2013-06-28.log

--- Log opened Fri Jun 28 00:00:09 2013
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* pasky used to take notes in his own tex flavor in the college03:48
paskyit's doable in real-time with light postprocessing phase03:48
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paskyi started in a meta-language i envisioned converting to tex and/or mathml, then i discovered (it was 2004) that mathml is unusable for anything and moved plain tex with huge number of shortcut macros :)03:49
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paskyhttp://math.or.cz/fastex/lib.tex ah these were the times \o/ *nostalgy*03:51
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kanzurepasky: is mathml still unusable?06:53
paskyAIUI there are now javascript libraries that make it usable, but I haven't looked into it much06:55
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jonathan__jeez, my poor apple stock07:46
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octopineAnyone want an old thermocycler? Pretty sure it takes diesel07:59
kanzureis this really a diesel-powered thermocycler?08:01
octopinekanzure no, I wish. It's the kind you have to use mineral oil with (no lid heating element)08:02
octopinewell if anyone's interested I can take a picture and make sure it works08:03
octopineand weigh it08:03
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abetuskoctopine, where are you and how much do you think shipping is?08:09
abetuskoctopine, let me rephrase, I'd like to give it to my local hackerspace, as the cost isn't too high08:12
ParahSailinheh, they're interviewing a new php monkey08:14
octopineabetusk in Florida. Not sure how much it will cost to ship as I haven't weighed it. It's pretty heavy though08:15
abetuskoctopine, you want to get back to me with an estimate?08:16
octopineabetusk where are you?08:16
abetuskoh, right, that's important.  Ithaca, NY08:17
abetusk1485008:17
ParahSailincornell?08:19
abetuskCornell is in Ithaca.  I'm not affiliated with them08:20
jonathan__apple stock despair http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2013/06/26/apple-stock-despair/08:23
jonathan__"since August 2004: AAPL has returned 2,500%, GOOG 763%, MSFT 63% and SPY 73%."08:59
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jonathan__"Chipotle's genetically modified burritos - Chipotle becomes one of the first restaurant chains to admit they have genetically modified organisms in half of their dishes."    ... soybean oil09:21
browniesisn't every organism on the planet genetically modified?09:27
browniesyou know, because it evolves, and stuff?09:27
ParahSailinstop being pedantic, you know what they mean and so does everyone else09:29
ParahSailinits hard enough for one person to understand another without one being intentionally oblique09:30
crwgenetically modified (by humans) organisms makes for a non-snazzy acronym. "GM(BH)O? that won't fit on my protest sign"09:31
ParahSailinGMO in the context of foods by convention and connotation means transgenic09:32
crwgenetically modified, by humans, on purpose. definitely not snazzy.09:35
jonathan__just call them zombie organisms10:07
jonathan__ZO-soybean10:07
jonathan__the public needs more hysteria. its the only way "pink slime" got finally taken down.10:08
jonathan__before that anti-marketing frenzy, everyone was happy to eat the disgusting stuff10:08
jonathan__chipotle's food is very unhealthy.  however i applaud their new labeling campaign.10:09
crwi don't understand why pink slime isn't an animated character yet10:10
ParahSailinchipotle isnt one i'd single out as being particularly unhealthy10:11
crwgive it a youtube show, packaged pink slime toys in happy meals10:11
kanzureyes, people modify foods on purpose on their own even without transgenic stuff10:11
kanzurei.e. intentional plant breeding10:11
kanzurethe end is near! fuck off.10:11
crw:P10:11
crwwhat was it douglas adams said about civilization?10:12
kanzurewho cares. he's dead and wrong.10:12
jonathan__look at the nutritional comparison.  chipotle is no more healthy than any other fast food.  it only "looks" healthy.  you have been deceived.10:12
kanzurenobody said it was healthy10:12
kanzurewtf10:12
crwi care, because he's funny :)10:12
jonathan__" isnt one i'd single out as being particularly unhealthy" - double negative leading to doublespeak10:13
ParahSailini havent seen their ingredient lists, but it seems like its mostly actual food there10:13
jonathan__"isnt .... unhealthy"10:13
crwoh but it's a memory failure on my part. i had confused his quote re: civilization with his quote about the beginning of the universe10:13
