| --- Log opened Thu Jun 06 00:00:48 2013 | ||
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| kanzure | "Objections to genetic modification typically emerge over the topic of GM crop plants or livestock. But the Glowing Plant Project has raised concerns from anti-GM activists and industry watchdogs alike. The ETC Group, an environmental organization that opposes all GM organisms, has even tried to launch its own campaign to stop the Kickstarter project." | 00:20 |
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| kanzure | http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/35670/title/Speaking-of-Science/ | 00:20 |
| kanzure | "“We are extremely concerned that the USDA is not planning to regulate the first-ever field release of an organism engineered through synthetic biology technologies. . . . We urge the USDA to put a halt to this risky, unregulated pursuit,” the groups wrote in a letter to the US Department of Agriculture in April." | 00:21 |
| kanzure | "The apparent lack of regulatory oversight concerns Todd Kuiken, who studies the ethical implications of DIY biology at the Washington, D.C., think tank, the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars. He told Nature that while the Glowing Plant Project does not seem especially risky, the regulatory precedents could prove more problematic with riskier projects in the future." | 00:21 |
| kanzure | god damn it todd | 00:21 |
| strangewarp | sort of wondering what Todd's endgame is, here | 00:46 |
| kanzure | more government funding for himself | 00:47 |
| strangewarp | ah | 00:51 |
| fenn | the whole "regulatory precedent" thing is bogus, since you can already buy genetically modified pet fish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GloFish | 01:14 |
| kanzure | i've met todd often at these diybio events. i don't know why jason is so complacent about todd. | 01:15 |
| kanzure | "don't worry about todd, he's a friendly".. yeah right. then why has he never shown any evidence of this. | 01:15 |
| fenn | huh. "The definitive environmental risk assessment was made by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA), which has jurisdiction over all genetically modified animals, including fluorescent zebra fish, since they consider the inserted gene to be a drug." | 01:16 |
| fenn | god i hate this world | 01:16 |
| kanzure | pretty awful | 01:16 |
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| nmz787_ | openAccess college chem courses http://learn.uci.edu/openedweek/opchem.html | 02:48 |
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| DonnchaC_ | paperbot: http://rsi.aip.org/resource/1/rsinak/v4/i7/p391_s1 | 03:03 |
| paperbot | error: HTTP 500 http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/A%20Vertical%2C%20Vacuum%2C%20SplitTube%2C%20GraphiteResistance%20Furnace.pdf | 03:03 |
| DonnchaC_ | Hmm, downloaded fine. Looks the link didn't enocde properly | 03:05 |
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| DonnchaC | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/A Vertical, Vacuum, Split‐Tube, Graphite‐Resistance Furnace.pdf The hyphen was not in the URL provided by paperbot | 03:06 |
| archels` | .u ‐ | 03:09 |
| yoleaux | U+2010 HYPHEN [Pd] (‐) | 03:09 |
| archels` | doing the right thing would be adding this on the issue tracker [and submitting a patch] | 03:09 |
| DonnchaC | Thanks for the reminder I'll do that in a few minutes :) | 03:11 |
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| JayDugger | kanzure, fenn--what do you two suggest for keeping up-to-date with the Glowing Plant controversy? | 07:49 |
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| kanzure | probably just my complaints and hate mail | 07:49 |
| brownies | what's the ETA to glowing cats now? 1 year? | 07:50 |
| kanzure | my complaints anticipated that news article by a whole week or something | 07:50 |
| JayDugger | :) I don't think that's going to reassure my wife, who donated. | 07:50 |
| kanzure | so i'm hipster or something | 07:50 |
| kanzure | JayDugger: oh, well, i just don't really like the people from the project | 07:50 |
| kanzure | JayDugger: http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/oscillator/2013/06/03/glowing-futures/ | 07:51 |
| JayDugger | Your complaints, your hate mail, and a little salt then should keep us up to speed. :) | 07:51 |
| kanzure | street salt? | 07:52 |
| kanzure | they are calling it lil' salt now? | 07:52 |
| JayDugger | I don't get the reference. I meant taking your rants and hate mail with a little salt. | 07:52 |
| kanzure | i think that article is a good outline of my rants | 07:52 |
| kanzure | i am not completely sure but i think that author was either reading ##hplusroadmap logs and making an article out of it, or just really really thoughtful | 07:53 |
| brownies | link to article? | 07:53 |
| kanzure | sigh. it was two seconds ago! http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/oscillator/2013/06/03/glowing-futures/ | 07:53 |
