up fairly disappointing.. | 23:12 |
| * juri_ nods. | 23:13 | |
| kanzure | "64 channels, but we can only train 3 actions. have fun, dinkwad." | 23:13 |
| juri_ | agreed. my input to mirage's work has been just some advice, and some 3d printer work/parts. | 23:13 |
| juri_ | so, again, i can't directly bio-hack.. but if you need something fixed, printed, or a printer fixed, i'm here. ;) | 23:14 |
| juri_ | also, i'd need one of the items in question in my hands, to do a deep reverse engineer.. unless its protocol level stuff, like you pointed to. i just think that we should let the users of the closed gear suffer with the gear. | 23:15 |
| kanzure | i may or may not have some anonymously contributed header files that i've been working from | 23:16 |
| juri_ | fun. :) | 23:16 |
| kanzure | i don't have the device anymore either. | 23:17 |
| juri_ | oh wow, i pointed you at the wrong link. | 23:17 |
| juri_ | http://mirage335.dyndns.org/wiki/Mirage335BiosignalAmp | 23:18 |
| juri_ | so, you don't have one.. so whom would we be helping by reversing the protocol then? a company's customerbase, which does not include either of us? | 23:34 |
| rigel | kanzure: ustream uses it to obfuscate their direct video URLs | 23:45 |
| --- Log closed Wed Apr 24 00:00:06 2013 | ||
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