kanzure"isn't unhealthy" doesn't mean "it's healthy". health is not quite like htat.10:13
kanzure*that10:13
kanzurecrw: isn't it cliche to be quoting douglas adams by now?10:14
jonathan__unhealthy <-> healthy is relative scale meansure10:14
jonathan__lots of oil10:14
kanzurelet's measure health impedance of chiptole with a giant oscilloscope10:14
jonathan__of course no one can agree on definition of health so it's all meaningless10:14
crwkanzure: i'm old, give me some leeway :P10:14
ParahSailinother than wheat, the food there seems about like the sort of stuff i'd cook at home for myself10:14
jonathan__you can't see the salt and oil that they add.  its invisible10:15
jonathan__oh but your body knows  muahahaha10:15
jonathan__sugar too10:15
jonathan__dont forget extra cheese   hmmm does a heart attack good10:16
ParahSailini thought we buried the lipid hypothesis like a decade ago10:16
jonathan__anyways  it sure will be nicer when food is labelled and tested as gmo vs. evolved10:16
ParahSailinalong with ancel keys10:17
jonathan__just keep doing whatever it is you're doing.  we'll analyze your autopsy when you eventually pass.10:18
ParahSailinill stick to science that hasnt been discredited10:19
kanzurecrw: are you done catching up on extropy-chat emails?10:20
jonathan__oh you mean the science funded by the meat & dairy industry dont you.  lol10:20
jonathan__my own medical stats are proof enough for me.10:20
crwkanzure: aye10:21
ParahSailindid i just get into a bloodwork e-peen contest?10:21
kanzurecrw: great, now catch up on science things, http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/longevity/ http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/bio/ http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/ http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/10:21
kanzureParahSailin: blood comparison as an olympic sport?10:22
kanzureParahSailin: seems like only multiple samples over the span of a week would be worth looking at10:22
jonathan__i only use blood for human sacrifice anyway10:22
kanzuremaybe longer10:22
ParahSailinkanzure: gotta be realtime gcms on chip implanted10:22
crwkanzure: hah, well, i'm a programmer/engineer, not a scientist. but i'll try to put a dent in that stuff as well.10:22
kanzurecrw: that's a lousy attitude :(10:22
kanzurecrw: i am also a programmer, but that doesn't mean i shouldn't science10:23
crwkanzure: my current to-read queue is over 400 books long, i do the best i can :)10:23
kanzureParahSailin: i'm not convinced that real-time would be interesting to look at for that sort of competition10:23
kanzureParahSailin: what about a game of immune system tests, where we put two blood samples together and observe which immune cells hate each other the most?10:24
ParahSailini'd win that one, im probably a host for all kinds of diseases that i've picked up over the last 10 years of not being sick10:24
gradstudentbotIs there free food at that seminar?10:25
ParahSailinwhat triggers that thing ^10:25
kanzurescience10:26
kanzuregradstudentbot: sup10:26
gradstudentbotI got in around 11.10:26
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ParahSailinpaperbot: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v498/n7455/full/nature12267.html10:49
paperbothttp://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Elastic%20energy%20storage%20in%20the%20shoulder%20and%20the%20evolution%20of%20high-speed%20throwing%20in%20Homo.pdf10:49
ParahSailinholy shit, nytimes.com linked an Original Source on a journal article10:49
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ParahSailintldr: girls throw like girls10:52
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jrayhawkthere's a theory that throwing produced high-functioning human egalitarianism by way of democratizing coercive threat13:02
kanzureis there a missing verb in there?13:02
jrayhawkdon't think so13:03
jrayhawkthe idea being that the biggest, strongest asshole can only coerce so many before he's outmatched by projectiles13:05
jrayhawkwhich is part of why 'alpha male' in other primates is not a good model for 'alpha male' in humans13:05
crwwould that not just cause the big, strong assholes to band together to coerce more effectively? or maybe that's where armies came from?13:06
jrayhawkassholes aren't good at banding13:07
crwhmm13:07
EnLilaSkoWouldn't assholes just need 1 leader?13:08
gradstudentbotShould I still be wearing gloves?13:08
crwit's an interesting theory13:10
jrayhawkpart of this concept is that increases in weapons technology sophistication are increases in potential scale for an organized society by way of coercive threat13:11
jrayhawkbut obviously there are issues with this; not all advancements were democratic13:11