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| JayDugger | My gosh...intelligent and civil comments? Did I eat LSD for breakfast by mistake? | 07:58 |
| kanzure | just cheerios | 07:58 |
| brownies | "Could genetically modified plants be open source" | 08:01 |
| kanzure | the problem was that they didn't actually want commercial use. which makes them anti-open-source. | 08:02 |
| kanzure | but then antony repented on that point | 08:02 |
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| kanzure | i just don't know why he keeps insisting on using the "genome compiler inc." software | 08:02 |
| brownies | what's so good/bad about it? | 08:04 |
| kanzure | well, for one it's not a fucking compiler | 08:04 |
| kanzure | and they are liars | 08:04 |
| kanzure | two, it's proprietary | 08:04 |
| kanzure | and three, it's adobe air | 08:04 |
| JayDugger | Really? Adobe air? | 08:04 |
| JayDugger | I didn't know that... | 08:04 |
| kanzure | yeh these guys are fairly manipulative | 08:05 |
| brownies | that article is pretty insightful. | 08:09 |
| brownies | she doesn't get to the real crux of it until near the end, but... damn. makes me glad i didn't fund them on kickstarter. | 08:09 |
| kanzure | you mean all your talk about glowpants is just a bunch of talk? | 08:09 |
| brownies | me? i only want glowing cats. | 08:11 |
| brownies | oh, glowing *pants*? i guess that could be a nice product, but do you really need to bioengineer pants ? | 08:11 |
| kanzure | it requires the best science available, so yes | 08:12 |
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| kanzure | http://news.dice.com/2013/06/06/openworm-wriggles-onto-your-screen/ | 08:42 |
| kanzure | "In recent films, like Transformers, CGI Graphics are astonishingly realistic looking. It probably wouldn’t be too hard to bring that kind of quality to the OpenWorm project, though it wouldn’t help with its goal. OpenWorm is trying to understand the reality of nematodes and displaying them realistically probably wouldn’t contribute much. Besides which, what does a 1-mm long worm really look like?" | 08:42 |
| kanzure | well we can use these devices called microscopes | 08:42 |
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| kanzure | "My name is Alexander Murer, I'm one of the founders of the biohackerspace in Graz, Austria, Europe" | 09:25 |
| kanzure | hmm why do i not have this hackerspace in my superstalklog | 09:25 |
| kanzure | "I found your presentation about dna synthesizer online and was wondering if you could give us further technical informations about them. | 09:25 |
| kanzure | We have quite good technicans with us, developping a thermocycler, bioreactor and 3d bioprinter right now and were thinking about developping an open source dna synthesizer, but we arent exactly sure if there are some subtletes. The big part seems to be to mix several liquids together, but do you maybe know what the "reaction chamber" or whatever it is should look like? Are the starter molecules for the dna strand linked to a surface or is it ... | 09:26 |
| kanzure | ... all liquid?" | 09:26 |
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| ParahSailin | paperbot: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/anie.201300680/pdf | 12:41 |
| paperbot | no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/418dc93847ee3f9486445cbbdb259a95.txt | 12:41 |
| ParahSailin | wow nice cache here http://libgen.org/ | 12:46 |
| ParahSailin | paperbot: http://libgen.org/scimag5/10.1002/anie.201300680.pdf | 12:46 |
| kanzure | ah good libgen.org is back. for a while i was only using libgen.net. | 12:46 |
| kanzure | "Search in DOI (e.g. 10.1063/1.529338) OR Author+Article, if file not found - redirect to sci-hub.org" | 12:46 |
| kanzure | 1. Public OCR in Library Genesis, discussion: flibusta, genofond | 12:47 |
| kanzure | http://flibusta.net/node/193940 | 12:47 |
| kanzure | http://genofond.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=6836&start=250 | 12:47 |
| ParahSailin | http://libgen.org/scimag/?s=10.1002%2Fanie.201300680 | 12:47 |
| kanzure | http://libgen.org/scimag/ | 12:47 |
| ParahSailin | i think sci-hub might automatically download stuff to libgen.org and update metadata there | 12:48 |
| kanzure | i doubt it. all sci-hub requests go to libgen? | 12:48 |
| kanzure | would be easy to test | 12:48 |
| ParahSailin | i found this url after putting that paper in sci-hub | 12:48 |
| kanzure | was it on libgen before? | 12:48 |
| ParahSailin | should test that | 12:49 |
| paperbot | no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/1efd1920760b882bd4ca5e3b544f3ed3.pdf | 12:51 |
| kanzure | good job paprebot | 12:53 |
| kanzure | *paperbot | 12:53 |
| kanzure | it eventually got it :) | 12:53 |
| ParahSailin | libgen pretty slow | 12:55 |
| kanzure | we should really mirror it | 12:55 |
| ParahSailin | you're right, scihub does not upload to libgen, but it does do a pdf cache http://sci-hub.org/pdfcache/25b43e6544380207639c4485a8474fcf.pdf | 13:03 |
| archels` | .title http://youtu.be/fzB1EcocAF8?t=3m30s | 13:11 |
| yoleaux | Regina Dugan at D11 2013 - YouTube | 13:11 |
| archels` | authentication via tattoos and pills | 13:11 |
| ParahSailin | that li-s-p battery actually looks doable | 13:12 |
| ParahSailin | crap, but they dont say anything about the resistivity of the electrolyte | 13:16 |
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| nmz787_ | kanzure: you're not hipster, you're clairvoyant | 13:23 |
| nmz787_ | bath salt | 13:23 |
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| nmz787_ | hrmm, the word oscillator at the top of that article made me think it might mention blinking glowing plants, but it mentioned nothing like that | 13:30 |
| nmz787_ | I guess that's the blogger's handle? | 13:30 |
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| kanzure | .title http://lists.randombit.net/pipermail/cryptography/2013-June/004364.html | 14:06 |
| yoleaux | [cryptography] Looking for earlier proof: no secure channel without previous secure channel | 14:06 |
| kanzure | "I am currently doing a write-up that dives into some of the more formal aspects of authentication. In particular, I am wondering when exactly it was formally proved that two entities A and B cannot establish a secure channel between them without such a secure channel having been available to them at a previous point in time." | 14:06 |
| kanzure | i replied here http://lists.randombit.net/pipermail/cryptography/2013-June/004372.html where i wrote that i figured that the security of the new channel is probably bounded by the security (erm, privacy?) of the original channel | 14:07 |
| kanzure | hrm i wonder about establishing a new channel by combining bits transmitted through multiple other less-secure channels. i guess that's relying on those less-probably-private channels to be less-private for different reasons. | 14:09 |
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| kanzure | ha ha ha | 14:16 |
| kanzure | "With libfaketime you can tell a process that the current time is something different from the machine's system clock. This fake time setting affects not only the functions directly related to reading the system time, but also file timestamps such as modification times. With libfaketime you can test how a program will respond when it is running in the future or in a different timezone without having to change your machine's system clock. ... | 14:16 |
| kanzure | ... Timezone testing can be useful for network applications where a certificate may have already expired in a given timezone but might still work in your local environment." | 14:16 |
| kanzure | "libfaketime works as a preload library. When you want to use it, you set the LD_PRELOAD environment variable to include the shared library when you execute a program. For example, when running the date program with LD_PRELOAD set, the machine's dynamic linker will load the libfaketime library into the new process, and by loading libfaketime, certain functions will be mapped into the libfaketime library instead of using your system functions ... | 14:16 |
| kanzure | ... directly. libfaketime cannot be used with statically linked or setuid programs, because LD_PRELOAD is not available to such programs." | 14:16 |
| kanzure | sounds good to me: "With libfaketime you can test how a program will respond when it is running in the future" | 14:16 |
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| kanzure | .title http://portlabpdx.org/wiki/index.php?title=Projects | 14:22 |
| yoleaux | Projects - Portlab Wiki | 14:22 |
| nmz787_ | paperbot: http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/login.jsp?tp=&arnumber=223872&url=http%3A%2F%2Fieeexplore.ieee.org%2Fiel1%2F49%2F5848%2F00223872 | 14:28 |
| paperbot | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/adfd64026d9cf7deb80c5d28895aeb96.txt | 14:28 |
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| nmz787_ | http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/pdf/Security%20Architectures%20Using%20Formal%20Methods.pdf | 14:30 |
| nmz787_ | hrmm, so my pdf uploader bookmarklet wouldn't work for that | 14:31 |
| nmz787_ | it loaded the pdf in an iframe or something | 14:31 |
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| ParahSailin | kanzure: actually i think sci-hub does upload to libgen | 15:00 |
| kanzure | evidence? | 15:00 |
| kanzure | would be p. cool | 15:00 |
| ParahSailin | because the one paper i tested, within thelast 3 hours it ended up being on libgen | 15:01 |
| kanzure | hm. | 15:01 |
| ParahSailin | its not instantaneous | 15:02 |
| ParahSailin | took <13 min for this http://libgen.org/scimag/?s=10.1002%2Fanie.201303067 to get into libgen after i grabbed it in sci-hub | 15:18 |
| kanzure | and it wasn't on libgen first? | 15:18 |
| ParahSailin | right | 15:18 |
| kanzure | damn we might have someone here who actually values his science | 15:19 |
| ParahSailin | russians are smart | 15:19 |