crwyeah that doesn't work13:12
crwjrayhawk: i wonder if there are any clues to that theory in the history of stoning as a punishment13:12
Sankyhappy tau day http://tauday.com/13:39
nmz787_jonathan__: was pink slime ever proven to be bad? I thought it was just tough bits and fat gassed with ammonia13:40
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jrayhawkhttp://newpaltz.mediasite.suny.edu/Mediasite/Play/ccadc3bce2e74f97829bb0d796b453c21d is an okay presentation on that throwing thing if you have silverlight13:42
jrayhawkotherwise13:42
jrayhawkmanifest=( $( curl -s http://newpaltz.mediasite.suny.edu/Mediasite/FileServer/Presentation/ccadc3bce2e74f97829bb0d796b453c21d/manifest.js | perl -ne 'print $_ if s/.+"(.+MP4Video.+?)".+/$1/ or s/.+SlideBaseUrl="(.+)".+/$1/; s/\// slash /g; s/ /_/g; print $_ if s/.+Title="(.+)".+/$1/ or s/.+Slides\[(.+)\].+/$1/' ) ); curl -C - -o "${manifest[2]}.mp4" "${manifest[0]}"; for slide in ${manifest[@]:3}; do curl -C - -o ...13:42
jrayhawk... "${manifest[2]}_Slide_$(printf '%04d' "$slide")".jpg "${baseurl}${manifest[1]}slide_$(printf '%04d' "$slide")_full.jpg"; done;13:42
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delinquentmekanzure, this weekend?13:44
ParahSailinjrayhawk: interesting sociology13:46
delinquentmeParahSailin, no!13:47
delinquentmeParahSailin, whatchoo working on13:47
delinquentmehow do save lives?13:47
delinquentmehow do immertl13:47
delinquentmeanyone else see this: http://semanto.me/2013/06/18/i-will-fear-no-evil-the-first-head-transplant-on-human/?blogsub=confirming#subscribe-blog13:50
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kanzuredelinquentme: maybe this weekend14:20
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kanzurejrayhawk: my first question is, after seeing that bash barf, are you feeling okay?14:20
delinquentmeredbull waterbaloons?14:20
kanzureno thanks14:21
delinquentme=[.14:21
delinquentmetransformers?14:21
jrayhawkit's only half bash-barf14:21
delinquentmeevangelion lambo??!14:21
jrayhawkoh, i screwed it up, too14:23
jrayhawk$baseurl is supposed to be http://newpaltz.mediasite.suny.edu14:23
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kanzurei just fixed a bug in a bash script that has been around for 14 months14:41
kanzure$"{}" p.sure this wont help much.14:41
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crwjrayhawk: before i go to the trouble of watching that presentation, does it go into language development alongside acquiring the ability to throw?17:48
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kanzure"    A month earlier, Samsung Bioepis—a Samsung-Biogen Idec biologics  joint venture—said it would collaborate with Merck & Co. to create  "multiple pre-specified" undisclosed biosimilars. The collaboration follows separate biosimilars failures by Samsung and Merck in recent years."21:09
kanzureha, biosimiliars21:09
kanzurebiosimilars, i mean21:09
kanzure"Sony, which is scrambling to reverse years of red ink, houses a Biotechnology unit looking beyond its traditional strengths in  advanced flow cytometry analysis and sorting technology." hmm.21:10
crwwith sony's track-record for tech, that's a scary prospect21:11
kanzurewell, just an opportunity21:11
crwas long as they've learned from their past mistakes, i guess21:12
kanzureeventually the biotech companies will be eaten alive by startups21:12
kanzureand the tech companies like sony/samsung are more used to the rapid changes in the technology markets21:12
kanzureso they would be possible entry-points for any tech-savy biotech startup21:12
kanzureor something like that21:12
kanzureidea not formed yet21:12
crwcan only hope it happens that way and that excessively-hostile regulations from a legislature that 1) doesn't know any better; and 2) over-lobbied from those currently-entrenched companies - don't ruin it21:13
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yashgarothmitsubishi's been big in biotech for a while21:29
kanzurecrw: the legislature is of no interest to me. they can't legislate bacteria into extinction.21:32
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crwno but they can instruct their enforcer class to more or less destroy you if you attempt to do something they don't like.21:34
kanzureanonymity21:34
crwoh i thought we were talking about businesses. though i guess anonymous business ventures shouldn't be out of the question if we're talking about hypothetical futures.21:35
kanzureyeah, ParahSailin's anonymous antibody black market seems to be paying off pretty well21:35
delinquentmeyashgaroth, reeeally21:40
yashgarothyes, mitsubishi tanabe research labs21:40