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| kanzure | "The ETG Group has launched a ‘KickStopper’ campaign to directly challenge the ‘Glowing Plants’ Kickstarter project which is attempting to make and distribute glowing genetically modified plants using synthetic biology | 16:11 |
| kanzure | oh brother. kickstopper. -_- | 16:11 |
| kanzure | "The popular crowdfunding site Kickstarter.com is prepared to hand hundreds of thousands of dollars to a controversial project for the widespread and unregulated distribution of over half a million extreme-bioengineered seeds | 16:11 |
| kanzure | Read more: http://www.motherearthnews.com/nature-and-environment/synthetic-biology-kickstarter-campaign-zwfz1306zkin.aspx#ixzz2VTrMzfGB" | 16:12 |
| kanzure | fucking javascript fuck you | 16:12 |
| kanzure | "extreme-bioengineered".. man, i wonder what would happen if they saw an actual pathway. | 16:12 |
| kanzure | http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/kickstopper-stopping-syn-bio-pollution | 16:12 |
| kanzure | "Those guidelines currently forbid Kickstarter from funding " hah | 16:13 |
| kanzure | fearmongering at its best "The petition through Avaaz.org has gathered more than 7,000 signatures in 7 days and signatures continue to pour in. | 16:13 |
| kanzure | man these guys have always been annoying | 16:15 |
| kanzure | how would we get rid of them? | 16:15 |
| kanzure | "We wrote to Kickstarter at length to ask them to de-list the Glowing Plants project . They sent us a dismissive one line reply. We even submitted this crowdfunding campaign to them - they declined it." | 16:17 |
| kanzure | well duh. | 16:17 |
| kanzure | "ETC Groupis a tiny (eight person) non-profit international civil society research group." is that all. we should be able to defeat those guys. | 16:17 |
| kanzure | although fearmongering has let jaron lanier cost since forever. hrm. | 16:17 |
| fenn | fearmongering is big business | 16:18 |
| kanzure | how about we just ddos them | 16:19 |
| kanzure | the idea that people are this freaked out about mailing some plants is really annoying. | 16:21 |
| kanzure | *some seeds | 16:21 |
| kanzure | "Plants biohackers are associated with a commercial company, Genome Compiler Corporation, and some of their backers have deep pockets to fund a PR war. Indeed they have hired a professional PR company to run their Kickstarter campaign." | 16:21 |
| kanzure | duh, everyone hires pr people to run kickstarter campaigns | 16:22 |
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| kanzure | "The WebKit build was disabled for the following reasons: ICU is required. To build QtWebKit with Qt 5 you need to build Qt 5 with libICU support. Check for ICU support being mentioned in qtbase/config.summary." | 16:28 |
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| nmz787_ | can you use android phones as dialup modems? | 17:58 |
| nmz787_ | easily? | 17:58 |
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| kanzure | there's probably at least a handful of dialup sound apps that unintentionally work | 18:14 |
| kanzure | but i'm not aware of any that intentionally work | 18:14 |
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| kanzure | ParahSailin: have you seen any watermarks on sci-hub-retrieved papers on libgen? | 18:19 |
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| bkero | Hey, which Portland persosn is behind Portlab? | 22:41 |
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| kanzure | bkero: nmz787_ | 22:47 |
| bkero | nmz787_: cheeeez | 22:47 |
| kanzure | bkero: how much better is gecko's build process compared to webkit | 22:47 |
| nmz787_ | huh | 22:48 |
| bkero | kanzure: Ours takes less memory to link. On the festest systemavailable it takes ~17 minutes. | 22:49 |
| nmz787_ | bkero: oh, well, sort of... Erik Hasenkopf has been doing most of the organizing, came up with the name, found/came up with logos, he and someone else got the website together | 22:49 |
| nmz787_ | bioguy (justin dormandy) is the other guy there | 22:49 |
| kanzure | bkero: damn. it's taking me about 25 minutes to fail to build webkit. | 22:49 |
| bkero | kanzure: hg clone http://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central && cd mozilla-central && touch .mozconfig && make -j4 | 22:51 |
| bkero | Bam, have yerself a firefox | 22:51 |
| kanzure | that doesn't sound exciting at all | 22:51 |
| bkero | Do you want 'exciting' in your build system? | 22:51 |
| kanzure | bkero: i'm porting phantomjs to qt 5 at the moment | 22:51 |
| kanzure | bkero: but i'm considering defecting to http://slimerjs.org/ | 22:52 |
| bkero | I see | 22:52 |
| kanzure | except, i don't have great experiences with gecko either | 22:52 |
| kanzure | see e.g. zotero translation-server | 22:53 |
| kanzure | build system is all over the place | 22:53 |
| * bkero hasn't used zotero before | 22:53 | |
| kanzure | i wonder if that's gecko's fault | 22:53 |
| kanzure | probably not | 22:54 |
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| --- Log closed Fri Jun 07 00:00:49 2013 | ||
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