yashgarothmostly they just buy up small companies, like big pharma does but without all that pesky research-doing21:41
yashgarothnot big like pfizer/lilly/merck/gsk big, but big for a non-biotech21:44
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jonathan__i read about those labs..  in william gibson..  that's where they make the cyborgs and mutants right22:47
jonathan__m. tanabe research labs and some in the archipelago22:48
jonathan__staffed by postdocs who never left, five generations ago, and had offspring within the complex, also to become postdocs, so they are completely estranged from society and have their own morals and values including massive self modification22:49
yashgarothgibsonland, where hybridomas are capable of anything22:49
jonathan__the sixth generation is mutating due to inbreeding so they are focusing on a way to create genetic diversity but many of the fifth generation are already mad22:50
jonathan__paranoid delusional22:50
jonathan__not unlike academia today22:50
yashgarotharcologies overgrown with experiments gone wrong22:50
jonathan__better them than me22:51
yashgarothwould be nice if more postdocs were into self modification tho22:51
gradstudentbotWhere did you put the revisions to the paper?22:52
jonathan__rumor has it that some biologists smoke cigarettes, that's some easy genetic self modification in the damage dept. at least22:52
jonathan__the kombucha is dead22:53
yashgarothhey man when my ultralungs finish evolving we'll see who laughs22:53
yashgarothwhaaat? both of them?22:53
jonathan__total zoo tonight22:53
jonathan__everyone walking in circles, one room to another, stuff moved around because of new benches22:54
yashgarothoh yeah how are/how many are the benches?22:54
jonathan__tons22:54
yashgarothsweeeee22:54
jonathan__like a dozen22:54
jonathan__someone brought in a different microwave "from the garage"22:55
jonathan__I asked if it was clean22:55
jonathan__"I dont know"22:55
jonathan__how do I know if I can use it?22:55
yashgaroth"he laughed"22:55
jonathan__"it's for food"22:55
jonathan__what if it's not clean?22:55
jonathan__"I cleaned it today"22:55
jonathan__with what?22:55
jonathan__"the cleaning stuff, windex and stuff"22:55
jonathan__what if it's hot?  how do you know what it was used for?22:55
jonathan__"what are you talking about, I just cleaned it today"22:56
jonathan__but where did it come from?22:56
jonathan__"I dont know"22:56
jonathan__how did it get here?22:56
jonathan__"it was in the garage, I told you"22:56
jonathan__but who dropped it off and what did they use it for?22:56
jonathan__"I dont know, katrina said use it for food."22:56
jonathan__how did she know what it was used for and if it was clean?22:56
jonathan__"she didn't know either"22:56
jonathan__then how can you say it's clean when you don't know where it's been?22:57
jonathan__"because I just cleaned it today!"22:57
yashgarothisn't she the one who's all paranoid about that shit22:57
jonathan__kind of reminds me of eliza lol22:57
jonathan__if it's radioactive then we shouldn't use it, right?22:57
jonathan__"just stop, it is not!"22:57
jonathan__how do you know?22:57
jonathan__"because it was in the garage"22:57
jonathan__Ok....22:57
yashgarothyeah I don't really trust babak's microwave either22:58
jonathan__me neither22:59
jonathan__"where's the microwave?"22:59
jonathan__oops wrong quoting22:59
jonathan__where's the microwave?22:59
jonathan__joe: "hmm ahh wheres the microwave.  did anyone see a microwave. where did that go to?"23:00
jonathan__dude, it's a microwave that's like 2' by 3' it's kind of hard to miss aint it23:00
jonathan__anyways it was across the room on the floor not plugged in23:00
jonathan__lol23:00
yashgarothhey they blend in23:01
jonathan__imagine what will happen when there are...  actual.... experiments...  going on23:01
yashgarothI try not to23:01
jonathan__i thought it was a working meeting, meanwhile everyone's chatting up the girls.  what23:02
jonathan__do work, chat up girls some other time dudes23:02
yashgarothpfft you're one to talk23:02
jonathan__might as well go to grad school with this nonsense23:02
jonathan__eh, I dont chat up lab girls when it's work time.23:03
yashgarothfair enough. did they get the 2nd hood raised?23:03
jonathan__I think so23:03
yashgarothwell huzzah I guess23:03
jonathan__if it's not connected it doesnt matter much does it23:04
yashgarothit only needs electricity23:04
yashgarothand functional hepa filters, those are more tricky23:05
jonathan__yes, needs air23:07
jonathan__i'm not worried since everyone in the lab will die from radioactive popcorn due to that microwave lol23:08
yashgarothwell it has a bigass fan, just needs to filter absolutely everything that comes in23:08
jonathan__its not the only bigass in the lab23:16
yashgarothho ho23:16
jonathan__tho you weren't there tonight  haha23:16
jonathan__anyways not to worry about those demos23:17
yashgarothoh?23:17
jonathan__cause doubt there will be ??23:17
yashgarothwell the kombucha may be dead but glorious digital chart recorder lives on23:18
jonathan__yes that's true.. if you can find your equip23:18
yashgaroththey touched my stuff?!23:18
jonathan__count on it23:18
yashgarothargh fuck23:19
jonathan__oh, I'm sure there was good reason..  ummm23:19
jonathan__for some reason they moved the entire bench with our stuff23:19
yashgarotheverything has been arranged by size, cross-referenced by shade of beige23:19
jonathan__should have just paid sportsman for some lab space eh23:20
jonathan__he's got a nice lab23:20
yashgarothit's okay23:20
yashgarothwhy, is he still selling?23:20
jonathan__havent seen him recently i dunno23:21
yashgarothyeah he's been on vacay for like a month now23:21
jonathan__he's gonna come back and say:  "ummm what the F----"23:21
jonathan__it's nice that they leveled the new benches23:21
jonathan__half over the power outlets lol23:22
jonathan__biologists are weird23:22
yashgarothlab setup is an arcane art, left only to the highest class of priests23:22
yashgarothwe anger the biology gods with our attempts, it cannot end well23:23
jonathan__dont let me get in the way of your feng shui23:23
jonathan__especially if there's water and electricity in the mix23:24
yashgarothfirst priority is to consecrate the pcr shrine, or else good luck doing any dna work23:24
yashgarothsurely the high-concentration alcohols cancel out the interaction between water and electricity23:25
jonathan__by alcohol I wonder if you mean wine and beer23:25
yashgarothpah that's barely flammable23:26
yashgarothI do really hope we forget to write a no-drinking clause into the bylaws, because 90% of biology would be made 10x better with a buzz on23:27
jonathan__really23:34
jonathan__kind of what ozzy said about being high while onstage right23:34
jonathan__"it makes the performance better"23:34
jonathan__ummm  not for the audience lol23:34
yashgarothmakes it more enjoyable for the performer at least yeah23:34
jonathan__what happened to the idea of reducing genetic damage??23:35
gradstudentbotThe protocol is wrong.23:36
yashgarothalcohol doesn't damage dna, just...cells in general23:37
jonathan__yea  BRAIN cells ummmmmm not a good idea23:37
jonathan__i like my brain  Mmmmm brains...23:37
yashgarothtoally worth it mostly23:38
jonathan__shitty drug imho23:41
jonathan__the worst choice of any23:41
yashgarothalmost any23:42
jonathan__hmm lemme see let me take something that has horrible side effects, short lasting, large tolerance, and makes a lot of pee23:42
jonathan__headaches, dizziness, aggressive behavior...  hmmm23:43
yashgarothsure but imagine how boring mardi gras would be otherwise23:45
jonathan__umm not necessary23:46
jonathan__lets see, it overrides inhibition23:46
jonathan__where does inhibition come from23:46
jonathan__oh yea, society training23:46
jonathan__oh yea, religion23:46
jonathan__oh yea, cultural stigma23:46
jonathan__why not kill those instead.23:46
yashgarothbeer is somewhat cheaper23:47
jonathan__ha23:47
jonathan__ok i'll give you that I guess23:47
jonathan__or maybe not23:48
jonathan__it's probably higher in terms of cost, from all the side effects23:49
yashgarothwell we could discuss this for a while but I do need to sleep23:50
jonathan__I dont think tei will be comiong to the lab much anymore23:50
jonathan__seems he is employed or something now23:50
yashgarothI thought he already was23:50
-!- randallagordon [~randall@75-164-230-243.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]23:51
jonathan__not really23:51
yashgarothdamn our exploitable unemployeds are drying up fast23:51
jonathan__we can resolve to replace him with a cuter version23:52
yashgarothif you like23:52
-!- randallagordon [~randall@71-38-147-37.ptld.qwest.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap23:53
jonathan__go hit up the nearby high school with talk about bio incubator such and such23:53
-!- delinquentme [~asdfasdf@66.233.132.203] has quit [Quit: Leaving]23:53
jonathan__get yourself some groupies23:53
jonathan__ok i'm out23:53
yashgarothaight see you whenever the next badly timed lab meeting is23:54
jonathan__as a closing note this biocurious "open source automated photobioreactor to grow algae" is biobogus23:55
yashgaroth"BioMONSTAAAR"? yeah sounds like it23:55
jonathan__arduino go go go ! haha23:56
jonathan__mine will be called.....  THE ALGINATOR23:56
--- Log closed Sat Jun 29 00:00:10 2013

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